Write a letter to Apple about the mini iPod

[pockyrevolution]

-Write a letter to Apple about the mini iPod-

A few thousand messages from MacRumors users should help Apple realize the $250 vs $299 deal.

:D

Send a message to Apple (http://www.apple.com/contact/feedback.html)

Oh yea, try to use "contstructive criticism".

[Grimace]

to what end? If 5,000 people write the same thing - is apple going to change the mini-ipod?

[Powerbook G5]

You'd rather Apple raise the price of the 15 gig iPod so that is looks more fair? So many people complain the 15 gig iPod is only $50 more and how the new pricing is unfair, but if anything, that should be a good thing that someone could get the full iPod for a small difference more. I see it more of a different kind of iPod than just the usual HD difference.

[Durandal7]

Miniturization = Money

[Sayhey]

If I was to write a letter to Apple about the iPod mini it would have to be positive. Don't think that is what you're looking for. If we look back in six months and the iPod mini is being out sold by the $249 4gb Rio then I will take back my estimate, but not before.

[eclipse525]

Apple royally screwed up with this announcement. The mini is just TOO much money. What market were they trying to capture here. I know it wasn't the under $200 market. Which is the market they shouldn't focused on. Under $200 is a HUGE market. $250 just ain't cutting it. They need a reality check. Most people in this country aren't doing as financially well as Mr.Jobs. Not to get off topic BUT that's why a large number of people opt for PC's oppose to Mac's. NOT because they don't like Mac's a prefer PC's but rather they just can't afford it and there's nothing wrong with that.

~e

[Awimoway]

I think the price is too high, but I'll pass on the letter writing. They read MacRumors. They know. They're also taking comfort in the presence of so many vocal apologists, so even if they did bother to read all the letters, they probably won't care. I don't see the price ever going down. I guess if the disparity bothers you, get a 15 gigger. They look sexier, anyway. :)

[Powerbook G5]

When all else fails, ask for an iPod as a christmas/birthday gift. That way you don't have to worry about getting bent out of shape over its price. :D

[jeff.macaddict]

I actually wouldn't mind having half the size of the iPod mini's hard drive for half the price, or just a more reasonable one.

It's just that that kinda blows Apple's thing about taking your entire music library (for most people) with you.

How many songs do you think a very cheap iPod mini with a smaller hard drive should hold? Please post your iTunes library size/song count.

[Powerbook G5]

I have around 250 songs taking just under a gig in my iTunes library. If I expand, I may be able to double that, but I don't see myself needing more than the 4 gigs that the iPod mini offers. If there were a 2 gig iPod like the rumors seemed to speculate for a $149-199 or slightly under price range, I'd have pre-ordered it the moment the keynote was over.

[eclipse525]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
I have around 250 songs taking just under a gig in my iTunes library. If I expand, I may be able to double that, but I don't see myself needing more than the 4 gigs that the iPod mini offers. If there were a 2 gig iPod like the rumors seemed to speculate for a $149-199 or slightly under price range, I'd have pre-ordered it the moment the keynote was over.

I totally agree with you. 1-2gig iPod would have been golden.

~e

[QCassidy352]

I have 3+ gigs of music, and an original 5 gig ipod. I was considering getting a mini ipod before the announcement - if they were very small, ~2gigs or more, and ~$150. Now I'll just stick with my old pal I guess...

[plasticparadox]

Oh well, I can't blame everyone for whinging about the price. But Apple's not in the business of giving miniPods away.

And there's not a huge need for Apple to compete on price with the low-end market. As Steve showed with his presentation, the $249 price is justified and still returns a healthy profit.

Because Apple is currently in the #1 spot for players, there's little justification to undercut it's own successful iPod line with $100 or $150 miniPods. Remember that the regular iPods are red-hot at the moment. Introducing a product that is drastically cheaper will steal the spotlight.

If you don't want to spend $249, then get a Rio. Get an eJam. Not that you'll be satisfied with it, but you'll be saving some cash.

[hulugu]

I would have bought a 2Gb $100.00 mini-iPod, but I see what Apple is trying to do. Right now many of the sub 512mb cost at least 150.00. So how could Apple produce a system that is 8x the size, smaller than most for less? I suddenly realized that the market may really support this new mini-iPod.
Now the Wallmart shopper who is looking for the cheapest Mp3 player possible is not going to buy even a $100.00 iPod if there is a $80.00 Rio, but Apple isn't trying to sell to that shopper because Apple will never be able to. This person will make the conscious decision to buy the cheapest item possible with a total disregard towards quality. But quality is important and is part of the value equation. Apple's new mini-iPod is expensive, but not out of the market and not a failure of the imagination, rather it is an acknowledgement that they can't secure and don't really want to secure every possible market, but rather want to secure the much larger middle-and-higher-end markets. Also, I think you will see a cheaper version of the mini-iPod as the new drive prices drop, same thing happened with the 5GB iPod.
As for the others, only the Rio Karma is remotely usable, and even it could be better, the Samsung Napster, the Dell DJ, and many of the small flash players are still hard to use, don't use AAC or do use WMP which blows. So iPod still the best, mini-iPod cool, but could be cheaper. But writing a letter to complain, tell you what get a savings account. By the time you have enough, there will be a $200.00 version or a 10GB.
What's the real lesson:

Never be a first adopter. The bleeding edge is just that.

