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Daveman Deluxe
Jul 12, 2004, 05:43 AM
OK, so this is not something I ordinarily do, but I'm going to explode if I don't get this out somehow.

Right, some of you know about my friend Becky who I met at the beginning of the school year. Those of you that know, know that she's one of my best friends--she's like a sister to me. There's a picture of me and her in the pics thread.

As of today, she's got a boyfriend.

And I've never been lonlier.

I'm not interested in her romantically. In fact, I've never been happier for her than I am today. And I know, and she's told me, that our friendship is not going to be changed. Privately, I know that if things really get serious, it'll change, but that's not a bad thing and it's not happening today.

It's not the future of our friendship that bothers me. Rather, it highlights the fact that I'm single. No girl has ever been interested in me. EVER. I don't even get a chance. I do well with the girls as friends. I have lots of girl friends, and they all think I'm really sweet... but it's like I give off an anti-pheremone that keeps anybody from being interested in me even before I have a chance to say hello.

I don't want to change who I am just to impress girls. I was once told by a girl, "You could get laid all the time if you tried." That's the thing... I'm not interested in changing myself just to get a girl. I mean... I want to change so I can be a better person, but I'm not going to change myself for the purpose of satisfying a girl.

Don't tell me to try a dating service. I'm not interested. I just... All I want is to fall in love with a girl who falls in love with me. Why's that so hard? Or, more specifically, why is it so damn hard for me? What is it about me that keeps me from ever having a chance with anybody?

I don't know what I'm looking for by writing this. I think I just needed to blow off steam. I'm not even all that interested in advice... I dunno. Respond as you will.

gwuMACaddict
Jul 12, 2004, 08:02 AM
how old are you? why the rush?

having lots of girl friends will come in handy for you one of these days, because you'll know how to treat the girl you're with. you'll understand her a lot better and things will work much better.

don't be in such a rush, enjoy having money, and spending time with the guys

jxyama
Jul 12, 2004, 08:46 AM
hate to say it, but a lot of times, it's just dumb luck. there's no "reason" and there's not much you can "do" to make it happen.

in the mean time, you can improve your chances as follows:

1) dress well, look neat, be clean and generally appear "pleasant" (note: this doesn't mean you must dress "preppy.")

2) diversify your interests, read a lot (books and news) and be knowledgeable about many things. this will make you interesting to talk to.

3) if needed, get in shape. also, find something you are good at and work hard at it so you will be very good. this will boost your self-confidence. improved self-confidence is the best way to improve your "chances."

good luck.

kgarner
Jul 12, 2004, 11:21 AM
I have to say that I agree with jxyama about it being just dumb luck. I was like you before, never had a girlfriend or anyone really interested in me. Then one day I met this girl and we just really hit it off. Now we've been married for over five years and things are still great. I would love to tell you there is some trick to it, but my experience has been that when the oppoortunity presents itself, you will know. Just be patient, but do try to get out there and give yourself opportunities.

Crikey
Jul 12, 2004, 12:29 PM
And a great way to give yourself chances is to place yourself where there are women. Women, more so than men, love to dance.

You should go out to Lakepark, about three miles north of Corvallis, on Monday night and check out the dance classes Trina teaches and the open dancing afterwards. Also, OSU has some great dance classes for credit, including interesting ones you wouldn't expect like Lindy Hop and zydeco. There is a free ballroom practice at the Women's Building on Tuesday nights, with an optional lesson beforehand for $1. Can't beat that!

Also, check this (http://www.uoregon.edu/~mlclark/calendar/) out.

Good luck, Daveman!


Crikey

Daveman Deluxe
Jul 12, 2004, 01:03 PM
Heh. Thanks for the replies. I actually felt a lot better after I woke up this morning.

Crikey: Actually, I've been taking the dance classes. Not really too keen on going to Lakepark, but I go to the OSU Ballroom dances when I can. And the practice in the WB is on Wednesdays now, so I can't go--other commitments.

blackfox
Jul 12, 2004, 01:24 PM
Hey Daveman, I noticed you live in Oregon (as do I)...perhaps that is the problem. Seriously. Since I moved here from Texas (Austin), I have noticed a much different dynamic than I have seen in the many other parts of the country I have lived in...especially in relation to Texas. As I am also, shall we say, unwilling to play the game, in order to get laid. Still, I find that girls in this state are difficult to read and a little less forthcoming in their advances...plus perhaps all the economic hardship has taken everyone out of the mood.

