Rumors of Disabled Intel Atom Support in Mac OS X 10.6.2 Unfounded?

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/11/04/rumors-of-disabled-intel-atom-support-in-mac-os-x-10-6-2-unfounded/)

Earlier this week, a report (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/11/02/apple-disabling-support-for-intel-atom-processor-in-latest-10-6-2-build/) surfaced claiming that Apple had apparently disabled support for Intel's Atom processors in the latest developer build of Mac OS X 10.6.2. The revelation set off a firestorm around the Internet, riling many users who have modified their Atom-based netbook models to run OS X and sparking speculation that Apple may have been moving to hamper such "Hackintosh" netbook projects as it prepares to launch its much-rumored tablet computer.

In an update (http://stellarola.tumblr.com/post/225234492/10-6-2-kills-atom-and-other-news-updated) to his original blog post about the discovery, Tumblr user "stellarola" reveals that the latest Mac OS X 10.6.2 developer seed (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/10/28/apple-seeds-mac-os-x-10-6-2-build-10c535-to-developers/) (Build 10C535) is apparently working just fine on his Atom-based netbook hardware.Anyways, in the latest development build Atom appears to have resurrected itself zombie style in 10C535. The Atom lives another day, but nothing is concrete until the final version of 10.6.2 is out.The original post describing the lack of Atom support was made on October 27th, one day before Apple seeded Build 10C535 to developers, meaning that the poster was experiencing difficulties on his Atom-based netbook with the then-current Build 10C531 (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/10/21/mac-os-x-10-6-2-build-10c531-seeded-to-developers/). It is unclear at this time whether the lack of Atom support in that build was intentional on Apple's part or if it was simply a bug that the company addressed in the next developer version.

Article Link: Rumors of Disabled Intel Atom Support in Mac OS X 10.6.2 Unfounded? (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/11/04/rumors-of-disabled-intel-atom-support-in-mac-os-x-10-6-2-unfounded/)

[djellison]

Fingers crossed, then, that the atom-break was simply an accidental biproduct of some sort of bug.

[OllyW]

There's a few members who have invested a lot of time and energy on that other thread who are going to be disappointed about this. :D

[JonB3Z]

That's why it's called MacRumors

[GSMiller]

Even if "support" was disabled for the Atom processor, it is against the EULA for Mac OS X to be installed on non Mac hardware, so people shouldn't be shocked.

[Borjan]

Well, for me anyway, fingers crossed things stay this way.

[crick3r]

PLEASE DELIVER 10.6.2 NOW !!!
I don't want to believe that they are still spending any time around atom, while we need the update NOW ! I want to use safari again !

[jon08]

PLEASE DELIVER 10.6.2 NOW !!!
I don't want to believe that they are still spending any time around atom, while we need the update NOW !

Exactly my thoughts. I mean who cares about the damn Atom anyway...

[dernhelm]

What? An unfounded rumor based on one person's experience riling thousands of people that would otherwise be completely unaffected?

Say it isn't so. Not reported here on MacRumors! :p

[nedzalife]

Its funny how the hackintosh community and tech news sites had a **** fest over something in a developer build, where bugs are worked out. I also really hope tech journalism hasn't stooped to basing claims off one user's feedback on a forum...

[skate71290]

PLEASE DELIVER 10.6.2 NOW !!!
I don't want to believe that they are still spending any time around atom, while we need the update NOW ! I want to use safari again !

lol i know safari is well good... just flash makes it wank... and i dont like firefox :( :mad:

[ValSalva]

It's amazing how much angst one report from one blogger has generated. But like he said, we won't really know until 10.6.2 is final.

[DUSTmurph]

How does he know that the Atom processor was the cause of the problem? Since it was a hackintosh, couldn't have been because of a number of other reasons?

[stridemat]

Looks like I may be able to buy my HP Mini 10 again. Lets hope so!!!

[FakeWozniak]

Personally, I think it is unfair of those Netbook folks installing MacOSX. Apple should lock them out. I had to pay Apple's hardware premium to use their software, they should too. Apple probably will lock them out regardless of the table to protect the hardware margins. I think they are on the tightrope now between protecting margins and keeping the hacker base happy.

[iSee]

Ha, ha, ha. I'll take this as a little reminder not to pay too much attention to MR articles.

This makes OS X Daily pretty lame. Their story bolds this in the first sentence:
"10.6.2 has been confirmed to kill support for the Intel Atom processor."

Not exactly confirmed as it turns out.

[Doctor Q]

Are we now having an unfirestorm?

I think the fuss over the Apple Disabling Support for Intel Atom Processor in Latest 10.6.2 Build? (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/11/02/apple-disabling-support-for-intel-atom-processor-in-latest-10-6-2-build/) rumor was a sample of what makes rumors exciting to talk about, then rehash as each new development occurs. It's also a reminder that we never know what we don't know.

[Nermal]

How does he know that the Atom processor was the cause of the problem? Since it was a hackintosh, couldn't have been because of a number of other reasons?

He's one of the developers of Hackintosh solutions. I'd imagine that he does indeed know what he's talking about :)

[djellison]

I wonder why anyone would rate this story negative? This place is very bemusing.

[zap2]

Even if "support" was disabled for the Atom processor, it is against the EULA for Mac OS X to be installed on non Mac hardware, so people shouldn't be shocked.

No, I'd be shocked...it be able going out of the way to say "no atom", it be a big change, calling the hackintosh community out(not saying they should or should not, just that currently, that leave the hobbyists alone), 2nd it send a clear message about no upcoming atom based OS X devices from Apple(the possible tablet)

[TsMkLg068426]

Huh! so I was right when I said in another thread here: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=810144&page=4

So either this was a rumor, a glitch or they were considering about it. For me who gives a ****. I just want the important issues fixed soon and I purchased my Mac OS X Snow Leopard. Try saving a bit of money and you can afford to buy something from apple also, sorry. Hopefully they will skip this problem they are having and worry about the main problems people are having that actually own a mac.

[MacKiddyWiddy]

Lets just keep our fingers crossed that it was a bug ot even just a rumor and all atom cpu users are good for slhttp://macblog.***********/imgs/signature_SmileyFace.jpg

[shamino]

PLEASE DELIVER 10.6.2 NOW !!!
I don't want to believe that they are still spending any time around atom, while we need the update NOW ! I want to use safari again !
Now? Even though there may be critical bugs left to be fixed? Do you think this problem with the Atom is the only bug delaying its release?

I think even you would prefer a working update in a few weeks over a broken one shipped immediately. (Unless you are looking forward to demanding 10.6.3, in which case, I stand corrected.)

[lostngone]

I say disable it now.

This is how things get out of hand. We all know it isn't "supported" but it works and people are using it. The problem is even if it isn't "supported" the more people that use it the more complaints/bad press Apple will get when it is finally pulled or it breaks.

[MartiNZ]

Now? Even though there may be critical bugs left to be fixed? Do you think this problem with the Atom is the only bug delaying its release?

I think even you would prefer a working update in a few weeks over a broken one shipped immediately. (Unless you are looking forward to demanding 10.6.3, in which case, I stand corrected.)

Of course there are plenty of bugs left, but the last few seeds have shipped with 'no known issues' according to the threads here, and that is the criterion they use rather than no more bugs ... or we would never see the update.

I would rather they release it with no known issues sooner, so that I could get back to complaining about the same bugs I've been complaining about for 5 years, in the hope that maybe 10.6.3 will be the one. Like if 10.6.2 doesn't fix the stack sorting bug or the iTunes dashboard widget ... can't wait to find out –*I almost won't be disappointed either way :).

[stade1979]

The hell with the Atom processor I want 10.6.2!!!!!!!!

[macduke]

The hackintosh lives! Hahahahahahahahaha...take that, suckas. Lol.

[DCJ001]

Exactly my thoughts. I mean who cares about the damn Atom anyway...

Steve?

[OnePotato]

I can confirm that Max OS X 10.6.2 does not work on my Radio Shack TRS-80. Damn Apple and their short-sighted greed.

