Graphic Design Schools. Recommendations? [Archive]

estlin

Oct 16, 2003, 04:36 PM

Art Institute has a no portfolio policy. While that may take a small load off your shoulders as the application process for all schools is quite hectic, this also has several implications:

(1) There is no qualitative screening process, so you're bound to get a lot of people with no talent/skills. You need to have comparable peers; otherwise, how do you challenge and inspire each other? This is essential to the design process.

(2) AI focuses on making a profit. That is why they don't require a portfolio, they want as many people as possible. As long as you can pay their high tuition, you're in.

Don't get me wrong; there have been some impressive work to come from AI. Some people merely require a little pushing and prodding and they bloom. AI is very much about the practical. They hire working professionals, so you do get an idea of the real world, plus some nice contacts as well. But if you're looking to expand your mind and conceptual skills, I wouldn't recommend AI.

AI also has a bad rep in the design biz. Ok, don't want to argue about reputable schools and such (I went to what some consider one of the best design schools, and I thought it was terrrible and left). But sometimes it can make some people pass over your resume & portfolio. OK, I know this is not a great argument, but take it however you want.

But the bottom line is this. If AI was cheap, it would be a good compromise for some people. But it is just as expensive or more than other schools, so it's just not worth it.

Where generally are you looking at schools, still in Texas or all over the country?

jphoenix

Oct 16, 2003, 04:49 PM

I'm looking all over the country. Texas isn't bad, but I don't want to lower my options by just sticking to TX. I've been thinking about California recently, particularly the San Fran area. Only reason I mentioned Art Institue is because I got a flier in the mail that mentioned that the Houston branch is now doing Bachelors, but I'm not sure how great the Houston branch, and the Art Institute in general, really are.

neut

Oct 16, 2003, 05:38 PM

why do you want to go to school for graphic design?

universities are usually behind the times tech wise (unless your tuition is high) ;)

AI's are good for surrounding yourself with art.

what do you want to do with GD?

If you want to be employed by a large corporation you will need a degree (but the money is in marketing anyway). You won't be doing anything fulfilling though.

freelance is hard these days. gd is moving to flash, video and film. print is old hat.

where do you see yourself?

litosclone

Oct 16, 2003, 06:09 PM

The Art Center (Albuquerque, NM)
Working professional’s train you, you learn on the most up to date programs (Adobe, Quark, Ect.) They have an excellent portfolio policy. The school offers a 2yr. (Assoc. Degree) or a 4yr. BOA. It's a private school for Graphic Design, so you focus on the industry and your not being bogged down with meaning less classes that don't apply to your major

rhpenguin

Oct 16, 2003, 07:14 PM

Sheridan College in Toronto...

wrc fan

Oct 16, 2003, 09:20 PM

Originally posted by jphoenix
Why do you say the Art Institute is a joke?

I graduated from The Art Institute in Seattle over a year ago. Nobody in my graduating class, except for maybe 1 or 2 people have gotten a job in the field (although it was Multimedia not Graphic Design). The reason? As soon as the people see AIS on the resume they politely tell you that the position has been filled. Why? Cause 90% of the people that graduate from there have no skill, and no talent. And unfortunatley that ruins it's rep for the 10% that are actually quite talented.

shecky

Oct 16, 2003, 10:05 PM

what level of school are you looking for? top tier? midrange? private? public? i can offer a few suggestions depending on what your looking at.

Art Institute is the graphic design equivalent of those late nite TV ads where you can get your diploma in Bookeeping, Law Enforcement, Refigorator Repair, etc....

"print is old hat" is the most ridiculous thing i have ever heard. print design is in as much demand as web or motion graphics. until they get rid of books, magazines, posters, business cards, flyers, annual reports, catalogs, monographs, and about 1000 other forms of print media i think print design is every bit as important as digital media, if not more so.

and lets not forget that (in my opinion) there are far, far, far more untalented web designers than print designers. just because everyone with a ripped copy of Photoshop thinks he/she can make a website does not mean print is dead. A computer to a real designer is just a tool, a really expensive, versatile pencil if you will. the problem with computers is that a lot of people out there manage to conceal the fact that they are talentless by hiding behind dreamweaver templates and photoshop filters. thats why 95% of websites are horrible. The good thing about computers is that it allows a designer to work much much MUCH faster and can in some cases allow the designer to be MORE creative and flexible to respond to the needs of a client. So i think that going into a program based on exposure to computers is not a valid reason to go into a design program. However, it is a very good reason to go into a vocational program.