So my advice is two-fold...first, those who have said it is dumb-luck (in part), are correct, and in such cases, all you can really do is work on being the best person you can be. This is, of course, not for the wooing of women, but something that should be done for you. I do not know how old you are, but as you (and the women you may date) become older, these things will become more important, and you should do very well for yourself. Some of us are late-bloomers.
Second, if you don't want to play the game or change yourself, fine. Just simplify the game to your liking, ie take the initiative. Simply put, this all revolves around confidence. If you find someone you are attracted to, go for it...if you get rejected, try again. You have nothing to lose by trying. This approach does not preclude taking time and getting to know people, but niceness, while an admirable quality, can often be equated with passiveness, and will get you, generally speaking only friends. I am not suggesting you abandon this, only augment it with some risk-taking on the battlefield - whether it be the classroom, the bar, or whatever...

Also, if you live in Portland, perhaps I can help you out, or at least buy you a beer as consolation...anyway, I can relate to your predicament, and feel my advice to be relevant...take as you will, and good luck out there.

Daveman Deluxe
Jul 12, 2004, 01:43 PM
blackfox: Well, I've just gotten over a romantic interest of about nine months. I asked her out early on, but she wasn't interested. She was kind about it, and we're good friends now.

I agree with you about just asking out someone who I am attracted to.

Believe you me, if I were in Portland, I'd take you up on that beer. Sadly, I live in Corvallis. And I'm twenty years old, since that seems to be a common question.

blackfox
Jul 12, 2004, 02:05 PM
blackfox: Well, I've just gotten over a romantic interest of about nine months. I asked her out early on, but she wasn't interested. She was kind about it, and we're good friends now.

I agree with you about just asking out someone who I am attracted to.

Believe you me, if I were in Portland, I'd take you up on that beer. Sadly, I live in Corvallis. And I'm twenty years old, since that seems to be a common question.
Gotcha...well, you have plenty of time then...believe me, priorities in the dating scene can be downright shallow at that age, and I wouldn't take it personally. In fact, I would guess that many who acheive success dating by being young, attractive and popular, might run into trouble later when they, or the rules change...don't sweat it.

All it might take is a move and a couple years, and things will be very different. For now, take heart that you are blessed with good friends...

wdlove
Jul 12, 2004, 02:20 PM
Daveman Deluxe, I'm happy to hear that you are already feeling better this morning. That is a good sign. At 20 you are still a very young man. I also met many girls and we were just friends. Never got serious with a girl to I met my now wife of almost 30 years. I was 24 years old at the time. Please try to be patient. You seem to be a real nice guy. When you least expect you will meet that special someone also.

iJon
Jul 12, 2004, 02:28 PM
alright here we go. your first problem is becoming a friend. you are falling in the friends zone with every girl and being "sweet" and they loose all respect and interest for you. you say you never get a chance, i dont believe it. just like that girl says, you probably don't try. im not trying to be an ass but sometimes people need to hear it harshly. put yourself out there. start hitting on girls. unless your brad pitt or someone, the girls aren't going to come up to you and ask you on dates. start flirting with girls and being social with them. don't become (as my good friends calls them) they "gay friend."

If you are intimidated by real hot girls, start with average girls, maybe even girls you really don't want and socialize and conclude with getting their number. you don't have to call them, but it will be good practice and benefit your self confidence. i don't know you personally, but if i had to guess you cater to women to much and somewhat of a doormat in some cases. girls do like jerks, but you don't have to be a jerk to get them. i could sit her all day and try to offer helpfull tips but that will take to much time. your best friend is moving on and it sounds like you may not want exactly her, but someone who offers what she has. you can find it but the girls aren't going to come to you, so get off macrumors, go spif up and go hit on some chicks.

iJon

rendezvouscp
Jul 12, 2004, 03:44 PM
iJon, imo, I think you're wrong. Now I'm only 15, but I do have somewhat of an experience with girls. Since I was 8, I've hung out with mostly girls. I've been that "gay" guy, as you might say. But, it's turned out for the better for me. Yeah, I (and dave, at least I hope that's your name...) may be sweet, but that doesn't mean girls lose respect. I don't even think I'm remotely "cute," but I've had girls ask me out after being friends for a while. I would say it's a really good thing to be friends first, then date. But, that's only after being a friend to my current gf for about a year and a half, the going out with her for another year and a half (and still going).