[MattInOz]

Personally, I think it is unfair of those Netbook folks installing MacOSX. Apple should lock them out. I had to pay Apple's hardware premium to use their software, they should too. Apple probably will lock them out regardless of the table to protect the hardware margins. I think they are on the tightrope now between protecting margins and keeping the hacker base happy.

You call the fake version of a man who is happy to stand in line and pay full price for Apple gear even though the company offered to send him free stuff. A man who no doubt also has a small fleet of Hackintoshs to mess around with, just because he can.

Then post that...

Delicious Irony

[lifeinhd]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPod; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5H11a Safari/525.20)

Personally, I think it is unfair of those Netbook folks installing MacOSX. Apple should lock them out. I had to pay Apple's hardware premium to use their software, they should too. Apple probably will lock them out regardless of the table to protect the hardware margins. I think they are on the tightrope now between protecting margins and keeping the hacker base happy.

That is the dumbest logic I've ever heard. No one cares what you paid. Some people want products Apple doesn't offer, such as, oh, I dunno, a netbook, but with Apple software installed. I can't help it if you don't fit into this category.



And to use the old cliché... life isn't fair ;)

[iigsie]

I say disable it now.

This is how things get out of hand. We all know it isn't "supported" but it works and people are using it. The problem is even if it isn't "supported" the more people that use it the more complaints/bad press Apple will get when it is finally pulled or it breaks.


I'm sorry, but that is a completely ludicrous thing to say. Who in their right mind would complain to Apple that their unsupported hardware breaching the quite clear EULA is no longer supported?

However people that do not pay for software are literally the scum of the earth, and deserve to be locked away, but if you've paid for the full box set you should be entitled to do what you want with it.


I'm with lifeinhd, I own 4 Macs, all of which I bought new. There is a gap in Apples lineup, It really can't be hard for them to make a small MacBook for around the same price as a HP Mini.

[nwcs]

I can confirm that Max OS X 10.6.2 does not work on my Radio Shack TRS-80. Damn Apple and their short-sighted greed.

You should have used the 16K upgrade pack like I did on my old CoCo1 Trash 80. The original 4K was rocking, though. Genuine Microsoft 9 color system.

[iigsie]

You should have used the 16K upgrade pack like I did on my old CoCo1 Trash 80. The original 4K was rocking, though. Genuine Microsoft 9 color system.

It's running fine on my PC-2. So nice to have Dock Expose :D

[Arthagnan]

That's why it's called MacRumors


http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/funny-pictures-lol-squid.jpg

[jaw04005]

Personally, I think it is unfair of those Netbook folks installing MacOSX. Apple should lock them out. I had to pay Apple's hardware premium to use their software, they should too. Apple probably will lock them out regardless of the table to protect the hardware margins. I think they are on the tightrope now between protecting margins and keeping the hacker base happy.

Why do you care what other people payed for their system? Do you get upset at Mac mini owners because you own an iMac? Or MacBook owners because you own a MacBook Pro?

The Hackintosh community as a whole probably accounts for less than one percent of the Mac user base. Apple could careless. By design, it’s always going to be limited to enthusiasts.

If a third-party OEM started getting Hacktintosh machines into retail channels, Apple would start caring. Otherwise, they should have better things to do with their time.

[localoid]

Its funny how the hackintosh community and tech news sites had a **** fest over something in a developer build, where bugs are worked out. I also really hope tech journalism hasn't stooped to basing claims off one user's feedback on a forum...

Blogging != journalism.

For further insight: see "the Nine Elements of Journalism", from the book, The Elements of Journalism...

[arkmannj]

Why do you care what other people payed for their system? Do you get upset at Mac mini owners because you own an iMac? Or MacBook owners because you own a MacBook Pro?

The Hackintosh community as a whole probably accounts for less than one percent of the Mac user base. Apple could careless. By design, it’s always going to be limited to enthusiasts.

If a third-party OEM started getting Hacktintosh machines into retail channels, Apple would start caring. Otherwise, they should have better things to do with their time.

I'd guess Apple secretly loves much of the Hackintosh community. They're a little fan club of sorts, most of which I am sure own Apple hardware. But the Hackintoshers are pretty much free advertising, most enthusiasts have friends/family that see what they are doing but are not into 'hacking' and all the extra work but they see that their Hackintosh friend loves Apple products (again, most of them use the Hackintosh for a fun hobby, something to just try and do to see if they can. but actually have Apple products at home) so their friends/fam go buy a real Mac.
Plus the Hackintosh community is sort of free R&D for Apple, Both in terms of seeing how people are accomplishing things (and then Apple can turn around and offer a polished version..kind of like Boot Camp) and it gives Apple a chance to see what people want that they are not offering. (another example would be people unlocking their iPhones to install applications before Apple allowed it. now that Apple allows apps I don't know many people with unlocked phones, and now that there's boot-camp I don't know anyone using a 3rd party boot loader)

[Rocketman]

I think the interest isn't so much about hackintoshes which are by definition hobbiest activities. It is about speculation that Snow Leopard 10.6.x being compatible with Atom on the theory some future Tablet might use it. Whatever PA Semi is doing is compatible, perhaps even driving the very existence of Snow Leopard itself.

10.5 was a lark and bridge to 10.6. Vista was an abortion leading to Windows 7. Two competitors with similar strategies/experiences.

W7 goes to more powerful laptop solutions. SL goes to more powerful handtop solutions. Everybody here knows who wins this one. The company with the highest margins and growth rate wins. Period.

Rocketman

[FakeWozniak]

That is the dumbest logic I've ever heard. No one cares what you paid. Some people want products Apple doesn't offer, such as, oh, I dunno, a netbook, but with Apple software installed. I can't help it if you don't fit into this category.


A little harsh on the "dumbest logic". I care what I pay. The Saturn division of GM did really well because people cared what they paid relative to others. Don't you think that if someone published idiot-proof instructions on how to download Snow Leopard from a bit torrent, then install it on a $300 low end machine, that the millions of folks buying genuine Apple hardware and software would feel upset about this. The difference seems to be most people have morals.

You seem to be one of those folks that feels entitled to things that either don't exist or are not yours. You can buy Snow Leopard, but good luck with it on non approved hardware.

Out of curiosity, what is your stand on the Palm Pre and iTunes thing?

[FakeWozniak]

You call the fake version of a man who is happy to stand in line and pay full price for Apple gear even though the company offered to send him free stuff. A man who no doubt also has a small fleet of Hackintoshs to mess around with, just because he can.

Then post that...

Delicious Irony

All your base are belong to us

[FakeWozniak]

Why do you care what other people payed for their system? Do you get upset at Mac mini owners because you own an iMac? Or MacBook owners because you own a MacBook Pro?

The Hackintosh community as a whole probably accounts for less than one percent of the Mac user base. Apple could careless. By design, it’s always going to be limited to enthusiasts.

If a third-party OEM started getting Hacktintosh machines into retail channels, Apple would start caring. Otherwise, they should have better things to do with their time.

I agree that it is just a hobby now, but if this takes off, then it will cause Apple to start getting defensive, like MS did. Agree? I think you believe it won't go anywhere. I used to think that way with iPhones before all the jailbreaking.

[doug in albq]

Trial balloon
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search

A trial balloon is information sent out in order to observe the reaction of an audience. It can be used by companies sending out press releases to judge reaction by customers, or it can be used by politicians who deliberately leak information on a policy change under consideration. In politics trial balloons often take the form of an intentional news "leak" to assess public opinion.

For instance, a company might announce they are going to release a new computer program in a year, and then read the press coverage for hints on whether or not the product will have appeal in the marketplace. If the coverage is favourable the money will be spent on development, but if not the project can be cancelled before using up resources. A trial balloon under the company's own name is somewhat risky; if too many are "floated" the company risks becoming known as the company that cried wolf, and can find itself being ignored completely. In addition, the company can find that the product being planned is unworkable, leading to the phenomenon of vaporware.

(Saying Atom support was never removed might be an additional trial balloon)

[iSee]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPod; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5H11a Safari/525.20)



That is the dumbest logic I've ever heard. No one cares what you paid. Some people want products Apple doesn't offer, such as, oh, I dunno, a netbook, but with Apple software installed. I can't help it if you don't fit into this category.



