What's with Aspyr?

[Ol3s]

They haven't released any mac games from them for a while, all they keep releasing are pc games.

[Signal-11]

After what they did to NWN2, I don't think I'm really interested in buying any of their software.

[eXan]

Their COD4 port is so much slower than native Windows version it looks like it was just Ciderized :rolleyes:

[txa1265]

Their COD4 port is so much slower than native Windows version it looks like it was just Ciderized :rolleyes:

Compared with NWN2 it is lightning fast ...

Yeah, they are becoming more and more of a PC game publisher. Got Puzzle Quest Galactrix from them.

[Rodus]

Plus Glenda Adams has just left the company which means one less mac supporter there.

[Cougarcat]

Aspyr is porting the last expansion to Civ IV. Beyond the Sword, to the mac. Although it hasn't been officially announced yet, it's nearing the end of development. (http://www.insidemacgames.com/forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=36361&view=findpost&p=372484) They also have a "AAA" pc/mac console port to be released by the end of the year.

[txa1265]

Plus Glenda Adams has just left the company which means one less mac supporter there.

Really? What is she up to now ... and how did I miss that ... ?

Aspyr is porting the last expansion to Civ IV. Beyond the Sword, to the mac..

Well, there was also Colonization, but that is really a whole different experience - but it was part of the complete pack just released.

[gregorsamsa]

More to the point: what's with Mac gaming? :rolleyes: A while back, I thought things might be picking up, but it seems to have fallen back again. Then again, I've already bought a lot of the better Mac-native titles available. As I won't buy Cider ports, it's mostly Bootcamp & Windows gaming for me in future.

Apparently, Aspyr will still bring out the occasional Mac game, but they're increasingly concentrating on developing games for the PC & console markets, simply because that's where the serious money can be made.

Really? What is she up to now ... and how did I miss that ... ?

I read on IMG that she's concentrating on iPhone apps & games via Maverick software. Average development times for iPhone are fairly short (about 3 months), with the prospect of greater rewards.

PS: Re "greater rewards" - that's only my interpretation as she doesn't say that's her motive.

[Rodus]

It looks like Brad Oliver will also be concentrating more on consoles which means Aspyr releases will be few and far between, although with the performance problems of their latest stuff can't say I'll shed a tear. Basically all Mac gaming has now is Feral and Blizzard.

[Eric5h5]

Basically all Mac gaming has now is Feral and Blizzard.

Virtual Programming actually does quite a few ports.

--Eric

[manmeet]

No they have released tony hawk pro skater! they have released nightfire also!

[Ol3s]

No they have released deimos rising! they have released nightfire also!

how old are these, i was talking about after CoD4

[TwinCities Dan]

how old are these, i was talking about after CoD4

Deimos Rising came out in like '01, I believe... :eek:

[Winni]

There is barely a market for games in the Mac ecosystem. And since Macs can now run Windows, the business case for porting games to the Mac has completely vaporized.

Furthermore, PC gaming itself has been dying a slow death since the launch of the Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 -- and nowadays most PC games are nothing more than Xbox 360 ports anyway. The studios don't have to fight against illegal copies of their games in the console market, they sell more units and its simply more lucrative to target consoles for them than to target PCs - or the tiny number of Mac gamers.

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games like World of Warcraft and simulations like Civilization are the last domains of the PC, but this could - and probably will - also change.

I've been a heavy gamer myself since the early 80s (Apple II, later PC - I never had an Atari or Commodore machine). Crysis was the last game that I bought for Windows, and it was a huge disappointment. I've bought more than 20 Xbox 360 titles since then and I can say that I very much prefer the Xbox experience over Windows/Mac. No copy protection hassles and the stuff always runs flawlessly and beautifully in HD mode (1920x1080).

While Gears of War 2 "just works" on the Xbox and looks great, I cannot even properly play the Mac port of Civilization IV on my Quad Core Mac Pro at 1680x1050: In the later rounds, when more units and cities have been built, the game painfully slows down and begins to show ugly graphical glitches. And yes, I have installed the latest patches from Aspyr. Sound playback is also faulty - Leonard Nimoy just doesn't talk anymore after a while. The game also occasionally crashes. While crashing games are normal in the PC/Mac world, in my experience they are a rare exception in the Xbox 360 world. The only game that ever crashed on me was Blacksite, and even that crashed only once.

I think the simple conclusion is that you have to buy a console when you're serious about games.

