Virtual Console on Euro wii.

[MacRumorUser]

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but its black borders all round :o

Why have they given us the crappy 50hz versions.

Sonic looks crap, even the sega classics collection was better than this.

Bad enough our wii points & console cost more than the states, but then for
the vc games to be the old 17.5% slower and 1" border debacle is really annoying.

Feel like I''ve wasted my money on a wii points card.

[Dagless]

meh, so long as they're like the classic games I once played I'll be alright. Never played an American Mega Drive.

[MacRumorUser]

So your willing to except and pay for a half assed version which has no reason to exist when the wii is more than capable of playing the VC games in 60hz mode ?

It's not just megadrive games, Mario 64 has massive borders too. When they can make the game for the DS full screen it's simply not acceptable to have ***** pal conversions on todays wii hardware.

Seriously Jimmi just because it's got a nintendo badge doesnt make it ok.
If Xbox Live Arcade titles were as poor as this youd no doubt be giving out about them.

[Sky Blue]

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but its black borders all round :o

Why have they given us the crappy 50hz versions.

Sonic looks crap, even the sega classics collection was better than this.

Bad enough our wii points & console cost more than the states, but then for
the vc games to be the old 17.5% slower and 1" border debacle is really annoying.

Feel like I''ve wasted my money on a wii points card.

That news was making the rounds last week.

[Sky Blue]

an American Mega Drive.
A Genesis?:p

[MacRumorUser]

That news was making the rounds last week.

I never had my Wii last week and I havent been following this board for a week or two.

:rolleyes: Sheesh.

[Dagless]

Sonic doesn't wear a Nintendo badge, he's in the club but not a badge holder. I'm used to the speed of Sonic, I played that more than any NES Mario game. I want the speed, but how are the borders? they could be a problem. Basically though I just want an exact system emulation even down to the bugs, if it replicates it properly (Can't remember if my Mega Drive had borders) then it saves me having to dig out my old machines.

[Spanky Deluxe]

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but its black borders all round :o

Why have they given us the crappy 50hz versions.

Sonic looks crap, even the sega classics collection was better than this.

Bad enough our wii points & console cost more than the states, but then for
the vc games to be the old 17.5% slower and 1" border debacle is really annoying.

Feel like I''ve wasted my money on a wii points card.

I haven't heard about this but that's aweful!

[MacRumorUser]

the borders are bad man. Seriously it's bad and remember if you do hook up via composite, stretching the image to fill up those borders on a tv makes the picture really washed out and bad.

Worse still hook up by component to vga box and you wont be able to stretch them (unless your monitor supports major vertical stretching), but a lot of HDTV's wont when connected via component.

Mario 64 is noteably slower than the DS title. I played the 2 side by side.

It's just very dissapointing and should not be excepted.

At 800 points for sonic and 1000 for mario64 that's nearly 2000 points at £20/€30 and its NOT CHEAP.

[BoyBach]

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but its black borders all round :o

Why have they given us the crappy 50hz versions.

Bad enough our wii points & console cost more than the states, but then for
the vc games to be the old 17.5% slower and 1" border debacle is really annoying.




That's SOOO 1990's! ;)

You'd think they would "remaster" the games though, 'tis a shame.

[Sky Blue]

Sonic doesn't wear a Nintendo badge, he's in the club but not a badge holder. I'm used to the speed of Sonic, I played that more than any NES Mario game. I want the speed, but how are the borders? they could be a problem. Basically though I just want an exact system emulation even down to the bugs, if it replicates it properly (Can't remember if my Mega Drive had borders) then it saves me having to dig out my old machines.


Sometimes the NES VC games don't work and you have to blow into the Wii Disc slot and turn it off/on a few times.

[Chrismcfall]

Sometimes the NES VC games don't work and you have to blow into the Wii Disc slot and turn it off/on a few times.

Good Joke, made me laugh! I remember having to do this quite a lot with my NES, but it was worth it to play home alone!

[aidanpendragon]

Sorry to hear about this. I understand need for translation, localization, etc., but if NA gets a fully-featured product...I guess you can't just run that program on PAL machines (or maybe you do and that's precisely what creates the problem). Hearing all this talk about 60Hz & scart cables is like another language.

But - am I correct in assuming that NTSC/PAL differences disappear with HDTVs, since resolution and hertz are part of the HD standard? 480P or 720P are the same (by definition) everywhere? So would this problem affect a Wii outputting via component to HD? Would it be an issue at resolutions higher than 480P?

Regardless, sorry again.

