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MacRumors
Jul 7, 2009, 09:44 AM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/iphone/2009/07/07/more-details-on-tomtom-for-iphone-emerge/)

Macworld recently talked with (http://www.macworld.com/article/141539/2009/07/tomtomiphoneupdate.html) TomTom Vice President of Market Development Tom Murray, who revealed some additional details about the forthcoming TomTom for iPhone (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/06/09/tomtom-and-navigon-bringing-turn-by-turn-gps-car-navigation-to-iphone/) offerings. While the release date and pricing remain unknown (although the company is leaning towards a fixed price rather than a subscription model), Murray was able to talk a bit about the combination hardware-software solution and how the iPhone version will differ from traditional standalone GPS devices.

Hardware: TomTom will be offering a Car Kit for the iPhone, integrating a car mount, enhanced GPS receiver, built-in speaker, and power cables. The kit also includes an audio output jack, as well as a microphone to enable use of the iPhone as a Bluetooth speakerphone.For starters, the Car Kit includes a separate GPS receiver that performs better than the one built into the iPhone; Murray said this receiver is closer to what you’d find in a dedicated GPS unit. The TomTom app uses this receiver when your iPhone is docked in the Car Kit, allowing for improved real-time navigation, especially in cities with large buildings or in locations with lots of trees or other natural obstacles. The Car Kit also includes a built-in speaker that provides better audio quality and considerably louder output, making it easier to hear spoken directions.
Software: Much of the functionality in the software will be similar to existing GPS devices from TomTom, offering a similar interface and TomTom's IQ Routes (http://www.tomtom.com/whytomtom/topic.php?topic=5&subject=3) feature, although Murray couldn't address whether Map Share (http://www.tomtom.com/page/mapshare), which allows users to submit corrections to TomTom, would be available.Mapping and navigation will apparently work much as they do on the company's standalone units, with a similar interface, most of the same core features, and similar voice-guided navigation. The app will include TomTom's IQ Routes feature, which takes advantage of other TomTom GPS owners' driving experiences to determine the actual speeds driven on particular routes at particular times of day. Murray said the "trillions of bits of data" lets IQ Routes provide accurate information about historical drive-speed norms, generating more accurate drive times and letting the software choose the actual fastest route, which may not be the same as the shortest route.Beyond the traditional TomTom software features, the iPhone version will be able to take advantage of Multi-Touch gestures for interface navigation and zooming, and will also support both portrait and landscape modes.

While the iPhone presents some challenges in the GPS navigation arena, including a relatively small screen size and lack of support for background processes while requiring the iPhone to still function as a phone, TomTom appears to have embraced these challenges and developed some innovative solutions for release later this summer.

Article Link: More Details on 'TomTom for iPhone' Emerge (http://www.macrumors.com/iphone/2009/07/07/more-details-on-tomtom-for-iphone-emerge/)



iGary
Jul 7, 2009, 09:48 AM
I want this, but I don't want to get raked over the coals for it.

Donz0r
Jul 7, 2009, 09:56 AM
Sounds awesome. I hope they dont charge too much for it. I'd pay $50

johnntd
Jul 7, 2009, 09:56 AM
TomTom is the worst GPS software out there from my experience. Their guidances are pretty much useless here in California. They have the oldest map that is at least 10 years old I think. My house is 7 years old and TomTom does not have it on its map. The user interface looks nice but that's all there is to it.

1voodoo4u
Jul 7, 2009, 10:02 AM
I suggest you save your money, The ATand T version of GPS (Turn by Turn) is a complete waste of $120 per year. you are better using the MAPS that came with the Iphone, Works Great. For the Extra Money Tom Tom is going to charge you. you might consider buying a dedicated GPS if that is the full feature you want. Why spend all the extra money with not a whole lot of results, This to me seems yet another way for a 3rd party to profit from Iphone owners and ATT is Horrible and I hope, the US Dept Of Justice who opened a case yesterday against Providers and Cell Manufatures becomes a full out law suit, Apple,ATT and Other you have taken your last $1 from me.........ohhhhhh wait did i just get a notice that MMS is now available? Nope still waiting, maybe i'll tell ATT my bill will be paid some time this summer........

MBHockey
Jul 7, 2009, 10:07 AM
I'll stick with my garmin.

tobefirst
Jul 7, 2009, 10:09 AM
Sounds awesome. I hope they dont charge too much for it. I'd pay $50

I would be surprised if it is less than $80 for the maps, and less than $125 for the mount and maps. I'm guessing $150 for the combination.

EDIT: On second thought, $150 may be a little high, compared to TomTom's existing offerings.

justflie
Jul 7, 2009, 10:10 AM
I just wish they would update the look of their software. It's so terrible looking. Compare it to a Navigon-type styling and you immediately see how antiquated Tom Tom's software looks. That being said, GPS is typically for getting you from here to there, but who said it had to look like crap while doing it?

1voodoo4u
Jul 7, 2009, 10:11 AM
I would be surprised if it is less than $80 for the maps, and less than $125 for the mount and maps. I'm guessing $150 for the combination.

EDIT: On second thought, $150 may be a little high, compared to TomTom's existing offerings.

I'm still paying off my First Generatio iphone that i waited in line for and paid $600 for. Not to mention the cost for the 3G and the full price of the 3Gs, Come on HTC Hero, I'll use my ipod for music.

iOrlando
Jul 7, 2009, 10:17 AM
i have this growing feeling that tom tom will blow it and charge way too much for it.

expectations high going into a release and most people's lack of putting big money towards a fancy gps system = fail.

u49aa2
Jul 7, 2009, 10:17 AM
If they offer, reliable INTERNATIONAL mapping then i am happy to pay $100

alhasa
Jul 7, 2009, 10:18 AM
am i the only one who thinks that this 'external' gps module could be used to turn an ipod touch into nav system?... and the iPod touch doesn't have the issue of receiving calls to worry about. PLUS the in built speaker would make it compaitble with ist gen iPod touches too!

just a though :rolleyes:

crackermac
Jul 7, 2009, 10:24 AM
I'm pretty happy with the built-in Google Maps. It's all I ever use. It might take a little more work on my part to estimate when a turn may come up and periodically check to see where my next turn is, but it beats paying more money just for something to tell me, "Turn Left".

SpaceKitty
Jul 7, 2009, 10:38 AM
Sounds awesome. I hope they dont charge too much for it. I'd pay $50

I doubt it will be $50, more like $99 just because of the nature of this and the time involved to produce this.

speakerwizard
Jul 7, 2009, 10:49 AM
"Murray said this receiver is closer to what you’d find in a dedicated GPS unit."

to my knowledge (and my usage) this is utter nonsense, and the iphone has enhanced gps for faster sat finding, i don't buy it, this accessory will be over priced and unnecessary. i have navigon and it works perfectly with no extra hardware, so i suppose that means its better than the tomtom app aye?!?! lol they are out to make hardware profit because its what they know, it may sound paranoid but i feel better about buying a software satnav for iphone from a company not trying to peddle hardware to me.

michael31986
Jul 7, 2009, 10:51 AM
i want the damn app to work w/o a damn receiver, so that i can use it on the go when im walking. i don't wanna carry a bulky thing. Will the tom tom app work w/o the receiver, but just not as fast, cause if so im happy with that.

yaktrax
Jul 7, 2009, 10:52 AM
I used the ATT Navigator on my IPhone recently on a trip and found it to be very accurate and reliable. I made two trips through downtown Atlanta Ga from East to West, then West to East. The Navigator made it very easy to stay on the correct course. Atlanta is a very difficult town
to drive in.I do have three complaints about it.
1. the reoccurring monthly cost
2. no secure location or bracket inside my vehicle to place the IPhone to track my progress while driving. I have to take my eyes off the road and that's not a good thing while driving through Atlanta.
3. The voice commands are difficult to understand with road noise.

DaveGee
Jul 7, 2009, 10:54 AM
Well the question I have is... Given the dock/charging unit from tomtom has a built in gps then does that mean that it'll function with an iPod touch?

D

nickXedge
Jul 7, 2009, 10:57 AM
I'm pretty happy with the built-in Google Maps. It's all I ever use. It might take a little more work on my part to estimate when a turn may come up and periodically check to see where my next turn is, but it beats paying more money just for something to tell me, "Turn Left".

My thoughts exactly on this matter. I don't have a 3Gs that will show me which direction I'm headed or anything, but my plain ol' 3G with GPS works plenty good enough for me. It seems like this hardware addon might as well be a separate GPS having nothing to do with the iPhone. It has everything a regular GPS has, except it plugs into the iPhone... what's the point? It's a GPS without a screen. It's probably going to be expensive too, but just slightly less expensive than buying a cheap GPS unit. Waste of money if you ask me.

grs1993
Jul 7, 2009, 11:04 AM
Well the question I have is... Given the dock/charging unit from tomtom has a built in gps then does that mean that it'll function with an iPod touch?

D

Do you think that the original iPhone or iPod touch will be supported...if so, this will be flying off the shelves

danny_w
Jul 7, 2009, 11:04 AM
I could never use gps on such a small screen; I would be squinting so hard at the screen I'd have a wreck first thing. If I ever get another gps unit (the last one that I had was a 4.3" dedicated unit) it will have as large of a screen as possible (there are 5" and 6" units out thee that would suit me fine).

ericvmazzone
Jul 7, 2009, 11:08 AM
i want the damn app to work w/o a damn receiver, so that i can use it on the go when im walking. i don't wanna carry a bulky thing. Will the tom tom app work w/o the receiver, but just not as fast, cause if so im happy with that.

If you'd have read the description is does work without the 'optional' mount. That is what optional means, it's not required.

My issue is wether it has a 30 pin port to hook up to my stereo that has a 30 pin connector giving iPod control with album artwork and does NOT have a aux input without buying more pricey hardware. If no tomtom can buy me a new stereo that is as good as my expencive Alpine hardware where the replacement has all the same features.

bigmc6000
Jul 7, 2009, 11:08 AM
Do you think that the original iPhone or iPod touch will be supported...if so, this will be flying off the shelves

Aha! I knew there was a reason I kept my original iPhone when I got the 3Gs - that'd be prefect!!! :)

Also, why does the article say "relatively small screen"?? Roughly half of the GPS devices on Amazon when you type in "GPS" are 3.5" screens... (most of the rest are 4.3')

53buick
Jul 7, 2009, 11:08 AM
I call shenanigans. This is total *************. Why do I need a CAR KIT with all these accessories? there's a GPS in the damn iphone already. and i don't need more crap coming out of the my cigar lighters in my car. the kensington charger/mount i have works just fine. ooooh a car speaker? no way! oh wait i've already got 6 speakers in my car, you nimrods. They need to just release the turn by turn app and sell for $25. they'd make a killing. Google Maps is what I'm sticking with, jerks.

bigmc6000
Jul 7, 2009, 11:10 AM
I could never use gps on such a small screen; I would be squinting so hard at the screen I'd have a wreck first thing. If I ever get another gps unit (the last one that I had was a 4.3" dedicated unit) it will have as large of a screen as possible (there are 5" and 6" units out thee that would suit me fine).