And to use the old cliché... life isn't fair ;)

I'm not sure I understand FakeWoz's logic either, but I think I get his point.

I think a lot of people are suspicious of the hackintosh movement because we're worried that it will take legitmate $$$ away from Apple or otherwise harm Apple in a way that will make Apple raise prices, add annoying anti-piracy measures to the OS, or something equally bad.

[Eric S.]

Ha, ha, ha. I'll take this as a little reminder not to pay too much attention to MR articles.

Well, if Apple wasn't so damn secretive about everything they do, perhaps these rumors wouldn't reach the wildfire stage.

Anyway, something has to fill the void between new product / new OS update releases. We couldn't all just be having a smooth ride with all the Apple products we've happily bought. :rolleyes:

[cjmillsnun]

PLEASE DELIVER 10.6.2 NOW !!!
I don't want to believe that they are still spending any time around atom, while we need the update NOW ! I want to use safari again !

FFS Wait until this update is tested. What happens if the bug fixes cause worse bugs in other areas.... That is what testing is about.

[Scottcop]

I for one am shocked, shocked I tell you, that information on a random persons blog turned out to be untrue, shocked.

Still said random person has picked up alot of free advertising, hopefully the "web" community will learn not to repost someones random ramblings, haha who am I kidding!

[cjmillsnun]

Why do you care what other people payed for their system? Do you get upset at Mac mini owners because you own an iMac? Or MacBook owners because you own a MacBook Pro?

The Hackintosh community as a whole probably accounts for less than one percent of the Mac user base. Apple could careless. By design, it’s always going to be limited to enthusiasts.

If a third-party OEM started getting Hacktintosh machines into retail channels, Apple would start caring. Otherwise, they should have better things to do with their time.

One word.... Psystar!

If the likes of Psystar carry on (and there are similar companies in Europe trying it on now) as they are, I would expect Apple to start really introducing some measures, including removal of the honour system.

I suspect they have very little of a problem with most hackintoshers. Despite it being against the EULA, they make no money out of it. Indeed those who host forums probably are lucky to break even.

Again, a lot of hackintoshers end up buying a mac. I had a Toshiba Laptop that came with the second worst OS in the world (Vista - The very worst was Windows ME). I found an insider secret on cnet showing Tiger running on a ThinkPad and was intrigued. I ended up buying Leopard (It wasn't expensive and I felt if I didn't like it, so be it) downloaded the BrazilMac hack and set to work. I now have a G4 and 2 MacBooks.

[doug in albq]

I think the interest isn't so much about hackintoshes which are by definition hobbiest activities. It is about speculation that Snow Leopard 10.6.x being compatible with Atom on the theory some future Tablet might use it. Whatever PA Semi is doing is compatible, perhaps even driving the very existence of Snow Leopard itself.

10.5 was a lark and bridge to 10.6. Vista was an abortion leading to Windows 7. Two competitors with similar strategies/experiences.

W7 goes to more powerful laptop solutions. SL goes to more powerful handtop solutions. Everybody here knows who wins this one. The company with the highest margins and growth rate wins. Period.

Rocketman

lots of truth in this post...I was thinking the exact same idea yesterday. Just another way to push more people into the clouds, also.

[SimonMW]

It really can't be hard for them to make a small MacBook for around the same price as a HP Mini.

No, it probably isn't. But Apple don't want to make cheap as chips bargain basement products. That sort of complaint is like complaining that Bentley don't make a low carbon family runabout. It isn't their market, and they don't want to be part of that market. Otherwise they would have made one.

[cjmillsnun]

Of course there are plenty of bugs left, but the last few seeds have shipped with 'no known issues' according to the threads here, and that is the criterion they use rather than no more bugs ... or we would never see the update.

I would rather they release it with no known issues sooner, so that I could get back to complaining about the same bugs I've been complaining about for 5 years, in the hope that maybe 10.6.3 will be the one. Like if 10.6.2 doesn't fix the stack sorting bug or the iTunes dashboard widget ... can't wait to find out –*I almost won't be disappointed either way :).

Ahhhh, "no known issues" in a thread on Mac Rumors They seeded something else after the first one with "no known issues" I suspect someone found an issue and it was a showstopper.... That is the point of seeding out to developers. They are beta testing to confirm there are no show stopping or serious bugs before release. They rushed 10.6.1 and it backfired. They should have just released a flash update.

[Eric S.]

They rushed 10.6.1 and it backfired. They should have just released a flash update.

Why do you say it "backfired"? Fixing the Flash issue was an immediate priority, so they just put it out with whatever other bug fixes they had ready at the time. That probably meant 10.6.1 came out a bit earlier than intended, which makes the time until 10.6.2 seem longer by comparison. But two and a half months after the initial release is about the usual timeframe for the 10.x.2 update.

[afishertx]

Don't you think that if someone published idiot-proof instructions on how to download Snow Leopard from a bit torrent, then install it on a $300 low end machine, that the millions of folks buying genuine Apple hardware and software would feel upset about this. The difference seems to be most people have morals.

As an owner of a Dell Mini 9 Running OSX, I would like to say that not all off us in the Hackentosh community are using torrented illegal copies of the operating system. I installed from a retail Family Pack disk that I used for my two 20" iMacs, my daughter's MacBook Pro, and my old reliable PowerMac G4. (which contradicts your earlier generalized point that the hackentoshers don't want to pay the premium for "real" Apple hardware).

Are there those who download a torrent and put it on a cheap machine? Yes, but I don't think that they are a majority of the hobbiest out there. Almost all of the other Dell Mini OSX86ers that I have had contact with used a purchased retail disk and also have a "real Mac" as well.

[lifeinhd]

A little harsh on the "dumbest logic". I care what I pay. The Saturn division of GM did really well because people cared what they paid relative to others. Don't you think that if someone published idiot-proof instructions on how to download Snow Leopard from a bit torrent, then install it on a $300 low end machine, that the millions of folks buying genuine Apple hardware and software would feel upset about this. The difference seems to be most people have morals.

You seem to be one of those folks that feels entitled to things that either don't exist or are not yours. You can buy Snow Leopard, but good luck with it on non approved hardware.

When you're at the pharmacy and you pick up Tylenol, do you get mad at the person next to you who picks up a cheaper no-brand painkiller? Do you think what they're doing is immoral? As long as they actually pay for what they're getting, is it really a problem that you ought to concern yourself with? There's really no reason to hate their decision, especially considering it's the exact same thing chemically as your Tylenol. This true both in the case of painkillers and Apple computers/generic PC hardware. Remember, a Mac these days is a generic PC in a pretty box and an Apple logo on it. So what if they install it on a low-end $300 box? Perhaps they don't need all the power an iMac or even a Mac Mini has to offer? Or maybe they want their netbook that Apple doesn't offer?

Out of curiosity, what is your stand on the Palm Pre and iTunes thing?

I say it doesn't affect me ;) That's also a slightly different case, in that that's a major company letting their users tether to iTunes, not a few hobbyist hackers building cheap Macs.

[Arcady]

Don't you think that if someone published idiot-proof instructions on how to download Snow Leopard from a bit torrent, then install it on a $300 low end machine, that the millions of folks buying genuine Apple hardware and software would feel upset about this. The difference seems to be most people have morals.

What about people like me, who own several real Macs, including an intel iMac, MacBook Pro, etc. but also have a Dell mini 9 with a store-bought copy of OS X 10.5 Leopard on it? I'd gladly buy a 9 inch Apple laptop if it existed. I'm not carrying around some huge 13" thing all day, even if it is as thin as a MacBook Air. When I want real computing power, then I'll take the MacBook Pro. When I want to remote into my Windows box or my iMac, or update a trouble-ticket from in the field, I want something small and light. And I'm not going to run Windows on my laptop. I spend too much time fixing Windows for my job as it is. Running 10.5 on my Dell mini is a perfect combo for me. I hadn't even planned to install 10.6 on it.

As for the EULA, it is not a law. It is not a contract I signed. And it would fall flat if ever tested in court. I see no issue there. I paid for the software; I instal it where I want; I don't expect support from Apple. Just like installing CP/M on my Apple ][ in 1981; why would I expect Apple to support that?

