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mrviga
Jul 14, 2004, 10:51 AM
Ok, so to my surprise, I get my new Airport Express today, 2 days earlier than expected. I open it up and play with it a little and I can't quite figure out a few things.

I get it all set up and I'm playing music on it wirelessly, pretty cool huh? Well, I notice that I have been logged out of the wireless network I have set up using a D-Link router and that I've been logged into the Airport Express wireless network that has no ethernet plugged into it. So I guess for now you can only connect to one wireless network at a time, and I have to choose either internet connection or music......poopy...very poopy.

I know that the product is brand new and I am one of the first to get it, and I have only played around with it for about 15 mins, but still. Theres only so much I can think of to get this thing to work the way I want it too.

I understand that it may not be able to boost/extend the signal of a wireless router other than the Airport Extreme, but they must have assumed that many people dont use the Airport Extreme Basestation and will want to connect to their existing network and the airport express network at the same time. What am I doing wrong?

Thanks...

P.S. Sorry for the long post.....:)

kgarner
Jul 14, 2004, 11:04 AM
Try looking through this (http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=108038#1). It says that you can't use it to extend a third party router, but there may be something else you can do. Look through there and see if anything looks helpful.

robbieduncan
Jul 14, 2004, 11:07 AM
I think you want client mode (http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=108040).

slowtreme
Jul 14, 2004, 11:37 AM
I understand that it may not be able to boost/extend the signal of a wireless router other than the Airport Extreme, but they must have assumed that many people dont use the Airport Extreme Basestation and will want to connect to their existing network and the airport express network at the same time. What am I doing wrong?
It's true, you can't connect to two wireless devices at the same time from a single NIC/WAR. What you want to do is connect to your WAP (D-LINK) and have the AEx connect to the WAP as a client. Then you will be able to send your music to that device through the WAP.
Mac -> WAP -> AEx.

I think it's pretty crappy that Apple has limited the Repeater function to only Airport/AE WAPs. Maybe they imposed this just so they don't oversell like iPod minis :)

Sabbath
Jul 14, 2004, 11:52 AM
Congrats on receiving your express, I'm still waiting for mine to ship, as others have suggested I think you want the client mode to get it to join your current network and stream music.

Any other exciting info you can give us?

crees!
Jul 14, 2004, 12:25 PM
I think it's pretty crappy that Apple has limited the Repeater function to only Airport/AE WAPs. Maybe they imposed this just so they don't oversell like iPod minis :) From what I heard Apple did not limit wireless to just Airport Extreme / Express. The protocol used has not been adopted yet so they can't guarantee it to work with non-Apple routers. Simple as that, that's what I heard, but I might be wrong.

That is just for wireless though. What I believe you can do is plug an ethernet cable from your D-Link router into the Airport Express WAN port. Then it will become part of your home network and you should have both internet and streaming music at the same time. And it should extend your wireless network as a "hotspot" that way as well.

Give that a try and let everyone know.

mrviga
Jul 14, 2004, 01:18 PM
Well, I got the Express to work, which is a good thing. I just can't seem to get the 2 to work in harmony. I tried to make the express a repeater for my D-Link wireless basestation, and it wouldnt let me even attempt the setup. It checks for what the device is, (Apple or not), not what the thing does. :p

Ill try some more when I get home later tonight, but I may break down and jsut have Apple walk me through it. This is very odd, as I am new to computers, and I am fairly sure I am doing things right. Oh well, Ill keep everyone posted....

Thanks for all the help! :) :)

crees!
Jul 14, 2004, 01:40 PM
Well, I got the Express to work, which is a good thing. I just can't seem to get the 2 to work in harmony. I tried to make the express a repeater for my D-Link wireless basestation, and it wouldnt let me even attempt the setup. It checks for what the device is, (Apple or not), not what the thing does. :p

Ill try some more when I get home later tonight, but I may break down and jsut have Apple walk me through it. This is very odd, as I am new to computers, and I am fairly sure I am doing things right. Oh well, Ill keep everyone posted....

