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Frisco
Jun 16, 2009, 07:19 PM
Ask Jobs about Apple TV and he'd do a double take, "what's that?" I know his excuse it's only a hobby, but Apple gave up on it way to quickly--very little marketing, etc.

When originally released it had its issues and they have had some minor updates, but if they were really focused they could have done so much more.

Is Apple TV--Apple's bastard child?



TRAG
Jun 16, 2009, 08:18 PM
I think it is. And it's messed up because I here so many good things about it. But for every good thing there are bad. Many people hack it, use a Mac mini as an HTPC, ATV can't play 1080p (retarded)(probably due to the size of the file), and the list goes on. I have no idea why they didn't market this thing. Never even saw a commercial

I personally want an ATV, but can't see myself getting one until it offers you to connect an external HD for more media without hacking. Not because I download movies and TV shows. I only get music videos because iTMS is a great pace to get music videos at a good quality. [If anyone knows of a better place please let me know.] I rip DVDs and play VIDEO_TS files on the fly. But I just do not think for a second that downloading will take over. Not a chance. Blu-ray has a better chance at being in Macs. There is just nothing better than having hard, tangible media in your hands that won't disappear with a HD failure. With that being said, the ATV is only desired by few people.

But still, with aTV Flash, I could be a happy camper. I might take the plunge. It hasn't been updated in 2 years. Maybe it will soon :confused:

kadeschs
Jun 17, 2009, 06:59 AM
Untether it from iTunes, remove gimped functionality, and open it up to play common formats that everyone uses and that would go along way. Their support for buying movies on it definitely helped. However, most people don't have a 3 Mbps download connection. Steve kept saying they've listened to what people wanted in the latest version. Well Steve, make it practical and cost effective as a cable replacement, now you have a product that sells.

shiseiryu1
Jun 17, 2009, 08:13 AM
I really enjoy my AppleTV... it's extremely simple/user-friendly and has an elegant user interface. I've synced all my music/photos to it and when friends come over I play music while the screen saver rotates through my photos (great conversation starter). I have a 1TB drive on my mac so I ripped all my ~250 DVDs to my HD and stream it to my AppleTV. It's awesome to have instant access to so many movies...no disk-swapping. I also have my mac backed up with Time Machine so I feel safe about having my files in a digital format. I also have the elgato TV tuner which I use to record shows and automatically push them to the AppleTV. Lastly, I can use my iPhone as a remote for the AppleTV...this is really great b/c I have some speakers on my porch so I can change songs/adjust volume while I'm sitting outside...all via wifi. :)

All my friends who come over are impressed and amazed by the power of the AppleTV. The shame is that because there hasn't been a marketing push, nobody knows that it even exists.

Saladinos
Jun 17, 2009, 08:21 AM
Apple wanted the AppleTV to replace your DVD player, but there's a design flaw in that respect: it doesn't play DVDs. If you did want to do things as Apple intended, you'd have to throw out all your DVDs and buy your content again from the iTunes Store. For most people, that's simply unacceptable.

The product isn't totally unsalvageable: add a DVD drive and lower the prices and it'll be workable. If it did play DVDs, I'd buy one in a snap. I simply don't have enough digital content to justify a box for that alone. The vast majority of us are still in a physical to digital transition (if we own any digital content at all), and the AppleTV is not a transition device -- it's a digital media only device.

If they added a Blu-Ray drive, they could position a model as a HD media device rather than a digital media device. That could allow it to grain more traction.

Santa Rosa
Jun 17, 2009, 08:27 AM
Make it a high quality freeview box as well as an Apple TV and they would have a sale from me.

It is a shame that they seem to be letting it stagnate a bit, September iPod event though, you never know what they might be cooking up.

Rich1963
Jun 17, 2009, 09:24 AM
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. If you want this thing flying off of the shelves, simply enable iTunes to rip and encode a DVD. Done. Can't build enough. Everyone who comes over to my house and sees 500+ movies and 600+TV shows at my fingertips (from my collection, I might add) wants the same thing for their DVDs. The problem is, when they see the workflow, despite how simple it is, it mellows their enthusiasm. Automate that via itunes, and this thing becomes a sales winner. Do it with Blu-ray, and suddenly you've just given the Blu-ray format a big boost as well. But I can gaurantee on thing - the MPAA is much too stupid and backwards to do this.

BornAgainMac
Jun 17, 2009, 09:39 AM
If only iTunes just had the DVD copy feature and made it mainstream. I think it is 8 Track Tape of the 90's.

J&JPolangin
Jun 17, 2009, 10:42 AM
...how long did it take for the mini to be updated?

Maybe the ATV is on the same time line...:eek:

skinnylegs
Jun 17, 2009, 10:45 AM
You guys might find this interesting......

http://www.atvflash.com/

shiseiryu1
Jun 17, 2009, 11:11 AM
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. If you want this thing flying off of the shelves, simply enable iTunes to rip and encode a DVD. Done. Can't build enough. Everyone who comes over to my house and sees 500+ movies and 600+TV shows at my fingertips (from my collection, I might add) wants the same thing for their DVDs. The problem is, when they see the workflow, despite how simple it is, it mellows their enthusiasm. Automate that via itunes, and this thing becomes a sales winner. Do it with Blu-ray, and suddenly you've just given the Blu-ray format a big boost as well. But I can gaurantee on thing - the MPAA is much too stupid and backwards to do this.

I agree. Isn't RealDVD or somebody in a lawsuit with the MPAA about this feature? If they win the case then it may give Apple the opportunity to do that with iTunes (although they may make their content providers angry...they'll probably threaten to remove what few movies they do have in the iTunes store if Apple enables ripping). :(

nuckinfutz
Jun 17, 2009, 11:13 AM
Ripping DVD
Blu-ray support

Someone wake these guys up from this dream. These aren't going to happen and both are out of Apple's control.

If the next Apple TV supports 1080p and is cheaper it'll sell like hotcakes. I already have a DVD player I don't need one in the Apple TV. It doesn't have to be all things to all people.

The software could get smarter as well if you have multiple TV. I'm guessing you could do what Tivo does and be able to watch a movie in the living room and then send it to the bedroom to finish.

chelseasian
Jun 17, 2009, 11:22 AM
It's interesting that the TV output from AppleTV can be 1080p but the video files only go as far as 720p. I do enjoy my ATV but I do wish Apple will at least offer a 3.0 software update or something. It's been eons since.

nathanj.massey
Jun 17, 2009, 11:57 AM
I think we'll see another software update to the AppleTV at the annual iPod event that Apple has.

The killer app for this thing is being able use things like Hulu and BBC iPlayer, like you can with YouTube now.

A smart move for Apple to make would be to create a AppleTV SDK and App Store. That way, they can outmaneuver people like MS and Sony by having a big group of developers rapidly add functionality to the AppleTV through 3rd party app's.

