PDA

View Full Version : Retards at SBC couldn't help; can you?


2A Batterie
Jul 15, 2004, 11:12 AM
I am eagerly awaiting my new G5 that I am going to utilize in my recording studio on the 3rd floor of my house. My 1st floor computer is connected via 2Wire to an SBC Yahoo ethernet connection (1100 model hub). I called SBC about internet for my 3rd floor computer; I just wanted another hub to plug in upstairs that would utilize the same phone #. I didn't want to go wireless because (a) I read that it slows down data transmission over the internet, (b) I'm not so sure about security, and (c) I have no need to connect the two computers aside from internet. After explaining this several times to several operators over the course of 45 minutes, I gave up after this exchange-
SBC Retard: What kind of system are you running?
Me: OSX
Retard: That doesn't help me. What kind of computer are you running it off of?
Me: a G5
Retard: Um, Ok... so is that an Apple, a PC, or a Macintosh?
Me: Thanks for your time, have a nice day. *click*

Since they haven't given me any info, can anyone out there? Should I get a new phone line? Should I get Airport extreme and do the wireless? What are my options to getting high speed internet on my second computer without getting a new phone line?

phiberoptik957
Jul 15, 2004, 11:23 AM
Scenario 1 (If the 2wire has a built in switch)

just run a cable from the 2wire to your G5


Scenario 2 (Assuming the 2wire has just one ethernet port)

from the 2wire come to a swithch (most newer switches have autosensing ports so any port on the switch will do. And then from there run a cable to each of the computers. (this is assumng that your 2wire is acting as a router because I dont believe sbc gives you more than one external ip ic ould be wrong. If the other computer doestn get an ip just repleace the swithc with a router.)



I hope this helps. if not ask a followup and I or someone else will add more

realityisterror
Jul 15, 2004, 12:07 PM
you easiest solution will probably be to get a cheap wireless router.. otherwise, you'll almost definitely need to use ethernet to connect all your computers to the same jack (via a router)...
if you get a cheap linksys or dlink, maybe you can also find a cheap directional antenna that you can point up... 2 floors up is pretty far away...

my suggestion: get a cheap wireless router and airport extreme for your g5 (if you don't already have it)... if you have a bad connection, try to find a cheap directional antenna..

just my 3.14,
reality

Horrortaxi
Jul 15, 2004, 12:21 PM
They also have networking over power lines now. I don't know much about quality or cost but it might be worth looking into.

goodwill
Jul 15, 2004, 12:22 PM
I feel your pain my friend. I currently have SBC Yahoo as well. Despite it being quite the reasonable price, it again goes back the personal theory. If its too good to be true (the price), then its too good to be true.

I needed some help in regards to setting up my powerbook to the ppoe and when I called the SBC gimp desk, they were so naive about anything Apple. Theyre useless 97 percent of the time.

sgarringer
Jul 15, 2004, 12:34 PM
SBC Retard: What kind of system are you running?
Me: OSX
Retard: That doesn't help me. What kind of computer are you running it off of?
Me: a G5
Retard: Um, Ok... so is that an Apple, a PC, or a Macintosh?
Me: Thanks for your time, have a nice day. *click*


Comming from someone who works in a customer service call center, not everyone in the world is as "up" on the mac scene as you are. I am sorry if not everyone understands OSX means mac, or realizes they have a G5 processor. I am sorry. Yes, this is my first post. I have lurked here for 6 months. But it just really angers me when people get obstinant on the phone.

Elan0204
Jul 15, 2004, 12:49 PM
Comming from someone who works in a customer service call center, not everyone in the world is as "up" on the mac scene as you are. I am sorry if not everyone understands OSX means mac, or realizes they have a G5 processor. I am sorry. Yes, this is my first post. I have lurked here for 6 months. But it just really angers me when people get obstinant on the phone.

