Apple still innovative leader in computer industry

[AlphaTech]

An article (http://maccentral.macworld.com/news/0206/01.leader.php) on MacCentral today is shows a statement by analyst David Bailey, vice president and research analyst with Gerard Klauer Mattison & Company, said that Apple continues to lead the personal computer industry in innovation.

This is not true on the wintel side though...

The analyst added that innovation "has almost ground to a halt" in the Wintel world. There's been a lot of discussion about tablet computers and wireless mobile computing, "but we view most of these initiatives as more evolutionary than revolutionary," Bailey said.

Worth checking out, especially since it is a short article.

[King Cobra]

I'm not too surprised that Apple seems to be leading the innovation world. First came the iPod, IMO, the best mp3 player known to date, then the iMac G4, based on the same color scheme as the current iBooks. I would not be surprised if Apple innovates a few more peecee users with a portable "supercomputer", i.e. a possible iBook G4. Then Apple will only have "supercomputer" computer lines in ALL of their main line of computers. That would be impressive.

I am sure that Apple still has numerous innovations up their sleeve. However, I am still waiting for an iBook G4 and a PowerMac G5. Aren't we all? :)
__________________

Fear the King.

[Grokgod]

Cant breath G5 statement sucking all air out of room!

Must counteract effects.

Boba Fett, Pademan, Stephan Hawkins, World cup, Henry Miller, G-Spot

Ahhhh better.

Something I dont get, If Apple leads in innovation.
Doesnt that already defeat WIntel?

IN the wintel world, so that is a separate world i know, they always ask for my passport at the compusa border.

Just seems like,Ok, Apple wiins, enuff said!

They won because the wintel world is lame, There isnt any other Mac producers to defeat. Did I make sense here/?

[ZealotBasher]

it's funny how he doesn't mention any of these 'innovations.' just sounds like maclots stroking each other.

[chmorley]

Welcome, troll!

Chris

[ThinkpadsRule]

What good is a pretty computer if it is slow? Slowerbooks crawl when compared to the likes of inspirons and thinkpads. I own a pbook 667 and thinkpad T30. The tibook is prettier but much slower as well.

[chmorley]

It's "Thinkpads rule". The apostrophe is grammatically wrong.

Also, I thought this thread was about innovation. Increased speed isn't really innovation, is it?

From WordNet (r) 1.7:

innovation: n 1: a creation (a new device or process) resulting from study and experimentation [syn: invention]

I am sure you are smart and know what you are talking about, though. :rolleyes:

Chris

[Rower_CPU]

Originally posted by chmorley
It's "Thinkpads rule". The apostrophe is grammatically wrong.

Also, I thought this thread was about innovation. Increased speed isn't really innovation, is it?

From WordNet (r) 1.7:

innovation: n 1: a creation (a new device or process) resulting from study and experimentation [syn: invention]

I am sure you are smart and know what you are talking about, though. :rolleyes:

Chris

I don't think innovation and speed are mutually exclusive.

On the contrary, sometimes it takes an innovation in design/technology to push machines to new speeds, or to move to new architecture that makes faster speeds possible.

[chmorley]

Originally posted by Rower_CPU
I don't think innovation and speed are mutually exclusive.

On the contrary, sometimes it takes an innovation in design/technology to push machines to new speeds, or to move to new architecture that makes faster speeds possible.
I agree that often increases in speed are often what allow innovation (in computing) and vice-versa. I never implied they were mutually exclusive, simply that they weren't synonymous. An increase in speed does not automatically imply an innovation. In addition, innovations are certainly possible without an increase in speed. Infrastructure, funding, and support also assist innovation. None of these is "innovation" in and of itself, either.

I take no issue with the complaint that Apple would benefit from catching up in speed with PCs. I simply stated that a speed complaint was not necessarily relevant to a discussion about innovation. I stand by that. They are two different (and only marginally related) issues.

The Jaguar developments are a prime example of this. They represent innovative solutions of computing problems. One might even argue that it is OS X's lack of speed (or the Apple CPUs') that has necessitated this innovation.

Chris

[Rower_CPU]

Agreed. :)

[AlphaTech]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
What good is a pretty computer if it is slow? Slowerbooks crawl when compared to the likes of inspirons and thinkpads. I own a pbook 667 and thinkpad T30. The tibook is prettier but much slower as well.

Stinkpads blow...

Who much memory is inside that TiBook that you have??? Which OS??

The T30 is a newer system, most likely, but I still can't see them running significantly faster, or faster where it really matters. Besides, the L3 cache makes a hug difference when it comes to performance. I know it makes my 800MHz TiBook rock.

[S]tinkpads stink, hence the name.

