Good Entry Level DSLR

[thunderweb]

I'm looking for a good quality entry level DSLR right now. I'm interested in the Nikon D40 and possibly the D60. The reason I'm looking at the D60 is because it comes with the 55-200mm lens and I would really like to have more than just the 18-55mm lens. Thanks for the advice!

BTW I am fairly new to the world of photography and I don't even own a camera at the moment lol.

[techie4life]

The D60 doesn't necessarily come with the 55-200, maybe you are looking at some sort of kit. If you do want to get the 55-200, skip the non-VR version, it's worth the extra money for the VR. I think both the D40 and the D60 are very capable cameras and great starter DSLR's. Anyone on here will tell you to stay away from the D40x, and I see that you didn't even list it as a choice, so that's great! Here are some links for reviews of the two cameras for you to read:

http://www.popphoto.com/Reviews/Cameras/Camera-Test-Nikon-D60
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikonD60/

http://www.popphoto.com/Reviews/Cameras/Camera-Test-Nikon-D40
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/NikonD40/

I will tell you this: neither camera has a built-in autofocus motor, so you will have to manual focus a lens such as the 50mm f/1.8, if you decide to get one. I personally have a D80 and love it. You could also check in to buying a D80, they are much cheaper nowadays!

Hope that helps! Good luck!

[thunderweb]

Thanks for the info! Do you think it would be less expensive to buy the D40 body and a Nikkor VR lens that fit my needs? or do they make any that are 18-200mm?

[Phrasikleia]

Thanks for the info! Do you think it would be less expensive to buy the D40 body and a Nikkor VR lens that fit my needs? or do they make any that are 18-200mm?

Sure, you can buy a lens that does 18-200 or even 18-270. The thing to know about such "superzooms" is that they tend not to be very sharp. The smaller the range, the easier it is for manufacturers to optimize the focal lengths for sharpness.

Also, you should know that Nikon has just announced the D5000, which is the successor to the cameras you are considering. The D40 and D60 are still fine cameras, of course.

[techie4life]

They do make an 18-200VR, but that will run you around $700 new. I don't know what your budget is, but there is also the 18-105VR (the D90 kit lens) and the 18-135 (not VR). I don't know what kind of shooting you will be doing and what your budget is, so I can't give one solid recommendation right now.

EDIT: Phrasikleia's post came in while I was writing mine. Take his advice over mine, he's much more experienced! The D5000 is definitely a good option also, it really just depends on your budget!

[OceanView]

The lens depends on what type of photos you will shoot.
For a beginner, I would suggest something in the 18-55 range.

[thunderweb]

Ok, my budget isn't high enough to include a $700 lens unfortunately but I think that for what I'm doing the 18-55mm would most likely do everything I need it to and later on down the road if I get more into it I can purchase another lens. I just want something that will last me for awhile and I won't end up regretting not buying the more expensive camera. Thanks for helpin me out!

[techie4life]

No problem! That sounds like a plan. I started off buying my D80 with the kit lens and the 50mm f/1.8, and I added the 55-200VR a few months later. You will be happy with whatever you choose!

[JosephBergdoll]

I'd suggest a used Canon 20D with a Canon 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM lens.

[thunderweb]

Why would you recommend the Canon over the Nikon?

[JosephBergdoll]

I prefer Canon's lens lineup and glass quality, and I find Canon's menus to be much more intuitive. And because I've been shooting Canon for the past 3 years.

[ftaok]

I started off buying my D80 with the kit lens and the 500mm f/1.8,
I'm sure you meant 50mm f/1.8 ...

just making sure the OP realizes it and isn't looking for some mythical lens that doesn't exist.

I wonder how much a 500mm f/1.8 would cost if it were practical to make?

ft

[LittleCanonKid]

I'm sure you meant 50mm f/1.8 ...

just making sure the OP realizes it and isn't looking for some mythical lens that doesn't exist.

I wonder how much a 500mm f/1.8 would cost if it were practical to make?

ftIt would probably stop being a lens and start becoming a WMD once it hit 500mm f/1.8. :eek:

[wadejc85]

Why would you recommend the Canon over the Nikon?

Just a heads-up.... you'll find that Nikon people are Nikon people and Canon people are Canon people (i.e. you will get somewhat biased comments). I'm a Canon person and will only recommend Canon. I've owned many Canon products and feel that their quality is superb.

Nikon is an outstanding brand, as well. What I would suggest is that you go to a photography or electronics store and grab a hold of different models of both brands of cameras. Feel their weight, the location of the buttons, go through their menus, and figure out which brand and model you like better. Voila!

[Razeus]

Don't waste your time on Nikon entry levels. Go for Canon. The XS and if you can swing it, the XSi.