[tirerim]

However people that do not pay for software are literally the scum of the earth, and deserve to be locked away


Oh, definitely. Well, them and jaywalkers. Rape, murder, and genocide are nothing compared to software piracy.

(I mean, I think people shouldn't steal software, but as crimes go, it's pretty low on my list of things to worry about -- somewhere around people sneaking into movie theaters.)

[Stridder44]

Wait, are you saying that a rumor on the internet was blown way out of proportion? :rolleyes:

[iigsie]

No, it probably isn't. But Apple don't want to make cheap as chips bargain basement products. That sort of complaint is like complaining that Bentley don't make a low carbon family runabout. It isn't their market, and they don't want to be part of that market. Otherwise they would have made one.


That argument is a little weak.....the company that designs and makes Bentleys also makes Skodas in case you have forgotten. That's good business sense.

What Apple doesn't want to do is make products with a profit margin of less than 50%.

[LagunaSol]

Are we now having an unfirestorm

Don't worry, I'm sure someone, sometime, somewhere on the planet will have an iPod explode in their pants and we'll have new headline news.

Wait, that "explode in their pants" part didn't sound right...

[Geordiekeith]

Just following on from a couple of recent posts - I am along-term Mac user, from system 6 on. I currently have two Mac Minis (and a third retired), a black MacBook, my two student daughters have new MacBooks each and my youngest daughter has (but only borrowed) my beloved 12" Powerbook. My study is littered with a Pismo, Lombard, 6320, 6400, LCII, a couple of Colour Classics and even three Powerbook 180's. I have heavily invested in Apple stuff - oh yes, there is the AppleTV and about seven iPods in the family.

So when I have to carry my work PC (Dell laptop) with me (with no extra software allowed, no Skype or movies, restricted Internet access) on business trips I want to take my own small personal computer with me - what the 12" used to be used for. Now I have a Lenovo S10, running Snow Leopard and Windows 7 - the latter only because Skype will not work with Snow Leopard.

Am I really ripping Apple off for using one of my family licenses to do this? I don't want a tablet, I want a small laptop with good battery life - something that fits nicely on tray tables in planes and trains, starts up quickly in lounges, and something I can do my personal stuff on - including typing e-mails or some work files. Steve does not want to give me one, unless he thinks I should use an iPhone (work phone is a Blackberry), so I am a part of the Hackintosh community. Is it so bad to want to to demonstrate to the world that Apple and Mac OS can make even PCs look good.

[paduck]

Even if "support" was disabled for the Atom processor, it is against the EULA for Mac OS X to be installed on non Mac hardware, so people shouldn't be shocked.

It's an assumed risk. They certainly shouldn't complain.

[LagunaSol]

That argument is a little weak.....the company that designs and makes Bentleys also makes Skodas in case you have forgotten. That's good business sense.

What Apple doesn't want to do is make products with a profit margin of less than 50%.

Making a profit margin of 50% on a computer used to be good business sense too, until the Dells and the HPs of the world started to bleed each other dry in a race to the bottom for the now-meaningless title of "market share leader." Soon you'll be able to get a free Dell PC with 10 box tops from your favorite cereal.

Oh wait, solid profit margins are still good business sense. Most PC manufacturers have just forgotten what they learned at their childhood lemonade stands.

[iigsie]

Oh, definitely. Well, them and jaywalkers. Rape, murder, and genocide are nothing compared to software piracy.

(I mean, I think people shouldn't steal software, but as crimes go, it's pretty low on my list of things to worry about -- somewhere around people sneaking into movie theaters.)

I think it's a bit worse than that personally, just because there is essentially no harm done other than revenue lost for the company concerned doesn't make it okay. How would you feel if I stole $50 from your wallet, and justified it with 'it's only a few bucks'. Piracy on the PC side is probably responsible for a significant portion of the viruses that spread.

[Vulpinemac]

PLEASE DELIVER 10.6.2 NOW !!!
I don't want to believe that they are still spending any time around atom, while we need the update NOW ! I want to use safari again !

What the heck are you talking about? I haven't stopped using Safari!

[weckart]

What really happened:

mailto: sjobs@mac.com
from: stellarola@xxxx.com

dude, 10.6.2 totally sucks ass on my netbook.
pls fix.

kthanxbye

[iigsie]

Making a profit margin of 50% on a computer used to be good business sense too, until the Dells and the HPs of the world started to bleed each other dry in a race to the bottom for the now-meaningless title of "market share leader." Soon you'll be able to get a free Dell PC with 10 box tops from your favorite cereal.

Oh wait, solid profit margins are still good business sense. Most PC manufacturers have just forgotten what they learned at their childhood lemonade stands.

If apple made a netbook, even for twice the price of a HP or Samsung or whatever, it would still sell in high numbers. Fact.

[weckart]

If apple made a netbook, even for twice the price of a HP or Samsung or whatever, it would still sell in high numbers. Fact.

But only to the faithful and possibly at the expense of other, possibly more profitable, sales. Twice the price of the Samsung is approaching the price of the cheapest Macbook.

The netbooks that enjoy the highest sales are those that are perceived to offer the best value, not necessarily the best designed/looking or most coveted brand. Acer's netbooks massively outsell Sony's, despite the latter's undoubted cachet.

To get the most out this market, the price needs to be pitched at a level such that it becomes an additional purchase, rather than replacement purchase.

[zami]

As an owner of a Dell Mini 9 Running OSX, I would like to say that not all off us in the Hackentosh community are using torrented illegal copies of the operating system. I installed from a retail Family Pack disk that I used for my two 20" iMacs, my daughter's MacBook Pro, and my old reliable PowerMac G4. (which contradicts your earlier generalized point that the hackentoshers don't want to pay the premium for "real" Apple hardware).

Are there those who download a torrent and put it on a cheap machine? Yes, but I don't think that they are a majority of the hobbiest out there. Almost all of the other Dell Mini OSX86ers that I have had contact with used a purchased retail disk and also have a "real Mac" as well.

Exactly, I'm in exactly the same situation as yourself.

The Dell Mini 9 is a brilliant solution for having an ultraportable laptop running OS X. Frankly I'd take it over a MacBook Air any day even at the same price just for the sheer convenience of it's size.

[*LTD*]

The other thread was a good discussion all the same.

[Maserati7200]

I can confirm that Max OS X 10.6.2 does not work on my Radio Shack TRS-80. Damn Apple and their short-sighted greed.

WAIT A MINUTE!!! Are you telling me that 10.6.2 isn't compatible with my Commodore 64?? GOD DAMMIT! Now I have to buy a new computer :(

[*LTD*]

WAIT A MINUTE!!! Are you telling me that 10.6.2 isn't compatible with my Commodore 64?? GOD DAMMIT! Now I have to buy a new computer :(

FUUUUUUUU . . . . !!!!!!!!!!!

[Stellarola]

I for one am shocked, shocked I tell you, that information on a random persons blog turned out to be untrue, shocked.

Still said random person has picked up alot of free advertising, hopefully the "web" community will learn not to repost someones random ramblings, haha who am I kidding!

I wouldn't call it untrue. If you read my post I said in the current developer build it was disabled, I never said the final. However OSXDaily took my post and ran with it, and so did every other site out there. I didn't think anyone gave a damn, tbh.

[FakeWozniak]

As for the EULA, it is not a law. It is not a contract I signed. And it would fall flat if ever tested in court. I see no issue there. I paid for the software; I instal it where I want; I don't expect support from Apple. Just like installing CP/M on my Apple ][ in 1981; why would I expect Apple to support that?

The Psystar case is interesting. I went to groklaw and read up on that a few weeks ago. I have mixed feelings about EULAs myself. For sake of argument, lets call the EULA void. All that's left is the implied warranty for what is in the Snow Leopard box. It clearly explains requirements on the box, and non-Apple hardware is not supported. So basically, you have a cup coaster and some packaging.

The point is that Hackintosh folks don't have any legal recourse if Apple changed the OS to block unsupported platforms. This is very similar to the Palm Pre arguments. Apple doesn't mind "hacking" when there is no significant $$ impact to the company, but when it shows up on the radar, they will trade a little bad publicity to recoup some of the lost $$.