I'd recommend glasses if it is really that hard for you to see big arrows on your iPhone a few feet from your face.

danny_w
Jul 7, 2009, 11:12 AM
I'd recommend glasses if it is really that hard for you to see big arrows on your iPhone a few feet from your face.
I have worn bifocals since I was 4 years old (I had already had 2 cataract surgeries by then). Yes, I know that I have vision problems, but that doesn't change things any for me.

iGary
Jul 7, 2009, 11:12 AM
I'll stick with my garmin.

I had a TomTom that got nicked from my car and replaced it with a Garmin Nuvi.

What a mistake. The TomTom interface and guidance (at least here in my neck of the woods) beats Garmin hands down.

I can't wait for this app.

bigmc6000
Jul 7, 2009, 11:29 AM
I have worn bifocals since I was 4 years old (I had already had 2 cataract surgeries by then). Yes, I know that I have vision problems, but that doesn't change things any for me.

I just know that I haven;t had any problems seeing what's on my iPhone from an equivalent distance and I even have a slight astigmatism (-.5 right, -.25 left). (Didn't mean to come across snippy, hope you didn't take it that way)

SkippyThorson
Jul 7, 2009, 11:30 AM
Aha! I knew there was a reason I kept my original iPhone when I got the 3Gs - that'd be prefect!!! :)

If this works on the first iPhone with that car mount, not only is that genius on their part, but I will seriously consider this.

The odds are strong that I'll get the car mount because I like the holder/charger/speaker combo as is. With the GPS module built in, that's one hell of an added bonus, and reason to buy the app. :)

Telp
Jul 7, 2009, 11:35 AM
I would love to know if this works on the original iPhone cause that might make it worth it. Have my 3GS for my phone and my old first gen iPhone as my GPS device. Beautiful.

imac george
Jul 7, 2009, 11:40 AM
Couple of things

do you think they are waiting for an updated iPod touch to release the app? Who knows what kind of processor speed is required for this thing to function in real time.

Also, does google license their maps from a tomtom subsidiary?

Telp
Jul 7, 2009, 11:43 AM
Couple of things

do you think they are waiting for an updated iPod touch to release the app? Who knows what kind of processor speed is required for this thing to function in real time.

Also, does google license their maps from a tomtom subsidiary?

I doubt they are waiting for an updated iPod Touch. The iPod Touch 2nd gen. already has a pretty fast processor, and also it wouldn't make sense for them to wait.

bigmc6000
Jul 7, 2009, 11:43 AM
If this works on the first iPhone with that car mount, not only is that genius on their part, but I will seriously consider this.

The odds are strong that I'll get the car mount because I like the holder/charger/speaker combo as is. With the GPS module built in, that's one hell of an added bonus, and reason to buy the app. :)

Not only that but since it's an App you can have it on both your 3Gs and your 2G so the times you're in someone elses car or whatever you'll still have the TbT software :)

Get Roped
Jul 7, 2009, 11:44 AM
I'm wondering if it will work for long range trips. I recently drove from Los Angeles to Denver and there are loooooong breaks in AT&T service.

Although I'm very pleased with the iPhone out of the box mapping, there were too many service "dead" zones. After a terrible road sliding incident in the snowy rockies, "dead" zones can be just that!

Will this dock be a satellite receiver or is this app AT&T service restricted? My XM radio worked the entire trip!

kdarling
Jul 7, 2009, 11:48 AM
Do you think that the original iPhone or iPod touch will be supported...if so, this will be flying off the shelves

Yes, I brought this up back when I first posted about the GPS chip in the mounting kit.

My guess is that TomTom mostly intended the kit to support the non-GPS phone and touch, but Apple is making them keep quiet until they've sold their fill of 3GS's.

bbplayer5
Jul 7, 2009, 11:53 AM
I call shenanigans. This is total *************. Why do I need a CAR KIT with all these accessories? there's a GPS in the damn iphone already. and i don't need more crap coming out of the my cigar lighters in my car. the kensington charger/mount i have works just fine. ooooh a car speaker? no way! oh wait i've already got 6 speakers in my car, you nimrods. They need to just release the turn by turn app and sell for $25. they'd make a killing. Google Maps is what I'm sticking with, jerks.

The GPS inside the iPhone is very average at best. The TomTom adds a GPS chip in the holder to enhance your GPS experience. Its worth it, and ill be getting both :)

joboy
Jul 7, 2009, 11:57 AM
I'm pretty happy with the built-in Google Maps. It's all I ever use. It might take a little more work on my part to estimate when a turn may come up and periodically check to see where my next turn is, but it beats paying more money just for something to tell me, "Turn Left".

I use a Garmin GPS. It shows the route as a red line that overlies the road. Over the years, I've learned that turning off the audio instructions is better for me. I just follow the map. Often, the voice commands are late in a high speed, complicated interchange and are confusing in that situation. The key is to have a GPS map that isn't too slow to update. Forget the voice prompts and just drive. Put the unit on the dash board in front of the steering wheel so you don't have to divert your eyes from the road too much. If your present system is quick enough to get the job done when you need it, you're OK. I'm keeping my cell phone for calls, not navigation.

kmcrawford
Jul 7, 2009, 12:09 PM
I hope it doesn't cost more than $50. But it most likely will... I have an old in dash gps and my maps are very old, to purchase an update disc they want to charge me over $200!

akutad
Jul 7, 2009, 12:13 PM
I would love to see Garmin come out with something. I own a Garmin GPS and have been very happy with it. Apparently Garmin is the leader in GPS and specialize in aircraft navigational systems.

akutad
Jul 7, 2009, 12:15 PM
I hope it doesn't cost more than $50. But it most likely will... I have an old in dash gps and my maps are very old, to purchase an update disc they want to charge me over $200!

WHAT!!! Garmin only charges $79 and I thought that was high.

SpaceKitty
Jul 7, 2009, 12:17 PM
I use a Garmin GPS. It shows the route as a red line that overlies the road. Over the years, I've learned that turning off the audio instructions is better for me. I just follow the map. Often, the voice commands are late in a high speed, complicated interchange and are confusing in that situation. The key is to have a GPS map that isn't too slow to update. Forget the voice prompts and just drive. Put the unit on the dash board in front of the steering wheel so you don't have to divert your eyes from the road too much. If your present system is quick enough to get the job done when you need it, you're OK. I'm keeping my cell phone for calls, not navigation.

Same. We updated all three of our Garmins with the latest maps last night for vacation in September. The only problem with this on last years trip was not being in the correct lane to exit onto another freeway in California. I blame that on California and not the GPS. :D

crisss1205
Jul 7, 2009, 12:46 PM
I call shenanigans. This is total *************. Why do I need a CAR KIT with all these accessories? there's a GPS in the damn iphone already. and i don't need more crap coming out of the my cigar lighters in my car. the kensington charger/mount i have works just fine. ooooh a car speaker? no way! oh wait i've already got 6 speakers in my car, you nimrods. They need to just release the turn by turn app and sell for $25. they'd make a killing. Google Maps is what I'm sticking with, jerks.

Who said you have to buy it. You don't need the car kit for the app to work.

Evangelion
Jul 7, 2009, 12:50 PM
I call shenanigans. This is total *************. Why do I need a CAR KIT with all these accessories?

The hardware-accessory is optional... In other words: you do NOT need it. Hows that reading-comprehension of yours?

They need to just release the turn by turn app and sell for $25. they'd make a killing. Google Maps is what I'm sticking with, jerks.

Google does not allow Google Maps to be used for turn-by-turn navigation, so they need their own maps, and those cost money.

macduke
Jul 7, 2009, 12:52 PM
I would love to see Garmin come out with something. I own a Garmin GPS and have been very happy with it. Apparently Garmin is the leader in GPS and specialize in aircraft navigational systems.

I'm living in Olathe, KS for the summer and the huge Garmin world headquarters building is right down the road. Do you want me to go over there, knock on the door and ask? Lol.

I drove by there yesterday and asked my wife "do you think they've got engineers in there developing an iPhone app?" We came to the conclusion that they probably aren't, unless there is some sort of hardware bundled. That is how they make their money. Well, that and map updates. I guess they could still make a killing on map updates? Now I don't know what to think!

MikeDTyke
Jul 7, 2009, 12:56 PM
Why couldn't they have asked something useful like will it support TomTom live services?

IQ routes is kinda nice but unless it's supporting live fuel prices, safety camera updates & HD Traffic it really is a second class GPS.

TheCheapGeek
Jul 7, 2009, 12:58 PM
I have no issues at all using the built in google maps that are built into the phone. I am excited about the receiver mainly for the speakerphone, charging, and audio output in one convenient holder.

53buick
Jul 7, 2009, 01:08 PM
I stand corrected and apologies for not reading thoroughly.

The hardware-accessory is optional... In other words: you do NOT need it. Hows that reading-comprehension of yours?
better than your social skills:p

MacFly123
Jul 7, 2009, 01:31 PM
It just better be a fixed price. These other GPS apps that charge a monthly subscription are IDIOTS. Nobody wants to pay a subscription for these GPS apps. All TomTom has to do is make theirs fixed price and their app will be #1 easy!

samab
Jul 7, 2009, 02:00 PM
It just better be a fixed price. These other GPS apps that charge a monthly subscription are IDIOTS. Nobody wants to pay a subscription for these GPS apps. All TomTom has to do is make theirs fixed price and their app will be #1 easy!

Reality is a lot more complex than "one time price good and monthly fees bad".

NONE of the one time price iphone nav apps come with live traffic information and automatic live traffic re-routing --- both of these features are available on AT&T Navigator and Gokivo.

You can cancel your monthly subscription AT&T Navigator or Gokivo at any time --- subscribe for July and August for summer trips for $20 a year.

iphones4evry1
Jul 7, 2009, 02:22 PM
I have a feeling they are going to sell several MILLION of these. If it is a one-time price and no monthly fee, then almost everyone who owns an iPhone and a car will buy this.

Stargaze
Jul 7, 2009, 02:35 PM
More info!! hurry up and release the HARDWARE already!! its got to be complete!! let me buy the hardware and oogle over that while i wait for you to tweak your APP to work properly.

so far the product shots of their mount are way better than any current docking solution out there and add on the fact that it has a External GPS antenna built into it with mic in it, audio out, and a speaker

yes Please!!

I can forsee the price of the Tom tom "dock" being worth around $80

software hopefully not much over $40.00 heh but we'll see

Blue Fox
Jul 7, 2009, 02:58 PM
I'm very interested and curious to see it work in action. I'm all for the dock too, but it all comes down to price. If it's astronomical (more than a regular GPS unit), then I'll pass, but if it's a bit cheaper, then I'm all for it.

I'm thinking a "realistic" pricepoint for the hardware would run right around $79.99 and the software either $19.99 or $29.99.....but I could be dead wrong too. :D

fishkorp
Jul 7, 2009, 03:00 PM
I can't believe how cheap some people are. $25? $40? Even $50? Do you know how much licensing fees are for map data? If TomTom sold the app for $25 they'd lose money. And being a 1-time fee does not make it "cheaper" than the subscription models. If you live in areas of high development you'll need to get map updates every year. They run anywhere from $70 to over $100. The map licensing is where most of the cost comes in. The app will probably sell for $99, possibly more. Everyone here is in denial, just like with the Sling app.

optophobia
Jul 7, 2009, 03:34 PM
I'm still paying off my First Generatio iphone that i waited in line for and paid $600 for.............

