Safari 4 Tops 11 Million Downloads in First Three Days [Archive]

MacRumors

Jun 12, 2009, 08:59 AM

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/06/12/safari-4-tops-11-million-downloads-in-first-three-days/)

Apple today announced (http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2009/06/12safari.html) that the final version of its Safari 4 browser, officially launched Monday (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/06/08/apple-releases-safari-4-for-mac-and-windows/) after the company's Worldwide Developers Conference keynote address, has been downloaded over 11 million times in the first three days of release. Notably, Safari for Windows has accounted for half of the total downloads.Apple today announced that more than 11 million copies of Safari 4 have been downloaded in the first three days of its release, including more than six million downloads of Safari for Windows. Safari 4 is the world's fastest, most innovative browser and is built on the world's most advanced browser technologies including the new Nitro JavaScript engine that executes JavaScript nearly eight times faster than IE 8 and more than four times faster than Firefox 3. Safari quickly loads HTML web pages more than three times faster than IE 8 and three times faster than Firefox 3.Safari 4 is a free download available from Apple's site (http://www.apple.com/safari/).

Article Link: Safari 4 Tops 11 Million Downloads in First Three Days (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/06/12/safari-4-tops-11-million-downloads-in-first-three-days/)

uberamd

Jun 12, 2009, 08:59 AM

I like to add that I contributed to that count, 4 times.

wankey

Jun 12, 2009, 09:02 AM

Ditto, 4 home, 2 work.

TheNorthWaves

Jun 12, 2009, 09:07 AM

when they bundle it into software update, who would've thought? he he

Trev311

Jun 12, 2009, 09:07 AM

How many of those windows downloads do you think were slipped in with people who hadn't updated their iTunes/quicktime yet and they didn't even mean to download it?

thedbp

Jun 12, 2009, 09:07 AM

You gotta figure that most of those Windows downloads were Boot Camp users. I'm sure there's a few Safari fans on Windows, but lets not delude ourselves ...

BornAgainMac

Jun 12, 2009, 09:08 AM

I noticed someone on the local news was still using Safari 4 Beta. He was going over the news with a video feed from his Mac screen this morning. That is a strange way to do the news. Using tabs to switch to different news stories and talking about them. Tabs were at the top.

uberamd

Jun 12, 2009, 09:08 AM

You gotta figure that most of those Windows downloads were Boot Camp users. I'm sure there's a few Safari fans on Windows, but lets not delude ourselves ...

haha probably true. I was at work yesterday (on my Mac) and I opened up a new Safari tab to show someone a website, and they saw the Quick Look screen while I was typing in the URL and it amazed them. They loved it.

niuniu

Jun 12, 2009, 09:10 AM

I didn't even know Safari 4 was released. You can add a +1 to that count in a moment :o

Draythor

Jun 12, 2009, 09:10 AM

You gotta figure that most of those Windows downloads were Boot Camp users. I'm sure there's a few Safari fans on Windows, but lets not delude ourselves ...

True

when they bundle it into software update, who would've thought? he he

More likely! I hit install without bothering to check what it was Apple was installing. I like this new build. The old one F'd up my skin.

iEnginerd

Jun 12, 2009, 09:11 AM

3 for me.... On 2 on my MacBook (boot camp) and downloaded it for my work computer as well. :)

bobbleheadbob

Jun 12, 2009, 09:12 AM

We've got it downloaded on 4 Mac's already in our household. So far I like it, but haven't decided to make the complete switch back from FireFox yet. Need to play with it some more, I think. :apple:

darthraige

Jun 12, 2009, 09:17 AM

Obviously this count will be high. It will most likely hit over 100 million soon. It's part of Software Update and people are just immune to updating their system. Most aren't saying, "Hey, I'm gonna download Safari 4." It's, "Hey, I'm gonna do the Software Update, oh look, Safari 4 is part of it." lol

Animalk

Jun 12, 2009, 09:18 AM

Safari 4 is running beautifully on my work pc running xp as well as my mac at home. I've experienced a couple crashes on the pc and the mac in the first two days but they have yet to reappear.

cg0def

Jun 12, 2009, 09:18 AM

How many of those windows downloads do you think were slipped in with people who hadn't updated their iTunes/quicktime yet and they didn't even mean to download it?

Hum if you've installed iTunes on Windows the software update DOES NOT ask you to install Safari. The only way it'll show Safari 4 as an update is if you have safari 3 installed. And since it is quite simple to not download the update ( a simple check ) there is no way that more than a dozen people downloaded Safari 4 without meaning to do so. Plus no regular windows user is using Safari. You have to go a bit off the beaten path in order to install Safari on windows.

andyvp

Jun 12, 2009, 09:20 AM

Safari 4 and the beta both kills my work pc. If it is open it and all my other programs run at half speed. I would love to use it but it's a no go.

morespce54

Jun 12, 2009, 09:21 AM

Yea, well, when you push-it thru SU... ;)

oldMac

Jun 12, 2009, 09:22 AM

I'm sure these figures are being driven by automatic software updates.

However... I must say that I was *shocked* by how fast Safari 4 is when I updated my year-old macbook last night.

If Snow Leopard has had as much attention as Safari 4 obviously has, then we're in for a real treat and an absolute steal at $29.

stuarthatto

Jun 12, 2009, 09:26 AM

Wonder how many will junk it because there is no progress indication.

PeteB

Jun 12, 2009, 09:27 AM

Just because I downloaded it as part of other updates doesn't mean that I use it... :p

JoeDRC

Jun 12, 2009, 09:35 AM

Wonder how many will junk it because there is no progress indication.

Thats my only grievance really

Hattig

Jun 12, 2009, 09:37 AM

Safari 4 Beta was what caused me to switch from the less-than-ideal Mac Firefox.

Shame I lose a bit of vertical space now the tabs aren't in the titles, but they did cause a few unexpected minimisations.

atomic3

Jun 12, 2009, 09:38 AM

This just in!!! The entire 300+ million United States population is switching to digital television today!!! Oh wait...

AndreH

Jun 12, 2009, 09:38 AM

I wonder if they're counting people like me...

I downloaded it a second time in the hopes that reinstalling it would stop it from hanging with the spinning pizza icon.

It seems that Safari 4 doesn't like me to scroll through long web pages - maybe with Flash. The beta didn't seem to be this unstable.

It also has trouble with the coverflow history viewer - similar hangs. Maybe getting stuck on the same pages, who knows.

I hope they fix this soon, as I like Safari 4 otherwise.

ghostface147

Jun 12, 2009, 09:40 AM

Safari causes more headaches than anything other browser (Chrome, Firefox, IE8) on the machines that I installed it on. Back to a real browser......

armoguy94

Jun 12, 2009, 09:41 AM

How the heck do they manage to get that many downloads in 3 days?

phillyeagles615

Jun 12, 2009, 09:45 AM

i still miss the tabs on the top. that was a feature apple emphasized in the beta. not that it made much of a difference but i def got used to it

thejadedmonkey

Jun 12, 2009, 09:51 AM

Hum if you've installed iTunes on Windows the software update DOES NOT ask you to install Safari. The only way it'll show Safari 4 as an update is if you have safari 3 installed. And since it is quite simple to not download the update ( a simple check ) there is no way that more than a dozen people downloaded Safari 4 without meaning to do so. Plus no regular windows user is using Safari. You have to go a bit off the beaten path in order to install Safari on windows.

No, I opened iTunes yesterday, and it came up "Itunes is out of date bla bla bla...." and the update box had itunes checked, and it also had a box for new software, and safari 4 was in there, checked by default. I run windows 7, and I only use IE8.

Data

Jun 12, 2009, 09:58 AM

For me it's not working as good as safari3 did, it's crashing a lot on me on all my mac's.
Hope this gets better soon with un update.

iheijoushin

Jun 12, 2009, 09:59 AM

I'll use Safari 4 until Chrome for Mac is finalized. Safari 4 has some great features but it's prone to locking up mysteriously when using certain features like bookmarks and history.

I gotta tell you, Chrome is one sweet ride in Windows. If it's half as good in Mac OS X I'm sold.

Dagless

Jun 12, 2009, 10:05 AM

3 here! Installed it on my cousins new Netbook. It's just lightning fast compared to any IE. Plus for someone who isn't 100% computer literate that Top Sites feature is just brilliant.

rlmccormick

Jun 12, 2009, 10:06 AM

lamadude

Jun 12, 2009, 10:13 AM

I prefer tabs on the bottom so that's one thing safari 4 got right.

I still won't use it though, since it doesn't have basic features I need, like switching the language of the spell correction. So I'll stick to firefox.
They compare Safari 4 to Firefox 3, which is fair of course, but the speed of firefox 3.5 is much faster.

cantthinkofone

Jun 12, 2009, 10:14 AM

I'm not very impressed with safari 4. I think its slower to load web pages. I'm thinking of moving back to 3 until chrome comes out.

bobsentell

Jun 12, 2009, 10:15 AM

I have windows, and the only reason I have Safari is for accessing MobileMe (shockingly, it doesn't like IE). I downloaded Safari 2 times, one for each system, as part of the Apple Software Update program, and I hardly use the thing. I also have Firefox, but only use it sites designed for it. Otherwise I use IE8 with no problems.

These numbers may be inflated a bit from people like me who like having a couple different browsers available. That may not translate into usage.

On a related note, my general boycott of all things Google prevents me from using Chromium.

MacLover4491

Jun 12, 2009, 10:16 AM

I am downloading safari 4 right now. Will give it a try. Usually it doesnt perform very well compared to Firefox and chrome

Shookster

Jun 12, 2009, 10:17 AM

I think a lot of people were just downloading it to try it out. The real question is - how many of that 100 million will still be using it this time next month?

sbrhwkp3

Jun 12, 2009, 10:17 AM

I love safari 4. The beta was lagging me down bad. This is very snappy, clean, and convenient.

ericinboston

Jun 12, 2009, 10:17 AM

reivilo

Jun 12, 2009, 10:18 AM

I contributed to this 11 million record. I downloaded Safari 4.0 and tested it on my iMac 20" G5 (I known, it's not the latest release). What I've found:

Heavy and slow program - more resources are used and the response time is slow, especially for additional features like the Topsites page.

