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applemax
Dec 20, 2009, 09:28 AM
Hi

Mainly for range reasons, I need to get 802.11n in my Power Mac G5 (Dual 2.3Ghz / PowerMac7,3), via presumably a PCI card.

It needs to use the AirPort Utility Interface for base station management, the AirPort Network status bars in the toolbar at the top of Mac OS X and no third party preference panes or software.

Does such a solution exist for a UK user? I found this item (http://www.dlink.co.uk/cs/Satellite?c=Product_C&childpagename=DLinkEurope-GB%2FDLProductCarousel&cid=1197319489522&p=1197318962342&packedargs=ParentPageID%3D1197318962321%26TopLevelPageProduct%3DConsumer%26locale%3D1195806691854%26 packedargs%3DProductParentID%253D1195808623928&pagename=DLinkEurope-GB%2FDLWrapper) - would that be suitable despite saying it's only compatible with Windows?

Thanks :)



applemax
Dec 20, 2009, 08:46 PM
...anyone? :)

dcpmark
Dec 20, 2009, 10:22 PM
Maybe I don't understand the problem, but why do you need a card? Buy an 801.11n Airport Extreme or Express, and run an Ethernet cable to the G5.

applemax
Dec 21, 2009, 04:09 AM
Maybe I don't understand the problem, but why do you need a card? Buy an 801.11n Airport Extreme or Express, and run an Ethernet cable to the G5.

I've gone over the options, Ethernet is impossible - I just need to find a suitable PCI card. :)

Dragonforce
Dec 21, 2009, 04:14 AM
I got this in a 1.8GHz single PowerMac G5
http://www.sonnettech.com/product/ariaextremenpci.html

applemax
Dec 21, 2009, 04:19 AM
I got this in a 1.8GHz single PowerMac G5
http://www.sonnettech.com/product/ariaextremenpci.html

does it use all the AirPort software or does it use it's own proprietary stuff? Thanks :D

ncc1701d
Dec 21, 2009, 04:28 AM
Not as tidy as the built in stuff, but I got this for my G5 works well:

https://eshop.macsales.com/item/Newer%20Technology/MXP802NU2C/

tsugaru
Dec 21, 2009, 05:50 AM
You could get an 802.11 ethernet bridge.

Short of that, it might be a toughie to find a Mac compatible PCI 802.11n card.

OrangeSVTguy
Dec 21, 2009, 06:34 AM
Is yours the dual-core version or dual processor?

The DC versions have PCIe so I don't think that normal PCI cards will fit. I just bought a DC model so I'm in the same boat as OP but I only have a G network and ebay is sadly way overpriced for the bluetooth/airport combo cards for this model.

applemax
Dec 21, 2009, 12:39 PM
Is yours the dual-core version or dual processor?

The DC versions have PCIe so I don't think that normal PCI cards will fit. I just bought a DC model so I'm in the same boat as OP but I only have a G network and ebay is sadly way overpriced for the bluetooth/airport combo cards for this model.

I've got the dual processor model with the PCI-X slots. If I were to buy a USB adaptor would it use the AirPort interface, preferences and software?

Thanks :D

Dark Dragoon
Dec 21, 2009, 02:52 PM
Why is this
Maybe I don't understand the problem, but why do you need a card? Buy an 801.11n Airport Extreme or Express, and run an Ethernet cable to the G5.
not a viable solution?

This is what I used for a while where you have an airport express plugged in close to the Mac with a short ethernet cable connecting it. Then the airport express connects to the airport extreme base station via wireless in a WDS setup. With this setup you wouldn't get to use the wireless configuration built into OSX though, as you would be connected by cable to the express. However you wouldn't need any third party software and you can use the AirPort Utility for administrating the Airport Extreme/Express.

With pretty much any third party solution including USB ones you will need to use third party drivers and software.

applemax
Dec 21, 2009, 02:56 PM
Why is this

not a viable solution?

This is what I used for a while where you have an airport express plugged in close to the Mac with a short ethernet cable connecting it. Then the airport express connects to the airport extreme base station via wireless in a WDS setup. With this setup you wouldn't get to use the wireless configuration built into OSX though, as you would be connected by cable to the express. However you wouldn't need any third party software and you can use the AirPort Utility for administrating the Airport Extreme/Express.

With pretty much any third party solution including USB ones you will need to use third party drivers and software.

