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fivepoint
Aug 13, 2009, 02:47 PM
I'm not one to post stories from the Huffington Post, but hey... every dog has his day.


Internal Memo Confirms Big Giveaways In White House Deal With Big Pharma (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/13/internal-memo-confirms-bi_n_258285.html)

A memo obtained by the Huffington Post confirms that the White House and the pharmaceutical lobby secretly agreed to precisely the sort of wide-ranging deal that both parties have been denying over the past week.

The memo, which according to a knowledgeable health care lobbyist was prepared by a person directly involved in the negotiations, lists exactly what the White House gave up, and what it got in return.

It says the White House agreed to oppose any congressional efforts to use the government's leverage to bargain for lower drug prices or import drugs from Canada -- and also agreed not to pursue Medicare rebates or shift some drugs from Medicare Part B to Medicare Part D, which would cost Big Pharma billions in reduced reimbursements.

In exchange, the Pharmaceutical Researchers and Manufacturers Association (PhRMA) agreed to cut $80 billion in projected costs to taxpayers and senior citizens over ten years. Or, as the memo says: "Commitment of up to $80 billion, but not more than $80 billion."

Representatives from both the White House and PhRMA, shown the outline, adamantly denied that it reflected reality. PhRMA senior vice president Ken Johnson said that the outline "is simply not accurate." "This memo isn't accurate and does not reflect the agreement with the drug companies," said White House spokesman Reid Cherlin.

Stories in the Los Angeles Times and the New York Times last week indicated that the administration was confirming that such a deal had been made.

Critics on Capitol Hill and online responded with outrage at the reports that Obama had gone behind their backs and sold the reform movement short. Furthermore, the deal seemed to be a betrayal of several promises made by then-Sen. Obama during the presidential campaign, among them that he would use the power of government to drive down the costs of drugs to Medicare and that negotiations would be conducted in the open.

And over the past several days, both the White House and PhRMA have offered a series of sometimes conflicting accounts of what happened in an attempt to walk back the story.

The White House meeting took place on July 7th, as first reported that evening in the Wall Street Journal. Also on the same day, a health care lobbyist following the talks was provided the outline of the deal by a person inside the negotiations. That outline had been floating around K Street before being obtained by the Huffington Post. In order to learn more about its origin, HuffPost agreed not to reveal the name of the lobbyist who originally received it.

"That is the PhRMA deal," said the lobbyist of the outline. He then clarified, "It was the PhRMA deal."

The deal, as outlined in the memo:

Commitment of up to $80 billion, but not more than $80 billion.
1. Agree to increase of Medicaid rebate from 15.1 - 23.1% ($34 billion)

2. Agree to get FOBs done (but no agreement on details -- express disagreement on data exclusivity which both sides say does not affect the score of the legislation.) ($9 billion)

3. Sell drugs to patients in the donut hole at 50% discount ($25 billion)
This totals $68 billion

4. Companies will be assessed a tax or fee that will score at $12 billion. There was no agreement as to how or on what this tax/fee will be based.

Total: $80 billion

In exchange for these items, the White House agreed to:

1. Oppose importation

2. Oppose rebates in Medicare Part D

3. Oppose repeal of non-interference

4. Oppose opening Medicare Part B
"Non-interference" is the industry term for the status quo, in which government-driven price negotiations are barred. In other words, the government is "interfering" in the market if it negotiates lower prices. The ban on negotiating was led through Congress in 2003 by then-Rep. Billy Tauzin (R-La.), who is now the head of PhRMA.

The rebates reference is to Medicare overpayments Big Pharma managed to wrangle from the Republican Congress that Democrats are trying to recoup. The House bill would require Big Pharma to return some of that money. The rebate proposal would save $63 billion over ten years, according to the Congressional Budget Office. The White House, given the chance, declined to tell the Wall Street Journal for a July 17th article that it supported the effort to pursue the rebates.

The Medicare Part B item refers to "infusion drugs," which can be administered at home. If they fall under Part B, Big Pharma gets paid more than under Part D. The agreement would leave infusion drugs in Part B.

