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View Full Version : in FL: Delays, Purge Hit Voter Rolls




zimv20
Jun 7, 2004, 04:48 PM
link (http://news.tbo.com/news/MGB7TQUZ5VD.html)


Florida is one of only seven states with laws that prevent former felons from voting unless they go through a long and sometimes difficult process of having their rights restored.

That law, which wasn't enforced by the state before the controversial 2000 presidential race, caused hundreds or possibly thousands of voters - no one knows for sure - to be turned away from the polls in 2000, some wrongly, because of errors in a state ``purge list'' of former felons.

Today, as the 2004 election nears:

* More than 43,000 Floridians are on the waiting list to have their rights restored, some of whom first learned in 2000, after voting for years, that they weren't legally entitled to vote. The restoration process can take years, and the list is growing, not shrinking.

* Hundreds of people wrongly removed from voter rolls in 2000, who never committed felonies or whose rights had been restored, may not yet have been put back on the rolls.

* A lawsuit charges that Florida's felon disenfranchisement is unconstitutional and affects up to 600,000 people.

Despite all this, state officials have just sent elections supervisors in Florida's 67 counties another list of 47,000 names of individuals who may have committed felonies in the past, telling the supervisors to purge their rolls again.

Some supervisors say they don't have the staff, expertise or money to do the purge without the same kind of errors as in 2000.

Legally purged voters, meanwhile, won't find out about it until they get a letter from an election supervisor this summer - too late to have their rights restored for this election - or are turned away on Election Day.

The vast majority of them are black and would be likely to vote Democratic.

In Miami-Dade County, for example, blacks are 20 percent of the population but make up 65 percent of those on the 2000 felon purge lists.


Another post-2000 lawsuit, by the NAACP, forced the state to use stricter criteria in producing its felon purge lists.

The lists are produced by matching lists of felons, from the Florida Department of Law Enforcement and other sources, against the statewide voter roll. In 2000, state officials purposely used loose matching criteria to capture as many names as possible, even knowing it would result in ``false positives'' - people who didn't actually have felony records, said Emmett Mitchell, former counsel of the Division of Elections.

They relied on local election supervisors to ensure accurate matches before removing the voters. But some supervisors, with limited time and staff to complete the task and little expertise in investigations, simply sent letters to everyone on their lists, and then purged those who didn't respond or couldn't provide proof they weren't felons.

That resulted in many people being wrongly removed; no one knows how many. Under the litigation settlement, each county is supposed to report completion of its efforts to find and re-register those wrongly removed. Only 33 of the 67 counties have done so.



skunk
Jun 7, 2004, 06:11 PM
Shouldn't the Governor be doing something about this?

Desertrat
Jun 7, 2004, 06:26 PM
I saw where the FDLE has set up a hotline and a window at their website to help deal with the problem. Anybody with questions about their status is advised to make contact.

They've been working on this since either March or early April, from a local article or two.

Lord knows it's easy enough to call a county clerk's office to see if your name is on the BadGuy list. The way their system is set up, protesting one's inclusion on such a list brings--so they say--reasonably quick action.

While I feel bad for those wrongfully purged for the 2000 elections, I remember there were national elections in 2002. If any of these folks cared, they've certainly had more than enough time to deal with it. 42 months, so far...

'Rat

Sayhey
Jun 7, 2004, 09:54 PM
Shouldn't the Governor be doing something about this?

Now, that is funny! Thank you, skunk.

Neserk
Jun 7, 2004, 09:58 PM
Now, that is funny! Thank you, skunk.

I wasn't sure if he was be facetious or not. Skunk, you need to use more smilies in your posts! I can't read you :D

skunk
Jun 8, 2004, 02:12 PM
I wasn't sure if he was be facetious or not. Skunk, you need to use more smilies in your posts! I can't read you :D
:) :) :) :) :) :D :rolleyes:

zimv20
Jun 8, 2004, 02:14 PM
I saw where the FDLE has set up a hotline and a window at their website to help deal with the problem. Anybody with questions about their status is advised to make contact.
but it also said:
1) even when identified as eligible to vote, it can take years to get back on the rolls,
2) there's another purge coming, and their isn't time, staff, or money to prevent more errors

i know you want to blame those who have been purged, but this is a system designed to work against them, including removing them w/o their knowledge.

afaik, i'm registered. but what happens if i show up, tell them my name, they refer to their book and then tell me i'm not in there? is it suddenly my fault?

mactastic
Jun 8, 2004, 02:18 PM
afaik, i'm registered. but what happens if i show up, tell them my name, they refer to their book and then tell me i'm not in there? is it suddenly my fault?