Daveman, it's a really long wait. Some people never find it, but I think it's out there for almost anyone. There isn't anything wrong with you, it's the rest of the girls ;). Seriously, it's a matter of time. Think of it this way: somewhere in the next few years (let's say 5) you're going to meet her. You may not know, but it will be her.
–Chase

rueyeet
Jul 12, 2004, 04:28 PM
your first problem is becoming a friend. you are falling in the friends zone with every girl and being "sweet" and they loose all respect and interest for you. As much as it repels me, I'll have to agree at least a little bit with Mr. "Playa" iJon here. Not that you should instantly become just another predatory asshat with no interest in women other than getting laid. Believe me, we gals know plenty of those, and can spot 'em a mile away.

Don't get me wrong, I think overall it's good that you're the kind of guy a woman can be friends with. It says you're willing to treat a girl as a human being, that you can move beyond the limits of the stereotyped interactions of dating. You might actually be the kind of guy who listens to a girl because he's interested in what she has to say, not because he's hoping to skip to the good bits.

Problem is, that our society's gotten so blindsided by the view that being friends and being attracted to each other necessarily have to go in separate mental silos that people, both male and female, often don't pick up on sincere attraction if it's offered in a friendly demeanor.

Maybe a little more flirtation in your friendliness, while maintaining the ability to be a friend as well as a boyfriend, is what's called for. And keep in mind that the number of women who haven't been brainwashed by the idea that "friends <> relationship" is a bit of a smaller pool to draw from.

Hell, I wish on a regular basis that there were more guys out there who could be a friend withOUT having to be interested romantically first. Because when the romantic possibility is gone, the friendship goes too, and that sucks.

iJon
Jul 12, 2004, 04:29 PM
iJon, imo, I think you're wrong. Now I'm only 15, but I do have somewhat of an experience with girls. Since I was 8, I've hung out with mostly girls. I've been that "gay" guy, as you might say. But, it's turned out for the better for me. Yeah, I (and dave, at least I hope that's your name...) may be sweet, but that doesn't mean girls lose respect. I don't even think I'm remotely "cute," but I've had girls ask me out after being friends for a while. I would say it's a really good thing to be friends first, then date. But, that's only after being a friend to my current gf for about a year and a half, the going out with her for another year and a half (and still going)
.

.

Daveman, it's a really long wait. Some people never find it, but I think it's out there for almost anyone. There isn't anything wrong with you, it's the rest of the girls ;). Seriously, it's a matter of time. Think of it this way: somewhere in the next few years (let's say 5) you're going to meet her. You may not know, but it will be her.
–Chase
alright, im not going to shoot you down, appreciate the valid opinion. now i will take into consideration that you are 15 as well. i didn't get into the habit of serious dating until this past year ,and it will only get more serious once i get my own place to stay. now i can relate to you. i dated my best friend for 2-3 years, and were best friends for 2 years before that. it was perfect and i did all the things i am telling dave not to do. i know this because this is why our relationship ended, then i pulled my head out of my ass and got a clue. girls attitudes are going to change when you get into your later years.

as for you saying its the girls, yeah right. that makes it sound like he is above all and all the girls are not worth messing with. you say he will find his girl in the next 5 years and i agree with that. only problem i see, is that i would like to have dated many women and have a good idea of what i want. when i was with my girlfriend in high school i thought she had it all and was perfect for me, thats cause i never knew anything else better was out there.

dave, in the meantime i advice taking a look at the advice on askmen.com. i first started reading it with a grain of salt but it soon made sense. i compared with my own beliefs when dating and i learned about myself, why my relationship ended with my girlfriend, how to do better in the dating scene and how to make my future relationships better. i even talk about their teachings with my older co-workers (male and female) who are much more experienced and wiser than me, and they even. if you even read their forums the girls agree with his concepts on dating. worth reading if your open to learning.

