TomTom and Navigon Bringing Turn-by-Turn GPS Car Navigation to iPhone

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/06/09/tomtom-and-navigon-bringing-turn-by-turn-gps-car-navigation-to-iphone/)

One of the featured demos at Apple's Worldwide Developers Conference keynote on Monday was TomTom for iPhone (http://iphone.tomtom.com/), a forthcoming turn-by-turn GPS navigation solution. Turn-by-turn car navigation has been a highly anticipated function for the iPhone whose deployment has been delayed in part by numerous hurdles imposed by Apple's SDK terms and restrictions from map providers on the use of their data. Several major vendors have been promising that they are working on such projects, with a small handful of applications even having been released (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/02/19/turn-by-turn-iphone-gps-app-already-available-in-itunes/).

TomTom last year asserted (http://www.macrumors.com/iphone/2008/06/10/tomtom-navigation-software-coming-to-iphone/) at the time of the iPhone 3G launch that it was working on developing turn-by-turn navigation, with additional confirmation (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/08/15/turn-by-turn-gps-for-iphone-coming/) coming several months later. According to this week's keynote demo and an associated announcement (http://iphone.tomtom.com/announcement.html), TomTom's offerings, which will include both the software app and a hardware "car kit", will become available following the launch of iPhone OS 3.0 next week. Pricing has yet to be announced.The TomTom solution combines two new TomTom products to provide users with state of the art in-car navigation on their iPhone 3G:

- The TomTom navigation application for iPhone; an Apple version of TomTom's award-winning turn-by-turn navigation software, including IQ Routes and latest maps from Tele Atlas;

- The TomTom car kit for iPhone; a specially developed car kit for secure docking, enhanced GPS performance, clear voice instructions, hands-free calling and in-car charging.TomTom has also released a brief promotional video demonstrating the hardware setup and providing a glimpse at the software interface:



Article Link: TomTom and Navigon Bringing Turn-by-Turn GPS Car Navigation to iPhone (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/06/09/tomtom-and-navigon-bringing-turn-by-turn-gps-car-navigation-to-iphone/)

[iGary]

I'm in, as long as the price isn't over $100.00 for the app and the mount.

[milbournosphere]

I'm glad to see NAVIGON is in on this. I use their regular GPS systems, and am pretty happy with their navigation. I wonder if they will try to incorporate traffic navigation into their app as well...

[Diode]

I'm in, as long as the price isn't over $100.00 for the app and the mount.

Same as above. Any word on pricing?

[ortuno2k]

I'm in, as long as the price isn't over $100.00 for the app and the mount.

Same. But I doubt the price would be so low...

[jsdc2005]

I've never seen navigon in real life, but their nav display looks amazing.

[Ross123]

Think this is a brilliant feature to have on the iPhone :D, just hope its not really expensive!

[Rodimus Prime]

To bad that it is Tom Tom. Garmain routing is better in the US.

Multiple test I have read report the exact same thing.

In the US Garmain has the best routing
In Europe Tom Tom has the best routing

[TheWarIsNotOver]

Buy TomTom XD

[Harun]

If we have this much hype about it and no price it means it is going to be expensive.

I bet $199.

[nkawtg72]

it definitely stands to be one of the more, if not most, expensive apps currently on App Store..

[zombitronic]

I wish that either Google Earth supported directions, or Google Maps could give you that angled view. As long as they both support compass data, there would be no need for these 3rd party apps.

[AdeFowler]

I wonder why the Tom Tom adaptor provides enhanced GPS… does the new iPhone need it or just those without the compass I wonder?

[mrklaw]

No news on an ipod touch version? Many many more of those than iphones, and I expect many people would upgrade to an ipod touch for good, fully featured apps like this.

And with the new OS 3.0 offering bluetooth peripheral support, they could sell a little bluetooth GPS that sits in the mounting cradle, or be compatible with existing bluetooth GPS units

[sneakyob]

What ever happened to TeleNav in this space? Didn't they talk about building an app like they do for other smart phones? I am surprised that they have not done a press release by now.

[happydude]

so glad this is coming, but shudder at the potential price. ah well. it'll be cool, though to be able to use the iphone for real navigation programs!!!

[HailToTheVictor]

Base package $49.99 and additional add-ons $19.99. No one would touch this for $100.00, especially without the base...$89.99

[JMax1]

Wonder if they are able to do cell triangulation for non 3G users....?

[PlaceofDis]

as long as it isn't ridiculously expensive i'll get it as other have said, but being hush on the pricing so far makes it not look so good.

[Planet Telex]

I just checked the tom tom store and pda maps are $70 US.

Considering that the mount charges the phone, I doubt it will be less than $30.

This makes it very likely that to get both will be over $100, unless they are willing to have a low price in order to increase volume.

My guess is $70 minimum for the software, $50 min for the mount.

[Planet Telex]

Base package $49.99 and additional add-ons $19.99. No one would touch this for $100.00, especially without the base...$89.99

Is this just a guess?

[Doctor Q]

Will the compass in the 3G S make any difference to navigation software, or does it make no difference as long as you are moving?

[BornAgainMac]

Integrated SMS and MMS* texting during navigation using a split screen mode would be cool.





* MMS not supported by AT&T until the end of the summer of 2009.

[str1f3]

I'm in, as long as the price isn't over $100.00 for the app and the mount.

Agreed. Also I hope that mount is good and it doesn't constantly drop off the window.:eek:

[nkawtg72]

Wonder if they are able to do cell triangulation for non 3G users....?

as i understand, the Tom Tom app would simply be getting the devices location from the Location API. this API gathers information from Edge/3G triangulation, WiFi proximity, and GPS.

GPS, is the only service which would provide Lat Long coordinates though that the Tom Tom app would depend on. The other services are not accurate enough for that.

My guess would be no, it would require at the very least the GPS receiver which is only in the iPhone 3G/3GS.

Tom Tom could provide an external GPS antenna now that it is allowed by the SDK

[halhiker]

What I'd really like to see is a hiking app with topo maps. I don't need a car GPS. The only benefit to me is knowing how long it will be to get somewhere. That silences the kids and their constant "When are we going to get there?" whining.

What I'd really like, though, is a GPS unit with topographical maps for hiking. I do a LOT of cross country travel and it would be really nice to know where I am sometimes.:D

[NAG]

Will the compass in the 3G S make any difference to navigation software, or does it make no difference as long as you are moving?

It might make a difference if you're moving slowly, say walking speed (geocaching apps are a good example here). Otherwise it should have a pretty good idea which direction you're pointing.

[nefan65]

I would pay more than $80/US. I can get a Garmin Nuvi 255 for $189/US. Why would I spend that much, or more for downloadable app and a base? No way...

[DipDog3]

What Happens when I Get a Phone Call in the middle of Directions???

[dvkid]

Integrated SMS and MMS* texting during navigation using a split screen mode would be cool.

It won't be long before we see more states outlawing texting while driving. Not to mention that even if its legal, it ain't exactly safe.

[newyorkone]

...is that it will be a monthly service fee model, but it will include internet based traffic info that is similar to the now defunct Dash hardware.

Speaking of Dash, they were supposedly trying to enter the PDA GPS app market. I wonder if they are trying to port to the iphone???

[syklee26]

it's amazing how American GPS manufacturers can successfully run a business when Asian countries, such as Korea, provide amazing Nav system for the same price.

such as this
http://gpsobsessed.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/easycar-ktshow.jpg

it's like charging same price for ibook g3 and unibody macbook pro.

[timish]

My big question is how are they going to prevent the Iphone from shutting down from the heat?

When a device is on the dashboard or attached to the windshield, it gets very very hot from the sun.

My Iphone has shut down automatically when I've driven in hot weather with the top down in traffic.

It simply overheats and turns itself off.

Hopefully this problem has been resolved with these GPS solutions.

[nosaj72]

Speaking of Dash, they were supposedly trying to enter the PDA GPS app market. I wonder if they are trying to port to the iphone???

Dash just got bought by RIM, so i'm guess no iphone port.

[Parky]

I wonder why the Tom Tom adaptor provides enhanced GPS… does the new iPhone need it or just those without the compass I wonder?

It just means it has a better antenna built into the holder for picking up the signal with the iPhone in the car.

[scootaru]

the possiblities are endless...traffic, accident alerts, weather advisories, super-imposed weather radar...can't wait to see the options.

[Chaos123x]

Is Garmin making a app? If so I will wait for them.

If not I will buy this.


Been waiting forever for this, it's the only reason I upgraded to the 3G iPhone, who knew it would take this long to get a GPS program, using google maps while driving is like a accident waiting to happen.

[pj rage]

I've been dying for a tom-tom/garmin/magellan/etc type navigator, but for more than $50 they can forget it. I don't care about the mount or anything. If the software is $20 or less, I'll buy it right away. Between $20 and $50, if the reviews come in positive I'll likely grab it. At more than $50 for just the software, I'll stick with google maps. Hopefully google or someone else comes out with something free or inexpensive that is just like xgps is now, which works perfectly fine for what I need.

These companies need to realize that it's not like we have NOTHING right now, I mean, google maps can get the job done, mostly. Sure it's not the best thing going, and a complete PITA to use to navigate you, but it's an alternative, and it's free. For people who just need nav one in a while, like me, I'm not going to shell out for new software. Besides, we can go buy standalone GPS units for close to what you guys are estimating this app might cost... And that won't eat up a ton of my phone's memory. If they try to charge too much, not only are not that many people going to buy it, but it damn well better work PERFECTLY, never crash, great accuracy, etc, etc, and generally work just like a good standalone in the same price range would. Somehow I don't see that happening, at least not on the 3G platform. Maybe on the 3GS platform?

[Parky]

Wonder if they are able to do cell triangulation for non 3G users....?

It has nothing to do with 3G, it uses Satellite signals for the GPS!

[lemmas]

No news on an ipod touch version? Many many more of those than iphones, and I expect many people would upgrade to an ipod touch for good, fully featured apps like this.

How is this going to work on a touch?

[JimAtLaw]

Integrated SMS and MMS* texting during navigation using a split screen mode would be cool.

* MMS not supported by AT&T until the end of the summer of 2009.

You mean "MMS not supported until some point in the indefinite future by AT&pple."

In any event, I'll be very curious to see how this works - the GPS in the 3G gets disoriented and is often off by a block or more, this will not work for turn by turn without hardware changes.

[LethalWolfe]

I'm very interested in the price point as well as I'm trying to decide between a Pre and an iPhone and GPS is high on my list of what I want.


Lethal

[cawesjmu]

What Happens when I Get a Phone Call in the middle of Directions???

I was wondering the same thing. I'm sure it won't be able to block the call so it can continue navigating. I don't know. Maybe with background notifications it'll beep at you while you're talking on the phone to let you know you're about to miss your turn.

[mobilehavoc]

What happens if you're using TomTom on iPhone and you get a phone call?? No more Nav for you :D

[brop52]

Buy the TomTom One 130 (http://www.amazon.com/TomTom-ONE-3-5-Inch-Navigator-Refurbished/dp/B001OAT9M0/ref=pd_cp_e_1) (for $49 after $20 rebate) or the TomTom One 130S (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001OAT9MU/ref=ox_ya_oh_product) ($69.99 after $20 rebate) refurbished units on Amazon and save your money for the likely very overpriced app. Do you really want to leave your iPhone in the sun on the dashboard anyway for extended periods of time?

Though looking back at the Amazon pages, they seem to have stopped the rebate on the 130 model for some reason but it still seems to be on for the 130S.

[mschwartz]

More info here:

http://blog.telenav.com/blog/2009/06/telenav-iphone-update/

I also agree with the speculation that this would be a monthly subscription, much like TeleNav and the re-branded AT&T Navigator apps are today.

It makes much more sense if you consider that the maps are downloaded live over the air when are you create a new route. The entire atlas is not stored on the phone. Thus, you are getting new maps as the central database is updated. No need for expensive annual updates as is the case with stand-alone GPS devices now. You also get traffic and other services, for which again, a subscription based business model makes sense.