Complicated interface - the address bar is a mess, combining too many buttons. The tabs are bigger so fewer pages could be opened simultaneously.

Poor ergonomics - there's no more a progress bar, but a nice message saying "Downloading". I want ergonomics back!

And the end of the day, I deleted Safari 4.0 and went back to Safari 3.2.3. Light and fast, ergonomic and reliable.

So 11,000,000 minus one = 10,999,999 :)

qbricc

Jun 12, 2009, 10:18 AM

slu

Jun 12, 2009, 10:19 AM

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5H11 Safari/525.20)

Maybe it is just me, but it doesn't seem that much faster than Firefox to me.

niuniu

Jun 12, 2009, 10:20 AM

So 11,000,000 minus one = 10,999,999 :)

Did you upload Apple a Safari 4 or what? :D

sishaw

Jun 12, 2009, 10:29 AM

Safari 4 and the beta both kills my work pc. If it is open it and all my other programs run at half speed. I would love to use it but it's a no go.

Funny thing is, it works beautifully on my 4-year old iBook--better than Firefox. It sometimes pauses a little while loading up a page, but in general, it's very smooth. Huh.

KCMichaelB

Jun 12, 2009, 10:31 AM

You gotta figure that most of those Windows downloads were Boot Camp users. I'm sure there's a few Safari fans on Windows, but lets not delude ourselves ...

Why would you think that? There are a lot of iPod Touch users that have Windows computers with iTunes and Quicktime installed. Why not Safari? I downloaded and installed Safari on 3 of my Windows computers.

amac4me

Jun 12, 2009, 10:37 AM

Hey, don't underestimate the impact of positive software experiences in the process of people switching from Windows OS to Mac. Safari was the second piece of Mac software I used after itunes on my PC and helped convince me that I wanted to switch over. Maybe all the recent news about the iphone has helped push Windows users towards other Mac software.

This is clearly Apple's motive ... expose Windows users to the look and feel of Mac OS X software with the hope that it will eventually encourage users to consider a Mac. It's brilliant.

BJMRamage

Jun 12, 2009, 10:38 AM

about 15 seconds for the reply page to load. not sure if it is Tiger or my work internet slowing it down but Safari 3 was FASTER at work.

Have yet to download for home use.

I HATE the "progress" mini bar, i liked the blue bar growing as the page loaded so I knew how much longer till the page was finished loading.

I also DISLIKE the STOP/REFRESH on the right side of the address bar.

Top Sites is cool but slow and slow to load a page when clicked.
History hangs with Cover Flow preview.

ok, not as great as Hyped for me just yet.

NinjaHERO

Jun 12, 2009, 10:40 AM

I just hope the more widespread use of Safari means that more sites start setting themselves up for it. The only reason I use firefox is because Safari had problems on half the sites I visit, like yahoo. Stupid yahoo, support safari.

lezzafeatures

Jun 12, 2009, 10:40 AM

Anyone found a method of copying Safari Bookmarks Leopard into Safari Bookmarks Windows XP without faffing about?
ie, the same easy way that firefox uses backup and restore....

wizard

Jun 12, 2009, 10:41 AM

You gotta figure that most of those Windows downloads were Boot Camp users. I'm sure there's a few Safari fans on Windows, but lets not delude ourselves ...

Safari is a very good alternative to the crap called Internet Explorer. More stable and faster.

Dave

Airforcekid

Jun 12, 2009, 10:41 AM

I cant get over when I click a link its instant internet explorer takes me about 10-15 seconds runs good on a Mac and PC!

Feng Shui

Jun 12, 2009, 10:44 AM

Safari 4 is crashing a lot because of flash scripts. Anyone else experiencing this problem?

mrrory

Jun 12, 2009, 10:50 AM

Wonder how many will junk it because there is no progress indication.

I won't junk it, but I WANT IT BACK! and move the refresh button back to where it was. There's absolutely no good reason to make these changes.

BongoBanger

Jun 12, 2009, 10:50 AM

I downloaded it mainly to get rid of that annoying blue beachball.

Think I'll stick with FireFox though - too many good extensions to switch.

guzhogi

Jun 12, 2009, 10:51 AM

Anyone found a method of copying Safari Bookmarks Leopard into Safari Bookmarks Windows XP without faffing about?
ie, the same easy way that firefox uses backup and restore....

Have you tried File -> Import/Export Bookmarks?

peterdevries

Jun 12, 2009, 11:00 AM

I cant get over when I click a link its instant internet explorer takes me about 10-15 seconds runs good on a Mac and PC!

You should try the new Macbooks. They come with full-stop and comma keys, which aid in people understanding your posts! ;)

csmitty

Jun 12, 2009, 11:02 AM

So the mac version moves the tabs back below. I think ill stick with the beta then. I installed the PC version at work and hate them on the bottom now. Glad I downloaded the beta. Never really had an issues with the beta. It'd be nice if they gave us the option to have them on top and bottom.

peterdevries

Jun 12, 2009, 11:02 AM

Safari 4 is crashing a lot because of flash scripts. Anyone else experiencing this problem?

That was already the case with Safari 3. It's a well-known problem, but doesn't appear to be anywhere near the top of the priority list of Adobe or Apple.

wizard

Jun 12, 2009, 11:03 AM

This just in!!! The entire 300+ million United States population is switching to digital television today!!! Oh wait...
I was going to jump on the bandwagon but have decided to put it off for awhile. Maybe a long while. It is just that I really don't need to spend money on a wide screen TV. Plus I get more enertainment these days out of the web.

It's a brave new world.

Dave

azentropy

Jun 12, 2009, 11:03 AM

3 here! Installed it on my cousins new Netbook. It's just lightning fast compared to any IE.

I installed the beta on my Samsung NC10 netbook, but haven't updated to final. The tabs as part of the window title bar was a real space saver, I don't want to lose that feature.

HailToTheVictor

Jun 12, 2009, 11:04 AM

I like how the user can click on the tab and an image of the screen appears so you can create a new window, a la chrome. However, I have not figured out how to put the tab back into the same window, like Chrome. Anyone?

Edit: Just playing with the Windows version, apparently you could do place the tab back into the window...

kas23

Jun 12, 2009, 11:08 AM

Safari 4 ownz. It's blazing faster on my PowerBook G4. Beautiful update. Can't wait until I try it on my new MBP which is current on it's way from China.

aricher

Jun 12, 2009, 11:09 AM

Safari 4 is crashing a lot because of flash scripts. Anyone else experiencing this problem?

I haven't had crashes on flash heavy sites but I've noticed that many flash-based sites are running much slower under Safari 4. I was looking at the Vaja cases site last night, all flash based & very slow in 4. Booted up Firefox to view the site instead.

EmperorDarius

Jun 12, 2009, 11:09 AM

Safari causes more headaches than anything other browser (Chrome, Firefox, IE8) on the machines that I installed it on. Back to a real browser......

Safari for Windows sucks. The OS X version is the real deal.

buffalo

Jun 12, 2009, 11:11 AM

I used software update to get Safari 4 on my iMac. Haven't yet done so on my MacBook. I gotta say, I am impressed by 4. It is quick and clean and the top sites is very nice. No crashes for me in the first couple days.

mcmlxix

Jun 12, 2009, 11:12 AM

Complicated interface - the address bar is a mess, combining too many buttons. The tabs are bigger so fewer pages could be opened simultaneously.

Poor ergonomics - there's no more a progress bar, but a nice message saying "Downloading". I want ergonomics back!

3 buttons in the address bar isn't too complicated for me, and the overall interface complexity is much less than IE and negligibly less than FF.

Actually it says Loading... It would be nice if instead of that it numerically displayed the percent complete. Or they could go back to the progress bar overlaid in the address bar. I always liked the that double duty of functionality saved screen real estate and made the status mar much more optional. But since Apple stopped doing it that way, I'm sure the change was deliberate for some reason...maybe one more move away from aqua color palate.

AdeFowler

Jun 12, 2009, 11:12 AM

Still using 4 beta and enjoying tabs on top ;)

You'd really think we'd be given a tab position option.

irnchriz

Jun 12, 2009, 11:15 AM

No, I opened iTunes yesterday, and it came up "Itunes is out of date bla bla bla...." and the update box had itunes checked, and it also had a box for new software, and safari 4 was in there, checked by default. I run windows 7, and I only use IE8.

If that was then case then either you had a very old version of Apple software update or you had previously installed Safari on your PC.

After users made a fuss about Apple software update setting Safari to install without the user selecting it they updated their software so that it would only show the other software which was available and not have the box checked to download it.

twoodcc

Jun 12, 2009, 11:16 AM

wow. now that is amazing. hopefully it'll continue to do well

selavy

Jun 12, 2009, 11:18 AM

Has anybody else experienced individual windows within Safari freezing? When I was trying it out I was filling out a survey and I lost all my work because I got frustrated with waiting and waiting for the page to un-freeze. It didn't affect other windows in the application, though. And there was no flash on the site at all. This totally put a bad taste in my mouth and now I'm on FF.

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 11:18 AM

I have all the packages on my flash drive to avoid having to wait to download it again and again.

I do miss the tabs on top.

Kar98

Jun 12, 2009, 11:19 AM

Well, I got it through Software Update, and as soon as Safari gets AdBlock Plus functionality and customizable tab behavior, I'll start using it.

irnchriz

Jun 12, 2009, 11:20 AM

appie57

Jun 12, 2009, 11:21 AM

I am happy with Safari 4: clean, very fast, no hangs or crashes. Better than the beta.

Doctor Q

Jun 12, 2009, 11:22 AM

ortuno2k

Jun 12, 2009, 11:25 AM

Downloaded it twice. Once on my Mac, another at work (Windows), with the intentions of keeping my bookmarks synced, but I'm thinking about using it as my main browser in lieu of Firefox.

r.j.s

Jun 12, 2009, 11:27 AM

Kar98

Jun 12, 2009, 11:29 AM

Command-R is much faster, and there are no mistakes.