iJon

Daveman Deluxe
Jul 12, 2004, 04:29 PM
Heh. Thanks again for all the replies and such, folks. I really appreciate it.

iJon, I think you're onto something about "putting myself out there". I'm not very comfortable with hitting on girls--it's just not something in my personality. But I think it would do me some good to be more social, even maybe ask a girl on a date just to go on a date. And I'm not a doormat. I just hang out with girls and talk to them and they seem to like me OK.

rendezvouscp: There's a lot to be said for being good friends with a girl before going out with her. Of course, it's not the only way to have a really good romantic relationship. I have a friend who's going to marry the girl he's with right now (they're just waiting for another year for her to finish college), and they started out as just a summertime fling before heading off to college. Another friend who got married last week--he was a rebound boyfriend after she went through a nasty breakup with another guy.

wdlove, thanks for the encouragement. I'm always amazed at just how much you really care about people.

iJon
Jul 12, 2004, 04:42 PM
Heh. Thanks again for all the replies and such, folks. I really appreciate it.

iJon, I think you're onto something about "putting myself out there". I'm not very comfortable with hitting on girls--it's just not something in my personality. But I think it would do me some good to be more social, even maybe ask a girl on a date just to go on a date. And I'm not a doormat. I just hang out with girls and talk to them and they seem to like me OK.

good, im glad you understand what im saying. girls like to around the social outgoing. its kind of like the retail business i am in. if i dont go help that customer or make an effort, they probably aren't going to buy a mac from me.

as for what rueyeet said about me, im glad a girl agrees. no i am not saying be an asshat. the problem with most guys is they are friendly, but become to friendly to fast. what you do is be friendly, but causually get their phone number. they like what you have to offer, but don't know much about you, thus they agree to a date. along with the romance and boyfriend like material comes the friendship, you just have the order mixed up. here is a personal example of mine.

this past christmas break a girl in class and i started talking online. we had a fun time talking but i could notice she was getting somewhat close to me, venting about her boyfriend. this was a bad sign, so i didn't cater to her that much. i would say "that's to bad" and change the topic. i could tell she was mad at her boyfriend, and she was somewhat interested in me. i invited her to a local film festival where my parents where sponsors. it was pretty much a date but i never called it one. i drove her homeand without her permission or anything i kissed her, she responded back. after that we became great friends, BUT i kept it romantically interesting and physical. we eventually started to date and become an offical couple.

now when iwas 15 and early on in high school i was much like you, and that 15 year old posting on here. i would have never approached a girl in the way i described above. i would try to become their best friend and listen to them when they say their boyfriend is an ass, hoping they would see me as a potential boyfriend. time went on and askmen taught me what i didnt know.

dave, you got the right idea, you don't need to change yourself, just add some things here and there and change the order in which you approach girls and i bet you will soon have successs.

iJon

wPod
Jul 12, 2004, 04:48 PM
stop trying!!! girls have a magical 'desperate guy' sensors. so as soon as they tell you are out to find a girl they all know to stay away. the bad side of it is as soon as you stop looking they end up fighting over you (like if you get a gf. . . they see you as a stable and nice guy and cant resist you). but seriously, take two months. and dont think about girls in a 'girlfriend' manner. be happy with who you are and where you are in life. the couple serious gfs ive had (serious means more than one year relationship) i have met when i have NOT been activly looking! (but i got rejected like 50 times b/w when i was trying!) if you are happy and not desperate you will deffinitly get the interest of a girl. but do maintain relationships with other girls, as friends. . . they will inevitably introduce you to more girls!!!

rendezvouscp
Jul 12, 2004, 05:08 PM
iJon: seeing a few more of your posts on this topic, I agree with what you're saying totally. Oh, btw, when I said it was the girls, I was joking. Didn't mean to come off serious.
–Chase

LethalWolfe
Jul 12, 2004, 06:06 PM
alright here we go. your first problem is becoming a friend. you are falling in the friends zone with every girl and being "sweet" and they loose all respect and interest for you. you say you never get a chance, i dont believe it. just like that girl says, you probably don't try. im not trying to be an ass but sometimes people need to hear it harshly. put yourself out there. start hitting on girls. unless your brad pitt or someone, the girls aren't going to come up to you and ask you on dates. start flirting with girls and being social with them. don't become (as my good friends calls them) they "gay friend."

