Mac Pro and Gaming

[vaderhater245]

As i slowly gather the funds for the next revision of the mac pro, I'm fully aware of what I'm getting myself into. Money isn't a issue which is why I want a mac pro so i can get the best of both worlds. I am a hardcore gamer but at the same time a graphic design student about to graduate. Being a "hardcore" pc gamer, can the Mac Pro really withstand long gaming sessions in Win7 bootcamp? Its designed to be pushed to the max correct? At the same time, this is will be my money maker in about 5-6 months. Gaming wont shorten the Mac Pro's life right? Win7 will be on a separate disk if that matters. thanks in advance.

EDIT: when i mean hardcore, im talking 70+ steam games including MW2, GTA4, and L4D2.

[smogsy]

im gunna answer this the best i can,

i have a Mac pro 8 Core 2.26ghz 12GB ram 4870 512MB i also used to be a hardcore gamer,(FPS mainly) 5 months old now.

I havent installed any Windows OS on my machine, but i've run a few games on OSX such as WoW, Qauke (normally running for at least 12 hours)

not Hardcore games but both run well at 2560x1600 (60fps-120fps) on Ultra High which i think is very good for a very small sized graphics card, for my screen size i really need a 1GB+ Card..

Although Remember Windows Most games will run 30-50% faster as there not ported. even WoW runs 50% slower on OSX

i hope i answered your question in a weird way but helpful.

[Casa]

The Mac Pro isn't the best gaming machine really, mainly due to the lack of good graphics card options. If you're really a hardcore gamer, you should get a Mac Pro with ATI 4870 graphics, and that option is ridiculously overpriced at the Apple store. Look below in this forum section for the threads about flashing ATI cards though.
As I just said in another thread, I wouldn't buy a new Mac Pro for my private life anymore, since you'll always get much better gaming PCs for much less.
That said, if you're going to be a professional graphics designer, a Mac Pro is probably almost a requirement. They are excellent workstations for Photoshop etc., so as a (tax deductible) working machine it's first choice, but it's an overpriced second class gaming machine. It'll still run your games fine though if you're not going with the standard card.

[vaderhater245]

thanks for the quick replies. Im trying to condense the amount of computers i have. getting rid of early 2006 MBP and gaming rig for a Mac Pro seems to be the safest bet for me. I have my fingers crossed for a 5870 BTO option. I just want to know if some long term gaming mixed with FCS/Logic/PS/AI/FL will shorten its life even more?

[Dr.Pants]

thanks for the quick replies. Im trying to condense the amount of computers i have. getting rid of early 2006 MBP and gaming rig for a Mac Pro seems to be the safest bet for me. I have my fingers crossed for a 5870 BTO option. I just want to know if some long term gaming mixed with FCS/Logic/PS/AI/FL will shorten its life even more?

Shouldn't, unless a defect is found to exist (such as the 8600GT). In which case Apple will [maybe] extend support; also, this wouldn't be Apple-only, as the only thing that really is different on Mac is EFI instead of BIOS (aka same processors, chipsets, etc).

If you're worried about temps, get a fan controller program on the software side and crank it up.

[seisend]

The EVGA nVidia 285 GTX Mac Edition is at the moment the best graphicscard you can get for your Mac Pro if you are gaming in Windows.

[Cindori]

no, that would be the 5970.

[juliancs]

. even WoW runs 50% slower on OSX



This is wrong.

[ildondeigiocchi]

As i slowly gather the funds for the next revision of the mac pro, I'm fully aware of what I'm getting myself into. Money isn't a issue which is why I want a mac pro so i can get the best of both worlds. I am a hardcore gamer but at the same time a graphic design student about to graduate. Being a "hardcore" pc gamer, can the Mac Pro really withstand long gaming sessions in Win7 bootcamp? Its designed to be pushed to the max correct? At the same time, this is will be my money maker in about 5-6 months. Gaming wont shorten the Mac Pro's life right? Win7 will be on a separate disk if that matters. thanks in advance.

EDIT: when i mean hardcore, im talking 70+ steam games including MW2, GTA4, and L4D2.