[ThinkpadsRule]

Slowerbooks are slow hence the name. My Tibook has 1 gig of ram and the Thinkpad has 512 megs ram. The Tibook has a 667 mhz cpu and the thinkpad has a 1.6 ghz cpu. The Tibook weighs 5.3 lbs and the thinkpad weighs 5.3 lbs. The tibook has a 15.2 display and the thinkpad has a 14.1 display. The thinkpad has more ports and is a helluva lot faster

[AlphaTech]

hey troll.. get the F out before I have to go postal on your a$$

Yes I am talking to you [s]ThinkpadsRule

[Macmaniac]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Slowerbooks are slow hence the name. My Tibook has 1 gig of ram and the Thinkpad has 512 megs ram. The Tibook has a 667 mhz cpu and the thinkpad has a 1.6 ghz cpu. The Tibook weighs 5.3 lbs and the thinkpad weighs 5.3 lbs. The tibook has a 15.2 display and the thinkpad has a 14.1 display. The thinkpad has more ports and is a helluva lot faster

Get out! Be gone troll!! The 667mhz Tibook doe not have L3 cache which makes a BIG difference! The 800mhz Ti Would waste your stinkpad a$$!

[Beej]

While you guys are arguing about what is and isn't innovation, just remember that evolution is not innovation. Typically, unless you see a huge performance increase in chip speed (eg the introduction of superscalar processors) it's just evolution... no innovation involved.

[Mr. Anderson]

Well, the innovation discussion got bogged down in TiPB vs. Thinkpads BS. Apple has innovated and will continue to innovate, period. They make the machines that everyone wants to copy, look at how much color came out of the iMac design. Now we have an LCD iMac, anyone want to bet something will come along similar (if Apple doesn't call a foul, and wade in with lawyers)

The iPod revolutionized how people look at mp3 players - all others are basically toys compared to the iPod. Don't worry about one or two specifics, focus on Apple's overall philosophy. There is no deny Apple is one of the main driving forces of tomorrows technology.......

[ThinkpadsRule]

Why are you guys getting so upset? No computer can always be the fastest or the best for long. Look how the computer industry changes from week to week. You guys know there is no way a 800 mhz cpu can compete with a 1.6 ghz cpu. Lets be realistic.

[Mr. Anderson]

This is not about speed, its about innovation. There is a huge difference, if you don't understand that, take some time to reflect on it and get back to us when you have something intelligent to say.

[AlphaTech]

Originally posted by dukestreet
This is not about speed, its about innovation. There is a huge difference, if you don't understand that, take some time to reflect on it and get back to us when you have something intelligent to say.

I second that motion... and move that it be passed.

[ThinkpadsRule]

Yes,yes,yes this is about speed. If you think making pretty products is innovation then you need to rethink this thread. Apple needs to produce(in your words innovate) a more up to date product. How can they be the innovative leader when they have produced nothing new (well OSX that's about it) and their products are inferior to other products? Some of you guys need to take the blindfolds off and see apple for who and what they are. Sure their products are cool looking(wow) but what about everything else. Ipod....how is that innovation when products just like it were already on the market. Tell me what has apple innovated.

[eyelikeart]

well it looks like we have another gocyrus lurking the threads...

as for being innovative...Apple beats the ***** out of everyone as far as design...nothing on the market looks like half as elegant as Apple's hardware...

as for performance...the specs may be different...but we've seen it time & time again...#'s don't hold ground when it comes to real work...and yes...Apple does need to have a fire lit under their @sses more often than not...but they are definitely highly competitive in performance...they do introduce many new technologies before anyone else...

I have proclaimed myself as an anti-zealot...thus I know there are people who simply do not need to use a Mac...and that's completely fine...

but if u are going to sit around here and just piss people off by throwing b.s. in their faces for the sake of getting your rocks off...just watch it...

[ThinkpadsRule]

I am not pitching B.S. I am trying to get some of you guys to open your eyes and see the whole picture. Apple makes nice products ( I have a tibook) I just hate to see these guys talk about apple like they are the best thing ever. There are better products and worse products out there. I would like to see some open mindedness on this board and not bash a person b/c they don't think apple is the *****.

[eyelikeart]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
I would like to see some open mindedness on this board and not bash a person b/c they don't think apple is the *****.

I am all for being open-minded...trust me...I've said enough around here in the past...

but I've already gotten a few complaints...so I'm going to stick around to see things go smoothly...

one thing u have to understand...this is a Macintosh rumors website....hence the mass amount of Mac-Zealots...one does not go into a Ford dealership and start in on how much Chevy has over them....so try to keep that in mind equally...

[AlphaTech]

Did you even bother to read the article stinkpadblows??? They were NOT talking about speed of processor, but what Apple has done for INNOVATIONS in the computer industry. It is also mentioned about how LITTLE the peecee world has done for innovations...

