Any present or former Boy Scouts?

[Gus]

So are there any here? I was one and loved every minute of it. I had a great Scoutmaster, and we went camping twice a month, even in the winter. Had a lot of good times at camp, except for becoming a borderline pyromaniac, of course. ;)

Regards,
Gus

[BrandonRP0123]

Eagle Scout, 1999

I currently do a few merit badges for the local troops.

[scem0]

I was a boy scout.

I quit though - in this day and age a sense of direction, purpose, and loyalty is less valuable then in the past couple decades.

I don't need to learn how to go camping because I never plan to. I got all the camping I could stand while in boy scouts.

It was never much fun for me, but that must be because I don't like being in nature :o.

edit - and yes, boyscouts DOES make you a pyro. :D

scem0

[legion]

Eagle Scout from 1992 and Order of the Arrow (Journeyman status). I had a great time camping and spent usually 3 months of the year camping. I still feel much of what I learned is invaluable. Most of my friends today, now that I live in a major metro area, find my survivalist skills amazing.

These days, though, I wouldn't have my kids part of the organization. I disagree with the BSA on many social and political viewpoints and find the group as a whole too political. Luckily I have all that I've learned to pass on without the need of a formal group. (though I feel that this sentiment a bit sad to have to be...)

Oh yeah, being part of the scouts did breed a bit of pyromanic tendencies....:rolleyes:

(and to mac15, GROW UP. That humour is unappreciated.)

[Stelliform]

I didn't make Eagle, but I made Life. :) (My mom wouldn't let m ego to summer camp. :( That is where I learned you get the majority of badges. :(

I still had a great time. My Dad got really involved also. I have a lot of great memories.

[scem0]

I must also say I didn't like most of the boys that were part of it.

Most had this macho mentality that the better you were at hiking, the more stamina you had, the more 'macho' your were was how good you were as a person.

I hate how they stressed loyalty, team work, and trust, also. I don't think you should trust every person you meet, I think I am better at most things working by myself, and there are few people worth being loyal to.

I don't really like the idea of an organization that doesn't allow homosexuals into it feeding our children morals.

scem0

[Roger1]

I made first class. I got into because my older brother became one. I never really enjoyed myself, because I didn't care for very many of the kids in my troop. I didn't miss it when I left.

[Mal]

I am an Eagle Scout, and I have to say that the Boy Scouts was one of the best experiences of my life. I'm not sure why any of you would have problems with the lessons learned in Boy Scouts, unless you're a homosexual, in which case I don't really care, because I believe that what you're doing is wrong. But oh well, I don't have the right to force you to change, so I won't even try. But I wouldn't be the person I am today without the Boy Scouts.

JW

[michaelrjohnson]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by mac15
Anyhow... I am an Eagle Scout, Brotherhood member of OA. Anybody who was a scout and made it to eagle would know that Boy Scouting is one of the most incredible experiences that you can ever have. Both of my older brothers are Eagles as well. :) It's very cool. Congrats to all of the Eagles and all the scouts!

[G4scott]

Originally posted by scem0
I was a boy scout.

I quit though - in this day and age a sense of direction, purpose, and loyalty is less valuable then in the past couple decades.

I don't need to learn how to go camping because I never plan to. I got all the camping I could stand while in boy scouts.

It was never much fun for me, but that must be because I don't like being in nature :o.

edit - and yes, boyscouts DOES make you a pyro. :D

scem0

Boy Scouts is about more than just camping. It's about leadership, and having fun. My Boy Scout troop went canoeing, rafting, mountain biking, and even camping- without tents, using what nature provided to make shelters. Also, during summer camps, we would go fishing, we could take the aviation merit badge, and get to fly in a nice little 2 seater open cockpit Piper Cub.

With troops with a good program, Boy Scouts can be a good experience.

Besides, I just had my Eagle Scout board of review last week.

I've learned so much from scouting, and the majority of it has nothing to do with camping. The main purpose of Boy Scouts it to teach boys to be good citizens in their community, helping others, and being a good leader. Camping, I feel, is just a great way to teach this, and it's a good way to take a break, and get in touch with nature...

Oh, and I can start a fire without any matches, lighters, flint, nine volt batteries and steel wool, or magnifying glasses. Lets just say that one of our leaders has taken several Tom Brown courses, and he knows a lot about wilderness survival...

[scem0]

Originally posted by G4scott
Boy Scouts is about more than just camping. It's about leadership, and having fun. My Boy Scout troop went canoeing, rafting, mountain biking, and even camping- without tents, using what nature provided to make shelters.

I've learned so much from scouting, and the majority of it has nothing to do with camping. The main purpose of Boy Scouts it to teach boys to be good citizens in their community, helping others, and being a good leader. Camping, I feel, is just a great way to teach this, and it's a good way to take a break, and get in touch with nature...

