OS X 10.3.7 Development Underway?

[MacRumors]

AppleInsider (http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=747) reports that less than two weeks after 10.3.6 was released, Apple is already circulating internal builds of 10.3.7. Reportedly to be released before year's end, with developers receiving their first builds within the next few weeks.
While details surrounding these very early builds are scant, sources say Mac OS X 10.3.7 will deliver enhancements to FireWire Audio, OpenGL, CoreGraphics, Multicast DNS, mLAN Audio, CoreFoundation, and AppKit.

The update is also said to include revisions to the Mach Kernel, PDF and PostScript rendering, ATI Radeon graphics drivers (8500, 9700), and Nvidia GeForce graphics drivers (3, 2MX, FX).

[MrMacMan]

Looks like an important update.

We all love our graphics updates 'OpenGL, CoreGraphics... ATI Radeon graphics drivers,and Nvidia GeForce graphics drivers'


Good good.

Always love these update rumors! :D

[javabear90]

hopefully it will improve Fps in game. Also what happens if they get to 10.3.9 will the next one be 10.3.10 and then 10.3.11? that would be weird

[AirUncleP]

Would have to guess that this would be the last update before 10.4.

[combatcolin]

Does anyone actually sleep at Apple?

[blufire]

"Before year's end?" Does that mean they won't be releasing a fix for the MDD audio issue for a long while? That's not very responsible of them :P

[stoid]

Does anyone actually sleep at Apple?

A few people, but most go home for that. :D :p

Anyway, does the rumored update have new drivers for the Radeon 9700 Mobility, or just the regular 9700?

[wrldwzrd89]

Better PostScript rendering is the only change that I consider particularly important. New graphics card drivers are always nice, especially when you take Quartz Extreme into account. Other than that, though, I don't use any of the other things that are supposed to be updated.

[1macker1]

WOW at the recent number of updates. I feel sorry for the 56k users.

[Lepton]

It's not unusual to release a tweak to the OS to handle new hardware. With a MacWorld coming up, this may include new code for new models of Mac..

[Longey Nowze]

aren't the drivers handled by ATI and nVidia? or does Apple make them?

anyway this is always good, they just put one out and they are working on the next one that is amazing! I hope that they keep this pace! our uptimes will suffer, but that's a small price to pay for stability i guess


MaT

[russed]

wow, lots of news today!

any update is a good update (well apart from 10.3.6, i'm just not entirely happy with it!)

i hope it will turn my 12" pb into a monsterous dual 3ghz g5 with 2 gigs of ram!

[bousozoku]

I'm glad they're fixing the kernel. Maybe they'll finally get the throughput up and the SMP leak down. Always glad to see that they're working on OpenGL and the video card drivers.

I'm sorry that they're not fixing the networking. It's been a year since I've had reliable access between my machines. I suppose the good thing is that they haven't made it completely impossible or I'd have to continue to use my Zip drive to transfer files.

In any case, it looks like we're going all the way to 10.3.9 before we get real stability.

[wrldwzrd89]

aren't the drivers handled by ATI and nVidia? or does Apple make them?

anyway this is always good, they just put one out and they are working on the next one that is amazing! I hope that they keep this pace! our uptimes will suffer, but that's a small price to pay for stability i guess


MaT
As far as I'm aware, Apple handles graphics card drivers for the Mac.

[reckless_0001]

Right On!!! mLAN audio... it's what i'm waiting for to increase compatibility with my Yamaha 01X.

[thecow]

Yay! I will get ut2k4 back! 10.3.6 messed it up.

[MrMacMan]

aren't the drivers handled by ATI and nVidia? or does Apple make them?

anyway this is always good, they just put one out and they are working on the next one that is amazing! I hope that they keep this pace! our uptimes will suffer, but that's a small price to pay for stability i guess


MaT

"All your drivers are published by us. -- Apple Computer"

Apple works closely with Game Devolpers and ATI/nVidia to develop the drivers tho, I mean they want to make sure that the macs can have and use similar features for both OS's.

[maya]

WoW, at this rate 10.4 will be out sooner than I thought. As one of the previous rumours states Jan-March 2005 is when Tiger OS will be released.

I am all excited :D

This is great news indeed. :)

[patseguin]

Good, maybe my 6800 card will perform like it's supposed to. Hopefully the drivers will fix the bugs to allow WoW to have pixel shaders.

[iriejedi]

I just bought that and it plays perfectly and FAST (2.5+6800) on everything as high as possible. :eek:

Maybe you should just reinstall it.... :)


Yay! I will get ut2k4 back! 10.3.6 messed it up.

[dizastor]

WoW, at this rate 10.4 will be out sooner than I thought. As one of the previous rumours states Jan-March 2005 is when Tiger OS will be released.

This rumor is about Panther, right? I would think updates to Panter are totally unrelated to Tiger's release date. That being said, I'm as anxious as the next guy when it comes to Tiger's impending release.

I think that the video driver updates are mostly to try to even the playing field for gaming... as many have seen with the beta test of WoW, something is fishy in driver land on the Mac side. It's sad that a huge game developer like Blizzard has poured so much time and money into developing a Mac release alongside the PC version only to run into driver issues and other problems. Hopefully if they get some of these things taken care of we might see some other companies develop popular titles for the mac at the same time as the PC version.

[MacsRgr8]

Would have to guess that this would be the last update before 10.4.

I see no reason to guess that.

[swissmann]

Makes you wonder if there could ever be an update where they say, "All is fixed all is well" and never update again. It seems to me that no matter how hard they try there are bugs old or new. If they could get it completely right that would make me happy. (I know a bit to idealistic but still something to wish for).

[FoxyKaye]

Come on native DVR-108 support! I know these will be appearing in Macs soon, since they're the next step in Pioneer's lineup. Unless, of course, Apple switches providers, or waits till Tiger for native dual-layer burning...

[themacman]

so what tiger is the only thing that matters

[macridah]

dang ... already. Improvement is always good. I just have to hold my breath for a few seconds after installing the update and hope my system works better, not worst. So far, I haven't had much or any problems ... knock on wood.

[diehldun]

just out of curiosity, why do people vote "negative" on the front????? what's so bad about having an update??? :confused:

[maya]

just out of curiosity, why do people vote "negative" on the front????? what's so bad about having an update??? :confused:

Sometimes updates make things worse for users rather than improve that is why? :(


However I have had no such problem and plan to keep up that record, here is to hoping for all the best.. :)

[ifjake]

man, they just keeping going at it. i like that about apple. always trying to make things better, even with panther's replacement just around the next one or two corners.

[applekid]

As long as Tiger doesn't break anything I'll be happy. Just make improvements and I'll be content.

Anyways, not really looking forward to the next 10.x.x update. I'm tired of updating my computer ;)

I hope these next improvements will be significant speed boosts and actually noticeable for OpenGL. And, I would like to see the drivers for the 6800 Ultra improved yet again. I'm not convinced Apple is squeezing out all of the power in the 6800 Ultra.

[Catfish_Man]

As long as Tiger doesn't break anything I'll be happy. Just make improvements and I'll be content.