[Rodus]

^^which is a pain as RTS games suck on consoles and many people prefer a mouse/keyboard combo for FPS' as well.

[Dagless]

I think the simple conclusion is that you have to buy a console when you're serious about games.

Console systems are much more 'casual' based than their PC alternatives. If you're serious about games - either install Bootcamp or buy a dedicated gaming PC.

[gregorsamsa]

There is barely a market for games in the Mac ecosystem. And since Macs can now run Windows, the business case for porting games to the Mac has completely vaporized.

Furthermore, PC gaming itself has been dying a slow death since the launch of the Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 -- and nowadays most PC games are nothing more than Xbox 360 ports anyway. The studios don't have to fight against illegal copies of their games in the console market, they sell more units and its simply more lucrative to target consoles for them than to target PCs - or the tiny number of Mac gamers.

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games like World of Warcraft and simulations like Civilization are the last domains of the PC, but this could - and probably will - also change.

I've been a heavy gamer myself since the early 80s (Apple II, later PC - I never had an Atari or Commodore machine). Crysis was the last game that I bought for Windows, and it was a huge disappointment. I've bought more than 20 Xbox 360 titles since then and I can say that I very much prefer the Xbox experience over Windows/Mac. No copy protection hassles and the stuff always runs flawlessly and beautifully in HD mode (1920x1080).

While Gears of War 2 "just works" on the Xbox and looks great, I cannot even properly play the Mac port of Civilization IV on my Quad Core Mac Pro at 1680x1050: In the later rounds, when more units and cities have been built, the game painfully slows down and begins to show ugly graphical glitches. And yes, I have installed the latest patches from Aspyr. Sound playback is also faulty - Leonard Nimoy just doesn't talk anymore after a while. The game also occasionally crashes. While crashing games are normal in the PC/Mac world, in my experience they are a rare exception in the Xbox 360 world. The only game that ever crashed on me was Blacksite, and even that crashed only once.
I think the simple conclusion is that you have to buy a console when you're serious about games.

Agree with your 1st point. Sad as it may be, it's something many of us predicted would happen as soon as Bootcamp was announced. :( For the rest, IMO, you couldn't be more wrong! So serious gamers no longer want to play KB-controlled games? To the contrary, most serious gamers will tell you that genres like RTS & FPS simply don't work too well on joypads.

Also, I wouldn't be too hasty with the "PC gaming dying a slow death" conclusion just yet, despite rampant piracy. I think what's happening is that the over-saturated PC games market is basically undergoing a long-overdue correction, so fewer game releases isn't necessarily a bad thing. But with a global market of many millions, the backing for "gaming on Windows" from many PC makers, with more PC download sales, increasing in-game advertizing revenues, etc. it's unlikely that most game developers will ever ignore the PC. They couldn't afford to.

Consoles however, as much as they have their place, probably have a less rosy long-term future than PCs. :rolleyes: Even in a buoyant economy, we're unlikely to ever again see the likes of MS & Sony be prepared to lose billions of $s (in MS's case, some $20 billion on the Xbox franchise) on developing & establishing new console hardware that has a useful life-span of barely 5 years.

[Signal-11]

Furthermore, PC gaming itself has been dying a slow death since the launch of the Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 -- and nowadays most PC games are nothing more than Xbox 360 ports anyway. The studios don't have to fight against illegal copies of their games in the console market, they sell more units and its simply more lucrative to target consoles for them than to target PCs - or the tiny number of Mac gamers.

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games like World of Warcraft and simulations like Civilization are the last domains of the PC, but this could - and probably will - also change.

Man, I've been hearing people bemoaning the death of PC gaming since I was a kid playing Leisure Suit Larry hoping my mom wouldn't catch me.

PC gaming will always be around in on form or another particularly for the absolute cutting edge. This weekend's TF2 updates are a prime example. PC gamers get them, XBOX gamers don't. Part of this is because the XBOX simply can't handle the newest stuff.

Console gaming won't kill PC gaming until console gamers are able to modify their hardware (upgrades) AND software (mods) to meet their demand. And if you're at the point of being able to alter both, this is no longer a console, but a PC.

[neiltc13]

PC gaming itself has been dying a slow death since the launch of the Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 -- and nowadays most PC games are nothing more than Xbox 360 ports anyway. The studios don't have to fight against illegal copies of their games in the console market, they sell more units and its simply more lucrative to target consoles for them than to target PCs - or the tiny number of Mac gamers.

