Apple Lowers Prices for eMac

[Dont Hurt Me]

go to Apple if you think im making it up. Fantastic. Emac is a great deal for those wanting to get into the Mac world. very nice.

[Lancetx]

Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
go to Apple if you think im making it up. Fantastic. Emac is a great deal for those wanting to get into the Mac world. very nice.

The price drops are nice as is the fact that all Macs have at least a Combo Drive now too. One thing though, with the drop of $200 down to $799 on the Combo Drive eMac, the hard drive capacity dropped as well from 60GB to 40GB. But it's still a great deal for that price (as is the SuperDrive model now for $1,099) and they all have Panther pre-loaded too.

[QCassidy352]

gack! well done apple. well done indeed! Finally, a truly low end machine that still is very nice. My family has the 1 Ghz combo emac and couldn't be happier. For $800 that is truly fantastic.

[billyboy]

In the UK, with an education discount, £549 for a 1GHz eMac with Panther.

That has to be very tempting to people curious about what you can do on a Mac

[BOOMBA]

Finally, Apple has recognized me as the marketing genius that I am, and has taken my advice.

Next stop is 100% market share!

[billyboy]

The entry level price in the UK with an education discount is £569 which is just silly- in a positive kind of way

[blueflame]

So, my question is, how does the 14 inch ibook compare to my 17in aluPB rev 1? seems to me e verything but ram speed is same or better, oh, and minus the fw800: screen size... obvious, mabye not a drawback

[Stike]

If Apple increases now the MHz count and/or the Graphic cards, they will enter mass market with the eMac, for sure. Bring on the best and most affordable Mac ever!

[ebow]

What were the previous prices? $1199 and $899? I can't remember...

[scottwat]

Well it looks like proc wise the 14 is as fast as the lower pb's and pretty close to the high end pb's. Surely we can't be too far away from a more dramatic update on the PB. Any idea the limit on the proc speed for the G4 in mobile form? I'd love to get a pb soon, but am very power hungry. I'd hate to wait but if they are updating the iBook surely the pb isnt far behind?

[jayscheuerle]

Rip the heads off these babies and sell them for $200 less.

A $599 headless Mac would do well, even if it's the lowest of low-end. This niche needs a filling!

[AirUncleP]

A $699 eMac for schools? Are you kidding me? I remember writing purchase orders for $1700 Performa 575s. Way to go Apple!

[pauld]

does a price drop constitute as a (now due) upgrade?

[machan]

YAY! my parents can finally get their own emac!! just in time for Xmas, too!!!

[Wyvernspirit]

Originally posted by scottwat
Well it looks like proc wise the 14 is as fast as the lower pb's and pretty close to the high end pb's. Surely we can't be too far away from a more dramatic update on the PB. Any idea the limit on the proc speed for the G4 in mobile form? I'd love to get a pb soon, but am very power hungry. I'd hate to wait but if they are updating the iBook surely the pb isnt far behind?

Not very likely. Apple just released the new PB a month ago. They wouldn't release a new model so soon. I would say at least another 2 months (which in computer thinking is a long time). I would, however, not count on that. It seems like a january/febuary time table more likely, but it also depends on what the upgrade will be.

Just a speed bump - late december to late january.

Complete upgrade (either enclosure, features, or G5 jump) - Late January to late march.

Just MHO and 2 cents. :)

[el gringo]

Agree totally! And, if I may add:

Take the discontinued Cube - rename it - maybe - to iCube/iBox or whatever. The hardware development has already been done...it's there...just put it back on track...

and sell it for 699$!! Lot's of people want their "old" monitor and hook it up to their new Cube ;)

I would certainly buy one!

Originally posted by jayscheuerle
Rip the heads off these babies and sell them for $200 less.

A $599 headless Mac would do well, even if it's the lowest of low-end. This niche needs a filling!

[Sabbath]

Originally posted by billyboy
The entry level price in the UK with an education discount is �569 which is just silly- in a positive kind of way

Bear in mind that isnt the bottom of the line emac without edu discount, its minus the combo drive, it has a standard CDrom instead. The combo drive version is £610.

[Bozola]

Somehow I just can't get excited over fairly old technology.. sure it may be cheaper, but it still is old..