Anyways, not really looking forward to the next 10.x.x update. I'm tired of updating my computer ;)

I hope these next improvements will be significant speed boosts and actually noticeable for OpenGL. And, I would like to see the drivers for the 6800 Ultra improved yet again. I'm not convinced Apple is squeezing out all of the power in the 6800 Ultra.

Tiger will introduce new problems. (in fact, you can substitute any new version of any major software for Tiger and it'll still be true)

From what I've seen though, the 6800 driver in 10.3 does suck pretty bad. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was a good deal better.

[wtmcgee]

I would say work on another 10.3.x release isn't good if you're expecting tiger in Jan.

To me, this screams Tiger won't be out till March or so.

[wrldwzrd89]

I would say work on another 10.3.x release isn't good if you're expecting tiger in Jan.

To me, this screams Tiger won't be out till March or so.
Just as I suspected all along. I'm forecasting April 2, 2005 (yes I know that's a Saturday) as the day the tiger's unleashed.

[Super Dave]

I only hope that this fixes the 10.3.6 PowerBook coma. This is the only bug I've ever run into with an update that was major, and even this is pretty minor.

http://discussions.info.apple.com/webx?50@19.1KMVaxvTBUq.0@.688dc68d

David :cool:

[Super Dave]

I would say work on another 10.3.x release isn't good if you're expecting tiger in Jan.

To me, this screams Tiger won't be out till March or so.

I've played with the latest builds. I wouldn't expect Tiger in January at all. It's not anywhere near done. It seems like it's still not feature complete either, which would put it still in alpha stage. When we get a proper beta, then it'll be a couple months....

David :cool:

[Super Dave]

man, they just keeping going at it. i like that about apple. always trying to make things better, even with panther's replacement just around the next one or two corners.

Amen. A company that cares.

David :cool:

[Mtn Tamale]

This could easily be a situation where they are trying to lock down a final Panther version with major bugs fixed before moving to Tiger in January and ditching Panther, or only doing minor compatibility tweaks to it in the future, like with Jaguar.

Who knows though?

I would say work on another 10.3.x release isn't good if you're expecting tiger in Jan.

To me, this screams Tiger won't be out till March or so.

[Jovian9]

any update is a good update (well apart from 10.3.6, i'm just not entirely happy with it!)


Agreed. I'm definitely not happy with that update. Come on 10.3.7....fix my problems.

[Jovian9]

Sometimes updates make things worse for users rather than improve that is why? :(


However I have had no such problem and plan to keep up that record, here is to hoping for all the best.. :)

I had a perfect record with updates until the 10.3.6 update (from 10.1 on) .....now I've got a mark on the loss side :)

[PLL]

Hi, A note about the 10.3.6 and the update drivers, my firelite firewire HD didn't mount at all on machines with 10.3.6, while other Firewire HD's mounted with no problems on that machines.
The Hard Drive that I am talking about is the Firelite 80GB mobile HD



Powerbook 12" 1GHZ
G4 dual 1.25
768 MB
back to 10.3.5 :mad: :mad: :mad:

[Cybornut]

Well, I have had no problem at all with 10.3.6 on an G5 iMac (17-inch Memory upped to 512), a 17-inch Powerbook (1.5GHz 1GB RAM 128MB VRAM), a 15-inch Powerbook (1GHz 512MB RAM 64MB VRAM), or a Dual 2GHz G5 (2GHz RAM). Don't honestly see what the fuss is.

Isn't it a bit too early for 10.3.7? You said? Think about it, 10.3 isn't really that old and if 10.3.7 is due "by the end of the year" it would fit into a neat 3 months cycle. I mean we've had at least 4-5 updates a year on the Mac, it's like a new Service Pack for Windows every 2.5-3 months! I don't think Microsoft can pull that off. Releasing at this rate Windows XP would be on SP17 or something now, not a shotty and incompatible SP2 (I have 2 PCs). Who can say that Jobs doesn't love us (and our money)?

Really, with all the updates to 10.3 was there ANY surprise that 10.3.7 will be due before the end of the year?

Panther had only been release on October 24th 2003! That's just slightly over a year ago.

At the update rate of 1 per 2.5 months, and assuming 10.4 is coming out at the END of the 1st quarter (March 31st), I predict another update or two. And I'm not at all surprised that 10.3 would still be getting updates well into Tiger's life-cycle. I guess we'll have probably around 10.3.8 or 10.3.9 when Tiger is released.

[mkjellman]

Well it has already been relieved to developers and there are not even half the changes that are mentioned in this thread so I would keep your pants on... ohh and for all the people with the Safari 2 click on link problem related with DNS, there is a fix for that in this release...

[mkjellman]

Hi, A note about the 10.3.6 and the update drivers, my firelite firewire HD didn't mount at all on machines with 10.3.6, while other Firewire HD's mounted with no problems on that machines.
The Hard Drive that I am talking about is the Firelite 80GB mobile HD


I have one of these too by the way and it mounts just fine. I have seen problems with the Firelite not even starting or getting power. Normally if I restart or change ports on the firelite is somehow seems to fix it...i don't think this is a 10.3.6 problem...

[PLL]

My problem occurs whenever I try to mount the HD, in the system profiler I see it but It doesnt mount it

Then In 10.3.5 everything Its allright
:confused:

[~Shard~]

Great news, hopefully this will fix many people's issues which were encountered when installing 10.3.6. I personally didn't experience any troubles, but an update is always nice to see regardless (when it works!)

[~Shard~]

I would say work on another 10.3.x release isn't good if you're expecting tiger in Jan.

To me, this screams Tiger won't be out till March or so.

March might be pushing it as it is. I'd expect to see a couple more revisions after 10.3.7 for Panther before we see a finished Tiger. Jobs promised Tiger in the first half of 2005 - that gives him until June 30 by my calendar to deliver. I'd expect Tiger later rather than sooner, March at the absolute earliest. :cool:

[mrman5917]

Well, I don't see any problem with getting a new update, but isn't it sorta soon? Don't get me wrong, I would rather have frequent updates than no updates (like M$). Oh well, being a switcher of nearly 1.5 years, i have yet to have a problem with and 10.x.x update. *crosses fingers*

[griz]

Can they possibly add a reliable method of automounting remote volumes at login?? Yea, I know they can be added to the Startup items, but every system in my office has intermittent reliability with this method. The connections will work for some time and then suddenly stop.
This is incredibly frustrating considering that OS9 worked perfectly and now coming up on generation 4 of OSX we still do not have reliable automounting of servers. What gives Apple???

[hjhhjh]

I just bought that and it plays perfectly and FAST (2.5+6800) on everything as high as possible. :eek:

Maybe you should just reinstall it.... :)

hey how many fps does your game run at, in like a closed room, at fastest possible really, whats the highest uve seen it go in a game online

clikc ` (under esc) and type stat fps

itl display the fps in the right up hand corner, let me know the number

[Fukui]

I'm sorry that they're not fixing the networking. It's been a year since I've had reliable access between my machines. I suppose the good thing is that they haven't made it completely impossible or I'd have to continue to use my Zip drive to transfer files.