I know, but I never had fun while in boy scouts. As I said, I never liked any of my troop. I don't have many guy friends though, if it had been coed I probably would have liked it more.

And as I said, I don't agree with a lot of the morals they teach.

scem0

[TEG]

I was a Cub Scout. However, in the 6th Grade, I joined the Boy Scouts. We met every Saturday in the Homeschooling Office. After 5 Months (The Beginning of Little League), we went camping. We were taking a hike, and several of us started running, and an older scout (The Scoutmaster's Son) Grabed at to of us to stop, He got a hold ov my shirt, and I fell flat on my rear. We weren't even doing anything wrond, we were running on the road in the campground.
Well the 'master made him appoligize, but I don't think he ment it.
Soon afterward, I was in little league, had a babysitting gig, and suddenly the day of meetings changed to Tuesday (The same day as LL Practice, and Babysitting)... Therefore I maintain that I was forced out of BSA.

TEG

[jelloshotsrule]

Originally posted by skywalker
...unless you're a homosexual, in which case I don't really care, because I believe that what you're doing is wrong. ...

luke, use the force to change those gays into straights the way they should be! :rolleyes:

[wdlove]

I personally wasn't in the Boy Scouts. Did have a cousin that was very active, he was able to make Eagle Scout. His father my Uncle was a Scout Master. It definitely was a great learning expereince for both of them!

[Killswitch]

life scout, OA... troop and council politics got in the way of my eagle project.. so I moved on.

Scoutmaster was a former Army Sgt...A good leader and I learned much from him. Survival skills and camping and overall life skills I learned then still apply now. We had an Asst. that was homosexual...we knew it..he knew we knew..and we never made a big deal about it. Was there a huge emphasis on morals? No. We emphasized decision making and leadership.

It seems that every troop has it's own dynamic...just like any group of people ( this forum included). If we accept each other as equals, it really doesn't matter if they are gay, straight, Venusian, liberal, conservative...etc.

[sketchy]

Eagle Scout 1994, Brotherhood - OA. Foxfire (JLT) Staff

I loved the Boy Scouts.. I loved hiking, camping, cooking, fire building, etc. I learned how to be a leader in the Boy Scouts, PL and SPL, and Junior Scout Master. At school I was not popular, not looked up to (except for my art skills) --- but in the Boy Scouts I was a leader. I was responsible, I was trusted to be responsible.

There are many things that I have used from the Scouts in my everyday life besides knots and first aid.

And in scouts it was not how strong you were or how much stamina you had -- it was if you tried or not. I was the fastest hiker in my troop, but I always walked with the slowest hiker when I was SPL. Try and don’t complain about it. You were supposed to want to do it, if you went because you dad or mom wanted you to go, then you probably should not have been there.

Dave
(I miss capture the flag)

[rainman::|:|]

Originally posted by mac15
haha are there any other potential child molestors out there other than that guy?

You know, I'm at odds with the BSA right now, for their staunch discriminatory views whilst getting funding from a variety of sources that do not agree. But even I think that comment was out of line. The BSA has had troubles with a few bad apples taking a perverse advantage of their nurturing relationship with the children, which is a damn shame to say the least. But the BSA is also a very positive and uplifting organization that can give [some] boys the chance and structure that they need to get in control of their life. I hope one day they open their organization to everyone, and teach that discrimination is wrong and that honesty is a prized value... but seriously, if you're going to take a jab at child molestors... *points to the catholic church*

:D

pnw

[jefhatfield]

i made a giant post about scouting but my outdated browser lost it

edit..

so yes, i was in scouts until i was 18

[jelloshotsrule]

Originally posted by paulwhannel
but seriously, if you're going to take a jab at child molestors... *points to the catholic church*


aww c'mon man... if you don't like *your group* to be attacked, why attack another group? every set of people has bad apples, why focus on that so much?


where's the love?!???

[G4scott]

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
aww c'mon man... if you don't like *your group* to be attacked, why attack another group? every set of people has bad apples, why focus on that so much?


where's the love?!???

Uh, I've only heard of one case about a scoutmaster being 'rejected' for being gay, and from what I've heard, he never molested anyone. (I haven't heard about any molesting going on within BSA, but I could be wrong. I don't keep up with the news on this type of stuff).

Now the catholic church... They've been all over the news, and the majority of it is not good...

[jrv3034]

Eagle Scout since 1995. Loved every minute of it. ;)

On a different note, I think they really should revise their policies on homosexuals. Discrimination on basis of sexual orientation is just wrong. Remember, only a few decades ago, African-Americans weren't allowed to use the same bathrooms as white people. In 50 years, we'll look back on this and think "My God, is it possible we refused to let kids into the Boy Scouts because they were gay?"

[applemacdude]

I dont even think theres boy scouts here in oakland. Theres girscouts. My friend is a boyscout...:rolleyes:

[G4scott]

The debate on homosexuality in Boy Scouts is a heated one.