[thunderweb]

Thanks a lot guys. I'll be going into the camera store at the end of this month when I get paid and check both the Nikon and the Cannon out some more. I'll post some photos when I get one!

[DeepCobalt]

I really liked the XSi feature and functionwise, but didn't like how it felt in my hand... I liked the Nikon's feel better. I would take the D40 over the D60, but if you can spend some more, I would spring for the D80 or even the D90. Getting a camera is very personal, I've found. See which model feels better.

[thunderweb]

Do you guys know if Nikon makes like a 18-80mm VR lens? I think that's the size that would be perfect for me. If I could get that lens fairly inexpensive I would probably buy a D60 body if it was a good price or just go with the D40.

[LittleCanonKid]

Do you guys know if Nikon makes like a 18-80mm VR lens? I think that's the size that would be perfect for me. If I could get that lens fairly inexpensive I would probably buy a D60 body if it was a good price or just go with the D40.Nikon makes an AF-S 18-105 VR. Sounds like that would fit the bill.

[FourCandles]

Do you guys know if Nikon makes like a 18-80mm VR lens? I think that's the size that would be perfect for me. If I could get that lens fairly inexpensive I would probably buy a D60 body if it was a good price or just go with the D40.

They do a 16-85mm f/3.5-5.6 VR but it's GBP 450.00 here, so maybe $550 US?
Otherwise it's the 18-55 or 18-105 at a reasonable price bracket.

EDIT: looks more like $630 for the 16-85mm.

[thunderweb]

Got ya, that's pretty pricy for me right now. Ok so tell me what you think of this package. I'm seriously considering this one. http://www.amazon.com/Nikon-D60-Digital-18-55mm-55-200mm/dp/B00155137S/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1242254354&sr=1-6

[FourCandles]

Got ya, that's pretty pricy for me right now. Ok so tell me what you think of this package. I'm seriously considering this one. http://www.amazon.com/Nikon-D60-Digital-18-55mm-55-200mm/dp/B00155137S/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1242254354&sr=1-6

Looks a nice kit. Can't comment on the deal as I'm not too up on US pricing (as you'll see from my previous post...).

But as this is your first DSLR I'd strongly recommend going into a B&M camera shop as opposed to just online and trying out various combinations of cameras and lenses (Nikon, Canon, whatever) and seeing what's right for you. The way the camera feels and handles, the weight, balance, position of the controls can make a huge difference to how happy you are with it, how often you use it and therefore how many good photos you'll take.

[JosephBergdoll]

Don't waste your time on Nikon entry levels. Go for Canon. The XS and if you can swing it, the XSi.

Don't waste your time with the XS/XSi... Get a used 20D/30D.

[wheelhot]

Don't waste your time with the XS/XSi... Get a used 20D/30D.

Why is that? the XS and XSi is a great camera, it just have a small grip and without top LCD. Check out the reviews for XSi, almost everyone is happy with it and what it offers.

[JosephBergdoll]

Why is that? the XS and XSi is a great camera, it just have a small grip and without top LCD. Check out the reviews for XSi, almost everyone is happy with it and what it offers.

I had an XTi and to be honest, they're like glorified point and shoots. The big screen always being on is a battery killer, they have no ISO 3200 capability, no spot metering, and the TINY grip and small plastic body make the camera feel like the toy that it really is.

[gkarris]

Don't waste your time with the XS/XSi... Get a used 20D/30D.

lovin' my 20D I got used.... :D

[wheelhot]

I had an XTi and to be honest, they're like glorified point and shoots. The big screen always being on is a battery killer, they have no ISO 3200 capability, no spot metering, and the TINY grip and small plastic body make the camera feel like the toy that it really is.

Hmm, well I do agree with you that the max ISO at 1600 is pretty sad, but if Im not mistaken, only the XS doesn't have spot metering, the XSi have spot metering, and yea agree with the tiny grip and small plastic body but I got no complain bout the plastic body cause of the price issue. Now about the whole battery killer thing, I don't think it's such a problem with the new battery found in XS, XSi and T1i, It takes like very very long to drain it, if memory serves me correct, I can fill up 8gb - 10gb worth of memory on a single charge, of course without using built in flash.

[techie4life]

I'm sure you meant 50mm f/1.8 ...

just making sure the OP realizes it and isn't looking for some mythical lens that doesn't exist.

I wonder how much a 500mm f/1.8 would cost if it were practical to make?

ft

Woah, sorry I didn't see that before I posted. Post edited!

[thunderweb]

So is the 20D the equivalent of the D60 as far as specs and price go?

[ftaok]

So is the 20D the equivalent of the D60 as far as specs and price go?

