Republicans in the Wilderness: Is the Party Over?

[rdowns]

Seriously, has a minority party ever been this inept?

Time magazine article (http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1896588,00.html)



These days, Republicans have the desperate aura of an endangered species. They lost Congress, then the White House; more recently, they lost a slam-dunk House election in a conservative New York district, then Senator Arlen Specter. Polls suggest that only one-fourth of the electorate considers itself Republican, that independents are trending Democratic and that as few as five states have solid Republican pluralities. And the electorate is getting less white, less rural, less Christian — in short, less demographically Republican. GOP officials who completely controlled Washington three years ago are vowing to "regain our status as a national party" and creating woe-is-us groups to resuscitate their brand, while Democrats are publishing books like The Strange Death of Republican America and 40 More Years: How the Democrats Will Rule the Next Generation. John McCain's campaign manager recently described his party as basically extinct on the West Coast, nearly extinct in the Northeast and endangered in the Mountain West and Southwest.

And this tidbit made me laugh

Even Joe the Plumber — who opposes abortion and homosexuality and considers America a "Christian nation" — wants the party to drop its "holier than thou" attitude on divisive social issues.

Samuel Wurzelbacher, better known as Joe the Plumber, tells TIME he's so outraged by GOP overspending, he's quitting the party — and he's the bull's-eye of its target audience.

[kavika411]

Cyclical.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/2361727.stm

[Teh Don Ditty]

The party has been over. These fear and hate mongers unfortunately had their time in the national spot light and luckily the people have realized that it's all bull *****.

It's about time we got into the 21st century here and make some progress.

*Note I'm not saying that the Democrats are the best party evar here, I'm just saying there's a better chance.

[mactastic]

Heh... when you said "Republicans in the Wilderness", I thought we'd be talking about this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDOykmey7-I).

[Rt&Dzine]

That's quite a rejection coming from Joe the Plumber who thinks that homosexuals are pedifiles or contagious:

I've had some friends that are actually homosexual. And, I mean, they know where I stand, and they know that I wouldn't have them anywhere near my children. But at the same time, they're people, and they're going to do their thing. http://www.usnews.com/blogs/god-and-country/2009/05/05/joe-the-plumber-on-the-gop-and-homosexuals.html

[leekohler]

That's quite a rejection coming from Joe the Plumber who thinks that homosexuals are pedifiles or contagious:

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/god-and-country/2009/05/05/joe-the-plumber-on-the-gop-and-homosexuals.html

Yeah- I doubt he has friends who are gay. Any friend of mine who told me I was a threat to his kids would be a former friend very quickly.

[iGary]

I used to be a registered Republican.

I'm not the only one of my friends that bailed on the party.

Eff them.

[rdowns]

I was never a registered Republican but I voted mostly Rep. for years. I can't see me ever supporting that party again, at least based on what we've seen for the past few years.

[Macky-Mac]

The main thing that the GOP has going for them in the future? They're the only "viable" opposition party we've got.

[solvs]

It's going to get worse for them, but that's what they need. They've screwed things up badly with their politics, and if they think moving further to the right is a good idea, they haven't been paying attention to the polls. Bush barely won the second time around for various reasons (Kerry was nothing to write home about, people were still afraid of terrorism and believed Bush was stronger, the economy wasn't in the toilet completely yet, wedge politics), but his popularity slid far lower afterwards, especially with Katrina, which the excuse of "the local politicians didn't ask right" (no one said they didn't screw up too, but the feds response was and is still appalling) didn't help with. Add in fatigue over the wars that were supposed to be over long ago, still no Bin Laden, and a host of other problems, and the Dems weren't winning, the GOP were losing. As time went on, things only got worse for them. When a new guy comes along promising something else, we couldn't have it fast enough, and all the opposition had were lame slurs about socialism and taking your guns away, which they're still using, and are still only working on the few fringies leftover.

We do need more than 1 political party, maybe even more than 2, and thankfully the Dems at time fill that nicely. Despite the BS talking points, most of fairly moderate, some even conservative, with a few actual liberals to balance things out. Plus, it takes them forever to do anything, so like last time it took them decades to screw things up not even as badly as the GOP did in just a few years. If the Dems even stabilize the current chaos, the GOP as we know it is over unless they make some major changes. The Dems would have to resoundingly fail and not get out their messages on the things they've succeeded on, which is possible, for them to even have a chance. Americans do have short memories. But that's a long shot, and hoping we fail isn't great either. Schadenfraude wasn't great for the Dems at first, which is why they generally tried to stay away from it, despite all they could have said and done, and despite being criticized for what little they did (and in some cases didn't) do.

Personally I don't care who fixes things, but anyone who can help (eventually) get us back to fiscal responsibility (without destroying infrastructure and removing much needed regulation Libertarians) gets my vote. The Dems need a good opposition to do such things. They aren't getting it. They're getting people who now suddenly don't like a little extra deficit spending that could actually help us, while ignoring those who helped to raise it this high in the first place (on both sides), partisan sniping like those who legitimately criticized Bush were accused of. Complaining that there isn't enough oversight in the bailouts is legit. Complaining about the continuation of loss of liberties, like allowing those who ordered torture to go unpunished is legit. Complaining because rich people's taxes are going up 3%, while yours are probably going down, to help pay for things we desperately need, as well as to help pay down that debt the previous admin made that we got nothing for? Tossing around words with "ism"s in them? Criticizing what mustard the Pres got? Having no ideas other than to say "no" and hope we fail?