One one hand, there is a line in the Scout Oath that says "To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake, and morally straight."

This, many argue, means 'not homosexual'.

And then there is the 12th point of the scout law. A Scout is Reverent.

And to a catholic scout, this means that they must love thy neighbor as they would love thyself. The bible teaches not to discriminate, because greek or jew, man or woman, rich or poor, they are still children of God.

So, we have scout guidelines conflicting with religious guidelines.

The BSA's main reason for discriminating against homosexuals is to protect their members. While some leaders who aren't homosexual could still pose a threat to the scouts, I believe that the districts and the councils should keep a closer eye on their troops. Possibly a "scout abuse awareness" system, where they teach scouts to report things that people do to them. They already include a child-abuse handbook in the front of every scout handbook, but I feel more should be done.

[rainman::|:|]

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
aww c'mon man... if you don't like *your group* to be attacked, why attack another group? every set of people has bad apples, why focus on that so much?


where's the love?!???

heh i hoped my tone was conveyed, i was being sardonic... and while i spent time as a boy scout, it's no friend of mine, a lot of it I don't agree with... particularly the fact that it's such a non-secular organization...

Here's my view-- The catholic church and the BSA are two organizations that have long rejected homosexuals (the BSA did long before their rules said so)... And yet they're the two organizations that have suffered the most subsequently by child-mollestation allegations. You can't tell me it's because accepting organizations ignore abuse; obviously the catholic church ignored it for a very long time on a very large scale... I think it's because both organizations live in total denial of homosexuals, thereby blinding themselves to those (tiny portion of) gays that are pedophiles... So they simply don't deal with it as other organizations would. And such, children suffer. Child abuse is something that spans both sexual orientations and must be dealt with as one single problem; not divided and then 'confronted'... It's counter-productive, and it's not fair to the kids. The division between gay and straight doesn't just hurt those on this side of the fence--

pnw

[mnkeybsness]

i was in boy scouts and screwed off a lot more than any of the scoutmasters knew about...especially my dad. during summer camp, me and one other scout made good friends with the counselors and they signed off our merit badges even though we never went and just hung out with them and went into the nearest town every day.

[jelloshotsrule]

Originally posted by G4scott
Uh, I've only heard of one case about a scoutmaster being 'rejected' for being gay, and from what I've heard, he never molested anyone. (I haven't heard about any molesting going on within BSA, but I could be wrong. I don't keep up with the news on this type of stuff).

Now the catholic church... They've been all over the news, and the majority of it is not good...

this type of thinking would lead everyone to believe that all muslims are terrorists. i'm not sure if you subscribe to this theory or not.

hate to tell you, but most catholic priests are not child abusers. it is their position of power, authority, and trust that makes the ones that do screw up stand out because if joe blow is a child abuser, then whatever. if it's your local priest who has had access to many kids, as well as maybe being your spiritual leader for a period of time, etc, then the betrayal aspect is there, along with the heinousness of the crime.

and going by what you see on tv about any group of people will lead to problems. if it bleeds (or abuses children) it leads.

of course i'll admit that the church has had a terrible history with this, and it needs to set up a 0 tolerance policy, asap, and act on it. however, to flatly speak of catholics or all priests as pedophiles, etc is the same as calling all honkeys racist, cross burning klansmen.

and i'm not sure why you took issue with my comment given the fact that it was directed at paul. and when i said "your group" i didn't mean BSA, so you're a bit off there.

paul- i definitely see your point, and as you may or may not have seen (elsewhere, in the past, etc) i'm a catholic who believes in gay rights, and while i'mm unsure of the "morality" of homosexuality, i would never tell you not to live by your heart, and i wouldn't judge you for it. god knows there's 1094224 times worse that i could be judged for. ;)

i kinda thought you were joking, but wasn't sure... you weren't as obvious with it as i was in my first post in this thread. hah :)

[G4scott]

Where did I say all catholic priests were child molesters?

Granted the catholic church is getting more media on these types of things, I think both organizations need to do something about it.

[jelloshotsrule]

Originally posted by G4scott
Where did I say all catholic priests were child molesters?

Granted the catholic church is getting more media on these types of things, I think both organizations need to do something about it.

where did i say anything about a scoutmaster being rejected for being gay?

anyhoo, your quote:

Now the catholic church... They've been all over the news, and the majority of it is not good...

my point was that just because one group gets a lot of press for their extreme cases, doesn't make the group as a whole any less valuable or respectable. my comparison was the muslim community

[Gus]

I hate to be "that guy", but please don'[t hijack the thread with an anti-gay group discussion. I know you all have valid discussions, but this is about being in the BSA, not who isn't in, or who did what to whom.

On that note, I'm really surprised how many there are. Pleasnatly surprised! As somebody pointed out, scouting is about more than camping, but I learned a lot of things other than survival through camping trips, not the least of which was astronomy and working together to accomplish something. That, and as an only child, it was great to have somethingin common with a group of guys I got along with, even though people at school would have thought it wasn't cool.

