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Punkwaffle
Aug 9, 2004, 09:28 AM
Ok, so i am getting a new mac sometime in the next month. Got about $2500 to spend on it, and I want it to last a while. Also, I'm not a "power user" but I like to mess around with a bit of everything.
So, I ask you: The G5 imac is around the corner, but those g4 powerbooks are so sweet. Portability is nice, but not a neccessity.
My question is if Apple intros G5 imacs next month, that makes the powerbooks the only cpu product line that is not 64 bit. So how long would you guess until the g5 powerbooks come out, and when they do, what would the price drop on the g4 pb be? anyone have any guesses based on previous product launches?
-j

NusuniAdmin
Aug 9, 2004, 09:50 AM
Ok, so i am getting a new mac sometime in the next month. Got about $2500 to spend on it, and I want it to last a while. Also, I'm not a "power user" but I like to mess around with a bit of everything.
So, I ask you: The G5 imac is around the corner, but those g4 powerbooks are so sweet. Portability is nice, but not a neccessity.
My question is if Apple intros G5 imacs next month, that makes the powerbooks the only cpu product line that is not 64 bit. So how long would you guess until the g5 powerbooks come out, and when they do, what would the price drop on the g4 pb be? anyone have any guesses based on previous product launches?
-j

ibook and emac also do not have 64 bit procs.
apple themselves said there would not be a powerbook g5 anytime soon, i am guessing powerbook g5 and rev 3 powermac g5 (or a rev 1 dual core g5) around april of next year....although that is a little optomistic.

Converted2Truth
Aug 9, 2004, 09:50 AM
Powerbooks are about to turn into big huge laptops that you can cook eggs on. I'd say that you've got a 6mo. wait for G5 laptop. ATI just released their 9800 mobile graphics chipset, and i am sure they'll drop that into the next reversion of the pb. That alone is worth waiting for. generally, i'd say whether you went with a G5 imac or a laptop depends on the graphics chip they put in the iMac. But i'm a gamer, so go figure...

jsw
Aug 9, 2004, 10:20 AM
FWIW, any of the powerbooks currently available are more than enough for a non-power-user - and usually enough for power users as well.

The G5 iMac will be a nice, fast, sexy unit, with zero upgradeability aside from RAM and an AirPort (most likely - iMacs have never been very upgradeable). Of course, the PB isn't upgradeable either.

Also, note that it might be a while before you can get ahold of a new iMac (or not - depends on supply issues). You could be holding a shiny new PB today if you live near an Apple Store or a reseller.

invaLPsion
Aug 9, 2004, 10:23 AM
I'm less excited about the powerbook G5 than I am about the new G4 "extended" processor which is rumored to debut in powerbooks this fall at speeds of up to 2GHz. It may finally support a faster system bus (333MHz?) and the laptop will reportedly sport an ATi Radeon Mobility 9800. (Finally with a processor that can power it!) :D

Converted2Truth
Aug 9, 2004, 11:00 AM
...and the laptop will reportedly sport an ATi Radeon Mobility 9800.

I was reading THG's review of the 9800 mobile chipset, and it turns out that this chipset more closely resembles the X800 than the 9800 by far! check it out HERE (http://www.tomshardware.com/mobile/20040727/index.html)

So the powerbook that sports this awesome chipset will rock the doghouse :eek:

so yeah.. wait for this chipset if you decide to go powebook instead of iMac. And if the G5 iMac sports a crappy nvidia chipset, drop the imac idea like a bad habbit.

iNetwork
Aug 9, 2004, 11:03 AM
I'm less excited about the powerbook G5 than I am about the new G4 "extended" processor which is rumored to debut in powerbooks this fall at speeds of up to 2GHz. It may finally support a faster system bus (333MHz?) and the laptop will reportedly sport an ATi Radeon Mobility 9800. (Finally with a processor that can power it!) :D

Ohh, that'd be tight, a 2ghz G4. With the shorter pipeline, it should be an impressive machine! Any links on the extended G4's? I had my eyes on a G4 1.5 but I think I'll wait... :rolleyes:

rareflares
Aug 9, 2004, 11:12 AM
I'm less excited about the powerbook G5 than I am about the new G4 "extended" processor which is rumored to debut in powerbooks this fall at speeds of up to 2GHz. It may finally support a faster system bus (333MHz?) and the laptop will reportedly sport an ATi Radeon Mobility 9800. (Finally with a processor that can power it!) :D





where did you hear this?

quagmire
Aug 9, 2004, 11:20 AM
The G4 extended will not be made by moto. Who think here moto can pull off a 500 Mhz increase with in a year? I thought so. The G4 extended is rumored to be made by IBM. But, is a definte no on moto. A prototpye G5 12" powerbook running at 1.4 Ghz(yes, they had fit one in) reached 55 minutes in battery life. :eek: I say we will still see Pbook G5 at MWSF in January with a new battery type(fuel cell anyone?). I will get the site here shortly.