If you don't have something to contribute other then b*tching about how your two laptops are not the same speed, then begone.

Oh, and it's generally NOT a good idea to piss on/off one of the moderators, especially one that is very active on this site. He will rip off your membership head and p*ss down your throat.

[ThinkpadsRule]

Why so belligerent?

[Mr. Anderson]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Why so belligerent?

Because you're not listening to what we're saying, you're the one who needs to open your mind!

The article mentions innovation, hardware and software. We are all aware that Apple needs to get faster CPUs, get up to speed with bus and memory systems. But in other ways, Apple started a lot of it, firewire, iMac, iPod (and what is out there that's better for MP3s than the iPod, I haven't heard about it), OSX and it looks like a few others soon.

So get off this speed issue. Its not innovation. The speed comes from the chip suppliers, we're not talking about Intel, AMD, Motorola here, we're talking about computer manufacturers.

[eyelikeart]

Originally posted by dukestreet

So get off this speed issue. Its not innovation. The speed comes from the chip suppliers, we're not talking about Intel, AMD, Motorola here, we're talking about computer manufacturers.

it's honestly like comparing apples & oranges...no pun intended...;)

the clock cycle #'s are completely irrelevant...a 500 Mhz G4 runs neck to neck with a 1Ghz P4 or P3...whatever it is...

and to be completely honest...unless u can actually sit with the 2 systems...it's hard to really gauge performance accurately...

[AlphaTech]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Why so belligerent?

Actually because you are acting like a true dumb-a$$ed peecheese user.

As dukestreet has already stated... "So get off this speed issue. Its not innovation. The speed comes from the chip suppliers, we're not talking about Intel, AMD, Motorola here, we're talking about computer manufacturers."

You really thought that a handle such as what you selected would get ANY respect??? Typical peecee user... the class of a slug, and intelligence of a retarded rock.

[ThinkpadsRule]

Man please....There is no way a G4 500 can compete with a PIII 1ghz. Only in a dream. A G4 500 might come close with a PIII 800 mhz cpu. Oh...I forgot about those blindfolds and apple showing how its powermac out perfoms a windows based machine in photoshop. There are alot more apps out there than photoshop. I know what innovation is...apple only creates pretty systems. I am sure many manufacturers can deliver a pretty system and call it innovation. If you are calling a pretty shell innovation then so be it. I like the inards of a system and not its cover.

[ThinkpadsRule]

Ignorance shows with each crude remark.

[britboy]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Oh...I forgot about those blindfolds and apple showing how its powermac out perfoms a windows based machine in photoshop. There are alot more apps out there than photoshop.


And you know why apple uses photoshop for their tests? Because it's had the hell optimized out of it, for both the G4 and P4, and virtually everyone with a mac is going to get photoshop. That makes it a fair test. They do choose which filters to run for the test, but who can blame them for that?

[iGav]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Yes,yes,yes this is about speed. If you think making pretty products is innovation then you need to rethink this thread. Apple needs to produce(in your words innovate) a more up to date product. How can they be the innovative leader when they have produced nothing new (well OSX that's about it) and their products are inferior to other products? Some of you guys need to take the blindfolds off and see apple for who and what they are. Sure their products are cool looking(wow) but what about everything else. Ipod....how is that innovation when products just like it were already on the market. Tell me what has apple innovated.

No, no, no...... it's not just about speed..... what's innovative about 1.6Ghz in a huge piece of black plastic???

No matter what you think about Apples current specified speeds, they're unquestionably the most innovative computer manufacturer at the moment.....

Apple has innovated many, many things..... but lets go with something recent......

Apple were the first to implement USB, and Firewire (they developed Firewire as well)

Or the original iMac, interms of both design, and ease of use...... this set the standard with regards to computer usability



Or the first to implement wireless networking as standard on some models......

Or the Cube....... innovative use of design and engineering, as well as being cooled by convection and thus fanless and almost totally silent.......

Or the iPod, when it first came out, no other Mp3 player had anywhere near the storage space, coupled to the fact that it intergrates perfectly with itunes.... has an intuitive interface, and can be used as a external HD.......

Or take the PowerBook G4..... to fit everything into such a slim case..... is still astounding........ no fully featured PC lapop comes close...... this is an innovative example of product design and engineering beautifully executed..... couped with the use of exotic materials in it's construction.

Or we could take Apples digital hub software........with regards to ease of use, product intergration, and productivity....... nothing... but nothing comes close on the PC platform........

And these are just a select few....... do you really want to talk about ABOUT INNOVATION......... or just about your block of black plastic with it's common as hell Intel processor???