Sorry to say... but the latest builds of X.4 haven't fixed this issue.
Maybe if we get a hundred or so developers to all file a bug report at the same time to fix the networking once and for all, they would notice...

[ClimbingTheLog]

End of the year? How about a 10.3.7 that fixes firewire, powerbook sleep, MDD audio, DNS failures, network homedir failures, and no feature enhancements?

How about next week?

Give us a 10.3 we can run without signficant issues and can actually recommend to our customers.

Then start in with the new an improved that's just going to cause another raft of problems.

[griz]

Come on now, Panther is extremely stable and usable and there is no reason not to recommend it to anyone. If you are waiting for the Utopian OS, then you will be waiting a long time. It doesn't exist. Try using Windoze sometime. They all have their issues. I think Panther is quite nice and in need of little in the way of fixes from a usability standpoint.

[bousozoku]

Come on now, Panther is extremely stable and usable and there is no reason not to recommend it to anyone. If you are waiting for the Utopian OS, then you will be waiting a long time. It doesn't exist. Try using Windoze sometime. They all have their issues. I think Panther is quite nice and in need of little in the way of fixes from a usability standpoint.

Actually, considering the memory leak I've seen since 10.3.6, I could not recommend it. 10.3.4 was the best of Panther for me. I hope it gets better soon.

[UnixMac]

I just bought that and it plays perfectly and FAST (2.5+6800) on everything as high as possible. :eek:

Maybe you should just reinstall it.... :)

Yeah, I have not been at all impressed with the level of optimization on the nv40 for the Mac... I hope Apple and NV get their act together and make this $600 card perform like a $600 card should.

[ClimbingTheLog]

Come on now, Panther is extremely stable and usable and there is no reason not to recommend it to anyone.

Are you kidding? You have to click on web links twice because DNS fails? You can't use it to log into server-based home directories? Certain firewire drives stop working? Filenames get truncated on network shares? Heck, I still have a stack of FW drives that all worked just fine on 10.2.8 but only some show up on 10.3. These are essential failings, not luxuries.

I think Panther is quite nice and in need of little in the way of fixes from a usability standpoint.

Exactly. It needs some little fixes and it'd be great. But we keep getting enhancements and more breakage instead.

[goof_ball]

10.3.6 worked ok for me. It took out some of my preferences on my 15" PB, ie. iTunes and Powerpoint so far prompted me for first time use.

My buddy's 17" PB got toast. I can't for sure blame it on the 10.3.6 update, but the problem occured right after. He had to archive and reinstall the system.

I hope 10.3.7 is better tested.

[maya]

Are you kidding? You have to click on web links twice because DNS fails? You can't use it to log into server-based home directories? Certain firewire drives stop working? Filenames get truncated on network shares? Heck, I still have a stack of FW drives that all worked just fine on 10.2.8 but only some show up on 10.3. These are essential failings, not luxuries.



Exactly. It needs some little fixes and it'd be great. But we keep getting enhancements and more breakage instead.

I can relate to what you have stated I had my trusty external FW HDD that ironically was a "Back-Up' drive FAIL to mount in 10.3.6 and it worked quite fine in 10.3.5

It was a LaCie HDD too worked fine for 2 years and ten suddenly it died *weird* <--- could have just been a faulty drive however it's hard to say at present. :(

[JFreak]

10.3.4 was the best of Panther for me.

and for me too, and for all the other pro audio people out there :D
i'm still using 10.3.4 and probably will not upgrade until there's enough good reports of tiger stability.

[stefman]

I really hope that 10.3.7 fixes all the problems I'm having with 10.3.6.

I would say that 10.3.6 has been the worst upgrade I've ever had with any OS X upgrade...by far!! :mad:

I used to eagerly upgrade and not have a problem, but I'll definitively be more cautious from now on.

[JFreak]

it has been so all along with panther - jaguar updates used to be good (with one exception), but i too have always been cautious with panther upgrades. so far only the retail version and 10.3.4 have worked nicely in my systems. i think i won't update panther anymore (if it ain't broke too bad, don't break it anymore).

it's as if apple had two separate development teams during the osx ramp-up: like the primary team having prepared 10.0, jaguar and tiger, and the secondary team releasing 10.1 and panther. jaguar was totally on a different level, reliablity-wise. i really hope tiger gets there too, and if this two-team development is in fact true, i would guess apple is going to join the teams into one now that osx is "ready". jobs said that the next major release after tiger would "take a longer time", which would support what i just said. maybe, who knows.

as for panther, it has been a disappointment. terrible firewire issues with audio systems, and very unreliable networking. all this was reliable and stable in jaguar, and i cannot see why the situation has changed so much.

[Nermal]

A couple of people have mentioned MDD audio problems with 10.3.6. I have an MDD with 10.3.6 and don't have any problems, so what's wrong? :confused:

I did a quick search for 'mdd audio 10.3.6' but that only have me the '10.3.6 released' thread with 350+ responses, and I don't really feel like trawling through that :rolleyes:

[Mac-Xpert]

i'm still using 10.3.4 and probably will not upgrade until there's enough good reports of tiger stability.The same here. My G5 came with 10.3.4 and after reading the problems people had with 10.3.5 (mostly networking problems I think) I decided not to upgrade and wait for 10.3.6. But when it turned out that this "upgrade" only made things worse I decided not to take the risk and stick with 10.3.4. This version of Panther is very stable for me. The machine has not crashed yet (running more than 3 weeks now) and the network (although very slow when browsing the afp share on our Windows 2000 server) seems to work reliable.

When the next update is released, I will certainly wait a few weeks to see the responses of the guys who do dare to update immediately (thanks guys! ;)) and will only update if there aren't any major issues reported.

It's funny how apple will keep on updating the system till the next major release comes out, fixing all the problems and ending up with a good working version of the OS (10.2.8 in its last release works very stable and reliable on my MDD G4.) and then introduce a new OS with some nice new features and eye candy and lots of new problems that weren't in the previous system. Then they will continue to fix those problems and (hopefully) end up with a stable version of this OS, only to introduce yet another new version with lots of new features and eye candy.

So I'm keeping my fingers crossed with the next major release "Tiger". You just KNOW that there will be major new problems with that one as well, and everybody will be saying "but it worked the right way in Panther" :o :(

[Windowlicker]

looks like I'm gonna have to restart my computer eventually ;)

[Zaty]

I wouldn't have expected 10.3.7 so soon, given the usual 2-3-month cycle. I guess there are two possibilities why Apple might want to release the new update soon:

1. Many users seem to have all sorts of problems with 10.3.6, so it's only logical Apple tries to address these problems as soon as possible, although the changes that leaked don't seem to support this theory.

2. Development of Tiger is progressing much faster than most of thought and it might be released in early 2005 rather than in May or June. This would mean that 10.3.7 would be the last update for Panther, so Apple has to make sure major bugs remain in Panther. After all, the last Jaguar update was released only month before Panther shipped.