In the section on Big Pharma's concessions, "FOBs" refers to follow-on biological drugs. Democrats have pushed to make it easier to allow generic drug makers to produce cheaper versions of such drugs, an effort Big Pharma has resisted. The Senate health committee bill gives drug makers 12 years of market exclusivity, five more than the White House proposed.

PhRMA's Johnson cast doubts on the provenance of the outline. "The memo, as described, is simply not accurate," he said in a statement. "Anyone could have written it. Unless it comes from our board of directors, it's not worth the paper it's written on. Clearly, someone is trying to short circuit our efforts to try and make health care reform a reality this year. That's not going to happen. Too much is at stake for both patients and the U.S. economy. Our new ads supporting health care reform are starting this week, and we are redoubling our efforts to drive awareness of why this issue is so important to America's future."

Johnson added that "no outside lobbyists -- not a single one -- were ever involved in our discussions with the Senate Finance Committee or the White House so someone is blowing smoke."

But the lobbyist who was given the outline defended its authenticity. And although the White House now says that drug price negotiations and reimportation were not actually discussed in the talks with PhRMA, the lobbyist said: "Well, that's bull -- that's baloney. That was part of the deal, for them not to push that."

The new uncertainty surrounding the deal comes after House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) has repeatedly said that her chamber is not bound by any agreement it is not a party to. On July 8th, the day after the Journal reported some elements of the deal, Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman Henry Waxman (D-Calif.) said in a public speech that his committee would not be tied down by the agreement.

Before recess, he followed through. His committee passed a bill that allowed for re-importation and drug-price negotiations.

In the Senate, Democrats Sherrod Brown (Ohio) and Byron Dorgan (N.D.) pressed White House officials at a closed-door meeting last week, asking whether the White House had tied the Senate's hands.

The health care lobbyist said that what deal still exists is uncertain, as a result of House pressure. "Now the White House is backing away from it, as you know, because of pressure from the House, because the House was not a party to the deal," he said. "The Speaker put enormous pressure on the White House, [saying], 'We weren't a party to it and we reserve the right to do whatever we want.' And which they did in the House Energy and Commerce Committee bill, which led the White House to say, 'Well, maybe it's not cast in concrete.'"

Obama is walking a tightrope here. He wants to keep PhRMA from opposing the bill, and benefits by having its support, which now includes a $150 million advertising campaign. That's a fortune in politics -- more than Republican presidential candidate John McCain spent on advertising during his entire campaign -- but it's loose change in the pharmaceutical business.

Opponents of the deal with PhRMA hope that Obama is playing a multilayered game, making a deal in order to keep the drug makers in his camp for now, but planning to double-cross them in the end if he needs to in order to pass his signature initiative.

Big Pharma, however, is still comfortable. "As far as the pharmaceutical industry, PhRMA and its member companies, yes, they say a deal is a deal. We'll see what happens," said the health care lobbyist.



In related news... http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columns/TimothyCarney/New-Chamber-index-shows-conservatives-arent-corporate-pawns-42379362.html



Zombie Acorn
Aug 13, 2009, 03:41 PM
I imagine we will see more and more of this type of thing as it unravels. Anything to get people on board.

spaceboots06
Aug 13, 2009, 05:12 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsuKhPbep70

thegoldenmackid
Aug 13, 2009, 05:14 PM
Hold on, wasn't our last vice-president the former head of this small business called Halliburton?

leekohler
Aug 13, 2009, 05:14 PM
That's bad. I predict this proposal will now go down in flames. It's going to have to be completely redone. When you try to please everyone, you please no one.

Thomas Veil
Aug 13, 2009, 05:47 PM
That's bad. I predict this proposal will now go down in flames. It's going to have to be completely redone. When you try to please everyone, you please no one.How pathetic. It takes this kind of back-door dealing just to keep the pharma industry from assailing the health care bill with millions of dollars of negative advertising? No, it doesn't look good for Obama, but it looks even worse for pharma. It confirms the industry is much, much too big for our own good.