:mad:

[dongmin]

Originally posted by ebow
What were the previous prices? $1199 and $899? I can't remember...
$1299 and $999 respectively. So Apple slashed $200 off each. Not bad, and you get Panther too.

[reedm007]

Originally posted by Bozola
Somehow I just can't get excited over fairly old technology.. sure it may be cheaper, but it still is old..

how exactly is this "old technology"? Do you just mean the CRT? Under the hood this puppy's got everything the iMac's got.

[FlamDrag]

This is great news. I would like to see them go ahead and make it 'headless' for less, but hey - it's still a great price and that's what Apple needed.

Even more fun is the "announce new stuff on any old day we darn well please" policy that Apple seems to have adopted. It's as if EVERY day were Tuesday. ;)

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by ebow
What were the previous prices? $1199 and $899? I can't remember...

Previously the $799 eMac had a CD-ROM, not a Combo drive. And it was at 800MHz G4, not 1GHz.

Other than that, the low-end one hasn't changed at all.

Note also, of course, that there used to be three models of eMac and now there are two.

[evilbert420]

Umm... the eMac doesn't do DDR, and it's system bus is 133Mhz. The eMac also has several-generations-old graphics subsystem.

[alset]

Originally posted by FlamDrag

Even more fun is the "announce new stuff on any old day we darn well please" policy that Apple seems to have adopted. It's as if EVERY day were Tuesday. ;)

Right on! It makes every day an adventure. Not to mention, it cuts down on rumors building us up for events on the wrong date.

Dan

[jxyama]

Originally posted by evilbert420
Umm... the eMac doesn't do DDR, and it's system bus is 133Mhz. The eMac also has several-generations-old graphics subsystem.

Umm... and eMac is not meant to be the latest and the greatest...

This is perfect. I was debating between refurb 15" iMac ($949, when available) and the lowest eMac (Prev. $749 refurb with a CD-ROM.) for my parents for Christmas. I was torn whether CD-ROM would be ok or not and was leaning toward the iMac just for the Combo Drive.

Now I will wait a bit longer to purchase. If similar price drop occurs for the iMac, I'll get that but at the least, I can get a very nice eMac with a Combo Drive even if the price drop doesn't occur for the iMac. :)

[nuckinfutz]

Originally posted by evilbert420
Umm... the eMac doesn't do DDR, and it's system bus is 133Mhz. The eMac also has several-generations-old graphics subsystem.

We can choose to point our eyes only at the deficiencies but let's look at the whole picture.

1. A Healthy 200Mhz speed increase is nice.

2. DVD Rom Capability in ALL Macs now means Apple can now ship more large packages in DVD ROM format.

3. No price change.


Someone looking for an $800 Mac is probably not worrying too much about bus speeds and graphics cards. This is the perfect computer for Education(it's original intended market) and as a first Mac or second Mac for the household.

I'm looking to purchase one in 6 months. Probably the next bump to 1.25Ghz hopefully.

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by Bozola
Somehow I just can't get excited over fairly old technology.. sure it may be cheaper, but it still is old..

:mad:

That's because you don't have kids.

As a "family" computer, the eMac is perfect: durable, simple, easy, and fast "enough" for most apps the kids want to do or play. No, it's not an 1337 gamerz system, but it certainly has its uses.

Looks like this (the low-end one; have a SuperDrive on my G5 and really don't need one in the living room) is what I'll be putting in our living room in January ...

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by evilbert420
Umm... the eMac doesn't do DDR, and it's system bus is 133Mhz. The eMac also has several-generations-old graphics subsystem.

133MHz system bus isn't really all that far shy of a 167MHz system bus ... granted, it's no 1GHz FSB, but it's just downright silly to be comparing an eMac to a G5 machine anyways.

For home use where the most "gaming" that'll be done on it is a rousing round of Reader Rabbit, the two-year-old graphics (ATI 7500 debuted in November 2001 as far as I can tell) are certainly acceptable. Heck, my PC is still running on a first-generation GeForce from 1998-ish, and I *know* the types of games my kids want to play run on that card perfectly. Moreover, given the lack of expandability and the not-intended-for-hardcore-gaming audience (meaning, the memory is not used to feed custom peripherals or AGP), the DDR memory wouldn't be a useful addition for the most part anyways.