[wrldwzrd89]

I wouldn't have expected 10.3.7 so soon, given the usual 2-3-month cycle. I guess there are two possibilities why Apple might want to release the new update soon:

1. Many users seem to have all sorts of problems with 10.3.6, so it's only logical Apple tries to address these problems as soon as possible, although the changes that leaked don't seem to support this theory.

2. Development of Tiger is progressing much faster than most of thought and it might be released in early 2005 rather than in May or June. This would mean that 10.3.7 would be the last update for Panther, so Apple has to make sure major bugs remain in Panther. After all, the last Jaguar update was released only month before Panther shipped.
Uhh...Zaty? Don't you mean "so Apple has to make sure no major bugs remain in Panther"?

[Pixeled_Apple]

Woh! 10.3.7... Already? Damn they're fast... I hope they don't forget that if too much updates up2 10.3.9, they'll sooner or later have to Tiger! :p :D 10.3.10 sounds pretty weird... 10.4 will sound betta!!! :cool:


Does anyone actually sleep at Apple?


If I worked @ apple, I'll probly be drinking Coke all day, and sleep won't sleep for even a bit :p :D

[broken_keyboard]

According to this, Microsoft are planning to launch a desktop search by the end of the year (there's a comment at the end)

http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsArticle.jhtml?type=internetNews&storyID=6765618&section=news

So maybe that will force Apple to hurry Tiger along...

[wrldwzrd89]

According to this, Microsoft are planning to launch a desktop search by the end of the year (there's a comment at the end)

http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsArticle.jhtml?type=internetNews&storyID=6765618&section=news

So maybe that will force Apple to hurry Tiger along...
It seems that developments with Apple and Google have convinced Microsoft to change their plans regarding desktop search. I don't think Apple should be worried, though: the Spotlight technology Apple already has is proven and has been shown to work; unlike Microsoft, who hasn't shown any working demos of either Longhorn searching or their desktop search tool as far as I am aware. Also, Google clearly has the advantage when it comes to Internet search, and Apple is smart enough to just use Google in Safari rather than try to compete with it, since internet search is not in Apple's market.

[broken_keyboard]

It seems that developments with Apple and Google have convinced Microsoft to change their plans regarding desktop search. I don't think Apple should be worried, though: the Spotlight technology Apple already has is proven and has been shown to work; unlike Microsoft, who hasn't shown any working demos of either Longhorn searching or their desktop search tool as far as I am aware. Also, Google clearly has the advantage when it comes to Internet search, and Apple is smart enough to just use Google in Safari rather than try to compete with it, since internet search is not in Apple's market.

Yes. I think Microsoft have probably decided to be a bit less technically ambitious. If I understand, their original approach was to replace the filesystem with a relational database (WinFS). That would certainly give you good search, but is also a pretty invasive change to the system, and I could see why it would take them years.

If they have now decided to go with the much simpler Apple approach of adding a hook to the OS file writing functions, they should be able to get a solution out much faster (which may be what we are seeing with this announcement).

[oingoboingo]

I mean we've had at least 4-5 updates a year on the Mac, it's like a new Service Pack for Windows every 2.5-3 months! I don't think Microsoft can pull that off. Releasing at this rate Windows XP would be on SP17 or something now, not a shotty and incompatible SP2 (I have 2 PCs). Who can say that Jobs doesn't love us (and our money)?

To be fair, Microsoft has to take into account a lot more hardware, drivers and 3rd-party applications than Apple does when it releases a Service Pack. It doesn't control the platform top-to-bottom like Apple does.

That said...XP Service Pack 2...what the hell were they thinking?

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

Looking forward to an update.

After updating my iBook G4 to 10.3.6 and iTunes to 4.7 it has gotten really hot. The processor reaching 60 degrees Celsius at a regular basis, just running Safari and iTunes (even when using headphones and not Airtunes). It didn't use to get that hot without playing CM4 or when ripping CDs. Safari uses 40-60% CPU just playing songs.

Don't know if it's an OS X problem or really an iTunes-problem that 10.3.6 made worse, but upgrades can only make things better (or so I hope)...

[ASP272]

Thanks Apple for always being on top of your game and continually improving the OS for the pleasure of your loyal consumers. :)

[UnixMac]

Thanks Apple for always being on top of your game and continually improving the OS for the pleasure of your loyal consumers. :)

Hear Hear

for the most part, my Mac works better now with 10.3.6

[bretm]

After all, the last Jaguar update was released only month before Panther shipped.

They still continue to update Jaguar elements. But nothing will ever be bug free. They continued to update OS9 for about a year after the first version of OSX.

[kettle]

Does anyone else ever wonder about similarities between the cats?

I always get the feeling that Panther has a lot of the clunkiness that Puma had. I'm kind of hoping that Tiger has the same base feel as Jaguar had.

If this sounds confusing I think I mean maybe Panther was built on the guts of Puma and maybe Tiger is being developed on the guts of Jaguar, like an over lapping period.

just a feeling I get sometimes, prolly very irrational. :)

[maya]

it has been so all along with panther - jaguar updates used to be good (with one exception), but i too have always been cautious with panther upgrades. so far only the retail version and 10.3.4 have worked nicely in my systems. i think i won't update panther anymore (if it ain't broke too bad, don't break it anymore).

it's as if apple had two separate development teams during the osx ramp-up: like the primary team having prepared 10.0, jaguar and tiger, and the secondary team releasing 10.1 and panther. jaguar was totally on a different level, reliablity-wise. i really hope tiger gets there too, and if this two-team development is in fact true, i would guess apple is going to join the teams into one now that osx is "ready". jobs said that the next major release after tiger would "take a longer time", which would support what i just said. maybe, who knows.

as for panther, it has been a disappointment. terrible firewire issues with audio systems, and very unreliable networking. all this was reliable and stable in jaguar, and i cannot see why the situation has changed so much.

Once can be quite sure that Apple indeed has 2 development teams working on the OS. Considering the amount of features and goodies they keep giving us all :D

I would not be surprised that the jaguar team has already started ground work or pre-alpha work on 10.5 for the matter at that it might be called 'Lion" since 10.5 will seem to try and dominate many platforms and exceed in ways that are unthinkable at current.

10.5 will take sometime that is a given since versions leading to 10.4 have been paving the way a little at a time. 10.4 is bringing in 64-bit and will look into converting and porting many enterprises applications to that with and after 10.4 :)

This is all good news, it seems that 10.4 ---> 10.5 will be a big push in which can be compared to a race and there after once in the lead it can result to refinements at a slower and quality base structure. I am not at all surprised that there are many bugs that are developing along the way and some that are long in the tooth.

Though I really feel that Apple should have built iSync into the OS rather than have it as one of the 150 new features with panther and then trashing the iSync name and application and then re-packaging the name and now building it AGAIN into the OS (which they should have done first) and calling it as one of the 150 new features included with Tiger. ;) :p :rolleyes:


And when will Apple start to include menu bar icons for the iApp family it is so much more convenient than having to have a 3rd party application or running to the dock. :) <-- though it is getting really weird how Windows had the Messenger in its task bar and now OS X having the iChat icon in the menu bar.

[maya]

Does anyone else ever wonder about similarities between the cats?