[Ajmbc]

Originally posted by eclipse525
Apple royally screwed up with this announcement. The mini is just TOO much money. What market were they trying to capture here. I know it wasn't the under $200 market. Which is the market they shouldn't focused on. Under $200 is a HUGE market. $250 just ain't cutting it. They need a reality check. Most people in this country aren't doing as financially well as Mr.Jobs. Not to get off topic BUT that's why a large number of people opt for PC's oppose to Mac's. NOT because they don't like Mac's a prefer PC's but rather they just can't afford it and there's nothing wrong with that.

~e

The mini iPod market is targeted at a totally different market- I have a 'big' iPod, and it is kinda big to carry around everywhere, or excercise with- the mini looks more rugged than its bigger brother. I know a lot of people who complain the iPod is to fragile to do lots of things with.

-aj

[Rezet]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
You'd rather Apple raise the price of the 15 gig iPod so that is looks more fair? So many people complain the 15 gig iPod is only $50 more and how the new pricing is unfair, but if anything, that should be a good thing that someone could get the full iPod for a small difference more. I see it more of a different kind of iPod than just the usual HD difference.

Thats not what people are saying. They are saying that this is silly in price/value competition. And that there is no reason to buy mini.

[Powerbook G5]

Why not? If you don't need 15 gigs, why pay more for what you don't need? And if you like the mini, then it looks like it's a pretty good product to me. I think the silver case looks sharp, it is smaller, it is cheaper, and it has more than enough space for me, so it looks like there is a market for it.

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by Rezet
Thats not what people are saying. They are saying that this is silly in price/value competition. And that there is no reason to buy mini.

That's true but by raising the price of the 15GB and all the other iPods the value of the 4GB iPod would go up. I agree with this evaluation.

Does anyone really think that these brand new small drives that just came out a few months back are actually the same price per MB as the regular iPod drives? I think not.

I agree they are a bit expensive. I think the price would be just as high but easier to swallow if they were GB flash card based iPods that were half the size of these so called Mini-iPods. Then they would have a selling point they would be much more durable.

On the other hand all in all the Mini-iPod is the same price as other similar small hard drive based players on the market so relatively it is not over priced. It is just in comparison with the old breed of hard drive players with the cheaper drives in the ala the current 3G iPods.

[funkywhat2]

http://reviews.cnet.com/iRiver_iFP_195T/4505-6490_7-20830083.html?tag=pdtl-list

I see these iRiver things all overschool, along with iPods. The iRiver is shown as costing between (appx) $250 and $300. Now, if you could buy an iPod with 8X the capacity, for the same price, would you? I think you would.

The name "iPod" means something to people. This thing is going to sell wonderfully.

[evil]

people will buy the new mini ipod.
i will not be one of them.

i agree with many who say that a cheaper 2 gig ipod would have been excellent.

personally i would have liked to see a smaller ipod with around 2 gigs or so.
the mini ipod form factor is not mini enough for me.

also, i think the new colours are ugly.

[tjwett]

Originally posted by jeff.macaddict
...Please post your iTunes library size/song count.

5,076 Songs, 18.5 Days, 23.78 GB

[Squire]

Originally posted by Rezet
Thats not what people are saying. They are saying that this is silly in price/value competition. And that there is no reason to buy mini.

I think those people will be surprised, then, when Apple sells a TON of these. I bet a lot of people (with a few extra bucks, that is) would fork out for a second iPod. As others have mentioned, it's the size of the the device and the size of the HD that are desirable.


Originally posted by funkywhat2
http://reviews.cnet.com/iRiver_iFP_195T/4505-6490_7-20830083.html?tag=pdtl-list

I see these iRiver things all overschool, along with iPods. The iRiver is shown as costing between (appx) $250 and $300. Now, if you could buy an iPod with 8X the capacity, for the same price, would you? I think you would.

The name "iPod" means something to people. This thing is going to sell wonderfully.

One of my students just informed me about his intentions of buying a 512 MB iRiver for that price. Why? I asked. You have to remember that Apple has a huge markup on iPods. (I forget the %.) A smaller version for a smaller price doesn't have the appeal to them. They'll take the top and middle thirds of the Mp3 market and let the el cheapo brands fight over the bottom.

Squire

P.S. When you start a thread, you should try to be a little more descriptive. I had no idea what "the $250 vs. $299 deal" was until about the 4th post.

[robotrenegade]

Originally posted by pockyrevolution
-Write a letter to Apple about the mini iPod-

A few thousand messages from MacRumors users should help Apple realize the $250 vs $299 deal.

:D

Send a message to Apple (http://www.apple.com/contact/feedback.html)

Oh yea, try to use "contstructive criticism".

Message sent.

[Kwyjibo]

I agree that apple didn't make a smart pricing plan, but the features are there and I wouldn't be surprised if after 6 months the ipod mini is $199 ... btw i like minipod better than ipod mini

[tjwett]

Originally posted by pockyrevolution
-Write a letter to Apple about the mini iPod-

I think I'll write them 2 letters; F & U.

[1macker1]

AHAHHAH, good one. Apple dont case about their users, just their bottom line, when will people see this.
Originally posted by tjwett
I think I'll write them 2 letters; F & U.