EDIT: here is the site. It is in French but, you should be able to tell what the speed is and battery life.

http://croquer.free.fr/

jxyama
Aug 9, 2004, 11:52 AM
if recent new product introductions are any indication, expect at least a decent delay in the shipment of new form factor iMac next month.

it wouldn't surprise me if G5 iMac was introduced in early Sept, but not ship until Oct.

if you want a computer in your hands in sept, then get a PB. otherwise, be ready to wait - you may not have to, but just in case.

Dr. Dastardly
Aug 9, 2004, 11:56 AM
Hey this is one of the best powerbook G5 threads in a long time. :D

emw
Aug 9, 2004, 12:05 PM
The problem with waiting for the next big thing is that there is always a next big thing, so you either never buy anything or you're always disappointed ;)

Anyway, you need to figure out what you're going to use it for and how much power you really need (or will really need in the future). If you think you're going to need portability (or want it), then the PowerBook is the deal.

If you never need to want to compute in the family room instead of the office, or out on your patio, then stick with the iMac. If, however, you like the portability, then the PowerBook is the way to go.

Plus, as jsw states, you can get one now that will likely meet your needs. Heck, I do quite a bit on my old 1Ghz model, and I work for a professional graphic design company.

Of course, if you could stretch your budget just a little, you could grab a 17" PowerBook, so you get the larger screen, or you could grab a 12" PowerBook with SuperDrive and a 20" ACD. That way you get the really nice monitor (like you'd get on the iMac) + get ultraportability when you want it.

But it's always easy for us forum members to spend other peoples' money!

jdogg707
Aug 9, 2004, 12:10 PM
Wouldn't making another G4 revision laptop be a bit redundant? I would say that we probably won't even start to see anything about new laptops until the first of the year, if that soon. The next Powerbook revision will have a G5, since that is the natural progression. By then ATi and Nvidia will have their next gen cards out and updated mobile chipsets based on those. We'll also probably see connectivity like SATAII come into play with laptop hard drives and possibly PCI-e, but those depend greatly on Apple's adaptation of those standards. Most likely a case redesign will be needed, since the current G4 chips, at least the 1.5's, seem to be maxing out the thermal characteristics of the current design. I would like to see a mobile specific chip from IBM, something that resembled the Centrino, with a shorter Pipeline, faster bus speed, larger cache, and better speed throttling to increase battery life. I think Intel realized that putting desktop chips in laptops just wasn't cutting it, and neither was just implementing SpeedStep,, they actually had to come out with a new processor. I think this would solve a lot of Apple's problems, while also providing higher performance and better battery life to their Powerbook line.

All kinds of speculation above, but hopefully we'll see something come of it!

Punkwaffle
Aug 9, 2004, 02:12 PM
Of course, if you could stretch your budget just a little, you could grab a 17" PowerBook, so you get the larger screen, or you could grab a 12" PowerBook with SuperDrive and a 20" ACD. That way you get the really nice monitor (like you'd get on the iMac) + get ultraportability when you want it.

But it's always easy for us forum members to spend other peoples' money!

I did think of that. I love the 12", but I am more than willing to deal with the additional cost and size of a 15" PB for one reason. The ambient light sensor on the keyboard!
I know it sounds stupid, but that illuminated keyboard has me sold. It's a shame the 12" models don't offer that. Or maybe someone knows of a mod for this.
I'm thinking I get a PB and have my 23" Cinema Display on a Marathon Pixarm on my desk. That seems like it would be a sweet setup. Any thoughts?

jsw
Aug 9, 2004, 02:29 PM
Wouldn't making another G4 revision laptop be a bit redundant? I would say that we probably won't even start to see anything about new laptops until the first of the year, if that soon.
I don't know about chip revisions, but I know for a fact that there are 7200 RPM drives and hi-res screens (my ~2-year-old Dell work laptop has a 15", 1900x1200 screen which is beautiful - too bad I don't use it) that would make major improvements to the line. Add in the apparent graphics card improvement, and the possibility of a faster G4, and you've got a great reason to release a revision.