If you are working a tech support line and you ask a question like "is that an Apple, PC, or Macintosh?" you don't know what you are talking about. Whenever you call a tech support line they need to know the operating system you are running in order to give you proper instructions on fixing your problem. The answer the original poster gave of "OS X" was the right one, and the tech person had no idea what that meant. Even after the tech support person eventually figured out that the caller had an Apple computer, what makes you think they are suddenly going to realize what OS X is? Plus, I think 2A Batterie handled the situation well by politely ending the phone conversation rather than insulting the tech support person.

MisterMe
Jul 15, 2004, 12:52 PM
Comming from someone who works in a customer service call center, not everyone in the world is as "up" on the mac scene as you are. I am sorry if not everyone understands OSX means mac, or realizes they have a G5 processor. I am sorry. Yes, this is my first post. I have lurked here for 6 months. But it just really angers me when people get obstinant on the phone.If you are expecting sympathy because you can't do your job, then I am afraid that you will be sadly disappointed.

reaper
Jul 15, 2004, 01:02 PM
Comming from someone who works in a customer service call center, not everyone in the world is as "up" on the mac scene as you are. I am sorry if not everyone understands OSX means mac, or realizes they have a G5 processor. I am sorry. Yes, this is my first post. I have lurked here for 6 months. But it just really angers me when people get obstinant on the phone.

But isn't that their job?!? If someone is working at a COMPUTER HELP DESK and doesn't even know the OSes that are running on the computers they "support" there are serious issues. It's not being rude to hang up on someone who is obviously doing nothing but WASTING YOUR TIME!

- reaper

jayb2000
Jul 15, 2004, 01:02 PM
A wireless card and router will run you at least $150 bucks.

You can get a 4 port swith/router and 200' of ethernet cable for like $50 (check Radio Shack).

Just take a cable from the 2wire router to the hub, then plug the downstairs computer into it as well. Then run the long cable up to the thrd floor. If they are on the same side of the house, you can even just run it out the window.
The only issue is whether the 2wire box will pass out multiple IPs or i you need to configure the router to do that.

If I remember, SBC wanted to charge more for a 2wire that would do that.
You could get somthing like this
http://store.yahoo.com/outletpc/c3475.html
Its $25 bucks and you should be all set.

sgarringer
Jul 15, 2004, 01:03 PM
But isn't that their job?!? If someone is working at a COMPUTER HELP DESK and doesn't even know the OSes that are running on the computers they "support" there are serious issues. It's not being rude to hang up on someone who is obviously doing nothing but WASTING YOUR TIME!

- reaper

he was clearly talking to a sales department who has a list of computers and their minimum requirements. he was SOOO close to getting that second adsl modem, but had to be a dick and ruined it all. dont expect any pitty from a customer service rep who has to deal with *******s like him on the phone all the time.

2A Batterie
Jul 15, 2004, 01:08 PM
Comming from someone who works in a customer service call center, not everyone in the world is as "up" on the mac scene as you are. I am sorry if not everyone understands OSX means mac, or realizes they have a G5 processor. I am sorry. Yes, this is my first post. I have lurked here for 6 months. But it just really angers me when people get obstinant on the phone.

I'm certainly not a pro, as my first post was marked with the error of me referring the modem as a hub. I did some research and found out I had it mixed up. Point is that I, along with everyone else, make errors and that it is ok. However if one is working as support in a tech-specific field, they should be well-informed of both the general (i.e. computer OS'es) and specific (i.e. internet equipment and provider) areas of the their job; if not, they can't really provide what they are hired to do.. support. The dialog that I excerpted illustrated my "support" and its extreme shortcomings in just basic knowledge. It would be like me driving my car that clearly runs on unleaded gas to a gas station and asking for 87 octane, and the pump operator responding "uh, so is that diesel or unleaded, or normal stuff?". However, all I did was tell the operator thanks for your time and ended the phone call. I did not verbally demean or insult the tech support, nor did I create an aggressive atmosphere. If this angers you so, how would you have suggested that I do it? Honestly, I'd like to know because I feel that everyone deserves to be treated properly, regardless of if they are capable or not.
In a nutshell, you shouldn't be working in a computer specific field if you don't know anything about computers.