Sweetfeld28

Oct 16, 2003, 10:35 PM

while i was at a two year college i heard about this school:

http://www.fullsail.com/index.cfm?mnc=25

they are a two year school. You are in school seven days a week for eight hours a day. I think. It also cost something like thirty or fourty thousand to go here. I wish i would've had the money, cause then i would've gone here.

Good luck with your search.

mactastic

Oct 16, 2003, 10:42 PM

The school I go to has both an Art and Design department, and a Graphic communications department as well. I've heard they are both at least decent, the tuition is reasonable (although going up), but housing will bite you in the ass. The school itself has a very good reputation in the state. It is (rumored to be;)) the top State University (not to be confused with the University of California system) in the state, and I know some of the Art majors have to work their butts off to get through. Anyway, here's a couple links to the departments. Good luck wherever you end up.
Cal Poly Graphic Communication Department (http://www.grc.calpoly.edu/)
Art and Design Department (http://cla.calpoly.edu/art/)

Coca-Cola

Oct 16, 2003, 10:59 PM

My advice... look for positions now. For instance Pixar has positions available on their website. Look at those positions, then get the training necessary to fill those positions. Go to a school as close to the entertainment industry as possible. I think Cal arts might be a good one.

jphoenix

Oct 16, 2003, 11:45 PM

Thanks for the comments everyone, they've been helpful. To be more specific, what I really want to do is find a good, 4 year school where I can get a masters. I want to specialize in graphic design with emphasis on web design as a career. I'm currently getting started on and learning web design. I would like to go somewhere with a good reputation that would teach me plenty to be able to work in different positions in the field, whether it be graphic design for print and video, or for the web.

oldschool

Oct 17, 2003, 01:29 AM

look at the back of archie comics. if u send in a drawing, they'll tell u how good u are, and send u a pamphlet about art.

shecky

Oct 17, 2003, 01:53 AM

in terms of top-tier/most competitive schools in the US this is my short list (and what i looked at for schools):

Cranbrook Academy of Art
http://www.cranbrookart.edu/2d/index.html - Michigan

Yale University (school of art)
http://www.yale.edu/art/ - Connecticut

The New School (Parsons School of Design)
http://www.parsons.edu - NYC

The Art Center College of Design
http://www.artcenter.edu/ - California. I plan on doing my Masters' Degree for Industrial Design here

Rhode Island School of Design
http://www.risd.edu - Rhode Island. where i currently attend school - BFA in Graphic Design

again, these are basically among the so-called "best" schools. i would also look at Savannah College of Art & Design http://www.scad.edu and Massachusetts College of Art http://www.massart.edu

neut

Oct 17, 2003, 09:20 AM

Originally posted by shecky
"print is old hat" is the most ridiculous thing i have ever heard...and lets not forget that (in my opinion) there are far, far, far more untalented web designers than print designers...the problem with computers is that a lot of people out there manage to conceal the fact that they are talentless by hiding behind dreamweaver templates and photoshop filters. thats why 95% of websites are horrible.

the print industry has gone to ****. designers are moving to multimedia and old farts are left running the show. there too much high demand for product that good print design gets lost in the rush.

i did print for a few years (and occasionally still do some), but turn-around is insane these days. no time to concept anything.

im sick of wasting paper anyways.

your right about the lack of digital talent. overused filters, stock photos, and blatant style hijacking expose them to those who know...but the public is blind.

e-coli

Oct 17, 2003, 10:12 AM

Portfolio Center has a great program.

The School of Design at N.C. State is great, too. But it's almost impossible to get into.

Cranbrook is great, but that goes without saying.

the print industry has gone to ****. designers are moving to multimedia and old farts are left running the show. there too much high demand for product that good print design gets lost in the rush

I would agree, to some extent. But if I had to do it all over again, I would go straight into advertising. Most designers would kill me for saying this. Actually, several years ago, I would have lashed myself for saying it. But in advertising, you can't cheat. Either your concept works really well, or it doesn't. You can't design your way into a solution. It's all about critical thinking. The good advertising, that it.

Just open up the D&AD annual. It's the best work around right now.

jayscheuerle

Oct 17, 2003, 10:51 AM

I went to the Otis Art Institute of Parson's School of Design in Los Angeles. Parson's also has schools in NYC and Paris, which is nice because you can spend a couple of years at one of the other schools, giving you a better-rounded education.

