15-inch Screens Demand Exceeding Supply

[MacRumors]

MacWorld.co.uk reports (http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/main_news.cfm?NewsID=6868) that due to the strong sales of laptops this year, demand for 15-inch LCDs have exceeded the supply.

As a result, there is "a significant shortage of 15-inch LCD monitors at present".

[DrGruv1]

another delay...

[Lancetx]

Hmm, 15" iMacs don't seem to be in short supply though. If this was a problem, wouldn't it affect those too?

[redcalx]

Possible delays? From Apple?

YOU'RE KIDDING ME.

Damn I hope my Dual 2ghz shows up soon.

[Mudbug]

I wonder if this is really what is slowing things down, especially with other computer manufacturers using 15" screens in their laptops now.

[Powerbook G5]

But this is Apple, so when is a delay actual news? :p

[bikertwin]

This made page one? This is news?

The PowerBook's 15.2" screen is:

a. widescreen (sorta)
b. 1280 x 854 resolution

This has nothing to do with 15" desktop LCDs which are:

a. conventional aspect ratio (4:3)
b. 1024x768

If anything, this has more to do with availability of the 15" iMac than anything to do with PowerBooks.

Is it me, or are Mac rumor sites sinking to new lows? :rolleyes:

[Physiognome]

It would be hard to believe that 15-inch iMacs are in high demand. The only people I know that have them are school employees.

[chazmox]

Originally posted by bikertwin
This made page one? This is news?

The PowerBook's 15.2" screen is:

a. widescreen (sorta)
b. 1280 x 854 resolution

This has nothing to do with 15" desktop LCDs which are:

a. conventional aspect ratio (4:3)
b. 1024x768

If anything, this has more to do with availability of the 15" iMac than anything to do with PowerBooks.

Is it me, or are Mac rumor sites sinking to new lows? :rolleyes:

Are you faulting the rumor sites or the guy who referenced the iMac above.

The macrumors article and the MacWorld article did not talk about desktops - only laptops/notebooks.

"Demand for 15-inch screens – as used in many notebooks – has also exceeded supply, as manufacturers move production to more profitable larger-sized screens ."

[arn]

Originally posted by bikertwin
This made page one? This is news?

Is it me, or are Mac rumor sites sinking to new lows? :rolleyes:

LCD supplies affect product lines. Both notebook and Display supplies of 15" screens are limited.

I'm not sure why this isn't relevant.

I removed the speculation from the main article -- as people seem to be reading too much into it. But yes, low 15" supplies could affect PowerBook or iMac lines.

arn

[Powerbook G5]

Originally posted by Physiognome
It would be hard to believe that 15-inch iMacs are in high demand. The only people I know that have them are school employees.

My girlfriend has one and absolutely loves hers.

[bikertwin]

OK, perhaps I was a little too harsh. I read "monitor" as something free-standing that sits on a desk, and "screen" as something that's either part of a monitor or part of a notebook. But in retrospect the article is pretty vague about the difference, if any.

In any case, many many notebooks (and freestanding "monitors") use 1024x768 LCD screens/panels. They are commodities. I can definitely see a shortage here.

But how many desktop monitors use a 15.2" or 15.4" widescreen LCP panel/screen? None that I know of.

And Dell & Emachines are the only other notebook makers with a widescreen 15.x" panels/screens. (Are there others?) I doubt there's a shortage, since these are higher priced and not the commodities that the 1024x768 4:3 panels are. No one makes a high profit on commodities, so companies pull back from making them, leading to shortages.

[arn]

Originally posted by bikertwin

In any case, many many notebooks (and freestanding "monitors") use 1024x768 LCD screens/panels. They are commodities. I can definitely see a shortage here.

But how many desktop monitors use a 15.2" or 15.4" widescreen LCP panel/screen? None that I know of.


True... and I suppose the supply is specifically low for the 15" size -- and not the raw materials.... since it seems screen-manufacturers are moving away from 15" to larger sizes.

arn

[ImAlwaysRight]

People are really buying 15" LCD's? I thought they were too small for most people's tastes. Apple actually did away with their 15" LCD what, 2 years ago now? I would have guessed 17-inch displays would run low, but not 15 inches.

[york2600]

I'll stick with my 19in CRT till I can afford a nice 18in+ LCD. That might be a while though. I dont' want anything on my desk with Dell's name on it and those are the only affordable ones out there.

