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Blue Velvet
Aug 12, 2004, 07:28 PM
I was told by a straight-faced self-styled "computer expert" the other day that:

"Macs aren't compatible with the Internet because the Internet runs on PCs"

He went on to say "... and they only come in girlie colours, anyway"

(This then caused me to think about the actual effectiveness of Apple's marketing strategy with the average consumer instead of the hype...)

What's the biggest load of uninformed baloney you've ever heard about Macs or Apple?

King Cobra
Aug 12, 2004, 07:33 PM
"Macs aren't compatible with the Internet because the Internet runs on PCs"

He went on to say "... and they only come in girlie colours, anyway"
That's pretty bad.

I got just a little pissed off when a bio teacher from my H.S. out of the blue referred to my Firewire Graphite iBook as a toilet seat. My H.S. was (and prob. still is) 100% PC-pro, because 0% Macs were being used for anything current. Maybe my 4 years there inspired some...since the new computer techie there is a Mac man.

stoid
Aug 12, 2004, 07:59 PM
One professor at my college told us to use mp3 format audio files because, "Macs aren't compatible with WAVs and Windows computers can't play AIFFs" I'm certain that OS X can handle WAVs fresh out of the box. Can't Windows computers handle AIFFs fine too? Or would you have to install QuickTime?

Elan0204
Aug 12, 2004, 08:07 PM
Not as bad as some of the ones said here, but many people don't understand what iTunes is. Some people think that the program costs money and that it has no other functions besides the iTMS. Worse still, others believe that it forces you to pay for all the mp3s you already have when you install it.

quagmire
Aug 12, 2004, 08:10 PM
That they believe that bs trojan made by intego was actually something.

jsw
Aug 12, 2004, 08:23 PM
Well, this doesn't quite fit, but I just had to share it because it just happened today.

I work a fair amount at home - mainly because I get a whole lot more writing and (Java) coding done on my Mac than I do on the Windows machines at work. Anyway, one benefit of working at home is that I can occasionally leave during the day and no one needs to know. Today, I went with my wife and daughter to Newburyport, MA (http://www.newburyportchamber.org/), a cute sea-side town about a half-hour away from me.

After lunch, while my daughter was playing on a nice outdoor jungle gym with other kids (I gave my wife some time to look around on her own), I sat down on a nearby bench to catch up on some work email. And, yes, I was keeping an eye on my daughter. Anyway... I sat down next to a guy with some obviously new, probably Centrino-based Dell laptop. He watched me take out my 1999 Lombard PB and then told me - with a smirk - that he couldn't get any wireless signal, and that there was "no way I would with that old thing." So, I thanked him, woke up the PB, logged onto work, read email, called my boss, told him I'd gotten his last mail (asking for a document), told him I was sending it to him as we spoke, sent it, then thanked him for letting me know he'd received it. I then checked out CNN.com to see what was happening. When my daughter needed my help for a second, I set the PB down - intentionally so the guy could see the screen. When I got back, he asked me how in the world I got signal there, when he couldn't detect anything. I just smiled and said "hey, it's old, but it's still a Mac".

I kept browsing - and I know it was eating him up that his brand-new toy got zero signal.

Then, later, I got up and walked away, calling my brother about an email he'd sent - he just got a new 23" ACD to play with at work. The guy on the bench was not pleased; I think he kept pretending to work just to try to save face. I felt pretty good about myself.

Had he not been such a dick, I might have told him a few things:

(1) I have two cell phones. The one I used to call work was my (duh) work phone. The one he did not see - my personal cell - was clipped to my belt, with Bluetooth enabled.

(2) I had a Bluetooth dongle on the PB that connected to the phone, letting me browse.

These things might have made him feel better. As it is, though, I have to wonder what he was thinking. ;)

Blue Velvet
Aug 12, 2004, 08:30 PM
...Then, later, I got up and walked away, calling my brother about an email he'd sent - he just got a new 23" ACD to play with at work. The guy on the bench was not pleased; I think he kept pretending to work just to try to save face. I felt pretty good about myself...

That is a great story.

He who laughs last...

Elan0204
Aug 12, 2004, 09:05 PM
I love the twist at the end of that story with the bluetooth dongle. Although, I think it would have been cooler if you really did get a signal when he didn't.

Jalexster
Aug 12, 2004, 09:13 PM
I know someone who insists that Mac OS X sucks because it is based on UNIX. He firmly belives that UNIX is unstable, slower, and less secure than Windows.

He also claimes that Macs can't use GIF, JPG, FTP or Apache.

Make them stop... please make the fanboys stop...

enclave
Aug 12, 2004, 09:14 PM
I know someone who insists that Mac OS X sucks because it is based on UNIX. He firmly belives that UNIX is unstable, slower, and less secure than Windows.

He also claimes that Macs can't use GIF, JPG, FTP or Apache.

Make them stop... please make the fanboys stop...

It's a sad fact that the only people to blame for the ignorant beliefs of macs are Apple themselves, if there marketing department stopped focusing so much on how macs look and started showing people what they CAN DO and that pc's and macs can live together quite happily, it will never change.....