[Spanky Deluxe]

Sorry to hear about this. I understand need for translation, localization, etc., but if NA gets a fully-featured product...I guess you can't just run that program on PAL machines (or maybe you do and that's precisely what creates the problem). Hearing all this talk about 60Hz & scart cables is like another language.

But - am I correct in assuming that NTSC/PAL differences disappear with HDTVs, since resolution and hertz are part of the HD standard? 480P or 720P are the same (by definition) everywhere? So would this problem affect a Wii outputting via component to HD? Would it be an issue at resolutions higher than 480P?

Regardless, sorry again.

Yeah, HDTV standards are different, as are DVD standards. Its to do with the standard television signal. Over here, we have 576 line signals at 50Hz, whereas you guys have 480 line signals at 60Hz. I think its basically 576i@50 or 576p@25 or PAL vs NTSC's 480i@60 vs 480p@30. Basically, our standard SDTV signals have a lower refresh rate but a higher resolution. The refresh rate isn't really noticeable though but the resolution is.

[MacRumorUser]

Sorry to hear about this. I understand need for translation, localization, etc., but if NA gets a fully-featured product...I guess you can't just run that program on PAL machines (or maybe you do and that's precisely what creates the problem). Hearing all this talk about 60Hz & scart cables is like another language.

But - am I correct in assuming that NTSC/PAL differences disappear with HDTVs, since resolution and hertz are part of the HD standard? 480P or 720P are the same (by definition) everywhere? So would this problem affect a Wii outputting via component to HD? Would it be an issue at resolutions higher than 480P?

Regardless, sorry again.


Pretty much they dissapear yes. The majority of 360 games for example are 60hz ONLY so there is no pal in the equation.

Whats annoying is you can run any emulator these days and stretch the image. So why didnt they merely stretch the pal games, it would at least make them look good, as it stands Mario looks like the dwarf in WoW...

[takao]

Pretty much they dissapear yes. The majority of 360 games for example are 60hz ONLY so there is no pal in the equation.

Whats annoying is you can run any emulator these days and stretch the image. So why didnt they merely stretch the pal games, it would at least make them look good, as it stands Mario looks like the dwarf in WoW...

perhaps not everybody wants a streched image i don't know


that aside the games have an "update" button besides them and in the help it says that it might be used for improvements free of charge ..so perhaps they are working on those issues

[FleurDuMal]

meh, so long as they're like the classic games I once played I'll be alright. Never played an American Mega Drive.

Hehe. But if it was Sony it would be a prime example of the European market having the piss taken :rolleyes:

That really does sound like Nintendo is taking the mickey. Given that VC is one of the main reasons I wanted to get a Wii, I'd have to reconsider if Nintendo don't pull their socks up.

[Haoshiro]

As I am not in the UK, does this mean you are getting PAL versions of the games rather then NTSC? Or vice-versa?

It seems logical that Nintendo/etc would just release one version of the game on VC across both NA/UK...

[Spanky Deluxe]

Hold on, I'm confused now, which versions are we getting, PAL of NTSC? Personally I'd want the 50Hz 576i versions because the refresh rate doesn't bother me and I'd like the higher resolution. What are we getting exactly? Are we getting 50Hz 480i versions, hence the black borders? Did Nintendo sell all PAL games on the N64 and SNES as 480i with black borders to get the resolution of PAL? If that's the case and these are simply the PAL roms then it doesn't really matter. I'm using my Wii at 576i PAL anyway. I set it to 480i@60Hz for a while but didn't really like it since the resolution was lower.

I guess Nintendo should really have built both PAL and NTSC roms into each download so that the Wii chooses the best one for the output method that that individual Wii's set up for.

[MacRumorUser]

perhaps not everybody wants a streched image i don't know

It technically wouldnt be a stretched image, it would adjusting it to the correct ratio :rolleyes:

The orginal image is full 4:3

When they are on a Pal screen they are squeezed / flattened to 14:9 dimension making all the charcters fat little blobs and a 1" border top and bottom.

Having the option to correct the screen is common in emulators.

[Dagless]

It's time for another game of help the luddite.

I've been running my Cube in 60hz on everything, but 50hz has a higher resolution? I might have to switch back (of course, RE4 and MP2 were both 60hz only and had better graphics than everything else, not possible in higher resolution?)

[MacRumorUser]

Hold on, I'm confused now, which versions are we getting, PAL of NTSC?.

We are getting the old bolloxed conversion ones with the thick borders top and bottom.

Remember it was only a handful of N64 titles that were properly converted, all Snes & Megadrive/Genesis games were not, so the likes of Sonic, Zelda Mario 64 have the massive borders top and bottom.