Forcing you to register to vote is the first step in taking your right to vote away. The last step is genocide. :eek: :D :p

Desertrat
Jun 8, 2004, 05:21 PM
"i know you want to blame those who have been purged, but this is a system designed to work against them..."

Bat guano. You don't know any such thing.

The law--and plain common sense--requires periodic purging of the lists. Get rid of the names of the dead, the left-town and the crooks. They ain't supposed to be voting. You have a bunch of gnomes in closets, comparing lists of names and not caring about race, creed, religion or whatever. So much an hour, cleaning up the voting lists.

"...including removing them w/o their knowledge."

So? Do you know every time your name is added to or removed from some list? If you hear of the purge, and you fear your name might wrongfully be removed, do you not check with the county clerk's office?

It would be nice if none of us had any responsibility for anything, but life just doesn't work that way.

'Rat

zimv20
Jun 8, 2004, 06:02 PM
Bat guano. You don't know any such thing.
it is a system which, through its implemenation, removes and causes problems for significantly more democratic voters than republican. i think my statement is fair. if you read the whole article, you'll see a guy claim that the basis for the purge, formed post-civil war, was to keep blacks from having influence over FL politics.


If you hear of the purge, and you fear your name might wrongfully be removed, do you not check with the county clerk's office?

i honestly don't know if IL has such a purge. what i do know -- when i moved, i re-registered. a registration card was mailed to me, a card which i take w/ me to the polls.

now, have i fulfilled my reponsibility? or should i really be calling every 6 months to make sure i'm still registered?

Voltron
Jun 8, 2004, 06:39 PM
it is a system which, through its implemenation, removes and causes problems for significantly more democratic voters than republican. i think my statement is fair. if you read the whole article, you'll see a guy claim that the basis for the purge, formed post-civil war, was to keep blacks from having influence over FL politics.

More dead Democratic voters than dead republican voters more than likely. :p

Desertrat
Jun 9, 2004, 08:06 AM
But for Tallahassee, much of NW Florida is still emotionally close to post-Civil War attitudes. Once you get down around Gainesville and points south, it's a whole 'nother world. Facetiously, from Orlando south, it's blacks, Cubans and "born in New Joisey". You're never sure if it's a melting pot or they're smokin' pot.

As for yourself, if there's nothing in the news about purges, you're golden.

"when i moved, i re-registered. a registration card was mailed to me..."

Providing a current address is what a lot of those in Florida haven't done.

If purging of the lists is occurring, I know I'd keep a wary eye on the bureaucrats. We've had list-cleanups in my county, but the population is too low for problems to arise. Everybody knows everybody else, pretty much.

:), 'Rat

Taft
Jun 9, 2004, 08:53 AM
Lord knows it's easy enough to call a county clerk's office to see if your name is on the BadGuy list. The way their system is set up, protesting one's inclusion on such a list brings--so they say--reasonably quick action.

While I feel bad for those wrongfully purged for the 2000 elections, I remember there were national elections in 2002. If any of these folks cared, they've certainly had more than enough time to deal with it. 42 months, so far...

'Rat

I agree that voters have a responsibility to check their status. However...

The artciel is dated June 7th. It states:

Despite all this, state officials have just sent elections supervisors in Florida's 67 counties another list of 47,000 names of individuals who may have committed felonies in the past, telling the supervisors to purge their rolls again.

...

Legally purged voters, meanwhile, won't find out about it until they get a letter from an election supervisor this summer - too late to have their rights restored for this election - or are turned away on Election Day.

That means voters who legally registered and who have been informed by the state that they are legally registered might get a letter this summer telling them they have been purged from the record. By that time, it will be too late to do anything about it.

The "purging" process is ongoing and new names are being added to it. I have seen quotes by the company hired to do the purging indicating a very high percentage of those purged do not meet the criteria for removal from voting eligability.

Forget the Dem vs. Rep aspect of this issue for a second: this is a clear-cut case of a bureaucracy disenfranchising voters through sloppy and inflexible policies and a reliance on a sleazy private sector firm. If I had been wrongfully purged from the record and were informed of it after it was too late to vote in the upcoming election, I'd want those responsible held accountable. They know there are problems with the policy AND implementation, yet they don't act to correct those problems, or finance the organizations chartered to correct those problems: the local election supervisors offices.

Taft

Desertrat
Jun 10, 2004, 06:56 PM
Agree, Taft. A pet peeve of mine about our system is a two-part thing: First, inadequate accountability; second, where or when it exists, it takes way too long.

I fail to see why "this summer" means an inadequate time to redress wrongful purging. Seems to me the courts could do something; obviously the Legislature could.

Sauce for the goose, sauce for the gander: A class-action suit in federal court, along the lines of, "If we can't vote, nobody votes."

:), 'Rat