I also was a hardcore pc gamer before my switch to Mac when I got my Mac Pro. The Mac Pro has enabled me to still continue being a hardcore "PC" gamer. I have Win7 installed on a dedicated Intel X-25m G2 80GB ssd and the OS runs great. The Mac Pro is really a great machine. The 4870 in my system has been able to run every game I've thrown at it on max settings with the exception of running slightly lower than native resolutions on my 30" ACD. However most steam games like L4D, L4D2, MW2, Half Life 2 Episode 2 and others run at max resolution and settings with over 60 FPS. My overall score in Win7 is a 7.4 which is great. The Mac Pro is a very wise investment and I strongly suggest it. Sure, you'll get people telling you that you can build a PC for less and get more out of it for gaming but a Mac Pro is elegant, a powerhouse workstation and a great gaming machine in Win7. The next revision should be interesting. I'm expecting Apple to offer the 5870 as BTO and if that's the case who says we can't run 2 in crossfire for gaming purposes under Windows. All it requires is a little cable tweaks. Depending how massive the update of the Mac Pro is, Apple might entice me to get the 2010 Mac Pro. I guess we'll just have to wait and see. The Mac Pro is truly a great investment and trust me you'll love it even more under Win7! :D

[ildondeigiocchi]

thanks for the quick replies. Im trying to condense the amount of computers i have. getting rid of early 2006 MBP and gaming rig for a Mac Pro seems to be the safest bet for me. I have my fingers crossed for a 5870 BTO option. I just want to know if some long term gaming mixed with FCS/Logic/PS/AI/FL will shorten its life even more?

Heavy gaming and video editing will always put a strain on your graphics card. However, if it does shorten its life with the purchase of Applecare you'll get it exchanged free of charge if it ever died on you.

[Mr.Bullitt]

I was wondering for long how many Mac Pro owners also use it for gaming via bootcamp.

Seem that new games support quad-core CPUs, - but do they also take advantage of the 2nd quad-core CPU if it is a dual CPU Mac Pro?

I assume that gamers can use one of the many Soundlbaster X-fi USB headset or external sound-cards for gaming sound..

[ildondeigiocchi]

I was wondering for long how many Mac Pro owners also use it for gaming via bootcamp.

Seem that new games support quad-core CPUs, - but do they also take advantage of the 2nd quad-core CPU if it is a dual CPU Mac Pro?

I assume that gamers can use one of the many Soundlbaster X-fi USB headset or external sound-cards for gaming sound..

I would say that a lot of Mac Pro owners game under windows. Only some games take advantage of 8-cores. FSX is one of them. However, most only go up to 4-cores. However, thanks to Hyperthreading games work really well. I love Win7 on my Mac Pro. Gaming for me is a must and my Mac Pro has never let me down! :D

[alam]

mac pro is well qualified for hardcore gaming
i've played crysis, crysis warhead, fallout 3, and many hardcore games on fullhd resolution 1920x1080 @ high end quality with my gtx 285 Mac Eddition, they run awesomely lol
except crysis warhead.... well i've played it on 1280x720 for decent FPS :o
good luck

[ildondeigiocchi]

mac pro is well qualified for hardcore gaming
i've played crysis, crysis warhead, fallout 3, and many hardcore games on fullhd resolution 1920x1080 @ high end quality with my gtx 285 Mac Eddition, they run awesomely lol
except crysis warhead.... well i've played it on 1280x720 for decent FPS :o
good luck

+1. I agree. Games run especially well under Windows 7 which I must say is a truly amazing Operating System. :D

[Gomff]

Another recommendation for gaming in boot camp (windows 7) here. :D:D

[maghemi]

no, that would be the 5970.

Can you point me in the direction of where Apple sell these?

[skyline r34]

Watch my youtube video i'm gaming on a 08 3.2GHz 8-Core with 512MB 8800GT

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kH-6gI34QLc

[Mackilroy]

Can you point me in the direction of where Apple sell these?

They don't. The 5970 is currently PC-only.

[Nostromo]

I regularly read about flashing ATI cards.