If these things are important to you, then you are not the eMac's target audience. For the eMac's target audience, the feature set and level of technology, combined with the price and overall design, make this a pure homerun.

[Phil Of Mac]

Has anyone done an eMac/Dell comparison? It might be interesting to see...

[Dahl]

Originally posted by jettredmont
That's because you don't have kids.

As a "family" computer, the eMac is perfect: durable, simple, easy, and fast "enough" for most apps the kids want to do or play. No, it's not an 1337 gamerz system, but it certainly has its uses.

Looks like this (the low-end one; have a SuperDrive on my G5 and really don't need one in the living room) is what I'll be putting in our living room in January ...
Precisely!

I'm about to buy a G5 and I don't want my 3 year old to use it like he is using my G3. I have been thinking about getting an eMac for him, I even looked at older models and original iMac's. But with these new prices, I will probably be able to find a very nice eMac ( new or old model ) for his simple games.

BTW. Great move, Apple.... :D

[Doctor Q]

I'm glad to see Apple keeping this product current with their ongoing technology improvements.

I'm surprised to find this thread, so soon after Apple's announcement, on page 3 of a "new posts" MacRumors search. I guess there are a lot of other discussions going on today!

I'd like to see Apple provide a headless consumer Mac, i.e., an eMac/iMac-level machine without a monitor, so people could buy one and then get a bigger/better (or even cheaper) monitor. I know people who want screen real estate but don't need Power Mac performance, and they would find that ideal.

[machan]

one other great thing about the new emacs is that you can BTO a 160gig hard drive!!!! i love that!

[Hawthorne]

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Has anyone done an eMac/Dell comparison? It might be interesting to see...

I tried that on dell.com, and 2.2 ghz P4 2400 spec'd out to match the low end eMac came out to $1151 (128mb RAM, 40 GB hard drive, FireWire, XP Pro, McAfee Virus, 1 year warr, DVD/CD-RW). And the video card on the 2400 stinks compared to the eMac.

And it gets even more favorable for Apple if you compare the SuperDrive eMac.

Apple needs to come out with a price/feature comparison of the eMac vs. Dell/HP/etc. The value of a Mac is overwhelming now.

[Dros]

Originally posted by jayscheuerle
Rip the heads off these babies and sell them for $200 less.

A $599 headless Mac would do well, even if it's the lowest of low-end. This niche needs a filling!

I wonder if they could do that? The monitor is costing them less than $200 for sure. The case would be a bit smaller and could ease up some design challenges, would have to add cables, etc to hook up to a monitor. I don't think they could make it that much cheaper and maintain margins. Of course, if they sold a bunch at that price, the margins wouldn't have to be huge.

As they move to a business model where software plays a greater role, then it makes more sense to increase the units sold even if hardware profit decreases slightly. And if having a cheap Mac encourages people to buy a $300 iPod, then even better.

[nagromme]

I love my eMac/700, and it can't touch the specs on the $799 model! $749 for students!

Imagine how low a headless eMac with lower, iBook-like specs could cost!

[Bozola]

Ha!.. I do have kids, two of them.. and they have their own imacs. and so does my wife.. in the kitchen of all places!

Bozola



Originally posted by jettredmont
That's because you don't have kids.

As a "family" computer, the eMac is perfect: durable, simple, easy, and fast "enough" for most apps the kids want to do or play. No, it's not an 1337 gamerz system, but it certainly has its uses.

Looks like this (the low-end one; have a SuperDrive on my G5 and really don't need one in the living room) is what I'll be putting in our living room in January ...

[Timothy]

My kids christmas present was just decided upon. ;-)

[Freg3000]

Time to get the eMac (WITH PANTHER) for my mom's birthday in November!

:D :D :D :D

[dieselg4]

As wiht all the other posts, I agree - a headless emac would be grrreat!. I have a 700/combo emac that I would really enjoy increased screen real estate on. With iChat, photoshop or a few java chat windows open, things get crowded mighty quickly. Maybe in a frosted plastic slab somewhat similar to the old Quadra 660 but in an emac- type finish with a slot loading drive?

Wicked . . .

