Why just 2GB?

[Santabean2000]

As the title suggests, why is the Air, esp the higher end model, limited to just 2GB of RAM?!

At least 4GB should be on offer, surely. Anyone any ideas why this is not the case?:confused:

Cheers

[CalMin]

The Macbook Air is not for heavy lifting. 2GB is ample for the typical light duties of this notebook.

[sparkie7]

b/c  had spare motherboards left over

[Santabean2000]

The Macbook Air is not for heavy lifting. 2GB is ample for the typical light duties of this notebook.

Yet the whitebook can be configured with a lot more RAM.:confused:

I love having all necessary apps open with no need to worry about running out of juice.

[Gruber]

Of course the Air is fine for serious work, it is not a netbook but offers similar oomph as desktops did not too long ago. Photoshop & Co will run just fine, and Java programming is possible, too.

For those willing to shell out close to and above 2K for a more portable laptop, more RAM would often be very interesting. And for some, 2GB will be a dealbreakingly little.

I expect that something like this happened before WWDC:

Steve: Phil, if you don't give me a little extra manpower, my secret iPad is not going to be ready by the end of June, and everbody will hate me!
Phil: Sorry, everybody is busy updating the existing portables...
Steve: Just give me Gary and his fire-brigade for a few overnighters.
Phil: But Gary is supposed to get done with the new revision of the Air!
Tim: Uum... I don't know how to break the bad news to you, guys...
Chorus: WTF?
Tim: There are some pretty annoying last minute glitches in the new functions of MobileMe. The guys are booked solid.
Phil: There, Steve! I told you that your 2lbs iPod would have to wait until next year!
Steve: Hrmpf.
Tim: But, but. What happens to the Air? Steve wanted to try his new Nano-DVI connectors on the new platform...
Phil: Stuff it. The hinges break anyway, and the form-over-function pimps turn out to me a much smaller clientele than initially expected. Tell people to buy small MacBooks. Hey, while you are at it, promote the small Macbook to Pro status.
Steve: You mean, accept defeat? No more airy hotness?
Phil: Hm, didn't we just plan to do the scheduled the cpu clock increase? Maybe we can sell this as an update?
Tim: This could work, but everybody will laugh at us!
Phil: Shuddup, and listen to the turtlenecks... Pimps got no brains. Just make it cheaper, and everybody will be happy.
Steve: Hrrrm. I will be back! Just wait!

[oscillatewildly]

If limited to one stick, how much is 4GB?

[Airforcekid]

Its os only needs 512MB and snow leopard 1GB so its still double what it needs. Since its built for email/web some video and photo its dosent need more until its next update.

[Airforcekid]

If limited to one stick, how much is 4GB?

Its built direct into the system no way to change it.

[Migwellious]

Its os only needs 512MB and snow leopard 1GB so its still double what it needs. Since its built for email/web some video and photo its dosent need more until its next update.

my macbook [white 2.0ghz nvidia] feels slow with 2Gb RAM, was expecting more speed somehow, am a bit disappointed actually.


first post btw :)

~m

[Veinticinco]

Why just 2GB? Because they are run by the worst kind of cheapskate beancounters, the kind who drop elastic-tethered coins into blind beggars' upturned hats.

[Veinticinco]

If limited to one stick, how much is 4GB?
Soldered on, so you can't upgrade.

[Veinticinco]

Its os only needs 512MB and snow leopard 1GB so its still double what it needs. Since its built for email/web some video and photo its dosent need more until its next update.
I'm sorry but you're generalising here, suggesting it's nothing more than a netbook even though you haven't said so specifically. The MBA is VERY much more than just a netbook. Netbooks don't have Core Duo 2 2.13GHz processors in there or 128GB SSDs.

Aside from the OS, some of us use highly-intensive pro apps - for which 2GB is like straining your workflow at the leash. Would have cost them very little to solder a 4GB chip in there - I'd have preferred less of a discount to offset the extra cost if it meant a 4GB chip in there.

[oscillatewildly]

Hi Airforcekid and Veinticinco,

I meant - is cramming on 4GB in the same space disproportionately more expensive than sticking the 2GB on the board? The price of 2 x 2GB versus 1 x 4GB. I'm aware the memory is soldered.

Cheers,
OW

[Veinticinco]

Hi Airforcekid and Veinticinco,

I meant - is cramming on 4GB in the same space disproportionately more expensive than sticking the 2GB on the board? The price of 2 x 2GB versus 1 x 4GB. I'm aware the memory is soldered.

Cheers,
OW
Sorry understood, just read it like that.

Yes it's more expensive as 4GB chips are still priced disproportionately high in comparison to 2GB chips (I've seen as much as 10x price as 'upgrade' kits), but even Apple with their notoriously high priced RAM BTOs, would be able to offer a 4GB option and swallow the cost, due to their relationship with Hynix/Samsung whoever. Alternatively it could just as easily have been offset - as I said above, I'd have preferred them to have reduced the price by $5-600 instead of $700 if it meant putting a 4GB chip in there.

[oscillatewildly]

Veinticinco,

Thanks.

Agree about reducing the price less in return for 4GB.

Cheers

[Scottsdale]

The space on the logic board takes up similar to two dimms of 1 GB each. Apple could have used the same space for 4GB but chose not to. I would guess that the net cost for Apple would be about $15 to $20 more.