Release date was July 2007. 2 years later and you are STILL paying it off ?
After the $100 rebate that makes it $500. So if you are STILL paying it off then you couldn't afford $20 per month for the last 24 months.
My suggestion is that YOU bought something YOU could not afford. That is in no way AT&T or Apples fault.

AND you have an iPod ? I think you really need to assess your finances before looking at an HTC.

MoonDogg
Jul 7, 2009, 04:03 PM
I can't believe how cheap some people are. $25? $40? Even $50? Do you know how much licensing fees are for map data? If TomTom sold the app for $25 they'd lose money. And being a 1-time fee does not make it "cheaper" than the subscription models. If you live in areas of high development you'll need to get map updates every year. They run anywhere from $70 to over $100. The map licensing is where most of the cost comes in. The app will probably sell for $99, possibly more. Everyone here is in denial, just like with the Sling app.


Y buy the app for $99 when you can get a whole GPS for less than that. Even from TomTom?

NightFox
Jul 7, 2009, 04:03 PM
I guess a lot of you don't realise that TomTom have been making satnav software for smartphones for years and years already; I think I'm right in saying since before they even started making standalone devices. Their current software, Navigator 7, retails in the UK for about £90 with maps of Western Europe, so I think it's a fairly safe bet that the iPhone price isn't going to be far off that - probably a nice round $100 plus whatever they charge for the hardware, I'd hazard a guess at least another $50 based on what they've previously charged for holders and standalone GPS receivers.

I used to regularly use Navigator on a range of Windows Mobile phones, and got on quite well with it, in fact I only gave up on it when I got a car with GPS built in. Have to say though, the TomTom has more features and better routing than my built-in. The only thing I didn't much like about the Navigator software was that TomTom seemed not to like using device APIs/libraries, presumably to make it easier to port the software between different platforms. This resulted in what I always thought was a bit of a clumsy look and feel, and you had to use the software the TomTom way, rather than the way your phone or PDA OS normally worked.

mrr
Jul 7, 2009, 04:28 PM
I used to have TOM TOM NAVIGATOR 5 running on my PALM TREO (650+700) already a couple of years ago with an external Bluetooth GPS. It worked great. The combo had a list of $300 later marked down to $200.

When I got my iPhone 3G, I had to get a Navigon unit which I did not like at all, and most recently I have been using the built in one in my father's Nissan Ultima automobile which really really stinks. Apple has really dragged their feet on this and I have been waiting for sometime already.

I am looking forward to getting the TOM TOM for the iPhone. I will not pay for a subscription and hope it is less than $100 since I can get their TomTom ONE XL-S for $90 new at Amazon.

Hawkeye411
Jul 7, 2009, 05:34 PM
Release date was July 2007. 2 years later and you are STILL paying it off ?
After the $100 rebate that makes it $500. So if you are STILL paying it off then you couldn't afford $20 per month for the last 24 months.
My suggestion is that YOU bought something YOU could not afford. That is in no way AT&T or Apples fault.

AND you have an iPod ? I think you really need to assess your finances before looking at an HTC.

Yes Mom.... Your right Mom .... Sorry Mom .... I'll try harder Mom ... LAMO :D

anjinha
Jul 7, 2009, 05:41 PM
It just better be a fixed price. These other GPS apps that charge a monthly subscription are IDIOTS. Nobody wants to pay a subscription for these GPS apps. All TomTom has to do is make theirs fixed price and their app will be #1 easy!

Well, for the most part Maps is enough for me since I don't own a car. But this Summer I'm going to travel abroad and need an app with offline maps since I don't want any roaming charges. Since I'm travelling for a month it would make a lot more sense to get a subscription for a month than buying a more expensive app.

Just because YOU don't need it doesn't mean it's stupid.

Krevnik
Jul 7, 2009, 05:49 PM
Well, for the most part Maps is enough for me since I don't own a car. But this Summer I'm going to travel abroad and need an app with offline maps since I don't want any roaming charges. Since I'm travelling for a month it would make a lot more sense to get a subscription for a month than buying a more expensive app.

Just because YOU don't need it doesn't mean it's stupid.

The problem with the one subscription app (AT&T Nav), is that it doesn't store maps locally, and instead pulls them down from the network.

The solutions that pack the maps in with the app are all flat-cost.

powerbook911
Jul 7, 2009, 05:52 PM
One problem with having the prices so high on the maps is you have to stop and wonder if you should just buy a dedicated Tom Tom unit.

MacU
Jul 7, 2009, 06:04 PM
I used to have TOM TOM NAVIGATOR 5 running on my PALM TREO (650+700) already a couple of years ago with an external Bluetooth GPS. It worked great. The combo had a list of $300 later marked down to $200.

When I got my iPhone 3G, I had to get a Navigon unit which I did not like at all, and most recently I have been using the built in one in my father's Nissan Ultima automobile which really really stinks. Apple has really dragged their feet on this and I have been waiting for sometime already.

I am looking forward to getting the TOM TOM for the iPhone. I will not pay for a subscription and hope it is less than $100 since I can get their TomTom ONE XL-S for $90 new at Amazon.

If it's over $30 they can keep it. All we are paying for is software that's already been paid for years ago.

jw586
Jul 7, 2009, 06:35 PM
I am excited about the new app coming out, but I am concerned that using it on long trips could cause overheating in the iphone. Is anyone else worried about this or do you think that it will be alright?

dkhenkin
Jul 7, 2009, 06:53 PM
Why wont they release this already!?!?!? I have been dying for this ever since it was announced. I already sold of my TomTom One which was an awesome little GPS.

I'm getting tired of using Google Maps, plus I REALLY want that mount.

vvebsta
Jul 7, 2009, 07:16 PM
I just wish they would update the look of their software. It's so terrible looking. Compare it to a Navigon-type styling and you immediately see how antiquated Tom Tom's software looks. That being said, GPS is typically for getting you from here to there, but who said it had to look like crap while doing it?

spoken like a true mac user :D

kdarling
Jul 7, 2009, 07:29 PM
Do you know how much licensing fees are for map data?

TomTom bought their map data supplier, TeleAtlas, for about $2.5 billion a couple of years ago.

So, while they no longer have to license the info from someone else, yes, they do have to pay back that investment.

twoodcc
Jul 7, 2009, 07:44 PM
sounds nice. but i already have gps in my truck

agkm800
Jul 7, 2009, 08:07 PM
Will using the TomTom mount cause more cracks?

Will Apple still give you new iPhone for the crack?

Terdinus Asus
Jul 7, 2009, 08:41 PM
Given Tom Tom's history for GPS on other mobile devices, I will eat my hair if this app is anything LESS than $120.

If it is, there will be subscription fees.

applehappy
Jul 7, 2009, 09:10 PM
Given Tom Tom's history for GPS on other mobile devices, I will eat my hair if this app is anything LESS than $120.

If it is, there will be subscription fees.

Well if you are right and the app is that much $ then I would still want to see if the cradle would work independently of the app. That cradle had me buying one the minute I saw it.

Seems to me there will be lots of third party car cradles coming along now that the restrictions have been lifted.

applehappy
Jul 7, 2009, 09:12 PM
Will using the TomTom mount cause more cracks?

Will Apple still give you new iPhone for the crack?

You could ask more questions into the oracle if you like. :p

applehappy
Jul 7, 2009, 09:19 PM
First look at the carkit
» Tuesday - June 9, 2009
Apart from software, TomTom will also introduce a brand new car kit to mount the iPhone in the car. This enables the user to make handsfree phone calls and to charge the phone whilst being docked. The image below highlights the most important parts:



1. The suction cup which attaches the holder to the car's wind screen or dashboard. We already know this so-called 'EasyPort' from the TomTom ONE and XL.
2. The holder features a separate speaker to be able to play the driving instructions loud and clear in the car. This will also help when making handsfree phone calls. The holder also features extra hardware which will give better GPS reception.
3. A scroll-wheel gives direct access to the volume settings of the iPhone.
4. Behind the small hole on the front there's the tiny microphone which enables the handsfree phoning.
5. A USB connector meant for connecting a 12-24 volts car charger.
6. An Audio line out socket meant to connect to the car's headunit. Once connected, driving instructions and phone calls are then transferred to the car's proprietary speakers.

dkhenkin
Jul 7, 2009, 11:41 PM
WANT.

First look at the carkit
» Tuesday - June 9, 2009
Apart from software, TomTom will also introduce a brand new car kit to mount the iPhone in the car. This enables the user to make handsfree phone calls and to charge the phone whilst being docked. The image below highlights the most important parts:



1. The suction cup which attaches the holder to the car's wind screen or dashboard. We already know this so-called 'EasyPort' from the TomTom ONE and XL.
2. The holder features a separate speaker to be able to play the driving instructions loud and clear in the car. This will also help when making handsfree phone calls. The holder also features extra hardware which will give better GPS reception.
3. A scroll-wheel gives direct access to the volume settings of the iPhone.
4. Behind the small hole on the front there's the tiny microphone which enables the handsfree phoning.
5. A USB connector meant for connecting a 12-24 volts car charger.
6. An Audio line out socket meant to connect to the car's headunit. Once connected, driving instructions and phone calls are then transferred to the car's proprietary speakers.

equlizer
Jul 8, 2009, 12:03 AM
Im personally looking forward to seeing it! I currently use the Tomtom 930 and LOVE IT! Ive had ZERO problems with it and very easy to use.

TK2K
Jul 8, 2009, 12:08 AM
I'm kinda annoyed it's taken so long to get tomtom to the market for the iphone. It looks like a fantastic application.

iphones4evry1
Jul 8, 2009, 03:36 AM
Can I still play my iPod over my car stereo, and will the TomTom voice commands just interupt my music while it says "turn left" and then my music automatically resumes (like the intercoms in retail stores) ?

Considering I can go to BestBuy right now and buy a full GPS for $79.99, they are going to have to make this $79.99 or less, otherwise people are just going to buy a regular, full GPS for their cars instead.

If they add a monthly service fee of anything more than $4.99, then I am definitely not going to buy this. I can live with the Maps App that came on my phone.

MacRumorUser
Jul 8, 2009, 04:19 AM
I can't see this coming in any thing cheaper than €79 for the software alone and maybe €129 with the car mount / charger etc.

IF they offer full continuos map updates on that software, then I'll pay for the software, however if they expect me to pay €79 every year to update then forget it.

I haven't updated my TomTom One Europe, since buying it due to the expensive map updates, so little chance of me doing it on the iphone.....

iluvgr8tdeals
Jul 8, 2009, 04:20 AM
TomTom is the worst GPS software out there from my experience. Their guidances are pretty much useless here in California. They have the oldest map that is at least 10 years old I think. My house is 7 years old and TomTom does not have it on its map. The user interface looks nice but that's all there is to it.

Just wondering,

Have you upgraded your unit yet? 1 or 2 years old I can understand, but 7? Most people don't upgrade software. I used TomTom in Southern California (and Nevada) in February, and I can assure you that, due to its mapshare feature, I was able to avoid blocked roads that my associate's garmin couldn't. I understand that Garmin and TomTom has its fans, but I think your critique on TomTom is a bit harsh!