Thanks for all the help! :) :) When you get home try what I said in the previous post and see if that solves things. Just plug a line from your router to Airport Express. Granted your stereo might be in / on a different floor / room than your D-Link. If so, just to test it bring AE in the same room as the router and hook it up as such. I'm interested to hear if this works as I'm looking to purchase one and that will be how my setup is.

mrviga
Jul 14, 2004, 05:16 PM
Ok, so I hooked my D-Link router up to the Airport express using a ethernet cable, and it worked, only because I now the only thing I am connected to is the Airport Express. Unfortunately, the speakers are in a totally different room than the router. Bummer....

I still havent tried for my best, so I may be able to pull this off eventually :)

Ill report back with any updates....

Anyone with any similar stories please post. I want to get this resolved so I can use my new toy!

vga4life
Jul 14, 2004, 05:21 PM
Ok, so I hooked my D-Link router up to the Airport express using a ethernet cable, and it worked, only because I now the only thing I am connected to is the Airport Express. Unfortunately, the speakers are in a totally different room than the router. Bummer...

Yo, reading is fundamental!

YOU WANT CLIENT MODE! SEE http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=108040 FOR THE SCOOP!

The third poster in this thread solved your problem already.

-vga4life

crees!
Jul 14, 2004, 05:23 PM
Ok, so I hooked my D-Link router up to the Airport express using a ethernet cable, and it worked, only because I now the only thing I am connected to is the Airport Express. Unfortunately, the speakers are in a totally different room than the router. Bummer....

I still havent tried for my best, so I may be able to pull this off eventually :)

Ill report back with any updates....

Anyone with any similar stories please post. I want to get this resolved so I can use my new toy!

If your stereo is small enough you could try hooking it up in the room with your router. If it works with both net and your stereo then maybe you can buy a long cable to reach the other room. As this will be my exact setup too.

crees!
Jul 14, 2004, 05:26 PM
Yo, reading is fundamental!

YOU WANT CLIENT MODE! SEE http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=108040 FOR THE SCOOP!

The third poster in this thread solved your problem already.

-vga4life

For me I would like to extend my wireless network since my signal isn't full in my room. But yes, after reading that info doc client mode is the way to go for you mrviga, unless you need to extend your wireless range.

comictimes
Jul 14, 2004, 05:43 PM
So wait, I just want to make sure I understand this before I buy and airport express, which I plan to do in the near future. These problems are mainly just if you're already using some other sort of wireless network? Since I'm currently wired the airport express will work as an airport base station as well as being able to connect to my speakers, right?

Jalexster
Jul 14, 2004, 05:55 PM
Right, let me try and explain this for you:

If you connect an AirPort Express unit to a 3rd party network or an AirPort (any kind) network, using Client mode, it can ONLY:
1. Stream Audio
2. Share a Printer

If you connect an AirPort Express unit to an AirPort Extreme or Express network, using WDS, it can:
1. Stream Audio
2. Share a Printer
3. Extend the range of your wireless network
4. Act as an Ethernet-to-Wireless bridge (because the knowladge base articals state that the ethernet port acts as a LAN port if it's set as a Remote WDS unit)

Right, you only want the first option, so you have to set the AirPort Express Unit as a client. Then it can join the D-Link's Network.

Why don't people listen? Others are giving ideas for a problem we have already worked out a solution to!

You don't need to extend your wireless network (and if you do, you didn't say so), so client mode is perfect.

Now please don't ignore this post, like people have ignored my posts in other topics, and like how people have ignored all the posts of people who know about client mode in this topic.

Edit: The AirPort Express is a Print-Server, Audio Streaming device, a Wireless Access Point, A DHCP server, A PPPoE client, and a few other things. It will do everything you need. It will also happiliy add wireless to a existing wired network (that has a router). Read my explanation above, for a quick run down of what it can do, in which configuaration. That should answer everyone's questions.

bullrat
Jul 14, 2004, 08:43 PM
Thanks for the warning on the AE. I was going to buy one to extend my D-Link network. A back room has a weaker signal, as router is on the opposite side of the house. Leave it to Apple to ignore standards and make this only work with their own equipment. Sheesh :rolleyes:

mrviga
Jul 14, 2004, 08:57 PM
Ok, so I called apple and I talked to a dude for about an hour trying to resolve this issue. He couldn't. We tried everything, and I mean EVERYTHING to make this stupid thing work.

