Apple in 2004 and Partnerships?

[MacRumors]

MacWorld.co.uk reports (http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/main_news.cfm?NewsID=8065) on Apple's Fred Anderson and Peter Oppenheimer's talk at Morgan Stanley's Semiconductor and Systems conference (web stream (http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/morganstanley04/)).

Unlike last year ("year of the laptop"), Anderson claims no specific theme this year but a focus on growth with three key drivers -- "portable – mobility and wireless communications; the digital lifestyle and music, iPod, iPod mini and iTunes Music Store".

Anderson also hints that there are more alliances in the works (beyond Pepsi, HP and AOL), but that there is nothing to announce yet.

[iHack]

Sounds like the year of portable music... ;)

[squatch]

Sounds like the year of portable music... ;)

It's more than just that, he specifically mentioned "mobility and wireless communications". To me, that sounds like something in the arena of the fabled iPhone, or hybrid PDA, or something. The severing ties that PalmOne has made now to Apple to not include Mac support with Cobalt can only translate to Apple being forced into that type of market. And if the iPod is any indication of how Apple can reinvigorate and eventually dominate a stagoring market (such as with handhelds), then I can't wait to see what the future holds. ;)

[PPC970FX]

Do I hear Sony in the background???

[Sabenth]

Year of the laptop year of the music. Year of lets get some dam market share ...

Hopefully we will also see iTunes global .. Not apples fault i know

[vollspacken]

GODDAMN, bring on new hardware!!! :mad:

vSpacken

[Savage Henry]

It's more than just that, he specifically mentioned "mobility and wireless communications". To me, that sounds like something in the arena of the fabled iPhone, or hybrid PDA, or something. The severing ties that PalmOne has made now to Apple to not include Mac support with Cobalt can only translate to Apple being forced into that type of market. And if the iPod is any indication of how Apple can reinvigorate and eventually dominate a stagoring market (such as with handhelds), then I can't wait to see what the future holds. ;)

The Phones and PDA markets should be dropped like a stone, there is no money there and they would add nothing to Apple's profile. For Jobs to go on record saying that phones and PDAs are not where it's at, but secretly harbouring desires and ambitions contrary to those remarks, would make him look like a bit of a lemon.

I love what Apple does, but presence in every technology product line would turn the company into a very ordinary and unprofitable business

[virividox]

it shoudl be the year of the lets kick some asss and put this puppy into high gear and roll out some hardware.

but thats just me

[ethernet76]

As noticed apple has only entered arenas where they thought they could improve upon current products. iPod for example came around when mp3 deviced where geek-only objects. The iPod changed that.

The same goes with iTMS. Back in April the only provider really that was on the radar was Rhapsody and that wasn't a download service. iTMS came around and with the avid Apple fanbase buying in reguardless, they were able to build up enough steam and hype to make it a success with Windows users as well. (All though I'll venture to say that disproportional number of songs are bought by Mac users. I.E. 25-33% with only a 5% computer marketshare.)

With the phones it's a totally different game. There are 10 or so worldwide makers of phones, with various sizes, colors, features to confuse even the most tech-savvy person. (Try looking at Japanese cell phones, they're clearly superior to even the best phones here in the States, and far cheaper too.) There isn't really anything apple could do to make the market better. Add mp3 playing ability? Already there. Better interface? They're good enough to the point where complaints are minimal. Style/Design? Don't think there is a problem there either. I know there isn't a market for an iPhone.

[KC9AIC]

Whatever Apple turns out, I want it yesterday, and for low prices. Yes, very easy to please, aren't I? :rolleyes:

[~Shard~]

Year of the laptop year of the music. Year of lets get some dam market share ...

Hopefully we will also see iTunes global .. Not apples fault i know

First of all, I agree - hopefully this translates into more iTMS around the world. Although I understand the assosciated legal difficulties, it's been far too long!

Secondly, it's "let's" and "damn" and "Apple's", ;) and lastly, I don't know why everyone is always so concerned about market share, and why they try to make it a priority and a be-all and end-all indicator of the success of a company. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Apple has any less market share in the computer industry than Porsche or BMW do in the auto industry - and those successful companies don't seem to care. Don't get me wrong, increased market share is always nice, but I definitely don't think it should be Apple's focus. :cool:

[~Shard~]

Whatever Apple turns out, I want it yesterday, and for low prices. Yes, very easy to please, aren't I? :rolleyes:

Would you like that to be a G6 as well sir? :D

[dongmin]

With the phones it's a totally different game. There are 10 or so worldwide makers of phones, with various sizes, colors, features to confuse even the most tech-savvy person. (Try looking at Japanese cell phones, they're clearly superior to even the best phones here in the States, and far cheaper too.) There isn't really anything apple could do to make the market better. Add mp3 playing ability? Already there. Better interface? They're good enough to the point where complaints are minimal. Style/Design? Don't think there is a problem there either. I know there isn't a market for an iPhone.

i disagree. they're rolling out 3G services in Europe this year. These services will let you download--to your phone--sports highlights, news segments, and episodes of your favorite TV program. If this isn't made for Apple and Quicktime, I don't know what is. Quicktime is already compatible with 3G services. And Sony, I believe, has come out explicitly in support of using Quicktime in its products. I see soemthing big in the works that involve quicktime, wireless, and some sort of mobile gadget. It may be just a partnership. It may be a new services a la iTMS. Or it could be a brand new hardware. All of the above is my guess.