If you are intimidated by real hot girls, start with average girls, maybe even girls you really don't want and socialize and conclude with getting their number. you don't have to call them, but it will be good practice and benefit your self confidence. i don't know you personally, but if i had to guess you cater to women to much and somewhat of a doormat in some cases. girls do like jerks, but you don't have to be a jerk to get them. i could sit her all day and try to offer helpfull tips but that will take to much time. your best friend is moving on and it sounds like you may not want exactly her, but someone who offers what she has. you can find it but the girls aren't going to come to you, so get off macrumors, go spif up and go hit on some chicks.

iJon

My spin (maybe clarification) on part of what iJon is saying. Girls don't like jerks, exactly, but they like guys who are confident and aggressive (willing to take the first step/get the ball rolling). And jerks are typically confident and aggressive because they are too ignorant and/or egotistical not to be. So be confident and aggressive, but not a dick.

Your other approaches kind of depend on what your goal is. Are you looking for a piece of @ss? A fun fling? A serious relationship?

wPod also brings up a good point. Desperation is bad. A zealous desire to do everything to please is bad.


Lethal

Pheonix
Jul 12, 2004, 06:12 PM
stop trying!!! girls have a magical 'desperate guy' sensors. so as soon as they tell you are out to find a girl they all know to stay away. the bad side of it is as soon as you stop looking they end up fighting over you (like if you get a gf. . . they see you as a stable and nice guy and cant resist you). but seriously, take two months. and dont think about girls in a 'girlfriend' manner. be happy with who you are and where you are in life. the couple serious gfs ive had (serious means more than one year relationship) i have met when i have NOT been activly looking! (but i got rejected like 50 times b/w when i was trying!) if you are happy and not desperate you will deffinitly get the interest of a girl. but do maintain relationships with other girls, as friends. . . they will inevitably introduce you to more girls!!!
I'm getting magical desperate guy sendrom :(
I noticed girls aren't interested in myself because they consider me dull, boring, square, etc. They go out with fun and exciting guys and then cry later when they are pregnant and Mr. Fun has moved on because she quit being so fun herself.
30 years old and the only women I've been able to hook up with are the ones I wouldn't want around for long durations. I'm not asking too much just someone who actually wants me for me and not some ulterior motive.

Daveman Deluxe
Jul 13, 2004, 01:24 AM
Well, I talked on the phone with Becky tonight. Talked out a lot of the stuff that I've been going through with the whole lonliness thing. It helped a lot. I'm still feeling pretty down right now, but it's not going to last forever. :) Thanks for the advice, everybody, it really helped me... it helped me think some things through.

iJon
Jul 13, 2004, 10:20 AM
Well, I talked on the phone with Becky tonight. Talked out a lot of the stuff that I've been going through with the whole lonliness thing. It helped a lot. I'm still feeling pretty down right now, but it's not going to last forever. :) Thanks for the advice, everybody, it really helped me... it helped me think some things through.
thats good that you talked to her. she is happy with someone, now we need to work on finding you someone. now go get your buddies and go have some fun. go camping, canoeing, skydiving, anything outgoing and fun and you will start to feel better. as for feeling better about girls, here's an idea i always reccommend. just drive to some town near by where no one will know you, and just start associating with girls. its like a clean start. no one will know you, your past, what your like. only thing they will know about you is your first impression you give off. you might be surprised at the results, I reccommend it. now stop worrying about (she will be fine) and go do something fun.

iJon

rueyeet
Jul 13, 2004, 02:00 PM
When I used to complain to my mom about not meeting guys, she'd basically tell me: Get out more. Volunteer, take classes, do activities, join clubs, etc. Put yourself out among people and you'll not only increase your chances of meeting someone, but you'll improve your people skills, have fun, and possibly learn something.

One caveat to that, of course, is don't make meeting someone the sole reason for what you're doing. And it isn't just girls who have the magical "desperation" sense...for any person of either gender the reaction is pretty much the same: they'll be repelled, or they will take advantage of it. The second one is worse, if you ask me.