[DakotaGuy]

Well now every desktop Mac is 1Ghz or higher with the 800Mhz model dropped. I don't know if anyone realized this, but I thought Apple finally completely hit the Ghz world on their desktops. The price is nice and I am thinking very strongly about replacing the iMac DV 400 now. I just know however the second I buy a new 1Ghz Combo eMac they will release a 1.25Ghz with a better graphics. So what to do? I know the 1Ghz eMac will completely dust my old DV in everything I do...but should I wait a couple more months...how sweet a 1.25Ghz, DDR memory, better graphics chip, Combo drive for the same $749 (I am a teacher) would be....

[Belisarius88]

Originally posted by machan
one other great thing about the new emacs is that you can BTO a 160gig hard drive!!!! i love that!

Yeah, I saw that too! $90 with edu discount. I'm no expert in HDs but going from 40 gigs to 160 gigs for $90 seems like a awesome deal for me. I think this will be enough for my entire family. [1 kid, 3 adults, 1 grandmother ;-) ]

I join many in this thread in announcing a future purchase of eMac before Christmas. It will be my family computer that will withstand potential abuse by a 4 year old. But I'm also going to max out the RAM and add Airport Extreme for some fun network games. I think Age of Mythology will run just fine, along with other games like EU2, Hearts of Iron, etc.

[jxyama]

Originally posted by Dros
I wonder if they could do that? The monitor is costing them less than $200 for sure.

i guess that's reason there hasn't been a headless consumer Mac. the inclusion of monitors in i/eMacs allow Apple to increase the margin.

in their analysis, it must be estimated that the additional revenue from lower margin headless mac and increased marketshare isn't offset by decreased revenue from the sale of higher margin, monitor included i/eMacs... so they just "expect" people with different monitor needs than the bundled ones to just buy a PowerMac...

[Lancetx]

Originally posted by Belisarius88
I join many in this thread in announcing a future purchase of eMac before Christmas. It will be my family computer that will withstand potential abuse by a 4 year old. But I'm also going to max out the RAM and add Airport Extreme for some fun network games. I think Age of Mythology will run just fine, along with other games like EU2, Hearts of Iron, etc.

Yep, and I'll do the same and make yet another announcement. :D After mulling it over today, this is what I'm going to go with for a Christmas gift for my Mother. And it'll be her first Mac too. Ah, what the joys of switching will influence you to do for others. :)

[Doctor Q]

Originally posted by jxyama
they just "expect" people with different monitor needs than the bundled ones to just buy a PowerMacWhich makes sense. The low-end-model buyers are likely to be the novices and switchers getting their feet wet, and the all-in-one simplicity suits them. I think those of us who might want a headless consumer Mac should be looking at one-generation-behind Power Macs. That's how to get less performance for less cost, while retaining configurability (your choice of monitor). The upside: this choice is already available. The downside: you miss out on the other developments, e.g., improved communication interfaces and included software, that come with the very latest models.

[Phil Of Mac]

I think they should make a new Cube for this market.

[Macco]

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
I think they should make a new Cube for this market.

Hmm I think you're probably the 10,000 person to post this on these forums since I first came here in March...

[Phil Of Mac]

Originally posted by Macco
Hmm I think you're probably the 10,000 person to post this on these forums since I first came here in March...

*Exactly*? Sweet! Do I get a prize?

[WhatTheFk]

STOP!!!!!!!

DO NOT BUY!!!

While Apple has dropped the price of the 1Ghz eMac, they have also crippled the computer, by once again using 5400 rpm drives. Check it out. All eMac pages on the apple site have been stripped of any mention of hard drive speed.

The emac, on its debut, had 5400 rpm drive, but were later upgraded to 7200 rpm drives and its website noted the speed. No longer.

Another clue? The cost to upgrade from 80gb to 160gb on the Superdrive eMac is $50. The same upgrade on the iMac is $100.

It's crazy how they want to screw over those who can least afford a computer. I have an emac, and was planning on upgrading to another one, but there's no way I'll accept inferior technology. Plus, it's so freakin difficult to take apart this thing to upgrade a hard drive on your own, so that's out. I guess it'll have to be an iMac for me.

[Stelliform]

I just bought this model last week for a client. I told them about the price drop, and they are cool with that, but I would love to get them $200 back from Apple. What do you guys think the odds of getting a rebate are, without returning the one that is setup on their network?

[Phil Of Mac]

My god, it's a 5400 rpm drive! IT'S CRRRRRAP!!!