[eSnow]

and lastly, I don't know why everyone is always so concerned about market share, and why they try to make it a priority and a be-all and end-all indicator of the success of a company. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Apple has any less market share in the computer industry than Porsche or BMW do in the auto industry

There is a huge difference between computers and cars: to run a car, you need gas (completely standardized across car brands), a road (again completely standardized). To operate a computer, you need software (with the exception of Java, there is nothing like a cross platform standard here - and nobody seems to like Java) and interchangeable document formats (just look how many different word processors can read .doc - or how web pages are "optimized" to work with IE/Win and IE/Win only). Operating systems and different CPUs create trench effects in computers, much like available films and available players decided the VCR format war - and the most crappy standard VHS won.

Market share in the software business is Apples make-or-break measure of success - Adobe or MS leaving the platform and they are a second Commodore. To gain market share in software they need to sell hardware by the truckload.

[dukemeiser]

McDonalds anyone? As bad as McD food is for you, I think I would still change some of my fastfood habits if it meant free songs.

[eSnow]

Unlike last year ("year of the laptop"), Anderson claims no specific theme this year but a focus on growth with three key drivers -- "portable – mobility and wireless communications; the digital lifestyle and music, iPod, iPod mini and iTunes Music Store".

If Apple was not such an america-centric company, they could really score in Europe by cutting a deal with one of the large telcos which are about to introduce UTMS over the next 6 month and offer wireless broadband access with every PowerBook for its customers at a good price. Telcos have sunken billions into UMTS and are craving for paying users but get the pricing completely wrong for using the standard for mobile internet access (much like the music download companies before iTMS was born). But hey, it's only 350mio people...

[cubist]

Sounds like the year of portable music... ;)

I agree :(

Nothing about Macs...

[Photorun]

GODDAMN, bring on new hardware!!! :mad:

vSpacken

I second Trogdor's GODDAMN!!!! Or rather, that's all fine and dandy, they can become the Gateway of trinkety sh** but they better not REPLACE development and constant upgrades ("constant" and "upgrades" talking about Apple, uh, yeah, that's a joke) with their PRO machines in place of this. Which, if you see how incredif***ingly STALE their entire pro line is one would think they are neglecting it. Morons!

[jouster]

For Jobs to go on record saying that phones and PDAs are not where it's at, but secretly harbouring desires and ambitions contrary to those remarks, would make him look like a bit of a lemon.


And, given that he's CEO of a publicly listed company, might even be illegal.

[Trowaman]

McDonalds anyone? As bad as McD food is for you, I think I would still change some of my fastfood habits if it meant free songs.

Poo, you said what I was going to. Oh well, that'll teach me to sleep in until 7 a.m. . . . . stupid midterm in an hour . . .

[agreenster]

GODDAMN, bring on new hardware!!! :mad:

vSpacken

Ditto. Everyone and their mother has an iPod already. Get me a RevB G5 please. (among all the other items needing an upgrade)

[whooleytoo]

With the phones it's a totally different game. There are 10 or so worldwide makers of phones, with various sizes, colors, features to confuse even the most tech-savvy person. (Try looking at Japanese cell phones, they're clearly superior to even the best phones here in the States, and far cheaper too.) There isn't really anything apple could do to make the market better. Add mp3 playing ability? Already there. Better interface? They're good enough to the point where complaints are minimal. Style/Design? Don't think there is a problem there either. I know there isn't a market for an iPhone.

Apple as a phone hardware maker doesn't make a lot of sense.

But Apple as a phone hardware, OS and developer tools maker sounds a lot more interesting. Especially if they license the OS to other hardware makers.

Although sales of smartphones are very good, I doubt there's very much revenue being made from smartphone software, it's too confusing and fragmented a market (and I say that as a smartphone software developer!). Getting everything from the one vendor with a significent market share would be a godsend by comparison.

Apple, with their 'lunatic fringe' who'll pre-order hundreds of thousands of anything they put on the market, has the oomph to be a big player in this emerging market.

[wdlove]

An alliance with Sony would make sense, they definitely have the marketing. Maybe that would prevent them from having there own music store.

I with others, where is the mention of hardware. Many want to see a G5 PowerBook. Personally I want to see the Power Mac upgrade, Rev. B with a dual 3.0.

[Spades]

Year of lets get some dam market share


Secondly, it's "let's" and "damn" and "Apple's", ;)


You never know. Apple might have plans for the Colorado river, or maybe even the Mississippi! It might be cool if Apple became a power company. Wouldn't you sign up? :D

But then that would be yet another thing that's not a computer. RevB G5s would be nice, but I still don't need one. I'm hoping Apple will release something totally new. G5 Cube, eBook. Anything that will make a splash like the iMac did.

[Rocketman]

Unlike last year ("year of the laptop"), Anderson claims no specific theme this year but a focus on growth with three key drivers -- "portable – mobility and wireless communications; the digital lifestyle and music, iPod, iPod mini and iTunes Music Store".

ATT Edge high bandwidth cellular internet everywhere is going to make some long invisioned devices practical.

Portable computers will all become mobile well beyond the base station. Handheld devices will become true internet workhorses.

It will be interesting to see if Apple actually leads this segment they are uniquely qualified to dominate.

Rocketman

[SiliconAddict]

I know there isn't a market for an iPhone.