A 15" PB with a 1900x1200 screen, a 7200 RPM HD, and an ATi Radeon Mobility 9800? Killer, regardless of the G4 inside.

jsw
Aug 9, 2004, 02:30 PM
I'm thinking I get a PB and have my 23" Cinema Display on a Marathon Pixarm on my desk. That seems like it would be a sweet setup. Any thoughts?
I'd be jealous, FWIW. ;)

NusuniAdmin
Aug 9, 2004, 02:32 PM
I don't know about chip revisions, but I know for a fact that there are 7200 RPM drives and hi-res screens (my ~2-year-old Dell work laptop has a 15", 1900x1200 screen which is beautiful - too bad I don't use it) that would make major improvements to the line. Add in the apparent graphics card improvement, and the possibility of a faster G4, and you've got a great reason to release a revision.

A 15" PB with a 1900x1200 screen, a 7200 RPM HD, and an ATi Radeon Mobility 9800? Killer, regardless of the G4 inside.

like that will ever happen. Apple seems to have a fetish with one button mice and slow hard drives much like steve jobs has a fetish with imacs and aluminum :rolleyes:

Lincoln
Aug 9, 2004, 02:35 PM
I had a 12" Rev A laptop and although it was VERY portable, it was a bit slow and the screen was just a bit too small too. So I sold it and have purchased a 1.5Ghz 15" Powerbook with 5200RPM disk and 128MB video card. This pbook should be fast enough for what I want and still be portable enough when it arrives.

As far as the G5 imac and G5 Powerbooks go, they will both be first generation products. Apple's track record for getting their first generation products problem free isn't very good lately. it may be wise to wait for any problems that may (or may not) occur first and then purchase. But you could be waiting a very long time!

Remember you can have a G4 Powerbook today, but a G5 iMac is probably 2-3 months away and the G5 Powerbook won't be here until sometime next year at the earliest.

Mord
Aug 9, 2004, 02:41 PM
if apple could make a super high res 17" powerbook that can handle HD natively (1920x1600) a 100GB seagate 2.5" HD (they are due in october) a 9800 mobility and a 9700 mobility in the 12" that 5200 dose not cut it, and maby some super high capasity batterys (8 hours +) with a redesigned 64-bit low power cpu like a g5 lite that would be a powerbook i'd go into debt for

nospleen
Aug 9, 2004, 02:55 PM
I had a 12" Rev A laptop and although it was VERY portable, it was a bit slow and the screen was just a bit too small too. So I sold it and have purchased a 1.5Ghz 15" Powerbook with 5200RPM disk and 128MB video card. This pbook should be fast enough for what I want and still be portable enough when it arrives.

As far as the G5 imac and G5 Powerbooks go, they will both be first generation products. Apple's track record for getting their first generation products problem free isn't very good lately. it may be wise to wait for any problems that may (or may not) occur first and then purchase. But you could be waiting a very long time!

Remember you can have a G4 Powerbook today, but a G5 iMac is probably 2-3 months away and the G5 Powerbook won't be here until sometime next year at the earliest.

Why does everyone keep saying the G5 imac will not be available for 2-3 months? Apple's site says announced and available in September. I hope they do not pull the typical end of September stuff. I hope it is announced and available the day of the Paris expo. (crosses fingers.)

emw
Aug 9, 2004, 03:03 PM
Why does everyone keep saying the G5 imac will not be available for 2-3 months? Apple's site says announced and available in September. I hope they do not pull the typical end of September stuff. I hope it is announced and available the day of the Paris expo. (crosses fingers.)

Apple's "available" and the real world's available are often two different things. Apple considers a product available if they have one of them on their warehouse shelf. The rest of us consider it to be available when they've built up enough stock to actually ship to a large number of users. ;)

Now, given that they've sold themselves out of the current iMacs, one would hope that there won't be what would essentially amount to a 2-3 month gap in iMac supply.

nospleen
Aug 9, 2004, 04:01 PM
Apple's "available" and the real world's available are often two different things. Apple considers a product available if they have one of them on their warehouse shelf. The rest of us consider it to be available when they've built up enough stock to actually ship to a large number of users. ;)

Now, given that they've sold themselves out of the current iMacs, one would hope that there won't be what would essentially amount to a 2-3 month gap in iMac supply.