Think how long it's taken MS to get stuff like Last.fm and FaceBook onto the 360, and now think how quickly those guys got their apps onto the iPhone.

Apple needs to learn from it's success with the iPhone, and repeat it with the AppleTV.

ATimson
Jun 17, 2009, 12:26 PM
Ripping DVD
Blu-ray support

Someone wake these guys up from this dream. These aren't going to happen and both are out of Apple's control.
Ripping DVDs unfortunately is. Blu-ray support is completely within Apple's control, they just don't feel like implementing it.

almostinsane
Jun 17, 2009, 12:50 PM
The killer app for this thing is being able use things like Hulu and BBC iPlayer, like you can with YouTube now.



Hulu doesn't want its app to be used with your TV, its strictly for supplemental viewing on your laptop and PC. Since the Apple 'TV'! is for your TV, good luck in ever seeing it on there.

And I'm not sure why getting 1080P viewable would help sell them. Consumers don't care about 1080P. The fact is that the ATV is yet another box that doesn't have much value add. Consumers already have a cable box and DVD player under their TV, they dont want another.

kiranmk2
Jun 17, 2009, 01:57 PM
I think AV is far more than a hobby, but they're gimped by the MPAA/studios.

The RIAA allowed Apple to distribute digital music files with DRM, so I can imagine it wouldn't be too hard to persuade the MPAA to allow DVDs to be ripped so long as the resultant file was DRM'd too - but of course Apple want you to rent/buy the film from them, so until they realise that people don't want to rebuy their collections I can't see this appearing. The ATV preset in Handbrake really is pretty fool-proof for most discs so with a bit more fine-tuning on the gui end (ie help with multiple soundtracks and soft-subs for people who get nervous at phrases like "patch" or "command line") that could indeed be a one-stop app for ripping.

1080p looks like being the dominant format for the foreseeable future so the next version of the ATV should at least support it, even if films at that resolution come later.

Internal drives will always fill up and be superseeded by larger models. I'd like to see the future ATV with 16 GB or so of flash/SSD for the OS/buffering and a replaceable HDD so it could function without a HDD as a pure streamer or users could upgrade the drives over time.

On the software side, the interface is really good (bar the odd caching/slowdown problem), but an App store (more likely, a widget store) to allow Hulu and iPlayer apps to be provided by 3rd parties if they want to would be really good. The whole point of the ATV is to stream files, so the obvious thing is to allow streaming from NAS units meaning you don't have to leave your mac on but how about also being able to stream from ATV to ATV if you have more than one - this could also function as a WiFi backup for the disks - seeing as they are always on. Building on this always on feature, how about adding airport express functionality - ie the ATV acts as a wireless bridge and further items (eg Xbox 360) can connect to the network port and join the WiFi network.

Finally, Apple need to finally move away from the idea of having files stored on one computer - allow the ATV to act as a media server and adapt computer software to keep up (ie in iTunes X and iPhoto X your libraries are on a shared drive) - they could even market it buy saying - the more ATVs you buy, the more backups you have!

The current model could be marketed as a pure streamer - I'm sure most people would hang on to theirs for a secondary TV, but I'm sure it could be soft-updated to include some new features (such as widgets, AP express features and ATV-ATV/ATV-computer streaming).

Like the Mac Mini before it, it's not dead...I can imagine heated debates between Apple and the movie studios are raging as we speak.

skinnylegs
Jun 17, 2009, 02:02 PM
IMHO, one way to increase enthusiasm for ATV is to interface it with the iPhone. In other words, Apple would need to have an ATV update that includes iPhone OS 3.0 on the ATV (easy enough) and allow the iPhone to essentially work as a remote control. Wouldn't it be cool to have Safari and text messaging and email and all of the other features of your iPhone on your widescreen LCD in the living room? :D

nuckinfutz
Jun 17, 2009, 02:07 PM
IMHO, one way to increase enthusiasm for ATV is to interface it with the iPhone. In other words, Apple would need to have an ATV update that includes iPhone OS 3.0 on the ATV (easy enough) and allow the iPhone to essentially work as a remote control. Wouldn't it be cool to have Safari and text messaging and email and all of the other features of your iPhone on your widescreen LCD in the living room? :D

This is a good idea.

Apple has a lot of room for growth here. They really don't need to do Hulu or Netflix because those features are being integrated into TV and Blu-ray players.

They should deliver an Apple media server that can send out streams to multiple ATV and centralize the storage. This would allow Apple to ship a low cost ATV with 8GB of NAND for buffering.

They should have some sort of routing features a la Sonos where you can zone parts of your home and play different music in each zone all controlled by a master iPhone/iPod Touch

The ATV should allow for light gaming as well.

Take the guts of the current iPhone and add some specific decoders for 1080p playback and voila you have a nice low energy consuming device that can be delivered cheaply yet still be an effective multimedia device.

skinnylegs
Jun 17, 2009, 02:11 PM
This is a good idea.

Apple has a lot of room for growth here. They really don't need to do Hulu or Netflix because those features are being integrated into TV and Blu-ray players.

They should deliver an Apple media server that can send out streams to multiple ATV and centralize the storage. This would allow Apple to ship a low cost ATV with 8GB of NAND for buffering.

They should have some sort of routing features a la Sonos where you can zone parts of your home and play different music in each zone all controlled by a master iPhone/iPod Touch

The ATV should allow for light gaming as well.

Take the guts of the current iPhone and add some specific decoders for 1080p playback and voila you have a nice low energy consuming device that can be delivered cheaply yet still be an effective multimedia device.Exactly!

I also envision being able to run OS 3.0 in window mode which would effectively allow you to continue watching whatever it is you are watching while doing something like texting or checking the weather in a window.

anubis
Jun 17, 2009, 02:24 PM
I bought my AppleTV about a year and a half ago and recently sold it. I decided I couldn't live with its limitations any longer and Apple doesn't seem to have any desire to actually improve the device.

I bought a used 3.4GHz Pentium 4 HT microATX desktop computer and upgraded it with 2 gigs of RAM, ATI Radeon 2400HD video card, Soundblaster Audigy 7.1 surround sound card, and full wireless keyboard with built-in trackball. It came with a 400GB hard drive and dual layer DVD burner. Total cost: $200. Less than the price of an AppleTV.

The difference in user experience is incredible. Boxee on AppleTV was unbearably slow, almost to the point of being unwatchable. Boxee on my HTPC is an absolte thrill. I've had zero problems getting Boxee to play with the video and sound cards. I installed a 1TB internal hard drive and copied all of my video files to it, clearing lots of valueable space on my iMac. I can easily run iTunes to stream music files and download and rent movies from the iTunes store. And since it has a full web browser, I can access things like ABC's online HD programming as well as HULU's HD library. I can also access full netflix. I can play DVDs in the DVD drive without having to rip them. 1080p support. All of this without having to do any hacking, patchsticks, or anything else like that.

