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View Full Version : Do you believe in EXORCISM??


Foucault
Jul 28, 2004, 04:05 PM
With the upcoming release of The Exorcist: The Beginning, does anyone here been to an exorcism or believes in exorcism. My brother who is a catholic priest has told me that there are actual procedures with the catholic church regarding performing an exorcism, and that my brother has been a witness to some of these. It all very secretive with the church, and he can't confirm any more details to me. But has anyone here actually seen or documented an exorcism???

MongoTheGeek
Jul 28, 2004, 04:28 PM
With the upcoming release of The Exorcist: The Beginning, does anyone here been to an exorcism or believes in exorcism. My brother who is a catholic priest has told me that there are actual procedures with the catholic church regarding performing an exorcism, and that my brother has been a witness to some of these. It all very secretive with the church, and he can't confirm any more details to me. But has anyone here actually seen or documented an exorcism???

Never seen it. A lot of Christians believe in it. There is a good amount of NT scripture devoted to it.

From what I understand the practice is hidden by the church for practical reasons that they don't want people fixated at on it.

JesseJames
Jul 28, 2004, 04:30 PM
No I don't believe in it. It's a vestige from the Dark Ages.

acceber
Jul 28, 2004, 05:07 PM
I'm 17 now, but I've been a Christian for a while (not Catholic though). I've seen The Exorcist but I've never witnessed a real one, I don't think it's a practice recognised in most denominations of Christianity apart from Catholicism.
So yeah, without having heard or witnessed one myself, I can't make a judgement on it's...credibilty, whatever you wanna call it.

Foucault
Jul 28, 2004, 05:25 PM
Personally I think most documented cases of exorcism can be explained by mental illness. My brother is adamant that evil spirits can possess those who have weak souls. I tend to be a practical person, and extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

sjjordan
Jul 28, 2004, 05:25 PM
In the book of Acts, Paul casts out a demon that allows a girl to predict the future. It is a great misconception that exorcism is a gift that only a few possess. In reality, all true christians have authority over Satan and his demons because of their position in Jesus Christ. (For further reading, check out Neil Anderson).

Most people don't believe that the spiritual world even exists, so exorcism seems so incredible when it happens. In actuality, it's just revealing the spiritual world that exists beneath our ignorance. (sound like the matrix? :D )

virividox
Jul 28, 2004, 05:47 PM
i have never witnessed an exorcisim, but i know several ministers and missionaries who say they have performed an exorcism. i would be pretty scared to try and document one, its not ur usual video cam fare of a kids party or a day out on the beach

Foucault
Jul 28, 2004, 06:13 PM
I found a definition of exorcism under the Christian Dictionary...

Exorcism is (1) the act of driving out, or warding off, demons, or evil spirits, from persons, places, or things, which are believed to be possessed or infested by them, or are liable to become victims or instruments of their malice; (2) the means employed for this purpose, especially the solemn and authoritative adjuration of the demon, in the name of God, or any of the higher power in which he is subject.

The word, which is not itself biblical, is derived from exorkizo, which is used in the Septuagint (Genesis 24:3 = cause to swear; III(I) Kings 22:16 = adjure), and in Matthew 26:63, by the high priest to Christ, "I adjure thee by the living God. . ." The non-intensive horkizo and the noun exorkistes (exorcist) occur in Acts 19:13, where the latter (in the plural) is applied to certain strolling Jews who professed to be able to cast out demons. Expulsion by adjuration is, therefore, the primary meaning of exorcism, and when, as in Christian usage, this adjuration is in the name of God or of Christ, exorcism is a strictly religious act or rite. But in ethnic religions, and even among the Jews from the time when there is evidence of its being vogue, exorcism as an act of religion is largely replaced by the use of mere magical and superstitious means, to which non-Catholic writers at the present day sometimes quite unfairly assimilate Christian exorcism. Superstition ought not to be confounded with religion, however much their history may be interwoven, nor magic, however white it may be, with a legitimate religious rite.