Not legit.

[Eraserhead]

It's going to get worse for them, but that's what they need. They've screwed things up badly with their politics, and if they think moving further to the right is a good idea, they haven't been paying attention to the polls.

Or reality, basically *no* other country in the world is as right wing as the US is these days.

[mactastic]

Or reality, basically *no* other country in the world is as right wing as the US is these days.
Not even remotely true. There are countries that are far more authoritarian and extreme in their application of religious zealotry.

[Thomas Veil]

Seriously, has a minority party ever been this inept?No. The Democrats, when they were losers, were at least still a diverse coalition of liberal interests. They did not decide to kick out different facets of their membership just to "purify" the party.

Nor did they ever have pathetic demagogues like Boss Limbaugh making them look like a bunch of closed-minded yahoos.

[kastenbrust]

Republicans will have their Bible preaching, belt tightening, White Obama, theres too many for it not to happen. The issue is with there gene pool it just takes a bit longer for that one in a billion to come along.

[solvs]

Not even remotely true. There are countries that are far more authoritarian and extreme in their application of religious zealotry.

But how many 1st world, non-theocratic, Democratic-Republics?

[dsnort]

The party should be over. The GOP has no ideas at this time, no sense of what they want for America, no articulated vision. They have basically become Democrats Lite, "Yeah, we want that too, only smaller".

[solvs]

They have basically become Democrats Lite
I don't see it. The Dems have become the Dem Lite. The GOP has gone ****ing bat**** crazy. Are you saying they need to move further to the right? Because good luck with that.

Unless you're saying they need to support true fiscal conservatism, but since none of them actually ever seem to, and Clinton was the only one actually close to that in the last couple of Presidencies, I don't get where the base point is for that.

[dsnort]

The GOP went bat*** crazy back in 2001-2009, it's why they are where they are. They totally abandoned any pretense of fiscal conservatism in favor of social conservatism, then spent the treasury like drunken sailors.

Now the Dems have gone bat*** crazy in a bizarre game of "anything the GOP can spend, we can spend more!".

We outta outlaw both parties, or in fact, any parties.

[obeygiant]

I thought republicans never stopped partying. :)

What happened was that they followed KING GEORGE into a goddamn ditch. Dumbasses.

[leekohler]

I thought republicans never stopped partying. :)

What happened was that they followed KING GEORGE into a goddamn ditch. Dumbasses.

IIRC- you followed them as well. ;)

[Eraserhead]

Not even remotely true. There are countries that are far more authoritarian and extreme in their application of religious zealotry.

So, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Iran, maybe some of the central asia countries (I don't know anything about them), Myanmar, Pakistan, Afganistan, maybe some afrian countries...

But how many 1st world, non-theocratic, Democratic-Republics?

You can add the South/East Asian countries and South America to that list. The only country where its even arguable is Argentina which is pretty bad - but their recent history has been pretty bad which makes the situation difficult for them.

Now the Dems have gone bat*** crazy in a bizarre game of "anything the GOP can spend, we can spend more!".

a) The conservatives are supposed to spend less.

b) People like the Economist (http://www.economist.com/) support the bail-out.

[TSE]

Ron Paul and the fellow non-neocons that are true conservatives is the small bright spot in a waste of a political party.

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Not even remotely true. There are countries that are far more authoritarian and extreme in their application of religious zealotry.
Many first world countries as right wing as the US?

[mactastic]

Many first world countries as right wing as the US?
Huh? :confused:

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Huh? :confused:
eh, I meant:

"Are there many first world countries as far right as the US?"

Would China and Russia be considered first world? I know China has made some big strides lately, but a lot of it is still in ridiculous poverty.

[mactastic]

eh, I meant:

"Are there many first world countries as far right as the US?"

Would China and Russia be considered first world? I know China has made some big strides lately, but a lot of it is still in ridiculous poverty.
That's a pretty subjective judgement; and one that is rather far removed from the statement I was responding to.

Remember, there's a lot of people in this country right now who think we're just a shade or two away from being a socialist nation, if we're not there already.

[Eraserhead]

Would China and Russia be considered first world? I know China has made some big strides lately, but a lot of it is still in ridiculous poverty.

I'd say the Chinese cities (I've visited Beijing, Shanghai and Xi'An) are approaching first world, and in the cities they probably are less authoritarian than the Republican party in the US.

Russia definitely isn't first world.

EDIT: To meat up this post, while the Chinese in the cities aren't allowed to discuss all political issues fully, principally Tibet, Taiwan and Tiananmen Square they are free to have abortions, to marry who they want, to have gay relationships and to follow different religions* without persecution.

* Xi'An has a famous (and still practising) mosque in the centre of the city and in Beijing I visited a Tibetan buddhist temple.

[mcrain]

Edit: Please delete. Posted in wrong thread.

Perhaps, but it was interesting to read the thread. Who would have thought at the time that the way the Republicans would try to become relevant again would be to take a hard turn to the right of GWB, and who would have thought that such a turn would actually resonate with people.

[kavika411]

Who would have thought at the time that the way the Republicans would try to become relevant again would be to take a hard turn to the right of GWB, and who would have thought that such a turn would actually resonate with people.

I guess The Party Of No thought that.