[Powerbook G5]

If Apple doesn't make a profit, they won't be around much longer for its users to be Mac users, though.

[hulugu]

Originally posted by 1macker1
AHAHHAH, good one. Apple dont case about their users, just their bottom line, when will people see this.

Yeah F&U that's just genius. And Apple doesn't care about their users, uh yeah they do but they're also a company who needs to make money, they need to satisfy shareholders, pay their employees, the manufacturers, the designers, etc. Yes, they don't work for free. Oh, and maybe they would like to make more money (gasp!)—its almost like they were oh I don't know capitalists. Grow up.

[rueyeet]

Originally posted by jeff.macaddict
Please post your iTunes library size/song count. 1,111 songs. Don't have the days/GB count here at work, but it's over 5 GB total.

Some of that, though, are one-star songs I don't need to carry with me, and stuff like the Dr. Demento novelty tunes that I just keep to have. I bet if I was just syncing playlists, rather than my entire library, and didn't have a System 9 install backed up to my iPod, a Mini would do just fine on capacity for a while. Though given the accelerated rate at which iTMS has made me buy music (and CDs!) I'm not quite sure whether 4 GB would be enough. The tiny size would be the attractor, for me.

Bet you they'll wait, see how sales are going, get some market research back on price points, and then lower it closer to $200. By then capacity may increase too.
Originally posted by hulugu
Never be a first adopter. The bleeding edge is just that. Exactly. And if the competition is priced at the same point for less capacity, why should Apple lower an already competitive price?

[Powerbook G5]

I think the pricing is really fair, and especially when you look both at the cost of these super slim HDs and the cost of the competition. It's really good. People complain that Apple needs a bigger market share and to grow larger, but yet they scream and complain "no fair" whenever they think Apple is trying to make some money and grow.

[erik1975]

Originally posted by Kwyjibo
I agree that apple didn't make a smart pricing plan, but the features are there and I wouldn't be surprised if after 6 months the ipod mini is $199

I agree with you Kwyjibo. Apple probably could have sold the iPodmini for $199, but there are tons of people who will pay $249. Thus, to expand on your theory. (no real proof here)

today - 4GB for $249
3 months - 2GB for ~ $175
6 months - $25-75 price drop on both.

This will bring a ton of interested people out to buy the product. Sure, some will complain about the initial prices, but in the end, Apple WILL get your money. There's no way to fight them!!! ;)

[fraeone]

Since when did Mac fanatics become marketing specialists?!

This is the CHEAPEST, SMALLEST ipod ever, and it has comparable storage to the first one (which is still quite a bit).

What in the world is there to complain about? I can't imagine all of you actually believed Apple was going to release a sub-$200 iPod.

[jimjiminyjim]

Alas, I thought apple was going to announce a 150 dollar ipod. And now no iPod for me. Cornice's announcement of their 2 GB drives was very well timed - for their own publicity. It sure through (edit: threw) a whole bunch of us mac fanatics for a loop though, leaving me sorely disappointed. I could have afforded $150. I can't afford $250. Now I'm sifting through other mp3 players. All I want is something to store a bunch of audio books (for learning pimsleur german).... but I'm having a lot of trouble finding anything I like, in the wake of the iPod.

[slipper]

i just sent in my letter and heres how it goes...

'i would like to comment on the recently released mini iPod. dont you guys think the price is slightly outrageous? $250 is a bit overpriced considering the 15gb iPod is only $50 more. i was looking forward to buying a mini iPod for each of my children, but for $250, i dont think so. As in every online forum that i visited, most people share my view. can you please justify why the mini iPod is so expensive?'

...after i sent the letter i realized, wouldnt a online petition with a formal letter sent directly to apple be more appropriate?

[yamabushi]

The final test of the success or failure of the iPod mini is sales volume. People will vote with their money.

[ioinc]

>>>>>>>>>>
If you don't want to spend $249, then get a Rio. Get an eJam. Not that you'll be satisfied with it, but you'll be saving some cash. >>>>>>>>>>

many people will do just that and apple will feel the pain because of it.

Apple just does not get it. Now is the time to close the door on the competition and lower the price (and profit margin) for the sake of market share)

[ioinc]

This is the CHEAPEST, SMALLEST ipod ever, and it has comparable storage to the first one (which is still quite a bit).

the goal is not to be the cheapest, smallest iPod... the goal is a cheaper music player.


What in the world is there to complain about? I can't imagine all of you actually believed Apple was going to release a sub-$200 iPod.


Yes.. this is exactly what we thought.

[beatle888]

Originally posted by jeff.macaddict
I actually wouldn't mind having half the size of the iPod mini's hard drive for half the price, or just a more reasonable one.


the 4GB is the first mini. give apple a month or two and im sure theyll make a 2GB thats less expensive.

the 4GB mini gives apple a chance to cash in on those people that buy the first thing that comes out.

[amnesiac1984]

Originally posted by ioinc


the goal is not to be the cheapest, smallest iPod... the goal is a cheaper music player.



I don't understand, y don't you get it. This is cheaper than a 512mb player? It is a cheaper player, there is nothing remotely compareable at this price range.

[Considering]

I think those who have justified this new mini-iPod based on technology have the stronger argument.