[themadchemist]

I think this is bigger news for those who follow screen manufacturers than for those who follow Apple.

[iBot]

Don't the iBooks still use 15-inch screens?

[Genie]

Does this mean 17 inch screens are hard to get too?
Please forgive my ignorance...

http://www.geniesongs.com/products/closeups/images/GenieWildflowersCoverTiny.jpg

[Spidermanjohn]

My G3 PowerBook has outlasted every-one of our Titaniums at my TV station. This same G3 PB is pushing its fifth birthday and has never had a problem with the chassis. All of our Titanium designs have broken a chassis within a year of everyday use. I am waiting for a better design before we purchase another PowerBook, though we do love the iBook design. Give us a G4 in the iBook and we shall once again purchase a PowerBook. Don’t, once again, blame another company for your problems. The Titaniums and Aluminiums are pretty, but very, very fragile when putting them in the field.

We have had to render all of our 3D work on a PC within the last year. I hate that we are doing this, but our dual G4 system are not even close to the same speed. OK, we have ordered these new undelivered G5’s still sitting on a dock somewhere. Yes, we have ordered, but we have yet to receive any of the new G5’s. AND we are an educational institution!!! Our animation project is due by the end of this month and the Dells are kicking G4 butt. My animators are literally crying because we are using Dells to render Cinema XL projects. Just one last word—AAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

[vitrector]

I knw from reliable sources, though am not an expert myself, that pretty much all LCDs use the same "glass" from a single manufacturer. This means that any shortage of supplies of LCDs should indicate a shortage of LCD raw materials in general or a shift away from the smaller screens.
The use of LCDs is booming as the tight budgets at many large corporations are being relaxed a little to persue necessary upgrades of their IT hardware. A major component of this is the increased installation of LCDs. I know this to be true for medical facilities.
The shortage of the 15 inch probably just represents a shift in production to the larger screens, such as the 20 inch LCDs, while many big purchasers are buying the 15 inch in greater volumes. (BTW the Dell 20 inch LCD is a great screen and very affordable for large purchasers, significantly less than $1000 in volume.)
just my 2 cents...

[charlesc]

If we don't get pb updates next week I'd almost be inclined to believe motorola is the true source of that story! Maybe they are trying to get the spotlight off them for dropping the ball with the cpu's for the new pb's.... Then again SJ wouldn't be going to Paris unless he has something(s) he knows we are all drooling for...

[WM.]

I'm with bikertwin here. Most likely this will only affect the 15" iMac--not the PowerBooks--and I don't think it's a huge disaster if it takes 8 business days instead of 5 to deliver someone's 15-incher. I mean, they can't be selling all that many of them anymore--or at least the demand must be more even (and thus easier to satisfy) than with the pro lines. In other words, Joe Blow isn't going to know or care about how long it's been since the last iMac refresh, so he'll buy throughout the cycle ---> fairly constant levels of demand. But those of us who read MR buy a whole bunch of PowerBooks and Power Macs right after they're refreshed, and the demand drops off after that. So, again, I don't think this is much of an issue for Apple.

Of course, I'm planning to order a 15" AlBook the second they show up on store.apple.com, so I might be just a tiny bit biased. :D

WM

[bikertwin]

Originally posted by arn
True... and I suppose the supply is specifically low for the 15" size -- and not the raw materials.... since it seems screen-manufacturers are moving away from 15" to larger sizes.

arn

My point being that availability of 1024x768 15" LCD panels (used in hundreds of models of desktop monitors and notebook displays) has nothing--as in zilch, zero, nada--to do with availability of high-resolution, widescreen 15.2" PowerBook LCD panels.

It's like comparing 1440x1024(?) 17" widescreen panels (in PowerBooks and 17" iMac) with desktop 4:3 17" (1280x1024) models. I doubt there's any connection in their production. They're different beasts. They both just happen to be 17".

But I could be wrong. :D

[machem]

Originally posted by Spidermanjohn


We have had to render all of our 3D work on a PC within the last year. I hate that we are doing this, but our dual G4 system are not even close to the same speed. OK, we have ordered these new undelivered G5’s still sitting on a dock somewhere. Yes, we have ordered, but we have yet to receive any of the new G5’s. AND we are an educational institution!!! Our animation project is due by the end of this month and the Dells are kicking G4 butt. My animators are literally crying because we are using Dells to render Cinema XL projects. Just one last word—AAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

Your undelivered G5s must be even more frustration-inducing knowing that they have to travel less than 10 miles to you, eh?