Selling my AppleTV and replacing it with an HTPC was one of the best decisions I've ever made, and it has substantially improved my home theater experience. AppleTV's main limitations are lack of full web browser and unbearably slow speed. Unfortunately, it does not appear that Apple is interested in breathing life into a fading platform :(

nuckinfutz
Jun 17, 2009, 02:36 PM
I certainly do not think Apple's going after the HTPC crowd. The Mac mini in the hands of a skilled home theater nut can accomplish that.

They need something that is distinctly "not" a computer. No fans, no desktop just a simple appliance that works with iTunes content and supports 3rd party codecs to a point.

I'm a bit different that many. I don't generally watch a bunch of TV shows I'm more of a movie fan so Hulu or Boxee isn't all that appealing to me. Now that HD camcorders are fairly cheap and plentiful and iMovie 09 can edit them nicely I'm interested in viewing my own content in HD.

skinnylegs
Jun 17, 2009, 02:40 PM
I'm a bit different that many. I don't generally watch a bunch of TV shows I'm more of a movie fan so Hulu or Boxee isn't all that appealing to me.You're not alone.....

TRAG
Jun 17, 2009, 03:01 PM
If it had more apps like Comedy Central, Hulu, CNet, Netflix, The Colbert Repoer etc (basically everything that Plex can do) I'd be all over one. And the ability to play VIDEO_TS files.

zedsdead
Jun 17, 2009, 03:27 PM
Apple has said they are going to continue investing in it...I think that it is getting an update before the end of the year...it's long overdue.

kjspidey
Jun 17, 2009, 04:43 PM
Since I use a Tivo I cannot receive on demand content from my cable provider. I use my Apple TV as an on demnad type of unit. When I want to rent a movie i do. That's really all I use it for. I cannot see any other reason to have it. Like someone else said I like to have the media. It could be nice to stream movies you have ripped if you use handbrake or something.

randy98mtu
Jun 17, 2009, 10:05 PM
I'm with those who think ATV will see an update this year. I think there will be new hardware and a software update for older boxes. I use the ATV for music, videos and movies. I already love what it does and in my opinion doesn't need much but has a lot more potential! Like others, I use it for background music when I have family and friends over and they all love the slideshow of pictures. They all ask how I did that and I just point to the ATV and tell them they can go get one too.

I'd like to see more interaction with the iPhone remote app. I would hope they would include a faster processor and the updated software would improve some of the response time issues for the older boxes. Hopefully with a faster processor new boxes would handle 1080p. The dream feature for me and least likely to happen would be a Bluray drive built in. lol I can dream, right? Right now I use the PS3 for Bluray and as a result don't watch many Blurays. I just hate the interface (I also have a hardware limitation in my receiver not having HDMI ports and limited to 2 optical ports)

So count me as one hoping for an ATV update this fall. The wife is prepped to move the old one to the bedroom TV and put the new one on the main TV. If I knew for sure they weren't going to update it, I'd go buy another one today for the bedroom.

CPD_1
Jun 17, 2009, 11:43 PM
I hope they update it at the iPod event later this year, too. 1080p, native support for USB storage, and an app store would all be nice inclusions.

Shuttleworth
Jun 18, 2009, 02:39 AM
Hulu doesn't want its app to be used with your TV, its strictly for supplemental viewing on your laptop and PC. Since the Apple 'TV'! is for your TV, good luck in ever seeing it on there.


But he said "LIKE Hulu". Do Hulu have a monopoly on this type of service? If it's possible to provide the service for equipment LIKE the Apple TV, what's to stop someone else from doing it instead of Hulu? It probably would have to be someone different for us anyway, as we can't get Hulu in the UK.

soLoredd
Jun 18, 2009, 06:55 AM
Apple really dropped the ball with the AppleTV. The problem is, an update will do us fine but for those who either never bought one or who got rid of theirs, an update won't do much. It seems like its a product stuck in space with nowhere to go. Apple has no idea what it wants it to be - other than an iTunes Store for your TV.

In order for Apple to make the "living room" relevant, they need to go back to square one and figure out what people are using their AppleTV for and what Apple wants it to do. We know they want iTunes to be relevant but for pretty much every AppleTV user, they already are using iTunes in another place. I'm not saying iTunes doesn't belong on the device - it does, and my wife and I use it a lot - however, it shouldn't be the focal point (which is what it is now). On every other device Apple has - Mac, iPhone, iPod - iTunes is an extension of the device, it doesn't make the device. The team needs to go back and open the thing up to truly be a living room experience. That's one thing the 360/PS3 does well because they also allow you to use physical media. I can turn on my 360 and either rent a movie there or watch a DVD. I guess the 360 lacks the buy digital download feature that the AppleTV has, however, I think the general public feels more comfortable knowing that DVD they bought will work pretty much however or whenever they want it to.

Hopefully, they come up with something. Right now my setup does me fine but in 3-5 years, something else will come along and whatever it is, it is being designed at this very moment.

jaw04005
Jun 18, 2009, 07:30 AM
If it had more apps like Comedy Central, Hulu, CNet, Netflix, The Colbert Repoer etc (basically everything that Plex can do) I'd be all over one. And the ability to play VIDEO_TS files.

Here's the problem. None of the "providers" you listed signed up to be in Plex or Boxee. The developers of both hacked their web streams to include them in their program.

Obviously, Apple can't do that. Specifically, Hulu has said their goal is not to be on TV. The TV networks that own Hulu don't want a Hulu set-top box.

The ripping DVD suggestion will never happen either. The MPAA is currently in a huge legal battle with Real over RealDVD, which ripped DVDs and placed copy protection on those rips (unlike something like Mac the Ripper, Handbrake, etc). They don't even want consumers to have the ability to rip DVDs as they believe it violates the DMCA.

You can see the challenge Apple has to define the Apple TV. Providers don't want Apple to control the video market like they control music.

At this point, the only realistic things mentioned Apple could add to Apple TV would be software improvements including an App Store and 1080p support.

iGary
Jun 18, 2009, 07:33 AM
I just got an Apple TV.

If I could use hulu and Netflix, I'd be happy - I assume there is no functionality for this yet.

pdjudd
Jun 18, 2009, 08:29 AM
Specifically, Hulu has said their goal is not to be on TV. The TV networks that own Hulu don't want a Hulu set-top box.

Specifically the content owners. Their mindset is (and probably will remain that way for the foreseeable future) is "If they are watching it on TV for free, they should be doing it on network TV and watching it with normal commercials!" Rupert Murdock (Fox head and major partner in Hulu) hates giving things away on TV for free. These guys make far more money selling their content on TV networks that are subsidized by lots of commercials then they do so on Hulu - which only shows stiff after its initial airing.