[gnasher729]

I wish that either Google Earth supported directions, or Google Maps could give you that angled view. As long as they both support compass data, there would be no need for these 3rd party apps.

The problem is that Google doesn't own the maps, they are licensed. And the licensor would want a lot more money off Google if Google Earth or Google Maps could do what you want them to do.

[VTECaddict]

so it is going to pull map data from the internet as it goes, or are users going to have to download a few gigs worth of maps at app purchase? :confused:

[bretm]

I've been dying for a tom-tom/garmin/magellan/etc type navigator, but for more than $50 they can forget it. I don't care about the mount or anything. If the software is $20 or less, I'll buy it right away. Between $20 and $50, if the reviews come in positive I'll likely grab it. At more than $50 for just the software, I'll stick with google maps. Hopefully google or someone else comes out with something free or inexpensive that is just like xgps is now, which works perfectly fine for what I need.

These companies need to realize that it's not like we have NOTHING right now, I mean, google maps can get the job done, mostly. Sure it's not the best thing going, and a complete PITA to use to navigate you, but it's an alternative, and it's free. For people who just need nav one in a while, like me, I'm not going to shell out for new software. Besides, we can go buy standalone GPS units for close to what you guys are estimating this app might cost... And that won't eat up a ton of my phone's memory. If they try to charge too much, not only are not that many people going to buy it, but it damn well better work PERFECTLY, never crash, great accuracy, etc, etc, and generally work just like a good standalone in the same price range would. Somehow I don't see that happening, at least not on the 3G platform. Maybe on the 3GS platform?

They'll try something high until there is lack of sales or competition. Just like all the games in the app store were $10 for the first month or so until everyone found you could make more money on volume by dishing them out for a dollar or two.

My guess is it will end up around $10-$20. There will be multiple versions with different features and scaling prices in the future. Just like the physical devices.

If it's going to be anywhere near $100 I'll go buy a much better, bigger one for (and NOT TomTom at that) at costco or something for sub $100. Has anyone checked out the current price of these things lately? Dropping like rocks. They keep coming out with bigger screens, or fancy features you don't need and charge hundreds. But the base models are $100.

[Berek]

The only question I had was how you were going to be able to keep the iphone charged while using it. Having the Base charge the iphone answered that.

I'm still curious about getting calls while navigating as well.

[thecritix]

I think you're all missing the point.

this will add huge functionality to your gps.

Push notifications for traffic, mobile speed cameras, over the air updates of speed cameras.

IQ routes.

All rolled into one handy package.

I would pay up to probably £49.99 and expect £19.99 for the mount.

I agree if the mount falls off the screen onto my hard gear knob I'd be pissed..

[copydeskcat]

How will the 3G iPhone know which direction you're facing - or does that mainly kick in when you start moving?

[bretm]

You mean "MMS not supported until some point in the indefinite future by AT&pple."

In any event, I'll be very curious to see how this works - the GPS in the 3G gets disoriented and is often off by a block or more, this will not work for turn by turn without hardware changes.

No, that was an exact quote from the Apple website. End of summer 2009. It shows that when you're ordering your phone.

[gnasher729]

I wonder why the Tom Tom adaptor provides enhanced GPS… does the new iPhone need it or just those without the compass I wonder?

TomTom has always worked fine without a compass - except when you leave from home and it can't tell you whether you should turn left or right, because without a compass it doesn't know in what direction you are pointing until you start driving (and then it guesses that you are not driving backward :D ) At that point you have to check its map and can't rely on voice instructions.

An adapter that includes a GPS receiver would be great for the 20 million or so iPod Touch users.

[twoodcc]

i'm glad to finally see this, but i probably won't buy the car mount. i already have gps indash in my truck. but it would be nice to have turn by turn in my pocket, wherever i go

[JimAtLaw]

No, that was an exact quote from the Apple website. End of summer 2009. It shows that when you're ordering your phone.

'Cause, you know, companies like AT&T never miss their deadlines. :rolleyes:

[bbplayer5]

Garmin is better than anyone. Ill wait for them but this is a good step!

[samab]

it's amazing how American GPS manufacturers can successfully run a business when Asian countries, such as Korea, provide amazing Nav system for the same price.

And the first thing that jumps out of the picture is the name of the device --- KT Show Wibro. KT controls 90% of Korea's fixed line telephone, 43% of broadband, 31% of mobile telephone. It's a loss leader to sell you their Wibro (Korean version of WiMax) service. That GPS will need a monthly subscription service to their wimax network.

[bbplayer5]

How will the 3G iPhone know which direction you're facing - or does that mainly kick in when you start moving?

You answered your own question. It sees which way you are heading.

[DELLsFan]

I. Want. This. Now.

Thank you, TomTom!

:D

[f8l0e]

It has nothing to do with 3G, it uses Satellite signals for the GPS!

I'm sure that he knew that. The 1st generation iPhone didn't have built in GPS. I believe he was referring to 1st gen owners, aka non 3G users.

[nep61]

If we have this much hype about it and no price it means it is going to be expensive.

I bet $199.

True, it'll probably be steep. However, only about 4 years ago I bought the Tom Tom GPS software for the US (on an SD card), a windshield mount, a car charger for my Palm Treo 650 and the small square-ish GPS unit... (I'm still using it)... the whole package was $169 if I remember correctly.

I'm guessing that the Tom Tom GPS for iPhone will probably be $99 through the App store, and they'll have to give buyers a code of some sort to use to acquire the GPS unit / Windshield mount.... OR would you buy the GPS unit in stores and use a code to download the software.

This seems to be the only, if not one of a select few, Apps which requires a separate piece of hardware to run it.

[zacman]

Pricing for Navigon will probably be the same as for the other mobile versions:

Between 99 € (around 140 USD) for the standard version and 149€ (around 210 USD) for the version including 2 years free updates of the maps.

TomTom will probably be 79 EUR (110 USD) which is also the same price as their other mobile phone versions.

[NightStorm]

True, it'll probably be steep. However, only about 4 years ago I bought the Tom Tom GPS software for the US (on an SD card), a windshield mount, a car charger for my Palm Treo 650 and the small square-ish GPS unit... (I'm still using it)... the whole package was $169 if I remember correctly.

I'm guessing that the Tom Tom GPS for iPhone will probably be $99 through the App store, and they'll have to give buyers a code of some sort to use to acquire the GPS unit / Windshield mount.... OR would you buy the GPS unit in stores and use a code to download the software.

This seems to be the only, if not one of a select few, Apps which requires a separate piece of hardware to run it.
It doesn't require a separate piece of hardware... but it will use the GPS chip/antenna built into the mount if it is available.

[jmpage2]

I think you're all missing the point.

this will add huge functionality to your gps.

Push notifications for traffic, mobile speed cameras, over the air updates of speed cameras.

IQ routes.

All rolled into one handy package.

I would pay up to probably £49.99 and expect £19.99 for the mount.

I agree if the mount falls off the screen onto my hard gear knob I'd be pissed..

I don't think we know yet whether in fact we will get traffic, etc, through this service.

I am very interested to know if traffic, etc, will be proviced and how well navigation will work if you don't use the cradle (I already have good mounting solutions in both of my vehicles that I use my iphone in).

I also think that Tom Tom is going to milk this for everything they can get out of it. $99 for the application and you will have to pay annually for map data updates. The hardware cradle will go for another cool $199 or you can get both together for $149.

I don't expect them to pull ANY punches on pricing until suitable competition is on the scene.

[jholzner]

No news on an ipod touch version? Many many more of those than iphones, and I expect many people would upgrade to an ipod touch for good, fully featured apps like this.

And with the new OS 3.0 offering bluetooth peripheral support, they could sell a little bluetooth GPS that sits in the mounting cradle, or be compatible with existing bluetooth GPS units

Until the iPod touch gets GPS this wouldn't work on one anyway.

[mattster16]

I held off on buying a GPS earlier this year because I had a feeling this would happen with the new iPhone.

I'm also glad to hear Garmin is also releasing an app, the more choices the better!

[Deefuzz]

I am looking forward to this, just hope it doesn't cost a crap ton.

[organerito]

I hope they build a gps accessory for those of us who have an iPod Touch.

[coasterswim]

You people would pay $100 for a navigation app? Are you serious? The Garmin nüvi 265WT (widescreen, text-to-speech, lifetime traffic) was $130 yesterday... for the entire device!

http://forums.slickdeals.net/showthread.php?t=1391981

[NightStorm]

I hope they build a gps accessory for those of us who have an iPod Touch.

It should be able to communicate with the GPS chip/antenna (if this is indeed true... I've seen it reported in a few places now) in the TomTom car mount.

[convergent]

Its comical that this is presented as "much anticipated" as if Tom-Tom is doing something that is a breakthrough here. I'm sure what they produce will work well, but I've been doing "turn by turn" navigation on my iPhone 3G for several months with G-Map. Its actually quite good and I could continue to be happy using it if anything better never came along, especially for the low $29 price. The mount that Tom-Tom has does look like a winner if it works the way they are saying it does.

[jhsfosho]

The mount is pretty cool in combination for turn-by-turn GPS navigation.

[kiranmk2]

I can see them using the new in-app purchasing feature with this one. You simply buy the program from the app store for about £20-30 and then pay through the nose for the maps. They may even give away the program for free. Single cities for cheap (£5 each) - remember TomTom 7 came bundled with some HTC phones and had a free city map, £50 for a state/country (ie england), £70 for a big country (ie half USA or UK & NI) and £99 for more (ie all USA or all of Western Europe).

[w00master]

Is Garmin making a app? If so I will wait for them.

If not I will buy this.


Been waiting forever for this, it's the only reason I upgraded to the 3G iPhone, who knew it would take this long to get a GPS program, using google maps while driving is like a accident waiting to happen.

I have my doubts on Garmin delving in to the iPhone. Hopefully, I'm wrong, but the reason why I think that they won't is b/c they're coming out with a mobile phone.

w00master

[Jonny75]

You people would pay $100 for a navigation app? Are you serious? The Garmin nüvi 265WT (widescreen, text-to-speech, lifetime traffic) was $130 yesterday... for the entire device!

http://forums.slickdeals.net/showthread.php?t=1391981

This is a big app, but to sell it combined with the mount for any more than their cheapest TomTom model makes no sense to the consumer.**

As for handling phone-calls in the car, well, most cars have Bluetooth now (and that's what you should be using in your car anyway) so it'll work in the usual fashion. Many TomTom machines handle calls too.


**Although that doesn't stop some!

[kobefanatic2289]

Sorry, noob question here. Will you need a data plan/3G service for this GPS to work? which services are required here if there are any?

[Jonny75]

More info here:

http://blog.telenav.com/blog/2009/06/telenav-iphone-update/

It makes much more sense if you consider that the maps are downloaded live over the air when are you create a new route.

So sat-navs don't work when you are outwith 3G signal or even EDGE?

Imagine taking your car across Europe and using the TomTom app. Your way, you'll be downloading maps across (several) mobile operators using roaming data charges for each routing procedure. Do you know how much that costs? TomTom is a European company and understand this.

It is likely you'll buy an in app year subscription that will update roads/spped cameras etc yearly.

[scottrob]

My Garmin gets very warm sitting on the dash while operating. I wonder if the TomTom will provide some heat shielding or if it is a non issue.

[Youngy]

I wonder why the Tom Tom adaptor provides enhanced GPS… does the new iPhone need it or just those without the compass I wonder?

My thoughts too..

"the TomTom car kit, that offers enhanced GPS reception"

How exactly?

[vbui26]

I wish that either Google Earth supported directions, or Google Maps could give you that angled view. As long as they both support compass data, there would be no need for these 3rd party apps.

i agree. ive used tom tom and garmin gps and they always tend to show me longer ways to get to places. but when i use google maps, the directions are much more accurate. google should come out with their own gps systems!! or other gps systems should use google maps as data..