Depends on what "type" of phone you are talking about.

Let me introduce you to the Apple iFone.

VoIP cordless phone that connects to your Mac and allows VoIP to anyone using iChat 2.3. This phone would also integrate into your standard landline phone system by plugging your modem into the wall. The phone would have a transreflective 16-bit color LCD display and 16MB of onboard memory. The storage would store the user icons on the phone so when someone tries to VoIP you it would display their username and picture on the phone. If you want to do real-time chat with them you simply walk to your Mac drop the phone into the cradle and it instantly transfers the session over to iChat and iSight starting up a video con call. Both landline and VoIP would display an icon for the person via caller ID and a utility that comes with the phone that allows you to assign pictures and names to incoming numbers and allows direct integration with your address book to allow easy dialing of numbers.
On the phone itself you differentiate a landline and a VoIP call with a color telephone poll with an electric current running across the wire and a spinning globe with little wires zapping electrical current across the globe.

This was a repost from a previous discussion. This probably won't happen but I do think Apple is going to get into the appliance market in the not to distant future. They've already shown a knack for making devices simple, stylish, and fill a gap that people never realized needed to be filled. So I'm bettering that we will start seeing apps that integrate into the home entertainment market that seamlessly integrate into the MOS. Another example. A stand alone wireless box that connects up to your airport network and allows video, audio, pictures, etc to be streamed to whatever video/audio out source you plug into this wonder box. Take it one step further. What if someone from the net could stream this content to this box?

There are plenty of revolutionary ideas that Apple could pounce on. In Apple's case its all a matter of timing.

[sinisterdesign]

Market share in the software business is Apples make-or-break measure of success - Adobe or MS leaving the platform and they are a second Commodore. To gain market share in software they need to sell hardware by the truckload.

i gotta agree here. as soon as i think Apple is cruising right along, getting some 'switchers', selling iPods like hotcakes, OSX finally out of it's akward years, i read something like Palm dropping us. that sucks. i've been a Palm advocate for the past few years b/c it was the one that was Mac compatible. Corel or somebody else dropped us, too, but no designer (ie Mac users) w/ self respect would be caught dead using that program, so no loss there.

i want to see OSX become a viable alternative to the virus ridden Winblows for some high profile companies (FedEx? government agencies? etc). i work at the US's 2nd largest retailer & people still think Macs are some strange voodoo computer that can't run Office. ughh. of course it doesn't help that i'm stuck in OS9 here at work, for god's sake. i want people to know what OSX *IS* and how kick ass of an OS it really is. is that too much to ask??!?

[agreenster]

But then that would be yet another thing that's not a computer. RevB G5s would be nice, but I still don't need one. I'm hoping Apple will release something totally new. G5 Cube, eBook. Anything that will make a splash like the iMac did.

The cube is dead. Dead. A G5 cube is outta da picture. Way too hot. eBook isnt that bad of an idea.

Truth is, splash or not, they need to keep maintaining their current lines. Maybe you dont need a RevB G5, but alot of us pro users DO. iPod keeps them "splashy" but G5's keeps them in the designers/high end users hands.

[Jerry Spoon]

GODDAMN, bring on new hardware!!! :mad:

vSpacken

You got that right.

Anybody know if there has been any more rumblings about McDonalds doing an iTunes music store thing? Was that confirmed and I just missed it or are we waiting until the Pepsi promotion is over before we start talking about that?

[vollspacken]

I second Trogdor's GODDAMN!!!! Or rather, that's all fine and dandy, they can become the Gateway of trinkety sh** but they better not REPLACE development and constant upgrades ("constant" and "upgrades" talking about Apple, uh, yeah, that's a joke) with their PRO machines in place of this. Which, if you see how incredif***ingly STALE their entire pro line is one would think they are neglecting it. Morons!

yeah, we don't want Trogdor coming over to Steve's office and stomp and burninate the campus until Apple's R&D guys finally do THEIR FRIKKEN' WORK, don't we???!!!

vSpacken

[Naimfan]

All--

I think Apple is on the right track with what they're doing, though I do have a couple of concerns.

First, I think they need to be more predictable and (somewhat) more open about upcoming hardware and software plans, at least for already existing products (computers, iPods, etc). If they would at least offer some kind of roadmap it would provide people with an idea of when new products were coming and allow them to budget accordingly. I understand that Motorola was a major factor here, but as Apple shifts CPU sourcing to IBM that should be less of a problem. Also, if something is projected but not delivered, just say why--candor works brilliantly with the public and with corporate buyers.

Second, I think they need to do more to get into the enterprise. Most businesses waste tons of money buying new hardware and paying IT folks to manage it; Macs offer a lower TCO and thus help ultimate ROI. Being more involved with the enterprise market would also help with the perception that no one uses Macs. I'm far from an expert, but my sense is that the Xserve G5 is an important step in that direction--I think Apple needs to continue to push that way.

Third: perceived pricing. It seems a lot of people think Macs are too expensive. While part of this is undoubtedly the "MHz (now GHz) Myth," Apple should address it because it really doesn't matter WHERE it comes from--if people believe it, then it is true for those people. I agree that Apple does not want to be all things to all people, and does not want to get into the commodity realm. But Apple really does need to realize that price and perceived value DOES matter to most people.