Yeah, inventing a new two-key command to replace a single key or single click command that has been in use for over a decade is sooooo much faster, and there's no way there could be mistakes. Like accidentally pressing command q instead.

r.j.s

Jun 12, 2009, 11:32 AM

Yeah, inventing a new two-key command to replace a single key or single click command that has been in use for over a decade is sooooo much faster, and there's no way there could be mistakes. Like accidentally pressing command q instead.

It's not new ... been around for a while, and anyone that can type is not going to accidentally hit Q instead of R.

wizard

Jun 12, 2009, 11:33 AM

That is on my early 2008 MBP. I'm not running a lot of extensions or other crap but it works SNAPPY!

Is it perfect, probably not - what software is. The thing is for the sites I visit it is very fluid. Fluid and fast I like. Since I've installed haven't tried it on any e-commerce sites though, I don't know what will happen with more complex Java or Flash scripts.

What I do know is that Safari 4 clicks with me. It has pretty much replaced Firefox for me.

On a side note; if people do have an issue with a web site or an extension compatibility issue make sure you report it. Not just to Apple but if the a third party developer if required. Bugs can't be fixed if the developers don't know about them. Safari is bleeding edge so work to make it better.

Dave

nagromme

Jun 12, 2009, 11:40 AM

That was already the case with Safari 3. It's a well-known problem, but doesn't appear to be anywhere near the top of the priority list of Adobe or Apple.

I can't give numbers as proof, but my impression is that Safari 4 (Mac) does crash--almost always due to Flash--more often than Safari 3 did. Which is to say, still not all THAT often, but the final is no better than the beta in that regard. (Yes, for all I know, even if the crashing has increased since Safari 3, it could simply be that Flash banner ads are being used more on the sites I visit. I think it's something with 4, but I can't be sure.) It's not enough to make me want to go back to Safari 3 (I actually USE Top Sites, to my surprise), but I do think I notice some change.

However, two things that help a little:

1. Fixing Flash may not be Adobe's priority (which is why I want it to stay off my phone for now) but Apple IS concerned: they demonstrated how Snow Leopard's threading for Safari 4 will prevent Flash crashes. I wish it were September now!

2. History > Reopen All Windows from Last Session. It's like the crash never happened! :) (But one time in Safari 4 final, that command failed to do anything. Maybe coincidence, but it worked 100% of the time for me in Safari 4 beta and early. Still, one instances isn't a pattern.)

I'd say I get a crash about every other day of very heavy, varied use. (Turning off plugins to block Flash cures what ails you :) ) Before Safari 4, I'd say maybe one day in three. I can't compare to Firefox--it crashes sometimes, but I don't use it enough to compare.

It's not new ... been around for a while, and anyone that can type is not going to accidentally hit Q instead of R.

The R for Reload shorcut has been around for at least 10 years. No, more: I was using it back in my Netscape Navigator days! (And you're right, Q and R are nowhere near each other.)

Luckily, the new stop/reload click location is just as quick to click as the old (Stop, in fact, is a bigger target now). Just as quick, once your habits have adapted. Mine have. Change is always difficult to cope with for humans, of course.

I do wish the bargraph loading would return. It gave more information more clearly :( (I know you can alter a plist to get that back if you want.)

SteveLV702

Jun 12, 2009, 11:40 AM

3 times faster then firefox... I am gonna have to call BS on this one... Safari has been nothing but extremely slow for me on 97.5% of websites I have gone too a few sites with some javascript Chat Icons won't even load at all and so ended up just going back to firefox since its 20 times faster then Safari 4

avkills

Jun 12, 2009, 11:44 AM

Kick ass on my Dual 2Ghz G5. Way better than 3.

-mark

HyperZboy

Jun 12, 2009, 11:50 AM

Nearly 100 Crashes Reported to Apple & Still Counting...

I really wanna like Safari 4, honestly I do. It's wickedly fast and faster than any other browser I've ever tried. When it works, its just plain amazing compared to Firefox 2 or Firefox 3 and it's really even better than Firefox 3.5 beta and certainly better than Opera.

But, the fact of the matter is that since the first Safari 4.0 beta release, on every PowerPC Mac I've tested it on (both G4s and G5s), the browser crashes many times a day, more so than any other Mac program I own. As a beta tester, I was not that upset and just kept reporting the crashes to Apple hoping they would be fixed.

But now that the final version is released, I have to publicly complain.

The final Safari 4 release is incredibly bug-ridden and crashes even MORE now that the final version has been released!

Most of the crashes are spinning beachball crashes of unknown reason, occasionally Flashplayer is identified as the culprit, so I updated Flash too. Nope, that didn't fix it either. I often have to force-quit the browser too, something I rarely have to do on any other Mac program. The crashes occur on multiple PowerPC G4s and G5s, all running 10.5.7 (I intend to do some PowerPC Tiger tests soon to see if its as bad, but so far don't know). The crashes are not occurring on any one website either, everything from Macrumors to newspaper sites to Facebook.com to Ebay.

So why bother releasing a PPC version Apple if it isn't even stable?

Safari 3 was never a speed demon, but the one thing it had going for it was stability. Safari 3 rarely ever crashed on any of my PowerPC Macs. So I don't get it, I don't understand what the problem is. Nothing on my many Macs has changed other than upgrading to Safari 4.

To add insult to injury, Apple removed the SNAPBACK feature widely touted by Steve Jobs.
And Apple removed the Aqua visual progress bar of pages loading.

Add to that the constant daily PowerPC crashing & I think I will have to switch back to Safari 3 unless someone here has some suggestion or solution.

Just way too much crashing for a FINAL RELEASE.
I guess once again Apple spent all their time testing on INTEL Macs. :(

krye

Jun 12, 2009, 11:52 AM

Microsoft: eat it.

Ericatomars

Jun 12, 2009, 11:54 AM

so i downloaded it last night and i have no compliaints... It's actually way better... I like how it previews but the saving all my history gets alittle annoying! It looks clean and fresh. I'm using a alum 2.4 macbook and it works great...:apple:

Gaelic2

Jun 12, 2009, 12:00 PM

WOW!! I downloaded the Safari and it really sings! It is the fastest browser I've ever used and I have been using a browser of some type for over 20 years. K:Dudos to Apple. They did this one right!

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 12:00 PM

Jayomat

Jun 12, 2009, 12:01 PM

with the "AdBlock" and "SafariBlock" plugins, safari4 runs great in respect of undisturbed browsing experience

HyperZboy

Jun 12, 2009, 12:07 PM

1. Fixing Flash may not be Adobe's priority (which is why I want it to stay off my phone for now) but Apple IS concerned: they demonstrated how Snow Leopard's threading for Safari 4 will prevent Flash crashes. I wish it were September now!

Snow Leopard will not be a solution for PowerPC users to fix Safari crashes, so its kind of disturbing that Apple released such a buggy product.

By the way, the vast majority of my crashes on various G4s and G5s do not occur while playing Flash video at all, they are unidentified and in my opinion are Javascript related. Flash crashes are a very small minority of my daily multiple crashes.

Also, I'm unlike most people, I reset Safari often to clear caches and cookies, so if anything, I should be LESS likely to have Safari 4 crash than other PowerPC users. Since I'm using it on multiple PowerPC Macs, its also unlikely my problems are specific to my machines.

:(

stu3ufc

Jun 12, 2009, 12:14 PM

Finally MSN now works because Safari 4.0 is here

about ****ing time

Ryox

Jun 12, 2009, 12:16 PM

I really liked Safari, but 4 is just simply awesome.

lezzafeatures

Jun 12, 2009, 12:17 PM

Have you tried File -> Import/Export Bookmarks?

yes, all I get is a list of my Bookmarks in text format in Safari XP which can be dragged one at a time, there must be an easier way, surely!

ChromeAce

Jun 12, 2009, 12:19 PM

Too bad Safari 4 breaks the Places feature in iPhoto, as well as the Maperture plug-in for Aperture and 1Password.

And I want my Refresh Page button back on the left where it belongs!

Concorde Rules

Jun 12, 2009, 12:21 PM

Twice here!

EmperorDarius

Jun 12, 2009, 12:23 PM

And I want my Refresh Page button back on the left where it belongs!

You should get used to using the shortcut. It's shared among most of the browsers. And btw, OS X is all about shortcuts, so why not use them?

geenosr

Jun 12, 2009, 12:25 PM

[QUOTE=wizard;7794743]That is on my early 2008 MBP. I'm not running a lot of extensions or other crap but it works SNAPPY!

Wizard-Dave stole my thunder...I think it's SNAPPY too! (I couldn't believe it took 80 posts to get a snappy) Anyway I am using Safari 4 on both MS and OSX in my house and I really like it a lot. It has had a few crashes on my XP machine, but works like a charm on everything else. When all the add-ons come to S4 like FF I'll jump full time. I am used to all my FF do-dads, so I'll be mainly using it....but I do like S4.

Matariel

Jun 12, 2009, 12:28 PM

when they bundle it into software update, who would've thought? he he

Exactly, Its rediculous for Apple to expound the popularity of their browser when they push it to every OSX system automatically, and every Windows system with the Apple updater installed.

Its like Microsoft saying how awesome they are because they've pushed the latest WGA authorisation app to 4 billion Windows PCs.
I dont even remember Microsoft saying how many people have downloaded IE8, even though they offered it for download once it'd gone final, BEFORE it was pushed via Windows Update.

peterdevries

Jun 12, 2009, 12:29 PM

peterdevries

Jun 12, 2009, 12:30 PM

Benchmarks are always cherry picked to look good. Real life performance will vary and more so with other webpage nonsense.

Hey, what happened to your avatar? The previous one always looked so angry. It was kinda cool.. I miss it. :o

nagromme

Jun 12, 2009, 12:32 PM

Snow Leopard will not be a solution for PowerPC users to fix Safari crashes, so its kind of disturbing that Apple released such a buggy product.

By the way, the vast majority of my crashes on various G4s and G5s do not occur while playing Flash video at all, they are unidentified and in my opinion are Javascript related. Flash crashes are a very small minority of my daily multiple crashes.