Oh, I misread that completely - I got the impression you meant I should run an ethernet from the router to the mac, which is impossible. I suppose I could create a bridge - I just go on 'extend network' right? My N network is already being extended by another AirPort. Can it be extended again?

Dark Dragoon
Dec 21, 2009, 03:14 PM
I just go on 'extend network' right? My N network is already being extended by another AirPort. Can it be extended again?
On the base station setup you should be able to set the main Airport as the WDS Main, the second Airport as a WDS relay and a third as a WDS remote. Thats if the third one can't get a direct signal to the first one. In this configuration they act as a chain, though you do loose a bit of speed.

This is a setup I've used for a while, though it's with a couple of older 802.11g Airport Expresses as the remote and relay and a newer Airport Extreme gigabit N as the main.

I'm not sure how many you can chain together though it works fine with two. Though if both the remote Airports can connect wirelessly to the main Airport then you can just set them both as WDS remotes instead of chaining them.

Though as tsugaru mentioned you could get a cheaper wireless ethernet bridge which will do the same thing, though it would just act as a client and not rebroadcast the wireless signal. You would most likely have to configure it using a web browser, however this should be a one time thing.

applemax
Dec 21, 2009, 03:27 PM
On the base station setup you should be able to set the main Airport as the WDS Main, the second Airport as a WDS relay and a third as a WDS remote. Thats if the third one can't get a direct signal to the first one. In this configuration they act as a chain, though you do loose a bit of speed.

This is a setup I've used for a while, though it's with a couple of older 802.11g Airport Expresses as the remote and relay and a newer Airport Extreme gigabit N as the main.

I'm not sure how many you can chain together though it works fine with two. Though if both the remote Airports can connect wirelessly to the main Airport then you can just set them both as WDS remotes instead of chaining them.

Though as tsugaru mentioned you could get a cheaper wireless ethernet bridge which will do the same thing, though it would just act as a client and not rebroadcast the wireless signal. You would most likely have to configure it using a web browser, however this should be a one time thing.

Yeah, but N doesn't use WDS.

Dark Dragoon
Dec 21, 2009, 03:43 PM
Yeah, but N doesn't use WDS.

Ah didn't realise that, though on my Airport Extreme it allows me to setup the WDS with 802.11n enabled but only on the 2.4GHz band. I wonder if it just drops to 802.11g speeds in that setup.

Do you use 2.4GHz or 5GHz 802.11n?

applemax
Dec 21, 2009, 03:44 PM
Ah didn't realise that, though on my Airport Extreme it allows me to setup the WDS with 802.11n enabled but only on the 2.4GHz band. I wonder if it just drops to 802.11g speeds in that setup.

Do you use 2.4GHz or 5GHz 802.11n?

I can't stand 5Ghz - it's way to slow for me. Yeah, WDS only supports G. For pure-n networks the option you'll see is 'Extend Wireless Network'

goMac
Dec 21, 2009, 05:00 PM
A bridge is probably the best option. I don't think there is a way to get 802.11 in there with the airport control panel.

dcpmark
Dec 21, 2009, 05:40 PM
Ok, my curiosity is peaked.

Don't take this the wrong way, but why would you need it to look a certain way unless you were trying to fool someone else? I've never known anyone who needs a solution to look a particular way....most people only care if it works properly or is more efficient. If you are simply trying to put give YOUR G5 an 802.11n network, it's quite simple to hook an Airport via an ethernet cable. You would control it using the Airport Utility, no 3rd party stuff involved, and the Network status icon in the toolbar would simply show that you are connected to the Network via ethernet. You wouldn't have the Airport signal bars, but again......who cares unless you are tying to hide something?

Are you trying to replace an internal g card on SOMEONE ELSE'S G5 with an n card without them knowing it? Why is God's name would ethernet be "impossible"???

I'm no expert, but it just doesn't make any sense to me.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 07:24 AM
Ok, my curiosity is peaked.

Don't take this the wrong way, but why would you need it to look a certain way unless you were trying to fool someone else? I've never known anyone who needs a solution to look a particular way....most people only care if it works properly or is more efficient. If you are simply trying to put give YOUR G5 an 802.11n network, it's quite simple to hook an Airport via an ethernet cable. You would control it using the Airport Utility, no 3rd party stuff involved, and the Network status icon in the toolbar would simply show that you are connected to the Network via ethernet. You wouldn't have the Airport signal bars, but again......who cares unless you are tying to hide something?