You had trouble with the Al chassis also? Except for the hinge design, I prefer the look of the Ti. I thought the Al was more robust, however.

Since it appears new 'books are coming next week (http://www.appleinsider.com), they will be Al models.

[cb911]

well one thing's for sure: you can't sell PowerBooks without a monitor. :p

we need a good smiley for *nervous*.



i just tried to see that rumors on appleinsider about the PowerBooks coming next week, but i can't get to the story. can someone post the entire story here? all i can get to is the headline. thanks. :)

[SeaFox]

Originally posted by iBot
Don't the iBooks still use 15-inch screens?

iBooks have never used 15" screens. They use 12" & 14".

I like how all the early posts seem to imply this is an Apple problem, it's an entire-industry-thing, not another Apple-not-keeping-up-with-demand thing. :rolleyes:



...But it sure would make a nice excuse for Powerbook delays.

[charlesc]

i just tried to see that rumors on appleinsider about the PowerBooks coming next week, but i can't get to the story. can someone post the entire story here? all i can get to is the headline. thanks. :) [/B]

Apple to Refresh PowerBooks in Paris

By:_Kasper Jade
09.11.03

For some Apple loyalists the wait for a new breed of PowerBook G4s has seemed like an eternity. Rumors routinely began to surface back in May, just prior to the company's annual World Wide Developer Conference. At the time, much of the buzz surrounded hints of a revised 15" model and soon spanned across the entire PowerBook product line.

A month later Apple's developer conference had come and gone and new PowerBooks remained as nothing more than hearsay. By mid-July sales of the current line of PowerBooks had slumped considerably in anticipation of the overdue revisions. The bi-annual Macworld trade show arrived shortly thereafter and high expectations once again turned to disappointment among eager PowerBook buyers.

With little to no explanation from the Apple, and frustration building among avid consumers, sources began to paint a muggy picture of Apple microchip supplier, Motorola. As it was reported, problems with the chip-maker's 0.13 micron process were resulting in extremely poor yields of the high-end PowerPC 7457 G4 processor, code-named 'Apollo 7.' Unfortunately for Apple, the PowerPC 7457 family of semiconductors were to power the entire line of new PowerBook G4s.

By late August the situation fared no better. Apple's two largest hardware distributors showed an almost completely depleted inventory of all current PowerBook G4 configurations. The computer company had missed out on potential millions in educational and back-to-school sales and their retailers were growing anxious. To levitate some concerns -- during the last week of August -- Apple told some of its select retail partners to expect new PowerBooks in early to mid September.

It wasn't until last week that sources began mumbling the first bits of promising information on the subject. According to an AppleInsider source, Apple's chip supplier had finally accumulated an ample supply of the faster PowerPC 7457 mobile chips. This news was soon echoed by French Mac news publisher, MacBidouille. According to the site, success rates on high-end PowerPC 7457 production improved this month with Motorola producing 30,000 and 20,000 units of the 1.25GHz and 1.3GHz chips, respectively. However, since Motorola's engagement with Apple sets a pre-defined price on microprocessors, they are currently eating a loss of approximately $125 per functional unit.

Nevertheless, AppleInsider has positively confirmed with multiple sources that the new species of PowerBook G4s will make their debut on September 16th during Apple Expo in Paris, France. While the confirmation has been specific to a remodeled 15" PowerBook, it's expected that the entire portable line will be refreshed. This information also corroborates last week's report stating all PowerBook orders would be full-filled within the two week period.

According to reliable sources, demo versions of these new PowerBooks are currently being produced and shipped to the site of the expo. Upon arrival, the laptops will be met by Apple engineers who will update their system software to the recently finalized version of Mac OS X 10.2.7 Blackrider.

Previous rumors put the new 15" PowerBook in an aluminum enclosure with ports on the sides, a backlit keyboard, USB 2.0, FireWire 800, and a 1.25 GHz PowerPC G4 processor. The 17" configuration is said to gain USB 2.0 and a 1.3GHz PowerPC G4 processor. It will be interesting to see if Motorola's current yields have allowed Apple to meet these original specifications.