Also, I'm unlike most people, I reset Safari often to clear caches and cookies, so if anything, I should be LESS likely to have Safari 4 crash than other PowerPC users. Since I'm using it on multiple PowerPC Macs, its also unlikely my problems are specific to my machines.

:(

It won't help Windows users either. (Does Safari 4 in Windows even have the same problem? I assume Flash, for one, is more stable there.)

I too have seen JavaScript-related crashes as the number two cause of crashes in Safari 4. Not common at all compared to Flash crashes, and if it was JUST the JS crashes I'd say Safari 4 was very solid. But when I do see a crash and it's not Flash, it's usually JavaScript. (To my untrained eye on the log!) Sometimes some kernel thing or other.

The good news about anything NOT related to Flash: Apple can fix it. Crashes WITH Flash? Maybe Apple can fix them. Maybe Adobe has to.

I wish Apple didn't HAVE to fix it--I'd rather there were no problem to begin with. But all software has bugs--it happens--and the crashes are rare enough (and Reopen All Windows reverses them) that I can survive OK for now. Lest's face it, even if Apple still called this version beta (and I do think it's better than THAT) I would still like it enough to use it and not wait for the next version.

But I do believe Safari 4 crashes more than 3, and that's worth people being warned of.

nagromme

Jun 12, 2009, 12:50 PM

EDIT: Sorry--two posts in a row? I thought it had been longer :o

I understand your pain, but technology is moving on, and so is Apple with the switch to Intel. You cannot expect any software/hardware manufacturer to support your hardware indefinitely with new releases. the amount of testing involved increases to a not manageable amount.
...

Actually I think Apple WILL support PowerPC users in the matter of these crashes. They seem to happen on both Intel and PPC, so if/when a fix comes, it will be offered to all Safari 4 users. Safari 4 works not only on Leopard PPC, but on TIGER too! That's very GOOD legacy support. Technology does move on, you're right, and eventually support goes ways--but Safari 4 is not an example of this.

Exactly, Its rediculous for Apple to expound the popularity of their browser when they push it to every OSX system automatically, and every Windows system with the Apple updater installed.
...

It's not ridiculous--it's absolutely necessary. You're thinking of this information like it's childish schoolyard bragging. That's how forums operate, but not now smart corporations act :p It's not about a "game" where bragging isn't "fair." It's necessary for Apple to publicize numbers that show the growth of Safari's user base. Why?

Because DEVELOPERS need to know that making sure about Safari support is becoming more and more important. That's a vital business factor, not a bragging game.

Which is also tied to the iPhone/iPod: they use the same rendering engine. Apple wants Web sites and Web apps to be well-supported on Safari in all its flavors.

tirerim

Jun 12, 2009, 12:51 PM

And some of them are probably people like me, who downloaded it without checking the system requirements, discovered it required 10.5.7, and haven't looked at it since. (Given the number of reports of issues with 10.5.7, I'm sticking with 10.5.6 until 10.5.8, thanks.) Fortunately, the beta (with Saft) works just fine for me.

mdriftmeyer

Jun 12, 2009, 12:56 PM

It won't help Windows users either. (Does Safari 4 in Windows even have the same problem? I assume Flash, for one, is more stable there.)

I too have seen JavaScript-related crashes as the number two cause of crashes in Safari 4. Not common at all compared to Flash crashes, and if it was JUST the JS crashes I'd say Safari 4 was very solid. But when I do see a crash and it's not Flash, it's usually JavaScript. (To my untrained eye on the log!) Sometimes some kernel thing or other.

The good news about anything NOT related to Flash: Apple can fix it. Crashes WITH Flash? Maybe Apple can fix them. Maybe Adobe has to.

I wish Apple didn't HAVE to fix it--I'd rather there were no problem to begin with. But all software has bugs--it happens--and the crashes are rare enough (and Reopen All Windows reverses them) that I can survive OK for now. Lest's face it, even if Apple still called this version beta (and I do think it's better than THAT) I would still like it enough to use it and not wait for the next version.

But I do believe Safari 4 crashes more than 3, and that's worth people being warned of.

Better yet, those web sites can hire developers who write Javascript that have zero defects.

fixmymac

Jun 12, 2009, 12:58 PM

Guys. I need some feedback on something worrying i have discovered.

If you are running Safari 4 on Mac OS X 10.4.x, could you all try the following for me and let me know your results.

1. Create a new user on your Mac. Make that user a Managed one.
2. Enable the Safari Parental Controls.
3. Log in to the account you have just created.
4. Try to visit a site that is not in the bookmarks.
5. Instead of typing in Admin credentials, when prompted, simply click Cancel.

What happens?

6. Now, try it again with proper admin credentials entered and click on OK

What happens?

Thanks for your help.

Voidness

Jun 12, 2009, 01:15 PM

I still won't use it though, since it doesn't have basic features I need, like switching the language of the spell correction. So I'll stick to firefox.
You can switch the language of the spell correction. Just right click on a text field > Spelling and Grammar > Show Spelling and Grammar. You'll get a floating window for spell check, which also has a drop down menu of languages. This also applies to all Cocoa applications. :)

wlh99

Jun 12, 2009, 01:15 PM

I was going to jump on the bandwagon but have decided to put it off for awhile. Maybe a long while. It is just that I really don't need to spend money on a wide screen TV. Plus I get more enertainment these days out of the web.

It's a brave new world.

Dave

Off topic, but DTV has little to do with widescreen TV's. It has to do with the over the air (antenna) transmission format. It is changing from NTSC to ATSC. If you have cable or Satallite, there is no bandwagon to jump on to. If you have an Antenna on your roof and didn't buy a new set or converter box, your TV stops working today.

On topic:
How many of the 11 million downloaders don't even know what Safari is or does? We have 50 PC's at work. Most have Safari due to Apples using updater to install it. Apple is using Microsoft tactics to make thier browser look more popular than it really is.

peterdevries

Jun 12, 2009, 01:21 PM

fixmymac

Jun 12, 2009, 01:24 PM

It's not very likely that people will try this when you don't explain what it is that is worrying you..

In addition, people might have an answer for your problem without having to try this.

Hi. Point taken.

However, because of what may happen (if this is, in fact, a bug) i deliberately did not divulge.

I have tested 10 systems and the problem is present on them all of them. Affects both PPC and Intel but does not affect 10.5 at all. I have spent almost all of today trying the most obvious fixes. I repair Macs for a living.

This potential bug is of concern to you if you have kids using Managed accounts on 10.4.x with Safari 4.

I am trying to be responsible here :D

maestro55

Jun 12, 2009, 01:32 PM

To be honest, I did the update but I am still using Firefox on this machine. However, it doesn't surprise me that it has gotten a lot of downloads, I am just waiting to see what happens when Google gets Chrome on mac.

slapppy

Jun 12, 2009, 01:38 PM

Safari always renders pages so beautifully. Functionality and for add ons Firefox is the best. :)

Internet Explorer when you are forced to use a site that forces you to use it. :mad:

morespce54

Jun 12, 2009, 01:38 PM

Thats my only grievance really

yes, this and the fact that it took me soooo long to find out where is the "reload" button... :o

mikeinternet

Jun 12, 2009, 01:44 PM

I thoroughly enjoy the top sites screen. Have it set as my default now. Love how it checks sites for updates, I didn't realize that until Schiller mentioned it at the keynote.
Almost takes the fun out of checking all my favs. One glance... nothing new... on with my life.

aristotle

Jun 12, 2009, 01:47 PM

So...what's the big hoopla, in general, about Safari? I own both Windows and Macs and I use either IE or Firefox on Windows and FF 100% on the Macs. I don't have any Mac friends/peers so I don't know what the big deal is about Safari as a whole. FF was released the same time as Safari.

Also, as some have implied on this thread, is Safari bundled with iTunes and/or Mac OS so that if an "update" is done for either iTunes or the OS that the user is forced to get Safari...and hence count as a "download" on this announcement? If so, that would hugely skew the announcement since people are being forced to get it.

-Eric
Nobody is being forced to get it. Firefox on the mac is crap, absolute crap. I prefer Safari in OS X because it is the fastest browser on that platform. Safari is not only faster but it also is the most standards compliant to date.

Why are you such a fanboy of Firefox? I like using Firefox on windows but I don't understand the appeal of firefox on a mac. It is way too slow, unstable and still has a non-native feel to it.

HyperZboy

Jun 12, 2009, 01:50 PM

I understand your pain, but technology is moving on, and so is Apple with the switch to Intel. You cannot expect any software/hardware manufacturer to support your hardware indefinitely with new releases. the amount of testing involved increases to a not manageable amount.

What Apple could or maybe should do is be more clear as to which hardware can run which software optimally like most windows software does. Alternatively, Apple could for example disable Safari 4 for PPC machines, but I guess that would piss off even more people.

Apple is one of few companies in the world that is ridiculously cash-rich.

Of course, if Apple didn't release Safari 4.0 for PowerPC, I'd be complaining, that's very true.
But the fact of the matter is that Apple did it because it has a financial interest in doing so and to increase the % of Safari users across 4 platforms simultaneously and thus affect marketshare and increase revenue. It's not like they released it for PowerPC out of "kindness." LOL

So, if Apple's going to make that business decision, well, ummm, guess what?

They need to get it right on all 4 platforms!

I think it's embarrassing that I have to tell people who ask about my Apple Macs that the most buggy program I have on 5 computers is APPLE SAFARI & while surfing the web, especially considering Apple has all the OS hooks to get it right more so than any other software company!

It's just inexcusable in my opinion for a browser to crash 5-10X a day, but I'm still holding out hope for a Safari 4.1 or a Flashplayer update that fixes this.
I'm still undecided whether i'm going to revert to Safari 3 or just use Firefox a little more often.
Dilemma. :(

morespce54

Jun 12, 2009, 01:57 PM

I keep moving my cursor to the left of the address bar to click the reload icon, then remembering it's on the right of the address bar now. It's not something you can customize either. So far I've made that mistake 11 million times, but I expect I'll get used to it eventually.