What's really annoying is they can make Zelda full screen when it was bundled as the freebie bonus disc to some gamecubes and with the original wind waker, so why have they given us these heaps of crap ?

As I say the simpliest thing they could have done, was give us a menu in the virtual console so we can stretch screen and put the ratio back to normal.

We might still be at pal 17.5% speed reduction, but at least we'd be at full screen.

[MacRumorUser]

It's time for another game of help the luddite.

I've been running my Cube in 60hz on everything, but 50hz has a higher resolution? I might have to switch back (of course, RE4 and MP2 were both 60hz only and had better graphics than everything else, not possible in higher resolution?)

Not hugely different to be honest.

Remember pal games are 17.5% slower too

So the tiniest increase in resolution (and we are talking tiny) is still degraded by that nearly 20% speed deduction.

60hz all the way...........

[Dagless]

so 50hz= higher res, VAT identical speed slower,
60hz= lower res, regular speed.

[MacRumorUser]

so 50hz= higher res, VAT identical speed slower,
60hz= lower res, regular speed.

Yes & No, because there is another factor.

Nearly all games are made with NTSC in mind and so are nativly 480i

Yes pal adds more lines but they arent really there to be made up, thats why we get borders top and bottom. Even on optimised pal games all they do is artifically stretch the image and not add more lines of information, which is then worse.

So actually technically PAL is higher resolution if material was native PAL resolution,
But in nearly all cases the source material is NTSC 480i, the higher res of pal isnt going to make Jack Poop of a difference.

Bascially NTSC 60hz is best, as its what the games were developed for and not ported too.

It's a case of where somthing in theory (here pal) is better than it is in practice (compared to NTSC games)

[takao]

Bomberman '93 on my PAL Wii doesn't have any black borders so i guess it's just like in past that some are really PAL and some not

[MacRumorUser]

Bomberman '93 on my PAL Wii doesn't have any black borders so i guess it's just like in past that some are really PAL and some not

:rolleyes: lol. that's typical alright. damn cant we just have a standard :o :D

oh well I might try downloading that when my wii stars can be cashed in.

I think €25 for 2000 points is a tad too expensive and hard to justify.

N64 titles should be 800 points and all the rest should be 400, at least you'd get upro 5 retro games for your €25, rather than 2 or 3.

[takao]

I think €25 for 2000 points is a tad too expensive and hard to justify.

i paid 20€ which is the recommended price from nintendo

that aside as said in another thread there is still the update button besides games.. try sending Nintendo an email or something and ask them about it perhaps the games might be upgraded in the past

the only problem i have with the store is that the initial loading takes 10-15 seconds to long for my taste
on the other side downloads were blazing fast just like with updates so far for me

[Dagless]

Price is varying an awful lot. £14.99 for 2000 points at Virgin, £19 at Game and £25 at some online shops. A standard in pricing would be nice too.

[MacRumorUser]

Oh yeah, it's €20 for 2000 points online, just checked :( cost me €25 in store with wii points card, the dirty robbing bas*****


Also other thing solved, the realisation of why bomberman 93 is full screen.

TurboGrafx was never released as a pal machine, so the game is the NTSC version so its obviously full screen.

So why couldnt they have just released the ntsc version of all of them....

[risc]

My GF really wants a Wii but the only thing I am really interested in would be the virtual console features. Is the Wii region locked? If not I'll just try and get an NTSC model, there is no way I could handle a console that doesn't do HD and then slaps me in the face even harder by playing old games at PAL50.

[Spanky Deluxe]

I just noticed something odd, kind of along the lines of this thread. I just put in my Wind Waker bonus disk so as to play Zelda: Ocarina of Time (I've never played it before) and it suddenly changed the display to 480i instead of the 576i it was set at. Everything took a blue tinge since my EyeTV was not set up for that so I turned the Wii off and on again and sure enough, in my Wii's settings it now said it was at 480i.
So it appears that the bonus disk was always NTSC even when it came with PAL versions of Wind Waker.

[Dagless]

I'll have to watch out for that. I've been playing Master Quest for a while. an awful long while :D

[Spanky Deluxe]

I'll have to watch out for that. I've been playing Master Quest for a while. an awful long while :D

When you start up the disk it says "This game supports 60Hz only". Balls, my EyeTV Hybrid doesn't seem to like 60Hz composite input. Looks like I won't be playing OoT after all! Figured it'd be something to do whilst waiting for Twilight Princess to arrive.

[risc]

Oh well I picked up a Wii today on impulse and the .au store is worse than I thought it would be. There are bugger all games. Oh well...