I know, I went through the whole dual 2.0 delays... I just want the new imac to be available already, although I know they will have the usual delays. Kind of sucks when you know the end result, eh. :D

jxyama
Aug 9, 2004, 04:33 PM
I know, I went through the whole dual 2.0 delays... I just want the new imac to be available already, although I know they will have the usual delays. Kind of sucks when you know the end result, eh. :D

yeah, no kidding. let's hope it won't be as bad as the 17" PB delays... *that* was quite bad.

nospleen
Aug 9, 2004, 04:37 PM
yeah, no kidding. let's hope it won't be as bad as the 17" PB delays... *that* was quite bad.

Nice job, you probably just jinxed us. :p

jxyama
Aug 9, 2004, 05:00 PM
Nice job, you probably just jinxed us. :p

well, hopefully not... ;)

but seriously, apple should be ready to ship in decent time, i'd hope, because they have pre-announced EOL for G4 iMac and the introduction of G5 iMac to be in Sept. this is something unheard of from apple. i realize they sort of shot themselves in the foot in miscalculating the G5 iMac intro-timing, but if they can't gauge the proper supply after nearly two months of lead time...

however, i do hope for apple's sake that the G5 iMac will turn out more like the Mini than the Cube - it's always better to have the demand exceed the supply... so lengthy wait is still a possibility if the new iMac's demand wildly exceeds the expectations...

nospleen
Aug 9, 2004, 05:17 PM
well, hopefully not... ;)

but seriously, apple should be ready to ship in decent time, i'd hope, because they have pre-announced EOL for G4 iMac and the introduction of G5 iMac to be in Sept. this is something unheard of from apple. i realize they sort of shot themselves in the foot in miscalculating the G5 iMac intro-timing, but if they can't gauge the proper supply after nearly two months of lead time...

however, i do hope for apple's sake that the G5 iMac will turn out more like the Mini than the Cube - it's always better to have the demand exceed the supply... so lengthy wait is still a possibility if the new iMac's demand wildly exceeds the expectations...

Me too! But, how can they top the design of the current imac? I just hope the G5 is a 2.0. If it is less, then I will be dissapointed.

invaLPsion
Aug 9, 2004, 05:54 PM
where did you hear this?

Apple Insider and Croquer Dans La Pomme had small reports on it.

invaLPsion
Aug 9, 2004, 05:58 PM
"ATI introduces new PowerBook bound graphics card

Earlier today, ATI Technologies announced the Mobility Radeon 9800, based on its award-winning RADEON X800. According to ATI, the AGP-based Mobility Radeon 9800 comes equipped with eight pixel pipelines and a 256-bit wide memory interface.

A Macintosh version of the Mobility Radeon 9800 is widely rumored for inclusion in a forthcoming PowerBook revision, which sources say will most likely include "PowerPC G4 extended" microprocessors running at speeds of up to 2 GHz. The chips, from Motorola, have yet to be tagged with an official name, sources added.

There also appears to be some internal optimism that the computer company will be able to deploy a G5 PowerBook before a G4 revision is warranted. However, this seems increasingly unlikely given IBM's continuous G5 manufacturing problems."



If motorola is only supplying chips for 3 product lines instead of 6 (as it used to be) it is safe to assume that they will be able to deliver these new chips without delays. The chips would also likely be running on 130nm making it even easier to make the chips.

iNetwork
Aug 10, 2004, 12:30 AM
I was reading THG's review of the 9800 mobile chipset, and it turns out that this chipset more closely resembles the X800 than the 9800 by far! check it out HERE (http://www.tomshardware.com/mobile/20040727/index.html)

So the powerbook that sports this awesome chipset will rock the doghouse :eek:

so yeah.. wait for this chipset if you decide to go powebook instead of iMac. And if the G5 iMac sports a crappy nvidia chipset, drop the imac idea like a bad habbit.

I hate to break the news to you, but NVIDIA makes the best graphics chips on the market. The 6800 GT is faster than ATI's X800 ultra, and the 6800 Ultra is much much faster than ATI's X800 U.

Now, the blame lies on Apple for choosing a CHEAP and SLOW graphics chip to go with the computer. Don't lay blame on Nvidia. The graphics chips in the past Imac and Powerbook 12" is an economy level chip.

I know you pay homage to Apple, but they do make mistakes and this was one of them IMO. Just like their supply chain problems. Don't release a product until you can ship it to a consumer <--that is the typical business model. But Apple beleives in "release a product so the guys over at macrumors can spray the inside of their pants with Jizz, and we can try and keep them as customers." If there was another PPC competitor that could deliver products faster, that are cheaper products (IE a Dell); Apple would be out of business. Why do you think Apple signed all of those contracts with Moto back when the "clones" came out?