Actually, it's one thing to get rid of a functional and informative UI element (aka as the "progress bar") but it's an other thing to completely switch useful UI from left-to-right (aka as the "reload button")... :(

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 01:59 PM

Hey, what happened to your avatar? The previous one always looked so angry. It was kinda cool.. I miss it. :oI'll change it back if it was so liked.

I'm still having font rendering weirdness on Safari under Windows. It seems to take its own path from ClearType. I've tweaked it's local font smoothing drop down but it's still no pleasant as it was under Safari 4 Beta.

BRLawyer

Jun 12, 2009, 02:03 PM

I didn't even know Safari 4 was released. You can add a +1 to that count in a moment :o

It's the best and fastest browser on Earth...should we be surprised? It hasn't crashed a single time on me yet, with flawless compatibility and performance.

MS IS DEAD.

HyperZboy

Jun 12, 2009, 02:06 PM

Nobody is being forced to get it. Firefox on the mac is crap, absolute crap. I prefer Safari in OS X because it is the fastest browser on that platform. Safari is not only faster but it also is the most standards compliant to date.

Why are you such a fanboy of Firefox? I like using Firefox on windows but I don't understand the appeal of firefox on a mac. It is way too slow, unstable and still has a non-native feel to it.

Sorry, but the Firefox 3.5 Mac beta is significantly more stable than Safari 4 by FAR!

It is a bit slower, true, however 3.5 is faster than 3.0 & 2.0. Also, Firefox is more compatible with some websites because more websites code FOR Firefox specifically.
"Standards compliant" obviously means a lot to geeks like us, but it is rubbish to the average user. I understand why it's a good thing, but it doesn't change the fact that so many websites are not following the principle.

I can still count on my hands the # of times Firefox 3.5 BETA has crashed.
I've lost track of how many times Safari 4 has crashed, but I figure since the original beta, it has to be up there over 80-90X, or close to 100.

I need a browser that doesn't crash 5X a day.

Firefox 3.5 BETA doesn't.
Safari 4 FINAL does.
It's just that simple.

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 02:08 PM

It's the best and fastest browser on Earth...should we be surprised? It hasn't crashed a single time on me yet, with flawless compatibility and performance.Safari 4 does crash more gracefully when it does. I haven't had it lock my system yet requiring a reboot. Not to mention it'll skip the crash report tool as well.

Snow Leopard looks to finally kill off of the plug-in issue that has plagued Safari and OS X for ages. I wonder how it'll carry over to FireFox.

MS IS DEAD.I wonder how you'll feel to see the percentage of Windows downloads vs. OS X ones of Safari. Not to mention every other browser that someone could use and those poor Linux users left in the cold. You forgot that some key components were ported over into DLL format as well.

DELLsFan

Jun 12, 2009, 02:11 PM

i still miss the tabs on the top. that was a feature apple emphasized in the beta. not that it made much of a difference but i def got used to it

Ok, I don't get the "tabs on top vs. bottom" complaint. The tabs are at the top of the page ... kinda like FireFox's tabs. Are you guys talking about the orientation of the tabs at the top of the page, or are you talking about the tabs being at the bottom of the page?

Screenshot lesson from Beta vs. today might help. :cool:

I LOVE Safari 4. Installed at work and on two machines at home. Top Sites is just an amazing feature. I love browsing my morning sites right from the Top Sites interface! Well done, Apple!

tirerim

Jun 12, 2009, 02:16 PM

It's the best and fastest browser on Earth...should we be surprised? It hasn't crashed a single time on me yet, with flawless compatibility and performance.

MS IS DEAD.

Give me a break. It's still a browser -- they all suck, it's just that some of them suck less than others. Saft (for crash protection) and ClickToFlash make it mostly usable, but I certainly wouldn't trust it alone. (Admittedly, I'm still on the beta, since I don't have 10.5.7, but I find it unlikely that the release is that much better.) And a better browser is not going to make anyone switch from Windows to OS X, especially since that same browser is available on Windows.

tirerim

Jun 12, 2009, 02:25 PM

Sorry, but the Firefox 3.5 Mac beta is significantly more stable than Safari 4 by FAR!

It is a bit slower, true, however 3.5 is faster than 3.0 & 2.0. Also, Firefox is more compatible with some websites because more websites code FOR Firefox specifically.
"Standards compliant" obviously means a lot to geeks like us, but it is rubbish to the average user. I understand why it's a good thing, but it doesn't change the fact that so many websites are not following the principle.

I can still count on my hands the # of times Firefox 3.5 BETA has crashed.
I've lost track of how many times Safari 4 has crashed, but I figure since the original beta, it has to be up there over 80-90X, or close to 100.

I need a browser that doesn't crash 5X a day.

Firefox 3.5 BETA doesn't.
Safari 4 FINAL does.
It's just that simple.

I can count to 1023 on my hands, so I'm not sure what you're implying. :-P

I find that Safari 4 beta crashes about as often as Firefox 3 (which is not very frequently). I have crash protection for both of them at this point, so fortunately it isn't a huge deal for either, though the time spent reloading all of my tabs is annoying.

How does Firefox 3.5 deal with large numbers of tabs (50-100)? I'm still waiting for a browser that doesn't waste CPU cycles on tabs that aren't doing anything, though Safari 4 is better about this than Safari 3, I think.

synth3tik

Jun 12, 2009, 02:26 PM

I will say the only time I would dl Safari would be by accident. That's a lot of accidents.

tirerim

Jun 12, 2009, 02:28 PM

Ok, I don't get the "tabs on top vs. bottom" complaint. The tabs are at the top of the page ... kinda like FireFox's tabs. Are you guys talking about the orientation of the tabs at the top of the page, or are you talking about the tabs being at the bottom of the page?

Screenshot lesson from Beta vs. today might help. :cool:

I LOVE Safari 4. Installed at work and on two machines at home. Top Sites is just an amazing feature. I love browsing my morning sites right from the Top Sites interface! Well done, Apple!

I'm too lazy to take a screenshot, but in the beta the tabs are actually in the title bar of the window, next to the close/minimize/maximize buttons, and above the URL bar and other controls. I'm assuming from comments that in the release they're back below the bookmark bar, just above the actual page, where they used to be.

I think that's probably better -- the problem with having them in the title bar is that there's no to see the full title of a page with a long title.

morespce54

Jun 12, 2009, 02:33 PM

Okay, something (kind of) weird... maybe it's just me but...

On Safari 4, I turn on "private browsing" and I log-in to yahoo (or any other site I've already visited and logged-in with Safari 3).

Then, I log-out and quit.

Then I reopen Safari (with "private browsing" on or off), then I visit one of the websites I visited while in "private browsing" mode, I often end up as already logged-in (and no, I do not check the "remember me" boxes)...

weird...

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 02:33 PM

I will say the only time I would dl Safari would be by accident. That's a lot of accidents.I accidentally a Safari. 11 million times.

EmperorDarius

Jun 12, 2009, 02:35 PM

Saft (for crash protection)

Looks interesting. But I don't understand what are the differences between the free(?) and commercial version.

EDIT: Got it.

BRLawyer

Jun 12, 2009, 02:48 PM

Safari 4 does crash more gracefully when it does. I haven't had it lock my system yet requiring a reboot. Not to mention it'll skip the crash report tool as well.

Safari 4 hasn't crashed a SINGLE time for me, let alone making me reboot the machine (actually I've never had it make me reboot my Mac)...you must be talking about Windows, right? :rolleyes:

Elegantwarfare

Jun 12, 2009, 02:50 PM

Is there a Terminal command to restore the progress indicator like in the beta?

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 02:53 PM

Safari 4 hasn't crashed a SINGLE time for me, let alone making me reboot the machine (actually I've never had it make me reboot my Mac)...you must be talking about Windows, right? :rolleyes:I haven't had a browser take down my operating system in Windows since IE 6 and Windows XP pre-SP2.

Sadly Safari and FireFox are horrifically prone to locking a machine and rendering Force Quit useless as well under OS X due to plug-in weirdness in most cases. Nothing gets written to log and you have to hold down the power button to recover.

Place this problem up there with randomly waking Macbooks.

wizard

Jun 12, 2009, 03:07 PM

nagromme

Jun 12, 2009, 03:43 PM

Better yet, those web sites can hire developers who write Javascript that have zero defects.

Regardless of whether the page has bugs in the text code, a browser should not be crashable that way--and certainly not commonly. It should gracefully tolerate bad JS without crashing the rest of the browser. And I'm skeptical that bad JS is the cause anyway: I visit the same page again, do the same thing, and it's fine.

immaculate

Jun 12, 2009, 04:08 PM

I've been trying out Safari 4 in Windows XP (running in VM Fusion) and it's been extremely slow and unresponsive. Top Sites take ages to render, delete etc, and the Edit/Done button disappears from the bottom left corner. Plus the first Top Site (top left) doesn't render properly, with a vertical strip missing from the page image.

Is anyone else seeing this in XP (in VM Fusion, or native)?

o9ski

Jun 12, 2009, 04:27 PM

It makes me wonder as to why Europeans are not getting after Apple's automatic upload in antitrust action as they do to Windows.
...too small to skin and fry?

Goona

Jun 12, 2009, 04:32 PM

One thing I like about Firefox is if you close the browser or if it crashes, it saves all you tabs so when you come back, you can resume where you left off. I've noticed Safari doesn't do this, am I doing something wrong?

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 04:33 PM

One thing I like about Firefox is if you close the browser or if it crashes, it saves all you tabs so when you come back, you can resume where you left off.You can do the same in Safari but it's not automatic.

Goona

Jun 12, 2009, 04:34 PM

It makes me wonder as to why Europeans are not getting after Apple's automatic upload in antitrust action as they do to Windows.
...too small to skin and fry?

What the heck are you talking about?

You can do the same in Safari but it's not automatic.
How you turn it on?

I've been trying out Safari 4 in Windows XP (running in VM Fusion) and it's been extremely slow and unresponsive. Top Sites take ages to render, delete etc, and the Edit/Done button disappears from the bottom left corner. Plus the first Top Site (top left) doesn't render properly, with a vertical strip missing from the page image.