sgarringer
Jul 15, 2004, 01:10 PM
I'm certainly not a pro, as my first post was marked with the error of me referring the modem as a hub. I did some research and found out I had it mixed up. Point is that I, along with everyone else, make errors and that it is ok. However if one is working as support in a tech-specific field, they should be well-informed of both the general (i.e. computer OS'es) and specific (i.e. internet equipment and provider) areas of the their job; if not, they can't really provide what they are hired to do.. support. The dialog that I excerpted illustrated my "support" and its extreme shortcomings in just basic knowledge. It would be like me driving my car that clearly runs on unleaded gas to a gas station and asking for 87 octane, and the pump operator responding "uh, so is that diesel or unleaded, or normal stuff?". However, all I did was tell the operator thanks for your time and ended the phone call. I did not verbally demean or insult the tech support, nor did I create an aggressive atmosphere. If this angers you so, how would you have suggested that I do it? Honestly, I'd like to know because I feel that everyone deserves to be treated properly, regardless of if they are capable or not.
In a nutshell, you shouldn't be working in a computer specific field if you don't know anything about computers.

again, i refer you to the fact that you were dealing with an outsourced callcenter, a group of highschool kids who dont want to flip burgers for $7 an hour and couldnt give a crap less about Macintosh, Apple, or OS X. To them they just care about checking off your computer on a list of requirements, sending you a modem, and getting their paycheck at the end of the month. Geeks could really learn how to deal with people who are "less intelegent" then them.

2A Batterie
Jul 15, 2004, 01:11 PM
Scenario 1 (If the 2wire has a built in switch)

just run a cable from the 2wire to your G5


Scenario 2 (Assuming the 2wire has just one ethernet port)

from the 2wire come to a swithch (most newer switches have autosensing ports so any port on the switch will do. And then from there run a cable to each of the computers. (this is assumng that your 2wire is acting as a router because I dont believe sbc gives you more than one external ip ic ould be wrong. If the other computer doestn get an ip just repleace the swithc with a router.)



I hope this helps. if not ask a followup and I or someone else will add more
Thanks for the response. I'm trying not to turn this thread into some moral debate (i.e. pissing contenst) about customer service, so I'll redirect towards the specific topic.
My third floor is a rather far stretch to the opposite corner of my first floor. It would take a mighty long cable to connect. Someone may have already provided a good solution, but I'm still trying to absorb and understand everything.
What about powerline? I read about that in MacWorld as a possible solution. All I want from the first floor computer is the dsl... nothing else. Should I get another IP address from SBC but still use the same connection for both computers? Thanks for the input everyone, and let's keep it friendly.

Timelessblur
Jul 15, 2004, 01:25 PM
well be rude to the person was your first mistake. Think about how much crap those people put up with everysingle day. They get to the point of autopilot so if the question not answered in some way the expact the ask some more. General they are clicking on there own computer for a quick solution. If there is not answer on there computers the bump you up to lv 2. 90% of the time the answer to the question can be answered by a lv1 tech. Those people dont need to know that much. Not much more than how to read a scripted.

As for a solution going wireless is the way to go. was long as it is a wirelessG network you will not notice a speed lose over the internet We currently have 3 computer running over our network. 2 of them wireless and there is no noticble diffence in speed.

As for security all you have to do is set it up and no computer but the ones with the key can access the network or see what the data be transmit is. it runs on a 128bit equition. No loose in speed. Download speed off of out SBC DSL line is still over 1mbs at the computers. Yeah it split when all th computer are using it but site normaly limit me to 150Kb/s. So I still well speed of my modem.