I think Apple delayed the new high end MBA because the 256 GB SSD wasn't ready. I think Apple planned to have the new high end be the low end. I think they used leftover boards for the low end now while waiting for new high end to be finalized. If one considers the Adamo, Sony and Lenovo competition, it makes perfect sense. Some of those have low end with 2 GB RAM and smaller SSD. And they have high-end with 4 GB RAM and larger SSD.

Therefore, I see a new high end added to the MBA lineup.

2.13 GHz
4 GB RAM
256 GB SSD
New battery tech
OLED display

I would think this makes perfect sense. In the meantime, Apple sells the leftover boards and gives the Air a chance at low end pricing to sell better. I think the new high end will be priced as an upgrade luxury MBA for those who want ultra portability with ultra power for $2199 to $2499.

This theory makes perfect sense to me. I would expect it as early as next month in Jobs presentation to as late as November. Then we can all be happy and upgrade yet again!!!

[Veinticinco]

The space on the logic board takes up similar to two dimms of 1 GB each. Apple could have used the same space for 4GB but chose not to. I would guess that the net cost for Apple would be about $15 to $20 more.

I think Apple delayed the new high end MBA because the 256 GB SSD wasn't ready. I think Apple planned to have the new high end be the low end. I think they used leftover boards for the low end now while waiting for new high end to be finalized. If one considers the Adamo, Sony and Lenovo competition, it makes perfect sense. Some of those have low end with 2 GB RAM and smaller SSD. And they have high-end with 4 GB RAM and larger SSD.

Therefore, I see a new high end added to the MBA lineup.

2.13 GHz
4 GB RAM
256 GB SSD
New battery tech
OLED display

I would think this makes perfect sense. In the meantime, Apple sells the leftover boards and gives the Air a chance at low end pricing to sell better. I think the new high end will be priced as an upgrade luxury MBA for those who want ultra portability with ultra power for $2199 to $2499.

This theory makes perfect sense to me. I would expect it as early as next month in Jobs presentation to as late as November. Then we can all be happy and upgrade yet again!!!
Scottsdale, please stop it - by 'it' I mean including an OLED display in the next revision specs. Just no way it's going to happen in 2009, especially at this price point. It will be a luxury BTO towards the end of 2010 as the economy (hopefully) starts to pick up again.

[crackbookpro]

I'm sorry but you're generalising here, suggesting it's nothing more than a netbook even though you haven't said so specifically. The MBA is VERY much more than just a netbook. Netbooks don't have Core Duo 2 2.13GHz processors in there or 128GB SSDs.

Aside from the OS, some of us use highly-intensive pro apps - for which 2GB is like straining your workflow at the leash. Would have cost them very little to solder a 4GB chip in there - I'd have preferred less of a discount to offset the extra cost if it meant a 4GB chip in there.

I agree, this is no netbook.

Really, I would be more interested in the MacBook Air if it did indeed have 4GB of memory...(and was a little less money ;)). Calling it a netbook - is wrong, and is not what Apple is trying to do.

I see the MBA having a higher memory capacity in the next MBA upgrade...which is not for awhile I'm guessing :confused:

if Apple does that, and can put in a larger hard drive(200GB+)...I'll be buying an MBA...c'mon :apple: ...do it!

CrackBookPro:cool:

[Scottsdale]

Scottsdale, please stop it - by 'it' I mean including an OLED display in the next revision specs. Just no way it's going to happen in 2009, especially at this price point. It will be a luxury BTO towards the end of 2010 as the economy (hopefully) starts to pick up again.

God, why does my prediction bother you so much? There is a rumor of OLED displays by LG making their way into a Mac this Summer. Apple signed a huge deal for something like a billion or more dollars to provide displays for Apple. LG has an OLED display ready right now for notebook markets. I think Apple/Jobs would love to make a high end MBA the first with an OLED. AND, the MBA would benefit the most from an OLED. Furthermore, more people would take the plunge and spend the extra for the display in the MBA. I really see this as possible this year for the MBA!

[hodgeheg]

The space on the logic board takes up similar to two dimms of 1 GB each. Apple could have used the same space for 4GB but chose not to. I would guess that the net cost for Apple would be about $15 to $20 more.

I think Apple delayed the new high end MBA because the 256 GB SSD wasn't ready. I think Apple planned to have the new high end be the low end. I think they used leftover boards for the low end now while waiting for new high end to be finalized. If one considers the Adamo, Sony and Lenovo competition, it makes perfect sense. Some of those have low end with 2 GB RAM and smaller SSD. And they have high-end with 4 GB RAM and larger SSD.

Therefore, I see a new high end added to the MBA lineup.

2.13 GHz
4 GB RAM
256 GB SSD
New battery tech
OLED display

I would think this makes perfect sense. In the meantime, Apple sells the leftover boards and gives the Air a chance at low end pricing to sell better. I think the new high end will be priced as an upgrade luxury MBA for those who want ultra portability with ultra power for $2199 to $2499.

This theory makes perfect sense to me. I would expect it as early as next month in Jobs presentation to as late as November. Then we can all be happy and upgrade yet again!!!

Carefully thought through and plausible post as always. However I suspect OLED will be a bit longer coming, for price reasons (but I hope I'm wrong!)