Anybody ever get sent to look for a "left-handed smokeshifter?" ;)

Regards,
Gus

[Powerbook G5]

I was a Boy Scout and loved it. We had a strong program in Illinois, but unfortunately we moved to Florida and they required that your dad come with you on camping trips over the weekends, and my dad is a minister, so I quickly found out I was unable to continue being a Boy Scout considering a great deal of it is outdoors/camping experience. I was so set on becoming an Eagle Scout, too :(

[jelloshotsrule]

it's cool, gus, i agree...

as for the thread, i was in cub scouts... then hit boy scout age, and wasn't interested, so i didn't bother. i can see the plus sides, and the minuses

[funkywhat2]

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule

as for the thread, i was in cub scouts... then hit boy scout age, and wasn't interested, so i didn't bother. i can see the plus sides, and the minuses

same. myfamily was all into it, and they tried to get me into real horrorshow like, and i just couldn't handle it, my dear brothers.

i just couldn't resist!:D ;)

[Powerbook G5]

Alex quotes are just plain creepy

[G4scott]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
I was a Boy Scout and loved it. We had a strong program in Illinois, but unfortunately we moved to Florida and they required that your dad come with you on camping trips over the weekends, and my dad is a minister, so I quickly found out I was unable to continue being a Boy Scout considering a great deal of it is outdoors/camping experience. I was so set on becoming an Eagle Scout, too :(

Hmm... That's weird. We encourage parents to participate in cub scouts, but unless the parents have what it takes to be a leader, or a scout master, they were usually not that involved with what the kids did. Like on campouts, the only dads that went were the scoutmasters, although most of the scoutmasters are or were dads of boys in the troop. It wasn't mandatory for every dad, though. We want to make sure that the boys can do things without the parents guiding them every step of the way. I'm sorry you weren't able to pursuit your Eagle rank.

[funkywhat2]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
I was a Boy Scout and loved it. We had a strong program in Illinois, but unfortunately we moved to Florida and they required that your dad come with you on camping trips over the weekends, and my dad is a minister, so I quickly found out I was unable to continue being a Boy Scout considering a great deal of it is outdoors/camping experience. I was so set on becoming an Eagle Scout, too :(

pardon my ignorance, but a minister cannot camp/scout/sleep outside? i had no idea:confused:

[Powerbook G5]

A minister can camp outside, but it isn't exactly possible when he has to be in the office, has a church service on Saturday, and 2 on Sunday along with hospital and nursing home visits. I tried staying in the scouts for a while, but it was just becoming too difficult since they wanted the dads around as much as possible for bonding and such, I guess.

[funkywhat2]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
A minister can camp outside, but it isn't exactly possible when he has to be in the office, has a church service on Saturday, and 2 on Sunday along with hospital and nursing home visits. I tried staying in the scouts for a while, but it was just becoming too difficult since they wanted the dads around as much as possible for bonding and such, I guess.

oh, i see. thanks for the clarifcation.:)

boy, i do love these smilies

[Powerbook G5]

No problem :)

[beefstu01]

Sorry, bit late in the conversation but-

Eagle Scout -> 2000
OA Vigil -> 2001
(Brother Elingomat Tschitnik -> Friendly Fast One)

I'm 18 right now, and as I type this, I'm on break from working at a summer camp. If anybody has heard of it, I'm currently the Scoutcraft Director at Camp Barton (on Cayuga Lake in New York State).

Boy Scouting has probably been the one thing that has shaped my life the most. It installed a set of morals that I follow to this very day. I learned a lot about leadership, service and dedication, made a lot of new friendships, and acquired many hobbies that I would not have had it not been for the Boy Scouts.

I love the BSA to death, and will always help out in any way that I can to give back all that it has given me. It has been the best thing I have done in my entire life.

Hey, how many of you Eagle Scouts are life members of the NESA?

[beefstu01]

Originally posted by Gus
Anybody ever get sent to look for a "left-handed smokeshifter?" ;)

And sent on a snipe hunt. And sent out to fetch a mile of seashore. Yeah, I even tried to draw up the plans for a left-handed smokeshifter, but my patrol found that saying "I hate rabbits" works a lot better:D

[Porshuh944turbo]

Eagle Scout 1995 - age 14

Best experience was Philmont... 10 day trek, 86 miles... anyone else been to Philmont?

Now as a 22 year old working professional, I still see the benefits of my scouting days. I give back to my council every year. I hope one day my sons will also go through scouting. Isn't it only 2% of all Boy Scouts become Eagle?