Check out this story:
http://groklaw.net/article.php?story=2009090111072988

Also, interesting read about Microsoft making a CPM card for Apple IIs. I'm sure the support from Microsoft would be sufficient! :-)
http://www.apple2info.net/hardware/softcard/softcard.htm

[macintoshtoffy]

lol i know safari is well good... just flash makes it wank... and i dont like firefox :( :mad:

There are rumours that 10.1 of Flash is going to make some major improvements (as claimed by Adobe) but I doubt it - Flash will still be the single largest vector of suckage on a platform. It sucks on Mac OS X, it sucks on Linux, it sucks on OpenSolaris - and even on Windows when using Firefox it sucks. I really hope that there is a hell so programmers from Adobe inhabit the lowest depths for throwing such a heap of garbage on the rest of humanity.

[SandynJosh]

I can't believe the uproar over this not working on an Atom processor. What has me concerned is that it won't work on my G5 processor.

[TsMkLg068426]

WAIT A MINUTE!!! Are you telling me that 10.6.2 isn't compatible with my Commodore 64?? GOD DAMMIT! Now I have to buy a new computer :(


This is a sign for to get a job:rolleyes::apple:

[SandynJosh]

WAIT A MINUTE!!! Are you telling me that 10.6.2 isn't compatible with my Commodore 64?? GOD DAMMIT! Now I have to buy a new computer :(

...and this is how Apple is doing it's part in stimulating the economy...in China.

[2992]

which is the best netbook around to run SnowLeo? :p

[Keniff]

WAIT A MINUTE!!! Are you telling me that 10.6.2 isn't compatible with my Commodore 64?? GOD DAMMIT! Now I have to buy a new computer :(

Aaarrrrgggghhh!!

DAMN THIS MODERN TECHNOLOGY!!



;)

[arkmannj]

which is the best netbook around to run SnowLeo? :p

I hear the dell Mini 10 (not 10v) is really good, though I can't speak from experience.

[harlinator]

It's funny... PC users hate Macs but they put OS X on their PC's... doesn't make much sense... oh but wait! It makes TOTAL sense! These jerks can get a copy of OS X and put it on a PC and don't have to pay for it! It has no key codes or authorization other than the Mac hardware itself so here again, we see what cheap assed people use these things. "Go get an OS X installer from a friend and there you go!" Apple is loosing money on this and you know it's causing the real Mac users that have been dedicated users since it'd conception headaches because Apple has to put all kinds of resources to combat it instead of using it's resources on product development that benefit the loyal and legal Mac owners.
I hate to admit it but I like copy protection more and more now! Why should the people who own Macs shell out their hard earned cash and have to get screwed by some punk assed cheap bastards running OS X on PC **** hardware?
Hmmm... Windows 7 runs about $219.00 from MS... ok, OS X SL is going to cost you $300.00... but $29.00 for registered (by serial number) Apple hardware!
We'll see how many hackintosh users there will be as soon as this is implemented he he... NONE!
It's only evident that 3% even purchase OS X to run on that crap!
Apple should shut it down! It's a form of cracking software and it's not legal... period!

[lifeinhd]

I hear the dell Mini 10 (not 10v) is really good, though I can't speak from experience.

Actually, it won't run on the 10, due to graphics issues. It will only work on the 10v.

[arkmannj]

Actually, it won't run on the 10, due to graphics issues. It will only work on the 10v.

Sorry, I knew that, got it all typed backwards... thanks for the correction ::sigh::

[Eric S.]

Apple is loosing money on this and you know it's causing the real Mac users that have been dedicated users since it'd conception headaches because Apple has to put all kinds of resources to combat it instead of using it's resources on product development that benefit the loyal and legal Mac owners.

What "all kinds of resources" is Apple using on this?

Hmmm... Windows 7 runs about $219.00 from MS... ok, OS X SL is going to cost you $300.00... but $29.00 for registered (by serial number) Apple hardware!

Apple doesn't care much because they make their money from hardware sales, not software like Microsoft. So far there aren't enough hackintoshes out there to put any kind of dent in their HW sales. Apple is going after Psystar because they want to choke off the commercial hackintoshes before they get started, but even Psystar hasn't been a real threat so far.

We'll see how many hackintosh users there will be as soon as this is implemented he he... NONE!

The people I know who have built hackintoshes have paid for their copy of OS X. And they all have at least one Apple system, so they probably could have bought it even with your proposed scheme.

It's only evident that 3% even purchase OS X to run on that crap!

Where did you get that number?

Apple should shut it down! It's a form of cracking software and it's not legal... period!

Until a court rules on it, its legality is a gray area.

[CQd44]

It's funny... PC users hate Macs but they put OS X on their PC's... doesn't make much sense... oh but wait! It makes TOTAL sense! These jerks can get a copy of OS X and put it on a PC and don't have to pay for it! It has no key codes or authorization other than the Mac hardware itself so here again, we see what cheap assed people use these things. "Go get an OS X installer from a friend and there you go!" Apple is loosing money on this and you know it's causing the real Mac users that have been dedicated users since it'd conception headaches because Apple has to put all kinds of resources to combat it instead of using it's resources on product development that benefit the loyal and legal Mac owners.
I hate to admit it but I like copy protection more and more now! Why should the people who own Macs shell out their hard earned cash and have to get screwed by some punk assed cheap bastards running OS X on PC **** hardware?
Hmmm... Windows 7 runs about $219.00 from MS... ok, OS X SL is going to cost you $300.00... but $29.00 for registered (by serial number) Apple hardware!
We'll see how many hackintosh users there will be as soon as this is implemented he he... NONE!
It's only evident that 3% even purchase OS X to run on that crap!
Apple should shut it down! It's a form of cracking software and it's not legal... period!

If it makes you feel any better, I have OS X installed just for kicks and because my friend needs it occasionally and has no mac of his own. I don't do anything serious on it. I'm not too big a fan of its window managing (not saying it's bad, it just doesn't suit me.)

[Mushi-shi]

It's funny... PC users hate Macs but they put OS X on their PC's... doesn't make much sense... oh but wait! It makes TOTAL sense! These jerks can get a copy of OS X and put it on a PC and don't have to pay for it! It has no key codes or authorization other than the Mac hardware itself so here again, we see what cheap assed people use these things. "Go get an OS X installer from a friend and there you go!" Apple is loosing money on this and you know it's causing the real Mac users that have been dedicated users since it'd conception headaches because Apple has to put all kinds of resources to combat it instead of using it's resources on product development that benefit the loyal and legal Mac owners.
I hate to admit it but I like copy protection more and more now! Why should the people who own Macs shell out their hard earned cash and have to get screwed by some punk assed cheap bastards running OS X on PC **** hardware?
Hmmm... Windows 7 runs about $219.00 from MS... ok, OS X SL is going to cost you $300.00... but $29.00 for registered (by serial number) Apple hardware!
We'll see how many hackintosh users there will be as soon as this is implemented he he... NONE!
It's only evident that 3% even purchase OS X to run on that crap!
Apple should shut it down! It's a form of cracking software and it's not legal... period!
So you are saying if everyone are forced to buy apple hardware then apple will work on dropping the price on apple hardware.. Well i can say it short.. No they wont.. look at all the time they was using PPC...

My picture of you are one that really want to try to run osx86 but you just cant figure out how to follow a guide so now all that runs osx86 are stupid... Almost makes me want to ask.. Did i ban you from a osx86 channel... lol..

But my point is... I have osx86 and i have real macs.. my real macs after i had been running osx86.. Before that time i was one of the pc users that did hate osx like the plage.. but after osx86 getting to know the os i started to like it so i did go out using my hard earned money on apple hardware... And i have sevel friends that did the same..

[DMann]

Making a profit margin of 50% on a computer used to be good business sense too, until the Dells and the HPs of the world started to bleed each other dry in a race to the bottom for the now-meaningless title of "market share leader." Soon you'll be able to get a free Dell PC with 10 box tops from your favorite cereal.

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/business/consuminginterests/blog/Steve_Dell_Ad.jpg
Redemption! - A.S.

[SimonMW]

That argument is a little weak.....the company that designs and makes Bentleys also makes Skodas in case you have forgotten. That's good business sense.