AppleMatt
Aug 12, 2004, 09:15 PM
I've had people swear blind Microsoft doesn't make Office for Mac, and when I've shown them they've insisted that Microsoft don't make it it's out-sourced, and that it's not compatible with the PC version anyway, and it's years out of date etc etc.

I don't bother with them in the end.

AppleMatt

jsw
Aug 12, 2004, 09:16 PM
I love the twist at the end of that story with the bluetooth dongle. Although, I think it would have been cooler if you really did get a signal when he didn't.Well, yes - that would definitely have been better. But I would have been embarrassed sliding my old PCMCIA Dell-branded (God forbid) 802.11b card into the slot - the Lombards don't support AirPort.

As it stands, though, the guy's left thinking his system is crap. I really would have told him, but he was so arrogant and smug I just couldn't make myself do it. If I go back and find him there with a new PowerBook, still unable to get a signal, I'll feel bad... for the PB. ;)

jsw
Aug 12, 2004, 09:19 PM
It's a sad fact that the only people to blame for the ignorant beliefs of macs are Apple themselves, if there marketing department stopped focusing so much on how macs look and started showing people what they CAN DO and that pc's and macs can live together quite happily, it will never change.....Hear, hear! God, I wish Apple would consider letting people know what Macs can do. One thirty-second commercial, properly written, voice-over by Jeff Goldblum, that's all it would take. Yes, they're pretty. Yes, they connect to the iPod. But, really, they actually can do work. Frustrating....

enclave
Aug 12, 2004, 09:20 PM
Hear, hear! God, I wish Apple would consider letting people know what Macs can do. One thirty-second commercial, properly written, voice-over by Jeff Goldblum, that's all it would take. Yes, they're pretty. Yes, they connect to the iPod. But, really, they actually can do work. Frustrating....

That's so true, as much as I hate that guy I agree...

stoid
Aug 12, 2004, 09:22 PM
The saddest part of your story jsw, is that due to the skewed Centrino commercials, that guy probably bought that laptop because he thought he COULD get a wireless internet signal anywhere and everywhere! :mad: :eek:

Blue Velvet
Aug 12, 2004, 09:25 PM
I also have been told with solemn authority:

"You can't upgrade them -- like putting a new hard-drive or memory in"

Don't know whether to laugh or cry...

jsw
Aug 12, 2004, 09:31 PM
The saddest part of your story jsw, is that due to the skewed Centrino commercials, that guy probably bought that laptop because he thought he COULD get a wireless internet signal anywhere and everywhere! :mad: :eek:Well, I thought the saddest part was that my laptop was over 5 years old, but whatever.... ;)

I think it's unfortunate if people buy laptops - PC or Mac or otherwise - under the belief that they'll get signal everywhere, especially if they're led to believe they'll get free signal everywhere.

Of course, I guess it's up to them to do their research. The ads are just ads. No one - hopefully - thinks that buying an iPod will make them able to dance, even though everyone in the 'pod commercials can.

jsw
Aug 12, 2004, 09:36 PM
I also have been told with solemn authority:

"You can't upgrade them -- like putting a new hard-drive or memory in"

Don't know whether to laugh or cry...

These lies were furthered by this movie (http://webdev.o1.com/rvb/movies/switch/RvB_switch.mov). "On the Mac, when it's time to upgrade, just pick it up, throw it away, and go buy another one."
Yeah, you've probably seen it. But it's a personal favorite. ;)

virividox
Aug 12, 2004, 09:36 PM
yeah those centrino commercials are really full of it; they make people who arent knowledgeable or saavy enough to do research think they can access the web anywhere anytime

flase advertising

Elan0204
Aug 12, 2004, 09:39 PM
But I would have been embarrassed sliding my old PCMCIA Dell-branded (God forbid) 802.11b card into the slot - the Lombards don't support AirPort.

Heaven forbid, indeed. :D

Maybe if you do find him there with a new powerbook it will have bluetooth built in, and you could then reveal your secret.

Hear, hear! God, I wish Apple would consider letting people know what Macs can do. One thirty-second commercial, properly written, voice-over by Jeff Goldblum, that's all it would take. Yes, they're pretty. Yes, they connect to the iPod. But, really, they actually can do work. Frustrating....

Good point. I'm the only Mac user in my family, and I have to correct them all the time about this stuff. Apple really needs to work towards correcting all these misconceptions. I wonder where people get all these wrong ideas from anyway.