Are you trying to replace an internal g card on SOMEONE ELSE'S G5 with an n card without them knowing it? Why is God's name would ethernet be "impossible"???

I'm no expert, but it just doesn't make any sense to me.

What are you talking about? I need it to be N and not ethernet because surprisingly, I don't want my house littered with grey cabling, OK? And why exactly would I be 'hiding something' - what are you on? I could not care less about 'someone else's G5'. All I came in here to ask was for someone to recommend a PCI card or adequate solution to achieve my needs. I didn't come here for someone to play some stupid little detective game with me. :mad:

dcpmark
Dec 22, 2009, 08:30 AM
What are you talking about? I need it to be N and not ethernet because surprisingly, I don't want my house littered with grey cabling, OK? And why exactly would I be 'hiding something' - what are you on? I could not care less about 'someone else's G5'. All I came in here to ask was for someone to recommend a PCI card or adequate solution to achieve my needs. I didn't come here for someone to play some stupid little detective game with me. :mad:

I guess you took it the wrong way after all....

Most people come asking for a solution to a problem. I've never seen anyone ask for a solution that had to look a certain way. My curiosity was peaked. I was hoping you'd explain to satisfy MY curiosity, as well as to possibly find a DIFFERENT answer to your problem. End of story.

By the way, your explanation "I don't want my house littered with grey cabling" is quite flimsy, in my humble opinion. One ethernet cable, in color of your choice, hardly constitutes littering a house with grey cabling. A single 6" cable for $.69 in any color you want would solve your problem, and Airport Express could sit directly behind the G5 with no exposed cables:

http://www.showmecables.com/showProducts.asp?category_id=268&gclid=CL2Ky7Oe6p4CFRYaagodjVF4Ew

And that still doesn't explain why it has to LOOK a certain way. Why would it HAVE to have Airport status bars at the top?? If I directed you to an internal n card that worked in your G5 but had different network status bars on the toolbar than Airport's, why would you turn it down? According to you, your only stated phobia of grey cables would be addressed.

Anyway, good luck getting an n network on a G5...a single white cable, neatly tucked away and connected to an Airport Extreme, solved that little problem for me for quite a while now.

10THzMac
Dec 22, 2009, 09:09 AM
Thinking more generally. I wanted to add an older iMac G4 to my house network (and to do so a long way from the router), recently updated to use a timeport with N wireless. I could not find a N access point anywhere. PC World had (a) G access points (b) USB 2 dongles for N access, neither of which were any good for older Macs. In the end I have installed the Netgear "200Mb" (max) mains ethernet, with one ethernet cable going to my timeport and another to the imac at the other end of the house. The N wireless remains useful for my newer Mac book.

After a lot of tweaking the mains ethernet is now doing very well. At the very far end of the house with old, dodgy wiring, I get 30Mbs now, rather more than my internet connection, peaking at 6.5, and way more than wireless ever got. I have added some other plugs to connect a PS3 - this is slightly closer to the router and gets 100Mbs ish. I have tried a direct cat6 connection with a 25M cable to test the quality - it does not improve matters, i.e., my bottlenecks are now not in the linkups but in things like HD access and net access.

So I guess my point is that for an even bigger, and presumably static Mac G5, you might find this an easier route.

I do remain mystified why a cheap stand alone N to ethernet access point is so hard to source - with an iMac I did not have a PCI option of course.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 09:31 AM
I guess you took it the wrong way after all....

Most people come asking for a solution to a problem. I've never seen anyone ask for a solution that had to look a certain way. My curiosity was peaked. I was hoping you'd explain to satisfy MY curiosity, as well as to possibly find a DIFFERENT answer to your problem. End of story.

By the way, your explanation "I don't want my house littered with grey cabling" is quite flimsy, in my humble opinion. One ethernet cable, in color of your choice, hardly constitutes littering a house with grey cabling. A single 6" cable for $.69 in any color you want would solve your problem, and Airport Express could sit directly behind the G5 with no exposed cables:

http://www.showmecables.com/showProducts.asp?category_id=268&gclid=CL2Ky7Oe6p4CFRYaagodjVF4Ew

And that still doesn't explain why it has to LOOK a certain way. Why would it HAVE to have Airport status bars at the top?? If I directed you to an internal n card that worked in your G5 but had different network status bars on the toolbar than Airport's, why would you turn it down? According to you, your only stated phobia of grey cables would be addressed.

Anyway, good luck getting an n network on a G5...a single white cable, neatly tucked away and connected to an Airport Extreme, solved that little problem for me for quite a while now.

