Can metal be considered a sub-genre of rock music?

[rickmathew]

Many times I've heard, undoubtedly professed, that heavy metal is a sub-genre of rock from an evolutionary standpoint and because it still compares to rock today. Is this at all debatable? I don't think it is for a few reasons but was wondering what others thought before expounding. Thoughts?

[c-Row]

"Evolutionary" rock itself would be a sub-genre. Guitars have been around pretty long. :p

[Mattaut]

I wouldn't call it a sub-genre of rock, but it definitely evolved from rock. Maybe back in the 70s you could call it a sub-genre of rock cause you could really hear the similarities, but the sound of heavy metal has gotten so much heavier in present times that you can't really compare it to rock now. There's also a **** load of sub-genres under heavy metal, I think it has earned it's own genre.
All music has evolved from the music before it, you could say everything is a sub-genre of classical if you're looking from an evolutionary stand point. Considering the complexities of some heavy metal music, it might be closer to classical than rock lol.

[mkrishnan]

Is this at all debatable?

One holdout I'd have is that a fair amount of metal (I think metal itself is pretty heterogenous) is based on the major/minor scales or the modal scales. Whereas usually the defining characteristic of rock music is that it is fast blues-based music. So in that sense, punk, which is more often blues-based, is a variation of rock (i.e. blues played even faster yet), but metal is not.

But that's pretty esoteric, and the term "rock" is not strictly used in that fashion....

[Big Boss Man]

Metal evolved from Rock and Rock evolved from the Blues. I would not call Metal a sub-genre of Rock, nor would I call Rock a sub-genre of the Blues.

[terry3111]

Metal evolved from Rock and Rock evolved from the Blues. I would not call Metal a sub-genre of Rock, nor would I call Rock a sub-genre of the Blues.

Metal... Rock...Blues...

For me music are persons... Executors.... For example - Beatles

I appreciate persons.

[Compile 'em all]

Metal is not a sub-genre of rock. If you think ACDC and Lamb of God sound the same then you need your ears examined :D.

[velocityg4]

Metal is not a sub-genre of rock. If you think ACDC and Lamb of God sound the same then you need your ears examined :D.
But Black Sabbath and Metallica definitely sound like an offshoot of Rock.

[Mattaut]

But Black Sabbath and Metallica definitely sound like an offshoot of Rock.

That was the heavy metal of the 70s/80s. Yes, back then you could argue that heavy metal was a sub-genre of rock. But now a days the average heavy metal band sounds much different than the average rock band. All genres started as sub-genres of the music before it, and then that sub-genre evolved into it's own sound and became it's own genre.

[Hellhammer]

IMO not really. What is rock and what is metal is a different question though

[velocityg4]

That was the heavy metal of the 70s/80s. Yes, back then you could argue that heavy metal was a sub-genre of rock. But now a days the average heavy metal band sounds much different than the average rock band. All genres started as sub-genres of the music before it, and then that sub-genre evolved into it's own sound and became it's own genre.

In that case modern rock couldn't really be considered rock either. As Emo, Punk, Grunge, Alternative &c sound substantially different than Rock and Roll from the 50's.

Though I guess you have to make a split at some point. I have no idea what modern heavy metal sounds like though as I could only liked 70's metal and some 80's.

Pantera was the breaking point for me as it started to sound like grunts and noise to me:p.

[agmetal]

As someone who's been a metalhead for over 10 years, I'd say metal has more in common with classical music than rock, and I don't generally consider it to be a subgenre of rock. I would agree that it evolved out of rock, originally, though...but it's definitely come a long way since then, and is now something more its own.

[Cromulent]

Compare these two tracks:

Rush - The Trees (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvQ2JF-glvw)

Ildjarn - Whispering Breeze (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuiPsRAz7wc)

I'm really not sure I would class the second one as a sub-genre of the first.

[ChrisA]

Compare these two tracks:

Rush - The Trees (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvQ2JF-glvw)

Ildjarn - Whispering Breeze (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuiPsRAz7wc)

I'm really not sure I would class the second one as a sub-genre of the first.

Don't listen to the "surface" or just the presentation style. For example the secon tack is "metal" but listen to the very slow chord progression. I could not make it out as I need to work harder on learning transcription skills but I'd not be surprized if this was not a simple blues like progression.

The first track by Rush is very much a folk song and not really "rock". "Rock" is usualy describbed as having a back beat. That is a dominat beat on the second and fourth beats of a 4/4 meassure. But of course rules are made to be broken. But any way you slice it the Rush track is not rock

I think Metal split from rock some time ago. I'd say the split was complete when metal no longer had any of the characteristic of rock music, When it lost the blues based chord progressions and the back beat rythum, not much was left.

That said, not all metal is fully split from rock.

Can anyone here make out the chord in the second track and post here?