Elan0204
Aug 12, 2004, 09:43 PM
These lies were furthered by this movie (http://webdev.o1.com/rvb/movies/switch/RvB_switch.mov). "On the Mac, when it's time to upgrade, just pick it up, throw it away, and go buy another one."
Yeah, you've probably seen it. But it's a personal favorite. ;)


I've never seen that one before. It's funny, and it is kind of true about the mac gaming stuff.

michaelrjohnson
Aug 12, 2004, 09:44 PM
yeah those centrino commercials are really full of it; they make people who arent knowledgeable or saavy enough to do research think they can access the web anywhere anytime

flase advertising

Word for word, my thoughts exactly.

stoid
Aug 12, 2004, 09:46 PM
Slightly off-topic I guess, but how would I go about using my built-in bluetooth to get dial-up internet anywhere? I have T-Mobile cell service right now (thanks to the 'rents). I'm guessing I'd need a Bluetooth enabled phone instead of this cheap POS Nokia that they gave me for free for signing up ;) What's a cheap BT phone, and will ANY Bluetooth phone work, or do I can I only get certain ones? Also, does it cost any more than just using plan minutes?

jsw
Aug 12, 2004, 09:56 PM
Slightly off-topic I guess, but how would I go about using my built-in bluetooth to get dial-up internet anywhere? I have T-Mobile cell service right now (thanks to the 'rents). I'm guessing I'd need a Bluetooth enabled phone instead of this cheap POS Nokia that they gave me for free for signing up ;) What's a cheap BT phone, and will ANY Bluetooth phone work, or do I can I only get certain ones? Also, does it cost any more than just using plan minutes?
One thread that discusses it can be found here (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=76163&highlight=bluetooth). There are others - just search for them. I connect using a Nokia 3650, which was free using an Amazon/T-Mobile rebate last year. I use T-Mobile, and have the tzones Pro package. Internet access costs me nothing additional and uses no minutes. However, it's slow (average <20kbps, with peaks to 27kbps) and unreliable (sometimes connect for 30 minutes or more, sometimes get dropped every two minutes).

jsj
Aug 12, 2004, 10:09 PM
It's a sad fact that the only people to blame for the ignorant beliefs of macs are Apple themselves.....

True. I'm constantly annoyed that people, even Mac enthusiasts, constantly downplay the power of anything minus the Power prefix, as something that is suited for little more than email and iPod. I see Apple Store employees constantly perpetuating this myth, perhaps to push higher sales, and have always been dumbfounded. Several people I've known (average computer users) have been turned off to Macs because they can't afford a Powerbook or Powermac, which they've been led to believe are the only Apple computers which can handle more than the most trivial tasks.

JzzTrump22
Aug 12, 2004, 10:16 PM
Theres someone whith no knowlede of macs... whatsoever. I always get the "macs are gay, there slow and crappy" Thats all i hear from most of my pc user friends.

tech4all
Aug 12, 2004, 10:24 PM
Tell me about it. It just ticks me off (really, my heart starts pumping a lot) when PC users put down Macs for dumb reasons. Like, "Macs can't play games". BS! Sure a PC is better at that, but a Mac CAN play games. Then theres, "Macs aren't compatable with anything"....."Macs only have a 1 button mouse" (HELLO, you get a two,three,four button mouse for a Mac, and it WILL work)...."You can't upgrade Macs; once there outdated you throw them away"....and I think I even heard...."Macs suck because they suck".......w/e :rolleyes:

But a lot of the critizisms about Macs are from people who have know knowledge of Macs and make ignorant statements.

Ryan1524
Aug 12, 2004, 11:19 PM
at least you heard them trying to back it up with some excuse. i've heard a lot of "macs? Ew" and that was it. i walked away with a peter griffin dumbfounded face on me. why bother. ;)

but yea, apple NEED to make more commercials, better commercials, longer commercials. they can make cool, informative videos for the keynote, condense it, and play them on TV for pete's sake. :mad:

SolidGun
Aug 12, 2004, 11:33 PM
I DESPISE people that judge products that they have never used or spent time to learn about. WHO are they to judge something that they don't know? I am a hardcore PC user that decided to try out the Mac to judge it for myself without other people influencing me and I am in love with my PB. I would marry it if bigamy was legal (okay, maybe not that far).
I read three Mac books in the last two weeks and I know enough to judge Macs from here and other Mac enthusiasts sites, and I do think Macs are better at a lot of things and will be if there was more support with software and hardware.
People just fear what they don't know and they don't know Mac.
Partially, Apple is to blame with their idiotic advertisement that shows the "looks", but doesn't explain what the hell is going on!?!?!?!
Next time someone judges something they have never used, you should remind them that it is not their place to make comments about what they don't know.

jhu
Aug 12, 2004, 11:38 PM
yes, apple does tend to have that snobbish, yuppy feel to their advertising. but really, the only real argument against macs is the price.

mac_gal
Aug 12, 2004, 11:57 PM
I am so embarrassed to admit this, but here's what I used to think before I got a Mac:

"The only reason they look so good is because they perform so badly. They've got to sell their computers SOMEHOW, so they make them sexy."

"The only reason creative types like the Mac is that it looks good."

"No right click. Grrrrrr."

I know, all wrong, sorrysorrysorry! I think though, that Apple hasn't done enough of a job emphasizing their software / interface. We have all these gorgeous ads showing the computer but not showing things like Expose, etc.

JeffTL
Aug 13, 2004, 12:33 AM
yes, apple does tend to have that snobbish, yuppy feel to their advertising. but really, the only real argument against macs is the price.

Price? Perhaps on the desktops. Funny that when I was in the laptop market (May 03) I couldn't find anything with as good a battery or hardware quality as an iBook, particularly with XP Pro as suggested for cooperating with large networks, for anywhere near the price.