My schooling was before computers were used for design so intensively (I went for illustration), but I found that the L.A. school and the N.Y.C. school had different focuses. L.A. was more focused on people learning their technical chops, where N.Y.C. was more about the ideas behind the work. Fore their respective markets, that made sense at the time.

Art School in the late 80's/early 90's was fun (as far as I can recall), but you're more exposed to things than taught. The talent is either there or not. The most neglected part of an education is teaching you what to do with your degree once you get it–how to get work after graduation. Expose, copy and learn to make things your own. Nothing beats creation in volume. The more you do, the better you'll get at finding what your own design style is.

Good luck! - j

neut

Oct 17, 2003, 11:00 AM

Originally posted by jayscheuerle
The more you do, the better you'll get - j

here, here!

create, create, create.

if your not constantly critically thinking, your at least in the wrong biz, if not in the wrong lifetime...

insidedanshead

Oct 17, 2003, 11:10 AM

it doesn't matter where you go. what matters is what you have to show for going to that school. you have to ask the school, "when i graduate from here will i have a marketable portfolio? will people want the skills that my portfolio shows? it's ALL about your work not the name of the school. i also second the AI comments, they want money and that's all it comes down to.

Peyote

Oct 17, 2003, 11:15 AM

Dude! You are overlooking the most obvious choise in design schools, and the school that you should be looking at first!

I'm talking about a 4 year college with a competative communication design (graphic arts) program. This college is probably THE BEST graphic arts school in the southwestern U.S. This college just got a brand new building this fall to support its program is it has grown 50% in the past two years. This college has professors that previously worked in the design industry, some of them with 25 years experience. This college just bought over 75 new G4 dual 1.25 ghz Macs, each with 1 GB of ram and each with a 17" Apple LCD screen. This program also just got all new Epson 3200 scanners, and a $10,000 wide format printer (just for the design department). This college held the "Bronze Portfolio" award from the Creative Summit from 1999-2002, each year. This award recognizes outstanding school.

This College has students whose work is constantly featured in Communication Arts magazine, as well as Print and others. Communication Arts Magazine is doing a story on this college because of the sheer amount of good design that comes out of it.

Last but not least, this college is only around an hour from where you live now! I'm talking about Southwest Texas (now Texas State). I'm graduating this semester with my BFA in Comdes (communication design, a.k.a graphic design). I have learned so much in this program it's unreal. I was also just accepted into the Art Directors Club of Houston Annual Competition (the student show). I might even win a medal, but that's yet to be determined. Incidentally, there were probably around 30 pieces that got into the Houston show from Southwest (err...texas state, or whatever).

Feel free to email me at

email@kevinbabcock.net

if you have any questions about our program. We could possibly have a Masters degree program in a couple of years, but in this profession you don't need it very much unless you want to teach. And remember that in the art world a masters degree is similar to a PhD in other fields, because PhD's basically do not exist for artists or designers. But one of my professors is pioneering a masters program. He had been working on it and finished his proposal last Spring, so its up in the air right now. Anyway, I could go on about our new building, classes, faculty, equipment, etc, but there are way too many things that I like to list. Just email me for more info. I think there are only a few schools that are better than Southwest. One is the Portfolio Center, but that is really just a finishing school to help you refine your already existing skills. Another is Creative Circus, but that's not a 4 year university.

BTW, my wife teaches at UTSA. I doubt you're in one of her classes but her name is Jaime Babcock and she teaches English.

Peyote

Oct 17, 2003, 11:16 AM

oops, double post

Peyote

Oct 17, 2003, 11:22 AM

Originally posted by insidedanshead
it doesn't matter where you go. what matters is what you have to show for going to that school. you have to ask the school, "when i graduate from here will i have a marketable portfolio? will people want the skills that my portfolio shows? it's ALL about your work not the name of the school. i also second the AI comments, they want money and that's all it comes down to.

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you. A school's reputation helps with a potential employer. Any designer seeking a job in this flooded market needs every edge possible. To flippantly say it doesn't matter where you go is dangerous. For instance, if you went to Creative Circus and got a degree from them, then went for a job, they are going to want to know where you went to school. Why? This tells them what your focus was (concept, hand skills, creative process, etc). If you went to school with little or no reputation, they are takign a chance on you to an extent. They don't know who your professors were, or what they taught you.