[mschwartz]

So sat-navs don't work when you are outwith 3G signal or even EDGE?

Don't be daft.

Imagine taking your car across Europe and using the TomTom app. Your way, you'll be downloading maps across (several) mobile operators using roaming data charges for each routing procedure. Do you have a clue how much that costs? TomTom is a European company and understand this.

It is likely you'll buy an in app year subscription that will update roads/spped cameras etc yearly.

I was not talking about Europe, with which I have no experience using the TeleNav app (or anywhere outside the U.S. for that matter). While I have travelled extensively outside the U.S., I don't use a GPS unit when doing so. I am typically on business, where I am going from airport to hotel to meeting, using local transportation (bus, taxi, train, etc.).

I was discussing the current model by which TeleNav offers their GPS application for WinMobile and Blackberry, which is a monthly subscription ($10 / month) model.

Yes, the maps are downloaded live over the air using the data service. Yes, the traffic information is download live over the air using the data service. Same with searches and so forth.

I cannot speak to whether Tom-Tom, Garmin or for that matter, even TeleNav's iPhone application will utilize the same approach or, given the much larger internal storage of the iPhone, will enable you to store the entire atlas on the device.

I was, as are others, simply speculating based upon existing experience and a certain amount logic, at least here in the U.S. There may be other approaches that will make sense outside the U.S. Sure, if roaming costs with data plans are going to substantially increase the expense, then this model does not make sense in that environment. However, at minimum, you are going to need some type of live data service for traffic, if that is of interest.

Oh...and BTW, yes, one potential deficiency in the TeleNav model is that you do lose access to maps and directions, if you are outside the service area. My experience is that this has been a non-issue. More often, especially in poor weather, I loose the GPS signal, not the AT&T data signal. Thus, I lose current location and directions until I get acquisition of the satellites back.

Lastly, for those of us in Minnesota, the windshield mount is illegal. You cannot mount anything above the dashboard here. I think that we may be the only state with this issue. Thus, I have a mount that clips to one of the air vents so that the top of the mount and phone are below the top of the level of the dashboard. Hence, at least here, the Tom-Tom mount will be problematic.

Such is life...

[ratGT]

This is all good news, at last, yippie, hurray, way to go, etc. ...

But, FOR WHAT COUNTRIES WILL MAPS BE AVAILABLE FOR!?!?!?
For God's sake, we have waited a respectful amount of time for a release-date while standing in the dark. Now we clearly understood that all this was withheld information so it would be one of the main elements on the Keynote presentation. But COULDN'T they AT LEAST justify all this waiting by bringing on more specific details! I mean, Apple's presentation did not include all the details which we are reading these following days (ex. better fingerprint-resistance, better processor & RAM, etc.), but at least they give you clues to follow, third-party pages and MOST importantly release-dates across the world. As for Tom Tom, all we know is that... it coming along new iPhone's release... Nough said!... :eek: How rude & irresponsible!!! :mad:

[JMax1]

It has nothing to do with 3G, it uses Satellite signals for the GPS!

i know thaaaaat I was just meaning the 3G phone and that it has the GPS whereas the non3G phones do not.

If you knock on my head it makes a soft sound. I'm not that dense

[shiseiryu1]

I wonder if the TomTom app will let you play music from your library while it's navigating...that would be really neat and would make sense.

[Braindead360]

Full TomTom Application will probably be $39.99, while the official TomTom Dock will probably be $49.99. What do you guys think?

[NightStorm]

I wonder if the TomTom app will let you play music from your library while it's navigating...that would be really neat and would make sense.

They made a reference during the keynote that this would be possible.

[inferno10]

Let's not forget the folks over at XRoad. They have had GPS turn-by-turn navigation on the iPhone, even before firmware 3.0 was announced! I use their G-Map US West app all the time, and it navigates me just fine. Plus, they separate US between West and East, so I only paid something like $25 for the app.

I stumbled upon a YouTube vid of their next version, which will also have voice turn-by-turn. But they seem to trump TomTom's app by also offering spoken street names!

Watch the preview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urwfnMZmrs4

[Dagless]

I'm all for this. I'll certainly get it, our Tom Tom 910 never let us down - the software is just superb. The OSX of the GPS world!
If that translates well to the iPhone they have a definite customer here.

[NateOMatic]

You'll notice that when Apple first announces turn-by-turn apps in the keynote address, the screenshot shown is not from TomTom but from the already-existing GMap program, the only currently available turn-by-turn app (although they call it a "game feature" in v1.3 to get around the restriction). Perhaps a tacit acknowledgement on Apple's part of the drama surrounding that app?

FWIW, expect an update of GMap, returning to full turn-by-turn functionality with the release of 3.0.

[Rootus]

$50 or less and I'm interested. At the $100 price point I'd just spend the extra $20 and get another Garmin.

[nsayer]

My thoughts too..

"the TomTom car kit, that offers enhanced GPS reception"

How exactly?

Through the dock connector.

Recall that iPhone OS 3.0 allows developers to do hardware accessories. The TomTom dock is one such device. It has, apparently, a better GPS receiver built-in. I suspect it will also support folks using the iPhone 1G which has no built-in GPS at all. Perhaps even iPod touch users - so long as all the maps are loaded in at start-up rather than streamed, there's no reason a GPS navigator needs to be online.

[Goona]

No news on an ipod touch version? Many many more of those than iphones, and I expect many people would upgrade to an ipod touch for good, fully featured apps like this.

And with the new OS 3.0 offering bluetooth peripheral support, they could sell a little bluetooth GPS that sits in the mounting cradle, or be compatible with existing bluetooth GPS units

Who told you there are more ipod touches than iphones?

[forty2j]

You people would pay $100 for a navigation app? Are you serious? The Garmin nüvi 265WT (widescreen, text-to-speech, lifetime traffic) was $130 yesterday... for the entire device!

http://forums.slickdeals.net/showthread.php?t=1391981

The reason many of us ARE iPhone users is because we don't believe we should have to own 10 pieces of hardware in order to get 10 services. There's a distinct advantage in letting your one master device do everything. (There's also a disadvantage, in that you're completely SOL if your one device breaks, but many of us assume that will never happen. :D)

Assuming there's a traffic feature, I'd pay up to $100 for this.

[wonderbread57]

I hope that TomTom dock actually takes advantage of more than just powering the iPhone and lets you tab into it's audio output, preferably digital output.

[theBB]

My thoughts too..

"the TomTom car kit, that offers enhanced GPS reception"

How exactly?
My guess: By placing it very close to windshield, so that the roof of the car blocks fewer satellite. I'd think those that expect an antenna or some other high tech gadget in the mount will be sorely disappointed. If there was a real technical aspect to it, they would have emphasized it.

[slimpunk]

But isn't it illegal to have a windshield mount in California?

If so, hopefully they offer a dashboard option.

[NateOMatic]

Let's not forget the folks over at XRoad. They have had GPS turn-by-turn navigation on the iPhone, even before firmware 3.0 was announced! I use their G-Map US West app all the time, and it navigates me just fine. Plus, they separate US between West and East, so I only paid something like $25 for the app.

I stumbled upon a YouTube vid of their next version, which will also have voice turn-by-turn. But they seem to trump TomTom's app by also offering spoken street names!

Watch the preview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urwfnMZmrs4

Thanks for that, it looks great! Also check out the first minute or so of his v1.3 review. It explains what happened with this app regarding violation of the turn-by-turn restriction.

Basically, GMap v1.2 was a full-featured navigation app, and this was the version that disappeared from iTunes for a while until they could negotiate a compromise with Apple. The compromise was v1.3, where a "game feature" gives you an audible tone as you collect "random" prize objects. Just so happens those always fall right before you have to make a turn. The tradeoff was losing the individual turn icons with distance remaining.

Few people prefer v1.3, and GMap's website pretty much discourages you from downloading the update if you like v1.2 (a true turn-by-turn version). GMap support told me the same in an e-mail, that 1.3 was only a temporary version until iPhone 3.0 is released. Glad to see that the superior features of v1.2 will be returning in the next update, plus much-requested improvements like landscape mode and voice prompts!

This program also uses NAVTEQ map data, which gives it another edge over TomTom (which, like Google, uses TeleAtlas). I also will be curious whether TomTom's price point is competitive with GMap's, which when I purchased was $39.98 for the whole US (currently $49.98).

[Andrew K.]

I think $29.99 for the App and $19.99 for the mount, TomTom will make a fortune out of us :D

[mschwartz]

But isn't it illegal to have a windshield mount in California?

If so, hopefully they offer a dashboard option.


California's law changed back in January. You can mount GPS devices on the windshield, but with restrictions on where. See this:

http://blog.telenav.com/blog/2008/09/california-oks-gps-mounts-on-windshields-kind-of/

The keys, as I understand them, for both the MN and CA laws are issues pertaining to obstructed vision and also potentially interfering with the function of air bags.

[Doctor Q]

But isn't it illegal to have a windshield mount in California?

If so, hopefully they offer a dashboard option.

If I remember correctly, since January 1 California allows GPS mounting within a 5-inch square area in the lower corner on the driver's side or a 7-inch square area in the lower corner on the passenger's side.

[mr.stinki]

Or they can sell the app for like $30 without any maps which you can buy per state for like $15 or whatever.

[w00master]

But isn't it illegal to have a windshield mount in California?

If so, hopefully they offer a dashboard option.

It's a sticky & suction cup. So, it'll work on a dash as well.

[jmpage2]

I think $29.99 for the App and $19.99 for the mount, TomTom will make a fortune out of us :D

If the crippled Slingplayer is going for $30 then you can bet your ass that Tom Tom is going to cost a helluva lot more.

This whole $30 and $50 pricing talk is a pipe dream.

Remember that these guys are in all likelihood looking to eventually replace their revenue stream from physical devices with software sales on devices like the iPhone.

$30 for an application when Apple takes 1/2 is not going to come even close to cutting it. They have to pay almost that much for the nav data anyways.

I would expect the navigation applications to be among the most expensive in the App store.

[jlwillia]

You people would pay $100 for a navigation app? Are you serious? The Garmin nüvi 265WT (widescreen, text-to-speech, lifetime traffic) was $130 yesterday... for the entire device!

http://forums.slickdeals.net/showthread.php?t=1391981

But I think you're kind of missing the point. I don't want another device. I want a device that can truly replace the seemingly hundreds of devices I have already.

The iPhone allowed people to not have to carry around an mp3 player, phone, PDA, and laptop. Now it will allow me to not have a separate device in my car for GPS navigation. I would be willing to pay about as much as an entry-level device for both the software and mounting accessory. I guess that would be around $100, give or take about $20.

[w00master]

But I think you're kind of missing the point. I don't want another device. I want a device that can truly replace the seemingly hundreds of devices I have already.

The iPhone allowed people to not have to carry around an mp3 player, phone, PDA, and laptop. Now it will allow me to not have a separate device in my car for GPS navigation. I would be willing to pay about as much as an entry-level device for both the software and mounting accessory. I guess that would be around $100, give or take about $20.

Understood that you "don't want another device," but considering I bought a TomTom for myself (the entire physical device and all) for $70, imho, if the app itself is over $70 it's really not worth it for me and I imagine many others.

[dmaxdmax]

It won't be priced such that it steals sales of their physical units. They also won't want to create the impression that their software isn't worth much. I'll be amazed if it comes in under $99 and if it integrates with other apps people will snap it up.

I don't know how the OS works but might it be possible to pull up a contact and single-click to launch the GPS app and get directions to the location? What about from Safari?

[RyanR.]

So will Tom Tom App work if I don't have cell service? :confused:

[Youngy]

Through the dock connector.

Recall that iPhone OS 3.0 allows developers to do hardware accessories. The TomTom dock is one such device. It has, apparently, a better GPS receiver built-in. I suspect it will also support folks using the iPhone 1G which has no built-in GPS at all. Perhaps even iPod touch users - so long as all the maps are loaded in at start-up rather than streamed, there's no reason a GPS navigator needs to be online.