Having said that, I wish that TomTom would put out an app that shall be competitive with their (and competitors') stand-alone units. There are very many iPhone users with stand alone units already, and only careful marketing shall make most purchase the app.

Dagless
Jul 8, 2009, 06:30 AM
Very nice!
We tried a bunch of Sat Navs a few years ago but settled on Tom Tom because, well, they're brilliant. We got the highest end model at the time (910?) and I hope to God this software works as well as that so we can leave the actual Tom Tom unit behind.

I hope theres an offline mode (sorry for not reading up on this, this is like the first time I've heard of a Tom Tom app) and that it supports the Europe map we bought for the 910.

E.Lizardo
Jul 8, 2009, 06:37 AM
If no tomtom can buy me a new stereo that is as good as my expencive Alpine hardware where the replacement has all the same features.

My guess is Tom Tom will turn down that deal.

E.Lizardo
Jul 8, 2009, 06:39 AM
I call shenanigans. This is total *************. Why do I need a CAR KIT with all these accessories? there's a GPS in the damn iphone already. and i don't need more crap coming out of the my cigar lighters in my car. the kensington charger/mount i have works just fine. ooooh a car speaker? no way! oh wait i've already got 6 speakers in my car, you nimrods. They need to just release the turn by turn app and sell for $25. they'd make a killing. Google Maps is what I'm sticking with, jerks.


Google the word"OPTIONAL"

FoxHoundADAM
Jul 8, 2009, 08:34 AM
Sadly, I think we all already know they will be charging way too much for this. They know iPhone users are a high end market and that they can charge a premium for it.

I hope I'm wrong.

t0mat0
Jul 8, 2009, 08:43 AM
Does it seem like they're going to stretch it to either an iPod Touch separate announcement showing accessories, or link this all up to the iPod refresh in September? Annoying that the Touch could be capable of using the dock if they did it right as the maps are loaded via the app and the dock has the necessary GPS antenna (which it seems the iPhone uses in preference also).

Hawkeye411
Jul 8, 2009, 08:50 AM
Annoying that the Touch could be capable of using the dock if they did it right as the maps are loaded via the app and the dock has the necessary GPS antenna

Not sure why this would be "annoying" to you"?? :confused:

Kudos to TomTom if they can figure out a way to sell their software and hardware to both iPhone and iPod Touch users.

I just wish they would release it already!! :mad:

Cheers. :D:D

kdarling
Jul 8, 2009, 08:59 AM
Sadly, I think we all already know they will be charging way too much for this. They know iPhone users are a high end market and that they can charge a premium for it.

Don't forget Apple's fingers are in the pie.

Apple wants 30% of the software revenue, which TomTom didn't have to deal with when they were selling software from their own website.

It would not be surprising if Apple wanted a cut of the hardware sales as well.

If Apple wasn't a choke point, I'd bet TomTom would've had their app out last year, and the mount would be usable by the old phone and touch as well.

roiegat
Jul 8, 2009, 09:56 AM
I have a feeling that with all the hype, it'll probably be cheaper to get a TomTom GPS standalone.

Personally, I think G-Map does a pretty good job and it's non-subscription. They recently raised the price from 25 dollars to 35 dollars since they introduced the voice turn-by-turn directions. I tested it over the fourth of july weekend by driving to NY and back to PA and G-Map did a great job.

I think AT&T's GPS software would be a little better if they gave you the option to buy a download of the maps. That way if your not in a 3G zone you can still have the maps ok. I don't mind paying to have it locally. G-Map is around one gig, and thats just for the east coast.

nizmoz
Jul 8, 2009, 10:02 AM
TomTom is the worst GPS software out there from my experience. Their guidances are pretty much useless here in California. They have the oldest map that is at least 10 years old I think. My house is 7 years old and TomTom does not have it on its map. The user interface looks nice but that's all there is to it.

TomTom's software is not that bad. Please. I switched from TT to a Garmin now and love the Garmin, but between the two they are pretty good and close to each other. While Garmin has more updated maps it seems, the TomTom never failed me and worked just fine.

MacFly123
Jul 8, 2009, 12:19 PM
Reality is a lot more complex than "one time price good and monthly fees bad".

NONE of the one time price iphone nav apps come with live traffic information and automatic live traffic re-routing --- both of these features are available on AT&T Navigator and Gokivo.

You can cancel your monthly subscription AT&T Navigator or Gokivo at any time --- subscribe for July and August for summer trips for $20 a year.

Well, for the most part Maps is enough for me since I don't own a car. But this Summer I'm going to travel abroad and need an app with offline maps since I don't want any roaming charges. Since I'm travelling for a month it would make a lot more sense to get a subscription for a month than buying a more expensive app.

Just because YOU don't need it doesn't mean it's stupid.


I am confident MOST people would highly prefer a one time price, which I think is why TomTom is leaning that way. Watch me be proven right as it becomes the number one sold nav app and basically all others switch to a one time cost model! :)

optophobia
Jul 8, 2009, 12:39 PM
Yes Mom.... Your right Mom .... Sorry Mom .... I'll try harder Mom ... LAMO :D

he was the one bitching about not being able to afford it. I just mentioned that we don't want to hear him bitching about it. Thats all.

Not really sure what LAMO means, obviously a Canadian thing. And no I am not a mom or your mom. Now get back to school little child.

Tunnelrunner
Jul 8, 2009, 01:01 PM
I think AT&T's GPS software would be a little better if they gave you the option to buy a download of the maps. That way if your not in a 3G zone you can still have the maps ok. I don't mind paying to have it locally. G-Map is around one gig, and thats just for the east coast.

One quick point: So far, in Chicago, IL and surrounding suburbs/counties, AT&T Navigator/Telenav has run fine on Edge, and even on roaming. I actually choose to run it on Edge (vs. 3G which I could easily do) to save battery life and have not had any data problems. I *did* have data/connection problems with Gokivo when I was in the heart of the city (the Loop).

AbjectEvolution
Jul 8, 2009, 01:12 PM
Is the normal map app for the iPhone 3GS supposed to re-orient on your direction as you move? I thought so, but the map app for the 3GS seems the exact same as the 3G. Wasn't there some updates to it?

SooneratND
Jul 8, 2009, 01:23 PM
Is the normal map app for the iPhone 3GS supposed to re-orient on your direction as you move? I thought so, but the map app for the 3GS seems the exact same as the 3G. Wasn't there some updates to it?

You have to tap the locate button a second time to switch it into the compass oriented mode. You can then tap it again to switch back.

pmbooks
Jul 8, 2009, 01:38 PM
Surprised nobody's mentioned the app, G-map, recently updated to include voice guidance. I've not used it yet so I can't say much about it. It will warrant a comparison, once the TomTom comes out.

edit: sorry, I did a thread search for the term and it didn't show the comment by roiegat.

realeric
Jul 8, 2009, 01:48 PM
TomTom is not that bad, but Garmin is better than TomTom from my experience. I'v used TomTom one, Mio, Garmin StreetPilot, Garmin nuvi, embedded navigation in Mercedes Benz, and TomTom Software installed in a PDA running Windows CE.

A. Hardware Performance and Usability:
Mercedes(embedded, 7") > Garmin nuvi(standalone, 4.3") > TomTom One(standalone, 3.5") > Garmin StreetPilot(standalone, 3.5") > Mio(standalone, 3.5") > PDA SmartPhone(3.5", TomTom navigation software)

B. Software Performance and Usability:
Mercedes > Garmin > TomTom(standalone) > Mio >...> TomTom(PDA software)

C. Performance/Price:
Garmin > TomTom(standalone) > Mio > Mercedes >...> TomTom(PDA software)

The Garmin nuvi 260W standalone navigation(refurb) is just $119.99 including tax and the latest map with free delivery services in the US. :eek:
https://buy.garmin.com/shop/store/assets/images/products/010-00718-20/en/cf-lg.jpg

co.ag.2005
Jul 8, 2009, 02:09 PM
... Personally, I think G-Map does a pretty good job and it's non-subscription. They recently raised the price from 25 dollars to 35 dollars since they introduced the voice turn-by-turn directions. I tested it over the fourth of july weekend by driving to NY and back to PA and G-Map did a great job...

I love G-Map. Got it back when it was $20 and now with the 3.0 TBT update, it's even better. If a person only needs half US (whole US), its only $35 ($70). Not bad considering the maps are stored on the phone, no subscription, and no need of cell signal to use. Frankly, I don't see the need for a Tom Tom app for myself when G-Map works well and will likely be cheaper. FWIW I use a Griffin WindowSeat (http://www.griffintechnology.com/products/windowseat)for my iPhone 3G so this app (my iPhone) has a clear view to the sky!

SooneratND
Jul 8, 2009, 05:26 PM
What worries me most about the pictures of the holder is that it doesn't look adjustable as far as holding the phone. I really don't want to have to strip my case off every time I dock the thing with the holder.

roiegat
Jul 8, 2009, 07:00 PM
Does anyone know how the built in map app gets it traffic information? Since we don't have to pay for that app, does that mean there is some free way of getting traffic info? If there is, could other third-party apps like TomTom or G-map eventually use it in there apps?

It was funny over the fourth of july weekend my wife and I were going from NY-> PA and I was using my iphone with G-map to navigate and she would go in and check the traffic using the map app on her iphone.

Kadman
Jul 8, 2009, 08:04 PM
TomTom's software is not that bad. Please. I switched from TT to a Garmin now and love the Garmin, but between the two they are pretty good and close to each other. While Garmin has more updated maps it seems, the TomTom never failed me and worked just fine.

Yeah, this guy either isn't bright enough to know that it takes updates to find these types of changes or he's simply lying because he has a grudge. Given dwindling intelligence in society today I fear it's the former. :rolleyes: I'm love my Garmin Nuvi 760, but I do respect the quality products that TomTom puts out.

iluvgr8tdeals
Jul 9, 2009, 04:34 AM
Sadly, I think we all already know they will be charging way too much for this. They know iPhone users are a high end market and that they can charge a premium for it.

I hope I'm wrong.

You are right! Most of the posts here (me included) are hoping for $20 to $100 for hardware + software, despite signs that show that the app + mount + software shall be over $100. (per annum, or if it is subscription, more than $10 a month)

I have noticed that, AT&T iPhone customers feel that, since they (we) plunk about $100 or more for the monthly cell-phone service, they should be able to get the rest of the services for free (seen the forums on charges for tethering? Most want it to be free, since they already pay for 'unlimited' data!) AT&T and Apple feel that, since iPhone customers pay $100 or more for cell-phone services alone, and pay more when purchasing apps, music, videos etc, they should be able to pay more for such a desired app (TomTom)

I hope that I am wrong, but I feel that I shall carry both my iPhone and stand-alone TomTom unit to avoid the $100 charge!

iluvgr8tdeals
Jul 9, 2009, 04:37 AM
TomTom is not that bad, but Garmin is better than TomTom from my experience. I'v used TomTom one, Mio, Garmin StreetPilot, Garmin nuvi, embedded navigation in Mercedes Benz, and TomTom Software installed in a PDA running Windows CE.