Not only is the smaller HD used (almost undoubtably) much more expensive per GB, think about the fact that the already small motherboard in the iPod is now even smaller.

It all costs money, people. The 15 gig is only $50 more because it is still using comparatively old technology, cheaper for Apple to acquire, and cheaper for them to make. I'm sure you will see price drops on the mini when the tech needed to make them comes down as well.

This is kinda just common sense, don't ya think? I mean, look at the price of the smallest PC laptops compared to the normal sized. Small = $$, as it has been pointed out before.

[fabsgwu]

You know, I totally forgot that just over a year ago, I purchased first gen 5Gb iPod for $300. It was a brick that I ended up selling on eBay for $200 to get my current 15Gb (mid-range) iPod. Just goes to show you how much things change in a year.

[tofi]

http://www.macgeneration.com/mgnews/categories/en_passant/upload/comparaison_ipod/comparaison_ipod.pdf

steve jobs was right they are attacking the flash based mp3
only size matters
stop complaning for price
http://www.macgeneration.com/mgnews/categories/en_passant/en_passant_106169_1.shtml

[Squire]

Originally posted by Considering
I think those who have justified this new mini-iPod based on technology have the stronger argument.

Not only is the smaller HD used (almost undoubtably) much more expensive per GB, think about the fact that the already small motherboard in the iPod is now even smaller.

It all costs money, people. The 15 gig is only $50 more because it is still using comparatively old technology, cheaper for Apple to acquire, and cheaper for them to make. I'm sure you will see price drops on the mini when the tech needed to make them comes down as well.

This is kinda just common sense, don't ya think? I mean, look at the price of the smallest PC laptops compared to the normal sized. Small = $$, as it has been pointed out before.

Good post. Voice of reason. Smaller is always more expensive. If you're not happy with it, check out the competition. That's the way the market works.

Squire

[nickfit]

This is the dumbest thing I've seen in a while. It is a deal. It's a great looking, and increadably small player. I'm sure if they could sell it for 100, 150 or 200 they would. For crying out loud, people, stop your crying.

[orangedv]

I am in agreement with the opinion that this mini player will never take on the flash market at this price, but that was Steve on stage saying that, not a banner from Apple's site.

I think they are going for the size, rather than the price point market and they may drop the price later if it doesnt shift.

My thoughts are that flash memory card mp3 players will dry up and go away over the coming months. The reason is the rapidly changing and growing mobile phone market. My N-gage, which was free as a contract phone has an amazing AAC player built in. More will follow. Once the flash mp3 player has been swallowed over the coming year or 2, the phone guys will turn their attention to the palm market; it will eventually replace all those pocket sized gadgets in your pocket with one. If this happens, Steves aim becomes a mute point, there won't be a market to go after.

I wish however that Apple would work on OSX mobile, for phones. Microsoft are in that market right now and they will prise it open with a crow bar. My brother is already reaping the costs; his Microsoft powered phone will only play video in windows format, whereas my java based phone has a real player that handles all sorts of stuff. Shame QT isnt there, but I can hope.

[King Cobra]

Originally posted by Durandal7
Miniturization = Money

Damn right. (bids on newbie's pea-sized brain for $10,000)


Re: Write a letter to Apple about the mini iPod

I think Apple knows by now... :rolleyes:

[ChrisH3677]

Apple didn't have a choice. What were they going to put in it? Flash RAM is too dear and there's no 1 & 2 gig mini drives around cheap enough either. (Bear in mind they were prob in design and production for more than a year)

No, the question is, why didn't Apple wait six months longer when it's probable they could have done 2Gb for $150?

The answer... I reckon they just wanted to get into (or establish) the market now, even if they risk not selling many.

You can bet that more people now will buy the 2GB model when it does arrive either out of spite (just to prove to APple they should have come out with a 2G model originally) or because they've seen the mini's and have mentally committed to buying one - but not till they come down in price.

I would actually still seriously consider a 4Gb model over a 15Gb model.

1) I just don't need 15Gb
2) 100 bucks is a 100 bucks is still a lot of money (In AUD$ as they'll prob be $350 compared to $450 for 15gb)
3) They're trendier simply by being newer
4) White's nice, but I like color.
5) I like smaller an lighter

[Powerbook G5]

From seeing the reactions of many people, there does seem to be a good market for these. A lot of us don't have 15 gigs worth of music, so we don't have any desire to spend even $50 more for the 15 gig iPod when a smaller, cheaper version that looks sharp and handles our needs is now out. Not to mention that plenty of people would rather have a silver or a blue or a pink iPod than a white one.

[iJon]

i think apple is going to do well with these. i look at these as a coolness factor and size factor as apposed to gigabytes. i want a mini ipod so bad, and i will probably buy one just ot have one. i love the size.these will play out just like the 5gb ipods, give it some time and they will probably drop to 199, just like how every apple product does. so of you complaining, just wait cause apples not gona give a s*** about what you say about ipods, steve will have you all on the automatic spam filter in mail anyways. i have already sold some and nobody was complaing about prices, there is a market for them, and they will sell, they will sell just fine.

iJon

[Achtung_U2]

Just thought I'd put this out there, as it seems that so many people think the mini is overpriced.