[Veinticinco]

God, why does my prediction bother you so much? There is a rumor of OLED displays by LG making their way into a Mac this Summer. Apple signed a huge deal for something like a billion or more dollars to provide displays for Apple. LG has an OLED display ready right now for notebook markets. I think Apple/Jobs would love to make a high end MBA the first with an OLED. AND, the MBA would benefit the most from an OLED. Furthermore, more people would take the plunge and spend the extra for the display in the MBA. I really see this as possible this year for the MBA!
Easy there, wasn't having a pop at you, maybe I should have added an exasperated/pleading/stop the pain smilie if one existed?

Just your unbridled enthusiasm can be a little, well, saccharine at times. Most of us expecting a decent MBA upgrade feel bitterly disappointed this week, yet you're still out there (and it is admirable if a little unrealistic) banging the Cupertino drum, dripping with enthusiasm, and lauding the price drop as something we should be thankful for, when in fact it's the least they could have done to keep the product alive.

As for the OLED rumours, I know - in fact I started the thread that posited it as a theory for the MBA in the first place - albeit I think I said it was more likely to be a rev.D. I just don't think given what they've provided and taken away with this summer update, that an OLED screen, ready or not, is going to find its way into an Apple product in 2009 or even early 2010. It's hugely expensive hardware tech, and will remain so for quite a while, and will first appear as a BTO only. Strategically it doesn't make sense right now, much as I'd like to think and argue otherwise.

[Maven1975]

I can't wait for the MBA to have 4GB. This way these threads will cease to exist.

Apple is going to stroke these 4GB consumers for top dollar next revision (And that sucks). I know there are some out there that NEED 4GB, but these same people would also like 8GB's as well.

Also,

Put me on the list of people the does NOT care/want a glass on my MBA as well.

[Santabean2000]

So cost seems to be the biggest reason at the mo. eh. 1x4GB is a lot presently.

I wonder then if there can be a subtle design revision to incorporate a second slot, (although not tiny, it's not like the RAM is a huge piece of componentry!).

I sense a real chance for Apple's Air to come of age here:
reasonable price + reasonable/better performance (as compared to other ultra-portables)+ sweet form factor = a winner eh?

[Kwill]

I can't wait for the MBA to have 4GB. This way these threads will cease to exist.


Yea, they'll be replaced with "Why just 4GB?" threads as opposed to 8GB.

[Maven1975]

Yea, they'll be replaced with "Why just 4GB?" threads as opposed to 8GB.

Yup

[Tomorrow]

I sense a real chance for Apple's Air to come of age here:
reasonable price + reasonable/better performance (as compared to other ultra-portables)+ sweet form factor = a winner eh?

Sounds like a new MacBook Pro 13".

This dead horse has been beaten into the ground - the MacBook Air, in my opinion and that of many others, was not designed to be a primary computer for a moderate to power user. Yes, it would be nice if it were - if they could cram 4 Gb of RAM, two SSD's, a video card, FW800, an SD card reader, an optical drive, and the rest of the machine into a form factor roughly the thickness of an empty manilla folder, that would be swell. But they can't.

[Ruahrc]

I also don't think OLEDs will appear as computer displays for a long while yet. Costs aside, phosphor burn-in issues will prevent them from being practical as computer displays (as opposed to television) because the display on the computer is static a lot of the time with little changing. The lifetime of an OLED display will be far too short.

They work on things like TVs and cell phones because on TVs, the picture changes a lot thus the wear is more even, no specific elements of the screen will get burned in or worn out too fast. Cell phones, the display is only on for relatively short amounts of time compared to TVs or computer displays, and cell phones are devices designed to last only a couple of years anyways so a dying display won't hurt too bad on a $300 phone but a dying display on a $2500 laptop will be pretty bad.

Ruahrc

[Santabean2000]

Sounds like a new MacBook Pro 13".

This dead horse has been beaten into the ground - the MacBook Air, in my opinion and that of many others, was not designed to be a primary computer for a moderate to power user. Yes, it would be nice if it were - if they could cram 4 Gb of RAM, two SSD's, a video card, FW800, an SD card reader, an optical drive, and the rest of the machine into a form factor roughly the thickness of an empty manilla folder, that would be swell. But they can't.

I hear ya, but all I'm mentioning here is extra RAM - and that's distinctly possible.

On the 13"MBP side, all the other goodies you mentioned could run close if they axed the optical drive, (and kept the thicker shape too), but that is for another thread eh.

[arcangel6]

I COMPLETELY AGREE! I owned an ASUS 1000 that I upgraded to 2GB RAM and for kick through in a Samsung SSD. Sort of like putting a Porsche engine into a on of those old Hugos. While the performance was considerably enhanced it does not even come close to the new MBA (2.13GHz, 128GB SSD) I got last week. The notebook is the best out there for those needing what it offers, solid performance in a very easy to transport package. It is equally ridiculous to compare it to a MACBook Pro since it was meant for a different purpose. Having said that you will find it fairs better than any netbook would at the present time.

I should add that I also own an Aluminum MACBook 13 with the same 128G SSD and 4GB RAM. It is a great computer but a little too heavy. The same is true for my DELL XPS M1550 w/4G RAM and the Samsung 128G SSD running 32bit Vista though I forget which processor.

All three the new MBA, the MB13 and the DELL were great systems. I honestly could not perceive any performance differences.....though I much preferred the MACs. I am also not a poweruser or computer expert. I am NOT saying that performance differences did not exist. ONLY, that for my use I could not perceive them. I am not a gamer but I do a little video editing, lots of basic Photo editing, watch videos and web surf.