Not necessarily. I'm not up on the specs, but the 20D and the D60 aren't really comparable.

The 20D is the predecessor to the 30D which is the predecessor to the 40D which is the predecessor to the 50D. The 50D is Canon's current "prosumer" dSLR.

The D60 is the replacement to the D40/40x and has been supplanted by the D5000. These are Nikon's entry-level dSLR.

I can't comment on whether the D60 beats the 20D in terms of IQ, but it is a few years newer. The 20D is a larger camera, probably with more dials and it has a separate LCD-info screen.

ft

[JosephBergdoll]

Hmm, well I do agree with you that the max ISO at 1600 is pretty sad, but if Im not mistaken, only the XS doesn't have spot metering, the XSi have spot metering, and yea agree with the tiny grip and small plastic body but I got no complain bout the plastic body cause of the price issue. Now about the whole battery killer thing, I don't think it's such a problem with the new battery found in XS, XSi and T1i, It takes like very very long to drain it, if memory serves me correct, I can fill up 8gb - 10gb worth of memory on a single charge, of course without using built in flash.

Price issue? Used 30Ds are cheaper than new XSi's/T1i's, and 20D's are cheaper than all of them combined.

[JosephBergdoll]

I can't comment on whether the D60 beats the 20D in terms of IQ, but it is a few years newer. The 20D is a larger camera, probably with more dials and it has a separate LCD-info screen.

ft

Actually has less dials...

[luminosity]

I really wouldn't make the mistake of directly comparing Canon xD bodies with Nikon Dx bodies. They have each been released at different times, with different priorities in mind, not to mention a different set of lenses (of particular importance for the D40/60, which can only autofocus with AF-S lenses).

Canon and Nikon's lineups are just too staggered to really make for a true comparison. Maybe the only real comparison to be had, if there is one, is between the D3x and the 1Ds Mark III. Even the D700 and 5D Mark II is a shaky comparison in some ways, given the difference in resolution and autofocus (heavy lean to the 5D on the former, heavy lean toward the D700 on the latter), not to mention the movie feature that goes with the 5D Mark II that's absent with the D700.

[LittleCanonKid]

The D60 is the replacement to the D40/40x and has been supplanted by the D5000. These are Nikon's entry-level dSLR.Just fixing up the names so we don't get confused here...

I agree, though that they're hard to compare directly. The 20D is going to be more prosumer-oriented, with a faster burst rate, two command wheels and information window. The D60 also does not have mirror lockup or exposure bracketing, which is minor but notable. You may or may not have to worry about the D60's need for AF-S lenses for autofocus--for many people this is irrelevant. Look at what lenses you'll probably want to buy if you go for Nikon and see if there are any non-AF-S lenses that could pose some problems.

I'm not quite sure on IQ differences either. Because they're in different tiers and separated by a good amount of time, it's hard to find direct comparisons. Should be good with either camera, the only question is which one is better.

[Phrasikleia]

I had an XTi and to be honest, they're like glorified point and shoots. The big screen always being on is a battery killer, they have no ISO 3200 capability, no spot metering, and the TINY grip and small plastic body make the camera feel like the toy that it really is.

I don't know about the XTi, but the XSi must be in another league. Its screen is not always on, since it has a detection mechanism that shuts the screen off when your face gets close (I love that feature and can't believe they omitted it from the 50D :confused:). It also has an auto-sleep feature. The battery on the XSi is nothing short of a modern marvel; I consistently get about 1,000 shots per charge (!). The XSi also has spot metering. They did rework the grip on the XSi, so it's much more comfortable to hold, especially with the added battery grip. The lightness of the plastic is still there, but that's the case with any entry-level camera except for those from Pentax (the K200D is a weather-sealed tank of a camera).

Hmm, well I do agree with you that the max ISO at 1600 is pretty sad, but if Im not mistaken, only the XS doesn't have spot metering, the XSi have spot metering, and yea agree with the tiny grip and small plastic body but I got no complain bout the plastic body cause of the price issue. Now about the whole battery killer thing, I don't think it's such a problem with the new battery found in XS, XSi and T1i, It takes like very very long to drain it, if memory serves me correct, I can fill up 8gb - 10gb worth of memory on a single charge, of course without using built in flash.

I agree with everything wheelhot said here. Yes, the XS lacks spot metering. It also lacks the rubberized grip of the XSi, so it would of course feel less satisfying to hold. They both stop at ISO 1600, but they handle that level of ISO with grace (or at least the XSi does).