[Gus]

Originally posted by beefstu01
And sent on a snipe hunt. And sent out to fetch a mile of seashore. Yeah, I even tried to draw up the plans for a left-handed smokeshifter, but my patrol found that saying "I hate rabbits" works a lot better:D

HAHAHAHA!! I KNEW somebody had to have had that experience as well! I actually fell for the smokeshifter, and it was at a jamboree, so there were like 25 troops camped out, and I went to every single one, and they all played along with the joke. Felt pretty stupid, but right afterwards, I was laughing my butt off.

I went to Philmont also. It was a defining trip for me. As the fattest and slowest kid in my troop, I had the roughest time at first. I was always in the back slowing everybody down. Then, on the 5th day, they put me up front, on that massive climb up the peak, and it just made me work that much harder. When I got to the top, and was alone for a few seconds, it really made a change in me.

And I lost weight doing it. :)

Ahh, the good old days . . .

I did all of the work for Eagle, including planning the project, and it was all set to go the week before my 18th B-Day, and my sponsor died of a heart attack. Not only was it a sad, but also a little disappointing, but life does that sometimes.

Regards,
Gus

[legion]

I've been to Philmont twice. I haven't stayed with the NESA. I've probably actually met most of the Eagles on this board if they were around during the 75th Jubilee which was held in St Louis, MO (and were at at least SPL.)

For those of you who know BoyScout history, I find it funny that the current Anglican/Episcopalian debate right now should have a direct effect on the policies of the BSA, but while the original religious side is growing more tolerant, the BSA is not.

I also agree with the statement about each troop having its own character that could be more tolerant and diversified than the BSA; only problem is that these days the BSA seems to want to exert more control. When I first joined, the troop I belonged to was more secular but I ended up moving and the only local troop was part of a private catholic school. I joined it and luckily no one was religiously intolerant; of course, I complicate matters with my staunch atheism. No problem with my troop (though the official BSA would've kicked me out)-- I ended up being the youngest Eagle Scout ever for my state, SPL for 3 years, ran one of the largest BoyScout owned properties for two years (S-F ranch: donated by the Famous Barr Family), and instigated the involvement of the Anheuser Busch family funding the Diamond Jubilee/Earth Day celebration. These days, the BSA probably wouldn't touch me with a 10ft pole (I find it incredulous that you have to believe in a religion (they're very open here under the guise of tolerance that it can be any religion), but if you proclaim yourself an atheist, even though you're respectful of other's beliefs, you are not allowed to be part of the BSA) Yeah I'm a bit bitter....

I even started an explorer branch so my sister could be involved because she was always jealous of all the camping I was involved in (and she's smart enough to realize that the girlscouts is a crock o'*****; more debutante than scouting)

And I did cheer inside when many of the major movie moguls (Speilberg, etc..) here in Los Angeles withdrew their funding of the Boy Scouts after some of the intolerance issues were raised in federal courts:cool:

[Porshuh944turbo]

I agree with the BSA that they should stick with their own oath and law and not back down to the everchanging society. peoples ideas will always be changing, why should a standing organization? This is not racism, this is not discrimination, its ******** moralilty people.

[legion]

Originally posted by Porshuh944turbo
I agree with the BSA that they should stick with their own oath and law and not back down to the everchanging society. peoples ideas will always be changing, why should a standing organization? This is not racism, this is not discrimination, its ******** moralilty people.


Yeah, some mornings I wake up and I think, "screw this ever-changing society... where's my feudal lord and king and queen???"and then I spend the day disassociating myself from anyone I know that has divorced parents (after all they are morally bankrupt) or has had sex before marriage (lack of morals again.) I'm not discriminating against these individuals, its ******** morality.


The histories of theology, of politics, and even of science have volumes on groups that have withered away because of their refusal to change. Good luck to anyone wanting to stay with a policy of absolutes...

[VIREBEL661]

Originally posted by jrv3034
Eagle Scout since 1995. Loved every minute of it. ;)

On a different note, I think they really should revise their policies on homosexuals. Discrimination on basis of sexual orientation is just wrong. Remember, only a few decades ago, African-Americans weren't allowed to use the same bathrooms as white people. In 50 years, we'll look back on this and think "My God, is it possible we refused to let kids into the Boy Scouts because they were gay?"

Totally agree.... ALL discrimination is wrong, and the same... But that's a SERIOUS can of worms for people not of liberal mind..

[VIREBEL661]

ON TOPIC - was a Cub scout as a kid, and I really enjoyed it.. But now I feel it would be necessary to seperate any religious messages before I would let my kids join (if I were to have any, that is)... And all discrimination is wrong to me, so that too!!!

[Porshuh944turbo]

Originally posted by legion
Good luck to anyone wanting to stay with a policy of absolutes...

hehe... maybe God will come in and post on this one... you know.. since he defines "absolute" and you know, he's been around, oh for a few years...


people think they know everything...