Yes, of course, I'd like it to be cheaper... wouldn't we all agree on that, same as with anything we'd like to purchase :)

But, heres some info, some of you know this, some dont, so here goes:

A little over a year ago, i wanted a small MP3 player to use with an armband for gym workouts...

The iPod was too big in my opinion, and... i saw no need to have 1/3, 1/2 or my entire MP3 library with me at all times.

Long story short... i decided on the Nike PSA, by Philips...

Yes, its small
Yes, it has an armband
Yes, it has nice earpods with a cool 'rear exit' wire to keep it out of your way, and very good sound quality

But.... this thing cost OVER $200, and generally (depending on file size, of course) only hold about 18-22 songs at one time!

On top of that (no OS X support).... being an exclusive Mac user and on OS X.... every time I want to change the songs... I have to re-boot into OS 9.2.2 (not Classic, doesnt even work in that mode), true OS 9 boot.... then reformat the drive, then drag over, and wait forever for each song to copy over.

After Im thru, I have to reboot back into OS X. Of course, with only 20 songs, you end up doing this frequently, because you get tired of whats on there.

For about $40.00 more, Apple has a tiny, very cool looking, and universally compatible device that holds about 1000 songs.

Im not here to start a battle, just to say that trust me.... as a real-world user.... the mini IS worth the money. Yes, its great when prices drop on anything, we all like it. But, even now... this product is a good value on so many levels.

If Im able to sell this Nike on eBay for a decent amount to some PC user out there..... Im all over the mini, even at $249.

BTW.... I see these things on tons of peoples arms at the gym, so.... obviously, there are plenty of people who have spent in this price-point already... all real-world candidates for the mini the next time around. And, thats a good thing :)

Thanks. Peace, Mark ~

[Dont Hurt Me]

Originally posted by iJon
i think apple is going to do well with these. i look at these as a coolness factor and size factor as apposed to gigabytes. i want a mini ipod so bad, and i will probably buy one just ot have one. i love the size.these will play out just like the 5gb ipods, give it some time and they will probably drop to 199, just like how every apple product does. so of you complaining, just wait cause apples not gona give a s*** about what you say about ipods, steve will have you all on the automatic spam filter in mail anyways. i have already sold some and nobody was complaing about prices, there is a market for them, and they will sell, they will sell just fine.

iJon I agree ijon, apple allways charges a premium when it launches a new product( You pay for the name) then they decrease the price later. I like the look better,the size ,color and how many songs do you really need to carry? If apple does a new computer that this matches or plugs into this will be even a bigger hit. your letters are a waste of time. Apple does what Apple wants to that i know for certain.

[jxyama]

as long as there are 256 MB flash players priced at $150 to $200 and 1/1.5/2/4 GB players priced at $200 to $300, apple will do fine with iPod mini. they are not being aggressive with their pricing, that's all.

i believe $50 is a pretty good apple/iPod "premium." a lot of people will pay $50 more to get an iPod mini over others. if there were 2/4 GB HD players priced $100 below iPod mini, then apple should worry, but i don't see those yet.

so i think it's rather fruitless to write letters of complaint to apple. it will just sound like "we want stuff cheaper!" whining. afterall, do you see a direct competitor to mini that is significantly cheaper (~$100) than iPod mini?

"But 15 GB iPod is only $50 more!!"

i'm pretty darn sure apple would be more than happy about you spending $50 more than you would have in getting the mini to get the iPod. the money still goes to apple...

the only segment of mp3 players apple hasn't addressed is the low capacity flash players, i.e. 64/128 MB players priced between $75 to $150... not sure if they ever will - they seem to think there's not enough margin for charging the apple "premium" in that market and hence not worth entering for the sake of entering...

[lakhdip]

Originally posted by eclipse525
Apple royally screwed up with this announcement. The mini is just TOO much money. What market were they trying to capture here. I know it wasn't the under $200 market. Which is the market they shouldn't focused on. Under $200 is a HUGE market. $250 just ain't cutting it. They need a reality check. Most people in this country aren't doing as financially well as Mr.Jobs.


Is sub $200 a huge market? Do we really know. We represent a skewed representation of the market. Our opinion may not neccesarily be what happens in the marketplace.

Consumers realise that, generally, a smaller electronics product will come with a higher cost (apart from tv's and a few others), but gadgets particularly. Consumers also realise that price will decrease with time as the device becomes cheaper to make.

Most of us are aware of the model for consumer electronic goods retailing requires the early adopters to subsidise the intial cost of starting production with price being cut to a point where a larger number of ordinary consumers become interested and the organisation is in a good position to scale production to match demand.

I find your point that the "$250 price point needs a reality check" to be unfounded. Perhaps that is your personal opinion, but until we see some sales figures... none of us really know how well this device has been priced. But most of us suspect that is there some wiggle room in the price, and I would not be surprised to see the magic $50 price drop by fall.

Originally posted by eclipse525

Not to get off topic BUT that's why a large number of people opt for PC's oppose to Mac's. NOT because they don't like Mac's a prefer PC's but rather they just can't afford it and there's nothing wrong with that.
~e

I don't agree with this point either. In fact, I think that the majority of Apple's products represent reasonable value for money. Especially taking into account the total cost of ownership. The portable line especially. I would think that the 10 common myths and learning curve is a greater barrier to Apple's target switchers than price.