Dont year or be rude to the tech support You more than likely really close to them giving you anohter modem if you where not rude. If you are rude they become a pain in the ass because then they go by the book and will not bother trying to do any thing extra to help you out that they dont have 2. If you are nice most of the time they will try to work something out for you that will make you happy and it normally faster and better than the book solution. If it is the book solution you will fully understand it and will not be frustated trying to figure it out

2A Batterie
Jul 15, 2004, 01:29 PM
again, i refer you to the fact that you were dealing with an outsourced callcenter, a group of highschool kids who dont want to flip burgers for $7 an hour and couldnt give a crap less about Macintosh, Apple, or OS X. To them they just care about checking off your computer on a list of requirements, sending you a modem, and getting their paycheck at the end of the month. Geeks could really learn how to deal with people who are "less intelegent" then them.
I don't make judgements on people or there INTELLIGENCE based on knowledge, or lack thereof, regarding computers. However, I believe that it is necessary for one to adequately perform the job they are hired to do.
On the other hand, I tend not to favor those whose words and actions lack diplomacy. I exhibit this by simpy ceasing to interact with the person(s)/party(s) involved. This is the last I will respond to this matter as I am interested in finding solutions to my wireless problem, not creating another totally irrelevant one.

sgarringer
Jul 15, 2004, 01:43 PM
I don't make judgements on people or there INTELLIGENCE based on knowledge, or lack thereof, regarding computers. However, I believe that it is necessary for one to adequately perform the job they are hired to do.
On the other hand, I tend not to favor those whose words and actions lack diplomacy. I exhibit this by simpy ceasing to interact with the person(s)/party(s) involved. This is the last I will respond to this matter as I am interested in finding solutions to my wireless problem, not creating another totally irrelevant one.

to point out, i use wireless to share my cablemodem throughout my apartment with no degradation of speed -- the wireless, expecially 802.11g is certified at 54 megabit, which is much faster than the 3 or maybe 6 megabit DSL service offered in most cities. By using 128 bit WAP keys and restricting your access point to only known MAC addresses you will have no problems with security. sure, someone with hours of time on their hands could (in theory) crack your encryption, but they could also just open up the box on thei side of your house and make long distance phone calls on your line, so i don't know which i'd be more worried about. =]

jayb2000
Jul 15, 2004, 02:06 PM
...
My third floor is a rather far stretch to the opposite corner of my first floor. It would take a mighty long cable to connect. Someone may have already provided a good solution, but I'm still trying to absorb and understand everything.
What about powerline? I read about that in MacWorld as a possible solution. ...

Never used powerline, but it looks pricey
http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatSectionView.process?Section_Id=201539
You would need 2 adapters at $100each, plus a network cable, assuming you want this kind of setup (attached image)

For $210 bucks, you could get an Airport Express and a a card for the 3rd floor computer. That would be more flexible, but less secure. Just be sure to setup WPA and such.

Lancetx
Jul 15, 2004, 03:14 PM
again, i refer you to the fact that you were dealing with an outsourced callcenter, a group of highschool kids who dont want to flip burgers for $7 an hour and couldnt give a crap less about Macintosh, Apple, or OS X. To them they just care about checking off your computer on a list of requirements, sending you a modem, and getting their paycheck at the end of the month.

That in a nutshell is the problem with customer service in many places today, not just at SBC in particular. If people actually cared about what they were doing rather than just getting the paycheck, they might take the time to educate themselves in order to give proper customer service. However, as someone that has worked in CS for many years and is now a CS manager, I can tell you for certain that I could not get away with having that kind of attitude. I'd lose my job in a heartbeat if I or any of those persons in my department under me didn't do an accurate and thorough job of taking care of our customers when they call. I've had people cuss and scream on the phone many times just as any CSR has, but you cannot let that phase you and that is no excuse for not knowing your job.