NBC and FOX do not want Hulu to compete with their own networks and givew an advantage to a model that shows only 1/4 of the commercials. They want as many eyeballs on their stations as possible.

BG-Mac
Jun 18, 2009, 09:48 AM
Add me to the list of those who desperately want an ATV update. I to am hoping for the September iPod event to be the time and place. There are so many possibilities. The ATV may be dead in its current form, but I think we'll see the product continue to evolve for years to come.

magikgeek
Jun 18, 2009, 10:21 AM
1. Compete with Netflix... Video-on-demand for a monthly fee. (People want it.)
2. Compete with Hulu... Video-on-demand but do it cheaper for the networks.
3. Allow users to use their content in any format any where on their network without iTunes running. (Solution Quicktime X + Software)
4. Make Apple TV organization visual and fast with a touch / slick interface.
5. Give users the ability to buy video 1080p directly on apple TV to have the highest quality possible with equal features to Blu-Ray (subtitles, menus, extras, etc.)
6. Provide Network / Internet Storage Options to the Customer. (Why did they buy that storage facility in North Carolina?) Most people won't know how to setup a NAS. Help a brother out. "They keep on saying backup my stuff up... I'm running out of room on my laptop."
7. Two processors to utilize new technologies just in case it becomes legal to backup your DVDs via an external USB DVD drive with automated software.
8. Blu-ray program. Send us your Blu-ray discs and we will give you a discount on a digital version.
9. 1080p compatibility on iPods... one format.

topher5
Jun 18, 2009, 10:45 AM
I bought my AppleTV about a year and a half ago and recently sold it. I decided I couldn't live with its limitations any longer and Apple doesn't seem to have any desire to actually improve the device.

I bought a used 3.4GHz Pentium 4 HT microATX desktop computer and upgraded it with 2 gigs of RAM, ATI Radeon 2400HD video card, Soundblaster Audigy 7.1 surround sound card, and full wireless keyboard with built-in trackball. It came with a 400GB hard drive and dual layer DVD burner. Total cost: $200. Less than the price of an AppleTV.

The difference in user experience is incredible. Boxee on AppleTV was unbearably slow, almost to the point of being unwatchable. Boxee on my HTPC is an absolte thrill. I've had zero problems getting Boxee to play with the video and sound cards. I installed a 1TB internal hard drive and copied all of my video files to it, clearing lots of valueable space on my iMac. I can easily run iTunes to stream music files and download and rent movies from the iTunes store. And since it has a full web browser, I can access things like ABC's online HD programming as well as HULU's HD library. I can also access full netflix. I can play DVDs in the DVD drive without having to rip them. 1080p support. All of this without having to do any hacking, patchsticks, or anything else like that.

Selling my AppleTV and replacing it with an HTPC was one of the best decisions I've ever made, and it has substantially improved my home theater experience. AppleTV's main limitations are lack of full web browser and unbearably slow speed. Unfortunately, it does not appear that Apple is interested in breathing life into a fading platform :(

Because I'm always curious, can I get more details on exactly which parts you bought? I'm on the fence about going this route and selling off my appleTVs as well. Do you have a problem with noise? That's my big hold up right now, I don't want fan noise while watching.

kadeschs
Jun 18, 2009, 11:49 AM
Apple really dropped the ball with the AppleTV.

For me, I'd say yes and no. AppleTV is an easy way to get my content up on the TV. That works for me. Of course, as with ALL of their products, they always do things that make their products less attractive. Price point is too high for what you get, but cheaper than the way overpriced Mini. They tether it to iTunes (no need to say more). Limited playback support (at the very least should support avi). Purposely gimping the hardware causing lower resolutions and frame rates. It's that way of thinking that hinders all of Apple's products.

nuckinfutz
Jun 18, 2009, 11:55 AM
The problem that Apple faces is that they're simply not going to satisfy every video lover. You have the people that want Hulu (though the companies behind Hulu want to control how their content is displayed) and you have Netflix and then of course the people that want Apple to playback every codec known to mankind.

Apple's thrust needs to lead with their crown jewels the iPhone and iPod Touch and that's what they appear to be doing with Snow Leopard and it's export options.

I expect that we'll have digital outputs so that you can purchase a movie on iTunes and send it to your iPhone or iPod Touch and take it anywhere you want to watch it. The digital out will let you output 720p HD video using a mddi to HDMI connector cable.

Then Apple brow beats the MPAA and Hollywood to lower their damn pricing on movies from the current ridiculous to something more palatable to people who are bringing their own bandwidth and storage.

TheCheapGeek
Jun 18, 2009, 12:18 PM
I love my apple tv, it does evrything I need it to. It allows me to play all of my content I have on my computer on either of my two tv's. I do agree they need to support 1080P, for me it means nothing but some users want the best quality. I have hacked it in the past to play other formats but I would rather spend the time transcoding than have a horrible interface for viewing, and have different shows in different places. Hulu's low quality would keep me from ever using their service. I think the main issue that divides people that love their apple tv's and people who want more functionality is "what are you using for you main tv viewership". If you use cable, satalite, blueray, ect for your primary means of enternaiment then the apple tv does not offer any compelling features, but for someone like me who relies soley on the apple tv its fantastic. I can subscribe to any show I would like to watch, import any content I get from elswhere( ie. DVD rips and other legal content), and my wife can operate it without thinking. And all of this is still cheaper than cable. All I want is a clock on the main screen?

magikgeek
Jun 18, 2009, 12:30 PM
I love my apple tv, it does evrything I need it to. It allows me to play all of my content I have on my computer on either of my two tv's. I do agree they need to support 1080P, for me it means nothing but some users want the best quality. I have hacked it in the past to play other formats but I would rather spend the time transcoding than have a horrible interface for viewing, and have different shows in different places. Hulu's low quality would keep me from ever using their service. I think the main issue that divides people that love their apple tv's and people who want more functionality is "what are you using for you main tv viewership". If you use cable, satalite, blueray, ect for your primary means of enternaiment then the apple tv does not offer any compelling features, but for someone like me who relies soley on the apple tv its fantastic. I can subscribe to any show I would like to watch, import any content I get from elswhere( ie. DVD rips and other legal content), and my wife can operate it without thinking. And all of this is still cheaper than cable. All I want is a clock on the main screen?