Lastly, I have not seen any of the reported screen problems (i.e. gray lines). They are either not there OR I simply cant see them. I would HIGHLY recommend the NEW new MBA w/2.13GHz, 128GB SSD if it fits your needs.

Regards,

Joe

I'm sorry but you're generalising here, suggesting it's nothing more than a netbook even though you haven't said so specifically. The MBA is VERY much more than just a netbook. Netbooks don't have Core Duo 2 2.13GHz processors in there or 128GB SSDs.

Aside from the OS, some of us use highly-intensive pro apps - for which 2GB is like straining your workflow at the leash. Would have cost them very little to solder a 4GB chip in there - I'd have preferred less of a discount to offset the extra cost if it meant a 4GB chip in there.

[Gruber]

Sounds like a new MacBook Pro 13". (...) if they could cram 4 Gb of RAM, two SSD's, a video card, FW800, an SD card reader, an optical drive, and the rest of the machine into a form factor roughly the thickness of an empty manilla folder, that would be swell. But they can't.

Yes, they can. It is entirely possible to stuff all the necessary ports, a good keyboard and screen, an SSD (one is enough, please!), 4GB and an SD card reader into a <3lbs package, and even throw in a Bluray drive (which I do not need). Look at the Vaio TT. But alas, it does not run OSX.

The MBP simply does not cut it. You are going to annoy people that want to buy a fully featured ultraportable, if you tell them to get something twice the weight and bulk.

The reason that the Air lacks so much functionality is not its compactness, but its specific design. The Air has not been built to be as portable as possible, but to look as thin as possible. Even if it meant to add unnecessary (empty!) bezels around screen and keyboard, to use a ridiculous video port and so on.

[aleksandra.]

Yes, they can. It is entirely possible to stuff all the necessary ports, a good keyboard and screen, an SSD (one is enough, please!), 4GB and an SD card reader into a <3lbs package, and even throw in a Bluray drive (which I do not need). Look at the Vaio TT. But alas, it does not run OSX.

The reason that the Air lacks so much functionality is not its compactness, but its specific design. The Air has not been built to be as portable as possible, but to look as thin as possible. Even if it meant to add unnecessary (empty!) bezels around screen and keyboard, to use a ridiculous video port and so on.

I guess it all comes to priorities. I would never want Apple to compromise basic comfort - screen size, keyboard - to stuck in as many features as possible. Air has been built to be light without compromising this. This "ridiculous video port" was also put on 17" MBP, which doesn't lack for space on the sides. Tapering and additional bezel around the screen are for looks (and for a trackpad to fit). Comparing it to an 11" thing is simply not fair.

[Gruber]

I would never want Apple to compromise basic comfort - screen size, keyboard - to stuck in as many features as possible. Air has been built to be light without compromising this. This "ridiculous video port" was also put on 17" MBP, which doesn't lack for space on the sides. Tapering and additional bezel around the screen are for looks (and for a trackpad to fit). Comparing it to an 11" thing is simply not fair.

The Vaio is even more compact without compromising on functionality. So why would the comparison be unfair?
If Apple hides the sides of the Air with these hideous tapering spoilers to optimize its air resistance and breadcuttingness, they are not improving its function, but are eating up the room for necessary ports.

It looks as if the Air is built to be looked at primarily from the side, to show off to onlookers. When I sit in front of it, I think: wasted space. As with cars, spoilers are a good reason for many people to buy, and I do not want to criticise you or anyone for liking them. I am not sore at the Air, but I am sore because the Air seems to be Apple's only idea about how to serve the ultraportable clientele.

BTW: Using proprietary ports is not better if Apple repeats this mistake with other models. For me, carrying the video adapters wherever I travel compromises my basic comfort when using the machine.

[anamznazn]

I have 2GB on my 15" MBP and it feels like it's enough. Would be great to have 4GB tho.

[BlizzardBomb]

Therefore, I see a new high end added to the MBA lineup.

2.13 GHz
4 GB RAM
256 GB SSD
New battery tech
OLED display

I would think this makes perfect sense. In the meantime, Apple sells the leftover boards and gives the Air a chance at low end pricing to sell better. I think the new high end will be priced as an upgrade luxury MBA for those who want ultra portability with ultra power for $2199 to $2499.

This theory makes perfect sense to me. I would expect it as early as next month in Jobs presentation to as late as November. Then we can all be happy and upgrade yet again!!!

The MBA battery is already built in and already lithium polymer. If the .5 hours they gained from the last revision was the silent bump to the new tech, there's nothing newer to go to yet.

[jav6454]

Light duty notebook. I hate the fact the memory is soldered in.

[Airforcekid]

I'm sorry but you're generalising here, suggesting it's nothing more than a netbook even though you haven't said so specifically. The MBA is VERY much more than just a netbook. Netbooks don't have Core Duo 2 2.13GHz processors in there or 128GB SSDs.

Aside from the OS, some of us use highly-intensive pro apps - for which 2GB is like straining your workflow at the leash. Would have cost them very little to solder a 4GB chip in there - I'd have preferred less of a discount to offset the extra cost if it meant a 4GB chip in there.

Im just saying dont buy a Mini to do a Mac Pro's job. Its a great computer for basic to light moderate use and that is what 2gb is meant for.