[Huskerflute]

Since this thread seems doomed to be pulled off topic, I will just add this:

It is not discriminatory to have membership rules. It is a voluntarily joined club, not a public or government run institution. If you do not want to, or do not fulfill the membership requirements, don't join. It's the same as saying colleges are discriminatory towards peoplle who don't meet the SAT requirements for that college. It is a term of membership into that college, and for that matter, that DOES apply to a state-run institution in that case.

The BSA was founded on a religious belief, thus the line in the Scout Law ". . . to do my duty to God and my country". It is a fundamental principle of the BSA. If you do not believe in God, and still want to be a scout, I realize you can fake your way through it, be successful and have a good time in the process, but joining the group, and then being upsaet about it is not a valid argument. This is not directed at any one person posting, just a geeral opinion.

Thanks, and I will stay on-topic on my own thread that I already yelled at people about getting off topic. ;)

Regards,
Gus

P.S. Whoops, I'm on my wife's iBook and it posted under her name. This is Gus.

[Powerbook G5]

Getting her post count up as brownie points? ;) Perhaps you could get a merit badge for that...

[krhodus]

first class (working on star), OA, and just got den chief service award. My dad is an Eagle. Went through Cub Scouts. Love every minute. We camp alot and are big time pyros.

[NavyIntel007]

I'm an Eagle Scout (2000). I'm a brotherhood member in O.A. but I always found that to be pointless. Went to Philmont and did the Appalachian (sp?) Trail twice. I had a good run. It was a great chance to meet and work with guys from all over the place that you wouldn't necessarily hang out with.

As for the no gay members... first off it's a rule. They are a private organization and are allowed to have rules. You're also not allowed to do drugs and smoke (kids) on camp outs. Should we be sensitive to drug addicts and underage cigarette users? I have no position on homosexuality. But all the boy scouts really need is a story about two or more boys getting caught having sex or kissing at a campout. Many parents, regardless of them being conservative or liberal when it comes down to it don't want their children to see that.

Think of how awkward it is sitting next to a young girl and boy who are making out through a movie. Now imagine hearing two guys getting it on in the tent next to you. I wouldn't want to be next to a straight or gay couple doing that. If that's acceptable then why don't the boyscouts and girlscouts integrate and we can all have a big orgy.

It doesn't make it right, it's just a situation where there can't really be a grey area.

Seriously, I mean homosexuals should have all the rights that straight people do; but straight people have the right to not have it shoved in their faces every day.

[Powerbook G5]

Would there be an orgy/sexual merit badge, then? Perhaps more people would become Scouts!

[NavyIntel007]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
Would there be an orgy/sexual merit badge, then? Perhaps more people would become Scouts!

Yeah sure, parents would be all over that idea.:rolleyes:

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by NavyIntel007
I'm an Eagle Scout (2000). I'm a brotherhood member in O.A. but I always found that to be pointless. Went to Philmont and did the Appalachian (sp?) Trail twice. I had a good run. It was a great chance to meet and work with guys from all over the place that you wouldn't necessarily hang out with.

As for the no gay members... first off it's a rule. They are a private organization and are allowed to have rules. You're also not allowed to do drugs and smoke (kids) on camp outs. Should we be sensitive to drug addicts and underage cigarette users? I have no position on homosexuality. But all the boy scouts really need is a story about two or more boys getting caught having sex or kissing at a campout. Many parents, regardless of them being conservative or liberal when it comes down to it don't want their children to see that.

Think of how awkward it is sitting next to a young girl and boy who are making out through a movie. Now imagine hearing two guys getting it on in the tent next to you. I wouldn't want to be next to a straight or gay couple doing that. If that's acceptable then why don't the boyscouts and girlscouts integrate and we can all have a big orgy.

It doesn't make it right, it's just a situation where there can't really be a grey area.

Seriously, I mean homosexuals should have all the rights that straight people do; but straight people have the right to not have it shoved in their faces every day.

i don't have problems with gay or straight leaders

my bosses' boss at the defense department was gay..she did a great job and was a gs-14 (out of a possible 15)

my boss at the CIA was gay...FORMER marine officer...no such thing as an ex-marine!!

and yes, my scoutmaster, a vietnam veteran who served proudly, was gay

if the intelligence community or the medical/dentistry community in the government and military was devoid of gays, guess what??...we wouldn't have doctors, nurses, spies, and dentists worth a damn in sufficient numbers in those fields

the friends of mine who are my age and are retired enlisted or officers pretty much concur...many gays will take lower paying jobs in the military and civil service (often due to prejudice...yes, it still exists) where many straight members of these fields have a more wide field of privelidge in the higher paying civilian sector

believe it or not, gays (if basically quiet) stand a better chance in the public sector where layoffs are not as common...many people, even today, are really laid off because they are gay

[NavyIntel007]

Originally posted by jefhatfield
i don't have problems with gay or straight leaders

my bosses' boss at the defense department was gay..she did a great job and was a gs-14 (out of a possible 15)

my boss at the CIA was gay...FORMER marine officer...no such thing as an ex-marine!!