18thTomorrow
Jul 13, 2004, 10:38 PM
If you are intimidated by real hot girls, start with average girls, maybe even girls you really don't want and socialize and conclude with getting their number. you don't have to call them, but it will be good practice and benefit your self confidence.

iJon

iJon, that is one of the dumbest things I've heard you say...
I'm an average girl. Average-to-short height, average weight, average abilities, above average intelligence which is made up with below average performance in athletics. I do NOT want some guy hitting on me for "practice", getting me all involved and hopeful just for his kicks. That is such a selfish, loserly thing to do.

Daveman, I could have written your original post. Except I'm a girl and my best firend just got a boyfriend. And things just aren't the same anymore. I'm extremely happy for her, just as you seem to be for your friend, however it only accentuates the fact that I'm alone. The things she and I used to do together all of a sudden have become a threesome, and I fit in just about as well as a third nostril...

I don't think there's anything wrong with your being a friend to girls. You may consider me old-fashioned or loony, but I doubt I would go out with a guy if he just asked me out of the blue because he thought I was hott or smart or whatever. I want to know him--the real him, not the mask he puts on for dating--before we become involved romantically. When I marry, I want to marry my best friend, not just someone who causes physical sparks. (Wait...and by marrying my best friend I don't mean I want to marry the gal I mentioned in the previous paragraph... :rolleyes: )

And again, this may be way off base, especially in the 21st century, but I really do expect the guy to make the first move. Telling a guy I liked him and asking him out or whatever...way not cool. That's his job. You'd be surprised how many girls think this way. Are you sure you don't have any potential girlfriends among your girl friends? Just a thought.

Misery loves company. Thanks for your post. I feel better just knowing I'm not the only person in the world in this situation.

Best wishes
Britt

iJon
Jul 13, 2004, 10:57 PM
iJon, that is one of the dumbest things I've heard you say...
I'm an average girl. Average-to-short height, average weight, average abilities, above average intelligence which is made up with below average performance in athletics. I do NOT want some guy hitting on me for "practice", getting me all involved and hopeful just for his kicks. That is such a selfish, loserly thing to do
loserly huh? even more so than getting online and complaining about being lonely and telling the guy everything will work out continuning this way when it probably wont. didnt think so.

from reading your post you sound like you would hate to be hit on by any guy, but thats my opinion. dave has a problem and we are trying to fix it. whether you like my advice or not, its advice none the less.he is intimidated by girls, nothing wrong with that though. All i am telling him to do is to be social with girls, practice getting numbers. its not dumb, its beneficial. what would you recommend, cater to all his friends and wait for that day (which will never come) that they want him.

the odds of going from friends to a relationship is very slim. it can happen but a lot must be put on the line and can be better than imagined or worse. you say you wouldn't go out with a guy if he asked you out of the blue, well thats no fun and it will help add to your "loneliness if you ask me." in no way am i trying to put you down, i am just trying to help dave put the odds in his favor, and i feel his current practices and your advice limit that.

if you ask me its called old fashioned for a reason and you are right, it is the 21st century, times have changed :)

iJon

themadchemist
Jul 13, 2004, 11:02 PM
if you ask me its called old fashioned for a reason and you are right, it is the 21st century, times have changed :)


No, if it were old-fashioned, Dave would meet the young lady at a ball and then go smoke a cigar with her father. Dave'd tell her old man that he's got an extremely successful cotton plantation and a little strategic partnership could help both men corner the market. The man would pause and smile and then say, "Well, sonny, I think you might have a point." They'd work out the details for a dowry and the happy couple would get married in the Spring.

iJon
Jul 13, 2004, 11:04 PM
No, if it were old-fashioned, Dave would meet the young lady at a ball and then go smoke a cigar with her father. Dave'd tell her old man that he's got an extremely successful cotton plantation and a little strategic partnership could help both men corner the market. The man would pause and smile and then say, "Well, sonny, I think you might have a point." They'd work out the details for a dowry and the happy couple would get married in the Spring.
haha, speaking of cigars, i could use one.

iJon

jenniff
Jul 13, 2004, 11:08 PM
Well, I talked on the phone with Becky tonight. Talked out a lot of the stuff that I've been going through with the whole lonliness thing. It helped a lot. I'm still feeling pretty down right now, but it's not going to last forever. :) Thanks for the advice, everybody, it really helped me... it helped me think some things through.