Additionally, and potential employer is likely a creative director or something similar, and probably went to a design school themself. Don't you think that if you went to the same school they did, or even a well known better one, they are going to consider hiring you over someone that went to a school that is an unknown?

As much as you may want it to be untrue, the fact remains that your choice of schools, and a school's reputation matter, especially if you are planning to seek a job in an area that has a reputable design school already in the area.

jayscheuerle

Oct 17, 2003, 12:03 PM

Originally posted by Peyote
Sorry, but I have to disagree with you. A school's reputation helps with a potential employer. Any designer seeking a job in this flooded market needs every edge possible. To flippantly say it doesn't matter where you go is dangerous. For instance, if you went to Creative Circus and got a degree from them, then went for a job, they are going to want to know where you went to school. Why? This tells them what your focus was (concept, hand skills, creative process, etc). If you went to school with little or no reputation, they are takign a chance on you to an extent. They don't know who your professors were, or what they taught you.

Additionally, and potential employer is likely a creative director or something similar, and probably went to a design school themself. Don't you think that if you went to the same school they did, or even a well known better one, they are going to consider hiring you over someone that went to a school that is an unknown?

As much as you may want it to be untrue, the fact remains that your choice of schools, and a school's reputation matter, especially if you are planning to seek a job in an area that has a reputable design school already in the area.

The flip-side is that if you walked into an interview with a great portfolio full of printed pieces, some work history behind you and said that you were self-taught and never went to school, you'd probably get plenty of props for your gum-shun.

A degree from a great school and a portfolio full of mediocre work will net you little more than a production job.

The question is: Are you good enough to make the cut?

Peyote

Oct 17, 2003, 12:11 PM

Well don't put words into my mouth. I never said that he could get by with a mediocre portfolio as long as his chool was reputable.

Also, he will be going to school, so it doesn't matter if an employer thinks he has good "gumshun"

Point is, going to a school that has a well established reputation for turning out good designers will not hurt your chances of landing a job, however it will, more often than not, help those chances. There is no good reason to not go to a school with a good reputation.

I agree that your portfolio is the most important aspect of you marketing yourself for a job. All I am saying is that to deny the influence a school's reputation can have is to deny yourself an edge in the marketplace.

jayscheuerle

Oct 17, 2003, 12:20 PM

Originally posted by Peyote
...to deny the influence a school's reputation can have is to deny yourself an edge in the marketplace.

nicely put.

D0ct0rteeth

Oct 17, 2003, 12:31 PM

I was an Art Institute graduate and I agree that the school really is a waste of money... I ended up going back to school again after graduationg as I felt I had learned nothing... however there are more important things to look at.

The quality of the school although important is really nothing compared to the work ethic of the student.. You can succeed at an art institute if you work hard enough, however the teachers and students you are surrounded with ARE NOT ARTISTS.. and cannot inspire you or help you succeed. A BFA at your local State University is actually more valuable than an AI degree.

I know several people who graduated from the Art Institute System and found good jobs.. but they are an exception to the rule and not the norm. My advice is to go to the best school that you can and bust it hard like nobody else... then when you succeed you can PARTY like nobody else..

Try http://www.sva.edu/

Peyote

Oct 17, 2003, 12:42 PM

Originally posted by D0ct0rteeth
I was an Art Institute graduate and I agree that the school really is a waste of money... I ended up going back to school again after graduationg as I felt I had learned nothing... however there are more important things to look at.

The quality of the school although important is really nothing compared to the work ethic of the student.. You can succeed at an art institute if you work hard enough, however the teachers and students you are surrounded with ARE NOT ARTISTS.. and cannot inspire you or help you succeed. A BFA at your local State University is actually more valuable than an AI degree.

I know several people who graduated from the Art Institute System and found good jobs.. but they are an exception to the rule and not the norm. My advice is to go to the best school that you can and bust it hard like nobody else... then when you succeed you can PARTY like nobody else..

Try http://www.sva.edu/

Just to add a little bit to that, I believe that work ethic and your quality of school go hand in hand. It did at least for me. I used to go to SFA, a dinky college in East texas. Their design program was nothing more than teaching photoshop skills, therefore that's all I knew about design. At the time I did very badly in school, my GPA was a 2.15. Once I transferred to Southwest and was attending a school that taught concept and marketable skills I became truly inspired in all my classes. My GPA now is a 3.25. I owe my success to my choice of schools. Once I got into this program and started learning design was more than photoshop skills, I started liking design a lot more. The better the program you are in, the more likely you are to become excited about your choice. You begin to take pride in what you do and truly start to succeed. I am a testament to the power the quality of a college program can have, and the influence it can impact on your outlook and success.