[eyelikeart]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Man please....There is no way a G4 500 can compete with a PIII 1ghz. Only in a dream. A G4 500 might come close with a PIII 800 mhz cpu. Oh...I forgot about those blindfolds and apple showing how its powermac out perfoms a windows based machine in photoshop. There are alot more apps out there than photoshop. I know what innovation is...apple only creates pretty systems. I am sure many manufacturers can deliver a pretty system and call it innovation. If you are calling a pretty shell innovation then so be it. I like the inards of a system and not its cover.

so have u not read any reviews or actually paid attention to comparisson tests?!

dude...I tried to be nice....but now u are starting to piss me off with your zealot attitude...

maybe u should just shut your piehole and quit trying to annoy everyone?

[ThinkpadsRule]

Yep...my common intel processor will spank anything apple has even some of those overpriced slowermacs .....oops powermacs. As I stated earlier....if a shell is innovation then d*mn I need to get some of my coated and reformed home products looked at.

[britboy]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Yep...my common intel processor will spank anything apple has even some of those overpriced slowermacs .....oops powermacs. As I stated earlier....if a shell is innovation then d*mn I need to get some of my coated and reformed home products looked at.


Hey, if it wasn't for apple and the original iMac, you'd probably still be using a boring, ugly beige box for a computer. The shell is all about innovation.

[ThinkpadsRule]

Go to barefeats. The pentium and atlon spanked the G4.

[iGav]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Yep...my common intel processor will spank anything apple has even some of those overpriced slowermacs .....oops powermacs. As I stated earlier....if a shell is innovation then d*mn I need to get some of my coated and reformed home products looked at.

Can you please list what is innovative on your Thinkpad please......??

Me thinks this is going to be a short list....... heh heh heh....... :p

[ThinkpadsRule]

I use thinkpads...they haven't changed alot over the years. So that ugly imac deal doesn't apply to me. The new imac is gorgeous though. I would lkie to have one of those.

[AlphaTech]

Hey stinkpadrules... I guess you have not heard what most IT departments call the thinkpads... yes, it IS STINKpads... There is a VERY good reason for this... which I WILL NOT get into here, since this is a MAC forum/site.

Continue acting like a troll and you WILL learn what happens to those that make themselves known here... suffice to say, they don't last all that long.

Once again, get it through that protruding brow of yours that we are NOT talking about speed of the processors...

[Mr. Anderson]

Originally posted by ThinkpadsRule
Yep...my common intel processor will spank anything apple has even some of those overpriced slowermacs

Again, not listening. Now you're really starting to piss me off, too. I hope you're enjoying this, cause you're losing all respect you can hope to get on these boards.

Coming in here and taunting us with crap, not caring to read or look at what we've said and continuing to hold on to your one bit of arguement.

WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT SPEED! WE ARE TALKING ABOUT INNOVATION. NOT INTEL AND MOTOROLA, BUT APPLE AND THE REST OF THE PC INDUSTRY.

Learn the difference, or just keep it to yourself and go bash macs somewhere else.

[ThinkpadsRule]

I have a slowerbook and a stinkpad. The stinkpad is by far the better machine. It destroys it even in apples beloved photoshop tests. The screen is sharper the vid card (64 meg as compared to 16 meg...I think the latest slowerbook has 32 meg)is better and it uses ddr ram...something apple has yet to impliment.

[ThinkpadsRule]

My bad...apple is so innovative they have yet to impliment ddr ram into any of their products. Why doesn't apple get off their inovative a$$e$ and innovate a mobo with ddr ram and a faster bus.

[eyelikeart]

as much fun as I'm sure AlphaTech is having with this...

it's over...

ThinkPadsRule...I am warning u right now...quit your b.s...if u continue to come to this site and preach about things are irrelevant to a "rumors" website...u will be banned...

[Mr. Anderson]

Did you read the article?

What do you use your laptops for?

Can you name one app that can compare to FinalCutPro for the same amount of money?

Hear's a quote from the article "Sometimes overlooked, but just as important, in our opinion, is Apple's portfolio of software products," Bailey said. "Apple has rolled out an entire suite of software products that enable consumers to capture, edit and distribute digital audio and video using very powerful but easy to use applications."

This is part of the 'innovation'

Stop being an ass and realize you have no idea what you're talking about

[Mr. Anderson]

Originally posted by eyelikeart
as much fun as I'm sure AlphaTech is having with this...

it's over...

ThinkPadsRule...I am warning u right now...quit your b.s...if u continue to come to this site and preach about things are irrelevant to a "rumors" website...u will be banned...

I'll back that up as a second moderator vote.

Toe the line and play nice, don't incite flaming. You're entitle to your opinion, whether we agree with it or not, its your attitude that's getting you deeper into trouble. And acknowlegde the posts where we try and get you to see what we're talking about, you've refused to change your approach or even look at what we're saying.