A. Hardware Performance and Usability:
Mercedes(embedded, 7") > Garmin nuvi(standalone, 4.3") > TomTom One(standalone, 3.5") > Garmin StreetPilot(standalone, 3.5") > Mio(standalone, 3.5") > PDA SmartPhone(3.5", TomTom navigation software)

B. Software Performance and Usability:
Mercedes > Garmin > TomTom(standalone) > Mio >...> TomTom(PDA software)

C. Performance/Price:
Garmin > TomTom(standalone) > Mio > Mercedes >...> TomTom(PDA software)

The Garmin nuvi 260W standalone navigation(refurb) is just $119.99 including tax and the latest map with free delivery services in the US. :eek:
https://buy.garmin.com/shop/store/assets/images/products/010-00718-20/en/cf-lg.jpg

I hope your post is not a premonition of bad things to come for the TomTom app, if its last place ranking in all your categories is anything to go by, LOL!

samab
Jul 9, 2009, 11:56 AM
I am confident MOST people would highly prefer a one time price, which I think is why TomTom is leaning that way. Watch me be proven right as it becomes the number one sold nav app and basically all others switch to a one time cost model! :)

TomTom spent $2.5 billion buying one of the 2 map makers in the world --- thus along with Nokia (who spent $8 billion buying the other map maker) becomes the duopoly of the map market.

TomTom has a totally different business model than the rest of the GPS nav makers --- because the rest of the GPS nav makers have to pay TomTom for the maps.

Krevnik
Jul 9, 2009, 12:12 PM
I am confident MOST people would highly prefer a one time price, which I think is why TomTom is leaning that way. Watch me be proven right as it becomes the number one sold nav app and basically all others switch to a one time cost model! :)

There are only two subscription GPS apps on the iPhone right now:
AT&T Navigator and Gokivo

They sure as heck won't change from that model anytime soon, and TomTom won't convince them to change from that model either. Sygic, Navigon, and XROAD all are one-time fees, download maps to the device, and work okay for navigation.

The reason why I say they won't change is because the why they charge a subscription is unlikely to be threatened in the near term unless TomTom does something very out of character.

See, AT&T Navigator includes local search over the cellular network, traffic, gas prices, ratings of restaurants and so on. It even ensures you always have the latest maps because they are streamed over the cell network.

Historically, that sort of live feed requires a subscription of some kind in the stand alone units (MSN Direct for Garmin, and the new Live services, or some of the Home services for TomTom). Don't forget you have to pay for map upgrades on the stand alones.

If TomTom's model is anything like the model for the standalone (maybe some discounted pricing on the live services or included in the price if they just really want your business)... you will still need to pay for the map upgrades, whereas the AT&T Navigator will always use the latest map data they have paid for. The flip-side is that TomTom's model is also the one that will work out of range of a cell tower, whereas AT&T Navigator won't.

As I will be travelling outside of cell range on national park grounds, the TomTom app, or a stand alone unit is what I have to use. Because of the timing of everything, I wound up getting one of the nice 4.3" TomTom units. Now if I could write up a script to scrape AT&T WiFi hotspots off their website and create a TomTom POI DB, I'd be set. :P

MacFly123
Jul 9, 2009, 04:22 PM
There are only two subscription GPS apps on the iPhone right now:
AT&T Navigator and Gokivo

They sure as heck won't change from that model anytime soon, and TomTom won't convince them to change from that model either. Sygic, Navigon, and XROAD all are one-time fees, download maps to the device, and work okay for navigation.

The reason why I say they won't change is because the why they charge a subscription is unlikely to be threatened in the near term unless TomTom does something very out of character.

See, AT&T Navigator includes local search over the cellular network, traffic, gas prices, ratings of restaurants and so on. It even ensures you always have the latest maps because they are streamed over the cell network.

Historically, that sort of live feed requires a subscription of some kind in the stand alone units (MSN Direct for Garmin, and the new Live services, or some of the Home services for TomTom). Don't forget you have to pay for map upgrades on the stand alones.

If TomTom's model is anything like the model for the standalone (maybe some discounted pricing on the live services or included in the price if they just really want your business)... you will still need to pay for the map upgrades, whereas the AT&T Navigator will always use the latest map data they have paid for. The flip-side is that TomTom's model is also the one that will work out of range of a cell tower, whereas AT&T Navigator won't.

As I will be travelling outside of cell range on national park grounds, the TomTom app, or a stand alone unit is what I have to use. Because of the timing of everything, I wound up getting one of the nice 4.3" TomTom units. Now if I could write up a script to scrape AT&T WiFi hotspots off their website and create a TomTom POI DB, I'd be set. :P

I would rather pay a one time fee and have the choice of whether or not to purchase map updates every year or however often, then be charged every month for updates that I may very well not even need or notice.

samab
Jul 9, 2009, 04:34 PM
I would rather pay a one time fee and have the choice of whether or not to purchase map updates every year or however often, then be charged every month for updates that I may very well not even need or notice.

Different people have different usage patterns and different usage needs.

Some people just want to use nav apps during their summer trips in July/August plus a few long weekends --- the $10 a month and $3 a day subscriptions are perfect for them.

Some people finds the live traffic information and automatic live traffic re-routing very useful --- and you can only get them on a subsciption fee basis.

Krevnik
Jul 9, 2009, 04:35 PM
I would rather pay a one time fee and have the choice of whether or not to purchase map updates every year or however often, then be charged every month for updates that I may very well not even need or notice.

Which is all well and good mind you... but TomTom isn't going to kill the subscription model for GPS apps anytime soon. Not when they themselves currently charge 10$/month for similar features (gas prices, local live search, traffic) on their Live models, and MSN Direct on Garmin is the same sort of price structure.

10$ a month for a capable GPS app with the sort of OTA/Live update functionality is valuable. The people it is valuable to may not be you, but it doesn't have to be. It is this very reason that competition is a good thing. Different ways of doing business to appeal to different people who value different features more/less.

I was mostly addressing this point you made:


Watch me be proven right as it becomes the number one sold nav app and basically all others switch to a one time cost model!

I disagree with that point entirely, because AT&T and Gokivo are both offering up some nice value adds in exchange for the subscription price that will let them continue doing business without bowing down to the 'it must be one-time cost' crowd. Hell, they are cheaper than a TomTom or Garmin with Live/MSN Direct services added in, after one year or a decade, with the same map data as the Garmin.

If it wasn't for the fact that maps were streamed, and there is no data stored locally, requiring a cell connection, I'd happily keep the service. It has features that are compelling to me, but the lack of local caching is killer for me when I know I will be out of the cell network trying to use the thing.

That said, you are already pretty much right, because "basically all others" on the app store already are on a pay-once model... and to be honest, their POI data currently stinks. I hope TomTom for the iPhone has similar POI features that their stand-alone devices do and offer up a pay-once GPS iPhone app I'd actually /buy/. Right now the only ones worth paying for with US support right now /is/ the AT&T app. We'll see if TomTom can do the same for the stand-alone apps.

SpaceKitty
Jul 9, 2009, 05:05 PM
Problem with the all in one apps available now such as Sygic (http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewArtist?id=306486843) is that it does NOT have the most up to date maps. I bought Sygic Mobile Maps North America and it does not have the most current map like my Garmin Nuvi does. I have found several areas not updated at all showing new developments. I'm not so sure the subscription ones will either.

Sygic had an app update over the weekend that did not update the maps.

Krevnik
Jul 9, 2009, 05:15 PM
Sygic is probably not the best example. I've found that it's POI database is extremely poor, compared to stand-alone units (even the bargin ones). They don't even mention what map data they are based off of, so it is really hard to figure out what their problem is when your map doesn't work.

I do know that AT&T/Telenav is using Navteq data, and Telenav seems to be setup to get map updates on a regular schedule from Navteq. As the maps are pulled from their map server (a la Google Maps on the iPhone), you should always get the latest data they have accessible on their server, to any phone Telenav supports.

Tunnelrunner
Jul 9, 2009, 05:44 PM
Right now the only ones worth paying for with US support right now /is/ the AT&T app. We'll see if TomTom can do the same for the stand-alone apps.

First off, well written post. Second, I definitely agree with your point re: AT&T Navigator/Telenav. If people could get past the monthly fee, it is overall, the most solid, complete GPS App available for the iPhone in North America. I can't compare it to Navigon (since it hasn't been released here yet) but Telenav easily outclasses Sygic and is still superior to G-Map.

I have a feeling that the TomTom app will be of excellent quality when it finally comes out and that it will, along with Telenav (two VERY different business models of service), be the 2 best GPS Apps available for the iPhone for the foreseeable future -- at least until Hell freezes over and Garmin wisely decides to jump on the iPhone GPS App bandwagon...

MacFly123
Jul 9, 2009, 07:03 PM
Different people have different usage patterns and different usage needs.

Some people just want to use nav apps during their summer trips in July/August plus a few long weekends --- the $10 a month and $3 a day subscriptions are perfect for them.

Some people finds the live traffic information and automatic live traffic re-routing very useful --- and you can only get them on a subsciption fee basis.

Which is all well and good mind you... but TomTom isn't going to kill the subscription model for GPS apps anytime soon. Not when they themselves currently charge 10$/month for similar features (gas prices, local live search, traffic) on their Live models, and MSN Direct on Garmin is the same sort of price structure.

10$ a month for a capable GPS app with the sort of OTA/Live update functionality is valuable. The people it is valuable to may not be you, but it doesn't have to be. It is this very reason that competition is a good thing. Different ways of doing business to appeal to different people who value different features more/less.

I was mostly addressing this point you made:



I disagree with that point entirely, because AT&T and Gokivo are both offering up some nice value adds in exchange for the subscription price that will let them continue doing business without bowing down to the 'it must be one-time cost' crowd. Hell, they are cheaper than a TomTom or Garmin with Live/MSN Direct services added in, after one year or a decade, with the same map data as the Garmin.

If it wasn't for the fact that maps were streamed, and there is no data stored locally, requiring a cell connection, I'd happily keep the service. It has features that are compelling to me, but the lack of local caching is killer for me when I know I will be out of the cell network trying to use the thing.

That said, you are already pretty much right, because "basically all others" on the app store already are on a pay-once model... and to be honest, their POI data currently stinks. I hope TomTom for the iPhone has similar POI features that their stand-alone devices do and offer up a pay-once GPS iPhone app I'd actually /buy/. Right now the only ones worth paying for with US support right now /is/ the AT&T app. We'll see if TomTom can do the same for the stand-alone apps.

Ok how do we make a poll on here? I've never set one up before, but it looks like this would be a good one.

I am still confident most people would want a pay once model. So lets get a poll going and find out :)

From a business perspective and seeing your points of view I would say offer the app with local maps at a ONE TIME COST with the OPTION to buy map updates annually, OR OPTIONAL subscription for constant updates and other OTA features.

How does that sound?

samab
Jul 9, 2009, 07:15 PM
Ok how do we make a poll on here? I've never set one up before, but it looks like this would be a good one.

I am still confident most people would want a pay once model. So lets get a poll going and find out :)

From a business perspective and seeing your points of view I would say offer the app with local maps at a ONE TIME COST with the OPTION to buy map updates annually, OR OPTIONAL subscription for constant updates and other OTA features.