The last issue is similar in that it is more a perception than reality, and that is that "There isn't any software for the Mac." A friend who is staying with me often voices this. When I finally prodded him to name something that couldn't be done on a Mac, he referred to GPS software. A very perfunctory Google search returned tons of hits for Mac GPS software, some of which included features the software he uses does not have. Nevertheless, the perception is out there, as is the perception that Macs can't co-exist with wintel machines.

Best,

Bob

The last two paragraphs are a repost from a different thread....


*

[ipiloot]

I listened the thing through and Anderson also said that they are not about to compete in a market for below $600 computers. This is sad news.

[agreenster]

First, I think they need to be more predictable and (somewhat) more open about upcoming hardware and software plans, at least for already existing products (computers, iPods, etc). If they would at least offer some kind of roadmap it would provide people with an idea of when new products were coming and allow them to budget accordingly.

I dont think I have ever agreed with anything on this entire forum more than this. Ive often wondered why the secrecy surrounding upcoming upgrades. Yeah, I know that theres the theory that people wont buy if they know an upgrade is around the corner, but if they dont know where that corner is, they REALLY wont buy.

Case in point:

I would buy a G5 today if I knew FOR sure that the next revision wasnt until June. But as it is, I expect a revision to be announced in March. But if they announced today that if you want a 2.5ghz G5 you'll have to wait three months, I'd whip out my credit card. I dont want to wait that long.

Also, I think Apple killed a lot of their own sales when they didnt say the 15inch Aluminum Powerbooks wouldnt be available for 6 months after the debut of the 17 & 12 inchers. People didnt buy because they expected a revision 2 weeks after the 17 inch's debuted. The longer they waited, the more they expected it, and the less likely to 'give in' and just buy the Titanium one. The mentality was, 'Ive already waited this long...' But had they known 4 months before, they probably would have bought back then.

oh well

[D*I*S_Frontman]

I listened the thing through and Anderson also said that they are not about to compete in a market for below $600 computers. This is sad news.

Wrong. This is FABULOUS news. The longer Apple can stay away from the computer-as-commodity-item rat race, the better.

To sell "below $600" computers, you have to accept razor-thin profit margins and sell hundreds of thousands of units to make even a tiny sqeak of a profit from them. You can gain marketshare, but R&D money will dry up as everything in the company must be geared toward raw output. This paradigm is okay for a company like Gateway, let's say, because Gateway is not a technology leader or an innovator. Actually, very few of the PC makers are. They really follow Apple's lead to a great extent. I mean, jeez, I just read that the PC makers are all going to drop floppies this year! And do you really think every PC laptop maker would be jumping on the widescreen bandwagon without the TiBook example showing them the way?

Apples are luxury items. Get used to it. You pay a premium price for the technology, and you will always get more bang-for-the-clock-cycle out of a PC, whether Apple leads the CPU wars (G5 release days) or not (G4 Moto foot-dragging days). What you get for your luxury expense is design elegance, durability, longevity, perfect os/hardware integration, comfortable and practical user-friendliness, and a dose of the chic "cool factor." Of course the irony is that over time the Mac's TCO is cheaper, too.

Do you like Apple innovation? Owning a piece of computing elegance? Using something now that all the other PCs will look like three years later? Then you should thank Steve Jobs for keeping Macs high priced and profitable so that the R&D can continue to make them the shining examples of what computing should be now and in the future.

[d8n_two]

I just wanted to make a note on wireless phones. Even though most of the talk seems to be about Sony, Nokia will soon be releasing its 6230 (http://www.phonescoop.com/phones/phone.php?p=408), which is a class 10 EDGE (enhanced data GSM) device capable of speeds up to 236.8 kbps on an EDGE network. It also supports several key Apple-backed formats, including AAC audio and 3GP video playback and streaming. Both of these can currently be encoded with QuickTime. It also supports Bluetooth and has a MMC card slot for expandable memory.

With this kind of device coming soon, Apple is in a good position to provided content and digital hub-type services. As mentioned earlier in the thread, AT&T already has EDGE active on their GSM network, and many think this will improve greatly with the Cingular "merger". Similar devices should also be coming on CDMA2000 networks as well. So the wireless phone arena should be something to keep an eye on.

d8n_two

[ipiloot]

Wrong. This is FABULOUS news. The longer Apple can stay away from the computer-as-commodity-item rat race, the better.

To sell "below $600" computers, you have to accept razor-thin profit margins and sell hundreds of thousands of units to make even a tiny sqeak of a profit from them.

Apples are luxury items. Get used to it. You pay a premium price for the technology, and you will always get more bang-for-the-clock-cycle out of a PC, whether Apple leads the CPU wars (G5 release days) or not (G4 Moto foot-dragging days).



Don't talk BS. Sorry, but this is usual "blinded person's" hoopla. Sayings like that are the reason why serious people ridicule macusers quite often. Look behind the flesh. $600 is currently the sweet spot of the market. If Apple is missing from the sweet spot then this is a problem. Computer business is a business and not an artwork. In the end of the day you have to make money and you have to do it also after ten years. Or at least five. Apple's market share has been drying. It did also last year. This is a problem. A serious-one. Last year was the first one when more new Linux desktops were installed than Mac's.


Cut off the damn monitor from eMac and you have your $600 computer without cutting your profits. Apple has nothing to offer for a company which would like to order a bulk of computers for office clerks while keeping their current monitors. This is the simple truth right now.