and yes, my scoutmaster, a vietnam veteran who served proudly, was gay

if the intelligence community or the medical/dentistry community in the government and military was devoid of gays, guess what??...we wouldn't have doctors, nurses, spies, and dentists worth a damn in sufficient numbers in those fields

the friends of mine who are my age and are retired enlisted or officers pretty much concur...many gays will take lower paying jobs in the military and civil service (often due to prejudice...yes, it still exists) where many straight members of these fields have a more wide field of privelidge in the higher paying civilian sector

believe it or not, gays (if basically quiet) stand a better chance in the public sector where layoffs are not as common...many people, even today, are really laid off because they are gay

I don't either, I'm just saying that when you have 13-18 year olds it's not such a good thing. Johnny comes home and tells mom and dad that two boys were kissing and other stuff at the last camp out and Johnny is no longer a scout. Neither are his friends. Now you can argue that this behavior wouldn't be allowed but who's to stop it? This is why there are Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts. If you merged these two groups, you'd have lots of kissing and touching going on. And unless you're Larry Flynt, that's the last thing you want.

[jefhatfield]

Originally posted by NavyIntel007
I don't either, I'm just saying that when you have 13-18 year olds it's not such a good thing. Johnny comes home and tells mom and dad that two boys were kissing and other stuff at the last camp out and Johnny is no longer a scout. Neither are his friends. Now you can argue that this behavior wouldn't be allowed but who's to stop it? This is why there are Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts. If you merged these two groups, you'd have lots of kissing and touching going on. And unless you're Larry Flynt, that's the last thing you want.

omg, here i am trying to get serious with military, medical, and spy stuff and you bring that stuff up>>he he ;)

when i was a scout, some 20+ years ago, or more....one of the boy scouts in the troop went on a JOINT excursion with swedish girl scouts

man, did he have stories...he said those swedish girl scouts...were agressive:eek:

...i have to admit, larry flint or not, i was...JEALOUS;)

[Zion Grail]

Eagle Scout, 2K1. w00t!

[NavyIntel007]

Originally posted by Zion Grail
Eagle Scout, 2K1. w00t!

Welcome to the party.

[tazo]

Originally posted by NavyIntel007
Yeah sure, parents would be all over that idea.:rolleyes:

Depends where you live...

[legion]

Because of this thread, I went and did a little snooping about my old Troop and OA lodge....

What happened to the BSA??? It's totally bureaucratic. In the good ol'days (and please realize I'm only 27), BoyScouts was about the wilderness, responsiblity, etc... today, it doesn't look like any of it. I now completely understand some of the posts I've seen from recent Eagles and members about "not getting it" The OA is ridiculous (district-fied into grid names???!) Once upon a time, it (the OA) was more or less a secret elite camping society....now it's an open book with voting, etc.

It's probably a lost cause to bring the BSA back to its roots, I just hope that there are other organizations that can fill that once rustic niche...

And for those who think having gay members in the BSA is going to result in boy-on-boy action:eek:, realize that there have been and probably always will be gay members in the BSA. If you adhere to the tenet of respect, along with it should follow tolerance (for yourself and others) These principles keep the unthinkable from happening.

The other way of looking at it is that if you apply that logic, then all nudist beaches have nothing but orgies on them and women shouldn't be allowed to hold executive positions (ol' boys club) because who knows what could happen at board meetings... It's just an excuse to justify discrimination (while trying to appear non-bigoted.)

[NavyIntel007]

Originally posted by legion
And for those who think having gay members in the BSA is going to result in boy-on-boy action:eek:, realize that there have been and probably always will be gay members in the BSA. If you adhere to the tenet of respect, along with it should follow tolerance (for yourself and others) These principles keep the unthinkable from happening.

The other way of looking at it is that if you apply that logic, then all nudist beaches have nothing but orgies on them and women shouldn't be allowed to hold executive positions (ol' boys club) because who knows what could happen at board meetings... It's just an excuse to justify discrimination (while trying to appear non-bigoted.)

You are comparing the actions of an adult to those of a child. Before you come out and call me a bigot, you should realize that there are plenty of good reasons to be openly against having gay members. One of which, is the "summer romance" theory. The other is just beaurocracy. The BSA is supported by tons of Christian Conservative organizations. By letting gays in, you pretty much remove that lifeline. And that's a big lifeline. And still another, maybe you don't realize how homophobic 13-15 year olds are. Most boys that age in the BSA will hide it so no one else knows for fear that they will be called... gay. Membership would fall, maybe not drastically but they aren't willing to take that risk.

So call names all you want, Troll. My BSA career is not shrouded in nostalgia.