How does that sound?

From a business perspective, feature phones still represent 80-90% of the total cell phone market --- you can't kill the monthly subscription-based AT&T Navigator or VZ Navigator or Sprint Navigation where they are the only apps available.

Tunnelrunner
Jul 9, 2009, 07:36 PM
Ok how do we make a poll on here? I've never set one up before, but it looks like this would be a good one.

I am still confident most people would want a pay once model. So lets get a poll going and find out :)

From a business perspective and seeing your points of view I would say offer the app with local maps at a ONE TIME COST with the OPTION to buy map updates annually, OR OPTIONAL subscription for constant updates and other OTA features.

How does that sound?

Samab has been making a point which I think bears repeating: reality is a lot more complex than "one time payment good, monthly payment really bad!!!"

It depends on which GPS app you're referring to. It also depends on so many other variables: quality of the app, TTS, UI, etc. Don't get so stuck on the pricing model; that's only one part of the package. As it stands right now, if you live in North America, Telenav is, IMO, the most polished GPS app available for the iPhone. It is superior to any of the current one-time fee apps and I know for a fact that like all apps, Telenav (AND for that matter, Gokivo of Networks in Motion) are actively upgrading/fixing bugs for the second roll-out of their apps; they're actively improving their GPS apps as I type this.

As I said earlier, when TomTom launches, then there may finally be a "one-time fee" GPS app to challenge Telenav - but until then, AT&T boasts the most robust, fully-featured sat-nav app. I mean, as big a fan I am of G-Map, I would never for a second think that it could replace Telenav...

Krevnik
Jul 10, 2009, 12:34 AM
Ok how do we make a poll on here? I've never set one up before, but it looks like this would be a good one.

I am still confident most people would want a pay once model. So lets get a poll going and find out :)

Most people wanting X doesn't mean there isn't a good business model in Y. If you have a 30/70 split on your poll... focusing on the 30% which is getting ignored by most of the market is bound to be just as viable as fighting to get a cut of the 70%.

Apple themselves seem to prove that you don't need a majority of the market to make the business viable and worth pursuing.


From a business perspective and seeing your points of view I would say offer the app with local maps at a ONE TIME COST with the OPTION to buy map updates annually, OR OPTIONAL subscription for constant updates and other OTA features.

How does that sound?

That is up to a business to decide if it is worth pursuing both groups. And as I pointed out in my other posts, Garmin/TomTom offer subscriptions for updates and OTA features... in addition to the cost of the device itself. They are trying to pursue both groups. But because they are doing both (and are only so flexible in what they can accomplish), it leaves the door open for groups like Telenav to undercut them on the subscription cost, in exchange for a few things that aren't available in the Telenav app.

This isn't a bad situation for the customer to be in right now... you have choice of a few stand alone devices (albeit with Garmin/TomTom being the heavyweights here), and smartphones are letting new players enter the market with new ideas that would simply not work on stand alone devices, or would work very poorly.

And it isn't like I have anything against the stand-alone devices or a flat-fee up front... I own one because it fits my needs better than Telenav going forward. Doesn't mean Telenav and it's ilk isn't going to be valuable for a segment of the market. And TomTom showing up on the iPhone isn't gonna strong-arm them into changing their business model in the short-term.

supmango
Jul 10, 2009, 07:51 AM
i have this growing feeling that tom tom will blow it and charge way too much for it.

expectations high going into a release and most people's lack of putting big money towards a fancy gps system = fail.

I tend to agree. They are trying really hard to build suspense for the product, which usually means they are a little worried about how it will perform once released.

Krevnik
Jul 10, 2009, 01:04 PM
I tend to agree. They are trying really hard to build suspense for the product, which usually means they are a little worried about how it will perform once released.

Looking at the responses on this very thread on what they would personally pay, I'd also be worried if I was TomTom. Even if they offer it at a competitive price, there are a bunch of people here who would not shell out that price because they feel it would be too expensive. Considering map data is an ugly fixed cost per unit that really forces the software to be priced at certain price points (for most companies)... I don't see TomTom hitting those price points, and mix that with a sort of 'it is a small iPhone app, therefore it must be cheaper than desktop-side software' attitude to pricing on the iPhone, and TomTom is in a sort of darned if you do, darned if you don't position. Especially without trials for the more expensive stuff.

applehappy
Jul 10, 2009, 05:51 PM
Some people seem to think the pricing is going to be crazy, I think tomtom might get it right. I can go buy a stand-alone unit for $90 - $230 and that is with the hardware. So, even if they charge a hefty premium for the NAV 7 style s/w it would cost something like what Navigon's Europe product is set at $140, maybe a cheaper intro price. I wouldn't be surprised to see it sell for close to $100. They would be smart to sell it cheaper as they would sell many times more.
Then the mount, which has bluetooth speakerphone, aux out, power in/charging, and GPS built in. I think they will be charging a premium for that puppy. $50 sounds too low and $100 is too high in my mind.
Whatever is going on though, I wish tomtom would sell it already.

neilp4453
Jul 11, 2009, 05:22 PM
I'd be willing to shell out what it costs to own a dedicated TomTom unit....but that includes all the hardware TomTom is offering as well. I'd expect to pay even less considering I already own the main unit.

Otherwise...screw them.

Londonluke
Jul 12, 2009, 10:09 AM
Tomtom really need to do some serious "customer research" I paid to call them to ask if the 2g will work using their GPS cradle and mapping. The tech guy did not know. Thats a $6 call to ask a simple tech question .If he does not know that then whats the point??

surferfromuk
Jul 12, 2009, 01:12 PM
I think they're on the verge of blowing it - you were ready 12 months ago - your already 30 days late.

Navigon are cleaning up - wait another 3 months and they will be the uncatchable market leader.

Tunnelrunner
Jul 13, 2009, 05:19 AM
I think they're on the verge of blowing it - you were ready 12 months ago - your already 30 days late.

Navigon are cleaning up - wait another 3 months and they will be the uncatchable market leader.

While agree that TomTom needs to come out sooner vs. later, I still believe that their launch -- at least here in the US -- will be a successful one, since their competition as a whole, really isn't that great. Navigon is also taking a long time to get here. G-Map (no strangers themselves, to bad marketing mishaps) is a decent GPS app but a far cry from any fully-featured nav app; it's gotten better but still has a ways to go. Had the version seen in the Tap Critic video been released by now, then TomTom might have a problem but that's not the case. And Sygic was a disappointment, given the expectations. Gokivo, while boasting some great features in the first roll-out, still has some bugs/instability issues to work out. IMHO, the only GPS app in America that is of any true quality right now -- and thus, any threat at all to TomTom -- is AT&T Navigator/Telenav - and as pointed out earlier, they're kind of aimed at a different audience than TomTom anyway, due to the different pricing model/philosophy. So I think TomTom should do well. They've been extremely
fortunate that Navigon has been equally as slow. I just hope TomTom keeps their promise of "later this summer"...

Londonluke
Jul 13, 2009, 09:48 AM
While agree that TomTom needs to come out sooner vs. later, I still believe that their launch -- at least here in the US -- will be a successful one, since their competition as a whole, really isn't that great. Navigon is also taking a long time to get here. G-Map (no strangers themselves, to bad marketing mishaps) is a decent GPS app but a far cry from any fully-featured nav app; it's gotten better but still has a ways to go. Had the version seen in the Tap Critic video been released by now, then TomTom might have a problem but that's not the case. And Sygic was a disappointment, given the expectations. Gokivo, while boasting some great features in the first roll-out, still has some bugs/instability issues to work out. IMHO, the only GPS app in America that is of any true quality right now -- and thus, any threat at all to TomTom -- is AT&T Navigator/Telenav - and as pointed out earlier, they're kind of aimed at a different audience than TomTom anyway, due to the different pricing model/philosophy. So I think TomTom should do well. They've been extremely
fortunate that Navigon has been equally as slow. I just hope TomTom keeps their promise of "later this summer"...

Navigon with a little more money behind them and some clever guys running it could give Tomtom a good run for their money.
If they come up with a fantastic cradle for the 3gs etc complete with speaker and mic etc and price it $30 under the tomtom then they will clean up. I sue a 730 and i like it. but the navigon i also have use of is excellent

surferfromuk
Jul 13, 2009, 03:10 PM
While agree that TomTom needs to come out sooner vs. later, I still believe that their launch -- at least here in the US -- will be a successful one, since their competition as a whole, really isn't that great. Navigon is also taking a long time to get here. G-Map (no strangers themselves, to bad marketing mishaps) is a decent GPS app but a far cry from any fully-featured nav app; it's gotten better but still has a ways to go. Had the version seen in the Tap Critic video been released by now, then TomTom might have a problem but that's not the case. And Sygic was a disappointment, given the expectations. Gokivo, while boasting some great features in the first roll-out, still has some bugs/instability issues to work out. IMHO, the only GPS app in America that is of any true quality right now -- and thus, any threat at all to TomTom -- is AT&T Navigator/Telenav - and as pointed out earlier, they're kind of aimed at a different audience than TomTom anyway, due to the different pricing model/philosophy. So I think TomTom should do well. They've been extremely
fortunate that Navigon has been equally as slow. I just hope TomTom keeps their promise of "later this summer"...

I wasn't aware Navigon wasn't stateside yet - that's going to give TomTom some room.

Krevnik
Jul 13, 2009, 03:23 PM
I wasn't aware Navigon wasn't stateside yet - that's going to give TomTom some room.

The free demo just came out... I'd expect the full version to not be too far behind.

JonB3Z
Jul 13, 2009, 04:30 PM
I tend to agree. They are trying really hard to build suspense for the product, which usually means they are a little worried about how it will perform once released.

I don't think that's what's happening. I think they simply aren't ready. Don't forget, unlike the other apps, there is a hardware component to this product, and production lead times are longer on such products. My guess is that TomTom would have preferred not to announce at WWDC but felt their hand was being forced by the fact that Apple was planning to announce that TBT would be possible with 3.0. So TomTom announced and are frantically trying to get their hardware to market. (Yeah, I'm guessing. Sue me!)

Of course, they could release the S/W without the H/W, but I'm sure they want to try to bundle them if at all possible.

One other note about pricing: There is no reason they couldn't produce a range of apps with different capabilities and different price points, just as they do with stand-alone units. Want a static map set? $79.99. Want voice address input? $89.99. Want real-time map updates and traffic? $99.99 plus a $4.99/month subscription. And so on. Obviously, I'm totally making up the numbers. My point is that there are lots of creative pricing models they could explore.

applehappy
Jul 14, 2009, 04:33 AM
I don't think that's what's happening. I think they simply aren't ready. Don't forget, unlike the other apps, there is a hardware component to this product, and production lead times are longer on such products. My guess is that TomTom would have preferred not to announce at WWDC but felt their hand was being forced by the fact that Apple was planning to announce that TBT would be possible with 3.0. So TomTom announced and are frantically trying to get their hardware to market. (Yeah, I'm guessing. Sue me!)

Of course, they could release the S/W without the H/W, but I'm sure they want to try to bundle them if at all possible.