Is anyone else seeing this in XP (in VM Fusion, or native)?

I'm using it on an XP laptop and it's just a lil faster than Firefox, some cases it even seems slower.

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 04:38 PM

How you turn it on?It's always on but the recovery isn't automatic.

History -> Reopen All Windows From Last Session

That's what it looks like in Windows. I don't have my Macbook with my right now.

BRLawyer

Jun 12, 2009, 04:40 PM

It's always on but the recovery isn't automatic.

History -> Reopen All Windows From Last Session

That's what it looks like in Windows. I don't have my Macbook with my right now.

Same on Macs.

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 04:44 PM

Same on Macs.I haven't used it much so I thought it might say something about Tabs as well. It'll reopen all the windows and tabs from a previous session and it effectively works like the recover does in FireFox.

EmperorDarius

Jun 12, 2009, 04:47 PM

It makes me wonder as to why Europeans are not getting after Apple's automatic upload in antitrust action as they do to Windows.
...too small to skin and fry?

Maybe because the browser isn't attached to the OS like on Windows?

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 04:48 PM

Maybe because the browser isn't attached to the OS like on Windows?Your mileage may vary with WebKit, its libraries, and binaries.

Check the package installer out.

MacLover4491

Jun 12, 2009, 05:04 PM

i turned on my windows machine today and i got notified from apple software update to update itunes and safari 4. Safari 4 is checked. I think apple wants to force people to do the update. Wonder why the number of downloads is so high.

Eidorian

Jun 12, 2009, 05:11 PM

cocky jeremy

Jun 12, 2009, 05:34 PM

Safari causes more headaches than anything other browser (Chrome, Firefox, IE8) on the machines that I installed it on. Back to a real browser......

If you're on Winblows, you probably need a real machine.

BRLawyer

Jun 12, 2009, 06:24 PM

If you're on Winblows, you probably need a real machine.

Exactly...Safari has seen ZERO crashes on my Mac and ZERO compatibility problems with any site I visit, not to mention the performance, way above any other crappy browser. Up to now, a flawless experience.

windywoo

Jun 12, 2009, 06:37 PM

If you're on Winblows, you probably need a real machine.

What, like an iMac or a mini? Laptop components passed off as desktop? Windows will give you far more machine for your money, it just won't qualify as a "style accessory".

windywoo

Jun 12, 2009, 07:02 PM

Microsoft: eat it.

What a laugh. Their browser will still be default on 90% of machines out there, and they'll still have about 70% of the browser share whether Safari is faster or not.

I like the speed of the new Safari, but Jesus are Apple ignorant when it comes to browsers. I have to use Onyx to make sure it opens links consistently in tabs not windows. It won't open my previous tabs by default when I open it, and when I do go to History to reopen them, it doesn't remember the history within those tabs. I can't click back to see the previous page, because as far as Safari is concerned, there is no page to go back to.

When you select text and choose search it insists on opening the search in the same tab, and if you select a link, you can't search for the text of the link, or even copy the text of that link.

And just to add my voice here, tabs on top were a great feature, giving in to the tabs below crowd showed lack of balls.

Chrome had a huge number of downloads in its first few days, its only at 2% share now. Thats pretty good, but nothing like the share it would have had if its initial download rate had continued.

clevin

Jun 12, 2009, 07:08 PM

yeah, IE was downloaded 500 million times the first day Micorsoft bundled it as update!.

lol, Monopoly is fun, isn't it?

windywoo

Jun 12, 2009, 07:10 PM

You scoff at MS monopoly, but where is the competition? Not Apple, so long as they continue to restrict their OS to select hardware.

clevin

Jun 12, 2009, 07:14 PM

No, i shouldn't compare apple to MS, apple is worse, people actually "downloaded" safari when they thought they are updating iTunes.....

Apple, how low. 11 million? lMAO

3Gmatt

Jun 12, 2009, 08:33 PM

clevin

Jun 12, 2009, 08:36 PM

Ok, I am prepared to accept dumb-ass related flaming on this one.

How can I make the URL bar smarter? It doesn't seem to be as smart as Firefox. For instance if you type in say 'James May' it doesn't pull up your James May Telegraph UK bookmark even though 'James May' is in the URL and page title (albeit not at the start of either).

So is this fixable or just something they have to work on?

Thanks.

(btw running on Mac OS 10.5.7)
the question should be, and actually has been asked multiple times at Mac Application board.

There is no answer to it. It has pros and cons, this is a con for sure.

yeah it saves 0.01 sec when loading js, while it needs extra 2 sec to find the website you are looking for.... (my thoughts)

heisetax

Jun 12, 2009, 09:09 PM

Safari causes more headaches than anything other browser (Chrome, Firefox, IE8) on the machines that I installed it on. Back to a real browser......

Like you I've had some strange screens. One was a reply screen to a local organization. It said that I was using either a very old browser or one that did not meet browser standards. It told me to use IE8. I did not get this screen when using FireFox 3.

Jeff321

Jun 12, 2009, 11:16 PM

Hum if you've installed iTunes on Windows the software update DOES NOT ask you to install Safari. The only way it'll show Safari 4 as an update is if you have safari 3 installed. And since it is quite simple to not download the update ( a simple check ) there is no way that more than a dozen people downloaded Safari 4 without meaning to do so. Plus no regular windows user is using Safari. You have to go a bit off the beaten path in order to install Safari on windows.

This is false, I've never installed Safari but just having iTunes/QuickTime will cause it to check for updates and it tries to install Safari by default there. It's quite annoying. I'm sure many Windows iTunes users didn't care and just let it install Safari even though they may never use it. And since they had Safari it then upgraded them.

Apple is definitely doing some shady stuff to boost their numbers here.

Here's a complaint about it: http://slashdot.org/story/08/03/22/1536250/Mozilla-CEO-Objects-To-Safari-Auto-Install?art_pos=8

dL.

Jun 12, 2009, 11:19 PM

Awesome! Safari 4 (and especially 4, not 3) is the fastest and the best browser I've ever used.

dL

iPhoneNYC

Jun 12, 2009, 11:26 PM

Working fine for me.

Pika

Jun 13, 2009, 12:03 AM

My fav browser.

sonictonic

Jun 13, 2009, 12:20 AM

Screw Safari 4, I installed it and half of my widgets freaked out and stopped loading. I did a repair permissions, reboots, reset of the P-RAM, trashed some pref files, reinstalled said widgets, and still it wasn't fixed. So I used Time Machine and I am back on Safari 3 until this crap gets sorted out. It's obviously not far from being "out of beta."

Abyssgh0st

Jun 13, 2009, 12:24 AM

I like Safari 4, it's a lot sexier than 3.

thecheda

Jun 13, 2009, 01:18 AM

I think I will stick with Google Chrome.

peterdevries

Jun 13, 2009, 02:40 AM

I like the speed of the new Safari, but Jesus are Apple ignorant when it comes to browsers. I have to use Onyx to make sure it opens links consistently in tabs not windows. It won't open my previous tabs by default when I open it, and when I do go to History to reopen them, it doesn't remember the history within those tabs. I can't click back to see the previous page, because as far as Safari is concerned, there is no page to go back to.

Just as other browsers have features that Safari doesn't have, Safari has features that other browser don't have. Live with the fact that in every piece of software you will be missing features that you would like to have or that are available in other software.

There is only one piece of software that tries to do everything for its type of software. It is called Windows and it sucks at it.

TuffLuffJimmy

Jun 13, 2009, 02:43 AM

I wish I had the option to have the tabs on top, even if they defaulted to the bottom. I don't use my mouse to select tabs, usually just the keyboard so it wouldn't have been very awkward.

Sehnsucht

Jun 13, 2009, 03:16 AM

Firefox is still my default, although I am using Safari 4 on Win7 at the moment. As for those who are reporting weird crashes and glitches with S4, I'm just shaking my head...:confused: No bugs, never crashed, none, not once, not at all, never, never at all...etc. :D It's been completely 100% stable on both sides of the Boot Camp fence.

And yes, it is faster than IE.

You scoff at MS monopoly, but where is the competition? Not Apple, so long as they continue to restrict their OS to select hardware.

http://i485.photobucket.com/albums/rr214/TheDavidFrom1988/YouFailAtFailing.jpg

:D

immaculate

Jun 13, 2009, 08:35 AM

This is what the glitchy rendering looks like.

windywoo

Jun 13, 2009, 08:49 AM

Sehnsucht I know you think you're clever for linking that picture, but in reality a 12 year old can do it. I bet you think the image is real too.

windywoo

Jun 13, 2009, 08:57 AM

Just as other browsers have features that Safari doesn't have, Safari has features that other browser don't have. Live with the fact that in every piece of software you will be missing features that you would like to have or that are available in other software.

There is only one piece of software that tries to do everything for its type of software. It is called Windows and it sucks at it.
No sorry, Safari has no features that I can't find in other browsers. And please, Windows doesn't try to do everything, you must be getting mixed up with a Mac which comes pre-installed with the iLife bollocks that I won't need, Time Machine I won't use, iCal, iChat, etc. All this talk on this forum about MS bloat, when I run MonoLingual on my iBook I save 3GB from multi-language help files.

If Windows is "trying to do everything" its because it has no competition, it has a far wider range of people to support than OSX.

Maury

Jun 13, 2009, 09:11 AM

Heavy and slow program - more resources are used and the response time is slow, especially for additional features like the Topsites page.

Safari 4 is the fastest browser on either the Mac or PC by a wide margin. I tested against Mac FF and Windows FF and Chrome. Safari 4 was clearly faster than any of them on /., ars, here and my banking site.

Complicated interface - the address bar is a mess, combining too many buttons. The tabs are bigger so fewer pages could be opened simultaneously.

My address bar has two buttons and two fields. It has less buttons than any other browser I have.

Poor ergonomics - there's no more a progress bar, but a nice message saying "Downloading". I want ergonomics back![/QUOTE]

Ergonomics is the study of the physical arrangement of objects in real space in relation to the human body.