You are kidding yourself if you don't think that piracy is a problem on consoles. Yes, it's not as big a problem as PC, but it is still there.

No copy protection hassles and the stuff always runs flawlessly and beautifully in HD mode (1920x1080).

There are only a handful of Xbox 360 games which run at 1920x1080. The only one I could think of off the top of my head was Virtua Tennis 3 but after a bit of searching I found that there also five others and of those four are arcade titles. The only other disc-based 1080p game is NBA Street Homecourt.

[Dagless]

Man, I've been hearing people bemoaning the death of PC gaming since I was a kid playing Leisure Suit Larry hoping my mom wouldn't catch me.

Oh it happens an awful lot on Mac sites. I find it hilarious too especially when Steam come out and announce another few quadrillion sales from their latest weekend sale or whatever. Of course PC gaming isn't dying, and what some folk fail to realise is that consoles are performing the same as they did last gen - the only anomaly is the Wii, but (as a Wii fan) it's a much more casual based system.

So, the increase in sales of a casual console somehow directly affect the buying habits of hardcore PC gamers. I think this warrants a term I rarely use - lol.

[txa1265]

Furthermore, PC gaming itself has been dying a slow death since the launch of the Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 -- and nowadays most PC games are nothing more than Xbox 360 ports anyway.
I think the simple conclusion is that you have to buy a console when you're serious about games.

Um ... no.

The PC is the biggest single platform for games, and aside from the Wii and DS is the only segment that has grown in the last 2 years.

Also, EA recently called out the PC as the largest and most important and profitable segment.

[Eric5h5]

I think the "PC gaming is dying" thing came from the fact that retail space for PC games has been shrinking for some years in favor of console titles. But that's only because PC games have been moving to online distribution. So of course there aren't so many boxes in stores anymore.

--Eric

[manmeet]

how old are these, i was talking about after CoD4

Nightfire can run on your mac and I don't know about deimos rising but tony hawk pro skater 2 is a good game and run on your mac well!

[txa1265]

I think the "PC gaming is dying" thing came from the fact that retail space for PC games has been shrinking for some years in favor of console titles. But that's only because PC games have been moving to online distribution. So of course there aren't so many boxes in stores anymore.

--Eric

That seems to have changed as well - for a while it seemed that most GameStops had no PC games at all, now I cannot think of the last time I saw one that didn't have more PC space than PSP space. Same for Walmart and Target. Not at the same level as the consoles, that is for sure.

[MrMacMan]

Direct downloading of Games will kill retail. (gamestop, etc).

Steam is convenient and reliable for most people anyway.

The only reason to get a game at a 'store' now a days (and by store i mean amazon) is for additional content, posters, shirt, collectibles.

[Signal-11]

I'm convinced that Steam is the way of the future. It's been what, five years since Steam went online? I've long since lost the physical media for most of my games but for every game I've ever bought through Steam, I can access from any computer. It's nice to be able to build a computer regardless of where you are, load up the Steam client and access your full library of games.

I just wish the PSP would go this way so I wouldn't have to lug around a zillion UMDs.

[nhexima]

Gotta agree, Steam is excellent. Even with the hassle of having to boot to Windows to play the games, I've still bought a ton of stuff in the last year due to the awesome weekend sales and general quality of Valve's games. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like they have any interest in making a platform for the Mac, but right now all we have is GameTree and Greenhouse - and their prices and selection are downright awful in comparison. At least they're growing, though...

[edddeduck]

There is barely a market for games in the Mac ecosystem. And since Macs can now run Windows, the business case for porting games to the Mac has completely vaporized.

This assumes your average Mac users wants to buy a copy of windows and PC games instead of having a native copy. Even if everyone in this forum would Bootcamp your average Mac user will not (my guess). Hell I help make Mac games (and am a gamer) and I dislike dual booting because I loose my OS X email, services etc when in Windows.

Hardcore gamers yeah they will dual boot but lets face it hard core Mac gamers always had a second PC rig anyway all it has done is lower the number of machines in the room!

Overall I think the intel move (and hence bootcamp) brings more positives than negatives even for gaming on the Mac.

Edwin

This is only my personal opinion though...

[Dagless]

And for what its worth; http://www.joystiq.com/2009/05/18/gamerdnas-left-4-dead-stats-reveal-power-of-steam-sales-promot/.
The PC version of L4D is doing rings around the console version. It's only one example mind, but a tremendously good game. And isn't there a game called World of Warcraft that took over the real world?
PC gaming is dying, lol.