This would be one case where I'd be in favor of the President going back on his word, i.e., telling the pharma industry what they want to hear and then going and doing what he wants anyway.

Zombie Acorn
Aug 13, 2009, 06:44 PM
Hold on, wasn't our last vice-president the former head of this small business called Halliburton?

I seem to remember people being up in arms about that. Either way this isn't really related unless Obama has a stake in the pharm industry, but it still looks bad that they are basically trying to buy them off.

Thomas Veil
Aug 13, 2009, 06:52 PM
Isn't paying off someone to stay away from your turf the sort of thing you usually see in, say, the Mafia?

"Youse got a nice little health care bill here, Mr. Obama. Be a shame if something were to happen to it. Isn't that right, Vinnie?"
"Yeah, yeah. Right, boss."

Zombie Acorn
Aug 13, 2009, 06:58 PM
Isn't paying off someone to stay away from your turf the sort of thing you usually see in, say, the Mafia?

"Youse got a nice little health care bill here, Mr. Obama. Be a shame if something were to happen to it. Isn't that right, Vinnie?"
"Yeah, yeah. Right, boss."

This is how politics works behind the scenes all the time. Got enough money to run ads and sway the public? You can get a piece of the pie.

opinioncircle
Aug 13, 2009, 07:03 PM
How pathetic. It takes this kind of back-door dealing just to keep the pharma industry from assailing the health care bill with millions of dollars of negative advertising? No, it doesn't look good for Obama, but it looks even worse for pharma. It confirms the industry is much, much too big for our own good.

This would be one case where I'd be in favor of the President going back on his word, i.e., telling the pharma industry what they want to hear and then going and doing what he wants anyway.

I agree with you, but most people (incl Fox News) will not see that.

leekohler
Aug 13, 2009, 09:42 PM
How pathetic. It takes this kind of back-door dealing just to keep the pharma industry from assailing the health care bill with millions of dollars of negative advertising? No, it doesn't look good for Obama, but it looks even worse for pharma. It confirms the industry is much, much too big for our own good.

This would be one case where I'd be in favor of the President going back on his word, i.e., telling the pharma industry what they want to hear and then going and doing what he wants anyway.

It still smells rotten.

Cleverboy
Aug 13, 2009, 09:55 PM
It still smells rotten. It smells rotten, but I think its crafty. I'm in favor of taking things in stages and building support bit-by-bit. So, for instance if we start off with simply reducing drug-costs, making insurance affordable/portable, not discriminate for pre-existing conditions, focus on advancing technology, and add in a public option... I think we're getting somewhere. Adding price-controls afterwards as part of additional changes I think would be the way to go. We don't even have to imagine the type of opposition health reform has to go up against. The unabashed ignorance is truly astounding without Big Pharma launching multi-million dollar ad campaigns to defeat the whole she-bang. I'm more irritated that end-of-life care compensation is losing support for the dumbest of reasons. Fear is such a resonating factor in all of this. Once confronted with the actual experience, people get used to it, and proponents can make a stronger case against fear-mongering the next step.

That's my theory anyway. Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I was listening to the outrage over the White House barring the Pentagon form using phrases like "war on terror" and calling 9/11 a "terror attack" (opting instead for a man-made disaster). I'm left thinking that its smart for the White House to stop giving these terrorists the kind of branding power they want, and making a strong case for asserting our own values and reason to our problems.

I just don't think the most likely course for success is a straight line or a game of connect-the-dots with only two dots. I think that was Deval Patrick's big mistake (and I mean BIG mistake).

~ CB

Iscariot
Aug 14, 2009, 08:30 AM
Hold on, wasn't our last vice-president the former head of this small business called Halliburton?

The sins of the father absolve those of the son?

OT: can't say I'm the least bit surprised.