What Apple doesn't want to do is make products with a profit margin of less than 50%.

I think you'll find that although Bentley are now under the banner of another company, they are still Bentley, a totally separate company. Skoda used to be a ****** east European car manufacturer who made cars that fell apart very quickly. The fact that a better manufacturer bought them out and improved them doesn't change the fact that they are still run as totally different companies.

Going on what you say the equivalent would be for Apple to buy Dell for example, and carry on making Dell computers under the name "Dell". Apples with OS X would still be as they are. Dell's would still have Windows because if in some fantasy world Apple did buy them out, they wouldn't be so stupid as to alienate all the existing Dell customers by putting OS X on them. To do that would strangle the whole 'exclusivity' factor of owning a true Mac with OS X on it.

[cheesymogul]

Personally, I think it is unfair of those Netbook folks installing MacOSX. Apple should lock them out. I had to pay Apple's hardware premium to use their software, they should too. Apple probably will lock them out regardless of the table to protect the hardware margins. I think they are on the tightrope now between protecting margins and keeping the hacker base happy.

Unfair? Apple doesn't deliver anything that could be called a netbook without bending the term drastically. Not even a high priced one in the $800 range!
An ultra-thin 13" notebook or a smart phone with a simplified OS are still miles away from that netbook philosophy...

Should Mac people who are desperate for a small footprint device rather switch to the Windows platform, even when an OSX installation on these Atom things is possible?
What if these users start to grow on Win 7 and like it? The HORRORRR!!!

Apple is playing in a very proprietary field with a fantastic OS that makes almost everybody happy. They also build a rather limited line of great computers that may fulfill certain needs.
But unfortunately they left barn-door-sized gaps in their model line!
Just look what most hackintoshers build: Mainly towers with medium power quads or netbooks.
Fill these gaps and deliver solutions for these demands. Then no hackintosh won't be worth the effort anymore.

[cheesymogul]

Don't you think that if someone published idiot-proof instructions on how to download Snow Leopard from a bit torrent, then install it on a $300 low end machine, that the millions of folks buying genuine Apple hardware and software would feel upset about this.
Why the heck should we be upset?
The only thing upsetting me for years is that I cannot buy a new genuine Apple laptop with a screen smaller than 13"!!!
If the Air had a smaller screen (10 or 11") I would run to buy it. Even for 1200 bucks...

[ozyr]

Frankly, I'm just laughing at all the Hackintosh folks that were so pissed off just a day or two ago when they thought Atom was being cut out of 10.6.2.

Nothing like a bit of entertainment (yeah, I like watching people rank in posts about such things - deal with it). :rolleyes:

[paduck]

Personally, I think it is unfair of those Netbook folks installing MacOSX. Apple should lock them out. I had to pay Apple's hardware premium to use their software, they should too. Apple probably will lock them out regardless of the table to protect the hardware margins. I think they are on the tightrope now between protecting margins and keeping the hacker base happy.

You must hate taking plane flights then since everyone pays a different price.

With your Apple Mac, you get fully supported hardware, a warranty and (generally) troublefree operation, installation, etc. with a guarantee of future compatibility.

Hackintosh users have none of that. It's a hassle to install and keep running. It doesn't always work. If it doesn't work, you have no one like Apple to go to for help.

That's what you paid extra to avoid. If you don't want to pay extra, there is no real barrier to entry for you. You can do what they did and get yourself a netbook. Apple doesn't do netbooks because they don't see the razor-thin margins in that market appealing to their business model. That's fine. I wouldn't have bought a Mac laptop, but a netbook worked well for me. I would have bought an iMac instead of building my own (the lineup was stale when I wanted to buy), so I prove both arguments...Still, I've owned every major product line of Apple computer and stuck with them through bad times, so my fanboy credentials are pretty good.

[paduck]

Frankly, I'm just laughing at all the Hackintosh folks that were so pissed off just a day or two ago when they thought Atom was being cut out of 10.6.2.

Nothing like a bit of entertainment (yeah, I like watching people rank in posts about such things - deal with it). :rolleyes:

If you look at the posts, it was more of the people saying "yeah, I'm glad Apple dropped Atom, I hate hackintoshes."

I don't have any sympathy for people who build Hackintoshes and get orphaned by an Apple upgrade. It's a risk they (I) assumed when they built the system. I do wonder about the motivations of people who complain about what others are doing though.

[mrboult]

wow, this is the longest piece of waffle I've seen in ages. You are simply incorrect in most of what you have said.

It's funny... PC users hate Macs but they put OS X on their PC's... doesn't make much sense... oh but wait! It makes TOTAL sense! These jerks can get a copy of OS X and put it on a PC and don't have to pay for it! It has no key codes or authorization other than the Mac hardware itself so here again, we see what cheap assed people use these things. "Go get an OS X installer from a friend and there you go!" Apple is loosing money on this and you know it's causing the real Mac users that have been dedicated users since it'd conception headaches because Apple has to put all kinds of resources to combat it instead of using it's resources on product development that benefit the loyal and legal Mac owners.
I hate to admit it but I like copy protection more and more now! Why should the people who own Macs shell out their hard earned cash and have to get screwed by some punk assed cheap bastards running OS X on PC **** hardware?
Hmmm... Windows 7 runs about $219.00 from MS... ok, OS X SL is going to cost you $300.00... but $29.00 for registered (by serial number) Apple hardware!
We'll see how many hackintosh users there will be as soon as this is implemented he he... NONE!
It's only evident that 3% even purchase OS X to run on that crap!
Apple should shut it down! It's a form of cracking software and it's not legal... period!

[harlinator]

So you are saying if everyone are forced to buy apple hardware then apple will work on dropping the price on apple hardware.. Well i can say it short.. No they wont.. look at all the time they was using PPC...

My picture of you are one that really want to try to run osx86 but you just cant figure out how to follow a guide so now all that runs osx86 are stupid... Almost makes me want to ask.. Did i ban you from a osx86 channel... lol..

But my point is... I have osx86 and i have real macs.. my real macs after i had been running osx86.. Before that time i was one of the pc users that did hate osx like the plage.. but after osx86 getting to know the os i started to like it so i did go out using my hard earned money on apple hardware... And i have sevel friends that did the same..
NO ONE IS FORCING ANYONE TO DO ANYTHING!!!!
Where in the heck do you get that? This is what I'm talking about! The mindset of these kids just really amazes me to no end!

You have a CHOICE! Use a Mac or use a PC!!!

Man, I have a render farm of 15 OCTAL Nehalems and have been a LOYAL MACINTOSH user since the Mac plus! I have stock in Apple because they are how I make a living... something you cheap Hackintosh users don't understand.
My work is mission critical! I have PC's too (I HAVE to unfortunately) and they are CONSTANTLY breaking down due to overheating and just garbage parts in them. My Macs have NEVER broke down and in ten years I have had one bad one... I have 12 PC's sitting in the back room that are doorstops in the same amount of time. Please boy, don't sell me on your BS!
Mac hardware is better and every Mac I have owned I was able to sell @ 2/3 of the price I paid for them... I have NEVER EVER been able to sell an old retired PC because NO ONE WANTS THEM!
It's called Return on Investment bud, and until you understand (you never will) that they are TOOLS... you'll sit back and keep cracking and being a low life!

[harlinator]

wow, this is the longest piece of waffle I've seen in ages. You are simply incorrect in most of what you have said.
Well then CORRECT me PROFESSOR!
Waffle... WTF is a waffle?
Interesting!
This is PURE evidence of the community of Hackintosh he he...
It's funny how they want to run the newest Mac OS on their boxes because they can claim that "they bought it"... the $29.00 is for the people who paid for a Mac in the first place he he... not some hacker to go put it on PC hardware and crack the ROM.
Again... we see how broke the hackintosh community is LOL!
I really hate saying this but I can't WAIT till Apple implements copy protection he he... I own Macs so I'm not concerned.
I just want to wipe the grin off their thieving little faces!

[Arthagnan]

Mac hardware is better and every Mac I have owned I was able to sell @ 2/3 of the price I paid for them...

Nah, Mac hardware isnt better... But I agree, they keep their value better.

[harlinator]

What "all kinds of resources" is Apple using on this?