[gri]

b/c  had spare motherboards left over

Which didn't prevent them from changing the main processor, did it? I was hoping for 4 G RAM and 256 G SSD (or HD) to ge a new laptop. The 4G is a deal breaker for me. My 5 year old PB G4 has 2 G Ram and I am not investing in something which is par to something 5 years old technically. I only hope that this is no indication of cycling the MBA out, I need a light computer for travel...

[bryng]

Which didn't prevent them from changing the main processor, did it? I was hoping for 4 G RAM and 256 G SSD (or HD) to ge a new laptop. The 4G is a deal breaker for me. My 5 year old PB G4 has 2 G Ram and I am not investing in something which is par to something 5 years old technically. I only hope that this is no indication of cycling the MBA out, I need a light computer for travel...

Well that's easily fixed. Just take a gig of RAM out of your G4 PB and then the Air will be a nice upgrade for you. :D

[gri]

Sounds like a new MacBook Pro 13".

This dead horse has been beaten into the ground - the MacBook Air, in my opinion and that of many others, was not designed to be a primary computer for a moderate to power user. Yes, it would be nice if it were - if they could cram 4 Gb of RAM, two SSD's, a video card, FW800, an SD card reader, an optical drive, and the rest of the machine into a form factor roughly the thickness of an empty manilla folder, that would be swell. But they can't.

Oh yes, they can. They just need to swap the 2 G chip with a 4 G chip, same size, no architectural change - and many of us would be happy. I have schlepped my MBP (2 G RAM) with me and am sick of its weight. On the other hand I use keynote for my presentations and keynote does not compress the files. So my presentations can become easily 500 MB (many graphics). Add to that the OS, the program and voila, the little sucker (MBP!) slows down with 2 G of RAM. A 256 SSD would make the deal perfect for me. In its current state - no.

[gri]

Well that's easily fixed. Just take a gig of RAM out of your G4 PB and then the Air will be a nice upgrade for you. :D

Hmm I should consider that...:D
Only, that PB is sitting in my closet as back up. Has a nice bigger 250 HD though, my MBP as a 120 GB (another reason I would liek a bigger HD or SSD in the MBA...)

[Tomorrow]

Oh yes, they can. They just need to swap the 2 G chip with a 4 G chip, same size, no architectural change - and many of us would be happy. I have schlepped my MBP (2 G RAM) with me and am sick of its weight. On the other hand I use keynote for my presentations and keynote does not compress the files. So my presentations can become easily 500 MB (many graphics). Add to that the OS, the program and voila, the little sucker (MBP!) slows down with 2 G of RAM. A 256 SSD would make the deal perfect for me. In its current state - no.

You just nailed this entire thread - that type of "heavy lifting" is not what the Air was necessarily designed for.

[Capt Crunch]

You just nailed this entire thread - that type of "heavy lifting" is not what the Air was necessarily designed for.

Perhaps not. The point remains, however, that it could do the heavy lifting if Apple could just be bothered to spend the extra $20.

It's like having a convertible that actually had a big trunk, but it was filled half-way with a non-removable iron girder. "Who cares?" you say, "A convertible isn't meant to have a large trunk." An yet it could be the only convertible that did have a large trunk if the designer spent an extra day on it.

[Gruber]

You just nailed this entire thread - that type of "heavy lifting" is not what the Air was necessarily designed for.

Aww, come on. The Air is no netbook. And giving presentations is really not heavy lifting, but exactly what a portable notebook should be designed for.

Three years ago, the processing power of the Air would have been considered sufficient for serious video processing, rendering and compiling. And now it is too small to fire up Keynote?

[Santabean2000]

Aww, come on. The Air is no netbook. And giving presentations is really not heavy lifting, but exactly what a portable notebook should be designed for.

Three years ago, the processing power of the Air would have been considered sufficient for serious video processing, rendering and compiling. And now it is too small to fire up Keynote?

Hah ah ah a, exactly!

It's capabilities are being artificially capped for no particular good reason, (cost can be passed onto the consumer, if they deem the need great enough then they should have the option).

Surely 4GB RAM is not too much to accommodate.

[Gruber]

It's capabilities are being artificially capped for no particular good reason

Does not make a lot of sense to me. Why would you needlessly want to cripple your premium line? CPU and gfx speeds are a little lower than in the current MBPs, but really not so much that it matters.

I guess that when the Air appeared, 2GB was more than good enough. Later on, Apple has not really bothered with an update, because it was busy with transferring the unibody design and battery into its bread-and-butter notebooks. The Air does not sell as well as the MBPs (and you guys send half of them back because of the screens).

There might be another reason that the Air is so neglected. Either its life runs out, and it is going to be replaced with something else (like Steve's 10in mystery device). Or Apple has been prepping a major revision, but did not get it done in time for the WWDC. In that case, we can expect something like a 4GB Air with 3G and 5-6h battery runtime pretty soon.

[Tomorrow]

And giving presentations is really not heavy lifting, but exactly what a portable notebook should be designed for.

If your presentation is a small file, yes. I replied to a poster who uses a 500 Mb presentation file with lots of graphics. That, by comparison, is "heavy lifting."

[eVolcre]

What kind of computer use profile would benefit with 4GB or RAM vs 2? I keep reading about RAM and how more is better but I don't think I've ever suffered with 2GB in my MBP. If programs run fine on 2GB will they run BETTER on 4? They still use the same amount of RAM as before right?

eV

[Santabean2000]

Can anyone confirm whether the Air has one or two RAM pieces in it.