Don't get me wrong. If you'd say some serious arguments favouring the lack of the company from sub $600 market, I'd be more polite and I'd be talking with your arguments. But things that you point out work only for 700 000 people a quarter. Not for 2 million that Apple needs to regain the lost poistions. Not even talking about getting back to be the $10 billion company some day.

That company needs hefty market share gains like a fresh air. And they need faster product cycles. Where are renewed G5-s? Xserves? Staying in power parity doesn't rise market share. You have to be better than others. Yet Anderson says that they want to make lifecycles longer? Why? Do they intentionally loose market share? This company is not in the market of he's own. They are in the computer market and computers are commodity - take it or leave it. Therefore they have to dance the music there. The only place where the can dictate the music is in iPod/iTunes market. But in a computer market the are runner-ups and there they have to run faster than others do.

I'm a strong supporter of Apple. And in software front they are just fabulous. But in hardware front they are starting to loose the just-gained ground again. Twon months ago Apple was in a best positsion over a long time to make things moving. Nothing happened. Even the G5 XServe is late. Not even talking about renewal of the G5 which is almost a quarter late. I'm sick of those lost chances. I want them to start winning once and for all.

[Flowbee]

Cut off the damn monitor from eMac and you have your $600 computer without cutting your profits.

I think the monitor is exactly where Apple's profit comes from on the eMac. You think that's a $200 monitor in there?

That being said, a 'monitorless' eMac for $699 would still be a sweet deal.

[sethypoo]

Here's hoping they do the Pepsi promotion again, but maybe add in the chance to win iPods and other neat stuff.

[Docrjm]

Would you like that to be a G6 as well sir? :D
Supersized naturally, all for 50c more :D

[painandgreed]

There is a huge difference between computers and cars: to run a car, you need gas (completely standardized across car brands), a road (again completely standardized). To operate a computer, you need software (with the exception of Java, there is nothing like a cross platform standard here - and nobody seems to like Java) and interchangeable document formats (just look how many different word processors can read .doc - or how web pages are "optimized" to work with IE/Win and IE/Win only). Operating systems and different CPUs create trench effects in computers, much like available films and available players decided the VCR format war - and the most crappy standard VHS won.

And computers use the same electricity and TCP/IP protocols. Programs are more like parts and accessories whcih are also proprietary and not available to all vehicles. The car analogy, although imperfect as all analogies are, is a good one.

[ipiloot]

I think the monitor is exactly where Apple's profit comes from on the eMac. You think that's a $200 monitor in there?

That being said, a 'monitorless' eMac for $699 would still be a sweet deal.

Don't forget that you get along with the cheaper case and cheaper montage as well. Some $650 or eaven $620 would be achevable with ease.

[allpar]

The car analogy is bad because you don't need to share your Dodge tires with the guy in the Chevy next to you. Nor do you have tollbooths on 20% of the roads turning away Dodges but letting Chevies through, and allowing Toyotas if they put on a Chevy mask (e.g. changing your ID code in Safari).

BTW, I have no problem wtih Apple not making sub-$600 computers if it means they will finally compete in the $600-$700 space!!! I mean, they can charge a premium, but charging triple is pushing it. And no, I don't consider the eMac to be a business computer. Desktops should be dual G4s at minimum.

[sw1tcher]

If last year was the year of the laptop, then IMO it was a disappointing year. Apple needs to move beyond Motorola as they're holding Apple back. Where's my G5 PB?

[shewy]

i disagree. they're rolling out 3G services in Europe this year. These services will let you download--to your phone--sports highlights, news segments, and episodes of your favorite TV program. If this isn't made for Apple and Quicktime, I don't know what is. Quicktime is already compatible with 3G services. And Sony, I believe, has come out explicitly in support of using Quicktime in its products. I see soemthing big in the works that involve quicktime, wireless, and some sort of mobile gadget. It may be just a partnership. It may be a new services a la iTMS. Or it could be a brand new hardware. All of the above is my guess.

Agreed - Apple would never enter this market space if they didn't think that they would reshape it - álá iPod in the mp3 market. A phone with built-in iChat AV is worth the price of admission for me. The PDA features built into phones and even the iPod are nice extras to have - but the primary job of a phone is help you communicate. Calling home and talking to my kids face to face. Functionality like that would totally change the phone market forever.

Dan

[lazyrighteye]

I can hardly wait for the year of the new Cinema Displays...

[Jack Reacher]

Look at what's happening at Dartmouth: incoming freshmen are issued "softphones" that work over their campus-wide wireless network.
http://www.telesym.com/news.php?page=dartmouth_release

I can envision an Apple wireless phone that utilizes your airport extreme base or other hotspot. I wonder if they could engineer a phone that automatically switches from VoIP to traditional cellular service? Would voice mail be integrated into my .mac account?

The traditional carriers (Verizon, Cingular, WorldNet, AT&T, etc.) are watching this very closely - VoIP is going to completely change the complexion of the phone business.

Apple is about innovation and design, not market share and dominance. If/when they release this product, it will simultaneously seem unique and obvious. Now close your eyes and think portable, mobile and wireless.

[windowsblowsass]

Apple, with their 'lunatic fringe' who'll pre-order hundreds of thousands of anything they put on the market, has the oomph to be a big player in this emerging market.
dont make fun of the apple lunitics many here are members of that so called lunatic fringe ;)

[craigiest]

eBook isnt that bad of an idea.