Now, first of all, I am not ignoring you. I tried your idea, and it did not work. Client mode gave me the ability to broadcast music/priont, but it did not allow me to have an active internet connection. I have tried every way imaginable of making this thing work properly and it simply wont. I am very dissapointed.

So right now, the Airport Express is a $119 paperweight sitting on my desk. I know the thing will work eventually, even if I have to do a little reconfiguring of my speaker/router setup...it's just a little disappointing to know that something that should work won't.

I will get it to work, that I can promise you all. When is the question. If anyone has any other ideas, or is facing a similar problem, please help me out. I'm desperate for ideas. Thanks for the help guys.

Jalexster
Jul 14, 2004, 09:24 PM
Is your internet connection hooked into the AirPort Express unit, or your D-Link unit?

If it's the AirPort Express unit, dont forget to configure it to work with your modem. If you have a DSL connection, you may need to copy your PPPoE settings over.

If your internet connection (broadband modem) is hooked to your D-Link unit, you need to make the AirPort Express join the D-Link's network in client mode, and join the D-Link's network from your laptop, do not join the AirPort Express's network. The AirPort Express unit's features will be accesable through the D-Link network, because the AirPort express unit is part of the D-Link network, as a client.

I really hope that makes sense.

RBMaraman
Jul 14, 2004, 09:27 PM
Ok, so I called apple and I talked to a dude for about an hour trying to resolve this issue. He couldn't. We tried everything, and I mean EVERYTHING to make this stupid thing work.

Now, first of all, I am not ignoring you. I tried your idea, and it did not work. Client mode gave me the ability to broadcast music/priont, but it did not allow me to have an active internet connection. I have tried every way imaginable of making this thing work properly and it simply wont. I am very dissapointed.

So right now, the Airport Express is a $119 paperweight sitting on my desk. I know the thing will work eventually, even if I have to do a little reconfiguring of my speaker/router setup...it's just a little disappointing to know that something that should work won't.

I will get it to work, that I can promise you all. When is the question. If anyone has any other ideas, or is facing a similar problem, please help me out. I'm desperate for ideas. Thanks for the help guys.

Ok, so you bought the AirPort Express to extend your wireless network from a 3rd-Party router even though Apple said it wouldn't do it, and your mad that Apple was right? Is that correct? I just want to make sure I have the facts right.

I've posted in at least 5 different threads that I contacted Apple and they assured me that the AirPort Express would NOT extend the wireless signal from ANY router other than an Apple one. They clearly stated it. If you have no use for the thing, return it and get 90% of your money back.

I too have a 3rd-Party router (LinkSys) and I too am frustrated that I can't extend my wireless network. I don't want to be an a$$hole, but Apple clearly said it wouldn't work. Maybe next time you look to buy a product, you'll listen to what the manufacturer says.

Steven1621
Jul 14, 2004, 09:37 PM
can't relay from third party routers??? oh man that sucks. i was about to buy one, now it is of very little use to me

mrviga
Jul 14, 2004, 09:38 PM
Chill out man...Im not mad that the Express did not extend my wireless network. I don't really care about that. That was a long shot to begin with. My problem is that the Express won't let me stream music to it, and connect to my wireless network at the same time. If I could do that, as I should be able to do, I would be very very happy. But I can't do that :(
I dont understand how Apple can claim true PC compatibility if the express only works properly with the Airport Extreme Base Station. I mean if you have to sacrifice the internet to listen to music, then thats just unacceptable...

And it is Apple's fault, as well as mine I suppose. I should know better than to purchase such a product without first understanding its true capabilities. Oh well, a lesson for next time i guess.