You are truly unbelievable! The computer and the router are very far away from each other and we simply cannot lay down cabling due to the way the house is. And I want it to use the AirPort interface and software so I can administrate the base station and so I don't have to faff around with third-party software and other crap, that's all.

I'm still bemused as to why you'd think I'd be doing this on someone else's computer - what would be the point in that? Some sort of prank that speeds up their network performance? Yeah, I'm going to shell out my own money to do that, aren't I. Get a grip, ffs.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 09:34 AM
Thinking more generally. I wanted to add an older iMac G4 to my house network (and to do so a long way from the router), recently updated to use a timeport with N wireless. I could not find a N access point anywhere. PC World had (a) G access points (b) USB 2 dongles for N access, neither of which were any good for older Macs. In the end I have installed the Netgear "200Mb" (max) mains ethernet, with one ethernet cable going to my timeport and another to the imac at the other end of the house. The N wireless remains useful for my newer Mac book.

After a lot of tweaking the mains ethernet is now doing very well. At the very far end of the house with old, dodgy wiring, I get 30Mbs now, rather more than my internet connection, peaking at 6.5, and way more than wireless ever got. I have added some other plugs to connect a PS3 - this is slightly closer to the router and gets 100Mbs ish. I have tried a direct cat6 connection with a 25M cable to test the quality - it does not improve matters, i.e., my bottlenecks are now not in the linkups but in things like HD access and net access.

So I guess my point is that for an even bigger, and presumably static Mac G5, you might find this an easier route.

I do remain mystified why a cheap stand alone N to ethernet access point is so hard to source - with an iMac I did not have a PCI option of course.

Yeah, I'm getting around 1Mb on my G5 over 802.11G at the moment. I tested with my MacBook Pro in the same location and that got 270Mb over 802.11N. I should point out that my main base station is a dual-band AirPort.

I guess I'll have to purchase an AirPort Express and extend the network, but it's a bit pricy compared to dongles and PCI cards.

dcpmark
Dec 22, 2009, 09:58 AM
The computer and the router are very far away from each other and we simply cannot lay down cabling due to the way the house is.

Perhaps you are not understanding my solution to your problem.

An Airport Express CAN act just like an internal Airport card when connected via Ethernet. You CAN have WDS on an N Airport network (it is a MYTH that you can't.....the option is just hidden in menus). You CAN wirelessly administer every Apple wireless device on the Network using the Airport Utility on the G5 (after a one-time hard connection during setup). The only difference is that in the toolbar you will see a Network status bar that indicates you are connected via ethernet, rather than the Airport statis bars.

If you stop acting like a prissy old queen who has had her honor besmirched for just a second, I might be able to help you!!!!!

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 10:06 AM
Perhaps you are not understanding my solution to your problem.

An Airport Express CAN act just like an internal Airport card when connected via Ethernet. You CAN have WDS on an N Airport network (it is a MYTH that you can't.....the option is just hidden in menus). You CAN wirelessly administer every Apple wireless device on the Network using the Airport Utility on the G5 (after a one-time hard connection during setup). The only difference is that in the toolbar you will see a Network status bar that indicates you are connected via ethernet, rather than the Airport statis bars.

If you stop acting like a prissy old queen who has had her honor besmirched for just a second, I might be able to help you!!!!!

And if you stop acting like an irritating and ignorant cock, then I might listen.

And, just to enlighten you, WDS does not work on N networks at all. WDS, as a technology, is limited to 54Mbps only. For N networks you have to click the checkbox marked 'Extend this network'. Besides, a PCI card costs around 25 whereas an AirPort express and ethernet cable can reach nearly 100, so it is simply not financially viable to do that.

dcpmark
Dec 22, 2009, 10:17 AM
And, just to enlighten you, WDS does not work on N networks at all. WDS, as a technology, is limited to 54Mbps only. For N networks you have to click the checkbox marked 'Extend this network'.

If you say so, it must be true. Never mind the fact that I had the EXACT same setup on my G5 working at 300Mbps.

Perhaps you can share your knowledge with these guys:

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13727_7-10330062-263.html

http://db.tidbits.com/article/10125

As you can see, not only can you select WDS on an n network and achieve n speeds, but you can also limit it to the 2.4 band only.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 10:26 AM
If you say so, it must be true. Never mind the fact that I had the EXACT same setup on my G5 working at 300Mbps.