I've really pushed my XSi in a lot of ways, and it has not let me down. I've used it in freezing temperatures, in drizzling precipitation, under a scorching hot sun at dusty archaeological sites. It's been everywhere with me, from California to Albania, some twelve countries in all. It has bounced around in various camera bags and on every imaginable type of transportation. I've taken photos of everything from pitch-black caves to gleaming white marble. The little champ just works and works well. I could not be more happy with it. :)

[JosephBergdoll]

I don't know about the XTi, but the XSi must be in another league. Its screen is not always on, since it has a detection mechanism that shuts the screen off when your face gets close (I love that feature and can't believe they omitted it from the 50D :confused:). It also has an auto-sleep feature. The battery on the XSi is nothing short of a modern marvel; I consistently get about 1,000 shots per charge (!). The XSi also has spot metering. They did rework the grip on the XSi, so it's much more comfortable to hold, especially with the added battery grip. The lightness of the plastic is still there, but that's the case with any entry-level camera except for those from Pentax (the K200D is a weather-sealed tank of a camera).

I agree with everything wheelhot said here. Yes, the XS lacks spot metering. It also lacks the rubberized grip of the XSi, so it would of course feel less satisfying to hold. They both stop at ISO 1600, but they handle that level of ISO with grace (or at least the XSi does).

I've really pushed my XSi in a lot of ways, and it has not let me down. I've used it in freezing temperatures, in drizzling precipitation, under a scorching hot sun at dusty archaeological sites. It's been everywhere with me, from California to Albania, some twelve countries in all. It has bounced around in various camera bags and on every imaginable type of transportation. I've taken photos of everything from pitch-black caves to gleaming white marble. The little champ just works and works well. I could not be more happy with it. :)
1. I'm talking about when it is at your side. XTi's had the auto-shutoff as well when your face was close but that's it.
2. The only reworking they did on the grip was the change in texture. It still is tiny and extremely uncomfortable compared to that of a xxD series. The main reason why I got rid of my XTi was because it frankly felt like a cheap PoS, and I couldn't even fit all of my fingers on it.
3. For me, I'd be pissed if the manufacturer deliberately cut high-ISO from the firmware of my camera, in essence crippling it in extremely low light unless you have extremely fast lenses or an all-IS lineup.

[wheelhot]

Price issue? Used 30Ds are cheaper than new XSi's/T1i's, and 20D's are cheaper than all of them combined.


Well, I was referring the price issue to XS and XSi, you can't compare the build of 20D/30D which is a few years older then XS and XSi. Besides, the Rebel series has always been for the entry level hence lots of plastic, but you can't say that for the xxD series.

And yea, the XS and XSi does a tremendously good job at ISO1600, add a quality lens and the photos will still look very good.

I do wish the XS has rubberized grip though, I recently bought a BGE5 battery grip and fuh do I love holding the textured grip.

Well I do agree some people will argue about the size of the Rebel series especially for those with large hands but we do get what we paid for.

[LittleCanonKid]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a problem with the Rebel's grip size? Granted, I'm not a hulking massive adult yet but my father doesn't have a problem either. He prefers the smaller overall size of the Rebel to the xxD series as well.

[Patriks7]

Are you set to go with a Nikon? I am currently on the same search for a new camera (also my first!) and have found from multiple reviews and comparisons that Canon's lower end seems to be better value, as do many of their higher end. I personally am going for either a Canon XS/XSi/40D with most likely a kit lens. I have also found that Canon seems to have a better selection of lenses (at least in my country). But like others said, go check them out in a store. I mean from reviews, all cameras are superb, from the Nikon D60 to the Canon XSi/40D to the Sony A350 to the Olympus E620 etc. You just have to find one that you find to be the best (ergonomic wise) because all of these people who buy one company will only recommend that company (happens to me with Macs and iPods :p).
Good luck on our decision!

[JosephBergdoll]

Everything feels small and uncomfortable compared to my 1D, now.

[thunderweb]

Hey Patriks7, ya I think I'm pretty set on the D60, I can get it at a great price wit a bunch of other accessories (and I get the 55-200mm lens as well). I posted a link to it on the previous page. I went in and held a couple different models and I really like the D60, it's the perfect size of me and I think it will be an excellent camera. I know what you mean as far as if you buy from that company you most likely will only refer that company :) Anyways, I love the D60's size and weight. I'm hoping to purchase it in a couple weeks (hopefully sooner than 2 :D) and I'll post some pics one I do get it. Thank you guys for the suggestions and recommendations!

[wheelhot]

Everything feels small and uncomfortable compared to my 1D, now.

Lol, tell me bout it, after using my friend 5D, I felt my XS grip ridiculously small, adding a battery grip to my XS soften the blow though :)

[cube]

Are you set to go with a Nikon? I am currently on the same search for a new camera (also my first!) and have found from multiple reviews and comparisons that Canon's lower end seems to be better value, as do many of their higher end.