ChrisFromCanada
Jul 15, 2004, 03:36 PM
I use the netgear (similar to belkin?) powerline adapters and they work very well with OS X. There is no software setup it just acts like an ethernet cable. The only thing is they occasionally (once every month or so) over heat and you have to leave them off for a couple of minutes to cool down. Also if for any reason the power goes off you have to wait a few minutes for them to re-configure. I have also heard they don't play friendly with some routers but don't get me wrong they do work well.

Good luck

Makosuke
Jul 15, 2004, 05:44 PM
It sounds like you have things sort of under control, but since there seems to be some confusion as to whether you need another IP address from SBC or not, here's basically how any set up you're going to get should probably work:

[Phone line] -> [DSL Modem w/1 IP Address] -> [Router of some kind that creates an internal network with internal-only IP addresses] --> [2 or more different computers]

The DSL modem, unless you're on one of SBC's expensive fixed IP address plans (which you don't need for what you want to do), gets one IP address from SBC. Right now, your computer gets that IP address directly, since it's hooked right to the modem.

What you want to do is instead give that single IP address from your modem to a router of some kind, which will then create an internal network for all your computers. From the outside world, it doesn't matter that there are multiple computers sitting behind that router, and it doesn't matter whether you get an Airport, wired router (which is what I'd do if it's at all possible to run the cable--you can go up to 500'), or power line networking (which I'd skip, personally)--all of them will do basically the same thing.

(A note, which is probably part of the reason you were confused about what to call your 2Wire box: according to 2Wire's specs, the 2Wire 1100 basically combines an ADSL modem, a firewall, and a single-computer-router into one box; this is why they were calling it a "router". The reason for this is that by acting as a router and not giving your computer the SBC-supplied IP address directly--instead creating a 1-computer mini-isolated-network--it shields it from direct access from the outside world. This shouldn't actually affect the setup everybody else is describing here; it should all work the same. I just thought I'd mention it, because you weren't exactly wrong when you called your modem a hub--in a manner of speaking, it is sort of both.)

phonemonkey
Jul 15, 2004, 05:54 PM
Thanks for the response. I'm trying not to turn this thread into some moral debate (i.e. pissing contenst) about customer service, so I'll redirect towards the specific topic.
My third floor is a rather far stretch to the opposite corner of my first floor. It would take a mighty long cable to connect. Someone may have already provided a good solution, but I'm still trying to absorb and understand everything.
What about powerline? I read about that in MacWorld as a possible solution. All I want from the first floor computer is the dsl... nothing else. Should I get another IP address from SBC but still use the same connection for both computers? Thanks for the input everyone, and let's keep it friendly.

I am an SBC retard and a very good one at that. I take no offense however because I work with some of these retards. My apologies for the dumb Mac agents. For a few months we had a great Mac Dept. and then they took the mac account to "another localality" if you know what I mean
Your best bet is to buy an HPNA adapter if it didn't come in your homenetworking kit. It plugs into your G5 with a USB adapter and the other end plugs into the phone line and talks to the 2Wire using the existing phone lines. I'm not sure how much they run at a store or on ebay but SBC sells them for 50 bones I think, but I am not very sure because I don't deal with money in any way. There is no need for another IP address as the 2Wire can accodomate several computers, though it only has one ethernet port (I always wondered why that was). But like I said if that blue usb adapter is not long enough for you which I am sure it is not use the hpna adapter or wireless. Hope this helps and if not feel free to ask me.
Phonemonkey

BrianKonarsMac
Jul 15, 2004, 06:07 PM
Geeks could really learn how to deal with people who are "less intelegent" then them. i couldn't think of a more appropriate word to mispell in that sentence.

I have SBC, and have never had an issue with Tech Support. Granted, I've had to WALK THEM through some things on occasion, but I always get what I want at least. Tech support people are generally not the most intelligent, because they get paid crap. When they are intelligent, they get promoted out of the tech support areas.