As a point of reference, my friend graduated from SFA 2.5 years ago with the same degree I was going for. The closest she has come to a design job is answering phones in a sign shop. Her job market was HOUSTON, a very good market for Texas. Her degree got her nowhere because she learned nothing about concept and her portfolio shows that.

D0ct0rteeth

Oct 17, 2003, 12:47 PM

Originally posted by Peyote
Once I got into this program and started learning design was more than photoshop skills, I started liking design a lot more. The better the program you are in, the more likely you are to become excited about your choice. You begin to take pride in what you do and truly start to succeed.

Amen Brah. Amen

Peyote

Oct 17, 2003, 12:50 PM

Originally posted by D0ct0rteeth
Amen Brah. Amen

Thanks, my point is simply that what a lot of people today don't realize is that you can never be a successful designer without challenging yourself by going to a competative school with a good program. The higher the standards are at the school you choose, the better your work will be. And those schools with great reputations (like southwest..wink, wink, nudge, nudge) tend to have higher standards to protect those reputations.

jefhatfield

Oct 18, 2003, 08:44 AM

parson's
pratt
cooper union
school of visual arts
rhode island school of design (called one of the big five, but not acutally in new york)

parson's was named earlier, pratt is also great, cooper union is free but thus very selective and hard to get into, school of visual arts is famous, rhode island is considered on the of top schools in the nation...you will do well at any of these fine institutions

a school in that area which as also just as good in art but overshadowed by its other more famous departments is the ivy league columbia university, which will get you a job in any field, regardless of your major, just due to the fact that it is one of the best universities in the nation and has been around for 300 years

new york is the art center for the united states, if not the world, and i would consider going there

i was a rock musician in the 80s and i considered going to los angeles and at that time, before athens, before seattle, los angeles was unrivaled in its connections in the rock and roll record business...so many so called los angeles rock stars were actually musicians that came from elsewhere to settle in the city knowing it's where the center of activity was at for the united states in the music business

good luck on your art education

e-coli

Oct 18, 2003, 09:29 AM

What school you went to has almost no bearing on whether or not you get a gig. At least it shouldn't. All that matters is your portfolio and how strong your ideas are.

Portfolio Center is great for this. You'll get out of there with an amazing looking book.

jefhatfield

Oct 18, 2003, 09:49 AM

i think a good school in any field is a good starting place and a way to get a foot in the door somewhat easier, but after a few gigs, in any field, you will be judged much more on your past performance than your school

pretty soon, if you are really good, people will chase you down based on your reputation and word of mouth and it's possible nobody at that point will know what school you went to or even if you went to school...their primary concern will be to get a job done and get the position filled so it could be done competently

in art, it is true that many very successful artists did not go to art school, but going to art school cannot make you a bad artist if you already have talent and are good

JesseJames

Oct 18, 2003, 10:46 AM

I'd say it's all about being challenged enough. Is the curriculum challenging and nourishing to your talents?
I think that's the key. Also, try to surround yourself with people who are better than you. That's the only way you get better.
That and work your butt off. No substitute for it.

jefhatfield

Oct 18, 2003, 11:13 AM

Originally posted by JesseJames
Also, try to surround yourself with people who are better than you. That's the only way you get better.

that is how i got up to speed in knowing about being a techie...i worked for this company up near the silicon valley and everybody knew more than me and i learned a lot...computerspeak is the second language of the region

and when i was a kid i got better at tennis by always trying to find partners better than me

if you go to an art school and you are better than everyone, either the school is terrible or you are an artistic genius and in that case, you would not need a school, but an agent:p

ps...i have seen a super talented youngun once...it was this 12 year old girl from russia who did oils and acrylics and she was written up internationally and had her paintings selling for big bucks in all the galleries...when she came to town the press was there and it was a big circus of people trying to get close to this young artistic phenom

shecky

Oct 18, 2003, 03:33 PM

like someone above mentioned, its a sliding scale - when you 1st get out of school and look for work, where you went is more important than later in your life where you have a body of commercial work to show. You need to keep that in mind when making a decision - i could have gotten my BFA in graphic design from a ton of places, but I chose to go to risd for a number of reasons:

1. they actually accpeted me
2. they are (arguably) one of the best schools in the country
3. they gave me enough of a scholarship for me to justify the rest of the expense.

now, im gonna walk out of risd with close to 6 figures in loans, but the opportunities that i will have with that degree are frankly dramaticly greater than the same degree from a so-called 'less impressive' institution. between the reputation of the school itself and, something a lot of people do not consider, the connections the faculty have with the outside world in terms of designers & firms & potential employers, the whole package just makes sense.