Rodimus Prime
Aug 14, 2009, 08:52 AM
I can not say I am surprised. Our politation at the top are pretty corrupted. They will not really give a damn about you unless you are on their campaign financing list and even then you have to give quite a bit for them to listen to you.
This bring in yet again more proof we need massive campaign finance reform

leekohler
Aug 14, 2009, 09:09 AM
It smells rotten, but I think its crafty. I'm in favor of taking things in stages and building support bit-by-bit. So, for instance if we start off with simply reducing drug-costs, making insurance affordable/portable, not discriminate for pre-existing conditions, focus on advancing technology, and add in a public option... I think we're getting somewhere. Adding price-controls afterwards as part of additional changes I think would be the way to go. We don't even have to imagine the type of opposition health reform has to go up against. The unabashed ignorance is truly astounding without Big Pharma launching multi-million dollar ad campaigns to defeat the whole she-bang. I'm more irritated that end-of-life care compensation is losing support for the dumbest of reasons. Fear is such a resonating factor in all of this. Once confronted with the actual experience, people get used to it, and proponents can make a stronger case against fear-mongering the next step.

That's my theory anyway. Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I was listening to the outrage over the White House barring the Pentagon form using phrases like "war on terror" and calling 9/11 a "terror attack" (opting instead for a man-made disaster). I'm left thinking that its smart for the White House to stop giving these terrorists the kind of branding power they want, and making a strong case for asserting our own values and reason to our problems.

I just don't think the most likely course for success is a straight line or a game of connect-the-dots with only two dots. I think that was Deval Patrick's big mistake (and I mean BIG mistake).

~ CB

You are an optimist. The more this gets watered down, the less attractive it will be to anybody. If we want to import cheaper drugs from Canada, we should be able to. What happened to "competition" and the "free market"? Let's see what the drug companies do when they actually have to compete. That's the problem with insurance companies, drug companies and our healthcare system in general. They never have to compete.

Zombie Acorn
Aug 14, 2009, 11:56 AM
You are an optimist. The more this gets watered down, the less attractive it will be to anybody. If we want to import cheaper drugs from Canada, we should be able to. What happened to "competition" and the "free market"? Let's see what the drug companies do when they actually have to compete. That's the problem with insurance companies, drug companies and our healthcare system in general. They never have to compete.

I am all for open drug trade over the borders (or anywhere for that matter as long as they meet regulations). Same with health insurance, I wouldn't even care if some foreign private entity wanted to insure Americans if they thought they could do it at a lower cost.

freeny
Aug 14, 2009, 12:15 PM
It confirms the industry is much, much too big for our own good.

Agree 100%

I can also see the pharm companies talking out of both sides of their mouths... Agreeing to this plan on one side while pushing for its failure from the other...

leekohler
Aug 14, 2009, 12:33 PM
Agree 100%

I can also see the pharm companies talking out of both sides of their mouths... Agreeing to this plan on one side while pushing for its failure from the other...

Bingo. They aren't doing this out of the goodness of their hearts or because they care whether people live or die. And they definitely don't want this to pass.

zioxide
Aug 14, 2009, 01:01 PM
so is every politician

that is one of the biggest flaws in this country

Shivetya
Aug 14, 2009, 03:37 PM
How pathetic. It takes this kind of back-door dealing just to keep the pharma industry from assailing the health care bill with millions of dollars of negative advertising? No, it doesn't look good for Obama, but it looks even worse for pharma. It confirms the industry is much, much too big for our own good.

This would be one case where I'd be in favor of the President going back on his word, i.e., telling the pharma industry what they want to hear and then going and doing what he wants anyway.

What can you say when he took in 62% of all political donations from this group? (he = him and his party - early 2008 he was leading the pack in accepting donations from those in this industry). Don't blame him too much, the industry knows who is in power and moves its donations appropriately.

Iscariot
Aug 14, 2009, 04:22 PM
It confirms the industry is much, much too big for our own good.

(Can't believe I missed this). I think this is the biggest takeaway from what's happening. However, I can't curb my disappointment at Obama and the Democrats.

Counterfit
Aug 14, 2009, 08:17 PM
What can you say when he took in 62% of all political donations from this group? (he = him and his party - early 2008 he was leading the pack in accepting donations from those in this industry). Don't blame him too much, the industry knows who is in power and moves its donations appropriately.