Is that fact or speculation? I realise the 'enhanced GPS' is through the dock but is this purely a better GPS chip in that dock? If so why not make better reference to that in the specs.

All very vague at the moment.

[Kar98]

Tom Tom could provide an external GPS antenna now that it is allowed by the SDK

Why do you think the mount provides even better GPS reception than just the iPhone receiver? :rolleyes:

[mschwartz]

So will Tom Tom App work if I don't have cell service? :confused:

At this point, nobody knows, since we don't have full technical details.

If the application comes with a full database of maps that can be installed on the iPhone, then it will work as long as you have a GPS signal.

If the application follows the current TeleNav model, where maps are downloaded over the air as needed, then no.

Beyond the basic GPS/directions functioning, if the application supports things like traffic status, then there will need to be some means to get live data, which will likely require a live internet/data connection (ie 3G). Some of the standalone GPS units do with this an FM radio connection, so that might be a possibility here as well.

We'll all have to wait until more details emerge.

[Kar98]

Come on, kids, be realistic. TomTom 7 for Windows Mobile is
EUR 99.95 / GBP 89.95, with no US pricing announced yet.

[Willis]

Come on, kids, be realistic. TomTom 7 for Windows Mobile is
EUR 99.95 / GBP 89.95, with no US pricing announced yet.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0024NL1GI?ie=UTF8&tag=cheaphighstre-21&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=B0024NL1GI

Seeing as the iPhone version will have IQ routes too, this would be the maps I'd get because I do use a Tom Tom abroad.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0024NL1G8?ie=UTF8&tag=cheaphighstre-21&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=B0024NL1G8

For UK only users, this would probably be the best choice. Seeing the price for that, I can see Tom Tom charging around £110 for the map and mount and £120 for the EU maps too

[genosseinski]

The decision whether to buy a navigation app only depends on the price. Today we´ve received a wonderful Navigon navigation system which works perfectly in your car. Nice speech-to-text recognition, Bluetooth paring with iPhone (managing calls and addresses) and many other stuff you could use. Having such a thing in your car is not a big deal and it you don´t have to worry about incoming calls, playing background music or using your iPhone for other things (Internet) etc.
So you have one device just for navigation and your iPhone for all your other needs.

If TomTom/navigon charges more than $90, I will rather turn to a solid stand-alone navigation system. They also do a quite good job. And come on folks, you´d only use this in your car. On foot, Google Maps will suffice.

[nsayer]

But isn't it illegal to have a windshield mount in California?

If so, hopefully they offer a dashboard option.

Go watch the keynote video. The TomTom guy said exactly that. In fact, you simply rotate half the thing 180 degrees and it's in the appropriate orientation to mount on a dash instead of a window.

[nsayer]

Why do you think the mount provides even better GPS reception than just the iPhone receiver? :rolleyes:

Because the TomTom guy *SAID SO* in his keynote presentation. :rolleyes:

[Kar98]

How is this going to work on a touch?

GPS receiver in the dock.

[nsayer]

Is that fact or speculation? I realise the 'enhanced GPS' is through the dock but is this purely a better GPS chip in that dock? If so why not make better reference to that in the specs.

All very vague at the moment.

If the dock enhances GPS, then how exactly do you think it's going to be done other than with a GPS chip inside? Pink taffy and LSD?

[ender78]

You people would pay $100 for a navigation app? Are you serious? The Garmin nüvi 265WT (widescreen, text-to-speech, lifetime traffic) was $130 yesterday... for the entire device!

http://forums.slickdeals.net/showthread.php?t=1391981

I have a Tom Tom right now but it's big and bulky. I refuse to leave it on my dash and am worried whenever I leave it in the car. This way I take it with me when I leave. The possible features that can be rolled out for a network connected GPS are incredible. I'll for example pay $20 a year to constant map updates. There is a big possible continued revenue stream for Tom Tom here.

Convenience is well worth $100.

[andrebob]

My first impression was: AWESOME!
But... I thought about it...

Let's say you're in a place you have no idea where you're at.
Someone calls you, and it's important. You keep the call going.
You are now lost.

Sure we're making the best use of a single device, but if you have your music, and your internet, and your phone, and now your GPS... umm, good luck.

[jmpage2]

I have a Tom Tom right now but it's big and bulky. I refuse to leave it on my dash and am worried whenever I leave it in the car. This way I take it with me when I leave. The possible features that can be rolled out for a network connected GPS are incredible. I'll for example pay $20 a year to constant map updates. There is a big possible continued revenue stream for Tom Tom here.

Convenience is well worth $100.

ender has hit it on the head. People will buy this even if they have a standalone GPS simply for the convenience. A lot of people travel, use more than one car, etc. They will gladly pay $100 for this application to avoid having to lug yet another device with them when they go somewhere.

Down the road there might be enough competition that we see competent GPS applications for $49, etc, but certainly not in the 1st wave.

[Kar98]

Let's say you're in a place you have no idea where you're at.
Someone calls you, and it's important. You keep the call going.
You are now lost.

Why?
To make one thing clear: TomTom and other sat nav software has been available on other smartphone platforms like Windows Mobile and Palm for ages.

[rstansby]

I wonder why the Tom Tom adaptor provides enhanced GPS… does the new iPhone need it or just those without the compass I wonder?

I bet the enhanced GPS performance comes from the fact that the phone is held high up, so it gets better reception (compared to having it sitting on the car seat next to you or in your pocket.

[Kar98]

I bet the enhanced GPS performance comes from the fact that the phone is held high up, so it gets better reception (compared to having it sitting on the car seat next to you or in your pocket.

Right. Because those 3 feet are gonna make a difference, considering that the GPS satellites are orbiting Earth at an altitude of roughly 13,000 miles.

[rstansby]

If the dock enhances GPS, then how exactly do you think it's going to be done other than with a GPS chip inside? Pink taffy and LSD?

Enhanced GPS performance is another way of saying: The dock holds the phone up near the windshield where the phone's built in antenna can get better reception.

[rstansby]

Right. Because those 3 feet are gonna make a difference, considering that the GPS satellites are orbiting Earth at an altitude of roughly 13,000 miles.

It's not the 3' its the metal that your car is made of.

My friend's GPS stopped working because the window tint she got contained small amounts of metal.

[mrklaw]

I had route 66 on an ancient nokia phone years ago, using an external bluetooth GPS, and on an old Ipaq. This isn't new - its just new to iphone.

I'd prefer a solution that works offline in case you're in a bad signal area, and maps these days are pretty small - maybe a gig?

Nokia maps uses both methods - you can either preload the maps for a chosen area from a PC to your phone and then its all offline, or you can download over 3G as you go. Maybe the tom tom solution for iphone will be the same.

And as for what happens when you get a call - seriously? You aren't literally driving by the spoken directions. You can take a call while still having the visual indicators on screen. Its not like you're going to drive over a cliff because you didn't hear the satnav tell you to turn left. You still have to pay attention.

[Kar98]

Exactly, mrklaw. This is just now coming to a late entry on the smartphone market, and so far I haven't had any problems not getting lost while taking a phone call.

For the rest:

http://www.pdamods.com/prodimages/XDA2/tomtom_xda_2s_mount.jpg

If a call or a text message comes in, it pops up in the lower third of the screen and you can decide whether to take the call or read the message, or not.

[GRuizMD]

Integrated SMS and MMS* texting during navigation using a split screen mode would be cool.

* MMS not supported by AT&T until the end of the summer of 2009.

MMM tell me where you drive so I can move to a different city....

*/somebody who works on a trauma unit... Everyday incidents with people trying to call and *Text* while driving... I have seen a few lives lost because of this in the last 3 years./*

[Andrew K.]

If the crippled Slingplayer is going for $30 then you can bet your ass that Tom Tom is going to cost a helluva lot more.

This whole $30 and $50 pricing talk is a pipe dream.

Remember that these guys are in all likelihood looking to eventually replace their revenue stream from physical devices with software sales on devices like the iPhone.

$30 for an application when Apple takes 1/2 is not going to come even close to cutting it. They have to pay almost that much for the nav data anyways.

I would expect the navigation applications to be among the most expensive in the App store.

Then I'll keep smokin' til we find out! :D

[iPhoneNYC]

I have an old huge clunker of a Garmin and this would be a welcome replacement. Again, at the right price.

[ScootPatoot]

I used to have a BB Curve 8310 and used both Telenav and Mapquest Navigator on it. What both of those apps did was download the entire maps you need for a trip. So instead of continuously streaming map data, it is already downloaded on your phone. So if you loose your cell signal, it doesn't matter.

Now if you go off course and don't have a cell signal then you could get lost.

Also, I would also imagine this would be a subscription service. Say $10/month and not a $99 +/- product to buy.

These are of course speculation since nobody knows unless you work for TomTom. Take it as you will.

[SandynJosh]

The reason many of us ARE iPhone users is because we don't believe we should have to own 10 pieces of hardware in order to get 10 services. There's a distinct advantage in letting your one master device do everything. (There's also a disadvantage, in that you're completely SOL if your one device breaks, but many of us assume that will never happen. :D)

Assuming there's a traffic feature, I'd pay up to $100 for this.

Another advantage to the iPhone/GPS unit is that when you exit your car you pocket the device because it has multiple other uses. My friend who has a stand-alone GPS unit has to stuff it all under his seat after he parks so the idiots who see it don't do a couple hundred dollars of damage to his car in order to steal it.

Just something more to factor in.

[jazz1]

Buy the TomTom One 130 (http://www.amazon.com/TomTom-ONE-3-5-Inch-Navigator-Refurbished/dp/B001OAT9M0/ref=pd_cp_e_1) (for $49 after $20 rebate) or the TomTom One 130S (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001OAT9MU/ref=ox_ya_oh_product) ($69.99 after $20 rebate) refurbished units on Amazon and save your money for the likely very overpriced app. Do you really want to leave your iPhone in the sun on the dashboard anyway for extended periods of time?

Though looking back at the Amazon pages, they seem to have stopped the rebate on the 130 model for some reason but it still seems to be on for the 130S.

I've got a TomTom One 3rd Edition that I'd most likely use on long trips to save wear and tear on the iPhone. However, On around last minute trips I might not have the TT with me. So having the iPhone as an alternative might come in handy.

Map updates are another ongoing expense on the TomTom One. I wonder how much that is going to cost on the iPhone?

Also, I wonder if the iPhone would have all the features of even my old TT?

[SandynJosh]

If the dock enhances GPS, then how exactly do you think it's going to be done other than with a GPS chip inside? Pink taffy and LSD?

It could house a much larger antenna to capture the satellite signal than apple has supplied inside the iPhone.

[joemama]

I won't be $99 or more because yo ureally have to by the windshield adapter, which will be $40-50.

So that would put you around $150, which is more than a low-end stand alone Tom Tom system.

Yes, you will pay a premium because it's an iPhone, but NO one is going to pay more than $100 bucks.

Besides, many people already gave a GPS system. There needs to be an incentive to switch. That, and you aren't paying for any physical hardware.

[theBB]

It could house a much larger antenna to capture the satellite signal than apple has supplied inside the iPhone.
How would that antenna make this signal reach the GPS chip deep buried inside the phone. Do you think there is a direct connection between the dock and antenna input of this GPS chip? This is just a plastic mount.

[DS Flyer]

I guess I'd have to settle for Tom Tom. Being a pilot I am definitely a garmin man.

[EagerDragon]

What Happens when I Get a Phone Call in the middle of Directions???

Your car engine dies, wheels lock up tight, and yes you get to answer the phone.

[Thex1138]

Lack of real GPS with turn by turn was the core reason I never bought it.
It is now the reason I will buy it :D

P.S. Next time you take a domestic plane trip check out your 'whatever' GPS with you..
Looks wild travelling 900kph over city streets.. zoom out... from the road..

