PS3 and 360 with Wii type controllers

[roach]

I think Wii’s remote is the way of the future. I predict PS3 and 360 introducing Wii type controllers in two years or so using add on hardware and software upgrade. If true, PS3 and 360 would have the best of both world…killer graphics and Wii type controllers? Possible?

Roach
Wii owner

[dreamsINdigital]

Well the PS3's SIXAXIS controller already has some motion sensing. Sony also filed a patent for their own wiimote-type controller.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/12/07/sony-patents-its-own-version-of-the-wiimote-and-sensor-bar/

[Spartacus]

There's probably going to be a lot of flaming on this thread, so let me support the OPer in saying this is a good question.

Heres my take: Consol gaming has been around for a long time. In that time Nintendo has really been the only one to utilize motion (ie Power Glove) or light technology (Duck Hunt anyone?) into their games on a meaningful level. I'd think if using these concepts were really how games were meant to be played Microsoft and Sony would have incorporated those functionalities into their gaming systems by now (especially considering both systems are on their second/third generation). Yes, the PS3 controller has 6-axis tilt functionality, but that doesn't really revolutionize the way a game is played like the WiiMote does.

The Wii is super inovative and Nintendo is way ahead of the competition in this regards, but the ideas of motion and light inputs have been around for almost two decades. If Microsoft and Sony wanted to use them, they probably would have already. I wouldn't expect anything coming from Microsoft on the current generation systems (when will it stop being called the 'next' generation system), but that doesn't mean I don't have high hopes for the XBox666, because having an XMote really would be the best of both worlds in my opinion!

Edit: And I don't know anything about copyright law, so if that's been Microsoft and Sony's barrier for implementing this technology then you might as well F the above.

[Anonymous Freak]

The Wii remote has two 'innovative' technologies.

First is the motion sensing. The fact that you swing it like a sword in Zelda, or like a bat or tennis racket in Wii Sports. Or that you rotate it like a steering wheel in Need for Speed.

This is the lesser of the two. Sony's PS3 controller (what is it with Sony fanboys insisting on calling it "SIXAXIS" in all caps?) can do this.

The more unique function is the 'pointer'. The fact that you have the sensor bar (badly name, it's just an LED infrared TRANSMITTER, it doesn't 'sense' anything,) whose signal is picked up by the remote (which has the sensors,) so you can just point at the screen to move the pointer. This is what Sony is lacking. Any such accessory would (barring some new technique that uses the content of the screen itself for calibration,) require a transmitter bar like the Wii.

[Dagless]

You've also got to remember that any new controller coming from Sony will lack rumble, so it's already a dead duck alongside already released competition.

And I think it was said in this forum, but I'm glad the 360 is a little more traditional. For ages I've been thinking "I won't get a 360" purely because I've had such incredible experiences using the Wii controller. But I have my wired 360 controller on my iMac/PC and it's the best classical controller ever (minus the D-pad).

I want one company to continue to push and evolve gaming (Nintendo) and another to keep classic, as gaming once was but shinier, faster and bigger (Microsoft). Not a half assed hybrid of the two machines in one package.

[.Andy]

I don't think either MS or sony will come out with a Wii-type controller for the 360 or PS3.

Firstly it's neither companies' style nor the market they are after at present. The fact that they went with vastly similar controller designs to last gen (albeit with some motion sensing on PS3) demonstrates that it's not a priority. Their priority is in online gaming, HD format wars, getting developers on-side, and increasing the scope and power of the machines in terms of graphics and multi-media capabilities. It's a more clout than risk strategy.

The second thing that will keep them out is installed base. This is where the Wii is a leaps ahead. Everyone who has a Wii has motion sensing controllers so developers know that their market will include everyone. For the 360 or PS3 to bring our motion sensing controls they have to sell it to the whole market. It'll take a lot of investment and a lot of risk to create killer apps that bundle the new motion sensing controls and appeal to the masses of 360/PS3 fans. I don't see this as an effort Sony or MS are likley to take with their current priorities.

With the success of the Wii's controls I think we will see motion sensing controls for 360/PS3. But I think these will come from 3rd party developers and be extentions of Guitar Hero or Eye-toy like gaming. Who knows what will happen by next gen though. If Nintendo continue their initial success and gain significant marketshare off Sony or MS, then their hand's will be forced to include motion sensing controllers for their next wave of consoles.

[e²Studios]

With the success of the Wii's controls I think we will see motion sensing controls for 360/PS3.

The PS3 has a motion sensing control out of the box. M$ is the only party to miss that boat for this gen. Of course they missed a lot imho.