You really had no reason to call tech support though. What would they tell you other than buy a router? To use two modems would require two PAID SUBSCRIPTIONS (two IPs). Buy an ethernet hub or PCI Ethernet card, run a cable between the floors to the 3rd floor, go to Mac OS X system pref. and turn Internet Sharing on on your main computer (the one directly connected to the net if using a PCI card) and presto.

Connections:
aDSL modem to 4port Ethernet Hub's WAN or LAN or whatever it's called port.

Computer 1 to port 1 of Ethernet Hub.
Computer 2 to port 2 of Ethernet Hub.

OR

aDSL to Computer 1. Computer 2 to Computer 1 PCI Ethernet. Computer 1 Internet Sharing On.

JesseJames
Jul 15, 2004, 06:28 PM
Can't we all just get along? :o :(

2A Batterie
Jul 16, 2004, 01:01 PM
Your best bet is to buy an HPNA adapter if it didn't come in your homenetworking kit. It plugs into your G5 with a USB adapter and the other end plugs into the phone line and talks to the 2Wire using the existing phone lines. I'm not sure how much they run at a store or on ebay but SBC sells them for 50 bones I think, but I am not very sure because I don't deal with money in any way. There is no need for another IP address as the 2Wire can accodomate several computers, though it only has one ethernet port (I always wondered why that was). But like I said if that blue usb adapter is not long enough for you which I am sure it is not use the hpna adapter or wireless. Hope this helps and if not feel free to ask me.
Phonemonkey

Let me get this straight because this sounds TOO easy if I'm interpreting correctly. I buy an HPNA adapter, which plugs into my G5 (on 3rd floor) with a usb adapter, then plug the oter end into the phone line? Does it matter that I'll be plugging it in on the 3rd floor, with my other internet-connected computer (has internet connection via SBC... 2wire 1100 model) being on the first floor? Do I have to do anything with the sharing options on either computer, or do I just plug in the adapter to my 3rd floor computer and the phone line up there? Dude, if this can happen I'll be stoked! Thanks for being such a "retard" and helping me ;)

Makosuke
Jul 16, 2004, 02:31 PM
Ah, I missed that the 1100 supports HPNA; though I've never used HPNA myself, so I don't know how well it works in practice, phonemonkey explained it correctly. Since your 2Wire already knows how to talk to HPNA equipment, all you (theoretically) need is your 2nd computer with an adapter plugged into the phone jack, and it will send a network signal (that theoretically doesn't interfere with DSL or voice traffic) that the 2Wire knows how to recognize, and it should automatically handle the 2nd computer.

They apparently have a Mac driver: http://www.2wire.com/?p=266

Sounds like the cheapest option, if it works, but you may want to read through the documentation yourself. It's all online, and should be in your manual as well.

phonemonkey
Jul 17, 2004, 12:54 AM
Let me get this straight because this sounds TOO easy if I'm interpreting correctly. I buy an HPNA adapter, which plugs into my G5 (on 3rd floor) with a usb adapter, then plug the oter end into the phone line? Does it matter that I'll be plugging it in on the 3rd floor, with my other internet-connected computer (has internet connection via SBC... 2wire 1100 model) being on the first floor? Do I have to do anything with the sharing options on either computer, or do I just plug in the adapter to my 3rd floor computer and the phone line up there? Dude, if this can happen I'll be stoked! Thanks for being such a "retard" and helping me ;)

right, the usb connector will obviousely go into your mac. there will be an open end on the other side. you will run a phone cord from there into the dsl side of one of the filters that was sent to you. that filter goes into the phone jack. install the drivers, set network prefrences for the hpna adapter to DHCP and there you go. it wont matter with the flooring because the filter will make sure the hpna adapter only picks up the digital signal running through the phone lines in your house. you will only need to change sharing options if you want to share files between your 2 computers. The 2wire is a router and will share the internet connection between the 2 computers for you so no need for other configuration changes.
Hope this helps and sorry for the late reply, couldn't find the thread.
Phonemonkey