[txa1265]

The downside of the whole Digital Download thing is the impact on the Used sale / trade game market.

I am very active on Goozex (game trading) and it is wonderful to be able to play a game like Legacy of Ys on the DS which took a couple dozen hours for me to work through and be completely 'done' with ... then trade it so someone else gets good value, and in exchange I can grab Okami for the Wii for one son and the latest Naruto Wii game which combined were about the same amount of 'points'.

However, under my desk I have a series of games I would *love* to get rid of ... but can't because Steam & Impulse tie things to your account *forever* ... even if you bought retail! Things like Empire: Total War, Last Remnant, Demigod, etc ...

That doesn't even count the digital games - and I have > 50 games on Steam, and loads more on GamersGate, Direct2Drive, EA Store, PopCap, GameAgent, Impulse and who knows where else ...

[Rodus]

There seems to be a growing suspicion on insidemacgames that the next Aspyr port could actually be The Force Unleashed, if this is true then I'll definitely be buying an Aspyr title again.

[Eric5h5]

The downside of the whole Digital Download thing is the impact on the Used sale / trade game market.

Whether it's a downside or an upside depends on if you're a consumer or a developer. ;)

--Eric

[nhexima]

The loss of resale thing bites - that's part of why I won't buy a retail product that has a limited number of required online activations, like Spore and many recent SecuROM titles that phone home.

OTOH, I've never paid more than $10 for a digital download game. (I even purchased Orange Box, retail, for $10) When I can buy a game like Bioshock for $5 on sale, I'm pretty willing to give up those resale rights, especially since I'll be able to reinstall it on any number of machines as long as the company is in business (Steam doesn't look like it's going anywhere for a while).

[neiltc13]

The loss of resale thing bites - that's part of why I won't buy a retail product that has a limited number of required online activations, like Spore and many recent SecuROM titles that phone home.

EA lifted the limits on Spore a LONG time ago.

[Brad Oliver]

After what they did to NWN2, I don't think I'm really interested in buying any of their software.

What did we do to it? If you're talking about the (lack of) patches, know that we have one in the pipe to bring us current with the PC, and we intend to try and stay current after that.

Their COD4 port is so much slower than native Windows version it looks like it was just Ciderized :rolleyes:

We've paid close attention to benchmarks on CoD4 and we appear to be within spitting distance of Windows on most configs (doing a Boot Camp comparison). The BareFeats benchmark testing seems to show this as well, although admittedly some cards/configs underperform vs. BootCamp.

We had a patch not so long ago that increased performance on some Nvidia cards, so grab that if you haven't already.Can you give me some details on your Mac config? Have you been eyeballing performance or have you been running timedemos? if the former, what parts of CoD seem to run worse for you - multiplayer, singleplayer, a specific level or event really chug?

[eXan]

We've paid close attention to benchmarks on CoD4 and we appear to be within spitting distance of Windows on most configs (doing a Boot Camp comparison). The BareFeats benchmark testing seems to show this as well, although admittedly some cards/configs underperform vs. BootCamp.

We had a patch not so long ago that increased performance on some Nvidia cards, so grab that if you haven't already.Can you give me some details on your Mac config? Have you been eyeballing performance or have you been running timedemos? if the former, what parts of CoD seem to run worse for you - multiplayer, singleplayer, a specific level or event really chug?

I have an ATI card, so nvidia patch will do no good. The setup is 2007 alu iMac 2.0 GHz, Radeon 2400 XT and 4 GB RAM. I dont play multiplayer - just the single player campaign and I had to run 800x4xx with everything low-med to get a framerate above 30 most of the time.

Numerous reports say that Windows COD4 runs at 40+ FPS on 9400M at 1280x800 everything near maxed and since 9400M is not that much powerful than my Radeon I wonder if Windows version runs so much better.

By the way, how to run a timedemo? I've tried some commands I googled (timedemo pipeline, etc), but the console always says "no demo file found" or something like that.

There seems to be a growing suspicion on insidemacgames that the next Aspyr port could actually be The Force Unleashed, if this is true then I'll definitely be buying an Aspyr title again.

+1 and lets hope it doesn't run slower than Crysis.

[txa1265]

What did we do to it? If you're talking about the (lack of) patches, know that we have one in the pipe to bring us current with the PC, and we intend to try and stay current after that.