[jelloshotsrule]

but your implication that allowing gay members would somehow increase the sexual activity is off base. there wouldn't necessarily be more gay members, they would just be able to be more open about it. and sorry, but i don't think that keeping kids in the closet until they're 18 or 20 or 25 or whatever is the way to deal with the issue. your point about the conservative christian backing is a much better point (in that it's more logical, while not necessarily a good thing).

the idea that if a gay headmaster is there, that he'd definitely be attracted to little boys is preposterous. and likewise with the kids (though less so). i'm not attracted to all girls. and even the ones i am attracted to, my goal is not inherently to try to get some action

but perhaps i am not the "norm"

[sketchy]

Originally posted by legion
Because of this thread, I went and did a little snooping about my old Troop and OA lodge....

Once upon a time, it (the OA) was more or less a secret elite camping society....now it's an open book with voting, etc.


The OA was "secretive" when I was a Scout (I am 27) but anyone could go to the district scout office and buy OA books.. the there was a "Secret" district council for the OA (as in no one knew about it, but not really a secret). I grew up in Roanoke VA and we held the district OA chapter meetings there -- we went over budgets and stuff like that. A few people from select troops would vote on when and where to hold weekend camping events, budget for the indian dress, etc.


Dave

[NavyIntel007]

Originally posted by jelloshotsrule
but your implication that allowing gay members would somehow increase the sexual activity is off base. there wouldn't necessarily be more gay members, they would just be able to be more open about it. and sorry, but i don't think that keeping kids in the closet until they're 18 or 20 or 25 or whatever is the way to deal with the issue. your point about the conservative christian backing is a much better point (in that it's more logical, while not necessarily a good thing).

the idea that if a gay headmaster is there, that he'd definitely be attracted to little boys is preposterous. and likewise with the kids (though less so). i'm not attracted to all girls. and even the ones i am attracted to, my goal is not inherently to try to get some action

but perhaps i am not the "norm"

It would never be open. People aren't even open about being scouts because they are afraid they'll be called gay. What makes you think they'll be any more welcome in an organization that's completely homophobic already? Adding gay scouts into the mix won't change that but rather make it worse.

And lets not forget the 30,000 year tradition of our friend the Bully.

[scem0]

Originally posted by NavyIntel007
It would never be open. People aren't even open about being scouts because they are afraid they'll be called gay. What makes you think they'll be any more welcome in an organization that's completely homophobic already? Adding gay scouts into the mix won't change that but rather make it worse.

And lets not forget the 30,000 year tradition of our friend the Bully.

I agree - let's overlook this problem and let the homophobia fester in this great and moralistic organization.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

scem0

[NavyIntel007]

Originally posted by scem0
I agree - let's overlook this problem and let the homophobia fester in this great and moralistic organization.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

scem0

Yeah and you're prety naive to think that a bunch of teenage boys are going to find "love and understanding." Outsiders call the scouts gay because they are an all boy organization. THAT is where the homophobia lies. That's not going to change, letting gays in would make the homophobia worse. Unlike you, scem0, I stuck it out the whole way... so I'm probably more familiar with this than you. :mad:

[scem0]

Originally posted by NavyIntel007
Yeah and you're prety naive to think that a bunch of teenage boys are going to find "love and understanding." Outsiders call the scouts gay because they are an all boy organization. THAT is where the homophobia lies. That's not going to change, letting gays in would make the homophobia worse. Unlike you, scem0, I stuck it out the whole way... so I'm probably more familiar with this than you. :mad:

You don't need to be part of the scouts to know about this.

Ive never heard an outsider call the scouts gay.

Letting homosexuals into BSA might make it worse but it is better than just doing nothing.

scem0

[legion]

Originally posted by sketchy
The OA was "secretive" when I was a Scout (I am 27) but anyone could go to the district scout office and buy OA books.. the there was a "Secret" district council for the OA (as in no one knew about it, but not really a secret). I grew up in Roanoke VA and we held the district OA chapter meetings there -- we went over budgets and stuff like that. A few people from select troops would vote on when and where to hold weekend camping events, budget for the indian dress, etc.


Dave

Your experience was more along the lines of what it was when I went through scouts. Our meetings were kind of covert, word of mouth was how you were notified of the meetings (no emails, or websites, or even flyers/mail), meetings were at night on scouting trips (most past midnight) and they were held usually across from where the rest of the troop was sleeping. The Ordeal and the tasks involved were never spoken about (it was the "grand" mystery.) If you weren't at the camping trip, you were called to showup and would drive out just for the meeting and then leave so no one knew you were there. I honestly can't remember a single OA meeting held indoors (after all, rain and snow etc shouldn't be any kind of issue for an OA member :cool: )

What I'm seeing with the information presented by the BSA and the OA now is meetings and getaways to college campuses, "re-zoning" of lodges (plus my lodge has been merged and renamed which ticks me off since we were one of the first and now it looks like the lodge has been around only a few years :( ), more importance placed on national networking than local camping and environmental issues...

(on a side note, I'm glad to see another 27 yr old on these forums (and an ol' Scout :) ); I always wonder want the median age group is for sites...)