Would that be a laptop with a CRT? Mac SX64!

[lajocaab]

The technology is available to provide consumers with a product like "iSlate". Of course only Apple could really do it right, although several other companies are attempting to create some variation of this device. Unfortunately many are too focused on video playback only, & not creating a true multi-function device that could be used at home, at the office, or on the road. This product would integrate well into the "Digital Lifestyle" philosophy & compliment existing Apple product. It would provide a screen large enough to actually watch video & view photos, while still being small enough to be portable. It needs to be smaller than a notebook computer, but larger than a PDA. Granted, you can not but a device the size of a DVD case in your pocket, but something doesn't have to fit in a pocket to be portable. This device could be used in so many different situations that if would have broad appeal in the market. I only pray that Apple is working on such a device & will release it in 2004. They have an opportunity to impact the industry with the iSlate & iVideo media Store as much as the iPod & iTMS will.

iSlate

New Apple mini-tablet –> PMA (portable media appliance)

Designed not to be a creative device like a desktop or laptop, but rather a sophisticated display device that communicates seamlessly with other devices via Rendezvous & 802.11, BT, FireWire, etc.


Device Size:
8” x 5.0” x .65” (±15oz)
± 1/2 size of a 17” PowerBook
± 2x size of a Palm T3 or an iPod
± size of a DVD movie case
small enough to hold with one hand by the bezel (.5” bezel on the sides)

Screen:
±8” LCD (16:9 ratio) -> 800 x 480 pixels minimum (1024 x 600 ideally)
± 1/2 size of 17” PowerBook screen
± 2x size of a Palm T3 screen
able to display “640 x 480 material” & DVD (720x480) quality video natively

Battery:
6-9 hr. Li-Ion battery (or some new battery technology)

Storage:
1.8” 20GB or 40GB Toshiba hard drive (additional capacity can come from external devices)
256MB or 512MB RAM - fixed
SD slot (w/ adapter for xD, or Smart Media)

Processor & OS ?:
Motorola 800 MHz G4 mobile w/ Mac OS X lite or
Intel 400 MHz XScale PXA263 w/ Palm OS 6 or Mac OS Mobile?

Connectivity:
802.11 –> Desktop or Laptop, Stereo, Internet via Wi-Fi hotspots
Bluetooth –> Keyboard, Mouse, PDA, Wireless Headphones, Internet via GSM Phone
FireWire –> iPod, Computer, Hard Drive, DVD/CD writer, Video Camera, iSight
USB 2.0 –> Printer, PDA, Digital Still Camera
mini-DVI w/adapter for:
-> ADC & VGA for larger monitor
-> DVI for video projector or HDTV
-> S-Video for video projector or TV
-> Composite for video projector or TV
Stereo mini out
Stereo mini in
Rendezvous for seamless connectivity to other devices

Input:
Inkwell via touch screen &/or stylus
Keyboard & mouse via Bluetooth or USB
Microphone
Remote control via Bluetooth

Applications:
inkwell, iPhoto, iTunes, iMovie, Safari, QuickTime, iSync, Rendezvous
Preview or Acrobat Reader, Mail, iCal, Address Book, Sherlock, iChat AV
Keynote, FileMaker, Quicken,

A/V Formats:
Pixlet, MPEG-4, MPEG-2, MPEG-1, AAC, MP3, WAV, AIFF, Audible, JPEG, TIFF, GIF

Accessories:
Charger, External Battery, Stand, clip for iSight, Portable folding BT keyboard, BT mouse
Headphone w/Microphone boom, quality stereo headphones

Price ??:
$699 to $899

Create a device that is bigger that the largest PDA or Archos type device, yet smaller than the average notebook or tablet computer. Imagine if you will, holding a device (about the size of a DVD case) away from you anywhere from 12" to 18". Obviously a 4" screen would be inadequate, but a 7" to 9" diagonal widescreen would be more than acceptable. It could still be small enough to fit in a stack of books, a briefcase, a large purse, of any number of other carrying cases. It would be something that could be viewed in an office, at home, in a coffee shop, on an airplane or train, or even in the backseat of a car.

The idea is not to see how much visual information one can cram into a small space (3" to 4" screens) or replace existing devices like the TV or Video Projector. The idea is to create a device that is a reasonable compromise between portability & "acceptable or pleasurable" viewing for multiple applications & that also complements existing devices.

Although a 4 lb, 12" notebook computer displays video beautifully (I use one everyday), it is too big for the situations I have described. Beyond the innumerable business applications it could fulfill, it could display video & photos on a screen that is much bigger than an Archos type device or PDA, & yet smaller than a notebook computer. It doesn’t need to carry everything all the time, so it doesn’t require a massive hard drive. The internal HD needs only to be large enough for the OS, applications & enough storage to carry material while you away from any connectivity to other devices or the internet.

From a strictly “video perspective”, a large part of its success would hinge upon Apple's ability to distribute video clips through an online store much like iTMS. This store could provide educational content, business content, news content, & entertainment content beyond just movies. To be truly successful, it must integrate into Apple's "Digital Lifestyle" strategy, & be truly portable (ubiquitous wireless connectivity & good battery life).

[WM.]