So is a great portfolio important? hell yes its important. can you get a great portfolio going to a midrange or lowrange school? possibly. i think that part of having a great portfolio is being challenged enough to hit a higher bar of expectation than maybe you are usted to, the top level schools give you that drive, the lower level schools may give you that drive.

i guess my overall point is that based on 2 factors:

1. you are talented & have the means to proove it to a school
2. you are able & willing to pay for school (loans/scholarships/whatever)

then you should do whatever you can to go to the best school possible.

Schiffi

Oct 18, 2003, 04:45 PM

Truman State University!!!!

truman.edu

It's great! Visual Communication all the way!

Well, it is a good school and a very good Fine Arts staff. And as a bonus I help many of my teachers with their Macs so pluses for me.

Moxiemike

Oct 18, 2003, 05:22 PM

D0ct0rteeth

Oct 18, 2003, 06:20 PM

Originally posted by Moxiemike
Docteeth.... i know a ton of people, especially from management at AIP who claim you would have done better if you didn't spend a bunch of time schmoozing on the 2nd floor and more time in class...don't blame the system.

It's all what you make of it.

Hey brah.. im not blaming anyone.. You are completely right.. It is what you make it and I honestly wish I applied myself more in college.. however I felt bored with the constant computer classes and unchallenged by a curriculium which I probably should not have specialized in.

I am not blaming the system and apologize for any offense you took.. In no way am I bitter.. I just cannot recommend that enviornment to someone who is looking for a true artistic experience. No slander intended.. I just feel the AI system rarely suits the artistic ambitions. I never took a class on composition, my photography class was taught with disposable cameras (developed by Ritz Photo), painting was an elective I had to "schmoose" may way into being allowed to take, and the constant message I was being taught was that a computer can make up for your lack of artistic ability. I was not inspired by these factors and just wish there was more to it. It is more than likely your experience was different, but that was mine.

As for me I had a job waiting for me after graduation and did graduate with a 3.7 GPA.. I feel fine with my accomplishments and count both you and I as successful examples of how to succeed at an Art Institute.

However you and I both know the vast majority of the people who we went to school with couldn’t get a job because they did not learn the necessary design skills and now have to pay back the loans while working at Borders. The Art Institutes are not cheap, and dollar for dollar there are great true design schools that are better connected to ad agencies and the like.

As for my personal life (which I have a hard time understanding why it is being brought up here) and the second floor, you are correct.. but the truth is I spent even more on the tenth with all the interior design chicks. :) Yes, I was bored and unsatisfied with the school.. and yes I became a skirt chaser and politician of sorts and through that I found my release.. Of course it was pointless and childish.. but hell I was 19 years old… it was better than drug use and meaningless sex :) (maybe)

The fact is that it is not an ART school but a trade school.. and although it is possible to succeed with the credentails supplied by an AI degree.. there are better options out there.

Good times.

janey

Oct 19, 2003, 09:17 PM

my art history teacher used to be like the directoy of admissions at art center college of design in pasadena (california) for a while and in his honest opinion (sorta biased :p ) that art center and the rhode island school of design were really great. Yeah.

jefhatfield

Oct 20, 2003, 07:00 AM

Originally posted by übergeek
my art history teacher used to be like the directoy of admissions at art center college of design in pasadena (california) for a while and in his honest opinion (sorta biased :p ) that art center and the rhode island school of design were really great. Yeah.

if one decides to go west or stay on the west coast, pasadena is one of the top rated schools for art, and san jose state, uc davis, and sf academy of art are highly regarded, too

i had a friend get his BFA from the highly regarded san jose state but he felt that he did not achieve his full potential there so he went for his MFA at school of visual arts in nyc or rhode island school of design because he wanted to be around what he thought would be the best art school and students he could find in the us

in the end, it is his effort he puts into art that counts and i know he will do well...ten years ago, he spent at least four years at the junior college honing his art skills in every area before moving onto san jose state