Foucault
Jul 28, 2004, 06:15 PM
Some psychologists estimate that over 80% of people are in some way influenced by discarnate entities. These entities range from those who have lived as humans to a variety of entities who were never human. The attachments may be intentional or unintentional. They entities may be benevolent, malevolent or neutral.

http://www.deeptrancenow.com/spirit-releasement.htm

themadchemist
Jul 28, 2004, 06:36 PM
Some psychologists estimate that over 80% of people are in some way influenced by discarnate entities. These entities range from those who have lived as humans to a variety of entities who were never human. The attachments may be intentional or unintentional. They entities may be benevolent, malevolent or neutral.

http://www.deeptrancenow.com/spirit-releasement.htm

1) That site doesn't look like the official source on clinical psychology
2) It says SOME PSYCHOLOGISTS...Maybe just the pot-smoking ones?


In the book of Acts, Paul casts out a demon that allows a girl to predict the future. It is a great misconception that exorcism is a gift that only a few possess. In reality, all true christians have authority over Satan and his demons because of their position in Jesus Christ. (For further reading, check out Neil Anderson).


I think it's dangerous to use religious texts as evidence of physical phenomena. Religion is excellent at helping us find our way through the world in a spiritual sense and in demystifying a lot of complex philosophical perspectives on life. Moreover, religion often provides an excellent ethical foundation for our lives, but it does not, I repeat DOES NOT, prove physical phenomena. Religious texts' stories may be real or fabricated, but that is less important than the themes and ideas those stories convey. But that we cannot prove their veracity means that we can rely on their details as proof of specifics.

jefhatfield
Jul 29, 2004, 08:17 PM
With the upcoming release of The Exorcist: The Beginning, does anyone here been to an exorcism or believes in exorcism. My brother who is a catholic priest has told me that there are actual procedures with the catholic church regarding performing an exorcism, and that my brother has been a witness to some of these. It all very secretive with the church, and he can't confirm any more details to me. But has anyone here actually seen or documented an exorcism???

some christians believe in the supernatural, as was written word for word in the bible, and they think they can go convert people, feed the poor, or exorcise demons just the same...all in a day's work

but many christians either believe the bible was talking in metaphors or if the miraculous exocisms did happen, it was with jesus, his disciples, and during the early years of the church

i take a middle view on the supernatural as it relates to regular humans...christ performed miracles and exorcisms imho...early christians also exorcised demons, healed, and spoke in tongues...i don't think christians do either the first two anymore, but i still believe that they speak in tongues to this day

i used to believe that even speaking in tongues was a phenomenon of the first century church so one day while i was in santa barbara, i got baptized by a charismatic church and later on while driving back home, while i was alone, i spoke in tongues...it was an amazing and truly supernatural experience, but i still don't think that makes all miracles talked about in the bible as things that are done today

also i don't see anybody turning water into wine or walking on water...certain things passed away and certain things/gifts of the holy spirit, remain to this day

it is not inconsistent with the bible for man's relationship with his higher power to change and evolve...2000 years ago we needed a savior in a man who was our diety, but also a human who gave us grace...before that, israel needed a powerful man like moses and there needed to be the law

themadchemist
Jul 29, 2004, 08:22 PM
also i don't see anybody turning water into wine or walking on water...certain things passed away and certain things/gifts of the holy spirit, remain to this day


Acid-catalyzed addition of water to ethene will give you the kick of the wine, if not the flavor. :D

jimsowden
Jul 29, 2004, 09:55 PM
religion is the opiate of the masses.

blackfox
Jul 29, 2004, 10:13 PM
opiates are the religion of the messes?...

themadchemist
Jul 30, 2004, 01:10 PM
opiates are the religion of the messes?...

messes are opiate religions?...


Now this is just geting silly.

FriarCrazy
Jul 30, 2004, 01:32 PM
religion is the opiate of the masses.

Marx was a loser, and his ideas failed. I always laugh when that quote is used to try to make organized religion look weak.

strider42
Jul 30, 2004, 01:36 PM
Personally I think most documented cases of exorcism can be explained by mental illness. My brother is adamant that evil spirits can possess those who have weak souls. I tend to be a practical person, and extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

For the Catholic church, its a matter of faith. Church doctrine supports the idea of exorcists, and they will perform them. but to get them done nowadays, you have to to get permission from the church authorities, and that will only come after extensive medical and psychological testing. They don't just do it because someone "looks' possessed. I don't believe in it, but in the Catholic faith, its a recognized, valid part of the religion. the church doesn't publicize it very much though, for a number o obvious reasons.

johnnowak
Jul 30, 2004, 02:35 PM
Marx was a loser, and his ideas failed. I always laugh when that quote is used to try to make organized religion look weak.