:rolleyes: If you're going to be using an eMac anyway, it doesn't matter. Get a life, or better yet get a job so you can afford a better Mac, if 7200 RPM is so important to you.

[PowerBook User]

Originally posted by Doctor Q
Which makes sense. The low-end-model buyers are likely to be the novices and switchers getting their feet wet, and the all-in-one simplicity suits them. I think those of us who might want a headless consumer Mac should be looking at one-generation-behind Power Macs. That's how to get less performance for less cost, while retaining configurability (your choice of monitor). The upside: this choice is already available. The downside: you miss out on the other developments, e.g., improved communication interfaces and included software, that come with the very latest models.
I hope they keep the Power Mac G4's around for a while for this reason. It' a mid-range desktop that you can pick a monitor for. You can even have a dual processor.

The eMacs are an outstanding deal now. For $799 you can get a Mac with a 17-inch monitor, 1 GHz G4, and a combo drive! What a deal!

[jxyama]

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
My god, it's a 5400 rpm drive! IT'S CRRRRRAP!!!

:rolleyes: If you're going to be using an eMac anyway, it doesn't matter. Get a life, or better yet get a job so you can afford a better Mac, if 7200 RPM is so important to you.

let's not get too feisty here... :rolleyes:

thanks for mentioning the other fact about "downgrades" though i'm not sure how "relevant" they are for emacs target market... i'm going to buy an emac for my mom. for her, it makes absolutely no difference how fast the HD is, and for that matter, it's fine that the default HD is now 40 gb, instead of the 60 gb. i'm sure she'll take the $200 price drop any day.

i guess if you were looking for every little faults then you will find that apple does some "shady" stuff. the thing i'm most excited about is that a G4 Mac with a Combo Drive can now be had for $800. that sounds pretty darn sweet to me.

[Sabenth]

Ok dont know if this has been mentioned in the posts previous but this makes perfect sense to me Look at this way Apple releases iTunes for Windows it causes people to look at what apple are up too and then they see price drops all in one systems yea yea crt but what the hell for 17inch all in one nice and quite systems g4 1ghz supper drive you cant get that for PC's its so dam right that well even ive just ordered a new e Mac from apple australia this is just what ive been waiting for and best of all ive just saved a small fortiune and corect me if i am wrong here but i think the memory prices have droped and so have the hard drive prices a 160 gig in a e mac ive got a 6 gig hard drive now with JAG AND ONLY A GIG LEFT WHAT THE HELL IAM I GOING TO DO WITH 160 WHOOOOAAAA

love it

[Thanatoast]

Does anyone know about the memory configuration in these things? Can I get at both DIMMs, or just one, like in the iMac? Or in other words, how much cheating on cost can be done with the RAM?

[dieselg4]

Originally posted by Thanatoast
Does anyone know about the memory configuration in these things? Can I get at both DIMMs, or just one, like in the iMac? Or in other words, how much cheating on cost can be done with the RAM?
you can get at both ram chips, by turning and emac on its face and unscrewing its underbelly. they're jammed up in this little hole, but they are both there. you could prob. do what i did and buy it w/ 128, throw that away and replace it with two 512's for not much money. it used a diff. ram type than the imac also, so be careful what you buy. compared to imac ram chips, emac ram chips are BIG.

[Mr. MacPhisto]

I actually think this is a great deal. As for the hard drive, the speed there is something that gives the iMac some greater advantage over the eMac. Fact is, most people don't care about the increased RPMs - not if they're in the eMac market.


As for the headless eMac or iMac - I'm sure Apple has considered it and done market research and found it's not lucrative right now. It's be nice to see something, and we may, but I think there aren't enought chips and Apple wants to differentiate models. Certainly the eMac is good as is. It is an introductory computer that can do most anything an average user wants.

[Belisarius88]

Surely the fact that the HD may be 5400 rpm cannot be that detrimental. Granted the iMac has 7200 rpm drives but the top of the line Powerbooks range from 4200 - 5400 rpm. If it is good for the top of the line laptop, it must be good for an entry level consumer desktop!

Sure make sure you add a stick of 512 RAM to your eMac and you'll never notice your "inferior" drive.

[knucklehead]

Originally posted by WhatTheFk
STOP!!!!!!!

DO NOT BUY!!!