[.Andy]

The PS3 has a motion sensing control out of the box. M$ is the only party to miss that boat for this gen. Of course they missed a lot imho.
In the context of this thread we are talking about Wii-like motion sensing. This includes movement and pointing. The PS3 implementation is not even an approximation to Wii controls.

[e²Studios]

In the context of this thread we are talking about Wii-like motion sensing. This includes movement and pointing. The PS3 implementation is not even an approximation to Wii controls.

The only thing its missing is pointing :rolleyes: Otherwise it has the same gyroscopes and accelerometers that the Wiimote has.

Ed

[GFLPraxis]

I think Wii’s remote is the way of the future. I predict PS3 and 360 introducing Wii type controllers in two years or so using add on hardware and software upgrade. If true, PS3 and 360 would have the best of both world…killer graphics and Wii type controllers? Possible?

Roach
Wii owner

Firstly, Nintendo has patented their controller like nuts. I really doubt it. Secondly, historically, addons fail, big time. Even if halfway through the systems life span they came out with a Wii-type controller and somehow DIDN'T get sued through the roof by Nintendo, all third party games in production would be working towards the traditional controller and there would be no reason to switch over.


PS3 and 360 games cost many millions of dollars to produce. Eight-digit numbers. No developer is going to risk bad sales by making their game exclusively work with a new addon that MOST PS3 and 360 users do not own, because since everyone with a 360 owns a regular controller but only a few early adopters own the Wii-type controller few will buy it, at least initially.

No one will take that risk, and thus, it will end up an add-on for a few games.

That's the beauty of Nintendo's strategy. They knew developers wouldn't take the risk of millions of dollars in development on an unproven platform. By making the Wii a budget system, they get more buyers. By making the Wii not so powerful, they GREATLY reduce development costs.

By making the Wii ultra-cheap to develop games for, developers are more likely to take the risk of making Wii games. When their games sell well, then they support the platform. It works; after Wii launch, Red Steel sold very well and Ubisoft announced seven more Wii titles.

[Dagless]

The only thing its missing is pointing :rolleyes: Otherwise it has the same gyroscopes and accelerometers that the Wiimote has.

Ed

True, but positioning is a key part of the Wii functionality. Even without the pointing ability you'd never get Lightsabre/sword like controls as the PS3 controller is designed for dual hand use.

I don't criticise the PS3 controller (in this respect at least) but it's main functionality from what I can see, will be steering and leaning (FPS). Or they're just the most obvious ones that come to mind.

[.Andy]

The only thing its missing is pointing :rolleyes: Otherwise it has the same gyroscopes and accelerometers that the Wiimote has.

Ed
It doesn't matter how similar the components - as Jimmi pointed out the implelmentation of the two are vastly different. Equating the two on the basis of componentry is absurd.

The PS3 has a motion sensing control out of the box. M$ is the only party to miss that boat for this gen.
To reiterate - the context of this thread is do we think that PS3 or 360 will see Wii-type control. If you're arguing that PS3 already has Wii-type controls I think you're on your own.

http://www.maj.com/gallery/drawne/Curve/ps3.gif

[dreamsINdigital]

(what is it with Sony fanboys insisting on calling it "SIXAXIS" in all caps?)

Maybe because that's the official name and capitalization of the controller? :rolleyes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/sixaxis

[e²Studios]

Maybe because that's the official name and capitalization of the controller? :rolleyes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/sixaxis

It's quite useless arguing with the xbox fanboys in this forums. The best just rename it "Nintendo & Xbox Game forums, if you like Sony go elsewhere & you're always wrong"

Ed

[.Andy]

It's quite useless arguing with the xbox fanboys in this forums. The best just rename it "Nintendo & Xbox Game forums, if you like Sony go elsewhere & you're always wrong"

Ed

Way to throw your dummy out of the pram ;).

[Anonymous Freak]

Maybe because that's the official name and capitalization of the controller? :rolleyes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/sixaxis

Yes, and the Wii controller is officially the "Wii Remote", yet everyone calls it the "Wiimote". I guess there's no easy, "friendly" name to derive from "SIXAXIS".

[.Andy]

Yes, and the Wii controller is officially the "Wii Remote", yet everyone calls it the "Wiimote". I guess there's no easy, "friendly" name to derive from "SIXAXIS".
The sixy*?


*With a New Zealand Accent

[Dagless]

Maybe because that's the official name and capitalization of the controller? :rolleyes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/sixaxis

"Could I buy a can of Coke Cola please?"
"What sort of automobile do you drive?"

"I'd like to buy a Microsoft Xbox 360 please"
"Would you like an extra Microsoft Xbox 360 WIRELESS controller with that?"