Marx was not a "loser", and his ideas were never really implemented. I laugh every time I witness more Marxist-paranoid McCarthyism.

JesseJames
Jul 30, 2004, 03:55 PM
Communism, socialism, Marxism, whatever. It only works on paper.
It doesn't really account for human nature. That's why it doesn't quite work.
It'd be nice if it did but human nature is to try and out-perform the other guy and be rewarded extra for said performance.

themadchemist
Jul 30, 2004, 04:56 PM
I find it ironic that Christian "scientists" conduct exorcisms.

poopyhead
Jul 30, 2004, 05:11 PM
Communism, socialism, Marxism, whatever. It only works on paper.
It doesn't really account for human nature. That's why it doesn't quite work.
It'd be nice if it did but human nature is to try and out-perform the other guy and be rewarded extra for said performance.

communism does work in small communities
marx was right in his dialectical materialism and much of his analysis of history and is far from being a looser
many of the early christians lived in quasi socialist communities and faired quite well
the christian relegion was for several centuries the opiate of the masses
and was used succesfuly by a combination of the church and royals/petty royals to keep their subjects subservient and to quell rebellion

Foucault
Jul 30, 2004, 06:02 PM
how the hell did we get from exorcism to communism in one thread???

parrothead
Jul 30, 2004, 06:50 PM
Well I excorcised this morning at the gym, does that count. ;) :D

parrothead
Jul 30, 2004, 06:54 PM
I find it ironic that Christian "scientists" conduct exorcisms.

Do you mean scientists that also happen to be Christian or something else?

themadchemist
Jul 30, 2004, 07:03 PM
Do you mean scientists that also happen to be Christian or something else?

let's go with something else. I know not all Christian scientists engage in it, but it does seem to be an activity at least condoned by the church, which I find surprising considering the etymology of the church's name.

parrothead
Jul 30, 2004, 07:19 PM
let's go with something else. I know not all Christian scientists engage in it, but it does seem to be an activity at least condoned by the church, which I find surprising considering the etymology of the church's name.

Actually there is nothing at all that would even come close to "exorcism" anywhere in Christian Science. Also, even if some CS'rs were to practice exorcisms, it would most definitely not be condoned by the church. So I agree, let's go with "something else."

rainman::|:|
Jul 30, 2004, 07:43 PM
i don't believe in unicorns, i don't believe in leprechauns, and i don't believe in exorcisms.

i do believe, however, that christianity is one of the best-run corporations on the planet. oldest, too.

paul

themadchemist
Jul 30, 2004, 09:52 PM
Actually there is nothing at all that would even come close to "exorcism" anywhere in Christian Science. Also, even if some CS'rs were to practice exorcisms, it would most definitely not be condoned by the church. So I agree, let's go with "something else."

oh, ok. I'll take it from you. I've read some articles suggesting this, and that so that was what I was getting at. If I'm mistaken, I accept my fallacy, and any apologies if I offended you.

themadchemist
Jul 30, 2004, 09:53 PM
i don't believe in unicorns, i don't believe in leprechauns, and i don't believe in exorcisms.

i do believe, however, that christianity is one of the best-run corporations on the planet. oldest, too.

paul

Nah, East India Company was run better. :mad:

invaLPsion
Jul 30, 2004, 10:21 PM
First off, Exorcist 1 & 3... TERRIFIC MOVIES! :)
Exorcist 2... not so good... :D

Exorcism continues because there are those who believe that they have been possessed by demons or evil spirits. They have a mental illness which leads them to believe so. When an exorcism occurs on these individuals, it acts as a placebo, making them believe that they have been freed from their spiritual imprisonment.

Again, great movies, and the new movie looks damn good. :D

parrothead
Jul 30, 2004, 10:34 PM
oh, ok. I'll take it from you. I've read some articles suggesting this, and that so that was what I was getting at. If I'm mistaken, I accept my fallacy, and any apologies if I offended you.

No worries at all, no offense taken, just thought it would be nice to correct you before someone did get offended. :D

agreenster
Jul 30, 2004, 11:40 PM
There's no such thing as demon possession, therefore there is no such thing as a genuine exorcism.

AssassinOfGates
Jul 31, 2004, 03:12 AM
There is exorcism! It just requires a deranged Leslie Nielsen singing rock music in front of Linda Blair :D