Perhaps you can share your knowledge with these guys:

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13727_7-10330062-263.html

http://db.tidbits.com/article/10125

As you can see, not only can you select WDS on an n network and achieve n speeds, but you can also limit it to the 2.4 band only.

Go ahead right now and try and create an n-only network in AirPort Admin Utility with WDS. Yeah, that's right, you can't - it's b/g only - which is slow.

Go on, take a look.

dcpmark
Dec 22, 2009, 10:42 AM
Go ahead right now and try and create an n-only network in AirPort Admin Utility with WDS. Yeah, that's right, you can't - it's b/g only - which is slow.

Go on, take a look.

Are you holding down the Option key when getting the choices? It should look like this:

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 10:47 AM
Are you holding down the Option key when getting the choices? It should look like this:

Yes, I am. But if you look at the image you attached, you haven't activated WDS. Once you've done that, all the n-only stuff disappears.

Dark Dragoon
Dec 22, 2009, 10:53 AM
Go ahead right now and try and create an n-only network in AirPort Admin Utility with WDS. Yeah, that's right, you can't - it's b/g only - which is slow.

Go on, take a look.

Maybe I'm not seeing the problem here but this is what my Airport Extreme lets me set it to. If it's set to 802.11n (802.11b/g compatible) then it should just use the fastest speed available.

Regardless the other options are a wireless to ethernet bridge where you won't have any direct control over the wireless connection. Though it seems like 802.11n ethernet bridges are rather rare.

Or a third part wireless card where you will likely need to use a third party tool to control the wireless card, however you can still use the Airport Utility to manage the Airport Extreme/Express as the way you are connected to it doesn't matter.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 10:58 AM
Maybe I'm not seeing the problem here but this is what my Airport Extreme lets me set it to. If it's set to 802.11n (802.11b/g compatible) then it should just use the fastest speed available.

Regardless the other options are a wireless to ethernet bridge where you won't have any direct control over the wireless connection. Though it seems like 802.11n ethernet bridges are rather rare.

Or a third part wireless card where you will likely need to use a third party tool to control the wireless card, however you can still use the Airport Utility to manage the Airport Extreme/Express as the way you are connected to it doesn't matter.

With that setup I think your speeds will be restricted to 54Mbps when connected to a WDS relay/remote device. However, when connected to the main base station there should be no limit.

dcpmark
Dec 22, 2009, 11:05 AM
This worked perfectly for me:

"Radio Modes
From a Manual Setup, go to the AirPort > Wireless tab of your Dual-Band AEBS. Select the Radio Mode popup menu. Get ready to be a bit confused. You may find just three choices: Automatic; 802.11a/n - 802.11b/g; and 802.11a - 802.11b/g. However, if you hold down the Option key, you will see 14 choices. Or you may see just 11 choices, with the three options missing that say "only (2.4 GHz)" -- as happens after enabling certain other settings. (NOTE: I can't recall what settings I enabled to get all 14 options).

In brief, these selections indicate the setup for each of the two separate bands. In other words, one band can be set up as 802.11a/n while the other is set up as 802.11b/g. Which option should you chose? Don't search Apple's documentation for the answer. It's not there, at least not yet. I can tell you that in most cases, you'll be fine if you select Automatic. After doing so, text appears below the menu that indicates the active mode. It will likely be a catch-all option not listed in the menu: 802.11a/n - 802.11b/g/n.

For more help, I recommend a TidBITS article by Glenn Fleishman. It covers these Radio mode selections as well as several other new features of the dual band AEBS (such as the "5 GHz Network Name" and "Guest Network" choices).

Participate in a WDS network
Having settled on a radio mode, I turned to my key question: How do I set up a WDS network using the dual band AEBS? I went to the Wireless Mode popup menu (in the afore-mentioned Wireless tab), but no WDS option appeared. Apple's current documentation remained of no use in figuring out why this was so.

Once more, the Option key came to the rescue. Hold it down while selecting the Wireless Mode menu and the desired option magically appears.

By the way, I've read some Web postings indicating that the "Extend a wireless network" option is now Apple's desired alternative to WDS. However, as confirmed by Apple, this option only works with 802.11n networks. As my AirPort Express units were the older "non-n" models, I could not use the Extend feature here.