What do you mean by better value? Just get the cameras in your hand, and let's see what you think after that. Also, it is known that Nikon is trouncing Canon at the higher end.

[Patriks7]

What do you mean by better value? Just get the cameras in your hand, and let's see what you think after that. Also, it is known that Nikon is trouncing Canon at the higher end.

Well I was just stating what I found on most reviews. I personally don't have experience, as I don't have a camera yet. Hopefully that should change within a couple weeks :p

[cube]

Besides serious photography magazines, there's ONE place online for reviews: dpreview. If you don't find it there, in that case one has to content oneself with what one finds in a couple other places.

But note that dpreview never gives a negative summary rating. You can ignore the final labeling, and come to your own conclusion based on the rest of the last page (or the whole review).

[romanaz]

Hmm, well I do agree with you that the max ISO at 1600 is pretty sad, but if Im not mistaken, only the XS doesn't have spot metering, the XSi have spot metering, and yea agree with the tiny grip and small plastic body but I got no complain bout the plastic body cause of the price issue. Now about the whole battery killer thing, I don't think it's such a problem with the new battery found in XS, XSi and T1i, It takes like very very long to drain it, if memory serves me correct, I can fill up 8gb - 10gb worth of memory on a single charge, of course without using built in flash.

personally, as an owner of an XSi, I don't see why ISO 1600 as a max is so bad. Its a consumer level camera, and even so, it wasn't to long ago, back before digital that it was hard to find that high speed film (AFAIK, from what I've heard from friends and relatives). Sure its a tiny grip and body, but for a lot of people that could be comfortable. Personally, I'm comfortable with canon's bodys from the XSi upto the 1D. The Nikons just don't feel as right.

For the battery, I shoot a lot of sports with mine, and I can easily fill 2-3 8gb cards on one battery. Thats on jpeg, so we are talking 4-5thousand photo's on one battery.

Sure the T1i has a much higher ISO capability, and it probably performs very well at that, but does everyone need that?

[techie4life]

Besides serious photography magazines, there's ONE place online for reviews: dpreview. If you don't find it there, in that case one has to content oneself with what one finds in a couple other places.

But note that dpreview never gives a negative summary rating. You can ignore the final labeling, and come to your own conclusion based on the rest of the last page (or the whole review).

I gave him links to the D60 and D40 reviews in my first post, as well as links to PopPhoto.

[cube]

I gave him links to the D60 and D40 reviews in my first post, as well as links to PopPhoto.

The point is that that poster seems to put too much faith on any random reviews he finds on the net.

[thunderweb]

^^ Trust me I am an EXTREMELY analytical person. I didn't just read one random review that told me to buy this certain camera. I have read quite a few and I have gone in and held them as well. I just am more comfortable with the Nikon.

[wadejc85]

^^ Trust me I am an EXTREMELY analytical person. I didn't just read one random review that told me to buy this certain camera. I have read quite a few and I have gone in and held them as well. I just am more comfortable with the Nikon.

If you are more comfortable with the Nikon, buy the Nikon. You will always regret not buying the one you wanted.

[JosephBergdoll]

Hey Patriks7, ya I think I'm pretty set on the D60, I can get it at a great price wit a bunch of other accessories (and I get the 55-200mm lens as well). I posted a link to it on the previous page. I went in and held a couple different models and I really like the D60, it's the perfect size of me and I think it will be an excellent camera. I know what you mean as far as if you buy from that company you most likely will only refer that company :) Anyways, I love the D60's size and weight. I'm hoping to purchase it in a couple weeks (hopefully sooner than 2 :D) and I'll post some pics one I do get it. Thank you guys for the suggestions and recommendations!
At least get a D90 so you're not limited to AF-S lenses... don't support manufacturers selling pre-crippled cameras.

[thunderweb]

I would be willing to buy the D90 if I had an extra couple hundred dollars but I don't. I think the D60 will be perfectly fine for my needs. I understand the problem with the AF-S lenses but I don't have the extra $300 + to spend. I can get the D60 outfitted the way I want it for $750.

[techie4life]

Well, I think that's a great choice! I love my D80 and I'm sure you will love the D60. I was torn between the Pentax K10D and the D80, but it ended up coming down to which one felt better in my hand. The D80 won by a longshot. Just make sure you are comfortable with the D60, and you will not regret it!

[luminosity]

I'd stay far away from the D60. You're closing yourself off to a lot of great Nikon lenses by choosing it, assuming you want autofocus with them.

[thunderweb]

^ You have to keep in mind that I am just starting out, after I buy the camera I don't plan on buying lenses for awhile because of the cost of them. If I get to the point that I absolutely need the other lens options that aren't compatible with the D60 I will upgrade to a D90 or something.