I'd like to remind everybody that the "year of the notebook" saw the release of:


Safari, which went from an early public beta to a solid 1.1
Keynote
Final Cut Express
iLife
the Xserve RAID
Final Cut Pro 4
Shake 3
DVD Studio Pro 2
the 3G iPod
the iTunes Music Store
iChat AV
the iSight
the Power Mac G5
Panther
the Windows version of iTunes

And during that year, Apple did most of the development of:


Final Cut Express 2
the iPod mini
the Xserve G5
a significant revision to the Power Mac G5 (yes, it's coming)
iLife '04

And that's just so far this year, and the things I can remember off the top of my head!! Yes, Virginia, Apple really can walk and chew gum at the same time.

BTW, feel free to add to my lists. :)

WM

[trilogic]

I want 2004 to be the Year of the new Cinema Display :(

[chriscorcoran]

The Phones and PDA markets should be dropped like a stone, there is no money there and they would add nothing to Apple's profile. For Jobs to go on record saying that phones and PDAs are not where it's at, but secretly harbouring desires and ambitions contrary to those remarks, would make him look like a bit of a lemon.

I love what Apple does, but presence in every technology product line would turn the company into a very ordinary and unprofitable business

No Money in Phones or PDAs? Are you sure? What are you smoking? Compaines like Motorola, Nokia, Kyocera and LG all seem to be doing pretty good in mobile phones. Heck they even made there own little bussiness around it. And no money in PDAs? I dont know if you have head of this little company called Palm? They make a nice little living on making PDAs. I checked they took in about 271 million in Revenue last quater. Oh not to metion companies like Hp? Hp...hmmm that name sounds fimilar? Oh yeah dont for get about Sony, Dell, Toshiba and Sharp.

Its not there there is no money in phones and pdas its that Jobs doesnt like the way the industry is set up right now. Right now there are cell phone makers and there are pda makers. Jobs vision is not opposed to entering the mobile device market its that he is waiting for the two devices to converge into a smartphone or blackberry devices. And even when this hybrid roll over is complete he will still wait for the market to be ripe for the picking. And even then he will wait untill his smartphone is perfect. Then and only then will he release a smartphone that will bitch slap micrsoft and dell. Much like he did with the iPod. He will wait until no one is watching that attack like a panther.
(pun intended)

Now on the point of it not fitting into Apples portfolio. Now I see it fitting quite nicely. Apple is applying its digital hub stragety in which apple is the hib of you digital life. The Powerbook being the mobile leg of that approach. Now just in the partical sence there are placed were the powerbook just dont work. So a smartphone device would exten the hub even father into ones life.

OK to sum up....
1) There is money in PDAs and Cell Phones.
2) Jobs didnt say he was opposed to PDA and Cell phones he was just for
Smartphones.
3) The Smartphone is just not ready in Jobs eyes.
4) Apple will have to release some sort of device for there digital hub
stragety to continue to grow.
5) A PDA or Smartphone runing some form of MacOS X would kick ass!

-Chris

[vollspacken]

Would that be a laptop with a CRT? Mac SX64!

wow, someone remembers the portable Commodore C=64 prototype... :D

way cool!!!

vSpacken

[windowsblowsass]

i dont know if people know this but remember how iphone.com used to mirror apple .com well now it doesnt. seems strange if the release of a phone happened :(
edit oops its iphone.org and its still an apple mirror

[windowsblowsass]

they can become the Gateway of trinkety sh** but they better not REPLACE development and constant upgrades !
hey dont diss trinkits we bought entire states from indians for teinkets maybe we can buy market share from microsoft with them ;)

[Dave the Great]

I want 2004 to be the Year of the new Cinema Display :(


Oh, yeah!!

What ever happened to the updates on the LCD?

I remember reading a couple of rumours on them a long time ago.

Will they ever be updated?

Or does anyone know what the hold up is?

[Dave the Great]

wow, someone remembers the portable Commodore C=64 prototype... :D

way cool!!!

vSpacken


Is that true?

Did Commodore have a portable computer?

Who had the first portable computer?

[vollspacken]

Is that true?

Did Commodore have a portable computer?

Who had the first portable computer?

here's a pic:
http://amiga.emugaming.com/commodore/sx64_sm.gif

and here are two links:
one (http://www.heimcomputer.de/english/comp/sx64.html)
two (http://oldcomputers.net/sx64.html)


vSpacken

[eSnow]

And computers use the same electricity and TCP/IP protocols. Programs are more like parts and accessories whcih are also proprietary and not available to all vehicles. The car analogy, although imperfect as all analogies are, is a good one.

The car analogy stinks :)
Well at least in the way you propose it here.

Maybe you are late in the game, but if you did own a Mac in the early 90s, it was a radically different beast:
- It did not use TCP/IP (you could install a TCP stack, though), but Apple had invented their own networking protocols - much more user friendly in a LAN than TCP/IP, I might add.

- It did use only proprietary connectors (monitor plug, ADB, NuBus, PDS) or high-end stuff (SCSI)

- The OS underpinnings were different from both the Windows and Unix world

- it was a truely different system.

Now we have:
- all networking based on TCP. Apple-specific solutions all culled and reinvented on a TCP base (Rendezvous)

- Cheap standard components with a platform-specific dongle (CPU). Gone are the days of crazy powerhouses like the IIfx and Quadra 840.

- They tapped the BSD world for their OS

While I don't deny this is mostly good news for Mac-users working in a colaboratory environment, it clearly shows how much of their R&D they have stopped over time.