I always get the feeling that Panther has a lot of the clunkiness that Puma had. I'm kind of hoping that Tiger has the same base feel as Jaguar had.

If this sounds confusing I think I mean maybe Panther was built on the guts of Puma and maybe Tiger is being developed on the guts of Jaguar, like an over lapping period.

just a feeling I get sometimes, prolly very irrational. :)

I believe that is because the PUMA team started work on Panther long before Jaguar was released. :D

[johnnyjibbs]

I just read in the AppleInsider article that Mac OS X 10.3.6 has "widely thought to have reintroduced data loss bugs concerning external FireWire drives". It goes on to say that 10.3.7 doesn't appear to offer a fix.

This has worried me.

I have updated to 10.3.6 but have yet to connect my external hard drive to it since the update. Now I'm worried that if I reconnect it I will lose my data. I can't afford to lose this data and I have no other means of backing it up or accessing the drive. It's a LaCie Porsche 250GB FireWire drive. Anyone know of any problems with it under 10.3.6?

[maya]

I just read in the AppleInsider article that Mac OS X 10.3.6 has "widely thought to have reintroduced data loss bugs concerning external FireWire drives". It goes on to say that 10.3.7 doesn't appear to offer a fix.

This has worried me.

I have updated to 10.3.6 but have yet to connect my external hard drive to it since the update. Now I'm worried that if I reconnect it I will lose my data. I can't afford to lose this data and I have no other means of backing it up or accessing the drive. It's a LaCie Porsche 250GB FireWire drive. Anyone know of any problems with it under 10.3.6?

Well I could have used this information a lot earlier. :(

I have a LaCie external FW HDD and it worked dine under X.3.5 and when I updated to X.3.6 it would not mount at all. :(

Now I believe it killed the HDD, so I replaced the internal HDD works dine now. *fingers crossed*

[wrldwzrd89]

Well I could have used this information a lot earlier. :(

I have a LaCie external FW HDD and it worked dine under X.3.5 and when I updated to X.3.6 it would not mount at all. :(

Now I believe it killed the HDD, so I replaced the internal HDD works dine now. *fingers crossed*
Hmm interesting m a y a. Both of my external FireWire drives functioned fine under 10.3.5 and continue to do so under 10.3.6.

[maya]

Hmm interesting m a y a. Both of my external FireWire drives functioned fine under 10.3.5 and continue to do so under 10.3.6.


It's maya no space, my name was taken. :( :P

Weird however mine was a LaCie, could have been a defective drive, or maybe not. Anyhow count yourself lucky since many people have reported that when Panther was released they external FW HDD had failed however I was lucky well that luck ran out. :( :P

[wrldwzrd89]

It's maya no space, my name was taken. :( :P

Weird however mine was a LaCie, could have been a defective drive, or maybe not. Anyhow count yourself lucky since many people have reported that when Panther was released they external FW HDD had failed however I was lucky well that luck ran out. :( :P

Both of my FW drives are LaCie's. One's a 160 GB drive; the other one is a 250 GB drive. My iMac's internal hard drive is 80 GB, so it made the most sense to use the 80 GB internal for primary storage, switch the 160 GB from backup to secondary storage, and partition the 250 GB to backup the other two.

[bousozoku]

Does anyone else ever wonder about similarities between the cats?

I always get the feeling that Panther has a lot of the clunkiness that Puma had. I'm kind of hoping that Tiger has the same base feel as Jaguar had.

If this sounds confusing I think I mean maybe Panther was built on the guts of Puma and maybe Tiger is being developed on the guts of Jaguar, like an over lapping period.

just a feeling I get sometimes, prolly very irrational. :)

I understand what you're saying but it didn't happen that way. It would be nice if they were constantly making forward progress. How's it go? Two steps forward, one step back. ;)

[ipodmann]

I really hope that 10.3.7 fixes all the problems I'm having with 10.3.6.

I would say that 10.3.6 has been the worst upgrade I've ever had with any OS X upgrade...by far!! :mad:

I used to eagerly upgrade and not have a problem, but I'll definitively be more cautious from now on.

Agreed.

After reading many of the issues with 10.3.6 I am starting to understand why my system is suddenly less responsive. Even my blank CDs have a hard time being mounted. My burner is no longer working on my eMac. I am ready to take it in, but now I will wait for the next update.

This is one update I wish I had not installed.

[maya]

Both of my FW drives are LaCie's. One's a 160 GB drive; the other one is a 250 GB drive. My iMac's internal hard drive is 80 GB, so it made the most sense to use the 80 GB internal for primary storage, switch the 160 GB from backup to secondary storage, and partition the 250 GB to backup the other two.

Sadly my external HDD was a backup and that failed and I was in the process of going to burn to optical. What timing and rotten luck. :P :(

Time to sue Apple and LaCie ;) <-- good thing I had an optical backup a year back not much added that I cannot re-rip again, though all that wasted time. :P

[Zaty]

Uhh...Zaty? Don't you mean "so Apple has to make sure no major bugs remain in Panther"?

Yes, of course, it's Apple we're talking about, not MS :)

[maya]

Agreed.

After reading many of the issues with 10.3.6 I am starting to understand why my system is suddenly less responsive. Even my blank CDs have a hard time being mounted. My burner is no longer working on my eMac. I am ready to take it in, but now I will wait for the next update.

This is one update I wish I had not installed.

Oddly enough my iPod, and Optical Discs blank an otherwise take time to also mount. All this on a new iMac G5 :P

And I am also lucky enough to have the power adapter (PSU) be faulty. :P :(

I am going to talk to the Apple Tech about this some more. :p

[wrldwzrd89]

Sadly my external HDD was a backup and that failed and I was in the process of going to burn to optical. What timing and rotten luck. :P :(

Time to sue Apple and LaCie ;) <-- good thing I had an optical backup a year back not much added that I cannot re-rip again, though all that wasted time. :P
That stroke of bad luck couldn't have happened at a worse time, it seems. Actually, my 160 GB external is dedicated to my iTunes library, since I've been ripping everything to Apple Lossless, and I've exceeded 5 GB already (in just Apple Lossless files - my total library is around 8 GB). I've got plenty more to rip though, and it's a slow but steady process, since I have to convert the files to Apple Lossless first, then tag them manually since they aren't in CDDB.

[wdlove]

At least Apple is still trying to make Panther the best that it can. Wonder if there will be a 10.3.8 and 10.3.9?

[wrldwzrd89]

At least Apple is still trying to make Panther the best that it can. Wonder if there will be a 10.3.8 and 10.3.9?
I'd say that depends on bug reports that come in after the release of 10.3.7. If significant issues still exist in 10.3.7, 10.3.8 will be released to fix them. Should 10.3.8 still not be good enough for the vast majority of Mac users, we'll see 10.3.9. If necessary, Apple will release 10.3.10 and beyond too.

[wdlove]

I'd say that depends on bug reports that come in after the release of 10.3.7. If significant issues still exist in 10.3.7, 10.3.8 will be released to fix them. Should 10.3.8 still not be good enough for the vast majority of Mac users, we'll see 10.3.9. If necessary, Apple will release 10.3.10 and beyond too.