You have a source for that figure? I have one (http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/indus.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00009638) that disagrees with you.

MyDesktopBroke
Aug 14, 2009, 08:27 PM
Yeah, I got fairly angry when I saw this.

Although I think this proves that the Huffington post is not just a liberal version of Fox News. They report everything with a liberal spin, but they will still report stories that are critical of Democrats and other liberals.

AP_piano295
Aug 15, 2009, 02:02 AM
What the hell are they (is he) thinking, the guy has the political clout, combined with a basically willing congress and senate and he goes to the drug companies and makes some half assed compromise. :confused:

I want a president with a spine please. :mad:

edit: Any pettions up and running yet to remind Obama who elected him and why?

designgeek
Aug 15, 2009, 02:09 AM
However, I can't curb my disappointment at Obama and the Democrats.

There's a reason why I'm liberal yet not a democrat. IMO they seem to get too little done in a period of time. Plus they mess up on things that shouldn't be messed up on.

Although I think this proves that the Huffington post is not just a liberal version of Fox News. They report everything with a liberal spin, but they will still report stories that are critical of Democrats and other liberals.

Yes. As one of my friends would say "it's what separates us from the animals" but that's someone else's opinion.;)

freeny
Aug 15, 2009, 08:46 AM
Yeah, I got fairly angry when I saw this.

Although I think this proves that the Huffington post is not just a liberal version of Fox News. They report everything with a liberal spin, but they will still report stories that are critical of Democrats and other liberals.

My thoughts exactly.

But to the story, it could easily looked at as Obama taking a Capitalist approach. The Republicans should be cool with that, right?

Desertrat
Aug 15, 2009, 09:16 AM
Why is anybody surprised? It's been known from the git-go about the familial relationships with the investment bank community. Geithner, Emanuel et al. And the Advisory Group for monetary policy which has led to the billions of your dollars funnelled to them--which then allow such as Goldman Sachs to declare profits. Compared to those corporations, the medical companies are little guys.

Remember, up until this present Big Bust, over 40% of ALL corporate profits in the US were in the financials. All other types of corporations in all other sectors got pieces of the remainder.

'Rat

designgeek
Aug 15, 2009, 01:12 PM
The Republicans should be cool with that, right?

If you ever watch Faux News you'd realize that the Republicans will never like anything he does.;) (see "The Beer Summit": Obama chose Budweiser which is owned by a Belgian company and thus "not buying American")

Wotan31
Aug 18, 2009, 08:18 AM
A politician from the most corrupt gangster city in the country? In bed with big business? That would never happen!!!!111!11one11 Obama is the Messiah!!1111!11!11eleven!!!!!!1

yg17
Aug 18, 2009, 08:30 AM
A politician from the most corrupt gangster city in the country? In bed with big business? That would never happen!!!!111!11one11 Obama is the Messiah!!1111!11!11eleven!!!!!!1

How about you go back to a high school civics class and learn what socialism actually is? Better yet, go try living in an actual socialist country for awhile, I always find the best way to really learn about something is to experience it for yourself.

hulugu
Aug 18, 2009, 01:12 PM
A politician from the most corrupt gangster city in the country? In bed with big business? That would never happen!!!!111!11one11 Obama is the Messiah!!1111!11!11eleven!!!!!!1

You're a silly person.

Muncher
Aug 18, 2009, 01:15 PM
A politician from the most corrupt gangster city in the country? In bed with big business? That would never happen!!!!111!11one11 Obama is the Messiah!!1111!11!11eleven!!!!!!1

Your attachment is very mature. Truly, a testament to the founding fathers' first amendment.

yg17
Aug 18, 2009, 02:04 PM
Your attachment is very mature. Truly, a testament to the founding fathers' first amendment.