Getting the Express units on board
I was now ready to have my two AirPort Express units join the WDS network on my new AEBS. For the sake of brevity, I'll omit the step-by-step details. The main thing is to enter the various AirPort ID numbers in the relevant places of the WDS tabs for each device. One key bit of advice: The dual-band AEBS has two AirPort IDs, one for 2.4 GHz mode and one for 5GHz mode (you'll see them both listed in the AirPort > Summary tab). As my Express units did not support 5GHz, I needed to select the 2.4 GHz AirPort ID.

After doing all of this and restarting my various AirPort devices ? my two Express units no longer showed up in AirPort Utility. All contact with them was lost. Oops!

To regain access, I had to temporarily connect each Express to my Mac via an Ethernet cable. After considerable trial-and-error, I eventually figured out that the older Express units and the new AEBS were using different password methods (WEP vs. WPA). This is a no-no for WDS networks. As much as possible, you want everything (such as password, network name and radio channel) to match across all devices on the WDS network.

After updating the Express units' passwords to match the one on the AEBS, everything at last fell into place. The WDS network was up and running as I had hoped."

Remember that with the dual band you are setting up two different networks, and you can create one n-only network while the other network is set as b/g only. I actually use both networks, but you don't HAVE to use the b/g band.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 11:08 AM
This worked perfectly for me:

"Radio Modes
From a Manual Setup, go to the AirPort > Wireless tab of your Dual-Band AEBS. Select the Radio Mode popup menu. Get ready to be a bit confused. You may find just three choices: Automatic; 802.11a/n - 802.11b/g; and 802.11a - 802.11b/g. However, if you hold down the Option key, you will see 14 choices. Or you may see just 11 choices, with the three options missing that say "only (2.4 GHz)" -- as happens after enabling certain other settings. (NOTE: I can't recall what settings I enabled to get all 14 options).

In brief, these selections indicate the setup for each of the two separate bands. In other words, one band can be set up as 802.11a/n while the other is set up as 802.11b/g. Which option should you chose? Don't search Apple's documentation for the answer. It's not there, at least not yet. I can tell you that in most cases, you'll be fine if you select Automatic. After doing so, text appears below the menu that indicates the active mode. It will likely be a catch-all option not listed in the menu: 802.11a/n - 802.11b/g/n.

For more help, I recommend a TidBITS article by Glenn Fleishman. It covers these Radio mode selections as well as several other new features of the dual band AEBS (such as the "5 GHz Network Name" and "Guest Network" choices).

Participate in a WDS network
Having settled on a radio mode, I turned to my key question: How do I set up a WDS network using the dual band AEBS? I went to the Wireless Mode popup menu (in the afore-mentioned Wireless tab), but no WDS option appeared. Apple's current documentation remained of no use in figuring out why this was so.

Once more, the Option key came to the rescue. Hold it down while selecting the Wireless Mode menu and the desired option magically appears.

By the way, I've read some Web postings indicating that the "Extend a wireless network" option is now Apple's desired alternative to WDS. However, as confirmed by Apple, this option only works with 802.11n networks. As my AirPort Express units were the older "non-n" models, I could not use the Extend feature here.

Getting the Express units on board
I was now ready to have my two AirPort Express units join the WDS network on my new AEBS. For the sake of brevity, I'll omit the step-by-step details. The main thing is to enter the various AirPort ID numbers in the relevant places of the WDS tabs for each device. One key bit of advice: The dual-band AEBS has two AirPort IDs, one for 2.4 GHz mode and one for 5GHz mode (you'll see them both listed in the AirPort > Summary tab). As my Express units did not support 5GHz, I needed to select the 2.4 GHz AirPort ID.

After doing all of this and restarting my various AirPort devices ? my two Express units no longer showed up in AirPort Utility. All contact with them was lost. Oops!

To regain access, I had to temporarily connect each Express to my Mac via an Ethernet cable. After considerable trial-and-error, I eventually figured out that the older Express units and the new AEBS were using different password methods (WEP vs. WPA). This is a no-no for WDS networks. As much as possible, you want everything (such as password, network name and radio channel) to match across all devices on the WDS network.

After updating the Express units' passwords to match the one on the AEBS, everything at last fell into place. The WDS network was up and running as I had hoped."

Remember that with the dual band you are setting up two different networks, and you can create one n-only network while the other network is set as b/g only. I actually use both networks, but you don't HAVE to use the b/g band.

Yes, but WDS is pointless for me, as because it only works with b/g networks, which are out of range for this machine, I require N, which doesn't support WDS, only extend network. But once again, this solution is way too expensive compared to a PCI card or a dongle.