Sony can call it whatever they want, along with Nintendo. It's Wiimote and the PS3 controller to most. Only fans and soccer moms go onto the pointless detail, the capitalisation is just the icing on my cake of giggles when I actually see it written by non-Sony execs.

[pcypert]

I agree with Ed H. I'm a big Nintendo fan (own every console from way back to present minus the Wii...even have that robot thing on the NES)...anyway, this should be renamed the Nintendo/WOW with a touch of real Mac gaming and mild toleration for 360 because it's not PS3 forum.

That people will go to such lengths to defend a system with a handful of playable games and to badmouth the PS3 which is the same deal by and large is insane...

Paul

[zap2]

It's quite useless arguing with the xbox fanboys in this forums. The best just rename it "Nintendo & Xbox Game forums, if you like Sony go elsewhere & you're always wrong"

Ed

Go look at the early threads about the PS2/Gamecube/xBox on this forum....you know what your going to find....PS2 and Gamecube being "good" and xBox being "bad"

People didn't just wake up and say "I hate Sony" they woke up and said "I hate what Sony is doing because ....."

[Mackilroy]

I agree with Ed H. I'm a big Nintendo fan (own every console from way back to present minus the Wii...even have that robot thing on the NES)...anyway, this should be renamed the Nintendo/WOW with a touch of real Mac gaming and mild toleration for 360 because it's not PS3 forum.

That people will go to such lengths to defend a system with a handful of playable games and to badmouth the PS3 which is the same deal by and large is insane...

Paul
No, we just don't like the PS3 fanboys claiming that the PS3 will own all and that it's the best system when currently it's in third and that 'best' is subjective. Sure, it's a great machine, but it doesn't suit most of us right now.

Sure, the 360 isn't perfect, but it has a lot more games then the PS3 and right now the graphics are just as good or better.

[poppe]

I hate the Wii controller. I was so afraid to get zelda for the fact that I was afraid I was gonna have to do mass movements, swings, and pull backs to play zelda. Luckily its just point and click and the once and awhile swing.

[Dagless]

People didn't just wake up and say "I hate Sony" they woke up and said "I hate what Sony is doing because ....."

Exactly. If you want to see baseless reasons to why people love or hate consoles go to the Gamefaqs forums.

[Rodimus Prime]

Firstly, Nintendo has patented their controller like nuts. I really doubt it. Secondly, historically, addons fail, big time. Even if halfway through the systems life span they came out with a Wii-type controller and somehow DIDN'T get sued through the roof by Nintendo, all third party games in production would be working towards the traditional controller and there would be no reason to switch over.


PS3 and 360 games cost many millions of dollars to produce. Eight-digit numbers. No developer is going to risk bad sales by making their game exclusively work with a new addon that MOST PS3 and 360 users do not own, because since everyone with a 360 owns a regular controller but only a few early adopters own the Wii-type controller few will buy it, at least initially.

No one will take that risk, and thus, it will end up an add-on for a few games.

That's the beauty of Nintendo's strategy. They knew developers wouldn't take the risk of millions of dollars in development on an unproven platform. By making the Wii a budget system, they get more buyers. By making the Wii not so powerful, they GREATLY reduce development costs.

By making the Wii ultra-cheap to develop games for, developers are more likely to take the risk of making Wii games. When their games sell well, then they support the platform. It works; after Wii launch, Red Steel sold very well and Ubisoft announced seven more Wii titles.

I can think of a few games that almost demand you have an add on to play them like they where meant to be used you had to have the add ons. And you really would not buy the game with out getting the Add on.

The 2 big one that I know have done amazing well are DDR (the entire DDR line and you kind of have to get the pad to really be able to play that game) and another game that has done amazing well is Guitar hero.

So do not say that because it would require an add on it would not do well. Several games have done very well requiring an add on.

[Chone]

Exactly. If you want to see baseless reasons to why people love or hate consoles go to the Gamefaqs forums.

Yeah, especially considering GameFAQs average age is probably 10 years old.

The beauty of the Wii controller is that it can work just fine for traditional games and it opens up a whole new world of gameplay possibilities but the 360 and PS3 controller still works better for other kind of games, for example I wouldn´t like to play a fast paced action game like DMC3 on a Wiimote nor Marvel Ultimate Alliance, etc,

The Wiimote is a very good way of controlling but I think its hardly the imperative future of videogaming.

[Dagless]

I can think of a few games that almost demand you have an add on to play them like they where meant to be used you had to have the add ons. And you really would not buy the game with out getting the Add on.

The 2 big one that I know have done amazing well are DDR (the entire DDR line and you kind of have to get the pad to really be able to play that game) and another game that has done amazing well is Guitar hero.