Kinda wonder what the founding fathers would've done if they could see into the future:

"Hey, Ben, there's a problem with that freedom of speech thing."
"Yeah, what's that Tommy?"
"Well, I can predict that in 2009, a bunch of teabaggers are going to whine and claim that everything our government does is socialist even though it really isn't and compare the president to some guy named Hitler."
"Who the ****** is Hitler?"
"Some German dictator who killed 6 million Jews."
"Oh, wow...holy crap. We don't want that. Better get rid of that then."
"They're also going to bring assault rifles to appearances by the president."
"So, should we get rid of the right to bear arms as well?"
"Definitely, that sounds dangerous."

Rodimus Prime
Aug 18, 2009, 02:05 PM
How about you go back to a high school civics class and learn what socialism actually is? Better yet, go try living in an actual socialist country for awhile, I always find the best way to really learn about something is to experience it for yourself.

minus the socialism part of the of the picture everything else is true about politicians. They are just corrupt Gangsters

Shivetya
Aug 18, 2009, 03:22 PM
How about you go back to a high school civics class and learn what socialism actually is? Better yet, go try living in an actual socialist country for awhile, I always find the best way to really learn about something is to experience it for yourself.

Yeah, its far better than what he is doing, which borders on facism

yg17
Aug 18, 2009, 03:24 PM
Yeah, its far better than what he is doing, which borders on facism

Okay, you need to go back to school and pay attention during the lesson on socialism AND facism.

Wotan31
Aug 18, 2009, 04:06 PM
You're a silly person.
Yes, I know! :D
Your attachment is very mature. Truly, a testament to the founding fathers' first amendment.
Thank you, I do enjoy exercising my rights. :)

I find it quite humorous that folks such as yourself get their feathers all ruffled when "your guy" is portrayed negatively, and yet you were perfectly content and even bemused to see these same type of political cartoons of W when he was in office.

It's quite natural really, I'm not pointing any fingers here. Just sitting back and chuckling at human nature when the tables are turned. :D

Wotan31
Aug 18, 2009, 04:15 PM
Kinda wonder what the founding fathers would've done if they could see into the future:

"Hey, Ben, there's a problem with that freedom of speech thing."
"Yeah, what's that Tommy?"
"Well, I can predict that in 2009, a bunch of teabaggers are going to whine and claim that everything our government does is socialist even though it really isn't and compare the president to some guy named Hitler."
"Who the ****** is Hitler?"
"Some German dictator who killed 6 million Jews."
"Oh, wow...holy crap. We don't want that. Better get rid of that then."
"They're also going to bring assault rifles to appearances by the president."
"So, should we get rid of the right to bear arms as well?"
"Definitely, that sounds dangerous."

I'm an "intent of the law" kind of person rather than a "letter of the law" person, so I've got a different take on this.

"Hey Ben, there's a problem with this first amendment thing."
"Yeah, what's that Tommy?"
"Well, I can predict that in 2009, a bunch of teabaggers are going to misinterpret this amendment, and whine and claim that all mentions of the word "God" should be removed from public view. They want to eliminate religion from the public eye!"
"Well Tommy, we had the Protestant Reformation in mind when we wrote that, so that the US Gov't wouldn't pick sides in the whole Catholic vs. Protestant debate and end up with the Church of England all over again. The 1st amendment is there to protect people's right to worship, not to eliminate it"
"Good point Ben, too bad we didn't make that clearer".
"Agreed. Oh and they're going to try and twist the words around of the 2nd Amendment too, and take people's guns away!"
"Why would they do that? Are they going to ban swords, clubs, hammers, and really pointy forks too???"
"Damn, those idiots need everything spelled out for them, don't they!"
"They sure do Ben, they sure do."

Muncher
Aug 18, 2009, 06:07 PM
Yes, I know! :D

Thank you, I do enjoy exercising my rights. :)

We all do.

I find it quite humorous that folks such as yourself get their feathers all ruffled when "your guy" is portrayed negatively, and yet you were perfectly content and even bemused to see these same type of political cartoons of W when he was in office.

It's quite natural really, I'm not pointing any fingers here. Just sitting back and chuckling at human nature when the tables are turned. :D

I can't say I don't do some of that, but W was a funny man. I really don't have a problem with your poster other than that it's not very mature. It's when people start comparing either one to Stalin or Hitler that I'm not amused.