[Hodapp]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
From seeing the reactions of many people, there does seem to be a good market for these.

If you honestly think Mac Rumors extremists are a good sampling of the general consensus of 95% of the average Apple users in the world, I'd like to take a puff or two on whatever you're smoking.

WHY do you need SO MUCH SPACE on an mp3 player? I've got a 30GB iPod, it's cool and all... but I only listen to my 4+ stars playlist, which is currently around 300 songs. Let's say on the HIGH SIDE of 5 megs a song, that's only a gig and a half. All the music I listen to, and I'll still have over 60% free space on an iPod Mini. I think my 4+ Star playlist is nearly 14 hours long, and on most days, I'm not even awake 14 hours, much less listening to music for 14 hours. I don't really understand the infatuation with having every CD you've ever owned with singles and remixes at the touch of a button. ...I guess it's cool if you're sitting around and feel like listening to whatever track 6 is of Vanilla Ice's To The Extreme, but that's about it.

I promise you the logic path most consumers will go on will be like this: "Well, I'm a casual downloader/music collector and have a collection that fits on a CDR or two that I've been working on for the past couple years, I don't know why I'd ever need 15 Gigabytes!" I know a TON of people who have pre-ordered the iPod Mini, myself included. If you guys haven't figured out yet that you ALWAYS pay a premium for Apple stuff...

I mean look at PowerBooks and compare what you get dollar per dollar with the PC competition. Avoiding the standard rhetoric "omg megahertz myth" reply, look at the speed of the optical drive, RAM speed, the fact that a lot of PC laptops have dual channel DDR, faster hard drives, better onboard graphics cards, and in a lot of centrino based solutions, much better battery life.

So why would anyone buy a PowerBook? The same reason why the iPod Minis will be impossible for Apple to keep on the shelves.

Edit: Here's a post from another forum I read which cannot be more correct:

A pretty good analogy between the whole ipod/ipond mini are digital cameras. I could've bought the powershot s230 over the s200 but I didn't for several reasons. (3.0 megapixels, 3x optical zoom vs 2.0/2x and fairly minimal price difference, at least IIRC)

1) Sure, it offers more megapixels, but if I'm only using it for small web shots, I don't need the higher resolution. Likewise with the mini, I don't need the extra space, so I don't necessarily see it as more value, but rather something I don't need.

2) If you look at the numbers it doesn't seem that much of a size difference, but believe me, when you get down to that size, any small change in measurements can mean that some things feel very different in your hands. I experienced this first hand with the s200 and the s230, and likewise I'd like to get my hands on a mini before I plonk down the cash for it. With the cameras, I realize that if I think it's too big to carry around, I won't use it. I'd rather spend 250 on a camera I'd be likely to use rather than 300 for one that's much nicer but stays in a drawer all day.

3) Meh, I'd like more accessories, but those are small issues which I really don't care about. I'll buy what I need, or just do without.

I'm not dead set on getting a mini, mind you. I just see it as a product that will probably suit my needs just fine.

When it comes down to it, Apple products are sleek and sexy, and just like everything in this world from cars to computers to women, sleek and sexy always costs more.

[kgarner]

I work at CompUSA, and i get a lot of people everyday, coming in and asking when are we going to have the Mini. I think that more people have been asking about the arrival of the Mini then they asked about when we would get some G5's. I think Apple's going to be just fine on these.

[CmdrLaForge]

I don't think that they give a **** about that letters. In fact - only NOT buying it will change their minds.

[pdrayton]

Love the iPod mini. Just right for MY needs.

Predict (contrary to most) that the price will only be down to $219 by June 2004.

Sales results of the iPod mini, not letters, will influence Apple in pricing. Sales look pretty hot so far.

[cheekyspanky]

I really don't see that $250 price is that high, maybe it's because I'm from the UK and used to being ripped off but to me $250 seems cheap when you consider they are going to sell the iPod mini in the UK for £199 which works out to be $376 at the current exchange rate! If they were £149 over here I'd be inclined to buy one even though I already have a 20GB bought in November.

[ioinc]

Originally posted by jxyama
a lot of people will pay $50 more to get an iPod mini over others. if there were 2/4 GB HD players priced $100 below iPod mini, then apple should worry, but i don't see those yet.
[/B]

Now is the time for apple to grab market share. The way to do this is with agressive pricing.

It is unwise to leave the door open and only begin to worry when the competition comes calling. Better to close the door and lock up the market.

Not dropping the price shows a lack of foresight.

It is not good enough to have the best product. (They have had the best personal computer on the market for 20 years).

The name of the game is market share. I is going to be a sad day when they are beat out by a product that is only 'good enough' but priced much better.

And when that product has a greater market share and 3rd party vendors start making add ons that are not compatible for the iPod.. the game will be lost.

[pdrayton]

Originally posted by ioinc
It is not good enough to have the best product. (They have had the best personal computer on the market for 20 years).

The name of the game is market share
The name of the game is sustainable profits through innovation. When market share is the only way for a company to succeed then it's a sure bet that the company makes a low-margin commodity product.

If market share was the name of the game Apple would have gone out of business many years ago.

Innovative companies don't make commodity products, and they don't outsource to far-flung countries the jobs of their innovative employees.