[theBB]

Agreed. Also I hope that mount is good and it doesn't constantly drop off the window.:eek:
I have a TomTom and the suction falls off the windshield about every 15 minutes or so. At least it does not fall on its screen.

Remember that these guys are in all likelihood looking to eventually replace their revenue stream from physical devices with software sales on devices like the iPhone. $30 for an application when Apple takes 1/2 is not going to come even close to cutting it.
Apple does not take half and TomTom might even have a better deal than the usual percentage applied to other smaller developers. In any case, they would want to maintain their profits, sure, but hardware involves a lot of production, shipping and R&D costs. I don't think they would mind being a software only company if they had to. If they can make money selling basic units at around $100, a software only package should cost considerably less.

[MrMoore]

I currently use a Navigon, but in the past I had a TomTom. (The reason I replaced it was because someone broke into my car and took the TomTom Doh! :eek:)

Anyway, the TomTom apps looks interesting, but I am really liking the Navigon map display. Maybe I'll see what the Navigon apps would look like.

I remember hearing the Navigon was leaving the US market. Would an apps only be for Europe?

[iMaggot]

I hope it's not too expensive, because i want to buy it.

[Sdancott]

What if i don't want the silly dashboard mount?

I have my own iPhone dashboard mount, I don't really want to buy something I already have?

But...will it cripple the app's functionality? Also, in the demo vids, the mount looks very snug - what about those of us with iPhone cases? Will they fit?

Trivial questions, but valid all the same.

[brop52]

I have a TomTom and the suction falls off the windshield about every 15 minutes or so. At least it does not fall on its screen.

Newer model or an older model? I know there were huge complaints a few years back.

[crazedbytheheat]

I wish that either Google Earth supported directions, or Google Maps could give you that angled view. As long as they both support compass data, there would be no need for these 3rd party apps.

I take it you live in an area where you have constant coverage. I don't, so an app with offline maps is required.

[Fizzoid]

This is just a plastic mount.How do you know, have you seen one or read more detailed specs? While SandynJosh was just speculating, so are you. Personally, I expect the cradle to be able to enhance the GPS signal by either having a GPS receiver or have an inbuilt antenna (my bet) which will connect to the onboard GPS through the dock connector. TomTom themselves also claim:
The TomTom car kit for iPhone; a specially developed car kit for secure docking, enhanced GPS performance, clear voice instructions, hands-free calling and in-car charging. So I fully expect it to have a built in speaker too

[crazedbytheheat]

Along with many others I will happily buy this or something similar. I currently have a Magellan that I don't really like all that much (it gets confused pretty easily). The allure of the iPhone to me has always been that I only need a single device. Phone, iPod, camera, video camera, gps device! Wow - that's pretty impressive for a single device (and cheap, contrary to the complainers).

I've been saving for the Garmin 705 Edge for my bike. I think I'll just figure out how to mount this bad boy on my bike and buy a much cheaper suunto or polar HRM.

I would like to see topo maps, though, with waypoints for hunting, hiking, and fishing. It should be an interesting year for the iPhone (at least the 3GS).

[woodgear]

will this TOMTOM Nav work on the iPod touch or is the iPhone the only one that will work?

[Fizzoid]

will this TOMTOM Nav work on the iPod touch or is the iPhone the only one that will work?Well, it's only being promoted for the iPhone, which is why I expect the cradle to be an external antenna rather than have an in built GPS, but no one really knows yet

[dZp]

Well, it's only being promoted for the iPhone, which is why I expect the cradle to be an external antenna rather than have an in built GPS, but no one really knows yet
More Details on TomTom for iPhone: Mount Has its Own GPS Chip (Wednesday June 10, 2009)
http://gps.about.com/b/2009/06/10/more-details-on-tomtom-for-iphone-mount-has-its-own-gps-chip.htm

After TomTom's announcement of TomTom for iPhone at the Apple's developer's conference, I had quite a few questions that weren't answered in the demo. Fortunately, I was able to catch up with Tom Murray, TomTom's vice president for market development, to see what I could pry loose. Everyone has assumed that a company like TomTom or Garmin could create a terrific app for the iPhone, but TomTom's multi-featured, docking windshield mount took everyone by surprise. For example, in the demo, TomTom stated that the mount "enhances" the iPhone's GPS. Really? How so? Turns out, the windshield mount actually has its own GPS chip and antenna inside, and when the iPhone is docked to the mount, it relies on the mount's GPS, says Murray. Wow. So much for depending on the iPhone's anemic GPS. The mount will "enhance reception in challenging areas, such as among tall buildings," says Murray. I was also curious about how maps for TomTom for iPhone will be sold. Mapsets will be bundled with the app software, says Murray. For example, if you want North America, you will purchase the app version that includes the North America mapset. They will be downloaded and installed together on purchase. If you want a mapset for Europe, you will need to purchase the European version of the app separately, and you will have separate apps on your phone for each region. Here are some more details on the TomTom for iPhone windshield mount/dock:

* The windshield mount/dock is optional. TomTom for iPhone app will run without it.
* Mount has a built-in, standard one-eighth inch audio-out jack. Can run a cable to car aux audio.
* It includes a microphone and speaker.
* It enables hands-free calling via its mic and speaker.
* It charges the iPhone.

Murray would not announce a release date (still officially "later this summer") for TomTom for iPhone, or provide pricing for the apps/mapsets, or windshield mount. Also, he could not comment on whether there would be a monthly fee associated with using the app (this seems unlikely, since Apple's App Store isn't set up for monthly-fee type billing).

[headfuzz]

TomTom finally on the iPhone, happy days. :)

I could finally get shot of my Xda Orbit, which is only retained for the fact it's got TomTom Navigator installed on it. Takes a bloody age to lock on though. Google Maps on my iPhone locks on WAAAAAAAAAY faster than Google Maps on my Orbit.

That said, it had better be the same deal with locally stored maps rather than some crap subscription / streaming download solution as I think some people have suggested.

The whole point of shelling out for a satnav app is NOT having to fork out extortionate roaming data charges for map download while abroad. I got burned using Google Maps to wander around Hamburg 2 years ago. £300 later I vowed never to use Google Maps (or any other over the air download map service) abroad ever again. :mad:

EDIT: just read dZp's post above, which allays my fears. Thank you sir (or madam!) :)

[Fizzoid]

More Details on TomTom for iPhone: Mount Has its Own GPS Chip (Wednesday June 10, 2009)
http://gps.about.com/b/2009/06/10/more-details-on-tomtom-for-iphone-mount-has-its-own-gps-chip.htm
I expect a hefty price tag for the mount then. I did think the talk of $19.99 was rather optimistic. Probably looking at around the £50+ mark although being in the UK I won't expect much change from £100 :(

[headfuzz]

I expect a hefty price tag for the mount then. I did think the talk of $19.99 was rather optimistic. Probably looking at around the £50+ mark although being in the UK I won't expect much change from £100 :(

I reckon the app will be priced in line with Windows Mobile download version, but yeah they'll probably put a hefty tax on the dock I expect.

BLU TAK FTW!!! :D

[jazz1]

More Details on TomTom for iPhone: Mount Has its Own GPS Chip (Wednesday June 10, 2009)
http://gps.about.com/b/2009/06/10/more-details-on-tomtom-for-iphone-mount-has-its-own-gps-chip.htm

Having some Tech. in the mount is really neat and makes me want to have it more. But knowing that the price can't undercut the price of their low end stand alone can it? They've got to keep their profit margins up don't they?

Anyone know if this is going to use TomTom Home application on your computer? How else would you build convoluted routes? TomTom Home finally got stable.

Wonder what Garmin is going to do?

[jon86]

I think I'll only get this if it's cheaper than a standalone TomTom. I have never had a necessity to talk to people on the phone while driving so that isn't a factor for me.

[kdarling]

As someone else pointed out, the cool thing about the mount having GPS built-in, is that perhaps the original iPhone and/or the iPod touch can work with it.

If so, TomTom has one heckuva neat addon.

[headfuzz]

As someone else pointed out, the cool thing about the mount having GPS built-in, is that perhaps the original iPhone and/or the iPod touch can work with it.

If so, TomTom has one heckuva neat addon.

I'm pretty sure they would have announced it in the keynote if that was the case.

But the fact they've specified on their website an iPhone 3G as a requirement, Pretty much scuppers 1st gen iPhone owners and iPod Touch users I reckon. But I could be wrong.

YMMV (see what I did there? ;) )

[RyanR.]

The chip inside the dock excites me. AT&T in my area is great on highways:rolleyes: I don't get lost on highways. I am a service tech and would love this app. as long as it works. I'm not gonna be the first in line thats for sure. I would hope they try to keep the price below $150 for the kit + software but who knows. :eek: or :D

[bbotte]

I agree, $150 US dollars total for app/Map and dock or less, it's a buy the day it comes out if I can get a dock.

[BigTRQ]

So if it has it's own GPS chip and antenna inside the dock, I can't see any reason as to why TomTom couldn't get this to work for iPhone 2G and iPod touch owners. The biggest roadblock is most likely Apple (hate to say it), as they want to move those newly out-of-contract 2G owners into 3G or 3G S phones.

I think it quite odd that iPod touch users won't be able to use this app. That's a HUGE user base that is going untapped here. Of course, the September refresh of the iPod line-up is drawing closer, so I wouldn't be surprised if the iPod touch 3G (3rd Gen) gains this availability. But what, if anything, could they (or have to) add for this GPS solution by TomTom work with the upcoming iPod touch?

(I'm holding out hope that the use of this app/dock with an iPod touch is something that does happen, as I have been wanting to get a GPS unit, but this would be so much simpler in the long run.)

[headfuzz]

The biggest roadblock is most likely Apple (hate to say it), as they want to move those newly out-of-contract 2G owners into 3G or 3G S phones.

I think you hit the nail on the head there.

[Ori]

Just a quick question. If I can download an application on up to 5 computers, what is there to stop me paying £100 for the app and installing on the wifes iphone as well as mine?
Assuming I don't need the mount?? Then the price drops?

[theBB]

Well, it's only being promoted for the iPhone, which is why I expect the cradle to be an external antenna rather than have an in built GPS, but no one really knows yet
It cannot be just an antenna, as the antenna in the mount would not be able to transfer that raw, analog and very low power signal over to the chip inside the phone. Either plastic only or full chip and antenna together so that it only needs to send processed digital data over to the phone. The posted message about the interview suggests that it is the latter.

In any case, I would not shell out for another chip until I see how well the built-in one works. If it is not cutting it, then I would use the iPhone version for quick instructions, but I think I would get a stand-alone unit for planned in advance out-of-town trips.

[dagger55]

Just a quick question. If I can download an application on up to 5 computers, what is there to stop me paying £100 for the app and installing on the wifes iphone as well as mine?
Assuming I don't need the mount?? Then the price drops?

BINGO!

[fixmdude]

Does one need the $10/mo AT&T Turn-by-turn Nav service on the cel account to use this App or will it be self-contained like a Garmin? I don't understand the point of that AT&T add-on monthly service... either a device has Nav, or it doesn't...

[BigTRQ]

The biggest roadblock is most likely Apple (hate to say it), as they want to move those newly out-of-contract 2G owners into 3G or 3G S phones.

I think you hit the nail on the head there.
And that's unfortunate. It's as if they're saying, "hey, early adopters of our first phone, we don't care anymore." Also, what about those that buy the iPod touch, with no intention of using an iPhone for various reasons (carrier, mostly)? I think Apple should allow the iPhone 2G and iPod touch users to access this app/dock. Surely TomTom would want more potential users?

[LethalWolfe]

If you have to buy an expensive dock to put the iPhone in is that really much more convenient than buying a stand alone unit?


Lethal

[Andrew K.]

What if i don't want the silly dashboard mount?

I have my own iPhone dashboard mount, I don't really want to buy something I already have?

But...will it cripple the app's functionality? Also, in the demo vids, the mount looks very snug - what about those of us with iPhone cases? Will they fit?

Trivial questions, but valid all the same.