I thought it was one, which would justify to some extent, why there is just 2GB in there. But I on inspection today in the store I checked out two different Airs and they both said (System Profiler) there were two 1GB pieces!

Two 2GB pieces are relatively cheap eh, surely they could be dropped in...

[aleksandra.]

Can anyone confirm whether the Air has one or two RAM pieces in it.

I thought it was one, which would justify to some extent, why there is just 2GB in there. But I on inspection today in the store I checked out two different Airs and they both said (System Profiler) there were two 1GB pieces!

Two 2GB pieces are relatively cheap eh, surely they could be dropped in...

RAM in Air is soldered on the logic board. It's 16 x 128 MB physically (8 on each side of the logic board), but these are connected by two channels (Core 2 Duo doesn't support more than 2). Step 17 and 18 of this teardown show them: http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/MacBook-Air/598/3.

Edit: It's a revision A Air, but it's similar in B and C (even though the logicboard is completely different).

[jdechko]

The space on the logic board takes up similar to two dimms of 1 GB each. Apple could have used the same space for 4GB but chose not to. I would guess that the net cost for Apple would be about $15 to $20 more.

I think Apple delayed the new high end MBA because the 256 GB SSD wasn't ready. I think Apple planned to have the new high end be the low end. I think they used leftover boards for the low end now while waiting for new high end to be finalized. If one considers the Adamo, Sony and Lenovo competition, it makes perfect sense. Some of those have low end with 2 GB RAM and smaller SSD. And they have high-end with 4 GB RAM and larger SSD.

Therefore, I see a new high end added to the MBA lineup.

2.13 GHz
4 GB RAM
256 GB SSD
New battery tech
OLED display

I would think this makes perfect sense. In the meantime, Apple sells the leftover boards and gives the Air a chance at low end pricing to sell better. I think the new high end will be priced as an upgrade luxury MBA for those who want ultra portability with ultra power for $2199 to $2499.

This theory makes perfect sense to me. I would expect it as early as next month in Jobs presentation to as late as November. Then we can all be happy and upgrade yet again!!!

This kinda makes me think that the Air might be the first mac to go totally SSD with no traditional hard drive option. Also, it seems like with respect to the 1.8" Drive only, the SSD tech is progressing way faster than the mechanical drives are. As far as I know, a 2-platter drive can only go up to 240GB (2x120 platters). This is why the iPod classic had a decrease in capacity--it went from 2x80 to 1x120. But a 2-platter drive won't fit in the air, so 1x120 is the way to go for mechanical drives. But with the SSD, I am sure that the next stop will be either 256 GB or 192 (possible, but why).

Having said this, it's possible that we will see 1.86/2GB/128GB SSD for $1499 and 2.13/4GB/256GB SSD for $1799-2199, Mechanical Hard Drive dropped completely from the line.

[manhattanboy]

The Macbook Air is not for heavy lifting. 2GB is ample for the typical light duties of this notebook.

Because APPLE sucks balz when it comes to memory!

I love the speed bump and what's up with the APPLE website saying they now have a glossy screen???

[Intenost]

What kind of computer use profile would benefit with 4GB or RAM vs 2? I keep reading about RAM and how more is better but I don't think I've ever suffered with 2GB in my MBP. If programs run fine on 2GB will they run BETTER on 4? They still use the same amount of RAM as before right?

eV

I'm in sales and use Daylite for CRM. Nice app, and I can attach email from mail.app to opportunities and projects and customers/prospects for filing and easy reference. It works nicely. But it means I need mail.app running, Daylite running, and then if I crank up an attachment from mail I will have Word or Powerpoint running. Then if I open OmniFocus to check my tasks and maybe a web browser, I've blown 2GB out of the water. That's why I went from a 2GB Air (rev A) to a 4gb Macbook (uMB Fall 08). Makes a big difference.

I loved the air (now my wife has it) and I'd readily go back to that form factor especially with the other improvements if there was only 4GB in it!

[TK2K]

Light duty notebook. I hate the fact the memory is soldered in.

Alright, here's the part that gets me annoyed...

Guys, step back for a second and look at what you are complaining about, essentially everyone here is complaining the macbook air isn't a 13" macbook pro that just magically weights 2lb less...

The ram is soldered in for a reason, because it saves space! it's limited to an extremely small footpring (1dimm equivilant) because.. you guessed it, it saves space.

now, could apple technically have filled it up with 4gb of ram, yeah i'd say they probably could have, but look at the intended market. The computer is intended for people who

a: would buy a macbook but want something lighter with about the same performance
b: mobility people, biz men, etc.
c: power users with a mac pro back home

Nether of those two categories needs 4gb of ram, and the upgrade to 4gb would probably require a 4gb stick, which in itself for low quality stuff is $300, so you're looking at a minimum of a $400 upgrade cost tacked on to the cost of the computer, plus an entirely different LINE of MBA to be manufactured due to the soldered in ram.

If you wanna really get down to it, the processor in the MBA is pretty weak compared to the rest of the line, it's obvious this computer is not built for heavy lifting, it's built to do one thing and do it well. To be light, and have a long battery life.


Don't get me wrong, I love the air and if i could edit 25mb RAW images on it, i'd have one in a heartbeat, or if I could afford a powerstation desktop and an air.

[jdechko]

The ram is soldered in for a reason, because it saves space! it's limited to an extremely small footpring (1dimm equivilant) because.. you guessed it, it saves space...