TEG
Aug 13, 2004, 01:17 AM
Before Working at my High School on the computer systems I knew how to work on Macs but didn't like them peticularly. It wasn't until I worked on them for a year at school, that I learned the greatest thing about Macs is how fast you can fix them when you have a problem. Since I've had my TiBook, I have had only one problem that I couldn't fix in 10 minutes.

I keep having to teach people about Macs, expecially since Centrino. Many believe that Centrino is a new Technology allowing you to wirelessly connect to a network or the internet, and that it is the only way to do it. When I inform them that the technology has been standard on Macs since 1999 the scoff and say I'm lying and walk away.

/I HATE CENTRINO

TEG

Blue Velvet
Aug 13, 2004, 02:07 AM
One of our web guys said...

"2.5ghz? That's not even as fast as a typical Pentium III. And it costs how much?"

edesignuk
Aug 13, 2004, 02:14 AM
One of our web guys said...

"2.5ghz? That's not even as fast as a typical Pentium III. And it costs how much?"That's funny. The PIII stopped at 1.4GHz!!!

Blue Velvet
Aug 13, 2004, 02:18 AM
That's funny. The PIII stopped at 1.4GHz!!!

That's why he's a web guy, I guess and not in I.T. :)

Like, I should know what a PIII is or does?!

But it's the same-old, same-old ghz myth.

iJon
Aug 13, 2004, 02:36 AM
people dont argue with me anymore, cause they know that i know what im talking about and they dont. even though macs being are better are opinion based, i always outweigh their opinions with mine, it's just no argument. my friend also respect my opinions cause of my job, so it's not to hard for me to inform people.

iJon

evilgEEk
Aug 13, 2004, 02:45 AM
My personal favorite is:

"Ugh, I used a Mac once in school and it was horrible!"

Of course they're referring to a machine that's 10+ years old!

I'm a switcher, but only because of OS X. Not a big fan of the previous versions of mac OS.

The other one I like is the typical "over-priced" excuse. Riiiiiight... a kick-arse ibook for $1100 bucks, retail? I don't think that's over-priced.

I have recently convinced a co-worker to switch, got her 14" ibook yesterday and absolutely loves it, and I've just convinced my sister-in-law to get a 12" ibook for school. It's going to be just wonderful when her $999 (edu price) 4.6lb ibook runs circles around her brother's brand new 30lb $2200 Sony Vaio. I so wish that man would have talked to me before buying that piece of trash laptop.

Oh, I've switched my wife too.

Changing the computer world one person at a time. :)

jhu
Aug 13, 2004, 07:38 AM
My personal favorite is:

"Ugh, I used a Mac once in school and it was horrible!"

Of course they're referring to a machine that's 10+ years old!

I'm a switcher, but only because of OS X. Not a big fan of the previous versions of mac OS.

The other one I like is the typical "over-priced" excuse. Riiiiiight... a kick-arse ibook for $1100 bucks, retail? I don't think that's over-priced.

I have recently convinced a co-worker to switch, got her 14" ibook yesterday and absolutely loves it, and I've just convinced my sister-in-law to get a 12" ibook for school. It's going to be just wonderful when her $999 (edu price) 4.6lb ibook runs circles around her brother's brand new 30lb $2200 Sony Vaio. I so wish that man would have talked to me before buying that piece of trash laptop.

Oh, I've switched my wife too.

Changing the computer world one person at a time. :)

you switched your wife? how were you able to switch wives?

personally, my computing needs are modest, so i couldn't justify a $1100 ibook. if i were to get a laptop, it'd probably be one of those $600 laptops that you see everyone once in a while. however, i can't even justify spending that right now either.

Mord
Aug 13, 2004, 07:59 AM
dude you dont get it do you, a $600 laptop will be a cellery cpu 1hour battery monster that will choke on it's 128MB of shared memory, you get what you pay for, for a laptop that will last you 5 years or so (yes 5 years) before it cant run the latest os you can get a 12" powerbook or for 3-4 years of solid mac use you can get an ibook. it's about cost effectiveness and buying a mac will last the longest, a $600 pc laptop will last a year before you get sick of it and cant live with it while you are useing xp sp3 sprawled with spyware.

broken_keyboard
Aug 13, 2004, 08:52 AM
I was surprised the other day when I brought some files to work on my Apple burned DVD (with the logo on it). Since our desktops only had CD drives I had to get the tech support ppl to load it on the network. As soon as they saw the Apple logo it was "is this compatible?" - "Apple sucks" etc.

And these are supposedly professionals. I'm sure the Apple server admin tools would make their lives so much easier. And the Xserve pricing is also very competitive I believe.

NusuniAdmin
Aug 13, 2004, 09:10 AM
only complaint i really hear about macs is they dont have many games. Which is true.

I have also heard the common things such as they are too expensive...usually that comes from my peers who wear 400 dollar shoes and live in a trailor park though. Usually after people like that say they are too expensive i will be a smart @$$ about it.

I actually (in real life, chat rooms is another story) rarely hear macs are slow, even from my x86 freak friends. One of them said macs were slow and crap until he got on one of my friends 1.33 ghz 15" powerbook...he shut up after that :D

Chappers
Aug 13, 2004, 09:53 AM
And don't forget 'Macs are only good for graphics'.

millhouse_man
Aug 13, 2004, 10:21 AM
And don't forget 'Macs are only good for graphics'.