10THzMac
Dec 22, 2009, 11:50 AM
So this site:

http://macwireless.com/

(maybe you already went there) claims to offer some options. The PCI card is still $80. There are some other options. I am in UK like you and a bit frustrated on this issue.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 12:03 PM
I think I've found a compatible card fromEdimax (http://www.play.com/PC/PCs/4-/3475306/Edimax-EW-7728IN-PCI-Wireless-N-WiFi-Card-300mbps-802-11n/Product.html?&_$ja=tsid:11518%7Ccc:%7Cprd:3475306%7Ccat:Networking). Has anyone used this one and is there anything obvious I'm missing? It uses a Ralink chipset - does that work with AirPort and will the Mac see it as an AirPort card?

Thanks :)

Dark Dragoon
Dec 22, 2009, 12:08 PM
I think I've found a compatible card from Edimax. Has anyone used this one and is there anything obvious I'm missing? It uses a Ralink chipset - does that work with AirPort and will the Mac see it as an AirPort card?

http://www.play.com/PC/PCs/4-/3475306/Edimax-EW-7728IN-PCI-Wireless-N-WiFi-Card-300mbps-802-11n/Product.html?&_$ja=tsid:11518%7Ccc:%7Cprd:3475306%7Ccat:Networking

Thanks :)

Have you checked to make sure it supports OSX?

There are other similar RaLink based cards such as SparkLAN WPIR-501 (http://www.oxfordtec.com/uk/APPLE-OSX-Wireless-PCI-Adapters-802.11n-draft---3000Mbps/c37_84_85/p131/SparkLAN-WPIR-501-Wireless-N-802.11n-draft-2.0-PCI-Adapter-(Ralink)-(with-antennae)/product_info.html), though it requires additional drivers and a separate connection utility. Also that particular one seems to have disappeared off SparkLans website along with the drivers.

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 12:12 PM
Have you checked to make sure it supports OSX?

There are other similar RaLink based cards such as SparkLAN WPIR-501 (http://www.oxfordtec.com/uk/APPLE-OSX-Wireless-PCI-Adapters-802.11n-draft---3000Mbps/c37_84_85/p131/SparkLAN-WPIR-501-Wireless-N-802.11n-draft-2.0-PCI-Adapter-(Ralink)-(with-antennae)/product_info.html), though it requires additional drivers and a separate connection utility. Also that particular one seems to have disappeared off SparkLans website along with the drivers.

It says it does on the website - ideally I want to find one that uses no such third-party connection utility - I'd prefer one that uses the AirPort software.

dcpmark
Dec 22, 2009, 12:37 PM
Yes, but WDS is pointless for me, as because it only works with b/g networks, which are out of range for this machine, I require N, which doesn't support WDS, only extend network. But once again, this solution is way too expensive compared to a PCI card or a dongle.

In retrospect I'm not sure how WDS even came into the conversation. When you set up a dual band network on the Airport Extreme, you can separately set the b/g to "participate in a WDS network", and the n-only network to "extend a wireless network." The Airport Express connected to the G5 via the ethernet cable, once properly set up, would function the same as a remote in a WDS network, thereby extending the n network to the G5 with only minimal loss of speed due to the overhead. I actually use this setup still to get blazing speeds into my PS3 compared to the built-in wireless connection.

Of course, I can't help on any cost difference between the two solutions. Had I known from your original query that you had a budget less than the cost of an Airport Express plus a cable I certainly wouldn't have tried to force the solution on you.....;)

applemax
Dec 22, 2009, 02:12 PM
In retrospect I'm not sure how WDS even came into the conversation. When you set up a dual band network on the Airport Extreme, you can separately set the b/g to "participate in a WDS network", and the n-only network to "extend a wireless network." The Airport Express connected to the G5 via the ethernet cable, once properly set up, would function the same as a remote in a WDS network, thereby extending the n network to the G5 with only minimal loss of speed due to the overhead. I actually use this setup still to get blazing speeds into my PS3 compared to the built-in wireless connection.

Of course, I can't help on any cost difference between the two solutions. Had I known from your original query that you had a budget less than the cost of an Airport Express plus a cable I certainly wouldn't have tried to force the solution on you.....;)

Except, it wouldn't as we have already established, WDS will NOT extend an N network. And actually the price difference between a PCI card and an AirPort Express is quite significant, so I ask again, seeing as no one has answered - can anyone recommend a PCI based solution?