I saw your second post, and honestly had no issue with CoD4 with my unibody Macbook Pro. The Mac / PC Bootcamp comparison feels reasonable for me.

However ... NWN 2 feels like it has a horrific performance gap. Most of that testing I did with an early 2008 MBP (max config).

[Brad Oliver]

Numerous reports say that Windows COD4 runs at 40+ FPS on 9400M at 1280x800 everything near maxed and since 9400M is not that much powerful than my Radeon I wonder if Windows version runs so much better.

I don't believe that to be the case. Some quick googling shows that at 1280x800, the 9400m can't quite manage 30fps and will drop to 11 in some cases:

<http://optimitza.cat/news/2008/10/16/nvidia-geforce-9400m-benchmarks/>

Edit: Huh. That page links to a review that actually benchamrks Mac CoD4 on the 9400M so it's not an accurate Windows benchmark. My google-fu is weak here - I can't find a Windows benchmark of CoD4 on that hardware at all! Any help?

The best way to judge the Mac version is to run Boot Camp on the identical Mac. That said, we are very competitive on ATI cards vs. Windows. In fact, I regularly talk with the manager of ATI's Mac driver group specifically about Mac CoD4 benchmarks and how we can work together to get better performance. ATI is dead-serious about Mac CoD4 performance to the point where I'm a little frightened. ;)

The card we do worst on for the Mac in CoD4 is the GeForce 7xxx series, and that's because we've had to disable a fast path to avoid panicking the Nvidia 7xxx driver. I have some hope Snow Leopard will address this and allow us to turn this path back on, but I don't know yet if that will be true.

By the way, how to run a timedemo? I've tried some commands I googled (timedemo pipeline, etc), but the console always says "no demo file found" or something like that.

You can only run timedemos from the multiplayer app. I don't know if there's a canonical set of files out there, but we have a series of timedemos that run via the ModWarfare mod. I'm not quite sure whether someone just recorded it here and used that or if it was grabbed from somewhere off the internet. I suspect the former. No timedemos actually ship with the game as far as I can tell.

Here's a link with some PC-centric instructions, but with the exception of the Windows-style file path it is identical to how you'd do it on the Mac:

<http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-wargames/161674-how-make-time-demo-cod4.html>

Hope that helps.

However ... NWN 2 feels like it has a horrific performance gap. Most of that testing I did with an early 2008 MBP (max config).

That's one with an Nvidia 8600 in it?

[eXan]

I don't believe that to be the case. Some quick googling shows that at 1280x800, the 9400m can't quite manage 30fps and will drop to 11 in some cases:

<http://optimitza.cat/news/2008/10/16/nvidia-geforce-9400m-benchmarks/>

Edit: Huh. That page links to a review that actually benchamrks Mac CoD4 on the 9400M so it's not an accurate Windows benchmark. My google-fu is weak here - I can't find a Windows benchmark of CoD4 on that hardware at all! Any help?

The best way to judge the Mac version is to run Boot Camp on the identical Mac. That said, we are very competitive on ATI cards vs. Windows. In fact, I regularly talk with the manager of ATI's Mac driver group specifically about Mac CoD4 benchmarks and how we can work together to get better performance. ATI is dead-serious about Mac CoD4 performance to the point where I'm a little frightened. ;)

The card we do worst on for the Mac in CoD4 is the GeForce 7xxx series, and that's because we've had to disable a fast path to avoid panicking the Nvidia 7xxx driver. I have some hope Snow Leopard will address this and allow us to turn this path back on, but I don't know yet if that will be true.



You can only run timedemos from the multiplayer app. I don't know if there's a canonical set of files out there, but we have a series of timedemos that run via the ModWarfare mod. I'm not quite sure whether someone just recorded it here and used that or if it was grabbed from somewhere off the internet. I suspect the former. No timedemos actually ship with the game as far as I can tell.

Here's a link with some PC-centric instructions, but with the exception of the Windows-style file path it is identical to how you'd do it on the Mac:

<http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-wargames/161674-how-make-time-demo-cod4.html>

Hope that helps.

Thank you for the reply :)

I don't have a specific URL to where I saw 40 fps 1280x800 near Max, but I think that's the impression I got from watching YouTube videos with uMBs running COD4 in Bootcamp, and reading threads here like Gaming on 9400m.

Good to know ATI is interested how games run on Macs with their cards :o

[txa1265]

That's one with an Nvidia 8600 in it?