Yeah, or "Why would you get a Mac unless your just going to use it for video editing?"

MattG
Aug 13, 2004, 10:29 AM
I've got a friend who goes "eww" every time I mention my Macs and constantly berates them, despite the fact that she *constantly* has problems with her HP, all Windows related. There's just no convincing some people.

jhu
Aug 13, 2004, 10:39 AM
dude you dont get it do you, a $600 laptop will be a cellery cpu 1hour battery monster that will choke on it's 128MB of shared memory, you get what you pay for, for a laptop that will last you 5 years or so (yes 5 years) before it cant run the latest os you can get a 12" powerbook or for 3-4 years of solid mac use you can get an ibook. it's about cost effectiveness and buying a mac will last the longest, a $600 pc laptop will last a year before you get sick of it and cant live with it while you are useing xp sp3 sprawled with spyware.

dude, you didn't read my comment carefully, did you? you don't know what my preferences are, so i'll tell you: price. i can't justify a $1100 laptop when i can get a $600 laptop that's fully functional by my standards and will last longer than you think. besides, i already said that i can't even justify $600 for a laptop. and who said i'd be using windows?

stcanard
Aug 13, 2004, 10:47 AM
personally, my computing needs are modest, so i couldn't justify a $1100 ibook. if i were to get a laptop, it'd probably be one of those $600 laptops that you see everyone once in a while. however, i can't even justify spending that right now either.

But how many $600 laptops do you have to buy over the lifetime of a single $1100 iBook?

I previously have bought 2 low cost (at that time low cost was defined as CDN$1100 you couldn't get a laptop cheaper) intel based notebooks. One Compaq and one Gateway.

Both of them had non-functional parts within a year. In the case of the Compaq it was the CD-Rom (common failure mode, too, I hear) which pretty much made the system useless. I take care of my systems, but they are notebooks so of course they will be carried around and knocked a bit.

[Back on topic]

I've heard all of these:

(from a fellow computer professional) "How can you live without Microsoft products? I need to have Word available"

"I can't send you an email, because I'm on a PC, you're a Mac. You won't be able to read it".

Lately though, I've been hearing a lot of this: :D

Can you burn this to a CD for me? My windows system doesn't like to do it.

Can you rip this music for me? I can't seem to get it to work.

Can you edit this picture/movie for me? I just can't find a way to do it.

My powerbook is making a lot of people around me who were windows only seriously rethink their next purchase. Anytime somebody asks me a question or makes an ignorant comment (honest ignorance, not bigoted) I make sure we sit down and I take them on a tour.

bosskxx1
Aug 13, 2004, 10:54 AM
A lot of people that I have talked to about macs have said they sucked because it really wasn't an operating system. When they were describing it to me, I knew what they were talking about, At Ease. At Ease was an application that prevented you from accessing the finder, and the only thing it allowed you to do was to click an application from a panel. It was mainly used in education about 10 years ago.

After showing them Mac OS X they were stunned, and believed it was as good or even better than WinXP.

AppleMatt
Aug 13, 2004, 11:01 AM
I've got a friend who goes "eww" every time I mention my Macs and constantly berates them, despite the fact that she *constantly* has problems with her HP, all Windows related. There's just no convincing some people.

Ha! I love that, I absolutely love it when Windows people ask me to download the latest patch for them because Windows won't see their modem or whatever. When that worm hit last year, that restarted PC's after a few minutes I was inundated with people asking me to download the fix for them, because everytime they tried it wouldn't complete before it restarted.

A lot of people that I have talked to about macs have said they sucked because it really wasn't an operating system. When they were describing it to me, I knew what they were talking about, At Ease. At Ease was an application that prevented you from accessing the finder, and the only thing it allowed you to do was to click an application from a panel. It was mainly used in education about 10 years ago.

Ahh, memories. I remember trying to sort out printing within At Ease. After running into a few brick walls, I disabled it completely.

AppleMatt

aussie_geek
Aug 13, 2004, 07:41 PM
He went on to say "... and they only come in girlie colours, anyway"



Peh,
Take him a Powerbook G4 and see what he says.. :p

aussie_geek

Andos
Aug 13, 2004, 08:00 PM
I've had people swear blind Microsoft doesn't make Office for Mac, and when I've shown them they've insisted that Microsoft don't make it it's out-sourced, and that it's not compatible with the PC version anyway, and it's years out of date etc etc.

I don't bother with them in the end.

AppleMatt

I was the IT manager at a company with a heap of Macs - about 150 or so - and we were having a lot of issues with Microsoft products on them and so I got into contact with the Microsoft developers working on the Mac products and it turned out they were the most dedicated Mac freaks I had ever meet. :D So I got to know them pretty well and our site became an Alpha test site for their products. It was pretty cool.

It was a real eye-opener to find such totally Mac people working for Microsoft!

(*waves to Jimmy if he's reading!*)

egor
Aug 13, 2004, 08:12 PM
What do you say to people who say jpegs and whatnot are incompatible, though?