[windowpain]

I would be willing to buy the D90 if I had an extra couple hundred dollars but I don't. I think the D60 will be perfectly fine for my needs. I understand the problem with the AF-S lenses but I don't have the extra $300 + to spend. I can get the D60 outfitted the way I want it for $750.

I was in the exact same situation as you. I would have loved the D90 but couldn't afford it.
I went for the D40, for me there wasn't enough difference to justify springing the extra money for the D60. I got the double lens kit, (18-55 and 55-200) and they aren't great lenses, but are far from bad. I'm also planning on getting the new 35mm f1.8 prime soon. ($200 on amazon.)
All of these lenses are afs-s so the lack of autofocus doesn't bother me.
The camera is light, small and is very good. Also as the D5000 has just come out, you can pick them up for 'next to nothing' ($430 on amazon, but I'm sure you can find it cheaper, try ebay even.)

I know it isn't a D300, but if you can't take good photos with it, then it ain't the camera. It is very capable.

Save the money, buy the lens and in a couple of years when you fully understand how to work it, buy the replacement for the D90. (This is my plan anyway ymmv.)

[luminosity]

^ You have to keep in mind that I am just starting out, after I buy the camera I don't plan on buying lenses for awhile because of the cost of them. If I get to the point that I absolutely need the other lens options that aren't compatible with the D60 I will upgrade to a D90 or something.

That's just it, though. With a D50/80/90, you can use good older glass that used to command high prices and now is cheap. There was a lot of AF-D glass made, and some of it was professional. It can be had for pretty good prices now in some cases.

[AlaskaMoose]

I had an XTi and to be honest, they're like glorified point and shoots. The big screen always being on is a battery killer, they have no ISO 3200 capability, no spot metering, and the TINY grip and small plastic body make the camera feel like the toy that it really is.

What do you want for an entry-level camera, a titanium body? If one has big hands, then one should get a big camera or something like that. That said, some photographers do wonders with relatively cheap cameras.

[telecomm]

...I think I'm pretty set on the D60, I can get it at a great price wit a bunch of other accessories (and I get the 55-200mm lens as well). I posted a link to it on the previous page. I went in and held a couple different models and I really like the D60, it's the perfect size of me and I think it will be an excellent camera.

I got a similar kit around Christmas and I'm really happy with my D60. (Of course, everyone's happy with the camera they get. :D) I haven't found the lack of a focus motor to be a big problem. Nikon seems to be moving to improve their AF-S offerings, so it seems likely to be less and less a limitation. (I've also now got the AF-S 50 mm f/1.4 lens.)

It's nice to have a couple of lenses to chose from when you get a kit like this, as you'll get a good idea of what range you'll like when you do start to upgrade. Myself, I rarely use the 55-200, so if I had to do it all over again I'd get a body, a wide-angle zoom, and some primes for portraits. Of course, it's only after playing around with the kit lenses that I had any idea what I "really" want, so I'm still glad I did get the 55-200 at the outset.

[DeepCobalt]

@thunderweb

I would seriously consider the D40 if you are leaning towards the D60. The D60 is worse for low-light shooting conditions (same size sensor as the D40 but more pixels--hence, more light needed). D40's base ISO = 200, D60's base ISO = 100. Also the D60 has a slower maximum shutter speed than the D40. The D60 is basically a more expensive version of the D40 but with some limitations and more megapixels to justify the higher price.

[ftaok]

The D60 is worse for low-light shooting conditions (same size sensor as the D40 but more pixels--hence, more light needed). D40's base ISO = 200, D60's base ISO = 100.

You know, I've seen this assertion a couple of times and it confuses me. I can buy that the D40's sensor makes it better in ISO sensitivity when compared to the D60's larger denser sensor. But why would having a higher base ISO be an advantage? Wouldn't having an ISO100 setting on the D40 be a good thing?

ft

[cube]

^^ Trust me I am an EXTREMELY analytical person. I didn't just read one random review that told me to buy this certain camera. I have read quite a few and I have gone in and held them as well. I just am more comfortable with the Nikon.

I said "that poster", not "the OP".

[DeepCobalt]

You know, I've seen this assertion a couple of times and it confuses me. I can buy that the D40's sensor makes it better in ISO sensitivity when compared to the D60's larger denser sensor. But why would having a higher base ISO be an advantage? Wouldn't having an ISO100 setting on the D40 be a good thing?

ft

My understanding is that the base ISO of 200 implies that the sensor natively captures light at that level, so better lower lighting results are achievable. It can do this because it has larger pixels (it is only 6.1 MP).