Nether of those two categories needs 4gb of ram, and the upgrade to 4gb would probably require a 4gb stick, which in itself for low quality stuff is $300, so you're looking at a minimum of a $400 upgrade cost tacked on to the cost of the computer, plus an entirely different LINE of MBA to be manufactured due to the soldered in ram.

While I understand what you are saying, I think there may be a little flaw in your logic. It's true that the RAM is soldered on to save space, but it's on both sides of the logic board, so it's like having 2x1GB installed, not 1x2. The RAM is stacked like it is in the MBP, but since it doesn't require separate boards for each DIMM and the RAM slots which are prohibitively thick, it fits in a space much smaller than would otherwise be required. So moving to 4GB doesn't require a "4GB RAM Module" but rather 2 "2GB RAM Modeules" which are much cheaper.

EDIT: See this page for a high-resolution picture of what I mean. http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/MacBook-Air/598/3

[tempusfugit]

I can't wait for the MBA to have 4GB. This way these threads will cease to exist.

Apple is going to stroke these 4GB consumers for top dollar next revision (And that sucks). I know there are some out there that NEED 4GB, but these same people would also like 8GB's as well.

Also,

Put me on the list of people the does NOT care/want a glass on my MBA as well.


if people NEED 4 gb they should just get a macbook pro

[stoconnell]

I love the speed bump and what's up with the APPLE website saying they now have a glossy screen???

The screen in the MBA has always been glossy. It is not an old school matte screen, but it is not glassy.

[spaceballl]

The RAM being stuck at 2GB and the SSD capping out at 128GB are the reasons keeping me away from this device and pushing me toward getting another macbook pro. I'm waiting for one to two more revisions before I upgrade, though, so hopefully by then these are taken care of.

[gri]

If your presentation is a small file, yes. I replied to a poster who uses a 500 Mb presentation file with lots of graphics. That, by comparison, is "heavy lifting."

But it is only loading that stuff into the RAM and than displaying on the screen! No Photoshopping with filters etc on big files. Its like working on a big grant with images in Word. So - if this thing cannot do a proper presentation of larger files or working with them on easy tasks...

OK it probably can, I haven't tried it since I don't own one. But probably it will slow down a bit - or even worse: it can handle it but is at its limits. Should I buy something which is for my use already at its max capacity from the start (and not 2 yrs down the road)? 13 MBP is out of the question - I hate the glossy screen, checked it out at 5th Ave store.

[gri]

Alright, here's the part that gets me annoyed...


a: would buy a macbook but want something lighter with about the same performance
b: mobility people, biz men, etc.
c: power users with a mac pro back home


Don't get me wrong, I love the air and if i could edit 25mb RAW images on it, i'd have one in a heartbeat, or if I could afford a powerstation desktop and an air.

But since the June now all the other portables start or at least are able to handle 4G - but not the little luxury MBA? I don;t know Apples logic behind it but it cannot be technically or pricing. ..

[iMacmatician]

But since the June now all the other portables start or at least are able to handle 4G - but not the little luxury MBA? I don;t know Apples logic behind it but it cannot be technically or pricing. ..This isn't much of a pattern because there's only one term yet, but it may be useful.

Late 2006: MacBook Pro (1 GB, 2 GB)
Early 2007
Mid 2007: MacBook Pro (2 GB)
Late 2007: MacBook (1 GB, 2 GB)
Early 2008: MacBook Air (2 GB)
Mid 2008
Late 2008: MacBook Pro (2 GB, 4 GB)
Early 2009: MacBook (2 GB)
Mid 2009: MacBook Pro (15", 17") (4 GB), MacBook (Pro 13") (2 GB, 4 GB)
Late 2009

If the move to 4 GB is similar to the move to the move to 2 GB, the MacBook Air would go 4 GB at late 2009 or early 2010. But since the MacBook Air was introduced in early 2008, it is unknown whether a 2007 MacBook Air would have 1 GB or 2 GB. Therefore, it would go 4 GB at or before late 2009 / early 2010. With the price cut it might take a bit longer.

[stoconnell]

Looking at the rev a tear down (http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/MacBook-Air/598/3), there are 16 1Gb (gigabit) chips soldered onto the mobo supplying the main amemory. The question for Apple is whether there are 2 Gb chips available at the same size with similar heat and power characteristics and at a cost they want to pay for their margins :) I also suspect since they only recently started shipping laptops with 4GB of RAM across all their lines, they haven't bothered yet.

[gri]

This isn't much of a pattern because there's only one term yet, but it may be useful.

Late 2006: MacBook Pro (1 GB, 2 GB)
Early 2007
Mid 2007: MacBook Pro (2 GB)
Late 2007: MacBook (1 GB, 2 GB)
Early 2008: MacBook Air (2 GB)
Mid 2008
Late 2008: MacBook Pro (2 GB, 4 GB)
Early 2009: MacBook (2 GB)
Mid 2009: MacBook Pro (15", 17") (4 GB), MacBook (Pro 13") (2 GB, 4 GB)
Late 2009

If the move to 4 GB is similar to the move to the move to 2 GB, the MacBook Air would go 4 GB at late 2009 or early 2010. But since the MacBook Air was introduced in early 2008, it is unknown whether a 2007 MacBook Air would have 1 GB or 2 GB. Therefore, it would go 4 GB at or before late 2009 / early 2010. With the price cut it might take a bit longer.