Maury

Eidorian

Jun 13, 2009, 10:48 AM

This is what the glitchy rendering looks like.It's a rarer under OS X but it does happen from time to time.

Sehnsucht

Jun 13, 2009, 12:00 PM

Sehnsucht I know you think you're clever for linking that picture, but in reality a 12 year old can do it. I bet you think the image is real too.

Oh, yeah, totally... :rolleyes:

Eidorian

Jun 13, 2009, 12:02 PM

Firefox is still my default, although I am using Safari 4 on Win7 at the moment. As for those who are reporting weird crashes and glitches with S4, I'm just shaking my head...:confused: No bugs, never crashed, none, not once, not at all, never, never at all...etc. :D It's been completely 100% stable on both sides of the Boot Camp fence.

And yes, it is faster than IE.Safari 4 is solid under Windows short of a few rendering quirks but it's still a bit instant quit prone under OS X. You'll go back to the page only to have it work just fine.

peterdevries

Jun 13, 2009, 01:24 PM

No sorry, Safari has no features that I can't find in other browsers. And please, Windows doesn't try to do everything, you must be getting mixed up with a Mac which comes pre-installed with the iLife bollocks that I won't need, Time Machine I won't use, iCal, iChat, etc. All this talk on this forum about MS bloat, when I run MonoLingual on my iBook I save 3GB from multi-language help files.

If Windows is "trying to do everything" its because it has no competition, it has a far wider range of people to support than OSX.

You are mixing some things up here. Just chuck the iLife programs in the waste bin.. No problem. Do the same with Time Machine.. Also no problem. And in addition. Having iLife and not using it doesn't slow down my machine. But each windows program that is installed on a windows machine and is not used does...

Try deleting notepad in windows or the media player and you will have a much harder time.

Concerning Monolingual: the additional languages don't slow your machine down, and 3Gb cost only a few cents nowadays. The added convenience of having all languages for most of the user population are more valuable than those few that juggle the last few Gb on their machines. Many of the user population live in Europe where we regularly switch between languages.

ITMacRN

Jun 13, 2009, 01:26 PM

Will never make the full time switch to Safari until they allow the option of viewing bookmarks in the sidebar as in Firefox.

windywoo

Jun 13, 2009, 01:50 PM

You are mixing some things up here. Just chuck the iLife programs in the waste bin.. No problem. Do the same with Time Machine.. Also no problem. And in addition. Having iLife and not using it doesn't slow down my machine. But each windows program that is installed on a windows machine and is not used does...

Try deleting notepad in windows or the media player and you will have a much harder time.

Concerning Monolingual: the additional languages don't slow your machine down, and 3Gb cost only a few cents nowadays. The added convenience of having all languages for most of the user population are more valuable than those few that juggle the last few Gb on their machines. Many of the user population live in Europe where we regularly switch between languages.

All these things are obvious, I am just commenting on the bloat that is a default install on a Mac. Having a program installed and not used on a Windows system is no more harmful than on OSX.

I am sure you do switch between languages, but between Chinese? Iranian? But now you are using the same logic Windows does, the extra bloat in Windows is there because its better to include that than have lots of users asking where it is.

manu chao

Jun 13, 2009, 01:59 PM

This is false, I've never installed Safari but just having iTunes/QuickTime will cause it to check for updates and it tries to install Safari by default there. It's quite annoying. I'm sure many Windows iTunes users didn't care and just let it install Safari even though they may never use it. And since they had Safari it then upgraded them.

Apple is definitely doing some shady stuff to boost their numbers here.

Here's a complaint about it: http://slashdot.org/story/08/03/22/1536250/Mozilla-CEO-Objects-To-Safari-Auto-Install?art_pos=8
And how old is that story? More than a year, this is really old news. Right now (and it has been like this for about a year), Apple Software Update on Windows does offer you Safari but with an unchecked box whereas updates to installed Apple software, eg, iTunes, have their box checked and you only have to hit enter. To install Safari you also have to check a checkbox.
Yes, initially when Safari for Windows appeared for the first time, that box was checked. But after large protests Apple changed that with a few months.

EmperorDarius

Jun 13, 2009, 02:02 PM

All these things are obvious, I am just commenting on the bloat that is a default install on a Mac. Having a program installed and not used on a Windows system is no more harmful than on OSX.
It is when what's installed is an antivirus software trial, which are generally difficult to remove completely, and which do nothing but slow down the system. I don't think that iLife really slows down the system. Besides, Windows gets much more slower than OS X with time, and even slower when you install apps.

I am sure you do switch between languages, but between Chinese? Iranian? But now you are using the same logic Windows does, the extra bloat in Windows is there because its better to include that than have lots of users asking where it is.

Languages are a different thing. Usually the more = the better. And besides, with Monolingual removing extra languages becomes very easy and quick.

peterdevries

Jun 13, 2009, 03:34 PM

No sorry, Safari has no features that I can't find in other browsers.

Top Sites?

jbembe

Jun 13, 2009, 04:48 PM

Is "APPLE-T" now cool or what!?! The new browser is really sweet.

windywoo

Jun 13, 2009, 06:09 PM

Top Sites?

Chrome.

KevinN206

Jun 14, 2009, 02:51 AM

groovebuster

Jun 14, 2009, 03:41 AM

Top Sites?

Well, sometimes you might wonder about the design choices at Apple.

Our daughter (8 y.o.) uses the old iBook G4 (with Tiger) of my wife with parental control enabled. I thought that Safari 4 would be cool for her, because she could see all her favourite websites right away instead of clicking somewhere in the bookmarks with the need to read everything all the time.

Know what? Top Sites is disabled when parental control is on! A feature that would be cool also for kids. Weird... And dissapointing.

groovebuster

EmperorDarius

Jun 14, 2009, 04:21 AM

Well, sometimes you might wonder about the design choices at Apple.

Our daughter (8 y.o.) uses the old iBook G4 (with Tiger) of my wife with parental control enabled. I thought that Safari 4 would be cool for her, because she could see all her favourite websites right away instead of clicking somewhere in the bookmarks with the need to read everything all the time.

Know what? Top Sites is disabled when parental control is on! A feature that would be cool also for kids. Weird... And dissapointing.

groovebuster

I think it's more like a bug...You should report that to Apple.
Or don't use parental control.
Or use a third party parental control software.
Probably the first option.

fixmymac

Jun 14, 2009, 04:38 AM

Well, sometimes you might wonder about the design choices at Apple.

Our daughter (8 y.o.) uses the old iBook G4 (with Tiger) of my wife with parental control enabled. I thought that Safari 4 would be cool for her, because she could see all her favourite websites right away instead of clicking somewhere in the bookmarks with the need to read everything all the time.

Know what? Top Sites is disabled when parental control is on! A feature that would be cool also for kids. Weird... And dissapointing.

groovebuster

Hi, you may be interested in my post, on page 5, number 105, on the subject of Parental Controls in Safari 4 with Mac OS X 10.4. There appears to be quite a major problem!

Papajohn56

Jun 14, 2009, 05:43 AM

Ugh. Google Adwords worked fine in Safari 4 beta, but now Adwords gives me a message that my browser is not supported. :mad:

groovebuster

Jun 14, 2009, 05:50 AM

Hi, you may be interested in my post, on page 5, number 105, on the subject of Parental Controls in Safari 4 with Mac OS X 10.4. There appears to be quite a major problem!
Thanks, I'll check out waht happens as soon as I have my hands on the iBook of my daughter again.

The sad part is, that I don't expect Apple to fix these things for Tiger... They will not put too much effort into a legacy OS. :-(

groovebuster

fixmymac

Jun 14, 2009, 06:13 AM

Thanks, I'll check out waht happens as soon as I have my hands on the iBook of my daughter again.

The sad part is, that I don't expect Apple to fix these things for Tiger... They will not put too much effort into a legacy OS. :-(

groovebuster

Hi, i think they will have to fix the issue i have highlighted. I have deliberately not mentioned the details of the problem just in case there are Managed Users reading this forum. I am sure you will understand once you get a chance to test it out. There is also the beginnings of a discussion about this matter on the Apple Discussions.

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2034579&tstart=0

alabanco

Jun 14, 2009, 03:13 PM

Safari 4 is out, nice, fast, gorgeous BUT

1) how can I save session
2) how can I duplicate tabs
3) how can I force it to open all links in new tabs not in new window

I can live without adblock plus but these things NEED TO BE in the 21st century browser

(tested Safari for Windows)

TuffLuffJimmy

Jun 14, 2009, 03:16 PM

NT1440

Jun 14, 2009, 03:17 PM

Complicated interface - the address bar is a mess, combining too many buttons. The tabs are bigger so fewer pages could be opened simultaneously.

Tabs get smaller as more appear.

Eraserhead

Jun 14, 2009, 03:52 PM

You gotta figure that most of those Windows downloads were Boot Camp users. I'm sure there's a few Safari fans on Windows, but lets not delude ourselves ...

It looks much more like a real Windows app now... (actually as someone at work pointed out it doesn't have an Apply button in the preferences - but apart from that.)

Maybe iTunes will be made to look like a Windows app too.

2. Microsoft will remove IE8 completely from Windows 7, an option Microsoft would like to take, but Opera & EU still not happy

Microsoft (http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2009/06/windows-7-to-be-shipped-in-europe-sans-internet-explorer.ars) have announced that they are doing that.

Bodie

Jun 14, 2009, 09:23 PM

Does any one else think that the final version is slower than the beta version? Several sites "hang" and take a bit longer to load. This was not a problem with the beta version.

Does anyone else miss the progress bar in the url window? -- and the stop and reload buttons that you could put anywhere in the toolbar?

So far I'm disappointed.

I've always used Firefox occasionally, but now I'm thinking exclusively.
:(

Doctor Q

Jun 14, 2009, 11:02 PM

It crashed on me for the first time today. Not even a message offering to inform Apple or relaunch. The window was just *poof* gone and the app was no longer running.