[thunderweb]

Ok, I went and and tried out a D90 today. They didn't have any when I went in last tim. I am now sold, I'm going to take the time to save extra $400. It just is the best feeling camera and I love everything about it (I spent 45 min in Best Buy playing around with it :D). So I'll post pictures once I get it (hopefully not more than a month from now). Thanks for all the advice guys.

[luminosity]

It's a great camera. From what I understand, it rivals the D3 at its base ISO level.

[techie4life]

Ok, I went and and tried out a D90 today. They didn't have any when I went in last tim. I am now sold, I'm going to take the time to save extra $400. It just is the best feeling camera and I love everything about it (I spent 45 min in Best Buy playing around with it :D). So I'll post pictures once I get it (hopefully not more than a month from now). Thanks for all the advice guys.

Great idea to go try it out. I ended up basing my decision on how the camera felt in my hand, and that's something you can decide in person! You'll love the camera, it will be well worth the wait!

[DeepCobalt]

You'll love the D90!

[aaronw1986]

Do you guys know if Nikon makes like a 18-80mm VR lens? I think that's the size that would be perfect for me. If I could get that lens fairly inexpensive I would probably buy a D60 body if it was a good price or just go with the D40.

There is also a 18-70mm vr for around $350

[dL.]

Awesome! Glad you like the feel of the Nikon cameras as much as I do. You'll definitely love the D90 as I just recently acquired that.

You'll certainly enjoy some nice features that no other brands currently provides for the price, such as better metering (420 segment), 3d tracking AF, scene recognition system (analyze 30,000 images for accurate exposure), wireless flash (Nikon CLS) with built in commander mode, all from the flagship D3.

dL

[Saladinos]

I ordered a D40 from Amazon (with 18-55mm kit lens). Estimated delivery is tomorrow. I'll let you know how it is.

Ken Rockwell also recommends the D40 over the D60 (sort of). I'd recommend taking a look at his site. He basically says that the camera doesn't matter all that much.

Considering the feature differences (or lack thereof) between the D40 and D60, and the additional money that could be used on lenses, I thought the D40 was a good choice.

[gkarris]

I ordered a D40 from Amazon (with 18-55mm kit lens). Estimated delivery is tomorrow. I'll let you know how it is.

Ken Rockwell also recommends the D40 over the D60 (sort of). I'd recommend taking a look at his site. He basically says that the camera doesn't matter all that much.

Considering the feature differences (or lack thereof) between the D40 and D60, and the additional money that could be used on lenses, I thought the D40 was a good choice.

dpreview.com more or less says the same....

Go for the Nikon ED lenses -very, very nice (I rented one over the weekend - pics posted in Photo of the Day).

Take some pics and post them, please. We'd like to see how it goes for you!

[Saladinos]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/75137613@N00/sets/72157618530809204/

Here are some pictures from me. Considering it's day 1, and this is my first DSLR ever, I think it's gone pretty well.

Oddly, whilst my camera arrived today, the SD card is still in the post, so I had to take the pictures with my camera attached to the computer with Sofortbild.

[Eyedn]

Sorry to "Jack" the thread but does anyone have any experience using the Canon 1000D? This would be my first camera.

[wheelhot]

I have the 1000D and it has been serving me well :)

[gkarris]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/75137613@N00/sets/72157618530809204/

Here are some pictures from me. Considering it's day 1, and this is my first DSLR ever, I think it's gone pretty well.

Oddly, whilst my camera arrived today, the SD card is still in the post, so I had to take the pictures with my camera attached to the computer with Sofortbild.

Great job on the panorama - any way of seeing it a bit larger?

[Saladinos]

I should add to anybody considering a D40 and worried that it's "obsolete" or whatever - check Flickr. It's the second most popular Nikon camera there under the D80.

I went to a camera shop before I bought my D40. The guy there tried to scare me by saying that all the stock sold as new was actually refurb, and that the camera went obsolete months ago and that the kit lens was awful. The evidence is against those claims, however:

- It's an Amazon.co.uk best seller (Ranked #1 in Digital SLR Cameras)
- Second most popular Nikon on Flickr. Hard to tell, but probably 6th most popular camera on Flickr overall (all brands)
- My D40 was brand new (from Amazon). No refurb here.
- My experience of it is that it's a fantastic camera
- Checking Flickr, D40 users are taking phenomenal pictures. Many of those great pictures are even done using the 18-55mm kit lens (one example (http://www.flickr.com/photos/maggybuenaventura/3541596075/))

If you're thinking about it, do it.

[gkarris]

- Checking Flickr, D40 users are taking phenomenal pictures. Many of those great pictures are even done using the 18-55mm kit lens (one example (http://www.flickr.com/photos/maggybuenaventura/3541596075/))

If that's the ED version of the lens - that makes all the difference in the world...