One other note about pricing: There is no reason they couldn't produce a range of apps with different capabilities and different price points, just as they do with stand-alone units. Want a static map set? $79.99. Want voice address input? $89.99. Want real-time map updates and traffic? $99.99 plus a $4.99/month subscription. And so on. Obviously, I'm totally making up the numbers. My point is that there are lots of creative pricing models they could explore.

Great post! Totally agree.

Londonluke
Jul 14, 2009, 05:07 AM
Great post! Totally agree.


Just wonder how many people will be selling these maps cheaper...? Ie hacked. My local computer fair has guys selling all uk, europe and full usa on a card for £30.00 (fully working and latest maps.. Its a human thing, people get sick to death of having to keep paying. Hard luck for Tomtom i know , but then again they do not seem to worry about their customers. This would then mean buying the cradle.

JonB3Z
Jul 14, 2009, 01:38 PM
Just wonder how many people will be selling these maps cheaper...? Ie hacked. My local computer fair has guys selling all uk, europe and full usa on a card for £30.00 (fully working and latest maps.. Its a human thing, people get sick to death of having to keep paying. Hard luck for Tomtom i know , but then again they do not seem to worry about their customers. This would then mean buying the cradle.

You mean selling copyrighted data they don't have a license to resell? None. At least, none through the App Store. I'm sure there will be stuff like that available for jailbroken iPhones, but I'm equally sure that Apple won't allow sale of such apps through the App Store.

"Its a human thing..." -- yes, because greed is a human failing.

ct2k7
Jul 14, 2009, 05:07 PM
Anyone want to make some guesses at some rough dates for release?

applehappy
Jul 15, 2009, 02:01 AM
I am starting to think maybe 3.0 issues are holding it up. Maybe we will see tomtom after 3.1 is released.

ct2k7
Jul 15, 2009, 04:36 AM
I am starting to think maybe 3.0 issues are holding it up. Maybe we will see tomtom after 3.1 is released.


What in 3.0 could prevent the release, and 3.1 to allow the release?

applehappy
Jul 15, 2009, 09:47 PM
What in 3.0 could prevent the release, and 3.1 to allow the release?

Just speculating, maybe the bluetooth cradle won't work like they want it to. Apple already said 3.1 will allow bluetooth voice command, etc. That just made me think they are having bt issues, and the tomtom mount uses bt for handsfree phonecalls, and, I would imagine, input commands.

LightSpeed1
Jul 16, 2009, 01:24 AM
I think it will be great, but not worth the money if you already have a dedicated GPS unit

Tiffy
Jul 16, 2009, 02:41 AM
What in 3.0 could prevent the release, and 3.1 to allow the release?

Maybe a bug in the management of external hardware. You remember that the demo failed during the last WWDC ?

ct2k7
Jul 16, 2009, 07:07 AM
Maybe a bug in the management of external hardware. You remember that the demo failed during the last WWDC ?

No :eek:

Hmm, I suppose this could be a reason, but either way, it's making us wait, and that isn't always good.

ct2k7
Jul 16, 2009, 07:07 AM
Just speculating, maybe the bluetooth cradle won't work like they want it to. Apple already said 3.1 will allow bluetooth voice command, etc. That just made me think they are having bt issues, and the tomtom mount uses bt for handsfree phonecalls, and, I would imagine, input commands.


I was thinking of such last night :)

SlavKO
Jul 21, 2009, 07:46 AM
Seriously, wth is taking so long? Couldnt they at least announce a date when it will be available?:mad:

Manic Mouse
Jul 21, 2009, 10:16 AM
Seriously, wth is taking so long? Couldnt they at least announce a date when it will be available?:mad:

I know, what was the point of showing it at WWDC if it was nowhere near complete?!

Hawkeye411
Jul 21, 2009, 02:41 PM
I know, what was the point of showing it at WWDC if it was nowhere near complete?!

Agreed! :mad:

NightStorm
Jul 21, 2009, 03:52 PM
I suggest you save your money, The ATand T version of GPS (Turn by Turn) is a complete waste of $120 per year. you are better using the MAPS that came with the Iphone, Works Great. For the Extra Money Tom Tom is going to charge you. you might consider buying a dedicated GPS if that is the full feature you want. Why spend all the extra money with not a whole lot of results, This to me seems yet another way for a 3rd party to profit from Iphone owners and ATT is Horrible and I hope, the US Dept Of Justice who opened a case yesterday against Providers and Cell Manufatures becomes a full out law suit, Apple,ATT and Other you have taken your last $1 from me.........ohhhhhh wait did i just get a notice that MMS is now available? Nope still waiting, maybe i'll tell ATT my bill will be paid some time this summer
DIRECTSTARTV.COM

Wow, I loved using the AT&T Navigator on my recent vacation trip to North Carolina... never had a problem with it and it alerted me to a couple traffic delays that would have prevented me from getting to the beach early. That said, I'm looking to buy either the Navigon or TomTom solutions once they are released... one less device to maintain/carry/protect (versus a standalone product).

The rest of your post read like an incoherent drunken rambling.

ct2k7
Jul 21, 2009, 04:32 PM
Wow, I loved using the AT&T Navigator on my recent vacation trip to North Carolina... never had a problem with it and it alerted me to a couple traffic delays that would have prevented me from getting to the beach early. That said, I'm looking to buy either the Navigon or TomTom solutions once they are released... one less device to maintain/carry/protect (versus a standalone product).

The rest of your post read like an incoherent drunken rambling.

I'm not impressed with the Navigon software, then again, I tried it on a 2G iPhone, which doesn't have a GPS.

BigTRQ
Jul 22, 2009, 10:13 AM
Now that Navigon's announced, how long will TomTom wait. The "killer" part of their solution would be the ability to use an iPod touch with their cradle.

At least that's what I'm hoping for anyway! :D

lw9090
Jul 22, 2009, 10:40 AM
I called tomtom again last night and the lady said it is still another month or two away. Then if it takes apple another month before they release it like they did with Navigon North America it will be Sept or Oct....:mad:

I went ahead and purchased Navigon. Still downloading at work another 3 hours to go. LOL

David-fr
Jul 23, 2009, 11:02 AM
i went ahead and got Navigon, i was not very please but am still going to get tom tom

pugnut
Jul 23, 2009, 11:36 AM
Drive into work, from North Arlingtion to Capitol Hill, I had no issues. I set the route and made a few pit stops and it worked without issues. The route change as responsive and go me back on the right path. The POI's are way better the G-Map and are accurate. I lvoe the fact that the directions and the warnings about the spped are routed throuhgh my headset.

As of today I would consider this as a replacement unit.

I am on a 3gs running 3.1.2

eawmp1
Jul 23, 2009, 12:10 PM
I'm not impressed with the Navigon software, then again, I tried it on a 2G iPhone, which doesn't have a GPS.

Well, that might dampen the user experience, wouldn't it?

tawfiqmp
Jul 24, 2009, 02:20 PM
When I look at the car kit... it shows in their picture... you have to have the iPhone naked to be able to hook it into the thing... that really sucks because I have a case and I don't want to keep taking it out everytime I want to use my navigation in my car with that sound thing.

Rayfire
Jul 25, 2009, 01:19 AM
A lot of people (or some) are waiting till Aug 14 before they bite the bullet on Navigon, that includes me. If TomTom won't get their act pulled together before that, they'd be losing a lot of potential customers. I called them too, the representative told me to "wait" :rolleyes:

Car kit so far is a big minus for all iPhones with a case out there.

Manic Mouse
Jul 25, 2009, 02:54 AM
I'm starting to suspect that TomTom was shown at WWDC in order to put people off buying the initial turn-by-turn options like Navigon and wait for it. It may have not been even close to being complete, but by saying "the summer" it makes one think it could be out any time.

brian4610
Jul 25, 2009, 12:50 PM
I'm starting to suspect that TomTom was shown at WWDC in order to put people off buying the initial turn-by-turn options like Navigon and wait for it. It may have not been even close to being complete, but by saying "the summer" it makes one think it could be out any time.

could be right....

what really surprises me the most is how little info we have been given, and how poorly TomTom communicates. Like a lot of others, i signed up to receive info from their website, but haven't heard a peep. Not even a confirmation email...

lousy PR.

mortfe
Jul 25, 2009, 06:17 PM
The big drawback to Navigon is that it doesn't announce street names. No mention of this either in update at app store. I emailed them about this feature but got no reply. I tried the lite version but it took me in a round-about way to my location. All I got was 'turn right-turn left'. Don't know how much text-to-voice it has. Read several complaints about this on HF.

mortfe
Jul 25, 2009, 06:25 PM
Just speculating, maybe the bluetooth cradle won't work like they want it to. Apple already said 3.1 will allow bluetooth voice command, etc. That just made me think they are having bt issues, and the tomtom mount uses bt for handsfree phonecalls, and, I would imagine, input commands.
Might be right - we know that the bluetooth will not work over a headset unless you start it from the phone. I had called apple support about 3 weeks ago & mentioned this & he said they had gotten a lot of complaints but hinted it would be corrected in 3.1.

smakdown61
Jul 25, 2009, 10:44 PM
I think whats even more interesting is the fact that TomTom announced they had nav software working on the iphone LAST SUMMER (2008) for testing but were unsure of how their relationship with apple would turn out. That would lead me to believe the software is complete but they are waiting on something they don't have yet that will come in 3.1.

xRobskix
Aug 1, 2009, 04:45 PM
Tomtom for iphone will be released this September in the Uk. It will cost 99 GBP and that will include the in -car mount AND the application.

David-fr
Aug 1, 2009, 10:18 PM
Tomtom for iphone will be released this September in the Uk. It will cost 99 GBP and that will include the in -car mount AND the application.

how do you know? and when for the US?

dudeitsvan
Aug 2, 2009, 12:12 AM
I call BS with no links to back it up.

Manic Mouse
Aug 2, 2009, 05:06 AM
Tomtom for iphone will be released this September in the Uk. It will cost 99 GBP and that will include the in -car mount AND the application.

Well that's me sold, decent price for both of them. If true...

Tunnelrunner
Aug 2, 2009, 06:48 AM
I call BS with no links to back it up.

I'm gonna give XRobskiX at least 24 hours to answer back with info on his sources...and boy, do I hope he does...

These days it seems like everyone has an insider at TomTom...except me...

m3coolpix
Aug 2, 2009, 09:11 AM
Tomtom for iphone will be released this September in the Uk. It will cost 99 GBP and that will include the in -car mount AND the application.

This would be a remarkable move. Basically this would say that they want market share, and our TBT software is worth nothing (or at least, next to nothing). Haven't they reported (or is it rumor) that the dock alone would be this price?

Software alone $10? $20? WOW. What's the name of this site again?

curly14
Aug 2, 2009, 06:31 PM
I call BS with no links to back it up.

would you like pie with that crow...look for Tom Tom in the US Sept 3..;)

ct2k7
Aug 2, 2009, 06:37 PM
This would be a remarkable move. Basically this would say that they want market share, and our TBT software is worth nothing (or at least, next to nothing). Haven't they reported (or is it rumor) that the dock alone would be this price?

Software alone $10? $20? WOW. What's the name of this site again?

You just failed....

£99... so the software could be £70 and the accessory £29.