Nah :) there is no hardware that connects to the phone so any mount should be good.

[w00master]

Nah :) there is no hardware that connects to the phone so any mount should be good.

I think Andrew K. is right, my understanding that the mount merely doubles as a charger, but besides that it doesn't really add any other tech features.

w00master

[fixmdude]

I think Andrew K. is right, my understanding that the mount merely doubles as a charger, but besides that it doesn't really add any other tech features.

w00master

The charger might be required to use Turn-by-Turn GPS/Nav for anything more than short trips, as it's a rather power hungry process. The Palm Pre uses more power during that process than the charger is even able to provide, and the battery will continue to drain, though much more slowly, when plugged in during GPS/Nav. I would assume that an Apple device would be better thought-out than that, but a charger-with-use might still be expected by TomTom to maintain a charge.

[kdarling]

But the fact they've specified on their website an iPhone 3G as a requirement, Pretty much scuppers 1st gen iPhone owners and iPod Touch users I reckon. But I could be wrong.

YMMV (see what I did there? ;) )

Yes :) Very well done, too.

I agree with everyone else... I betcha Apple doesn't want anyone to know that they could use their old phone or touch with TomTom. This could be interesting.

Does one need the $10/mo AT&T Turn-by-turn Nav service on the cel account to use this App or will it be self-contained like a Garmin? I don't understand the point of that AT&T add-on monthly service... either a device has Nav, or it doesn't...

Nope, don't need it. The ATT monthly nav service is for renting a constantly updated app that runs on other phones and uses assistance from ATT's servers. Good if you only need it for a short time, or don't feel like carrying an extra device.

If you have to buy an expensive dock to put the iPhone in is that really much more convenient than buying a stand alone unit?

It is if the phone did anything extra cool, as Garmin's Nuvi phone will. Like hitting one button and transfering your position or destination to your wife's Nuvi. Unfortunately, Apple's sandboxes might get in the way, unless TomTom implemented it.

The charger might be required to use Turn-by-Turn GPS/Nav for anything more than short trips, as it's a rather power hungry process. The Palm Pre uses more power during that process than the charger is even able to provide, and the battery will continue to drain, though much more slowly, when plugged in during GPS/Nav. I would assume that an Apple device would be better thought-out than that, but a charger-with-use might still be expected by TomTom to maintain a charge.

Many people have reported that iPhones also slowly discharge while plugged in and navigating. Perhaps this has changed.

[headfuzz]

Just a quick question. If I can download an application on up to 5 computers, what is there to stop me paying £100 for the app and installing on the wifes iphone as well as mine?
Assuming I don't need the mount?? Then the price drops?

I guess if both iPhones were synced to the same user account and therefore the same iTunes account there'd be no issue, but otherwise I don't think it'd work.

TomTom could possibly require an online / over the air activation to lock the app to one particular iPhone... :confused:

Either way, it will be mine :D

[Dammit Cubs]

What if you get a call?

What if you get a text?

I just think that because multitasking isn't fully utilized on the iphone. Will "quiting" your tomtom to go answer a phone call or text ruin your tom tom and you have re-input the data?

[RyanR.]

Just a quick question. If I can download an application on up to 5 computers, what is there to stop me paying £100 for the app and installing on the wifes iphone as well as mine?
Assuming I don't need the mount?? Then the price drops?

Just means that you need to sync to the same computer.

[headfuzz]

What if you get a call?

What if you get a text?

I just think that because multitasking isn't fully utilized on the iphone. Will "quiting" your tomtom to go answer a phone call or text ruin your tom tom and you have re-input the data?

a) iPhone OS 3.0 allows apps to run in the background so no it won't cancel your route
b) not sure what the law is where you are but here it's illegal to use a mobile phone whilst driving, unless you are using a Bluetooth headset for calls or a fitted in car system. Pretty sure it's the same across the EU.
c) you should not be reading texts whilst driving at all.

[bigwig]

It won't be priced such that it steals sales of their physical units.
If they're shortsighted enough to price it like that, it won't sell. As has been repeatedly pointed out, standalone nav units are getting perilously close to the $100 price point, and the standlone units likely have significantly better GPS hardware than the iPhone because they aren't as constrained by size and power. Besides, software is so much more profitable than hardware that you can set a low price and still make a killing.

[kdarling]

a) iPhone OS 3.0 allows apps to run in the background so no it won't cancel your route

What? No. You've probably confused the notification process with background apps.

Unless Apple provides TomTom with some kind of special status, taking a call means the navigation stops until you restart it.

For that matter, notifications could be popping up and sounding off while you're driving.

You really have to wonder if anyone in power at Apple uses this stuff.

[DavoMrMac]

In the UK, I would expect to see this for £29.99 for the car mount and around £69 for the UK Map Software. So long as it does not go over the £100 mark they will pick up a lot of customers.

TomTom standalone devices can be picked up for under £100 now. I have even seen specials for around £70. So they need to take this into account.

Wouldn't it be awesome if they did something for £69 with dock and the application ($89). Now that would be good!

[Ori]

Just means that you need to sync to the same computer.

Not as I understand it.
If I authorise another computer with my itunes account then any purchases made on that account will happily download for free on that computer!?!

The limit is 5 computers?

Am I wrong here? The only block I see is if TT do some sort of activation that requires a connection to the internet, but so many apps don't do that so i am not sure why they would? Just a thought.

[Diode]

Many people have reported that iPhones also slowly discharge while plugged in and navigating. Perhaps this has changed.

That's mainly because they were using google maps which in addition to the GPS was using the 3G chip for data. A combo of the two was too much power. Since the maps will already be on the phone little data will be needed and the drain would be less.

Furthermore using an outside GPS chip would further reduce the power consumption and I could see no problem with a dock keeping up with the tomtom going.

[MacU]

If they're shortsighted enough to price it like that, it won't sell. As has been repeatedly pointed out, standalone nav units are getting perilously close to the $100 price point, and the standlone units likely have significantly better GPS hardware than the iPhone because they aren't as constrained by size and power. Besides, software is so much more profitable than hardware that you can set a low price and still make a killing.

Totally agree,

There will also be the free app that will, I guess, compete with the other free Nav apps without turn by turn voice directions. If this app is anymore then $20-$30, will anyone buy it? I'm in the market for a GPS and there are several that are under $100. We're only paying for inexpensive software.

[FrogTastic]

Been looking forward to this for ages!

[gnasher729]

If you have to buy an expensive dock to put the iPhone in is that really much more convenient than buying a stand alone unit?

You need _something_ to keep the iPhone in a position where you can see the display without being distracted while driving. You can't hold it, you can't put it on the dashboard and then go crazy when it drops down in the next curve, you need something to hold it nicely. Protection from direct sunlight would be good as well.

[bbotte]

I already have a kensington windshield mount for my 3G, I have to pull it off the mount and unplug the car charger and then the aux out cable from the headphone jack. This dock will eliminate me un-plugging cords and plugging in cords, and give me a better Nav while charging my phone.

Announce the freakin' price already!

[copydeskcat]

Does this have a built-in speaker?

I'm presuming the cable in the photos on their website is for charging via the 12v socket?

[tivoboy]

I'm in, as long as the price isn't over $100.00 for the app and the mount.

it will be more than 100$ for the app and the mount, unless they totally crippled the mapping.

[Fizzoid]

it will be more than 100$ for the app and the mount, unless they totally crippled the mapping. I expect so too, they'll be banking on the fact people won't want to carry 2 devices around with them (+ Apple Tax of course ;))

[tivoboy]

I expect so too, they'll be banking on the fact people won't want to carry 2 devices around with them (+ Apple Tax of course ;))

There is still a place for PND devices, since if you use the gps on the iphone (or any phone for that matter) constantly, you'll be lucky to get more than about 3-4 hours of life out of it.

[extremei5]

School is out, summer is here, it's time to travel!! I hope they don't keep us waiting to long for it to come out :rolleyes:

[Bye Bye Baby]

What? No. You've probably confused the notification process with background apps.

Unless Apple provides TomTom with some kind of special status, taking a call means the navigation stops until you restart it.

For that matter, notifications could be popping up and sounding off while you're driving.

You really have to wonder if anyone in power at Apple uses this stuff.

I think you will find that apple's own apps can run in the background. So receive and sms and phone call would still work the same. I am sure that there will be something where you can listen to your call through a bluetooth headset.

[Lara F]

Yes, Apple apps work in the background but to get to them (ie. taking a call, or changing to a new album on the iPod) you'd have to leave TomTom. I do wonder how that's going to work.

[kas23]

Yes, Apple apps work in the background but to get to them (ie. taking a call, or changing to a new album on the iPod) you'd have to leave TomTom. I do wonder how that's going to work.

You'll have to simply exit out of TomTom. There's no other way around it since TomTom (or any other 3rd party app) cannot run in the background, unless they rigged it so it would push your directions (imagine that!).

I think you will find that apple's own apps can run in the background. So receive and sms and phone call would still work the same. I am sure that there will be something where you can listen to your call through a bluetooth headset.

Yes, Apple's own Apps can run in the background. However, suppose you are driving and you get a call. This incoming call will force quit your TomTom app. Once you answer the call, you will then be free to re-open TomTom and continue. But, there is no away around initially getting kicked-out of TomTom when a call comes in. As for SMS, I have never been using a 3rd party app while receiving a text, so I don't know.

[NightStorm]

Yes, Apple apps work in the background but to get to them (ie. taking a call, or changing to a new album on the iPod) you'd have to leave TomTom. I do wonder how that's going to work.

For iPod functionality, I believe 3.0 allows apps to access this information directly, so they could build an interface within the application that would allow you to perform iPod functions (change album, look through songs, etc) if they are so inclined.

[dumell]

Looks like Navigon beat TomTom to the store: Navigon (http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=320279293&mt=8) is now available but no signs of TomTom (in the App store in Finland at least). Navigon does not require any aditional hardware and costs 75 EUR - and this is "special introduction price".

[ABG]

Looks like Navigon beat TomTom to the store: Navigon (http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=320279293&mt=8) is now available but no signs of TomTom (in the App store in Finland at least). Navigon does not require any aditional hardware and costs 75 EUR - and this is "special introduction price".

Thanks for the heads up.
£54.99 in the UK App store - price valid until 30th June.

Looks like the maps cover most (all?) of Europe, which is way more than I need.
I love the idea - but without extra hardware I'm not sure I'd trust my iPhone 3G to be loud enough by itself. Also £55 is lot to pay for software you've not seen working IMO - I'd want to see some for of demo version to know how well it would work on the iPhone.

[i2m]

With turn by turn functionality coming to the iPhone. I wonder how this is going to impact the other "navigation" apps.
I hope these vendors let other build on their functionality and open up theri platform.
The only difference/USP remaining for other LBS provider is the quality of theri POI, which is difficult to maintain.
:confused:

[icemangrmed]

Has anyone tested it yet?

[VoR]

Personally I'd wait for igo8 over tomtom/navigon

[dumell]

Let's hope that tough competition in the App store will bring prices down. Perhaps this is why TomTom decided to bundle a physical thing with the app, to differentiate it from the competition and be able to stay out of any price wars between the other navigation apps.

[nrechtman]

I agree it's nice to have all my devices in one iphone, but as some have pointed out you can pick up a pretty nice GPS unit from Navigon, Garmin, Tom Tom for around $75, I own a Navigon 2100 and it's a pretty incredible little unit, it has text to speech and Navigon units show you what the green expressway signs look like and show you what lane you should be in, so if they are going to charge more than what a full GPS unit would cost, I don't see alot of people buying he app.

And if they try the method that these idiots who make Gokivo, then it will surely fail, (Gokivo came out with a .99 cent app on the 17th and nowhere on he description did it tell you that you would have to pay for the service, they first had prices of .99 cents for a minute or $2.99 for 10 minutes, or $9.99 for a month, now after getting slammed in the reviews, they only have the $9.99 per month fee, but whose going to pay $9.99 per month, at that rate in 6 months you've paid for a GPS unit.