Apple has a winner in the iPod mini, and is acting very wisely in its pricing.

[cheekyspanky]

To be honest I think that this kind of product people will be willing to pay a premium for, peer pressure will make a lot of teenagers buy one and it'll be the latest cool thing to have on the tube or in the park.

People may look at a product thats $100 less, but will still be inclined, in my opinion, to pay that extra $100 for the brand and the coolness factor, thats what people are willing to pay for and the iPod mini can probably charge a higher percentage premium than the standard iPod due to its diminutive size and cute colours. This product is aiming at a different market to that of the standard iPod, which appeals to "audiophiles" and people with large music collections whereas the mini will appeal to a lot of people with a lesser knowledge of technology (who have only become aware of the iPod due to media coverage over christmas) and latching onto the latest trend now everyone and their mother seems to know what an iPod is! and I also think, from seeing peoples reactions, that the mini will appeal to women more than the standard iPod, as the girls i asked were more interested in the size of the whole thing as opposed to the hard drive and the fact it was pink/blue etc.

Also, many people who have previously looked at the iPod, eliminated the lowest spec one and the highest (as almost everyone seems to do) will look at the mini and think to themselves "Ooh, that iPod mini is $150 less than the one I looked at last time" as opposed to saying "ooh, that iPod mini is still $250"!

[Wash!!]

1685 songs/5 days, 6.75 gig and listen to every one of them and need more :D

[gwangung]

Originally posted by ioinc
Now is the time for apple to grab market share. The way to do this is with agressive pricing..

I think you better LOOK at the market before saying this.

[lakhdip]

Originally posted by pdrayton
The name of the game is sustainable profits through innovation. When market share is the only way for a company to succeed then it's a sure bet that the company makes a low-margin commodity product.

...

Apple has a winner in the iPod mini, and is acting very wisely in its pricing.

A great point. I think this is a smart assessment of the music player market.

[Krizoitz]

Originally posted by Considering
This is kinda just common sense, don't ya think? I mean, look at the price of the smallest PC laptops compared to the normal sized. Small = $$, as it has been pointed out before.

Finnally somebody who gets it!

As for all the people who think putting a 2GB drive in should drive the price down $50, you are dead wrong. The price difference between the 2gb and 4gb microdrives is very very little.

I seriously doubt Apple is doing this just to make more money, my guess is that they are selling it for what they can afford to for now. You have to remember that in addition to the manufacturing cost, they also have to pay of the RD cost as well. The iPod can be sold for less because it has been refined and the components are larger and cheaper. The mini is a new gadget. Plus its not being sold based on capacity compared to the big iPods, its being sold on capacity compared to high end flash players, which are priced about $200-$300. So instead of saying the mini is to highly priced, think of the great deal you can get on a 15gb ipod!

[crees!]

Originally posted by slipper
i just sent in my letter and heres how it goes...

'i would like to comment on the recently released mini iPod. dont you guys think the price is slightly outrageous? $250 is a bit overpriced considering the 15gb iPod is only $50 more. i was looking forward to buying a mini iPod for each of my children, but for $250, i dont think so. As in every online forum that i visited, most people share my view. can you please justify why the mini iPod is so expensive?'\

You think that the mini iPod is outrageously priced? Okay then, what do you get - 4GB's (1,000 songs) for $250. Well why don't you just save $50 and get this (see link below) at 256MBs (120 WMA songs or 60 MP3 songs).

iPod mini.. expensive? really! (http://www.digitalnetworksna.com/shop/_templates/item_main_Rio.asp?model=213&cat=55)

This is not just directed to you Slipper, but everyone who says the mini is overpriced. SJ said the mini is here to compete with the high end flash market. And if you call this model above high end, you're kidding yourself. Shop around before you accuse of overpricing.

[Achtung_U2]

Originally posted by crees!
You think that the mini iPod is outrageously priced? Okay then, what do you get - 4GB's (1,000 songs) for $250. Well why don't you just save $50 and get this (see link below) at 256MBs (120 WMA songs or 60 MP3 songs).

iPod mini.. expensive? really! (http://www.digitalnetworksna.com/shop/_templates/item_main_Rio.asp?model=213&cat=55)

This is not just directed to you Slipper, but everyone who says the mini is overpriced. SJ said the mini is here to compete with the high end flash market. And if you call this model above high end, you're kidding yourself. Shop around before you accuse of overpricing.

crees!

You are sooo right. Thats why I chimed in on this earlier today to remind those who do keep saying how high the price is, of what is out there in the market.

Im glad you showed that Rio model. As I mentioned, it was just over a year ago, that I paid $40 less than the new mini, ($210), for the Nike PSA 128, and I only have an average of 20 song capacity!

I still say the mini is worth every cent right now, and.... the bonus is, as we all know with technology... the mini will get even better, and the price WILL go down... all in due time.

Sooner or later though, we all must draw the line somewhere, as.... if you just kept waiting for the next intro, or the next big or better thing... you would never actually buy, own, use or enjoy any of the products that we all do, buy, own, use and enjoy, especially when it comes to tech & electronics.