I mean, you could just say "no they're not...", but, well, it seems like an impossible thing to argue! Plus I have qualms about sounding like a mr know-it-all, unlike some people here...

jhu
Aug 14, 2004, 04:54 PM
What do you say to people who say jpegs and whatnot are incompatible, though?

I mean, you could just say "no they're not...", but, well, it seems like an impossible thing to argue! Plus I have qualms about sounding like a mr know-it-all, unlike some people here...

well, that's exactly what you'll have to do, ie - "you don't know very much about computers in general, do you?"

MacFan26
Aug 14, 2004, 05:39 PM
One of my favorites was "Macs can only run one program at a time." You know, I made the mistake of telling some of my friends that I was a Mac user in Jr. High, and pretty much then all the up through high school I just couldn't get away from their stupid remarks. The odds were already against me, even if I did try to correct their claims, girls "don't know anything about computers anyway." Geez, I'm sure there are other things they could've made fun of me for. When it all comes down to it, it's just a computer! No one laughs at the brand of toaster I have. Ugh, I just get annoyed talking about it :rolleyes:

Brother Michael
Aug 15, 2004, 02:49 AM
"Macs are for pixies."

"Why would you want to use a pixie machine?"

"Dude, Mac's crash all the time."

"Mac's suck."

"They have one button!"

"A PC can do everything a Mac can do."

This one was from an IM convo, I later found out my friend didn't care, he just wanted to see if I would flip out over his comment...he won...

Friend: "Dude, screw you and your Linux icon!" (it's the Bill icon)
Me: "Actually, that's a Mac icon there chief"
Friend: "Whatever, all I know is that it isn't Windows so it's not American!"

It was funny as hell.

Little off topic:
I have a funny transcript from a convo with a friend about Macs. We were goofing around, but it's great.

Here's a sample:
friend (8:46:04 PM): YES YOU HAVE YOU HAVE SAVED ME FROM THE CESSPOOL THAT IS MOCRONS$HAFT
friend (8:46:17 PM): IT IS BAD BECAUSE A LOT OF PEOPLE USE IT
me (8:46:23 PM): i know
friend (8:46:25 PM): THANK YOU FOR REVEALING THAT UNTO ME
me (8:46:31 PM): you are welcome good sir
friend (8:48:07 PM): HAHA I WILL CALL WINDOWS WINBLOW$ NOW BECAUSE I GOT +3 INTELLIGENCE FROM SWITCHING TO APLEE!
me (8:48:23 PM): i can tell
me (8:48:28 PM): what are you up to now? 3?

Mike

jacobj
Aug 15, 2004, 03:29 AM
These lies were furthered by this movie (http://webdev.o1.com/rvb/movies/switch/RvB_switch.mov). "On the Mac, when it's time to upgrade, just pick it up, throw it away, and go buy another one."
Yeah, you've probably seen it. But it's a personal favorite. ;)

OK, upgrading a mac can be done, but with difficulty unless you have a powermac. Of course this all depends on you interpretation of simple.

Apple perpetuate the myth that when your machine is bust or outdated, then you need a new one. When you browse their support websites they infer that the only part of your machine that can be upgraded is your RAM and battery.

Then of course there was the gaming. I started another thread yesterday re how embaressed I get when talking to the few highly cued up and tech savvy gaming friends I have. I just lower my head and admit that the Macs are crap for that. I hate having to lower me head in shame re a mac to anyone.

munkle
Aug 15, 2004, 04:26 AM
The worst case I've encountered was at a Mac reseller...somebody was admiring an ibook and asked one of the salesman why she should buy a Mac, the answer she received was, 'Well basically it's the same as a PC but prettier'. :eek:

And this was at a sole Mac reseller, they weren't selling PC's just Macs and this is how they try to get a sale?!!

Needless to say I got a little bit over excited and decided to jump in. Explained about ease of use, viruses etc, showed her iLife and a few other apps, dispelled myths such as word processing does exist on the Mac platform and yes you can connect to the internet! Not her fault that she was a bit clueless when it came to computers, Apple needs to do more on that front. Although I am confused where all the myths come from. After about 30 mins she was so excited she bought the ibook on the spot! :D

Changing the world one person at a time! Switch count = 4 so far, and each of them couldn't be any happier and the nice thing is, all are happy for completely different reasons!

512ke
Aug 15, 2004, 04:31 AM
This is weird, but lately "PC people" I know have been _admiring_ my Macs at work. They want to take a look. They want to see how it works. They ask if I have any problems opening docs and such. The usual feeling of such folks seems to be, oh, wow, your Mac is so cool I only wish I could have one. But for some strange reason I can't...

Blue Velvet
Aug 15, 2004, 07:36 AM
This is weird, but lately "PC people" I know have been _admiring_ my Macs at work. They want to take a look. They want to see how it works. They ask if I have any problems opening docs and such. The usual feeling of such folks seems to be, oh, wow, your Mac is so cool I only wish I could have one. But for some strange reason I can't...

It is the halo effect (play: heavenly choir) of the iPod at work.