My thought on 10.3.9 is that it would lead into 10.4 and Tiger. A very natural type of transition. Mac OS 9 certainly didn't have that many releases. :D

[gopher]

The Firewire bug on 10.3.6 is different than the 10.3.0 - 10.3.5 bug, but has similar symptoms. I've updated my FAQ regarding the bug:

http://www.macmaps.com/firewirebug2.html

And the news about 10.3.7 does say "Firewire Audio" from the initial post of this thread. Actually I was hoping that's a typo meaning Firewire, Audio. Because both have apparantly suffered from 10.3.6. Only time will tell if it was a typo or not.

10.3.6 also has remnants of the 10.3.0 to 10.3.5 bug as well. That really needs to be fixed by the vendors who haven't upgraded their firmware.

[johnnyjibbs]

I don't really understand all that stuff about the FireWire Panther bug (and the link in the above post) but all I know is that I've only had my FireWire drive when I've been operating 10.3.5 as it was a recent purchase and I've had no problems.

As I said, I haven't used it yet under Mac OS X 10.3.6 and am a bit cautious, even though wrldwzrd89 has the same drive and has reported no such problems with 10.3.6.

I did use my Mac as a FireWire hard drive (target disk mode) to update a few things on my brother's new iBook (the one with the stuck key (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=97520)) and we had no data loss problems (although I can't remember if he had updated from the stock 10.3.5 by that point).

Maybe I'll just hold off until more word on 10.3.7 to be on the safe side. I haven't done much video editing recently anyhow..

[joeboy_45101]

There are no apparent problems with 10.3.6 for me. My little iBook G4 933 just keeps humming right along. But I think the engineers over at Apple should take their time with 10.3.7, there are some things that have been mentioned early on in other OS updates that never make it into the final release. Maybe it's a good time to mop up a lot of those past and current problems and incorporate them into 10.3.7

[joeboy_45101]

Once can be quite sure that Apple indeed has 2 development teams working on the OS. Considering the amount of features and goodies they keep giving us all :D

I would not be surprised that the jaguar team has already started ground work or pre-alpha work on 10.5 for the matter at that it might be called 'Lion" since 10.5 will seem to try and dominate many platforms and exceed in ways that are unthinkable at current.

10.5 will take sometime that is a given since versions leading to 10.4 have been paving the way a little at a time. 10.4 is bringing in 64-bit and will look into converting and porting many enterprises applications to that with and after 10.4 :)

This is all good news, it seems that 10.4 ---> 10.5 will be a big push in which can be compared to a race and there after once in the lead it can result to refinements at a slower and quality base structure. I am not at all surprised that there are many bugs that are developing along the way and some that are long in the tooth.

Though I really feel that Apple should have built iSync into the OS rather than have it as one of the 150 new features with panther and then trashing the iSync name and application and then re-packaging the name and now building it AGAIN into the OS (which they should have done first) and calling it as one of the 150 new features included with Tiger. ;) :p :rolleyes:


And when will Apple start to include menu bar icons for the iApp family it is so much more convenient than having to have a 3rd party application or running to the dock. :) <-- though it is getting really weird how Windows had the Messenger in its task bar and now OS X having the iChat icon in the menu bar.

From what I've read 10.4 will be the last significant OS upgrade for a good while. Maybe you're right about two development teams leap-frogging the OS. I'd probably see both teams coming together after the release of 10.4 and working on 10.5.

[JJTiger1]

Would have to guess that this would be the last update before 10.4.

Could be, but don't count on it.

10.2 went to 10.2.8, and then very quickly to a newer 10.2.8 because of problems with the first 10.2.8.

Many people refer to the last 10.2.8 as 10.2.8.1.
=-=
And as several people have pointed out, a new model of computer sometimes comes with a new OS sub revision.

What was the OS 10.2.x that came with the initial G5's? 10.2.7? I believe that no one (except developers) could updater to 10.2.7.

I'm betting that OS 10.4.0 will be announced in the spring at the convention.
I'm betting that OS 10.4 will come on a new computer model that will be announced in the spring at the convention.

Maybe 10.4 will be released along with that G5 laptop that the whiners are crying for so that they can organize their recipes for ice and boiling water. :D
=-=
JJ

[myapplseedshurt]

Makes you wonder if there could ever be an update where they say, "All is fixed all is well" and never update again. It seems to me that no matter how hard they try there are bugs old or new. If they could get it completely right that would make me happy. (I know a bit to idealistic but still something to wish for).

as someone who works on code and computer guts, I can say that will never happen. There are too many rules and too many people working from that set of rules, but inevitably, the rules get broken in ways that are hard to find. plus it helps keep some jobs around the US a little longer.

and computer guts are messy and smelly. Ya ever see Alien?

[The Lamprey]

Hey- They should stop development and start FIXING The previous problems with firewire and with safari, before even persuing any advanced features. What use is new features and small updates if all the other stuff is broken and not working properly??

Any why is 10.3.6 Causing more firewire problems??

Those guys over there at apple should stop tinkering around with set standards and use stuff that works so they should not pissoff their users.

And why the hell is G5's burning up hubs for??!! geez, Stop Tinkering! Obey the standards! I've stopped upgrading so all my previous work on my HD's are not in jeopardy of being corrupted.

Notice to all-- read,read,read before upgrading to the next update, or else you might lose out on precious data!!!!!

[appleface]

i'm not up on all the latest mac OS builds. i was just browsing the rumors, and i saw that two audio modifications are slated for the next build. are these programs dealing with audio in or audio out? are they more likely dealing with proBand or the macTV (the imac is all but cable-ready)?

[Rincewind42]

I've got plenty more to rip though, and it's a slow but steady process, since I have to convert the files to Apple Lossless first, then tag them manually since they aren't in CDDB.

You do know you can fill in the track info on the CD first, then rip the CD right? And you can even submit the tracks to the CDDB database so that others like you won't have to face that problem in the future :).

[Chupa Chupa]

The FW bug only affected enclosures with the Initio chip. If your enclosure uses the Oxford chip you should be fine. If you have the Initio you need to update the firmware on a non 10.3.5 machine.

That said I can't wait to see what 10.3.7 breaks.

[cb911]

well... updates are always good... and this is good news as well... it means they're not holding out on new features or updated features for 10.4. by releasing this update now, they're pretty much guaranteeing that 10.4 will be even more kick-ass than this. :D

about the FW bug - i don't know what you guys are talking about? 10.3.6 actaully fixed one slight problem i had with an external HD. perhaps you just need a re-install or something?

Safari bugs? such as? i just run a tight system i guess. :D :p

[maya]

Hey- They should stop development and start FIXING The previous problems with firewire and with safari, before even persuing any advanced features. What use is new features and small updates if all the other stuff is broken and not working properly??

Any why is 10.3.6 Causing more firewire problems??

Those guys over there at apple should stop tinkering around with set standards and use stuff that works so they should not pissoff their users.

And why the hell is G5's burning up hubs for??!! geez, Stop Tinkering! Obey the standards! I've stopped upgrading so all my previous work on my HD's are not in jeopardy of being corrupted.