Don't be sad. Embrace your singleness!

When I was regularly dating someone, at my young age, I just wasn't happy.

Just think of all the benefits of singleness:
-No need to be attached to one person
-You can travel anywhere you want, without having to schedule it around another person
-You can spend your money on yourself
-You can hang out with your friends whenever you want
-Since you are friends with girls, you can hang out with girls without a significant other getting jealous
-No commitment
-No worrying about hurt feelings
-No risk of having the sig. other turn psycho and having random arguments about random unimportant things
-No scheduling your life around someone else's schedule

There's tons of awesome things with singleness. You have the rest of your life to be married and whatnot. Twenty is young, go on a roadtrip or something, or backpack Europe, or something else that's fun that you couldn't do if you had someone else attached to your life.

iJon
Jul 13, 2004, 11:11 PM
i cosign with jenniff. thats how i have been all year and its been wonderful.i feel a year has been enough and as soon as college starts it will be time to settle back down in a relationship, but damn will i miss once i change. i feel the key is just making the most out of any situation you are in, whether single, taken, dumped or whatever.

iJon

nospleen
Jul 13, 2004, 11:31 PM
Daveman, quick, PM Britt. She sounds sweet to me. :D Just kidding, best of luck to the both of you. You both sound like wonderful people to me.

Daveman Deluxe
Jul 14, 2004, 12:08 AM
Britt, thanks for the response. I've been blown off by so many friends who find themselves attached that it's really gotten old. Strange thing, though, Becky told me she doesn't want our friendship to change one bit. She actually told me that she wants my friendship even more dearly now that she's together with Josh... weird, and I know it won't be that way forever if they stay together for awhile, but I'll not complain.

I think that I'm going to go somewhere between Britt and iJon in how I approach things. I'm going to be more social and whatnot, but in all honesty, I'm personally not in favor of asking out a girl I just met (actually, I can't remember the last time I was even attracted to somebody I just met). But I don't have to be really awesome friends that I've known for years to ask her out either. I'm just going to ask out whomever I'm attracted to, and see how it goes.

And a friend told me that the best way to be happily attached is to be happily single. How true that is! And there are some girls I'm friends with that I could maybe go out with, but nobody jumps out at me yet. Maybe that'll change soon. Who knows...

And, Britt, I don't think you're way off base. There are guys who are attracted to girls like you. I know I am. For what it's worth, you sound a lot like Becky in your approach to guys, and it seems to be paying off for her ATM. :D

iJon
Jul 14, 2004, 01:42 AM
good call. i was you i would do something similar. going from this to asking out girls is a huge jump, proably to hard and uncomfortable. i just work on the social aspects. along with you will develop confidence, and then once you notice a girl that might be interested in you, you can make the right decisions, example being getting the digits, going out on a casual date and so forth. so just go hang with the guys and just be more outgoing, and im suer we will all agree on that on this board just being more social is a good first step.

iJon

absolut_mac
Jul 14, 2004, 01:53 AM
And again, this may be way off base, especially in the 21st century, but I really do expect the guy to make the first move. Telling a guy I liked him and asking him out or whatever...way not cool. That's his job. You'd be surprised how many girls think this way. Are you sure you don't have any potential girlfriends among your girl friends? Just a thought.

Hey Dave, as my best friend always used to say to me "The worst thing that a girl can say to you is *no*", so go ahead and don't be shy to ask any girl out.

While I never did date as much as he did - and still don't :) - this December will be our 25th wedding anniversary.

Hey Britt, no need to be miserable. Happiness likes company too :)

Good luck you two!

iJon
Jul 14, 2004, 01:55 AM
Hey Dave, as my best friend always used to say to me "The worst thing that a girl can say to you is *no*", so go ahead and don't be shy to ask any girl out.

While I never did date as much as he did - and still don't :) - this December will be our 25th wedding anniversary.