Yes - though the with new one NWN2 *still* feels quite sluggish. It is a matter of NWN2 Mac feeling like it ran better on the Windwos side of a MBP from 2 gens ago than it does on the Mac side of a current one. (always top memory, top vid card)

[alkar]

Brad, I still think it runs faster on 8800GT in Windows... I have both versions of the game and I can do a timedemo + screenshot of the results if you are interested in it... I'll post the results later today...

But for example, the first map in the boat in single player is sometimes crawling at 30fps at the very beginning when dropping the helicopter, while on Windows I remember it was smooth to my eyes (maybe around 50-60fps)....

[Huntn]

Gotta agree, Steam is excellent.

I don't care for Steam. I prefer selling old games when I'm done with them and I believe this is prevented after the game is registered via Steam. no?

[gfoster610]

Woo hoo a Brad Oliver appearance ;)

I'd just like to say thanks Brad for popping into a thread to answer people's concerns in regards to Aspyr games. I know when I was playing Civilization a lot, you were always around the Civ Fanatics boards to help with issues and concerns. It's always nice to see someone who cares about the products he develops :)

[Brad Oliver]

Brad, I still think it runs faster on 8800GT in Windows... I have both versions of the game and I can do a timedemo + screenshot of the results if you are interested in it... I'll post the results later today...

I am interested, but make sure of two things: you're using the same settings and that the Mac version is using the latest patch. Before that, as I hinted earlier, we were way behind on the 8800 vs. Boot Camp. With the patch, we're only behind by a few fps in our internal testing.

[MOFS]

They haven't released any mac games from them for a while, all they keep releasing are pc games.

The other thing that people have hinted at but not explicitly said is that more and more games producers are releasing games simultaneously on the Mac and PC. When I got my iBook, The Sims was an Aspyr port, and Championship Manager 01/02 was a Feral port. Now Sims 3, Spore and Football Manager are released pretty much simultaneously to name a few. Essentially more producers are doing it in house, meaning less opportunity for converters to bring PC games across.

[alkar]

@Brad, i've finally run a timedemo (you can find it with this post) both on OSX 10.5.7 + Windows 7 RC with the same settings (same "players" folder actually) and Windows wins hands down !

Settings were 1280x1024 FSAA 4X + anisotropic 16X + everything else maxed. Patch was the latest 1.7.1 (else fsaa is slow as hell and I can tell you now FSAA hasnt much impact.. maybe 1fps or 2 less)

38.6fps on OSX vs 66.4fps on Windows !

Dunno what internal test you are doing but cod4 windows is really much more optimized.

Here is the link to the demo : http://rapidshare.com/files/235670758/d1.dm_1.zip.html

mirror : http://rapidshare.de/files/47249676/d1.dm_1.zip.html

[Brad Oliver]

Essentially more producers are doing it in house, meaning less opportunity for converters to bring PC games across.

This is true, but the problem we've always had is more games to port than manpower so in a way it's helpful to the Mac community in general that some of these guys are picking up the slack. Consider all the Activision, LucasArts and Take2 titles still out there in need of a Mac home (when it makes sense, of course). There's still plenty out there for the Mac.

@Brad, i've finally run a timedemo (you can find it with this post) both on OSX 10.5.7 + Windows 7 RC with the same settings (same "players" folder actually) and Windows wins hands down !

Settings were 1280x1024 FSAA 4X + anisotropic 16X + everything else maxed. Patch was the latest 1.7.1 (else fsaa is slow as hell and I can tell you now FSAA hasnt much impact.. maybe 1fps or 2 less)

38.6fps on OSX vs 66.4fps on Windows !

Thanks, I grabbed the timedemo. I have one last favor to ask. Can you e-mail me your config.cfg file? On OS X, it's found in "Call of Duty 4 Data/players/profiles/<yourprofilename>/config.cfg". Send it to brad AT aspyr DOT com. That file contains no personal info, just your settings.

For our timedemo testing we actually stick to the default settings to keep things simple (for bulk testing it's a pain to keep altering it), and our performance is pretty much close to even for Windows in those scenarios.

[txa1265]

I don't care for Steam. I prefer selling old games when I'm done with them and I believe this is prevented after the game is registered via Steam. no?

Sadly that is the case ... as it is whenever you buy anything digitally from GamersGate, EA, GameAgent, GameTree, Impulse, Direct2Drive, GameStop Downloads, and so on.