[AppleMark]

I agree it's nice to have all my devices in one iphone, but as some have pointed out you can pick up a pretty nice GPS unit from Navigon, Garmin, Tom Tom for around $75,

Maybe, but none of these are as small as the iPhone are they?

I have both iPhone and Tom Tom (which is a very good satnav) but I still have to carry around an extra bulky item.

I agree the price has to be good, but I feel that they will price with all this in mind and for the fact that the iPhone is considered a 'Premium Phone', as quoted by my carrier.

[brop52]

Maybe, but none of these are as small as the iPhone are they?

I have both iPhone and Tom Tom (which is a very good satnav) but I still have to carry around an extra bulky item.

I agree the price has to be good, but I feel that they will price with all this in mind and for the fact that the iPhone is considered a 'Premium Phone', as quoted by my carrier.

Why would you carry around a TomTom? Put it in your center console when you are out of the car if you really worry about someone stealing it. The refurb 130 (http://www.amazon.com/TomTom-ONE-3-5-Inch-Navigator-Refurbished/dp/B001OAT9M0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1245657967&sr=8-1) can be bought on Amazon for $49 after $20 rebate and you get one free update to the maps to make sure it is up to date. If you want the road name to be spoken get the 130S refurb (http://www.amazon.com/TomTom-3-5-Inch-Portable-Navigator-Refurbished/dp/B001OAT9MU/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1245657848&sr=8-2) for $69 after $20 rebate. These things are not bulky at all. The stand is great and the device itself is only 3.5" and is quite good (especially for the money).

As for the iPhone, it is great, but the added subscription cost of using it for GPS, worrying about the logistics of phone calls, and worrying about direct sunlight or heat damaging the phone if it is mounted on the dashboard I would say it isn't worth it.

[Fizzoid]

Why would you carry around a TomTom? Put it in your center console when you are out of the car if you really worry about someone stealing it. Erm, because that and the glovebox would be the first place a thief would look?

[brop52]

Erm, because that and the glovebox would be the first place a thief would look?

If someone breaks into your car you have more issues than losing a $49-$69 GPS. If you use the iPhone as your GPS you will have the same problem as they will break in to get in and look for a GPS because they see the mount. Only way you can prevent this is to have a good security system and make your car less valuable to a thief than the one next to yours.

[Fizzoid]

If someone breaks into your car you have more issues than losing a $49-$69 GPS. If you use the iPhone as your GPS you will have the same problem as they will break in to get in and look for a GPS because they see the mount. Only way you can prevent this is to have a good security system and make your car less valuable to a thief than the one next to yours.Security systems don't stop people breaking into cars, they can be in and out in seconds. Best way to prevent it is not to leave the mount on display, but even then it may not stop speculative thieves breaking in. However, I'd rather have to pay for a new window than a new window and a £200 Sat Nav

[DougB541]

Security systems don't stop people breaking into cars, they can be in and out in seconds. Best way to prevent it is not to leave the mount on display, but even then it may not stop speculative thieves breaking in. However, I'd rather have to pay for a new window than a new window and a £200 Sat Nav

Agreed.

My friend had his navi stolen out of his glovebox.

At least if someone does a smash and grab they won't have an easy target.

[Drag'nGT]

If someone breaks into your car you have more issues than losing a $49-$69 GPS. If you use the iPhone as your GPS you will have the same problem as they will break in to get in and look for a GPS because they see the mount. Only way you can prevent this is to have a good security system and make your car less valuable to a thief than the one next to yours.

Exactly, keep the items in your car low profile and the thieves will look for another car.

[Fizzoid]

Exactly, keep the items in your car low profile and the thieves will look for another car.
Or just don't leave them in your car! Why bother taking the risk?
That's why, despite owning a TomTom, I'm planning on buying this app, then I'm only having to carry 1 device around with me after leaving the car somewhere

[bbotte]

Can we get some more info on this thing? Sheesh.....

[Fizzoid]

Not until more info is actually released, no :rolleyes:

[mschwartz]

Hi all,

As I suspected in prior posts, AT&T has made its Navigator application available for the iPhone with a $9.99 per month subscription fee, which is the same as it does now for other phones.

It is available via the iTunes store.

More information here:

http://www.macnn.com/articles/09/06/23/att.navigator.iphone.app/

Bear in mind that Navigator is a re-branded version of TeleNav's application, so I would expect TeleNav to announce something RSN, probably with the same pricing model.

HTH,

Marc

[vvebsta]

I think TomTom would easily dominate the turn by turn market if they put a gps chip in the car kit. There are millions and millions of iphone 2G and ipod touch owners out there that would take advantage of this and TomTom would be foolish not to tap into that part of the market.

[OZMP]

If it has a GPS speedo function I will be hard wiring it into my car. I change rims/ diff ratios too often to trust anything else, I have a gps speedo on the iPhone now, but no holder, and an extra antenna would help it.

I returned a Garmin I bought as it was just crap compared to a friends TomTom, so atleast in Australia, TomTom are half decent.

[tivoboy]

I think TomTom would easily dominate the turn by turn market if they put a gps chip in the car kit. There are millions and millions of iphone 2G and ipod touch owners out there that would take advantage of this and TomTom would be foolish not to tap into that part of the market.

I don't think they will put a chip in it, that is in the phone. but, I thin the car kit, cradle, charger HW device they are going to offer with it, WILL have an external antenna interface - assuming that apple has an API for that.

[Zimmy68]

Hi all,

As I suspected in prior posts, AT&T has made its Navigator application available for the iPhone with a $9.99 per month subscription fee, which is the same as it does now for other phones.

It is available via the iTunes store.

More information here:

http://www.macnn.com/articles/09/06/23/att.navigator.iphone.app/

Bear in mind that Navigator is a re-branded version of TeleNav's application, so I would expect TeleNav to announce something RSN, probably with the same pricing model.

HTH,

Marc

The downside of this is it is now obvious that Tom Tom will go the "service" route with their app.
For $10 per month, they better include traffic management.

[Fizzoid]

I don't think they will put a chip in it, that is in the phone.
It's already been reported it has, as well as a mic, speaker and FM transmitter (so I believe those hoping for a $30 price tag are going to be severley dissapointed)
http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/blog/tag/iphone-tomtom/

[AforAndromeda]

:confused:

Are we sure this will work on '2008' iPhone 3G's with 3.0 os - not just the newly released iPhone 3 GS's etc..?

I can understand how the extra features in the new iPhone 3's would really bring some turn by turn advantages, but I can't just write off the remaining year's contract on my present iPhone 3G

[will0407]

:confused:

Are we sure this will work on '2008' iPhone 3G's with 3.0 os - not just the newly released iPhone 3 GS's etc..?

I can understand how the extra features in the new iPhone 3's would really bring some turn by turn advantages, but I can't just write off the remaining year's contract on my present iPhone 3G

Agrred. With the ridiculous prices having to be paid to upgrade to the new 3g s, tomtom would lose a lot of customers if this didn't work on the iphone 3g.

[mschwartz]

The downside of this is it is now obvious that Tom Tom will go the "service" route with their app.
For $10 per month, they better include traffic management.

It may not be obvious, although it gives more credibility to the possibility of this model with other vendors.

Keep in mind that TomTom is offering the hardware add-ons, which AT&T and TeleNav (so far) do not offer. So that likely means that at least the hardware would be purchased. They may offer a software only option, which may make sense to make available for a subscription basis. Of course, there could be a hybrid option of buying the hardware and then make the software subscription. Too many possibilities until they actually formally announce something.

The question remains relative to software/map updates. With a subscription model, this would be included, as it is now with AT&T and TeleNav. With a purchase model, will they make the updates free or will they charge for them. If the latter, that has to be considered in the ongoing costs of their product.

If they were to offer a subscription based model, they would have to offer the traffic service to be competitive with similar options. Navigator/TeleNav have it it built-in and of course even with the standalone units, some have lifetime traffic built-in with the FM receivers in the charging cable as an alternative to the MSN based subscription traffic service option.

As others have noted, including in the thread now on this forum regarding the AT&T announcement, while the monthly service adds up over time, it has to be considered relative to the total cost over time of the stand-alone units. In the latter case, there is the initial purchase price, the cost of software/map updates and unless lifetime traffic was included, the monthly traffic subscription fee.

People clearly have strong feelings on this subject as noted here and elsewhere. It will all depend upon the feature set and costs of each option and what folks prefer. There are pros and cons to each option, whether for the iPhone or standalone units.

The one thing that I know for sure is that I want traffic and I have been MS free for a number of years. No going back on that... :-)

[tivoboy]

It's already been reported it has, as well as a mic, speaker and FM transmitter (so I believe those hoping for a $30 price tag are going to be severley dissapointed)
http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/blog/tag/iphone-tomtom/

I am not totally sure that "includes a GPS receiver to boost the signal received by the iphone GPS" means an actual GPS chip, or an antenna.

If it is GPS receiver AND antenna, then it would work with the touch no proble.

obviously, we'll see.

[tivoboy]

I think TT will go full blown HW/SW local maps data, etc.
and THEN they will offer some additional model for monthly traffic data and additional in application offerings.

[Fizzoid]

I am not totally sure that "includes a GPS receiver to boost the signal received by the iphone GPS" means an actual GPS chip, or an antenna.

If it is GPS receiver AND antenna, then it would work with the touch no proble.

obviously, we'll see.
Well, I'm still sticking with a GPS chip :)
http://gps.about.com/b/2009/06/10/more-details-on-tomtom-for-iphone-mount-has-its-own-gps-chip.htm

[JonB3Z]

I am not totally sure that "includes a GPS receiver to boost the signal received by the iphone GPS" means an actual GPS chip, or an antenna.

It has been reported to be a GPS receiver. And frankly, I don't see any other possibility. There doesn't appear to be any way to couple an external antenna into the iPhone or Touch. The connector is the 30-pin A/V/data connector, which is not an RF connector and thus has no antenna connection AFAIK.

Plus, this makes for an intriguing product for non-iPhone users if it supports the Touch. If you are in the market for a GPS unit, you would now have the option of one that has full iPod capability. I could see some people opting for a TomTom cradle plus Touch over a dedicated nav GPS.

[tivoboy]

Great!

Makes it even better, but then of course it will be more $$ too.

I still think this is the one I am waiting for.

[skye12]

Pricing will be critical. They should price it no higher than a hundred imo.
Why? It will kill the car device gps market (whap garmin) and give them huge penetration.

[kas23]

Pricing will be critical. They should price it no higher than a hundred imo.
Why? It will kill the car device gps market (whap garmin) and give them huge penetration.

Good point. I can see them charging $60-$75 for the software and then over-charging for the car-mount. A plastic car-mount for about $40-$50 will be mostly profit as they likely cost under $5 to actually produce. I can't see the car-mount plus software in the $140-$150 range. Why buy it then? A stand alone unit would be cheaper.

[kas23]

Maybe, but none of these are as small as the iPhone are they?

I have both iPhone and Tom Tom (which is a very good satnav) but I still have to carry around an extra bulky item.


Why does size matter? Where are you carrying around your GPS unit? I would just attach it to my windshield or dash and that's it. It would then be placed in a concealed place while not in the car.

[tivoboy]

I think the combo will be more like 199$, at LEAST 99$ for the SW.

There might be a special coming out of the gates, like 169-179$ for a few weeks, months.

But, the combo won't be less than these prices, IMHO.

[tivoboy]

Good point. I can see them charging $60-$75 for the software and then over-charging for the car-mount. A plastic car-mount for about $40-$50 will be mostly profit as they likely cost under $5 to actually produce. I can't see the car-mount plus software in the $140-$150 range. Why buy it then? A stand alone unit would be cheaper.

I think the mount, connector (which has to be licensed), gps chip, gps antenna and engineering applied is going to COST TT much more than 5$. It is probably for them a lower margin product, hoping and probably rightly assuming that buyers will be buying the TT SW to go with it, and therefore getting them on at least annual or bi-annual subscriptions of the SW.