Another subjective issue, but for me anyway, the size is very important in these players, and was the reason I did not buy the iPod last year and went with the Nike. I use it at the gym or jogging, and, I dont want anything like an iPod or larger strapped to my arm, the mini is perfcet on that level and I'd be going from 20 songs to 1000.... I think I'd be pretty damn happy on that level as well.

Take care everyone, have a great weekend :)

[crees!]

Originally posted by Achtung_U2
crees!

You are sooo right. Why thank you. In comparison the $50 more price tag is so worth it, but I too would like to see it at $200 which I think that might come sooner than some of us expect.

How about we sign off on this thread?

[iJon]

whenever i think of the ipod minis being over priced, i dont think of them overpriced compared to other flash players, but when i compare them to their big brother ipods. if you judge them just spec wise for 50 dollars more you get so much more. but when you think of it, it doesnt really matter. apple will be getting your money either way, rather it be a mini or not.

iJon

[mmmdreg]

I think the pricing's no issue. Leave em alone ffs. They're two seperate products. Sure, if the iPod mini was a 4gig version of the normal iPod, you could whinge.. but it's not.

[KC9AIC]

I think the $50 price difference is great for Apple. Wouldn't they love for you to be attracted to the higher-priced iPod and pay them a little more? The $249 will attract people, and they will either bite for the miniPod or pay more and get a full-capacity iPod.

[pdrayton]

Originally posted by slipper
i just sent in my letter and heres how it goes...

'i would like to comment on the recently released mini iPod. dont you guys think the price is slightly outrageous? $250 is a bit overpriced considering the 15gb iPod is only $50 more. i was looking forward to buying a mini iPod for each of my children, but for $250, i dont think so. As in every online forum that i visited, most people share my view. can you please justify why the mini iPod is so expensive?'

...after i sent the letter i realized, wouldnt a online petition with a formal letter sent directly to apple be more appropriate?
I just sent my letter and here's how it goes...

"I would like to comment on the 20oz Pepsi. Don't you guys think the price is slightly outrageous? $1.20 is a bit overpriced considering the 68oz Pepsi is only 29 cents more. I was looking forward to buying a 20oz Pepsi for each of my children, but for $1.20 I don't think so. In every online forum I visit most people share my view. Can you please justify why the 20oz Pepsi is so expensive?"

We could do the same comparison with an untold number of products. I'm getting the impression that people who are shocked by the iPod mini pricing are people who don't have real-world experience in shopping for consumer products.

[flyfish29]

Originally posted by Sayhey
If I was to write a letter to Apple about the iPod mini it would have to be positive.

I would have to say the same thing, except I would discuss the color choices...I can see why they picked some colors, but overall I was not happy with many of the color choices...but my personal opinion. I was unhappy at first with the price, but when i leared the size,e tc. I realize that smaller does indeed cost more than big and cheap when it comes to electronics. Take the eMac for example vs iMac...cost difference is somewhat due to the engeneering that went into the iMac design...and any improvemnts need to fit within that design...obviously there are other differences including the LCD which is of course smaller and more costly to produce.

[crees!]

Originally posted by pdrayton
I just sent my letter and here's how it goes...

"I would like to comment on the 20oz Pepsi. Don't you guys think the price is slightly outrageous? $1.20 is a bit overpriced considering the 68oz Pepsi is only 29 cents more. I was looking forward to buying a 20oz Pepsi for each of my children, but for $1.20 I don't think so. In every online forum I visit most people share my view. Can you please justify why the 20oz Pepsi is so expensive?"

We could do the same comparison with an untold number of products. I'm getting the impression that people who are shocked by the iPod mini pricing are people who don't have real-world experience in shopping for consumer products.

Why don't you just go to 7-11 and buy a BigGulp with pocket change. Some people are just too thrifty and emails like this to Apple are just ignorant.

[pdrayton]

Originally posted by crees!
Why don't you just go to 7-11 and buy a BigGulp with pocket change. Some people are just too thrifty and emails like this to Apple are just ignorant.
Not sure if that was a response to me. If so, my post was facetious (2 : meant to be humorous or funny : not serious <a facetious remark>) ... I didn't send an email to Apple or Pepsi. The point I was making was that the iPod mini pricing is no different than what most companies do with pricing for "small" vs "large" products, and that many posts in this thread don't seem to recognize that. I used a Pepsi analogy because the 20oz bottles have the iTunes promotion.

[johnnyjibbs]

Letters to Apple complaining about the difference of $50 between iPod and mini are not going to change anything. Apple will just write back and say how much better value a mini is over a $200 512MB/256MB player, (and how the 15GB regular iPod is even better value per GB, but that's a slightly different market).

It wouldn't surprise me if Apple had a cheaper 2GB mini in the works, ready to be released in 6-12 months time, depending on when it becomes commercially viable and the iPod mini has had time to establish itself in the marketplace. Right now, plenty of people will pay the premium for the 4GB model so it would not make sense to release a lower capactity model (if they could anyway).

Anyway, it's wise not to complain why one thing is better value than another, becasue we end up being worse off. We don't want Apple getting the idea that the 15GB value could be sold for more now do we? (Similiarly, when complaints were made in Britain about women retiring at 60 instead of 65 (as do men), the government just raised the retirement age for women to 65. When people complained that CDs were far more expensive than cassette singles and albums, they put up the price of cassettes to about the same as a CD, without changing the CD price!)