Court cost! Have you taken anyone to court lately?
No, you've probable been taken "TO" court!
You go down my list as if your some type of analyst...
You seem more like a TRAITOR!


Apple doesn't care much because they make their money from hardware sales, not software like Microsoft. So far there aren't enough hackintoshes out there to put any kind of dent in their HW sales. Apple is going after Psystar because they want to choke off the commercial hackintoshes before they get started, but even Psystar hasn't been a real threat so far.
You answered the question from the fifth word in that reply..."because they make their money from hardware sales"
If they're NOT selling a Mac for the OS to run on, aren't they loosing money?
YES!
For every last stinking one of them, if you counted up the PC's running OS X out there it would be some cash bud! So Apple should just charge the same price as MS for their OS to run on multiple platforms then (it won't happen) then we would really know if it was a sincere love of the OS or another crack technique to be a thief!!!
In which we really KNOW the real reason is because they don't have to pay for it!
You guy's give yourselves away by saying you own a Mac and that you go out and buy another install CD to install the OS on your PC's... man, I DON'T believe you @ all... you think we are THAT stupid?
Who in their right mind would go buy an OS X install DVD (when they already have one if they own a Mac already) for their other Mac (let alone a PC) do you think we are that stupid?
Yes you do, and I am NOT buying it!
APPLE isn't either!

[harlinator]

Nah, Mac hardware isnt better... But I agree, they keep their value better.
It isn't WORSE by any means! Hey, I do this for a living and you know what?
Read my post about how many PC's I've gone through. if they are just as good or better than a Mac, why are they breaking bud?
I KNOW this first hand my man, C'mon, your user experience is what, a notebook?
Please...

[weckart]

Going on what you say the equivalent would be for Apple to buy Dell for example, and carry on making Dell computers under the name "Dell". Apples with OS X would still be as they are. Dell's would still have Windows because if in some fantasy world Apple did buy them out, they wouldn't be so stupid as to alienate all the existing Dell customers by putting OS X on them. To do that would strangle the whole 'exclusivity' factor of owning a true Mac with OS X on it.

Which would have the added benefit of appalling all of the frothing-at-the-mouth fanboys to such an extent that they would ditch Apple to find some other overpriced trinket to be insufferably smug over.


I really hate saying this but I can't WAIT till Apple implements copy protection he he... I own Macs so I'm not concerned.
I just want to wipe the grin off their thieving little faces!

Yes, because that has totally eradicated the piracy problem with Windows, Blu-ray, DVDs, Xbox, PS3 etc

The only people who are inconvenienced by DRM/Activation registration codes are the honest. Did you learn nothing from Apple's pursuit of a DRM-free iTunes store?

It sure seems like it.

[mrboult]

Well then CORRECT me PROFESSOR!
Waffle... WTF is a waffle?
Interesting!
This is PURE evidence of the community of Hackintosh he he...
It's funny how they want to run the newest Mac OS on their boxes because they can claim that "they bought it"... the $29.00 is for the people who paid for a Mac in the first place he he... not some hacker to go put it on PC hardware and crack the ROM.
Again... we see how broke the hackintosh community is LOL!
I really hate saying this but I can't WAIT till Apple implements copy protection he he... I own Macs so I'm not concerned.
I just want to wipe the grin off their thieving little faces!





OK*calm*down*sir.*
I*have*solely*used*and*purchased*Mac*since*about*1992*ish.*I*too*use*them*professionally.

I*am*not*trying*to*get*into*the*hackintosh*debate*as*I*have*no*concluded*opinion.*I*was*merely*point ing*out*that*in*your*mac*loving*rant*you*presented*very*little*ACCURATE*information.

I*don't*mean*to*fuel*this*age*old*argument*and*I*respect*and*share*your*love*of*apple,*however*I*thi nk*think*this*argument*is*rarely*as*Black*and*White*as*each*side*makes*out.**

And*as*for*the*previous*'kid'*comment,*he*he,*I*wish!

[shamino]

You answered the question from the fifth word in that reply..."because they make their money from hardware sales"
If they're NOT selling a Mac for the OS to run on, aren't they loosing money?
YES!
Lots of people say this, but it makes absolutely no sense.

I bought my Mac (a dual-PPC unit) in 2002. It came with 10.1. I have since bought 10.2, 10.3, 10.4 and 10.5.

Do you mean to say that Apple sold me those four installations at a loss every time? And that they are somehow OK with that because of profit from a sale they made seven years ago?

That's just crazy talk. And if they were doing it, they would be obligated to report such creative (and stupid) bookkeeping in all their financial reports.

[Mushi-shi]

NO ONE IS FORCING ANYONE TO DO ANYTHING!!!!
Where in the heck do you get that? This is what I'm talking about! The mindset of these kids just really amazes me to no end!

You have a CHOICE! Use a Mac or use a PC!!!

Man, I have a render farm of 15 OCTAL Nehalems and have been a LOYAL MACINTOSH user since the Mac plus! I have stock in Apple because they are how I make a living... something you cheap Hackintosh users don't understand.
My work is mission critical! I have PC's too (I HAVE to unfortunately) and they are CONSTANTLY breaking down due to overheating and just garbage parts in them. My Macs have NEVER broke down and in ten years I have had one bad one... I have 12 PC's sitting in the back room that are doorstops in the same amount of time. Please boy, don't sell me on your BS!
Mac hardware is better and every Mac I have owned I was able to sell @ 2/3 of the price I paid for them... I have NEVER EVER been able to sell an old retired PC because NO ONE WANTS THEM!
It's called Return on Investment bud, and until you understand (you never will) that they are TOOLS... you'll sit back and keep cracking and being a low life!

Lool there are so much wrong in your statement there that i dont know where to start.

first of all i am not cheap i dont mind paying the price stuff cost, but not all of us makes a million or more pr year so we can buy 15 Mac Pros... Lucky you.

What strikes me that you dont mind paying for the mac but on the other hand i have to say looks like you buy the all to cheap pc models.. I have never had a pc or a part in a pc die on me from something i was't the cause of (Most bios updates on motherboards or grapichs cards something Macs can die from also) i have never had a pc overheat but then again i dont mind building the pc my self or but from a brand i know dont have the problems.

And mac hardware is NOT better then pc hardware.. IT IS THE SAME CHIPS apple use now.. The chipset on your so loved mac pros are the same as any other dual socket 1366 motherboard, the xeons are the same as the one you get at your local pc pusher..

A mac now is nothing more then a PC with the apple EFI.

but sorry to say but you are not any better then the PC users that clame that osx are bad... You are a Apple Fan boy, that is fine but just know this.. Most people hate the kind of fanitic fanboy that you are.

i see myself as open minded, i like mac's, pc's i dont mind windows, osx or linux at all... and i dont prefere one over another when i talk to people because i have to remember they can choose what they want.

[Eric S.]

Apple is playing in a very proprietary field with a fantastic OS that makes almost everybody happy. They also build a rather limited line of great computers that may fulfill certain needs.
But unfortunately they left barn-door-sized gaps in their model line!
Just look what most hackintoshers build: Mainly towers with medium power quads or netbooks.
Fill these gaps and deliver solutions for these demands. Then no hackintosh won't be worth the effort anymore.

I agree 100%.

Man, I have a render farm of 15 OCTAL Nehalems and have been a LOYAL MACINTOSH user since the Mac plus! I have stock in Apple because they are how I make a living... something you cheap Hackintosh users don't understand.

I have been a loyal Mac user since the Mac Plus also. But Apple no longer makes the midrange tower product that I want so I'm considering the hackintosh route now, it's as simple as that.

Court cost! Have you taken anyone to court lately?

Like any huge corporation, Apple has a legal department that deals with a large number of issues. The Psystar action is just one of them and it certainly isn't diverting any resources from product development.

You go down my list as if your some type of analyst...
You seem more like a TRAITOR!

If you don't want your statements to be analyzed then don't post.

For every last stinking one of them, if you counted up the PC's running OS X out there it would be some cash bud!

Completely wrong. All the hackintosh users I know have built a midrange tower system, which is a product that Apple doesn't sell. So how is Apple losing money on a product they don't offer?