For me, the worst thing is how Impulse & Steam tie your serial number for retail games into your account permanently ... I would love to trade out (via Goozex) Last Remnant, DemiGod, Empire: Total War, Sins of a Solar Empire, GalCiv II, etc ... but I can't. Definitely impacting my game purchases.

[Ol3s]

The other thing that people have hinted at but not explicitly said is that more and more games producers are releasing games simultaneously on the Mac and PC. When I got my iBook, The Sims was an Aspyr port, and Championship Manager 01/02 was a Feral port. Now Sims 3, Spore and Football Manager are released pretty much simultaneously to name a few. Essentially more producers are doing it in house, meaning less opportunity for converters to bring PC games across.

Thats cos spore and sims 3 are ciderised, meaning it wont take as long to port them, while before sims 2 was a native port

Brad Oliver, are there any possible new games that could potentially be ported by aspyr to mac, like modern warfare 2 adn whatnot (hey maybe call of pripyat too)

[Kaketrinsa]

Hi to Brad, and all CoD4-players.

After some excessive testing, I've figured out the (perfect) CoD4-config.
Taking base in max-settings-framerate (with the 1.7.1-update), it improved mine with 80 % (!) while just turning the graphics-quality a liiitle bit down. Hardly recognizable.

Start by turning up all the graphics. Yeah, even the texture quality to max. Then turn off a few options under the pane 'Graphics':
- Anti-Aliasing. This one can be left on if you have a good computer and have the 1.7.1-patch. Not 1.7, but 1.7.1! Turning off will improve framerate with about 10-to-20 %.
- V-Sync. Err... Err... WTF does this even do? Turning off will improve framerate with 20 %.
- Depth of Field. This is the effect that appears when you aim down the sight. It is also the effect that causes a nice chop in your framerate during tight situations. Turn this off for a 10 % fps-increase.
- Soften Smoke Edges. Here it is! The true frame-rate-killer. Turning it off will increase framerate by massively 30 %!

Here are the before and after on the map Bloc. Photos shot at 1920 x 1200 originally.

Maxed out:
http://att.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=179738&stc=1&d=1246266567

My config:
http://att.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=179739&stc=1&d=1246266567

The 80 % increase in fps just as I promised! Roughly, you can say that the config will improve your fps with 50-to-100%, but that depends on the map (and especially the amount of smoke).
The framerates are still veeery depressing, considering I have the 2008 iMac top-specced. The game came out the fall 2007. I also get pass the recommended system-specs on the game-cover.

So... Aspyr... Brad... Time to brighten up the game a little more?
I experience that smoke is the worst thing the frame-rate suffers from. If that's my nVIDIA GF 8800 GS, I don't know, but I think there are a few things you could do to brighten the game up.
Shadows that are cast from buildings are all pixelated, while the ones from characters are nearly perfect. Is there a way to fix that?
I'd rather have one bulletproof port than 50 cider-ports.
I hope I'll see a 1.7.2, or something, after Snow Leopard is released. That update should take full advantage of what the OS offers.
Glad one of you guys from Aspyr came out to the people! MacSoft sucks at that...

[eXan]

Hi to Brad, and all CoD4-players.

After some excessive testing, I've figured out the (perfect) CoD4-config for iMac with GeForce 8800

Fixed. You can't expect turning down options to have the same effect on all systems.

[Brad Oliver]

Brad Oliver, are there any possible new games that could potentially be ported by aspyr to mac, like modern warfare 2 adn whatnot...

There are *always* new games that could potentially be ported by Aspyr. ;)

[Brad Oliver]

So... Aspyr... Brad... Time to brighten up the game a little more?

If by brighten, you mean "increase performance", yes. There are a few things we're looking at for the next patch.

Also, ss someone else noted, the performance increases from tweaking settings will vary depending on what class of video card you are running, so keep that in mind.

[Signal-11]

- V-Sync. Err... Err... WTF does this even do? Turning off will improve framerate with 20 %.


If you don't notice the difference, just leave it off. It's for people who are bothered by the screen tearing issue that can happen when the screen refreshes but received different portions of different frames from the frame buffer.

With vsync on, your graphics card will wait until your monitor is ready for another full frame (which depends on your monitor's refresh rate) and then delivers a full frame and a full frame only. With it off, the card delivers what's in the buffer, which could be half of one frame and half of another, thus making the screen look like it was torn in half then the two halves were moved slightly so they don't line up.