I agree with what your saying but Apple needs to out do Boxee. People want all of their media at the ready and what Apple and Netflix have to offer. Boxee does not have a media store and Apple TV does not have interface for unlimited content. They are going to meet in the middle. Someone is going to offer Boxee a deal to be able to purchase content in Boxee. Netflix's long term solution will be the same. Netflix may partner with Amazon. The wheels are in motion. Physical media will die; how long that takes will be up to the people and the media companies. Stop buying into Blu-Ray if you want digital distribution to surge ahead; it's an fruitless venture for the consumer who will in the end be stuck with useless media.

nuckinfutz
Jun 18, 2009, 12:35 PM
I agree with what your saying but Apple needs to out do Boxee. People want all of their media at the ready and what Apple and Netflix have to offer. Boxee does not have a media store and Apple TV does not have interface for unlimited content. They are going to meet in the middle. Someone is going to offer Boxee a deal to be able to purchase content in Boxee. Netflix's long term solution will be the same. Netflix may partner with Amazon. The wheels are in motion. Physical media will die; how long that takes will be up to the people and the media companies. Stop buying into Blu-Ray if you want digital distribution to surge ahead; it's an fruitless venture for the consumer who will in the end be stuck with useless media.

I disagree.

TV junkies like Boxee but Boxee's design is anti-thetical to Apple's design. Note that Apple is known for their minimalism not "hey let's through every port on a computer and support everything in software"

People looking for a Boxee like interface would be better suited to get a Mac mini for their setups.

TheCheapGeek
Jun 18, 2009, 12:43 PM
I disagree.

TV junkies like Boxee but Boxee's design is anti-thetical to Apple's design. Note that Apple is known for their minimalism not "hey let's through every port on a computer and support everything in software"

People looking for a Boxee like interface would be better suited to get a Mac mini for their setups.

I agree, I can install boxee if I want but I choose not to because its a feature overload.

aiannar974
Jun 18, 2009, 01:01 PM
I own a different video box that has been nothing but problems and i figured out why. They tried to be everything to everyone and they did nothing good. By apple limiting what codecs it uses, it has less issues. I must have tried 10 different formats before one worked on my box. Believe it or not the one that worked was handbrake using an appletv format.

Anthony

Shuttleworth
Jun 18, 2009, 01:20 PM
TV show rentals at say 1/4 the price of buying the episode might make more people interested.

BG-Mac
Jun 18, 2009, 01:31 PM
Reading all of these ideas gets me excited about what the ATV could be. I really hope Apple doesn't drop the ball. I don't think they will, but still.

kiranmk2
Jun 18, 2009, 01:49 PM
In terms of renting, I think the ATV works perfectly as it is - all the stuff needed (more choice, option of subscriptions) is probably down to the studios. I'm not even that fussed about the lack of codec support - H264 is pretty much the best anyway, but at least make the new unit powerful enough to use all the features (high profile). It's easy enough to use Handbrake to convert other videos and people moaning about MKV files probably pirated them anyway. I don't think these features need changing and they won't change.

The storage and distribution needs to to change and I think it will like buying content from an ipod/iphone has evolved.

magikgeek
Jun 18, 2009, 02:01 PM
I disagree.

TV junkies like Boxee but Boxee's design is anti-thetical to Apple's design. Note that Apple is known for their minimalism not "hey let's through every port on a computer and support everything in software"

People looking for a Boxee like interface would be better suited to get a Mac mini for their setups.

What I was trying to say is that Apple has one piece of the pie and not very well. "Direct sales" and "Rentals". Boxee has an open interface and has "internet content" by the horns. You are correct they are at odds.

However, Boxee has more content and a bigger following. How will Apple get both direct sales and a bigger following? Answer: More content through internet Apps and subscription based services designed to compete with Netflix. Will this include Hulu? no. Could Apple try to compete with Hulu? yes.

For $20 under Apple's current model, it only gets you 5-6 movie rentals with no waiting. With Block Buster or Amazon we get 12 or more for the same price and you may have to wait.

Apple must be realizing by now that customers want video without the hassle of media storage. They know rental are the bread and butter. Music works on a buy and store model. Video gets complicated. They currently have the the distribution network before the technology; its still has not progressed enough through m4p technology. For $19.99 its missing subtitles, 1080p, 5.1 surround, menus, extras, etc. They don't have a model yet that works well for TV. They are between a rock and a hard place. Expect big changes coming to their model for TV and movies.

magikgeek
Jun 18, 2009, 02:18 PM
From:

http://www.apple.com/macosx/technology/#quicktimex
http://www.apple.com/macosx/refinements/enhancements-refinements.html#quicktime

"QuickTime X also takes advantage of ColorSync to provide high-quality color reproduction during playback and when sharing media to your iPhone, iPod, or Apple TV.":eek:

almostinsane
Jun 18, 2009, 02:24 PM
But he said "LIKE Hulu". Do Hulu have a monopoly on this type of service? If it's possible to provide the service for equipment LIKE the Apple TV, what's to stop someone else from doing it instead of Hulu? It probably would have to be someone different for us anyway, as we can't get Hulu in the UK.

Whats stopping someone else? Wholesale transfer pricing. The content owners want all the money and will squeeze every bit out of it from anyone who attempts to monetize IP video services. Since Hulu is a joint venture, the owners look at it as a wash and any money they make off of it is just butter.

vendettabass
Jun 18, 2009, 02:24 PM
I think the hardware will be improved at the iPod event, possibly NVIDIA ion platform?

A little more storage and a price drop would be great too.

Tower-Union
Jun 18, 2009, 03:34 PM
Do we have a tenative date yet for the iPod event?

almostinsane
Jun 18, 2009, 05:08 PM
I think the hardware will be improved at the iPod event, possibly NVIDIA ion platform?

A little more storage and a price drop would be great too.

Why would upgraded hardware get people to buy it? That doesn't offer anything that isn't available today. Its all about the software and services.

Tilpots
Jun 18, 2009, 08:46 PM
Why would upgraded hardware get people to buy it? That doesn't offer anything that isn't available today. Its all about the software and services.

DVR - would get me to buy it.

Blu-Ray player - would get me to buy it

Larger HDD - would be very nice

FW800 - would be extremely nice

Apple sells hardware, first and foremost. Improve the product, the "software and services" will follow.

BG-Mac
Jun 18, 2009, 09:34 PM
Pretty much any update would get me to buy it at this point. I'm at the point where I need one but will wait till the iPod event to see if anything happens. If not possibly a Mac Mini is in my immediate future.

NiteWaves77
Jun 19, 2009, 12:25 AM
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. If you want this thing flying off of the shelves, simply enable iTunes to rip and encode a DVD. Done.

What are your thoughts on the "digital copy" included with some DVDs now?

CPD_1
Jun 19, 2009, 12:37 AM
I know that question wasn't directed towards me, but I think the digital copy with DVDs is a great idea. I'd just like to see it a little more wide spread. I'd even buy blu-rays if they came with HD digital copies, and I don't own a blu-ray player (yet).