[bbotte]

Well if I have to wait longer than this week, I'm spending my money elsewhere.

[Drag'nGT]

That's the good and bad about knowing something new is coming but don't know when.

[SlavKO]

That's the good and bad about knowing something new is coming but don't know when.

Exactly...I keep checking this thread every few days hoping for more info about a release date.:D

[DELLsFan]

Exactly...I keep checking this thread every few days hoping for more info about a release date.:D

Me too ... although I did sign up at the TomTom site with a presumption THEY would email me too. :rolleyes:

[bbotte]

Me too ... although I did sign up at the TomTom site with a presumption THEY would email me too. :rolleyes:

I would take any info at this time such as: "Coming July 30th" or whatever, just say something......

[mschwartz]

I would take any info at this time such as: "Coming July 30th" or whatever, just say something......

I wonder if they are re-evaluating the price points based upon what AT&T and TeleNav seem to be doing with a subscription based approach.

The comments on the AT&T/TeleNav product for the iPhone have been generally positive so far. I think that TT and Garmin (presuming that the latter has something in the works) risk losing business if they don't jump in with something pretty soon. Whether it is to the aforementioned product or stand-alone GPS units.

BTW, I like your Steve McQueen Le Mans avatar. Along with Grand Prix, it is one of my all time favorite racing movies. :-)

[rjohnstone]

Good point. I can see them charging $60-$75 for the software and then over-charging for the car-mount. A plastic car-mount for about $40-$50 will be mostly profit as they likely cost under $5 to actually produce. I can't see the car-mount plus software in the $140-$150 range. Why buy it then? A stand alone unit would be cheaper.
I agree.
I'm not going to buy any add-on product for my iPhone that costs almost as much as the phone.

It's a plastic mount and software.
If they went subscription based, $40 - $50 tops plus a reasonable monthly fee.
Non-subscription, $75 tops.
Anything more than that and I'll just keep a regular GPS unit in my car.

[anim8or]

I agree.
I'm not going to buy any add-on product for my iPhone that costs almost as much as the phone.

It's a plastic mount and software.
If they went subscription based, $40 - $50 tops plus a reasonable monthly fee.
Non-subscription, $75 tops.
Anything more than that and I'll just keep a regular GPS unit in my car.

The funny thing is that one of the main aims of the iPhone i to reduce the amount of devices that a person has to carry around... ie not having to carry a phone, an ipod, a portable gaming system and now a GPS unit in your car....

I dont think people who already own a GPS unit should be thinking of buying any GPS software for their iPhone.

While i hope that the prices are not as inflated as we all are guessing I guess its just what we have to expect for the convenience!

[diamond.g]

I agree.
I'm not going to buy any add-on product for my iPhone that costs almost as much as the phone.

It's a plastic mount and software.
If they went subscription based, $40 - $50 tops plus a reasonable monthly fee.
Non-subscription, $75 tops.
Anything more than that and I'll just keep a regular GPS unit in my car.

Eh, TomTom Navigator (http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=tomtom+navigator+6&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=11982175073404109693&ei=_W5LSuKWN4S6NY6r4Z8B&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=5#ps-sellers) for PDAs typically cost between 150 and 300 dollars. So I wouldn't be surprised if it is over 99 bucks.

[Manic Mouse]

I really, REALLY hope they don't go with a subscription model. This is a deal breaker for me. Offering the app for free and then charging for whatever maps a user may need (and thereafter map updates) seems much more elegant and sensible to me.

[bbotte]

I really, REALLY hope they don't go with a subscription model. This is a deal breaker for me. Offering the app for free and then charging for whatever maps a user may need (and thereafter map updates) seems much more elegant and sensible to me.

agreed, I'm not paying a monthly fee, my AT$T (<-- Pun) Bill is large enough per month. I don't need additional monthly charges.

[croy]

I wish they would hurry up & release this app already! I also signed up to their newsletter on the website, but never received any information yet.

A release date/price would be nice TomTom....

[mschwartz]

...Other than suggesting that they will not take a subscription based approach.

This still does not satisfy those who are concerned with the initial pricing of the software and maps, the pricing of the hardware and the pricing of map updates, all of which can end up being substantially expensive over a period of time of use.

Given the size of the initial app/map download (~1 Gb), you had better have an unlimited data plan or a good WiFi connection.

http://www.macworld.com/article/141539/2009/07/tomtomiphoneupdate.html

Over a two year time period (a reasonable device life) the subscription for AT&T's app would be around $240 U.S. and that includes map updates and traffic. That is competitive with the purchase price for a lot of the stand alone GPS units that have lifetime traffic included.

It will be interesting to see where TomTom's pricing comes to and whether it includes things like traffic, or will that be another paid for extra. Traffic is not mentioned at all in the above article.

I know a lot of folks don't like subscription models, but one has to compare pricing over time to be fair. One way or another, you are going to pay somebody a fair amount of money. All of them (AT&T, TomTom, Garmin, etc.) are in business to provide products and services at a fair profit.

How will TomTom's pricing compare and what if any other functional differences will be there that might outweigh any pricing advantage of one application over the other.

[Manic Mouse]

Over a two year time period (a reasonable device life) the subscription for AT&T's app would be around $240 U.S. and that includes map updates and traffic. That is competitive with the purchase price for a lot of the stand alone GPS units that have lifetime traffic included.

Except that all they're doing in the iPhone's case is providing software. Your $240 for the stand alone unit includes the price of manufacturing, packing and shipping a unit to you along with the software.

The iPhone app should cost significantly LESS than a stand-alone unit, not the same as considering all the GPS company is providing is software.

Of course companies sometimes don't work based on logic, I recently purchased a physical copy of Patapon 2 for my PSP which cost less than the digital download. Despite the fact that they have to make the disc and packaging, transport it, and sell it at a lower price to the retailer. Ridiculous!

[LethalWolfe]

Except that all they're doing in the iPhone's case is providing software. Your $240 for the stand alone unit includes the price of manufacturing, packing and shipping a unit to you along with the software.

The iPhone app should cost significantly LESS than a stand-alone unit, not the same as considering all the GPS company is providing is software.

The expensive part is the software though, not the GPS hardware. I mean, pretty much every phone made in the past few years has GPS hardware. Current solutions for mobile phones costs around $100 for the software.


Lethal

[mschwartz]

Except that all they're doing in the iPhone's case is providing software. Your $240 for the stand alone unit includes the price of manufacturing, packing and shipping a unit to you along with the software.

The iPhone app should cost significantly LESS than a stand-alone unit, not the same as considering all the GPS company is providing is software.

Of course companies sometimes don't work based on logic, I recently purchased a physical copy of Patapon 2 for my PSP which cost less than the digital download. Despite the fact that they have to make the disc and packaging, transport it, and sell it at a lower price to the retailer. Ridiculous!


I think that you overestimate the HW related cost versus the R&D cost for the software. Shipping and packaging are negligible.

Also, one thing that I realized that I left out is that most standalone units have a cost associated with getting map updates. So that would be an additional perhaps $100 to $200 over a two year time frame, depending upon the particulars and whether or not you perhaps got a deal for free updates.

The other consideration is convenience. You pay a premium for a laptop over a desktop for the convenience of portability. You pay a significant premium for a laptop that even comes close to desktop performance (such as my 17 inch unibody MBP with upgraded CPU and HD).

What sort of monetary value can you associate with not having to carry around yet another device? That's a personal issue that we all have to decide for ourselves and applies whether one is looking at TomTom or the subscription based applications.

Somewhere, presumably TomTom is making some marketplace assumptions regarding its pricing model for the initial purchase and the ongoing costs of updates. They of course have to evaluate the likelihood that it would be competitive with subscription based approaches as well as standalone units.

That is a value proposition that we all get to assess for ourselves, once they actually get around to putting out details, presuming that some proportion of us don't give up by then and go with other alternatives. The longer they wait, the greater the loss of sales opportunities for them.

[Manic Mouse]

I think that you overestimate the HW related cost versus the R&D cost for the software. Shipping and packaging are negligible.

Also, one thing that I realized that I left out is that most standalone units have a cost associated with getting map updates. So that would be an additional perhaps $100 to $200 over a two year time frame, depending upon the particulars and whether or not you perhaps got a deal for free updates.

The other consideration is convenience. You pay a premium for a laptop over a desktop for the convenience of portability. You pay a significant premium for a laptop that even comes close to desktop performance (such as my 17 inch unibody MBP with upgraded CPU and HD).

What sort of monetary value can you associate with not having to carry around yet another device? That's a personal issue that we all have to decide for ourselves and applies whether one is looking at TomTom or the subscription based applications.

Somewhere, presumably TomTom is making some marketplace assumptions regarding its pricing model for the initial purchase and the ongoing costs of updates. They of course have to evaluate the likelihood that it would be competitive with subscription based approaches as well as standalone units.

That is a value proposition that we all get to assess for ourselves, once they actually get around to putting out details, presuming that some proportion of us don't give up by then and go with other alternatives. The longer they wait, the greater the loss of sales opportunities for them.

Personally I would argue that it's more of an inconvenience to have GPS on your phone rather than in a unit. You don't really carry a stand-alone device around with you, you put it in the car and keep it there. With a phone it could kill battery life. The only substantial advantage to having GPS on your phone, IMO, would be a lower price since they don't have to provide any hardware. If it's no cheaper you might as well buy a stand-alone unit and not have to burn your battery life on phone or buy a load of peripherals to keep it charged in the car.

But that's just me, maybe others would rather have it on their phone than a stand-alone unit. However if the TomTom app costs more than 60% of a device then I'll simply buy a device and save space and battery on my phone, and have less swapping and changing to do when I get in the car. £60 is probably about my limit.

[tivoboy]

Don't forget, I think apple has upped their charge to USE the dock connector API to 15$?

[chimpboy74]

Not as I understand it.
If I authorise another computer with my itunes account then any purchases made on that account will happily download for free on that computer!?!

The limit is 5 computers?

Am I wrong here? The only block I see is if TT do some sort of activation that requires a connection to the internet, but so many apps don't do that so i am not sure why they would? Just a thought.

Is this correct?

Can I authorise my mates PC and let him download the navigon software (that I have bought) for free?

or is his iphone connecte to his account so will not show in his app list on PC when he syncs? He wants the tomtom but I have said the navigon is worth a punt so he asked if he could borrow my phone ( no dice pal) but if we could work this he can give it a proper go.

[jazz1]

...Other than suggesting that they will not take a subscription based approach.

This still does not satisfy those who are concerned with the initial pricing of the software and maps, the pricing of the hardware and the pricing of map updates, all of which can end up being substantially expensive over a period of time of use.

Given the size of the initial app/map download (~1 Gb), you had better have an unlimited data plan or a good WiFi connection.

http://www.macworld.com/article/141539/2009/07/tomtomiphoneupdate.html

Over a two year time period (a reasonable device life) the subscription for AT&T's app would be around $240 U.S. and that includes map updates and traffic. That is competitive with the purchase price for a lot of the stand alone GPS units that have lifetime traffic included.

It will be interesting too see where TomTom's pricing comes to and whether it includes things like traffic, or will that be another paid for extra. Traffic is not mentioned at all in the above article.

I know a lot of folks don't like subscription models, but one has to compare pricing over time to be fair. One way or another, you are going to pay somebody a fair amount of money. All of them (AT&T, TomTom, Garmin, etc.) are in business to provide products and services at a fair profit.

How will TomTom's pricing compare and what if any other functional differences will be there that might outweigh any pricing advantage of one application over the other.

I read the article. Frankly unless the total package including software, extra hardware, and no monthly subscription happen why wouldn't I stick with my TomTom One 3rd Edition? Let it fry on my dash I say and save the iPhone. I guess if the total package wasn't to expensive it might tempt me. Maybe I'll be wowed, but if there is any "wow" in the package they are keeping it quiet.