Jalexster
Jul 14, 2004, 09:47 PM
To help everyone. here is a crappy diagram:

The setup you should have:

Broadband
Modem
|
(Ethernet cable)
|
V
D-Link <-(Client Config - MUSIC AND PRINTING ONLY)-AirPort Express
Router
|
(Wi-Fi connection)
|
V
Client Computer (Mac or x86)

(x86 is Intel compatible, and refers to Windows, Linux, Unix, etc...)

The setup you SHOULDN'T have:

(Ethernet cable)
|
V
D-Link <-(Client Config - MUSIC AND PRINTING ONLY)-AirPort Express
Router...................................................................|
............................................................................|
............________(Wi-Fi connection) ________________|
...........|
...........V
Client Computer (Mac or x86)

Now as you can see in diagram 2, if you are connecting to the AirPort Express unit with your wireless (AirPort/Wi-Fi) connection, you won't get any internet function from the D-Link, because the client link ONLY supports Music and Printing.

Does that make it clearer for EVERYONE (Including the poster above)?

robbieduncan
Jul 15, 2004, 02:45 AM
This is just a quick note for those blaming Apple for not being able to extend non-Apple network. WDS (which is what Apple uses to extend the network) IS NOT A STANDARD. It is an optional part of 802.11g which different manufacturers are free to implement in different ways. This means that even if your DLink stuff has WDS it is not the same as Apple WDS.

WCat
Jul 16, 2004, 12:00 AM
This is just a quick note for those blaming Apple for not being able to extend non-Apple network. WDS (which is what Apple uses to extend the network) IS NOT A STANDARD. It is an optional part of 802.11g which different manufacturers are free to implement in different ways. This means that even if your DLink stuff has WDS it is not the same as Apple WDS.

Robbie is right, and let me just add an additional thought here as well. You cannot, repeat CANNOT mix the various forms of WDS (or whatever each manufacturer calls it) because WDS is not part of ANY 802.11 or Wi-Fi standard. You can't extend the range of your Linksys router by buying a DLink box, either. Only another Linksys will work. Period. Stick with one manufacturer and you're OK. That said, some early gear won't work on WDS or interoperate properly with later gear, even from the same manufacturer.

This is also not a case of Apple vs. everyone else, either. Everybody has their own proprietary way of making it work in their own firmware, using their own implementations of the management bits. If the Wi-Fi organization had made WDS interoperability mandatory, then we wouldn't be complaining about this, but nobody ever though about such a thing as WDS back a few years ago. It started out as a hack to 802.11b by Linksys, I believe. Now, with both 11b and 11g mixed systems, it would be a real mess to implement cleanly.

Suggestions if you just have to have WDS:

1. Buy another Airport Express and use it as your main wireless access point/router.

-or-

2. Buy an Airport Extreme if you think you need more than 10 clients, or if you need to also connect things directly to your router with Ethernet. If things > 1 then buy a cheap $20 Ethernet switch to plug into it.

Done. 11g speeds all the way, full WDS, great Software Update service and management tools that work for all your devices.

Don't blame Apple for this, folks!

JFreak
Jul 16, 2004, 01:21 AM
Buy an Airport Extreme if you think you need more than 10 clients

ahem, is the airport express limited to 10 clients? isn't it capable of the same 50 than extreme? and why extreme has been limited to 50? almost every 3rd party wireless base station can have a whole c-class subnet of clients...

vocaro
Jul 16, 2004, 03:28 AM
ahem, is the airport express limited to 10 clients? isn't it capable of the same 50 than extreme? and why extreme has been limited to 50? almost every 3rd party wireless base station can have a whole c-class subnet of clients...

That's just the theoretical limit that they put in their specifications. Many of those base stations you refer to max out at around 25 or so clients due to processor and bandwidth limitations. For instance, see http://www.planet.com.tw/product/product_dm.php?product_id=190 and scroll down to Key Features. Note the bit about "for best performance".

Trevor

bbarnhart
Jul 16, 2004, 06:19 AM
Somebody got an AirPort Express to extend a wireless network with a Linksys WRT54G router. There is a small thread here at MacRumors (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=79968&highlight=express+linksys+wrt54g) discussing it.

The trick is to use a third-party firmware with the Linksys router.