I don't care if it's got some DRM connected to it if it's iTunes compatible.

kadeschs
Jun 19, 2009, 07:35 AM
Ask Jobs about Apple TV and he'd do a double take, "what's that?" I know his excuse it's only a hobby, but Apple gave up on it way to quickly--very little marketing, etc.

When originally released it had its issues and they have had some minor updates, but if they were really focused they could have done so much more.

Is Apple TV--Apple's bastard child?

Well, it's apparent that the AppleTV will be embedded into LCD TVs. It could be that they are purposely fading out the stand-alone box because of this.

palane
Jun 19, 2009, 09:43 AM
Give it a blue-ray drive and sell it for a couple hundred over a DVD player alone. I'm not putting another box under the TV.

BB

kadeschs
Jun 19, 2009, 11:31 AM
Give it a blue-ray drive and sell it for a couple hundred over a DVD player alone. I'm not putting another box under the TV.

BB

Here! Here!

nuckinfutz
Jun 19, 2009, 12:01 PM
I'm sure people are just chomping at the bit to pay $399 for an Apple TV.

Keep dreamin fellas. :P

Trimmer2
Jun 19, 2009, 12:06 PM
Well, it's apparent that the AppleTV will be embedded into LCD TVs. It could be that they are purposely fading out the stand-alone box because of this.

I doubt it. Why alienate all the existing TV's?

I'd REALLY like to see Blue Ray (as long as it's backwards compatible) as this will solve most everyone's needs. You already have to use HD hook ups (HDMI or Component) why not just add Blue Ray? Maybe the form factor will be the current Mac Mini.

This seems like a very logical next step along with a much bigger hard drive...

pdjudd
Jun 19, 2009, 12:33 PM
You already have to use HD hook ups (HDMI or Component) why not just add Blue Ray?

I bet that Apple sees Blue Ray as competition. Not to mention that Blue Ray is already expensive - it would have to be a major loss leader.

cgray24
Jun 19, 2009, 12:58 PM
If I was a betting man, I'd almost put money they are letting Apple TV linger while developer support for iPhone gets built up, and then sometime in the future they will release a Apple TV SDK to allow iPhone developers to very easily port their game for larger screen sizes (aka the Apple TV)

Then with the connection of a iphone, itouch or maybe even the future tablet, you can start having a interactive gaming device on the TV. And since they already have some pretty heavy gaming companies working with the Iphone SDK, switching to the Apple TV would be pretty natural and you would have a light learning curve and thus a flood of cheap games and apps.

Talk about immediately catapulting the Apple TV.

If I were Apple, this would be my next step in their somewhat sudden entry into the Gaming industry and seriously making the Apple TV, the ipod for your tv.




Now, if I was a dreaming man. I would say in a few years theyll launch an iphone with a front facing camera, have the ability for the Apple TV to have an attached web cam and youll be able to make iChat calls between iPhones, Wifi connected iTouches, internet connected Apple tablets, Macs, Apple TVs, hell launch iChat for windows and let Windows people enjoy the fun too. Make a facebook/myspace app too and youll strike gold. (This is the only way I'd ever get use out of the front facing camera it seems like a ton of people want on the iPhone), and while im dreaming I'll throw out Netflix and Hulu, both of which I bet will never get ported to the AppleTV.


Honestly, I would use my AppleTv a hella lot more if it was just simply more reliable. It hangs up more than it works, but that may be only mine

Rich1963
Jun 19, 2009, 02:17 PM
I like the digital copies, but my point was more about using the collection you already have. I've written in this forum about it before, but I'll write it again in a condensed version. Of all the music on the average ipod user's ipod, only 3% of it was purchased via itunes. The rest was from that person's own ripped collection (and before people say P2P, this study was conducted several years ago by Apple to an anonymous sampling of ipod and itunes users, and P2P content was excluded). Once apple offered an easy and seamless hardware/software experience to manage their 300 CDs, the ipods flew off the shelves, and the rest is history.

An AppleTV is no different. It's just an ipod that connects to a television and manages a person's video collection. Enable people to take media they've already purchased and place it in a more manageable interface, and you've got the next ipod. Enable them to also shift it to their ipod touch and iphone, and it's even better.

Digital copies are great, but I'm not buying what I already own, again. "You've Got Mail" isn't going to look any better on Blu-ray. What I want to do is take my entire collection I already own, and place it at my fingertips to use as I see fit. I have already done that, but not everyone's cut out to rip and encode. And that's where Apple can move in and yet again revolutionize the game. Blu-ray uptake isn't taking off as well as the Blu-ray consortium wants you to believe, simply because people are a) tired of buying the same movie again and again b) many movies aren't going to look markedly better and c) those blue DVD cases aren't cheap, and the economy isn't looking great right now.

Blu-rays aren't as cheap as DVDs are and in this budget-conscious time, it makes alot more sense for the large movie-buying masses to grab 4 DVDs in the bargain bin for $20, as opposed to one for $30.

The last thing that I think alot of people are miffed about is portability. People over the last few years have sunk money into a DVD player for each room, a DVD player for the car, and a portable DVD player for when they are out of town, and they can buy one DVD for all of them, or limit themselves to playing their Blu-Ray in one, maybe two locations where they can afford players. This is another place Apple can step into and say, "Hey! Feed your disks into the itunes media center, give it some time to encode them, and then play this movie via your computer, apple TV, ipod, ipod touch, iphone, or plug a cable into your ipod/ipod touch/iphone and play it on a television." The Real / MPAA lawsuit will determine what happens there, but I think Apple has enough sway to approach the MPAA and DVD consortium and convince them that with the right copy protections put in place, this is a good thing, not a bad thing.

Holla!!

almostinsane
Jun 19, 2009, 03:09 PM
If I was a betting man, I'd almost put money they are letting Apple TV linger while developer support for iPhone gets built up, and then sometime in the future they will release a Apple TV SDK to allow iPhone developers to very easily port their game for larger screen sizes (aka the Apple TV)


How are you going to game with the ATV remote? Even if they released a controller it would be IR based which sucks for gaming. There's always the unused USB port, though.

paduck
Jun 19, 2009, 03:59 PM
They should deliver an Apple media server that can send out streams to multiple ATV and centralize the storage. This would allow Apple to ship a low cost ATV with 8GB of NAND for buffering.

They should have some sort of routing features a la Sonos where you can zone parts of your home and play different music in each zone all controlled by a master iPhone/iPod Touch.