Meanwhile, the computer company is also readying updates to their consumer iBooks. The new units will sport USB 2.0 and AirPort Extreme support, sources said. Additionally, the PowerPC 750FX flavor of IBM's G3 processor allows for the implementation of a 200MHz 60x bus that could potentially keep the portables running Apple's latest OS offerings at more than respectable speeds for a fraction of the cost of the PowerPC G4. Further information pertaining to the official release of these iBooks, as well as their processor generation, is currently unconfirmed.

[cb911]

charlesc, thanks for that. :)

now time to catch up on some reading and decide if new PowerBooks are coming next week.
;) :p :D

[evanmarx]

i read that the shortage concerns the widescreen ratio (1280x800) of 15' lcd screens. not the 4:3 version.

dell's latest notebook used 3 different resolutions of their 15,4' screens (1280x800, 1650x1050, 1920x1200).

now they only sell the two bigger resolutions! no 1280x800. and that's the exact same screen the 15' powerbook was using until now. that means shortage on the new Al powerbook too, unless they use higher res screens (e.g. 1650x1050) which would be too much for my taste...

so the shortage looks real.

[trilogic]

although a higher resolution might be very cool. there is a downside that there are different resolution for 15" displays.

have you ever looked at a flash website that has small pixelfonts on a 15" dell laptop with 1650x1050 or even higher res?

everything get's so tiny that you can hardly read stuff.

with win xp you can change the resolution from 120dpi down to 96dpi. then webpages are displayed in the "correct" size. but all pictures look like crap, because the browser has to scale the pictures.

[evanmarx]

Originally posted by trilogic
although a higher resolution might be very cool. there is a downside that there are different resolution for 15" displays.

have you ever looked at a flash website that has small pixelfonts on a 15" dell laptop with 1650x1050 or even higher res?</B>

i know, i'm a webdesigner myself, i've seen it, i hate it.

<B>everything get's so tiny that you can hardly read stuff.

with win xp you can change the resolution from 120dpi down to 96dpi. then webpages are displayed in the "correct" size. but all pictures look like crap, because the browser has to scale the pictures.

i know. i've seen it. i hate it

that's why i'm tending toward a 17' (1440x900). seen it. love it!

[windwaves]

hmmmmmmmmm,
oh !.....interesting, very interesting

[eric_n_dfw]

There's a shortage because Apple probably bought all of them and they are installed in a 100,000 15" Al PowerBooks that sit in an Apple factory waiting to be mated to G4 chips that Moto was supposed to ship months ago. :eek:


Okay, maybe not. ;)

Seriously though, didn't Apple invest heavily in Samsung a couple of years ago to make sure their name was always near the top of the list to get CRT glass when they needed it?

[eric_n_dfw]

Originally posted by trilogic
although a higher resolution might be very cool. there is a downside that there are different resolution for 15" displays.

have you ever looked at a flash website that has small pixelfonts on a 15" dell laptop with 1650x1050 or even higher res?

everything get's so tiny that you can hardly read stuff.

with win xp you can change the resolution from 120dpi down to 96dpi. then webpages are displayed in the "correct" size. but all pictures look like crap, because the browser has to scale the pictures. Seems like the OS and app's like Flash need to be smart enough to rescale not only fonts but maybe images to match the DPI (or is it Pixels Per Inch for screens?) . Do JPG's contain info about how many DPI or PPI that they are supposed to be representing? I know TIFF and other formats used in print publishing do.

[Photorun]

My understanding is that the LCD panels that are in the iMac are not the same one as in the Powerbook. This after seeing them both taken apart. Powerbook is radically different so I'm thinking whatever shortages wont affect laptops unless it's a global part used across the board causing shortages.

For the person upstream, iBooks use 12.1 and 14.1 TFT displays, nothing close to 15 inch. Again, if there's some part used in all LCDs then I could see that affecting the iBook, if not, no affect.

[WM.]

Originally posted by evanmarx
no 1280x800. and that's the exact same screen the 15' powerbook was using until now. that means shortage on the new Al powerbook too, unless they use higher res screens (e.g. 1650x1050) which would be too much for my taste...

so the shortage looks real.
No, the 15" TiBook uses a screen with 854 pixels vertically, not 800. (Can't remember what the horizontal pixel count is right now...)

HTH
WM