Lets hope itslate 2009. I can wait a bit. It would be soooo sweet!:)

[trip1ex]

Yeah 2gb is enough especially for the MBA.

I've been "suffering" with 2gb of RAM in my new iMac for 2 months with nary a hiccup. And in case you say I don't know what I'm missing, well, my previous iMac had 4gb of RAM.

[nahsor]

The RAM being stuck at 2GB and the SSD capping out at 128GB are the reasons keeping me away from this device and pushing me toward getting another macbook pro. I'm waiting for one to two more revisions before I upgrade, though, so hopefully by then these are taken care of.

Yeah same here. If they offered the 4GB with the SSD, I would upgrade in a heartbeat. I don't mind paying the extra. With those two major upgrades, the Air could be used as a primary machine for someone for someone like me who uses it for internet, movies, word, ppt and light gaming. It would be perfect!...C'mon next upgrade! :p

[UltraNEO*]

I can't wait for the MBA to have 4GB. This way these threads will cease to exist.

Apple is going to stroke these 4GB consumers for top dollar next revision (And that sucks). I know there are some out there that NEED 4GB, but these same people would also like 8GB's as well.

Also,

Put me on the list of people the does NOT care/want a glass on my MBA as well.


So when will a MBA have 8GB RAM? How about a custom option for those who'd like to spend a little more? :D:D

[jdechko]

Yeah same here. If they offered the 4GB with the SSD, I would upgrade in a heartbeat. I don't mind paying the extra. With those two major upgrades, the Air could be used as a primary machine for someone for someone like me who uses it for internet, movies, word, ppt and light gaming. It would be perfect!...C'mon next upgrade! :p

I guess I'm a little confused, though, why 4GB is necessary for what you want to do. It seems like all of those could be accomplished quite well with only 2GB, with a good deal of multi-tasking as well. Unless you are meaning that it would do well for a longer time time (ie: 4-5 years)?

Sorry, it's just odd when people want to have 4GB when they're doing, well, pretty much exactly what you're doing. In my experience, even having 4GB for gaming is a little overkill at this point, especially on a machine with such an anemic graphics card.

[Eyedn]

Because a 2GB stick is cheap and a 4GB stick is very expensive. Technically not a "stick" because its soldered but you get where im coming from.

[jdechko]

Because a 2GB stick is cheap and a 4GB stick is very expensive. Technically not a "stick" because its soldered but you get where im coming from.

Except it's 16x128MB RAM Chips that are soldered on both sides of the board to give you your 2GB. That's equivalent to 2 sticks of 1GB, which isn't expensive at all. Bumping it to 16x256MB would be equivalent to 2-2GB sticks, which is more, but not nearly as much as a single 4GB stick.

http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/MacBook-Air/598/3

There are 16 RAM chips (eight one-gigabit chips on each side of the logic board) for a total of 2 GB 667MHz DDR2 SDRAM.

[gri]

I guess I'm a little confused, though, why 4GB is necessary for what you want to do. It seems like all of those could be accomplished quite well with only 2GB, with a good deal of multi-tasking as well. Unless you are meaning that it would do well for a longer time time (ie: 4-5 years)?

Sorry, it's just odd when people want to have 4GB when they're doing, well, pretty much exactly what you're doing. In my experience, even having 4GB for gaming is a little overkill at this point, especially on a machine with such an anemic graphics card.

Because as 2 G might be sufficient for most of the stuff today it won't be tomorrow. The MBP even have options to go to 8GB. Not needed now but in the future, when software is getting more demanding and "used" to bigger RAM. I.e. programmers are utilizing the larger space they have for their programs. So a year from now 2 GB is probably not cutting it anymore. And I don't want to invest into something which is technically behind soon. Especially since I cannot upgrade later on as with the MBP. Why not a MBP you may ask? Screen and weight.

[jdechko]

Because as 2 G might be sufficient for most of the stuff today it won't be tomorrow. The MBP even have options to go to 8GB. Not needed now but in the future, when software is getting more demanding and "used" to bigger RAM. I.e. programmers are utilizing the larger space they have for their programs. So a year from now 2 GB is probably not cutting it anymore. And I don't want to invest into something which is technically behind soon. Especially since I cannot upgrade later on as with the MBP. Why not a MBP you may ask? Screen and weight.

Fair enough. I wasn't necessarily attacking your stance, by the way. I even included Unless you are meaning that it would do well for a longer time time (ie: 4-5 years)? because I didn't bother to ask. I assumed that you wouldn't be keeping it for a long time, because a lot of people on MR are constantly upgrading to have the latest and greatest.

I find myself somewhere in the middle, between having to have something that will last a long time, and having something cooler (the Air) that won't last quite as long (but would still last long enough for me). I honestly expected to upgrade my computer long before now, but I've been stuck with 384MB RAM on my VAIO since day 1, so I completely understand that having the ability to upgrade is nice. In the meantime, I just hope that an update to the iPhone OS won't force me to upgrade iTunes.

[gri]

Fair enough. I wasn't necessarily attacking your stance, by the way. I even included [I]Unless you are meaning that it would do well for a longer time time.

No apologies neccessary, didn't see it as an attack:). I like to have the latest and greatest as well but cannot always afford it... Now I am in the market for a new Mac (desktop and laptop) and I don't want to buy something that is (hopefully) not the latest any more. And currently with 2G RAM it seems not the latest to begin with...