I've long maintained that the missing piece of Apple's home integration puzzle is a centralized storage unit. Right now, everything is based off your iTunes media collection which is stored on a single computer. Having a server based option opens it up to multiple computers and allows for the AppleTV to stream without the computer being on with iTunes running. Apple has the Time Capsule, but that is a backup device, not a media server. It wouldn't be too difficult to add that capability though. And they should allow you to plug in a USB drive to backup your server (or send it across the network to something else). You can get devices that will be iTunes music servers, but none that will stream to the AppleTV. The key, and it probably isn't too difficult, is to make sure the centralized server can add content from multiple sources simultaneously and then serve that content out. Apple would probably want some sort of parental controls so that your 16-year-old's R movies aren't available for your 6-year-old without password or something.

Apple probably has some concerns about user-upgradable servers. It goes against their closed system approach. If you look, in almost every device they sell the user cannot upgrade the hard drive or the battery. That probably gives them feature and quality control, but means you have to make some important sizing decisions on the day of purchase or incur a big expense to do an official upgrade down the road.

The killer app for AppleTV is something that will allow it to cheaply replace cable. Call it an unlimited content subscription fee for on-demand TV. If Apple could take just a small percentage of that revenue and send everything else to the content providers, that could be a successful business model. I bet cable would hate that - especially if the product was coming over their high-speed cable Internet lines. Apple is doing ok with on-demand movies, although a partnership with someone like Netflix might help.

A great additional feature for iTunes would be the ability to simultaneously stream different content to multiple Airport Expresses and AppleTV's. I know you can only do one song via AirTunes to one or more Airport Expresses at a time. I think you actually can do multiple AppleTV video streams. It would be nice to do several songs to different Airport Expresses at the same time.

anubis
Jun 19, 2009, 04:14 PM
Because I'm always curious, can I get more details on exactly which parts you bought? I'm on the fence about going this route and selling off my appleTVs as well. Do you have a problem with noise? That's my big hold up right now, I don't want fan noise while watching.

Honestly, I just went to newegg and opened up their "Video Cards" section and picked the lowest price card that appeared to have a large number of reviews and DVI out, which for me was a Powercolor Radeon 2400HD for I think $24. Soundblaster audigy 7.1 low profile was $35. Don't remember the sepcifics of much else. The PC has multiple fans that are speed-controlled by temp sensors. Most of the time it's silent, but yes, sometimes the fans do come on... not sure if there's a cheap workaround so I just keep the volume turned up on my 7-channel Klipsch stereo ;)

nuckinfutz
Jun 19, 2009, 04:17 PM
Yes indeed paduck.

The current iTunes/Apple TV setup is ok if you have one computer doing most of the streaming. Once you have content from say 3-4 Mac/PC that want to share content then you have these islands of storage that become difficult to manage. The Enterprise has been dealing with this stuff for years which is why NAS and then SAN have become the dominant storage platforms trailing direct attached storage.

The home user needs this at a scaled back level. Most people don't realize but the Marvell chips that power the Time Capsule are the same chips that run multibay home NAS from some home storage vendors.

kiranmk2
Jun 19, 2009, 04:22 PM
Apple probably has some concerns about user-upgradable servers. It goes against their closed system approach. If you look, in almost every device they sell the user cannot upgrade the hard drive or the battery. That probably gives them feature and quality control, but means you have to make some important sizing decisions on the day of purchase or incur a big expense to do an official upgrade down the road.

The killer app for AppleTV is something that will allow it to cheaply replace cable. Call it an unlimited content subscription fee for on-demand TV. If Apple could take just a small percentage of that revenue and send everything else to the content providers, that could be a successful business model. I bet cable would hate that - especially if the product was coming over their high-speed cable Internet lines. Apple is doing ok with on-demand movies, although a partnership with someone like Netflix might help.


That's why I suggest keeping the OS on a small SSD and allowing a user changeable harddrive - I think the public could cope with pulling a flap, pulling out a drive, putting in the new one and closing the flap (the OS then takes care of all the formatting). This assumes they don't go with the central server.

I think we have to watch the MPAA vs Real case now. If Real win, I think we could start to see commercial rippers. I mean Apple lets you rip CDs in iTunes, but what about copy protected CDs - ripping them would break the DCMA (or whatever you Americans have). Imagine a device marketed as being able to rip store you current collection on disk (and serve it out to multiple computers and ipods/iphones) as well as being able to rent and buy a new generation of HD films. How about if iTunes converts other formats to m4v (as it offers to do when you try to import a wma track)?

In fact, BluRay has that managed copy thing coming so Apple may introduce BluRay when that feature is ratified to allow making digital HD copies to stream.

arnette
Jun 20, 2009, 01:37 PM
My suggestions for Apple to promote Apple TV sales:


Provide subscription-based rentals of TV programs in iTunes
Make 1080p standardized on AppleTV
Lower the price
Allow for external hard drive support


That is all.

TRAG
Jun 20, 2009, 02:23 PM
My suggestions for Apple to promote Apple TV sales:


Provide subscription-based rentals of TV programs in iTunes
Make 1080p standardized on AppleTV
Lower the price
Allow for external hard drive support


That is all.

I think 1,2 and 4 are possible. I doubt if Apple would lower the price too much.

zedsdead
Jun 20, 2009, 04:04 PM
I think 1,2 and 4 are possible. I doubt if Apple would lower the price too much.

They really need a built in dvr that utilizes all the patents apple has, not to mention an app store and better hardware.

TRAG
Jun 20, 2009, 07:49 PM
They really need a built in dvr that utilizes all the patents apple has, not to mention an app store and better hardware.

Better hardware is a must. I'd like to see how an app store for Apple TV would work. I can't picture how it would work. But as far as what the Apple TV can play and it's expandability, it's lacking. It only plays certain formats. It really boxes you in to their standards.

cgray24
Jun 24, 2009, 11:58 PM
How are you going to game with the ATV remote? Even if they released a controller it would be IR based which sucks for gaming. There's always the unused USB port, though.

Like mentioned, it could be through a iPhone, iPod, etc.

Take the new Apple Remote interaction with Apple TV for example.

Obviously things as they are now cant work, they would have to release new hardware.. the point is they have a game developer network now.. porting it to larger screen somewhat painless..

The inactivity of Apple TV probaly means... its about to be killed... or they are planning something huge with it and will do maintenance updates

soLoredd
Jun 25, 2009, 06:53 AM
One question I have is this: I keep hearing about DVR, DVR, DVR, but how would that work?? Right now, I have DirecTV, and I can only use DirecTV DVR boxes with their service. I don't get it. Apple would have to start their own TV service in order for the DVR to be any effective and I simply would NOT trust Apple to keep that going for long or be as competitive.

The DVR thing is a pipe dream. For those of you on OTA TV service, fine, it would work, but that number dwindles each and every year.

mohanman
Jun 25, 2009, 07:41 AM
I don't see the Appletv ever getting dvr function. Apple wants to sell tv shows, which may in fact in the long run be cheaper than actually having cable at home. For instance I pay nearly 100.00 a month on my cable bill alone through comcrap.. 100x12 months = 1200 stinking dollars! Thats for my two tvs I have in my apartment. I don't even have premium channels!