You guy's give yourselves away by saying you own a Mac and that you go out and buy another install CD to install the OS on your PC's... man, I DON'T believe you @ all... you think we are THAT stupid?
Who in their right mind would go buy an OS X install DVD (when they already have one if they own a Mac already) for their other Mac (let alone a PC) do you think we are that stupid?
Yes you do, and I am NOT buying it!
APPLE isn't either!

You give yourself away. Apparently you have 15 octal Nehalems and you only bought one copy of OS X. I'd guess that a very large number of people who own more than one Mac only buy a single copy of OS X instead of the "family pack." Apple is probably losing a lot more money on OS sales from their "loyal" Mac customers than they are from hackintosh users.

[CQd44]

Court cost! Have you taken anyone to court lately?
No, you've probable been taken "TO" court!
You go down my list as if your some type of analyst...
You seem more like a TRAITOR!



You answered the question from the fifth word in that reply..."because they make their money from hardware sales"
If they're NOT selling a Mac for the OS to run on, aren't they loosing money?
YES!
For every last stinking one of them, if you counted up the PC's running OS X out there it would be some cash bud! So Apple should just charge the same price as MS for their OS to run on multiple platforms then (it won't happen) then we would really know if it was a sincere love of the OS or another crack technique to be a thief!!!
In which we really KNOW the real reason is because they don't have to pay for it!
You guy's give yourselves away by saying you own a Mac and that you go out and buy another install CD to install the OS on your PC's... man, I DON'T believe you @ all... you think we are THAT stupid?
Who in their right mind would go buy an OS X install DVD (when they already have one if they own a Mac already) for their other Mac (let alone a PC) do you think we are that stupid?
Yes you do, and I am NOT buying it!
APPLE isn't either!

So angry. Calm down buddy :]

[cheesymogul]

You answered the question from the fifth word in that reply..."because they make their money from hardware sales"
If they're NOT selling a Mac for the OS to run on, aren't they loosing money?
YES!

NO! In the case of netbook hackintoshs Apple is not going to lose (m)any sales. The reason: They have no viable netbook alternative of their own to offer (yet)!
Or do you seriously think that someone who wants an ultra-portable notebook will buy a Macbook, Pro or Air instead? There is only a slim chance, because most Hackintosh netbook users already got one (or two)!

The only way Apple still can make a few bucks from the netbook hype, is by selling their OS to a few honest hackers.
This won't change until the day they present their own and long overdue tablet/netbook device, and nobody gives a **** about PC netbooks anymore.

[iigsie]

I think you'll find that although Bentley are now under the banner of another company, they are still Bentley, a totally separate company. Skoda used to be a ****** east European car manufacturer who made cars that fell apart very quickly. The fact that a better manufacturer bought them out and improved them doesn't change the fact that they are still run as totally different companies.

Going on what you say the equivalent would be for Apple to buy Dell for example, and carry on making Dell computers under the name "Dell". Apples with OS X would still be as they are. Dell's would still have Windows because if in some fantasy world Apple did buy them out, they wouldn't be so stupid as to alienate all the existing Dell customers by putting OS X on them. To do that would strangle the whole 'exclusivity' factor of owning a true Mac with OS X on it.



You really do not have any idea how VW runs its sister companies. Try working for one of them, or try asking people who work for them. Your opinion will change very quickly if you listen to what they/we say.


Your second point is completely irrelevant to the original comment I was replying back to, which was that Apple is interested in the low end market, at least to some extent, or we would not have the Mac mini, MacBook and even the Shuffle.

[iigsie]

I can't believe the uproar over this not working on an Atom processor. What has me concerned is that it won't work on my G5 processor.


Your hardware is out of date. Accept it and move on. Most others have, including me.

The Atom is relatively new at least, G5's are certainly not.

[twoodcc]

i bet it'll work on atom processors when released

[harlinator]

I agree 100%.



I have been a loyal Mac user since the Mac Plus also. But Apple no longer makes the midrange tower product that I want so I'm considering the hackintosh route now, it's as simple as that.



Like any huge corporation, Apple has a legal department that deals with a large number of issues. The Psystar action is just one of them and it certainly isn't diverting any resources from product development.



If you don't want your statements to be analyzed then don't post.



Completely wrong. All the hackintosh users I know have built a midrange tower system, which is a product that Apple doesn't sell. So how is Apple losing money on a product they don't offer?



You give yourself away. Apparently you have 15 octal Nehalems and you only bought one copy of OS X. I'd guess that a very large number of people who own more than one Mac only buy a single copy of OS X instead of the "family pack." Apple is probably losing a lot more money on OS sales from their "loyal" Mac customers than they are from hackintosh users.
If I own the hardware I have the software installers to go with them... "why did I even say this?"
Most likely, because you didn't probably know he he..
I LOVE making the hackitoshers sweat!
GTH!:mad::mad::mad:

[lifeinhd]

Man, I have a render farm of 15 OCTAL Nehalems and have been a LOYAL MACINTOSH user since the Mac plus! I have stock in Apple because they are how I make a living... something you cheap Hackintosh users don't understand.
My work is mission critical! I have PC's too (I HAVE to unfortunately) and they are CONSTANTLY breaking down due to overheating and just garbage parts in them. My Macs have NEVER broke down and in ten years I have had one bad one... I have 12 PC's sitting in the back room that are doorstops in the same amount of time. Please boy, don't sell me on your BS!
Mac hardware is better and every Mac I have owned I was able to sell @ 2/3 of the price I paid for them... I have NEVER EVER been able to sell an old retired PC because NO ONE WANTS THEM!
It's called Return on Investment bud, and until you understand (you never will) that they are TOOLS... you'll sit back and keep cracking and being a low life!

So tell me... what exactly have you got against people making Hackintoshes? How does it affect you?

[Eric S.]

I LOVE making the hackitoshers sweat!
GTH!:mad::mad::mad:

I don't know who you have made sweat, certainly not me.

And believe me, Apple has made its share of profit off me in the past 23 years, so if I do decide to go the hackintosh route to get a system that Apple doesn't even sell, my conscience is clear on that score.

[SimonMW]

[QUOTE=iigsie;8765857]You really do not have any idea how VW runs its sister companies. Try working for one of them, or try asking people who work for them. Your opinion will change very quickly if you listen to what they/we say.[quote]

Bentley is a totally separate legal entity like it or not. It might fall under the umbrella of Volkswagen, just as Vauxhall was part of GM. But you'd never mistake a Vauxhall Cavalier for a Buick.

Don't you think that if Apple waned to buy out Dell or someone they would have done already? The fact is that to do so would dilute the Apple brand. Apple is about simplicity and a pared down product line based on function. As opposed to the chaos of Dell offerings that have several gazillion configs and models.

[MorphingDragon]

I don't know who you have made sweat, certainly not me.

And believe me, Apple has made its share of profit off me in the past 23 years, so if I do decide to go the hackintosh route to get a system that Apple doesn't even sell, my conscience is clear on that score.

Why would that matter, just because you've gave your money to Apple before doesn't mean its suddenly right to not do so.

What would happen if I sent my car to the mechanic and didn't pay the mechanic because I've given him profit before? He'd be bloody pissed thats what.

[OllyW]

Why would that matter, just because you've gave your money to Apple before doesn't mean its suddenly right to not do so.

As long as people pay for a retail copy of Leopard for their Hackintosh and aren't doing it for commercial gain (like Pystar) I don't see a problem myself.

[Eric S.]

Why would that matter, just because you've gave your money to Apple before doesn't mean its suddenly right to not do so.

I have to buy an Apple system even when they don't sell what I want? How does that work?

If Apple offered a midrange tower I wouldn't even be having this discussion because I would already have bought one. Like something with a single Core i7-950 for around half of what the cheapest Mac Pro goes for, or even 50% less.

What would happen if I sent my car to the mechanic and didn't pay the mechanic because I've given him profit before? He'd be bloody pissed thats what.

You're going to have to explain that analogy to me. What car have I sent to Apple and didn't pay for?

[Mattie Num Nums]

You're going to have to explain that analogy to me. What car have I sent to Apple and didn't pay for?

Agreed probably one of the worst analogies I have heard!