And yet, the software issue is not really solved. Programs are nothing like accessories - I know more people buying Computers for the software they run than the hardware they run on. Just look around here: OS X is the #1 reason to buy a mac. For developers, things are different. You don't support a platform because you like its style, you do so because you like the business case you can make supporting it.
A lot of shareware applications are indeed like auto parts in the sense that every platform has a similar application targeted at a certain task. They are somewhat interchangeable. This is not, however, true for the big-boy apps like Word, Excel, Photoshop.

I have seen two technically superior platforms (Atari, Commodore Amiga) sink to their graves both because of management incompetence and neglect by thirdparty developers. Linux, the free juggernaut does not really catch on outside of geek circles not least because people don't regard it a serious OS as it cannot run business apps.

If you need car analogies to feel good, think about alternative designs that are constantly not catching on because of network effects:
Pressurized gas can drive a car and it is much more eco-friendly and could be cheaper. Almost no-one uses it because you have a hard time refilling outside of all but the larges cities. Biodiesel (harvested and processed from oil-generating plants) is not catching on because it requires a modification to the motor. Car companies could easily modify the motors from the start, but they don't because so few people would have the chance to use biodiesel.
To compare different brands on the fuel-gas platform (BMW, Porsche) is like comparing Dell and HP.

[spinko]

Apple, with their 'lunatic fringe' who'll pre-order hundreds of thousands of anything they put on the market, has the oomph to be a big player in this emerging market.

Exactly, and that may just get the snowball rolling..

PS.: why not put a subversion of OSX into a phone ?

[whooleytoo]

dont make fun of the apple lunitics many here are members of that so called lunatic fringe ;)

"Here's to the crazy ones. The people who buy v1.0 of software. The people who fork out hundreds of dollars for a product that isn't even out yet..

Bling Different.." :D

[allpar]

Biodiesel doesn't require any modifications to the engine - if you have a diesel engine to begin with. That's according to long-term tests.

http://www.allpar.com/ed/biodiesel.html

More to the point, I agree with what you say. Ask me why I have a PC. Well, is there ANY survey software for the Mac? NO. Now let's look at the PC. we have EZsurvey (OK, so I never got it to work), Perseus SurveySolutions (I use it), Snap! (probably the best but I can't afford it and it's hard to use), and a dozen more.

My old company and now my client requires me to use an Access database. I could probably manage that in SoftPC but not the Perseus - far, far too slow in emulation. (Not a speed demon without it, either). The Access database actually gets to be too slow, too. So I need a real PC.

Let's go to the Internet. This bank, that bank, the other bank don't allow Macs. hmmm. Chrysler TechConnect doesn't allow Macs. Lotus Notes doesn't allow Macs. Well, that means my mechanic had to buy a PC - and if I want to read my corporate e-mail, i do too.

THAT is where the car analogy fails. Nobody cares if I drive a Peugeot 504 (I do not), even though hardly anyone supports it or makes parts for it any more. If I can keep it running, I can use it on any road. If I have a Mac (I do), well, my options suddenly become limited. I can't even use the military's electronic voting system!

THAT is why we need more market share - and that means $700 Macs.

And yes, I would gladly give up my cute shiny case for a beige box if it meant $100 off the price. I frankly don't like the G4 case much. Damage a ribbon cable and you're looking at hours of repairs. You have to take off the end of the optical drives to make 'em fit, you can't use the manual eject buttons, you can't shove a third drive into the front (e.g. for up-front USB ports), etc., etc. Yes, it's pretty. Guess what - that's not what I need. I need function, not form. (I might make an exception for the Cube.)

iMac or eMac? No thanks, I keep my monitor for a LONG time. My Sony monitor that I got in 1994 is still in use. My ViewSonic (that I am using now) should last me far past this computer - and I bought it two or three years ago when I had a beige G3 (that replaced my Quadra 605, which, incidentally, was probably the best of the pizza-box machines).

[Dave the Great]

here's a pic:
http://amiga.emugaming.com/commodore/sx64_sm.gif

and here are two links:
one (http://www.heimcomputer.de/english/comp/sx64.html)
two (http://oldcomputers.net/sx64.html)


vSpacken


That is so cool!

Thanks for the links!!

Did you actually own one?

[wdlove]

here's a pic:
http://amiga.emugaming.com/commodore/sx64_sm.gif

and here are two links:
one (http://www.heimcomputer.de/english/comp/sx64.html)
two (http://oldcomputers.net/sx64.html)


vSpacken

That is very interesting vollspacken. I remember those Commodore computers. Using those portables would certainly give you some exercise.

[vollspacken]

Did you actually own one?
That is very interesting vollspacken. I remember those Commodore computers. Using those portables would certainly give you some exercise.

I had two C=64 but not a portable one - they were too damn expensive, and how would anyone play Last Ninja or Winter Games on that tiny screen..? ;)

I really like the 80s style industrial design of that machine... that and the features make it a very attractive computer

vSpacken

[Scottgfx]

I have seen two technically superior platforms (Atari, Commodore Amiga) sink to their graves both because of management incompetence and neglect by thirdparty developers.

Here's the OS war all over again... The Atari was built from off-the-shelf parts and it's OS came from Digital Research. The ST's OS was CP/M 68K with the GEM windowing interface. Nothing about it was superior.