100 a month! Imagine how many tv shows I could buy from appletv, and have them in my itunes library and able to transfer them to ipod/iphone instantly etc. Plus no commercials, instant access, and you can view it anytime you want. Of course, I would still have over the air and some "free" cable channels just in case zombies started coming out of no whever taking over the world and I could at least get some news on the event and start packing up on weapons. I think a couple shotguns under the bed, a machine gun, hand gun and an easy escape route should be great, but escape to where? I have no idea.. probably some island or something like in Day of the Dead.

Just a thought.

Mo

Tower-Union
Jun 25, 2009, 07:57 AM
Mo, I'm pretty sure they got attacked and died once they got to the island. . . just a thought. Personally I'm going to hole up in the natural hot springs located in the Rocky Mountains of AB :D

BG-Mac
Jun 25, 2009, 08:03 AM
I don't see the Appletv ever getting dvr function. Apple wants to sell tv shows, which may in fact in the long run be cheaper than actually having cable at home. For instance I pay nearly 100.00 a month on my cable bill alone through comcrap.. 100x12 months = 1200 stinking dollars! Thats for my two tvs I have in my apartment. I don't even have premium channels!

100 a month! Imagine how many tv shows I could buy from appletv, and have them in my itunes library and able to transfer them to ipod/iphone instantly etc. Plus no commercials, instant access, and you can view it anytime you want. Of course, I would still have over the air and some "free" cable channels just in case zombies started coming out of no whever taking over the world and I could at least get some news on the event and start packing up on weapons. I think a couple shotguns under the bed, a machine gun, hand gun and an easy escape route should be great, but escape to where? I have no idea.. probably some island or something like in Day of the Dead.

Just a thought.

Mo

The one MAJOR thing missing from ATV that would make dropping cable for good a reality is live sports. If Apple could cut some kind of deal with the NCAA, NFL, etc. I think they'd get a bunch of converts. Just something like a Season Pass. I'm sure they could get something rolling with say... the MLS (soccer) and test the idea on a smaller scale. If it was successful the larger sports like the NFL would follow suit.

mohanman
Jun 25, 2009, 08:10 AM
Mo, I'm pretty sure they got attacked and died once they got to the island. . . just a thought. Personally I'm going to hole up in the natural hot springs located in the Rocky Mountains of AB :D

My friend,
You have your zombie movies mixed up in fact. Dawn of the Dead was when they reached some island off the coast of Wisconsin, and yes probably died. Day of the Dead is when they made it to the helicopter and we see them resting on the beach of some island safe and sound.

In any matter.. I think I better get a helicopter too

Mo

mohanman
Jun 25, 2009, 08:11 AM
and no you can't come with me ..

Rich1963
Jun 25, 2009, 12:57 PM
Even if I can contribute to the firepower equation? Not to mention, I've got an Airhog helicopter and have become very proficient at flying it around my living room. How hard could the real thing be?

mohanman
Jun 25, 2009, 01:20 PM
Even if I can contribute to the firepower equation? Not to mention, I've got an Airhog helicopter and have become very proficient at flying it around my living room. How hard could the real thing be?

Well I guess you could come, but if I got to the island and find out there are some zombies around, I'll probably need to use you as bait.. no offense or anything.

If I were to tie you up and use you as live bait and draw the zombies to you, i could pick them off one by one with my rifle. That way, the zombies on the island would all be eradicated.

Mo

Tower-Union
Jun 25, 2009, 01:23 PM
I stand corrected! :o I'll have to watch day of the dead. . . the 2008 or 1985 versions? Oh and you may want to give some thought to your island plans. I don't think you'd be able to last against conventional "zombies" (slow moving, but truly UNdead) as they can just walk through water, and eventually get to you, well in the event of a class 5 outbreak that isn (I'm assuming you've read Max Brook's writings). Now if we're talking ZOOMBIES (say, mutated version of rabies, which is much more possible) you'd be in good shape, as they are still technically alive and need to be able to breath, probably not making it all the way out to the island. I'm thinking personal car to get me as far as my local armored truck company's HQ and then jack a few of those, along with shotguns, sidearms, and all the ammo I can find! Fortress on wheels baby :cool:

dmm219
Jun 25, 2009, 01:56 PM
The one MAJOR thing missing from ATV that would make dropping cable for good a reality is live sports. If Apple could cut some kind of deal with the NCAA, NFL, etc. I think they'd get a bunch of converts. Just something like a Season Pass. I'm sure they could get something rolling with say... the MLS (soccer) and test the idea on a smaller scale. If it was successful the larger sports like the NFL would follow suit.

Your wish comes true...MLB.tv on ATV with Boxee...

Rich1963
Jun 25, 2009, 02:00 PM
With regards to the zombies and bait, I'd make such good bait, I would probably classify as a Master-baiter (come on-you just knew that was coming).

With regards to the whole slow vs. fast zombies, one thing very few zombie movies ever address (28 weeks later being one of the few) is that don't the zombies eventually run out of food and just decompose and die? I mean, within 2-3 weeks, wouldn't the planet simply become a sparsely populated world?

With regards to the slow vs. fast zombies and the island, I would just use the helicopter to fly to a remote mountain top fortress, as we all know the climbing prowess of a slow moving zombie is virtually nil.

mohanman
Jun 25, 2009, 02:13 PM
I stand corrected! :o I'll have to watch day of the dead. . . the 2008 or 1985 versions? Oh and you may want to give some thought to your island plans. I don't think you'd be able to last against conventional "zombies" (slow moving, but truly UNdead) as they can just walk through water, and eventually get to you, well in the event of a class 5 outbreak that isn (I'm assuming you've read Max Brook's writings). Now if we're talking ZOOMBIES (say, mutated version of rabies, which is much more possible) you'd be in good shape, as they are still technically alive and need to be able to breath, probably not making it all the way out to the island. I'm thinking personal car to get me as far as my local armored truck company's HQ and then jack a few of those, along with shotguns, sidearms, and all the ammo I can find! Fortress on wheels baby :cool:

Oh crap! I forgot about Land of the Dead in which the Zombies can go through water! Man, I guess I'll need a supply of fireworks too to keep them occupied while and I can use the other guy as bait to take them out too. They are slow moving, so I'll just stock up on ammo and try to eradicate them.

As far as fast zombies, an armored vehicle may do nicely. Ever play Zombies the board game? Best game ever, however it didn't teach me the necessary tactics to stay alive in real life.

Mo

BG-Mac
Jun 25, 2009, 03:15 PM
Your wish comes true...MLB.tv on ATV with Boxee...

Unfortunately I'm not a big baseball guy. Now give me College Football and NFL games.... and I'm sold!! :D