At the office, one iPod-using bloke got all intrigued by our Macs.

Another then wanted to have a play (with the machine :) ) and confessed he'd been thinking of buying one for himself and his mother...

aldo
Aug 15, 2004, 08:09 AM
Guys I've heard a lot of **** about Macs, but you guys peddle the worst amount of stuff about Windows.

If you use a secure browser (like FireFox or anything none-IE), a firewall or a NAT router and some good antivirus you really won't have problems.

I think calling windows spyware infested is a bit much, because if you know how to look after Windows it's fine (most of the time). I'm totally in agreement that pre-2000 Windows sucked hard - but Microsoft has done a great job with 2000 and XP.

Oh also, don't assume that Dell hardware is crap. It's actually very well assembled for the price - I deal with about 200 of them every day and the new micro-ATX ones are very nice to work in.

And to the person complaining about the Dell WiFi card, it's 95%-sure got a Prism Chipset which will be the _exact_ same chipset inside an Airport card. All Apple does is change the interface on it.

While I'm not suggesting at all that WinXP is nicer than OSX, you guys have to admit it's a good step up from 95/98/ME, it's quite well priced if you buy it OEM and as I said it will give you no problems on the Spyware front if you don't use IE.

That is all.

Blue Velvet
Aug 15, 2004, 08:13 AM
...because if you know how to look after Windows it's fine (most of the time). I'm totally in agreement that pre-2000 Windows sucked hard - but Microsoft has done a great job with 2000 and XP.

But most people don't know how to look after Windows & that is it's greatest weakness -- the constant nursing involved.

Also, I have to use Win2000 at work alongside the Macs and it's just plain horrible as a user-experience...

radiocore
Aug 15, 2004, 08:21 AM
I gotta admit that I also said alot of the mentioned above BEFORE i bought my PB.

I loved my PB12 so much, i gave it to my sister within 4 months and bought the PB15. =D

Price/gaming has always been an issue with me, but even when i was soley a PC user, I always felt compelled to buy one.

Oh, and my experience in school with apple wasn't great too..maybe that was also a factor.

munkle
Aug 15, 2004, 08:36 AM
Guys I've heard a lot of **** about Macs, but you guys peddle the worst amount of stuff about Windows.

If you use a secure browser (like FireFox or anything none-IE), a firewall or a NAT router and some good antivirus you really won't have problems.

I think calling windows spyware infested is a bit much, because if you know how to look after Windows it's fine (most of the time). I'm totally in agreement that pre-2000 Windows sucked hard - but Microsoft has done a great job with 2000 and XP.


But that's the whole point...you have to put a lot of effort in to make it usable, that's just wrong. Out of the box it's not as secure as OSX and does not provide the same user experience.

And no, I'm not a fanboy or a blind hater either...

Squire
Aug 15, 2004, 11:20 AM
There was a nearly-identical thread discussing this a little while ago. A lot of te comments are the same as well.

dude, you didn't read my comment carefully, did you? you don't know what my preferences are, so i'll tell you: price. i can't justify a $1100 laptop when i can get a $600 laptop that's fully functional by my standards and will last longer than you think. besides, i already said that i can't even justify $600 for a laptop. and who said i'd be using windows?

I can relate to that. At work, I've been using a Pentium 166 MHz laptop with a 4.3 GB hard drive. It had Windows 95 until 6 months ago. Then I upgraded to Win 98 hoping that my USB CD burner would work. Of course, the USB port "couldn't be found" or something. But as far as Word and Excel were concerned, the machine was fine. The reason: It hasn't been connected to the Internet for nearly 5 years. Which brings me to the next comment...

But most people don't know how to look after Windows & that is it's greatest weakness -- the constant nursing involved.


True, so true. About every six months, I have to take my PC (not the laptop; a 1.6 GHz P4 desktop) in for maintenance. It gets slow...really slow. I don't do much in the way of downloads but I have kids and kids like to click stuff. "Constantly nursing" sucks and can take up a lot of your time.

It is the halo effect (play: heavenly choir) of the iPod at work.

At the office, one iPod-using bloke got all intrigued by our Macs.

Another then wanted to have a play (with the machine :) ) and confessed he'd been thinking of buying one for himself and his mother...

Also very true. A die-hard PC-using friend of mine was praising the new iRiver the other day. Then, just out of the blue, he told me that he's going to order an iPod. I bet he'll have a Powerbook within 12 months. And, in an effort to stay on topic, he was absolutely floored when I told him I had MS Office on my iMac.

Squire

P.S. Great story, jsw.

Mord
Aug 15, 2004, 12:35 PM
OK, upgrading a mac can be done, but with difficulty unless you have a powermac. Of course this all depends on you interpretation of simple.

Apple perpetuate the myth that when your machine is bust or outdated, then you need a new one. When you browse their support websites they infer that the only part of your machine that can be upgraded is your RAM and battery.

Then of course there was the gaming. I started another thread yesterday re how embaressed I get when talking to the few highly cued up and tech savvy gaming friends I have. I just lower my head and admit that the Macs are crap for that. I hate having to lower me head in shame re a mac to anyone.

well there is one solution to that, learn far more than they do about there hardware so when they have a problem they learn to come to you, secondly i am liveing proof that i can upgrade my mac and play games :eek:

aka i put a dual cpu into my cube and a radeon 7500 and i also play a little halo aka most lightweight mac gamer in the univerce.