Does this mean to install different firmware to make them OS X compatible?

[maghemi]

They don't. The 5970 is currently PC-only.

As I thought.

Then this statement is incorrect

no, that would be the 5970.

[Cindori]

as it was an answer to this:

The EVGA nVidia 285 GTX Mac Edition is at the moment the best graphicscard you can get for your Mac Pro if you are gaming in Windows.


It's not incorrect. 5970 is the best graphic card for MacPro when gaming in windows.
A MacPro booting windows is basically a PC.

[HSJR]

I had similar situation a yours last year. I've bought MP quad core 2009 model with ati 4870. I am playing all games with highest resolution 1920X1200. I play fallout 3 and Empire total war with Darthmod ultimate commander. Both games run smoothly with the highest setting. Gaming on MP under bootcamp is highly recommended with no known issues. Surely MP 2010 model will get more advantage over 2009 in all aspect. :D:D:D

[Mackilroy]

I regularly read about flashing ATI cards.

Does this mean to install different firmware to make them OS X compatible?

It just means you flash the card with a Mac-appropriate ROM to enable use under OS X.

[maghemi]

as it was an answer to this:
It's not incorrect. 5970 is the best graphic card for MacPro when gaming in windows.
A MacPro booting windows is basically a PC.

Should have quoted that then.

[Mackilroy]

Should have quoted that then.

It was pretty obvious...

Hopefully if Apple releases the 5870, we can get the 5970 working in the same manner we got the 4890 working.

[Cindori]

It was pretty obvious...

Hopefully if Apple releases the 5870, we can get the 5970 working in the same manner we got the 4890 working.



no...

we can get it to work in the same manner as 4870x2. aka, with injectors, and only 1 core working, aka a 5870.


5970 = 5870x2

no card like the 4890 has been announced for 5000 series yet

[Mackilroy]

no...

we can get it to work in the same manner as 4870x2. aka, with injectors, and only 1 core working, aka a 5870.


5970 = 5870x2

no card like the 4890 has been announced for 5000 series yet
That's what I meant. Sorry.

[lannister80]

I have a flashed 1GB XFX 4870 in my 8x2.8 2008 MP. It flies. I can fully max out:

Crysis
Crysis 2
Borderlands
Batman: Arkham Asylum
Modern Warfare 2
Modern Warfare
CoD: World at War
Dirt 2
WoW (of course)
L4D2

etc with almost 0 frame stutter, and that's just using XP32 (so limits my RAM usage, as I have 10GB).

You should have no problem with Win 7, I'm sure it's even faster.

[Mr.Bullitt]

how is the new top of the line iMacs for gaming compared to the Mac Pro???

[ildondeigiocchi]

how is the new top of the line iMacs for gaming compared to the Mac Pro???

Compared to the Mac Pro, iMacs will not get as good FPS. Mac Pro uses desktop graphics cards whereas the iMac uses mobile graphics, which results in a performance decrease. Nonetheless, they can run all new games just not on max settings like a Mac Pro. :p

[Mr.Bullitt]

Compared to the Mac Pro, iMacs will not get as good FPS. Mac Pro uses desktop graphics cards whereas the iMac uses mobile graphics, which results in a performance decrease. Nonetheless, they can run all new games just not on max settings like a Mac Pro. :p

I am not a hard core gamer, but play like 2-3 games a year - when something big comes out, like doom 3, call of duty series...

and after owning a PS3 for 2 years, I bought the first game this week - maybe I will not need the PC part anyway :-)

[MacRumorUser]

I have a flashed 1GB XFX 4870 in my 8x2.8 2008 MP. It flies. I can fully max out:

Crysis
Crysis 2

etc with almost 0 frame stutter, and that's just using XP32 (so limits my RAM usage, as I have 10GB).

You should have no problem with Win 7, I'm sure it's even faster.


Yeah I have same machine albeit 12GB ram, and also a flashed XFX 4870 but I'm on Windows 7 64bit.

I too can run Crysis & Crysis Warhead maxed out at 1920 x 1200 with seemingly no dramatic framerate drops.