So do not say that because it would require an add on it would not do well. Several games have done very well requiring an add on.

While true it doesn't mean a raving sucess for the controller.

How many PS2 owners do I know? 8.
How many PS2 controllers have we all got? 9.
How many PS2 owners have a DDR dance mat? none, just us (with 2 I might add).

Of course it's just me and my friends. But they aren't doing amazingly well as the controllers are in a minority of PS2 players homes. Unless Guitar Hero and co have sold over 60 million copies.

[Rodimus Prime]

While true it doesn't mean a raving sucess for the controller.

How many PS2 owners do I know? 8.
How many PS2 controllers have we all got? 9.
How many PS2 owners have a DDR dance mat? none, just us (with 2 I might add).

Of course it's just me and my friends. But they aren't doing amazingly well as the controllers are in a minority of PS2 players homes. Unless Guitar Hero and co have sold over 60 million copies.


at the same time among my friends that own a PS2 is 7
14 controls
DDr mates 9

It all a matter of who you know. Your friends I am going to assume do not care for that type of game.
I have heard a lot of people talk about Guitar Hero and I know it is a fairly big hit.

Now compared to the total count out there it is not that high but when you look at the number of games sold it becomes another matter. They both have a very high game sale count and they require an add on.

[pcypert]

I've got friends with DDR mats in their corner in original packaging...people bought them for gifts and things like that. But I know tons of folks who play them and bought one or two mats each for their systems.

Over here there's also a pretty good market (still kind of small comparatively I acknowledge) for gun games which require purchasing a light gun. I've always been up for it.

Heck I even bought the lame, lame, lame Power Glove.

I mean beyond Zelda and Wii sports developers would be wise to still hold their breath as controls on other games has been less than ideal...so what would keep XBox from doing some type of sensor and releasing a slicker version of a sports game? It's obvious at this point folks will pay 300 bucks for a couple games...doesn't seem too out there to think they could make some bucks from a new controller and a handfull of games for the folks who want the novelty of a new controller for a few games and then want to get back to games that push boundaries in other ways than just controllers....

Also, anyone remember that huge control surface for mech games on the "old school" Xbox :)

Paul

[Dagless]

Now compared to the total count out there it is not that high but when you look at the number of games sold it becomes another matter. They both have a very high game sale count and they require an add on.

They do. But as an accessory later added on they fail. Accessories never seem to reach into the majority of systems homes. That might change with the 360 and its HD-DVD drive, who knows at this stage? Point being the only standard accessory out of light guns, mats, cameras, extra drives, online adapters etc are all in their minority and developers cannot rely on people having anything more than a regular, official controller as their means of input.

[.Andy]

They do. But as an accessory later added on they fail. Accessories never seem to reach into the majority of systems homes. That might change with the 360 and its HD-DVD drive, who knows at this stage? Point being the only standard accessory out of light guns, mats, cameras, extra drives, online adapters etc are all in their minority and developers cannot rely on people having anything more than a regular, official controller as their means of input.
Developers also aren't likely to program for a periperal made by another developer. If MS or Sony decide that they want (or at all need) to go the way of Wii-type controls it has to be their initiative, it's very unlikely a third party will successfully fill in the gap.

[pcypert]

I don't know that it'd be too hard for someone to do...there's all kinds of little cheap paddle games over here for 5 bucks or so...you plug a racket into the tv and have a little motion sensor tennis game...someone could do a sports type package and sell it for 60 bucks easy...maybe even 75...would be better if MS did it first and then others could choose to develop for it...or if it could be mapped via options saved on the HD

[Dagless]

I don't know that it'd be too hard for someone to do...there's all kinds of little cheap paddle games over here for 5 bucks or so...you plug a racket into the tv and have a little motion sensor tennis game...someone could do a sports type package and sell it for 60 bucks easy...maybe even 75...would be better if MS did it first and then others could choose to develop for it...or if it could be mapped via options saved on the HD

But then we're going back to Pong days, pre-consoles. Consoles and microcomputers were revolutionary as it made game playing cheap, past the initial price of the console the games, controllers etc would be cheap. There is no market for it. Sega released a few (IIRC) Mega Drive consoles that had likt 6 built in games and plugged straight into the TV. They sell but compared to big consoles? They're nothing. That's a huge step backwards to everything consoles have achieved.

[pcypert]

I don't know...I still think it's feasable. People are willing to shell out 2-400 bucks to get a Wii to play the Wii sports...I'm betting there's lots of 360 owners who wouldn't mind picking up something for half or less that will give them fun mini games added to their HD systems. It's like the best of both worlds...next gen gameplay and graphics...