Notice to all-- read,read,read before upgrading to the next update, or else you might lose out on precious data!!!!!

ROTF.....

I believe the programmers at apple need to SLEEP and not keep awake by drinking pop and coffee. ;) maybe once they have had a good night rest they mind and fingers will co-function and fix what was broken and not rebuild something that was already fixed. :D

[maya]

The FW bug only affected enclosures with the Initio chip. If your enclosure uses the Oxford chip you should be fine. If you have the Initio you need to update the firmware on a non 10.3.5 machine.

That said I can't wait to see what 10.3.7 breaks.

Checked the LaCie site that firmware update is for the big, bigger, and so on disks with the FW 400 and 800 ports.

I have the d2 FW 400 (thing is riddled with problems) :P <-- LaCie is not going to see anymore of my money anymore :P

[maya]

well... updates are always good... and this is good news as well... it means they're not holding out on new features or updated features for 10.4. by releasing this update now, they're pretty much guaranteeing that 10.4 will be even more kick-ass than this. :D

about the FW bug - i don't know what you guys are talking about? 10.3.6 actaully fixed one slight problem i had with an external HD. perhaps you just need a re-install or something?

Safari bugs? such as? i just run a tight system i guess. :D :p

Panther has never really played nice with external FW HDD since its release. I hope Tiger takes care of this issue its rather important considering many mac people work with video and images and the external is a great device to move a lot of data from point A to B fast without burning optical.

[wrldwzrd89]

You do know you can fill in the track info on the CD first, then rip the CD right? And you can even submit the tracks to the CDDB database so that others like you won't have to face that problem in the future :).
Regarding point 1, yes I knew about that - but it makes no difference in the end. The end result is a tagged Apple Lossless file, whichever order you do it in.
Regarding point 2, um...they aren't from CD anyway, so CDDB is going to be of no use whatsoever. It's video game music (or VGM for short) that I'm converting from its original format (SPC, PSF, etc.) to WAV, then converting the WAV to Apple Lossless before tagging it using the information inside the SPC/PSF/etc. If there aren't any tags, I tag them myself.

[Rincewind42]

Regarding point 1, yes I knew about that - but it makes no difference in the end. The end result is a tagged Apple Lossless file, whichever order you do it in.
Regarding point 2, um...they aren't from CD anyway, so CDDB is going to be of no use whatsoever. It's video game music (or VGM for short) that I'm converting from its original format (SPC, PSF, etc.) to WAV, then converting the WAV to Apple Lossless before tagging it using the information inside the SPC/PSF/etc. If there aren't any tags, I tag them myself.

What program are you using to rip them? I've been out of that scene for way too long, so I don't know what Mac programs would be useful for that anymore. Personally, I've been spending bits and pieces of time here and there trying to get at least SPC & NSF into an audio decoder...

[wrldwzrd89]

What program are you using to rip them? I've been out of that scene for way too long, so I don't know what Mac programs would be useful for that anymore. Personally, I've been spending bits and pieces of time here and there trying to get at least SPC & NSF into an audio decoder...
Mac? Forget about it. Winamp (for Windows) is the ONLY way to go - Audio Overload just doesn't cut it here. That's why I have a Windows machine too (see my website - link in my signature).

[ClimbingTheLog]

If your enclosure uses the Oxford chip you should be fine.
I thought so too, until I read this on AppleInsider:

Although there have been wide-spread reports that the recently released Mac OS X 10.3.6 Update has re-introduced data loss bugs for users with external Firewire drives, the Mac OS X 10.3.7 Update shows no signs of an immediate fix. Withal, Apple is reportedly working on a solution to this problem, which appears to be affecting FireWire drives based on the Oxford 922 and 911 chipsets.
You wouldn't guess that Apple invented the bloody standard. I'm using my drives in USB2 mode now. I think Apple's lead Firewire Driver developer got fired between Jaguar and Panther. Maybe when they acquired Zayante.

[maya]

I thought so too, until I read this on AppleInsider:


You wouldn't guess that Apple invented the bloody standard. I'm using my drives in USB2 mode now. I think Apple's lead Firewire Driver developer got fired between Jaguar and Panther. Maybe when they acquired Zayante.

I was using the OXFORD 911 chip and still failed. Dam you FW developer at Apple, obtain some knowledge about FW :mad: :( ;) :D

[Rincewind42]

Mac? Forget about it. Winamp (for Windows) is the ONLY way to go - Audio Overload just doesn't cut it here. That's why I have a Windows machine too (see my website - link in my signature).

Pretty much what I figured... guess my (increadibly slow) efforts haven't been going to waste then! :D

[Fukui]

I thought so too, until I read this on AppleInsider:


You wouldn't guess that Apple invented the bloody standard. I'm using my drives in USB2 mode now. I think Apple's lead Firewire Driver developer got fired between Jaguar and Panther. Maybe when they acquired Zayante.
Actually, 10.3 drivers actually just exploit a bug in the Firmware. Thats why they say "to prevent data loss, upgrade to the newest firmware." Thats also why they point the finger at apple, and apple points the finger at them...

[ClimbingTheLog]

Actually, 10.3 drivers actually just exploit a bug in the Firmware. Thats why they say "to prevent data loss, upgrade to the newest firmware." Thats also why they point the finger at apple, and apple points the finger at them...

That's a fine excuse for 10.3.0 - I understand and almost accept it.

But to reintroduce the problem in 10.3.6? Do they have a QA lab? You'd think they'd have a test for the #1 complaint with the particular OS and catch these things before shipping.

[kettle]

Is there anything that points towards extra cost in developing firmware to cover the full feature set of Firewire?

For example, would it just be cheaper to manufacture drives that just work rather than comply to the ip over Firewire feature set.

Is there an over lap as to how compatible drives would be if they respected the entire Firewire standard?

[Mac-Xpert]

You wouldn't guess that Apple invented the bloody standard. I'm using my drives in USB2 mode now. I think Apple's lead Firewire Driver developer got fired between Jaguar and Panther. Maybe when they acquired Zayante.So does this mean that in the current build of Tiger the same firewire problem exits as well?

Are there any developers with a recent build of Tiger that could confirm the existence of this bug in Tiger or if it was fixed?

[hayesk]

Makes you wonder if there could ever be an update where they say, "All is fixed all is well" and never update again. It seems to me that no matter how hard they try there are bugs old or new. If they could get it completely right that would make me happy. (I know a bit to idealistic but still something to wish for).

How many years would you wait for an OS update then? It would take years, and then they would still find bugs because Apple can never test under all circumstances.

In short, it's impossible - software has become too complex to expect no bugs at all.

[lssmit02]

Actually, considering the memory leak I've seen since 10.3.6, I could not recommend it.

What do you mean exactly? I ask, because I noticed a weird memory situation after my upgrade to 10.3.6: my used memory creeps up over time, and does not go down, even after I exit programs. I have 2 gigs ran on my G5, run folding in the background and nothing else, as far as I know, which should only use up ~350 megs (that's what it's at after a restart). But after a few days, my used memory listed in Activity monitor is running at 1.6 gigs. That doesn't make sense--I though OS X was good at releasing memory when a program is exited.