Although other than the in-engine cutscenes, I think both Crysis games are very graphically overated. I just can't figure out whats so great about them.

However it is always nice to know your macpro can handle them still though :)

Dragon Age Origins
Borderlands etc... all maxed out too. Great machine really and the 4870 is a great GPU for the money.

[Cindori]

Neither of you are maxing out AA.

[MacRumorUser]

Is there a need for AA at high resolutions though ? But yes I will admit on Crysis / Crysis warhead AA turned off, and on games like Dragon Age 4x AA is on.

[Transporteur]

Is there a need for AA at high resolutions though ?

Don't you think?

I played COD MW2 on my Pro on 7Pro 64bit and it looks definitely way better with AA, even though I chose the native resolution of my display.

BTW: Runs great with Apples 4870 and the maximum resolution of 2560x1600.

[Topper]

Is there a need for AA at high resolutions though?

Just as one example:
I run X-Plane with my Mac Edition GTX 285 in Boot Camp (WinXP).
Resolution 2560 x 1600.
At 4xAA the beaches look very realistic as they blend in beautifully with the ocean and land.
With no anti-aliasing, there is a coarse line between the ocean and the beaches and the land and the beaches.

[Cindori]

there is no need for more then 2x aa in crysis at high res. I was simply correcting your statement; crysis isnt "maxed" with only the effects set to Very High.

[ildondeigiocchi]

Is there a need for AA at high resolutions though ? But yes I will admit on Crysis / Crysis warhead AA turned off, and on games like Dragon Age 4x AA is on.

In my opinion AA makes a world's difference. With AA turned on to the max objects look so much smoother and details stand out better.

[Matrixfan]

In my opinion AA makes a world's difference. With AA turned on to the max objects look so much smoother and details stand out better.

I came to an opposite conclusion :p AA sometimes tends to blur the overall detail. Granted, jagged lines are distracting but imho AA is only needed on the edges.

[lannister80]

there is no need for more then 2x aa in crysis at high res. I was simply correcting your statement; crysis isnt "maxed" with only the effects set to Very High.
Hmm, I thought I had all the textures set to "extra" or "ultra" or whatever plus 8x FSAA. Maybe I'm not remembering correctly...?

[Transporteur]

Hmm, I thought I had all the textures set to "extra" or "ultra" or whatever plus 8x FSAA. Maybe I'm not remembering correctly...?

Depends on the resolution, doesn't it?

Crysis on 2560x1600 and full AA is definitely not possible with the ATI 4000 series, but should run pretty smooth on 1280x800.

[brendon2020]

i'm a web developer and also a hardcore pc gamer and decided to just to get a mac pro and build a pc and just switch between the two. I've also never had any issues with the mac pro, so the long gaming session shouldn't be an issue on the mac pro. They're so well ventilated that heat won't be an issue.

[Nostromo]

i'm a web developer and also a hardcore pc gamer and decided to just to get a mac pro and build a pc and just switch between the two. I've also never had any issues with the mac pro, so the long gaming session shouldn't be an issue on the mac pro. They're so well ventilated that heat won't be an issue.

Why do you buy two computers? Why not pool the money, get the best Mac Pro, and run windows via Boot Camp?

[Gomff]

Why do you buy two computers? Why not pool the money, get the best Mac Pro, and run windows via Boot Camp?

For gaming, Macs will always lag behind PC's, largely because of the limited GPU options.

[Nostromo]

For gaming, Macs will always lag behind PC's, largely because of the limited GPU options.

Yes, this is a big Achilles heel that Apple has to get rid of.

I don't see why Mac users have to go through trouble like flashing GPUs because they are either not available for the mac, or for twice the price that a PC user pays.

[Cindori]

For gaming, Macs will always lag behind PC's, largely because of the limited GPU options.

but isnt it easier still to then buy a dedicated windows GPU like 5870? still cheaper then buying a whole pc.

[sparkie1984]

hi guys, sorry to but in on this

so the post above, is that saying you can just buy a decent card thats windows compatible and set windows to boot with that card running instead of the one that comes with the mac pro??

can you set windows to do that? or do you mean by flashing it, it makes osx work with it as well as windows?