All I'm saying is if someone did release something regardless of game makers supporting it right out...that might put a damper on things for Nintendo. I know the Nintendo crowd here won't like that...but it's true. Right now you got the Wii and 4 or 5 decent games...imagine a HD Wii type gaming console with a whole established library of games, ability to play DVD's, stream stuff from computer, etc...

I hope they don't as I'd like for Nintendo to get as much money as possible and keep putting out games and systems...

Paul

[JackAxe]

I don't know...I still think it's feasable. People are willing to shell out 2-400 bucks to get a Wii to play the Wii sports...I'm betting there's lots of 360 owners who wouldn't mind picking up something for half or less that will give them fun mini games added to their HD systems. It's like the best of both worlds...next gen gameplay and graphics...

All I'm saying is if someone did release something regardless of game makers supporting it right out...that might put a damper on things for Nintendo. I know the Nintendo crowd here won't like that...but it's true. Right now you got the Wii and 4 or 5 decent games...imagine a HD Wii type gaming console with a whole established library of games, ability to play DVD's, stream stuff from computer, etc...

I hope they don't as I'd like for Nintendo to get as much money as possible and keep putting out games and systems...

Paul

You have to consider that Nintendo would have taken measures to protect their investments. So a company like MS couldn't just introduce their own version of a Wiimote, without stepping on some legal toes. The perhiperhal has to be included with the system, or esle developers won't support it. An add on to a 360, would be like the PS2's eyeTV, nothing more than a gimic that would never gain the level support the Wii has in place.

I doubt that any add on will put a damper on what Nintendo has accomplished with the Wii. It was built from the ground up for this controller. Nintendo's DS has been a massive success for them, the Wii was the number one selling TV console this season, and even a PS2 outsold the X360, which doesn't even have half the totall sales of a PSP, so the chances of an aferthought putting a damper on Nintendo, is slim at best.

Think back to the X360's launch titles, I wouldn't rate a vast majority of them as even decent. Out of the gate Nintendo has some great games and many more are on the way. Zelda alone is worth a Wii purchase, because of its enhanced controls.

Wii Sports is free, and like the Wiimote, the system has many features in place to support it; Like the Miis. There are already more Wii-xxxxx games on the way that take advantage of these features, so an afterthought for a 360 would not be able to offer the same experience as the Wii. That's assuming they could even legally release their own Wiimote wannabe.

Your hope is needed elsewhere. ;) Unlike MS, which has yet to make a profit in the gaming arena and is still billions in the hole, Nintendo has always profited. They've been doing really good for themselves, even through the GC days they still made a profit. I personaly hope that there will always be a company like Nintendo, because they seem to be the only ones innovating and really focusing on making gaming better, not video downloads or becoming a media-center like those other guys.

I game because it's fun, not for somewat better graphics and thumb-twiddling, unless the game calls for that sort of gimped play. :)

<]=)

[pcypert]

I don't know...my controlers from varioius systems are all patented and what not but they seem to be able to get around it. The Sony controller changed controllers and MS and Nintendo followed suit with the XBox and Cube controllers. Not as far fetched as some would like to think. There might be certain ways they couldn't do it...but they could do it if they wanted....and if Nintendo does as well as folks are suggesting...they'll want to.

I'm no MS fan...or even that much of an Xbox supporter...wouldn't even say fan...I've owned way more NES stuff than anything else. But others can do it and make money if they want as I see it. Technology is there, they could have it out in less than a year and not suffer too much...

Paul

[Dagless]

I don't know...my controlers from varioius systems are all patented and what not but they seem to be able to get around it. The Sony controller changed controllers and MS and Nintendo followed suit with the XBox and Cube controllers. Not as far fetched as some would like to think. There might be certain ways they couldn't do it...but they could do it if they wanted....and if Nintendo does as well as folks are suggesting...they'll want to.

I'm no MS fan...or even that much of an Xbox supporter...wouldn't even say fan...I've owned way more NES stuff than anything else. But others can do it and make money if they want as I see it. Technology is there, they could have it out in less than a year and not suffer too much...

Paul

You know that the PS1 controller really was nothing more than the SNES controller but with added grips and doubled shoulder buttons? The leap from the NES to SNES was bigger (4 face buttons and the creation of the shoulder buttons). Out popped the N64's analogue stick and vibration pack, what did Sony do?

All modern day controllers are based around the SNES controller. The diamond face button layout, the shoulder buttons. N64 introduced the analogue stick and rumble. Sony and MS just further built on Nintendos standards. Hell the NES could use wireless controllers!