[ltldrummerboy]

I think it's absolutely wonderful that a dev who works on high-profile games is so open. I've come to expect it from small Mac developers like the guys at Agile Web Solutions, but never from a company like Aspyr.

Even if the Mac version of COD4 is slower, I'm buying it to support Mac gaming. Windows will probably always dominate in this area, but I still want to have some kind of a selection for OS X.

[nasabaer]

Hmm would be nice not to wait again 1 year for the mac version of Modern Warfare 2.
This game is nearly a 100% HIT on all systems - so... maybe aspyr could take a look an begin a mac port this time a bit earlier ? :)

[Brad Oliver]

This game is nearly a 100% HIT on all systems - so... maybe aspyr could take a look an begin a mac port this time a bit earlier ? :)

Brilliant! Are you charging a fee for this advice? ;)

Seriously, in most of these cases, the companies aren't ready to talk about Mac ports until after they're done with the lead platforms. In some cases we do start before titles ship, sometimes by months (Civ4 comes to mind) and sometimes just weeks (NWN2 comes to mind, sadly).

[Ol3s]

Brilliant! Are you charging a fee for this advice? ;)

Seriously, in most of these cases, the companies aren't ready to talk about Mac ports until after they're done with the lead platforms. In some cases we do start before titles ship, sometimes by months (Civ4 comes to mind) and sometimes just weeks (NWN2 comes to mind, sadly).

How many people work on one port of a game?

[Brad Oliver]

How many people work on one port of a game?

Do you mean just programming/artwork or including QA and all the other support staff as well?

For programming, it varies on the complexity of the code. Some games are one-man jobs, others more depending.

[Ol3s]

Do you mean just programming/artwork or including QA and all the other support staff as well?

For programming, it varies on the complexity of the code. Some games are one-man jobs, others more depending.

I meant all of it, from the beginning to the end.

One man? Well, then how many people did it take for CoD 4, I am just curious about the whole process.

[gregorsamsa]

There are *always* new games that could potentially be ported by Aspyr. ;)

Whilst Feral add some final touches to "Rome: Total War" & presumably may want to follow that up with "Medieval 2", how about you guys trying to bring "Empire: TW" to Mac? Now that most of the bugs in the PC version are known about, a Mac version from Aspyr could prove to be superlative. :)

[Brad Oliver]

One man? Well, then how many people did it take for CoD 4, I am just curious about the whole process.

With the caveat that I was at Apple during most of CoD4, my understanding is that the dev was done by i5works (we outsourced it) which is AFAIK 2 developers. We then had our QA team, one of our developers on hand to assist, an artist and a producer (who keeps the spice flowing).

[iAlexG]

The COD4 Port is slow but I still find myself buying their games. On its way now is Quake Wars.

[lewdvig]

After what they did to NWN2, I don't think I'm really interested in buying any of their software.

Is it taboo to discuss community cider ports here?

There is a port of the PC version with expansions. Oblivion too.

It takes a bit of work, but its not too hard to figure out. PC games are cheap, these hacks make them work on teh Mac.

http://notebookcritic.com/2009/04/18/recently-switched-to-mac-have-some-old-windows-games-you-love/

[lewdvig]

Thank you for the reply :)

I don't have a specific URL to where I saw 40 fps 1280x800 near Max, but I think that's the impression I got from watching YouTube videos with uMBs running COD4 in Bootcamp, and reading threads here like Gaming on 9400m.

Good to know ATI is interested how games run on Macs with their cards :o

The 2400xt is an extremely weak card and you must have imagined seeing the 9400m play CoD4 at 40fps on max settings:

http://notebookcritic.com/2008/12/19/review-apple-macbook-late-2008/

It barely get that at 12*8 low settings.

It's not Aspyr's fault the 2400xt sucks in demanding games. I have one too. It sucks.

[edit] I keep finding this thread on google and reviving it - sorry.

I was trying to determine if Force Unleashed was ciderized or native.

[edddeduck]

the 2400xt sucks in demanding games. I have one too. It sucks.

At least it is not a NV 7000 series, shudders the amount of QA time we spend on that series getting the speed acceptable.... In comparison the 2400 is not to bad at all.

[lewdvig]

The last thing that I want to do is antagonize Aspyr - we don't have many Mac game devs left.

I do wish they would have sales though. I buy several D2D or Steam games every week when they are on sale.