Hey Britt, no need to be miserable. Happiness likes company too :)

Good luck you two!
very true. dating can somewhat of a gambling game and rejection is part of it. if you can't handle rejection dating is really doing to be hard.

iJon

18thTomorrow
Jul 14, 2004, 10:12 AM
loserly huh? even more so than getting online and complaining about being lonely and telling the guy everything will work out continuning this way when it probably wont. didnt think so.

from reading your post you sound like you would hate to be hit on by any guy, but thats my opinion. dave has a problem and we are trying to fix it. whether you like my advice or not, its advice none the less.he is intimidated by girls, nothing wrong with that though. All i am telling him to do is to be social with girls, practice getting numbers. its not dumb, its beneficial. what would you recommend, cater to all his friends and wait for that day (which will never come) that they want him.

the odds of going from friends to a relationship is very slim. it can happen but a lot must be put on the line and can be better than imagined or worse. you say you wouldn't go out with a guy if he asked you out of the blue, well thats no fun and it will help add to your "loneliness if you ask me." in no way am i trying to put you down, i am just trying to help dave put the odds in his favor, and i feel his current practices and your advice limit that.

if you ask me its called old fashioned for a reason and you are right, it is the 21st century, times have changed :)

iJon

First of all, I think it's nice of you to offer Daveman (and perhaps myself...) advice. I agree with you when you say it's better than just pretending things will work out as they are. They may. They may not.

I wouldn't "hate to be hit on by any guy". I enjoy flirting as much as the next girl. What I wouldn't enjoy is someone who acts like they like me, even gets my number, and then forgets anything ever happened, because it was just "practice." HOwever, I do agree with your advice to get out, meet more people, be social with other girls. Develop a wide circle of friends/acquaintences. Not in the hopes of finding a gf/bf, but just because of how much it can enrich your life to know other people. Getting to know a girl isn't rude; it's how relationships come about! However, in my opinion leading her on with no intention of calling her is rude.

And perhaps i should qualify what I said in my last post, about knowing a guy before I date him. We don't have to be best friends or bosom buddies who know each other inside out before beginning the romantic relationship; you're right. Going from a best friend relationship to a romantic relationship could ruin a lot of good and put a lot on the line. All I really want is to know the guy from some previous encounters in a casual situation--the friend of a friend who I hang with at a party, the guy who sits across the aisle in class, or something like that. I like to have a casual relationship before investing more.


And Daveman, I've gotten blown off by lots of friends recently, too. I hang with a group of about 20 people who have known each other for a long time. All of a sudden, *everyone* has significant others, and I don't. It's the wierdest feeling.

Jennif, thanks for listing the advantages of singleness. You're right, there are many positives.

Happiness loves company, too

:)

Britt

rueyeet
Jul 14, 2004, 02:58 PM
I do NOT want some guy hitting on me for "practice", getting me all involved and hopeful just for his kicks. That is such a selfish, loserly thing to do.Not only that, but remember that magical "desperation sense" we were talking about? Any gal worth her brain cells has that same sense for a guy who's just after what he can get. It takes a little more time, but not that much more, to figure out where a guy's focus is, unless the guy in question would make a great con artist.

Some girls are flattered by any attention, even if it's just to be played for whatever they'll put out, and will go along with anything. I'm not one of them, and from the sound of it neither is Britt, or Daveman's Becky (or probably anyone Daveman would want to be dating).

I also don't think Dave's is a confidence issue, just a communication issue. Any guy who can genuinely be friends with a woman is probably less "intimidated" by them than the kind of guy who feels the need to separate his relationships from his friendships. It's just that to take things beyond friendship, an effort has to be made to specifically convey romantic interest. The cues have to be there for others to pick up on before they'll come to you, and a lot of that actually happens on the same subconscious level that processes body language.

I think Dave's got the solution--"I'm just going to ask out whomever I'm attracted to, and see how it goes." Can't think of anything better to do than that! And best of luck....though be aware that it might take a bit longer to meet a woman who's happy to be thought of first and foremost as a human being rather than a "real hot" girl.

And yeah, single-hood IS pretty cool. I'm currently quite happy to be single, personally, even if everyone in my immediate social circle is pairing off and popping out babies. I hear you on the wierdness factor, Britt!....though some of mine comes from being so absolutely certain that I don't actually want what everyone around me is doing.... :D