[Cindori]

you can have 1 mac card for osx and 1 pc card for windows. all you have to do is to switch the cable upon reboot.
a mac booting windows is a PC.

[sparkie1984]

thanks cindori

[Genghis Khan]

you can have 1 mac card for osx and 1 pc card for windows. all you have to do is to switch the cable upon reboot.
a mac booting windows is a PC.

i'm thinking of doing this. my 8800GT handled MW2 fine @1920x1080...but i've started playing Crysis...it's just dying

a 4870x2 would be good if i could find one cheap...

[Cindori]

personally I would just wait, we are only a few months away from flashing 5870's

[Akula971]

you can have 1 mac card for osx and 1 pc card for windows. all you have to do is to switch the cable upon reboot.
a mac booting windows is a PC.

If you have a Dell monitor that has VGA & DVi inputs then no need to switch cables, just select the input via the front panel buttons.

I was in the same quandary that you are in. I had one PC for gaming and a mini mac for everything else. The mini was underpowered for photo editing and such, so I had the choice of either a PC for games, plus an IMac for everything else or just get a Pro to do it all. I didn't like the idea of two machines with rats nests of cables, cables switch boxes and such. So I got the Pro with a 4870 and am glad I did. In the future when the 4870 fails. I'll get a lower powered card for OSX and an off the shelf PC video card for gaming in windows.

I used to be a PC fanatic, always updating to the latest cards, faster ram, etc. But in all honesty the changes you see from generation to generation of card, processor are best described as incremental. Yes they may quote that you get 20Fps more, but does it really make a great difference above 60FPs? I don't think so.

[Akula971]

Deleted, Double post

[nanofrog]

you can have 1 mac card for osx and 1 pc card for windows. all you have to do is to switch the cable upon reboot.
a mac booting windows is a PC.
Or get a 2 port KVM switch for convenience for those "Ugh. I have to stretch to reach the cables..." moments. ;) :D :p

[Topper]

Or get a 2 port KVM switch for convenience for those "Ugh. I have to stretch to reach the cables..." moments. ;) :D :p

That's a great suggestion.
You've got me looking at KVM switches.
I've found two problems:
Very few support 30 inch monitor resolutions.
Those that do are quite expensive.

[nanofrog]

That's a great suggestion.
You've got me looking at KVM switches.
I've found two problems:
Very few support 30 inch monitor resolutions.
Those that do are quite expensive.
I don't know where you are, but here's the only 2 port DVI KVM switches that can run 30" monitors (2560 x 1600) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010290143%201112808982%201112929427&name=2560%20x%201600) on newegg.

They range from $140 - $220USD. It's not that bad, given the resolution requirements (Dual Link DVI compliant).

[Topper]

I don't know where you are, but here's the only 2 port DVI KVM switches that can run 30" monitors (2560 x 1600) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010290143%201112808982%201112929427&name=2560%20x%201600) on newegg.

They range from $140 - $220USD. It's not that bad, given the resolution requirements (Dual Link DVI compliant).

Yep, I found them, thank you.
The reviews on the Belkin are a little iffy.

It will be nice to run a powerful PC card without unplugging the monitor cables.

[glowfly]

the 4890 works just fine. btw the new mac i just bought is off the hook.. i just love it so much

[glowfly]

something i want :D

* 2.8GHz Intel Core 2 Extreme
* 2GB memory
* 500GB hard drive1
* 8x double-layer SuperDrive
* ATI Radeon HD 2600 PRO with 256MB memory

The new imac

[nanofrog]

Yep, I found them, thank you.
The reviews on the Belkin are a little iffy.

It will be nice to run a powerful PC card without unplugging the monitor cables.
I didn't read the reviews, so I don't know the details about the Belkin unit.

As I also didn't know where you're located (US, Europe,... ?), the link was just for information (model #'s to check other sites for example). Newegg's fairly easy to find things, but for other sites, it may be harder to narrow the search parameters.