[Saladinos]

If that's the ED version of the lens - that makes all the difference in the world...

It is.

ED — "Extra-low Dispersion" glass incorporated to reduce chromatic aberration.

[thunderweb]

Guys does the D5000 have an internal drive motor for auto focusing with non Nikon lenses?

[cube]

D40/D40x/D60/D5000 = AF challenged (no motor)

[cube]

Guys does the D5000 have an internal drive motor for auto focusing with non Nikon lenses?

It's not about "non Nikon lenses". It's "lenses lacking an AF motor".

[thunderweb]

Ok got ya. Thanks. My Dad has a really nice Pentax film camera and about $6,000 of lenses and I was curious if they could be used with a D5000.

[cube]

Look no further:

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0905/09052003pentaxk7dslr.asp

[thunderweb]

Thanks. I'll look into it.

[cube]

I assume you meant your dad has a 35mm K mount camera, not medium format.

[thunderweb]

Correct.

[Saladinos]

The lack of an autofocus motor means you can only autofocus "newer" AF-S or AF-I lenses. You can manual focus on any F-mount lens, though.

If you want to do macro photography, this doesn't matter, as you're going to be manual focussing anyway. The lack of an AF motor doesn't limit your choice of lenses much, as it can autofocus plenty of lenses and Nikon's commitment to keeping it off the D5000 indicates that they see this as the way forward.

The only thing this stops you doing is autofocusing on old telephoto lenses. Manual focus on a telephoto shot isn't that bad anyway, because they're mostly still shots and you have time to move your little finger a bit to focus. If you're buying a telephoto lens today, you're going to want to pay extra for a new one in order to get VR anyway, so you'll get an AF-S lens anyway. There is only one VR lens without AF-S: the 80-400mm f/4.5-5.6D ED AF VR (FX format. Released in 2000).

The one thing I do lament is the price of Nikon's AF-S 50mm. That said, it's really new.

[thunderweb]

Ya I understand that. The lenses that I would be using of my Dad's would be his 80-300mm and his macro lens. I'm planing on getting the 18-105 with my Nikon so I was wondering if those would work. I'm still swaying between the D90 and D5000. I just can't shell out that much for the D90. I would like to have a camera before I leave for the summer traveling ect. and If that means I have to go for a less expensive camera that's probably what I'm gonna do. I can get the D5000 in a kit with the 18-105mm lens that comes with the D90 and a lot of other accessories (16 and 4 gig SDHC cards, tripods, case, ect.) for about $1049.00. The D90 is about $300 more.

[cube]

For some mount combinations, sometimes one can get an adapter to go in one of the directions, but that will only allow you to use the lens MANUALLY.

[Disregarding FourThirds to Micro FourThirds]

[cube]

Just get the K200D. It's weather sealed and has stabilization.

[Phrasikleia]

Ok got ya. Thanks. My Dad has a really nice Pentax film camera and about $6,000 of lenses and I was curious if they could be used with a D5000.

Good grief! Case closed: get a Pentax!

Pentax glass is some of the best made, and they are the only company that has complete backward compatibility with their entire lens line. You can use any Pentax lens ever made on any modern Pentax DSLR and will even be able to meter with them.

Get a K200D, a K20D, or wait until July for the K-7.

[luminosity]

Pentax is the brand of people who look past the usual suspects and do their research. I'm a Nikon guy, but if I were starting over, it could just as easily be Pentax that I went with.

[jvalente]

I own a D40 and I strongly recommend it. It's actually better than the D60 in every way other than megapixels. It has better flash sync speed, better ISO, and it costs way less. I paid AU$420 for my D40. It should be about $300ish US. It is an awesome camera. The fact it can only use AF-S lenses is not a limitation. Most of the AF-S lenses are just upgrades of tried and tested lens designs reworked so that they work they best they can for DX format. They're lighter, simpler, and no more expensive that older lenses.

A D40 and an 18-200mm Nikkor lens is pretty much everything someone who's just taking normal photos (meaning no crazy stuff like live music, or professional sports photography, even though this camera could probably handle that pretty well if you are a good enough photographer) could ever need.

The next step up is the D90. Get one of these if you want to use lenses other than AF-S. Remember the 1.5x crop factor of the sensor on the camera though.

The next real step up at the moment is a D700. The D300 is an awesome camera, but will soon be replaced, and it's image quality is just as good as the D90's since it has the same firmware. They have the same amount of megapixels and the same firmware. The only difference I can see is the FPS.


I vote the D40. And then use the cash you saved to save for a 50mm prime, or the 18-200mm.



edit:

wow i really did not read the whole thread. ignore

[cube]

Some people don't bother reading the whole thread.