Makes sense to me.

dudeitsvan
Aug 2, 2009, 07:11 PM
would you like pie with that crow...look for Tom Tom in the US Sept 3..;)

I still have yet to see any proof besides two people saying something on a forum.

curly14
Aug 3, 2009, 10:46 AM
I still have yet to see any proof besides two people saying something on a forum.

Your right there is no link to back it up it's straight from someone in at TomTom a good friend of mine who is involved with the app program:D

optophobia
Aug 3, 2009, 11:01 AM
Your right there is no link to back it up it's straight from someone in at TomTom a good friend of mine who is involved with the app program:D

HERE IS THE PROOF http://www.handtec.co.uk/product.php/2126/tomtom-for-iphone-inc-mount

It is actually £99 PLUS VAT = £113.85

IrishSniper87
Aug 3, 2009, 11:12 AM
I will buy TomTom for iPhone the second its available.

Blue Fox
Aug 3, 2009, 11:16 AM
^^ I figured the dock itself would be priced sort of high. A low price point on a dock that has enhanced GPS, speaker, charger, etc. for $30 seemed quite low. I'm just wondering if they're going to include the App if you buy the accessory for $100 bucks or if they're somehow going to bundle it. We'll see though. All that we can do is speculate.

ct2k7
Aug 3, 2009, 01:01 PM
I will buy TomTom for iPhone the second its available.

Good luck, I'll stay with Navigon, it's provided me with what TomTom hasn't and has therefore won against TomTom.

countrydweller
Aug 3, 2009, 01:04 PM
Good luck, I'll stay with Navigon, it's provided me with what TomTom hasn't and has therefore won against TomTom.

I bought Navigon for this years vacation, I'll get TomTom for next year's vacation, I'll keep the one I like best after trying them both.

ct2k7
Aug 3, 2009, 01:07 PM
I bought Navigon for this years vacation, I'll get TomTom for next year's vacation, I'll keep the one I like best after trying them both.


erm... either way you've wasted some money :/

Randman
Aug 3, 2009, 01:09 PM
£113 = US$191. That's expensive, almost 3 times the price of Navigon.

Nevermind. Thought it was pounds.

countrydweller
Aug 3, 2009, 01:09 PM
erm... either way you've wasted some money :/

Some, but I'll get fresh maps for next summer, which is nice to have anyway.

ct2k7
Aug 3, 2009, 01:11 PM
Some, but I'll get fresh maps for next summer, which is nice to have anyway.

Well, if you go with navigon, you've wasted at least £50... with TomTom, then around the same.

Maps will always be updating with each app, so it really doesn't make a difference, also, Navigon are leaning towards not making you pay for maps :eek:

countrydweller
Aug 3, 2009, 01:17 PM
Well, if you go with navigon, you've wasted at least £50... with TomTom, then around the same.

Maps will always be updating with each app, so it really doesn't make a difference, also, Navigon are leaning towards not making you pay for maps :eek:

My guess is they'll all charge for map updates, on a yearly basis.

ct2k7
Aug 3, 2009, 01:21 PM
My guess is they'll all charge for map updates, on a yearly basis.

We'll see, it's everyone's first year in the iPhone, but TomTom making us wait so long for their app? not good for me at all.

curly14
Aug 3, 2009, 02:31 PM
My guess is they'll all charge for map updates, on a yearly basis.

nope have it from a good source that Navigon will not charge for map updates:)

ct2k7
Aug 3, 2009, 04:37 PM
nope have it from a good source that Navigon will not charge for map updates:)

Yep, that looks good :)

Rayfire
Aug 4, 2009, 12:23 AM
£113 = US$191. That's expensive, almost 3 times the price of Navigon.

Nevermind. Thought it was pounds.

That is indeed expensive :eek:

and rumors to be released to September? Hopefully not. Go early before Aug 15! :p

ct2k7
Aug 4, 2009, 06:25 AM
That is indeed expensive :eek:

and rumors to be released to September? Hopefully not. Go early before Aug 15! :p

That's uber un-cool (the price):eek::eek::eek::eek:

Tiffy
Aug 4, 2009, 07:24 AM
IGo just released its GPS software today on the AppStore. The provider of the maps is the same as for Navigon (Navteq), but the software looks very different. The demo video is very nice, but a demo is always nice...
If someone tried it, could he give us some information about it ?

With 2 such big competitors (and there is also G-Map), if I was TomTom I wouldn't release my product on Iphone except if I had something really unique to propose. TomTom, what will you offer that your competitors don't ? It's time to communicate with something else than a basic video...

m3coolpix
Aug 4, 2009, 07:40 AM
With 2 such big competitors (and there is also G-Map), if I was TomTom I wouldn't release my product on Iphone except if I had something really unique to propose. TomTom, what will you offer that your competitors don't ? It's time to communicate with something else than a basic video...

The biggest difference is going to be their GPS antenna and Bluetooth dock, IMHO. That's going to help separate them from the other apps, as the TomTom device will have a separate antenna that's much better/faster at obtaining the initial GPS lock, as well as helping keep their app locked onto the GPS signals. Unfortunately, as it's been noted, it's not going to be inexpensive, and you probably can't use any type of bulky case.

FWIW, I've not had the annoying problems with the GPS signal lock/acquisition or have the signal drop while using Navigon. I use a suction cup window mount (that allows for cases, but I don't use a case currently). The mount keeps the iPhone about 4" from the windshield, and gives the iPhone an unobstructed view to the sky.

ct2k7
Aug 4, 2009, 07:50 AM
Actually, TomTom have IQ Routes etc.

What strikes me is that the initial shipment to a shop had been delayed.

Tiffy
Aug 4, 2009, 09:14 AM
The biggest difference is going to be their GPS antenna and Bluetooth dock, IMHO.

Hi Coolpix,

Some people on this forum told that Apple had asked TomTom to make its hardware compatible with other GPS applications. If it's true (is it ?), then TomTom will have to offer great software functionalities to attract the customers. IQRoutes is something interesting but for example around Paris in France it is useless because there is not enough TomTom users to allow the app to know the traffic on small roads. So the GPS unit can direct you to roads that are worst that the one it wants to avoid... I already have Navigon, and I wouldn't spend again the same price just to have IQRoutes. Regarding the GPS antenna, with the Iphone positioned near the windshield (and a reboot of the Iphone :D) I almost never loose the GPS signal.

I think TomTom has only 2 options now : either they propose their app at a very competitive price, or they propose a very high-end solution, far better than the existing apps. But this second option is doubtful as the existing apps are already very good.

0B1
Aug 4, 2009, 09:16 AM
if you look at the Handtec site it says price is still TBC
So essentially they are simply speculating what the price will be in order to drum up some interest. No doubt when/if TomTom do make an announcement handtec will adjust their site to match.

ct2k7
Aug 4, 2009, 10:07 AM
if you look at the Handtec site it says price is still TBC
So essentially they are simply speculating what the price will be in order to drum up some interest. No doubt when/if TomTom do make an announcement handtec will adjust their site to match.

Correct, how their support said:

In regards to this all we can suggest is checking out our website weekly to see if or when this becomes available, however in a couple of weeks our site will have a feature allowing you to receive emails regarding items such as this one,

but before:

I'm very sorry but at this time we do not have a specific date for when this item is coming into stock. An order has been placed with our suppliers however the shipment dates have been delayed and we cannot estimate a specific date as of yet.

Macintosh Sauce
Aug 4, 2009, 10:12 PM
The iGo app looks way better than TomTom IMHO.

curly14
Aug 5, 2009, 11:56 AM
The iGo app looks way better than TomTom IMHO.
ya and Naviagon looks better then both of them:cool:

m3coolpix
Aug 5, 2009, 12:21 PM
Hi Coolpix,

Some people on this forum told that Apple had asked TomTom to make its hardware compatible with other GPS applications.

I've heard this too. That would be interesting. There's also a separate dock accessory now available for this functionality for the other GPS apps:

Orange Gadgets (http://www.orangegadgets.com/)

$75.00 plus shipping, and that's just for the external GPS antenna capability (no bluetooth, no cradle like the TomTom). Also requires JB'ing your iPhone currently to load an extension to make it compatible with other software.

But, using a window mount, and even with my iPhone in a case (SwitchEasy Capsule Neo), I have no major GPS signal issues, at start up or with it dropping during use. I can tell that with the SwitchEasy case, Navigon takes a bit longer for initial lock, but never more than 30 seconds. It's almost immediate with the iPhone naked and in the window mount.

ct2k7
Aug 6, 2009, 05:31 PM
http://smartphones.about.com/b/2009/08/06/tomtom-denies-iphone-app-price-leaked.htm

TomTom Denies iPhone App Price Leaked

fr00b
Aug 6, 2009, 05:33 PM
http://smartphones.about.com/b/2009/08/06/tomtom-denies-iphone-app-price-leaked.htm

TomTom Denies iPhone App Price Leaked
Could be even more expensive than the 'leaked' £113 :eek:

ct2k7
Aug 6, 2009, 05:38 PM
Could be even more expensive than the 'leaked' £113 :eek:

That's a WCS for me.

fr00b
Aug 6, 2009, 06:30 PM
That's a WCS for me.

Yep. I already think £113 is too much for the App and Dock. Only reason I'm waiting is for the dock, or I else I would have purchased the Navigon by now. Plus I'm in no rush in getting a TBT app.

ct2k7
Aug 6, 2009, 06:37 PM
Yep. I already think £113 is too much for the App and Dock. Only reason I'm waiting is for the dock, or I else I would have purchased the Navigon by now. Plus I'm in no rush in getting a TBT app.

Yeah, I understand. It does look interesting.

nik911sc
Aug 19, 2009, 09:02 AM
1. At that price thats a definite thanks but no thanks.

2. The dock not having a 30 pin plug is short sighted as it negates video output from iTunes and YouTube

3. Not having video output available for all apps is just frustrating though that is an Apple constraint even though the API functionality is blatantly there albeit hidden, not documented and not available to use for mainstream release though it can be used for application development using the xCode tools. Come on Apple.....why why why

4. So imagine if your GPS application - google maps, Tom Tom or other was ALLOWED to output video to your car LCD monitor....I just don't get it.....

Blue Fox
Aug 19, 2009, 10:10 AM
1. At that price thats a definite thanks but no thanks.

2. The dock not having a 30 pin plug is short sighted as it negates video output from iTunes and YouTube

3. Not having video output available for all apps is just frustrating though that is an Apple constraint even though the API functionality is blatantly there albeit hidden, not documented and not available to use for mainstream release though it can be used for application development using the xCode tools. Come on Apple.....why why why

4. So imagine if your GPS application - google maps, Tom Tom or other was ALLOWED to output video to your car LCD monitor....I just don't get it.....

The iPhone already has a screen, why output a video signal to a monitor? And if you already have an LCD screen inside the car, it probably also already has GPS. Not to mention, there is a VAST array of resolutions and screen sizes to support, which is the reason why it doesn't.

smbmarket
Aug 27, 2009, 09:53 PM
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lily.jime
Sep 1, 2009, 01:29 AM
I'd recommend glasses if it is really that hard for you to see big arrows on your iPhone a few feet from your face.

it is really that hard for you to see big arrows on your iPhone a few feet from your face:o