While Apple has dropped the price of the 1Ghz eMac, they have also crippled the computer, by once again using 5400 rpm drives. Check it out. All eMac pages on the apple site have been stripped of any mention of hard drive speed.

The emac, on its debut, had 5400 rpm drive, but were later upgraded to 7200 rpm drives and its website noted the speed. No longer.

Another clue? The cost to upgrade from 80gb to 160gb on the Superdrive eMac is $50. The same upgrade on the iMac is $100.



It's crazy how they want to screw over those who can least afford a computer. I have an emac, and was planning on upgrading to another one, but there's no way I'll accept inferior technology. Plus, it's so freakin difficult to take apart this thing to upgrade a hard drive on your own, so that's out. I guess it'll have to be an iMac for me. :)The best clue I've been able to come up with involved clicking on my system profile and finding this drive :

http://www.directdial.com/vs/item/prod.asp?item_num=6Y080L0

Seems pretty 7200 to me ... javascript:smilie(':)')

[neilt]

They are selling 20 packs of the emacs to education at $599.....this is from the asu bookstore page.

neilt

[solvs]

Originally posted by Stelliform
I just bought this model last week for a client. I told them about the price drop, and they are cool with that, but I would love to get them $200 back from Apple. What do you guys think the odds of getting a rebate are, without returning the one that is setup on their network?

There's like a 10 day window. Call Apple and ask.

And 5400 vs a 7200 isn't going to be that much different in speed, but it isn't that much of a cost savings unless Apple got a big discount on bulk. I do wish they had a cheaper headless, but those $500 PCs ain't that great anyway.

Unless you build it yourself like I did, but... you know. That's a whole other issue. ;)

[RichardCarletta]

If the combo drive is now 1 GHZ and $800 , do you think it is too late to go buy the previous combo model ? Do you think I could buy it for less than $750 ?

[Jerry Spoon]

The best thing apple could have done. I swear I just sold two emacs yesterday to people who were thinking about a new computer, and one is a switcher.

I'll stop by my local apple store for my cut later, OK Steve.

[knucklehead]

I bought a new eMac yesterday, and it does have a 7200 HD.
Why is that strange alarmist assumption being repeated as fact?

[Dont Hurt Me]

who knows , how you like that emac? still got to say that is a awsome price for a awsome machine.what cant you do with the Emac???except maybe carry it around with you.:)

[encro]

Originally posted by Sabenth
ive got a 6 gig hard drive now with JAG AND ONLY A GIG LEFT WHAT THE HELL IAM I GOING TO DO WITH 160 WHOOOOAAAA

I went from an Amiga with a 210meg harddrive to a 60Gig drive on the Mac and thought it would last almost forever. 1 Year Later... Trust me you will use space up like a crazy man if you have it sitting there. :D

[gekko513]

Originally posted by knucklehead
I bought a new eMac yesterday, and it does have a 7200 HD.
Why is that strange alarmist assumption being repeated as fact?

Agree ... I would rather think that it doesn't say anything about rpm because all the HD options now have the same rpm.

[pjkelnhofer]

Originally posted by RichardCarletta
If the combo drive is now 1 GHZ and $800 , do you think it is too late to go buy the previous combo model ? Do you think I could buy it for less than $750 ?
From the Applestore Refurbished Page (http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/70602/wo/FC4Zr5EmWnSF21kzUkp1mHjOK8S/6.0.7.1.0.5.13.0.3.0.0.0.0.3.1.1.0?73,55):
eMac 800MHzG4/128MB/40GB/CD-ROM/E/56K $699.00
eMac 1GHzG4/128MB/60GB/Combo/E/56K $849.00
eMac 1GHzG4/256MB/80GB/SuperDrive/E/56K $1,099.00

Doesn't really seem like all that great of a deal to me.

[HenrikDK]

Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
go to Apple if you think im making it up. Fantastic. Emac is a great deal for those wanting to get into the Mac world. very nice.

WHERE is the 1,25GHz version of eMac??????????????????
That's the one I wanted for my home office :mad:

[Dont Hurt Me]

i think apple is trying to get seperation between imac & emac performance. only 250 mhz doesnt make that much difference on the g4. consumer models will be way behind the pro stuff after the next g5 bump. Apple has a lot of work cut out for it the next year with g5 advancement and g4 crawl.