[bousozoku]

What do you mean exactly? I ask, because I noticed a weird memory situation after my upgrade to 10.3.6: my used memory creeps up over time, and does not go down, even after I exit programs. I have 2 gigs ran on my G5, run folding in the background and nothing else, as far as I know, which should only use up ~350 megs (that's what it's at after a restart). But after a few days, my used memory listed in Activity monitor is running at 1.6 gigs. That doesn't make sense--I though OS X was good at releasing memory when a program is exited.

I'm frequently at the limits of my 1.5 GB when normally, I would have only half that much in use. Since this update, I've actually noticed virtual memory accessing the hard drive and the accompanying slowdown.

Mac OS X does not quickly release memory unless there is a vital need from the system. Apple even changed the way Mac OS 9 cached applications to provide a quicker startup all but the first time. Unfortunately, with this update, they've tried to speedup application launch the first time and they succeeded in producing a system that doesn't purge the virtual memory cache soon enough. While I'd like to set a flag saying which applications I use most to determine what stays in the cache longest, I suppose it's impractical to give any user that control.

[fatbarstard]

Never had a problem with an update until now... it buggered up my printer drivers - so had to do celan intsall of all of them...

The system logs me out after 30 minutes of no use - kills everything - no matter what the power and screen saver settings are - and it resets the screen saver setting to zero... mightly miffed at this as it is screwing up my folding@home stuff....

Apple - this update sucks. Its no wonder that 10.3.7 has appeared so quickly - to fix all the bugs introduced in 10.3.6 - I hope someone got fired for this....

:mad:

[wrldwzrd89]

What do you mean exactly? I ask, because I noticed a weird memory situation after my upgrade to 10.3.6: my used memory creeps up over time, and does not go down, even after I exit programs. I have 2 gigs ran on my G5, run folding in the background and nothing else, as far as I know, which should only use up ~350 megs (that's what it's at after a restart). But after a few days, my used memory listed in Activity monitor is running at 1.6 gigs. That doesn't make sense--I though OS X was good at releasing memory when a program is exited.
Mine doesn't do that. I watched it for a while, and while stuff was running it crept up slowly, but once I quit some apps the free memory jumped quite a bit higher. All seems normal here. I've had no other troubles with 10.3.6 either.

[wdlove]

Never had a problem with an update until now... it buggered up my printer drivers - so had to do clean install of all of them...

Apple - this update sucks. Its no wonder that 10.3.7 has appeared so quickly - to fix all the bugs introduced in 10.3.6 - I hope someone got fired for this....

:mad:

I doubt that anyone got fired, overall its not that serious. Looking at what hayesk had to say rings so true, software has become a complex interrelation so it is very hard to fix all bugs.

[FFTT]

I've been jumping around the rumor mills just hoping to catch
some sort of indication of what new hardware we might be seeing
in January. ( OTHER THAN iPods )
What I was hoping to see in the OS updates would be "any" indication
of PM dual core QUADRA support??? <">

[UnixMac]

I doubt that anyone got fired, overall its not that serious. Looking at what hayesk had to say rings so true, software has become a complex interrelation so it is very hard to fix all bugs.

It's almost (I stress almost) becoming a bit like the wold of PC and Windows with all of the conflicts.. No wonder Apple likes to keep such tight control over their stuff... quality control.

Frankly.. I think we've gotten to a time with computers being so complicated that on a system like mine (which was basically a supercomputer 5 years ago), it's normal to have at least one or two ongoing problems/issues with the installation of the OS. It's been a while since I've had a completely flawless week on my mac.

I guess if I never added any software (or freeware) it would be easier.

[Fukui]

It's almost (I stress almost) becoming a bit like the wold of PC and Windows with all of the conflicts.. No wonder Apple likes to keep such tight control over their stuff... quality control.

Frankly.. I think we've gotten to a time with computers being so complicated that on a system like mine (which was basically a supercomputer 5 years ago), it's normal to have at least one or two ongoing problems/issues with the installation of the OS. It's been a while since I've had a completely flawless week on my mac.

Well, not only that but think about what the OS lives on: a volitile magnetic disk where your not really ever 100% guaranteed that every single bit will be perfectly copied in the first place! So even if apple fixed a bug here or there, you never know what might of happened to your system at the disk level, bad sectors, corrupted data etc... to say nothing about apps that install stuff with the wrong permissions that can screw things up...

[UnixMac]

Well, not only that but think about what the OS lives on: a volitile magnetic disk where your not really ever 100% guaranteed that every single bit will be perfectly copied in the first place! So even if apple fixed a bug here or there, you never know what might of happened to your system at the disk level, bad sectors, corrupted data etc... to say nothing about apps that install stuff with the wrong permissions that can screw things up...

frankly it is nothing short of amazing that todays HD's can be so fast, store so much info so accurately... I use Diskwarrior regularly for health of my disk, but guys can go years without any kind of repair and never experience a problem.

[johnnyjibbs]

*PHEWSH*

I just plugged in my external FireWire HD for the first time under 10.3.6 and all is well. Now my need for 10.3.7 has gone, although there is something about 10.3.6 that makes me uneasy..

[wdlove]

It's almost (I stress almost) becoming a bit like the wold of PC and Windows with all of the conflicts.. No wonder Apple likes to keep such tight control over their stuff... quality control.

I guess if I never added any software (or freeware) it would be easier.

Then it would become very boring without anything new. Change is the spice of life. It keeps us on our toes. All this is what keeps this forum so active.

[Jovian9]

I really hope that 10.3.7 fixes all the problems I'm having with 10.3.6.

I would say that 10.3.6 has been the worst upgrade I've ever had with any OS X upgrade...by far!! :mad:

I used to eagerly upgrade and not have a problem, but I'll definitively be more cautious from now on.

I agree (though I had lots of problems with my HP Photosmart Printer when I first installed Jaguar). I will definitely wait after each update is announced before I upgrade....and not just for OS updates, but for all Apple Software updates. 10.3.6 has caused me way too many problems.

[Jovian9]

What do you mean exactly? I ask, because I noticed a weird memory situation after my upgrade to 10.3.6: my used memory creeps up over time, and does not go down, even after I exit programs. I have 2 gigs ran on my G5, run folding in the background and nothing else, as far as I know, which should only use up ~350 megs (that's what it's at after a restart). But after a few days, my used memory listed in Activity monitor is running at 1.6 gigs. That doesn't make sense--I though OS X was good at releasing memory when a program is exited.

I've noticed this on my iMac G5 but not on my PowerBook. I've been shutting down and restarting the iMac (instead of sleeping) at night and that seems to help.....except for having to wait for it to boot up every morning.

[maya]

I've noticed this on my iMac G5 but not on my PowerBook. I've been shutting down and restarting the iMac (instead of sleeping) at night and that seems to help.....except for having to wait for it to boot up every morning.

I believe its an issue with the G5 processor. Since I do not notice this issue with the G3 or G4 only G5. Tiger should fix this issue.