Eidorian

Jun 14, 2009, 11:04 PM

It crashed on me for the first time today. Not even a message offering to inform Apple or relaunch. The window was just *poof* gone and the app was no longer running.It is very disturbing to see Safari 4 just go poof like that. Were you able to reproduce it on the same website(s)?

ercanbas

Jun 14, 2009, 11:36 PM

On the beta if you had two windows open and wanted to combine them you would drag it from the top right since tabs were on top. I cannot seem to figure this out on the new version. Any insight?

alabanco

Jun 15, 2009, 12:49 AM

Originally Posted by alabanco
Safari 4 is out, nice, fast, gorgeous BUT

1) how can I save session
2) how can I duplicate tabs
3) how can I force it to open all links in new tabs not in new window

I can live without adblock plus but these things NEED TO BE in the 21st century browser

(tested Safari for Windows)

When would you ever need to duplicate tabs?

Very ordinary situation. Imagine you are searching for smth. You are in the middle of some page you want it to be open but you need to move back in time and to have that also as an open tab. Browser is used not only in one way track.

So the logic is if there is no duplicate tabs then let it be ? (Although Chrome, FF do have that option and widely used not only by me )

But, hey this is just one the important issued I listed. What are the others. Perfectly ignored.

Sehnsucht

Jun 15, 2009, 01:14 AM

Looks like Safari's marketshare will increase pretty soon in Europe:

1. Microsoft may have to include competitor browsers in Windows 7 (Safari, Opera, Firefox, Chrome, etc...) OR

2. Microsoft will remove IE8 completely from Windows 7, an option Microsoft would like to take, but Opera & EU still not happy

That would be the ultimate, ULTIMATE irony. :D

Windows 7 "Ultimate Irony Edition." :D

It crashed on me for the first time today. Not even a message offering to inform Apple or relaunch. The window was just *poof* gone and the app was no longer running.

:eek: SRSLY?

I've had apps crash on me, but I've never seen them go "poof". I *always* get the Relaunch/Report prompt. Disturbing...

br0adband

Jun 15, 2009, 02:46 AM

11 million downloads... riiiiggghhhtttt... and I've got this bridge in Brooklyn they might be interested in, good condition, I'll even throw in a party for the sale.

Apple marketing... the best that the Apple Tax can buy... ;)

MikeTheC

Jun 15, 2009, 12:47 PM

Speaking of parental controls vis a vis the Web...

Generally, I advise people to make use of their router to block inappropriate sites, simply because you can't bypass that from the computer.

fixmymac

Jun 15, 2009, 02:46 PM

Speaking of parental controls vis a vis the Web...

Generally, I advise people to make use of their router to block inappropriate sites, simply because you can't bypass that from the computer.

Speaking as a technically minded person, i would agree.

However, the average Jane/Joe would expect a feature called Parental Controls to actually control. There will be many parents who have kids using Safari 4 on Mac OS X 10.4.x and they will expect the Parental Controls to continue to do their job.

Right now, when little junior tries to visit a site that is not permitted, he will probably click Cancel when the window appears looking for admin credentials. Will little junior run and tell mummy and/or daddy that when he clicked Cancel, the site was added anyway?

Nadav

Jun 15, 2009, 02:54 PM

I am still using Safari 4 beta, has anybody found a solution to keep tabs on the top with the newest version? I don't understand why Apple decided to bring them back down, and I really don't like the downloading bar on the new version.

Doctor Q

Jun 15, 2009, 03:47 PM

It is very disturbing to see Safari 4 just go poof like that. Were you able to reproduce it on the same website(s)?
No. I knew that I had just opened a tab with an embedded video, so I tried it again after relaunching Safari, but had no trouble. I'm waiting to see if it happens to me again or to anyone else, because it was a mighty strange experience. If it never happens again, then I'll conclude that I simply imagined it.

pubwvj

Jun 15, 2009, 04:29 PM

11 million downloads... I've downloaded it four times. Can't get it to work. I tried redownloading hoping that perhaps there was something wrong with the download. No go. Safari 4.0 is a bomb. That is to say it bombs immediately on opening. I've reverted to Safari 3.2.3 which is very stable.

xerenthar

Jun 15, 2009, 10:37 PM

1) bing videos crashes it

2) any way to edit the tabMinWidth like you can in Firefox? with the size of my safari, i can only have 9 tabs without it scrolling. i have 25 or so in Firefox and it just shows little icons. that's what i want.

TurboSC

Jun 15, 2009, 10:41 PM

woo, who's excited for Internet Explorer 8.. huh... anyone? :P

Eidorian

Jun 15, 2009, 10:44 PM

woo, who's excited for Internet Explorer 8.. huh... anyone? :PIt's much easier to change search providers in Internet Explorer 8 and the accelerators are quite useful.

NT1440

Jun 15, 2009, 10:47 PM

It's much easier to change search providers in Internet Explorer 8

How hard is it to go into preferences really? (Im on W7)

Eidorian

Jun 15, 2009, 10:48 PM

How hard is it to go into preferences really? (Im on W7)Do it in Safari.

NT1440

Jun 15, 2009, 10:51 PM

Do it in Safari.

I meant preferences in safari, there is not preferences in windows.

Little gear icon-> Preferences-> (under general, the default pane thats open) change default search engine

Does it NEED to be any simpler than that?

Eidorian

Jun 15, 2009, 10:53 PM

I meant preferences in safari, there is not preferences in windows.

Little gear icon-> Preferences-> (under general, the default pane thats open) change default search engine

Does it NEED to be any simpler than that?I can understand how you missed my point. Try picking something that isn't Yahoo! or Google in Safari.

NT1440

Jun 15, 2009, 10:56 PM

I can understand how you missed my point. Try picking something that isn't Yahoo! or Google in Safari.

And how many people WANT to do that?:rolleyes:

Eidorian

Jun 15, 2009, 10:57 PM

And how many people WANT to do that?:rolleyes:I can do it in FireFox and Internet Explorer 7/8. Why can't I do it in Safari too?

EmperorDarius

Jun 16, 2009, 03:34 AM

I can do it in FireFox and Internet Explorer 7/8. Why can't I do it in Safari too?

Yes, that sure is a disadvantage. Yet, you can add the search of the website you want as a bookmark, or the old good "x site:y.com"
BTW: Still Internet Explorer sucks. Really. Sucks badly.

chagla

Jun 16, 2009, 08:23 AM

IE 8 is decent. chrome is interesting. Safari on windows is not that great. check out the followings:

lightweight, superfast - http://www.browzar.com/index.html
full featured - http://opera.com

Matek

Jun 16, 2009, 08:26 AM

woo, who's excited for Internet Explorer 8.. huh... anyone? :P Well, if you look at things in a more reasonable way, Safari is actually doing worse than IE8 (http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/asa/archives/2009/05/a_common_browse.html). It's all a matter of perspective.

Lycanthrope

Jun 16, 2009, 08:48 AM

Am I the only one that was surprised to see the tabs move down?

Nope, took me ages to get used to it after FireFox and then I decided I loved it. Now they've moved it back down, bugger.

Of course I didn't realise until I had updated on my MacPro, I assumed then it would be parameter driven, but no :(

So on my MBP I'm sticking to the beta :)

Matek

Jun 16, 2009, 09:04 AM

I assumed then it would be parameter drivenThere's a large number of things in OS X that could be user-selectable and would make my life so much easier, but Apple prefers to stick to their "we know best" philosophy.

Lycanthrope

Jun 16, 2009, 10:32 AM

There's a large number of things in OS X that could be user-selectable and would make my life so much easier, but Apple prefers to stick to their "we know best" philosophy.

You're probably right, but to be fair I would take a totally non-customizable OS X over any version of Windows any day :)

xerenthar

Jun 16, 2009, 11:26 AM

anyone on tabMinWidth?

bobertoq

Jun 27, 2009, 10:29 PM

why are my tabs back on the bottom?
because with top tabs, you couldn't double-click to make another tab... double-clicking minimized the window. this is much better. i'll use Safari 4 because of this.But look at Google Chrome:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d8/Chrome_Mac_Dev_Build_3.0.182.5.png
You can click near the top to minimize and you can still double click to make a new tab.

Has anyone figured out how to get tabs on top back on Windows?

iAlexG

Jul 1, 2009, 10:21 PM

Ive had my macbook for 2 weeks and ive used Safari 4 since I got it but I have just tonight switched to Firefox since I wanted some extra capabilities (add-ons) and a slight speed boost on Youtube.

iAlexG

Jul 3, 2009, 12:12 PM

I have since switched to Firefox mostly because of the add-ons for more capabilities.

ExSafariUser

Jul 26, 2009, 03:28 PM

.. if they also mentioned, that they slipped it into the auto-update Mac feature along with the usual routine updates as if it were just a regular Safari security update - and that if you don't happen to like the in-your-face-constantly look of it, which many do not, tough, because they have made it impossible to uninstall other than via re-installing the whole operating system, and impossible to disable the features you don't like.... You remember those things that we hated about Microsoft and Windows? Apple's policies are changing. Lets hope it doesnt go too far, or like Windows users, we may be led to be convinced that user-unfriendliness, regular crashes, error messages only interpretable by technicians, and total corporate insulation from the customer are all ok, and just "to be expected - it's a computer" ;0) Guess how I got my name. (Previously solely a Safari user for over 10 years)

groovebuster

Jul 27, 2009, 01:37 AM

(Previously solely a Safari user for over 10 years)

Wow... considering, that the public beta of Mac OS X started in September 2000 and Safari was never available for MacOS 9... And the first beta of Safari was available in January 2003...

Safari 2 was available in April 2005. That was the first version that was actually really usable. So if you were using Safari solely, then you can't have ment the vesrions before that one...

That makes a maximum of 4 years!

The Auto-Update thing was resolved again by Apple after crticism in late 2008. Other than that I wonder how you got the idea that you can not uninstall Safari? Just put it in the trash can.

Enough said... right?

groovebuster

P.S.: Since this was your first post after just signing up yesterday, I should have saved the time to reply. I just wonder what the motivation for people like you is to spread this kind of FUD? Maybe a pay-check by MS? At least it is obvious that you are not a the Mac connoisseur your are pretending to be.