MacRy
Aug 15, 2004, 02:18 PM
My worst experience was going into PC World (i'm not proud) and checking out the limited Mac section I came across an old CRT iMac next to a new eMac and they were priced almost identically. I called over a PC World monkey and asked him why the old iMac was the same price as the brand new eMac and - i kid you not, he really said this to my amazement - "It's because the new one is heavier!"

I'm not sure how that justified the price but that's what he said.

Jaw drop!

Blue Velvet
Aug 15, 2004, 03:04 PM
My worst experience was going into PC World (i'm not proud) and checking out the limited Mac section I came across an old CRT iMac next to a new eMac and they were priced almost identically. I called over a PC World monkey and asked him why the old iMac was the same price as the brand new eMac and - i kid you not, he really said this to my amazement - "It's because the new one is heavier!"

I'm not sure how that justified the price but that's what he said.

Jaw drop!

That has to be the best & funniest one so far... :D

PC World UK are hopeless if you need the help of knowledgable trained staff. You have to know exactly what you want.

starcrossed
Aug 15, 2004, 03:14 PM
This might be slightly off-topic, but one thing I can't stand is when some PC-buddy uses my computer to use the web or whatever program and they either stretch the window to fullscreen or they ask me which button in the top left corner makes the window fullscreen. One thing I like about the Mac platform is not having windows fullscreen. The only exception I have is with Final Cut Pro and DVD Studio Pro. I just enjoy being able to see that I can run many programs simulataneously, and seeing my desktop change pictures every minute behind my Safari or whatever window. It is all certainly much better than on the windows world where little programs want to take up the entire screen.

sgwigle3
Aug 15, 2004, 03:33 PM
I have this argument all the time, and it sucks. The naivety of some people scares me beyond belief, it truly does, but when I make them feel stupid it makes me feel a little better. For example. this seems to be the most common misconception of Macs and I have found a simple and easy answer in just 2 words. "Macs aren't compatible". The answer to this question is simple, "Like What?" Then there're stumped, and confused, cause its a world they totally don't understand! In the silence I say, "I can see the same pictures as you, watch the same movies as you, get the same documents, listen to the same music... the difference is... my way is soooo much easier and less hassle."

"What is this?! The devils work?! Where's the start button?!" You see I play the field the other way... when I go on friends PCs, the first thing I do, (after making a song and dance about not being able to connect to the internet!) is go to .Mac and bring up my bookmarks for the internet, then check mail, (cause it looks very mac like). I then simply reverse it. "Where are the movies? Your expose is broken, the windows don't move. It says error. Norton has found a virus! Where did the window go?! then scream like a little girl a push it away."

This has done the trick for me. However there are some people that refuse to switch... one such friend I am always arguing with. He loves displays, and loved the 23" apple one (pre aluminum) He said he would get that monitor and scratch the apple logo off! Since then, the 30" screen came out, Airport Express came out, and the iPod is more popular and getting the apple name back out there on the streets.

Although apple isn't advertising their stuff, other companies are. The iPod is in all the magazines in the the news, etc. Its sooo frigging popular! However, I do agree, I would love to see an advert for apple styled... like this:

1. INT. BLACK SCREEN. from the darkness and in the distance, an iPod slowly movies forward. A voice over of Jeff Goldblum, "If you liked the iPod *Pause* *A little laugh* "Enough said"... then a huge explosion of everything OSX, Expose, iChat AV, the genie effect, Word, Excel, a stream of file extensions trailing down the side,* styled to the recent music solutions video to the tune of "Get Free - The Vines" (look it up on iTms). Ends with a white apple logo on a black screen, underneath reads, "Apple, the makers of computers"

Or version II, the same but ends, "Apple, compatible with your average Joe, and PCs."

Some day.

Total switchers made: 7.

Get Free - The Vines (http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=14834777)

evilgEEk
Aug 15, 2004, 03:39 PM
This might be slightly off-topic, but one thing I can't stand is when some PC-buddy uses my computer to use the web or whatever program and they either stretch the window to fullscreen or they ask me which button in the top left corner makes the window fullscreen.

ha ha...yeah, I hate full screen windows. I don't even use full-screen on my PC, it is nice being able to see what's going on behind you.

Of course the other thing that just makes me laugh is when a PC user has just finished using a mac, every application they opened is still running, they just closed the window. So every time I have to go through and quit every program they opened... heh heh heh...

Good times.

starcrossed
Aug 15, 2004, 03:57 PM
Of course the other thing that just makes me laugh is when a PC user has just finished using a mac, every application they opened is still running, they just closed the window. So every time I have to go through and quit every program they opened... heh heh heh...

Good times.

Oh my God, I forgot about that one! :D Cause they're so used to just closing the window, and not actually quiting the app. Yeah, I get frustrated having to Tab through all the apps to quit them all. But its also helpful because I can see just what they were doing on my computer, possibly opening an app that they didn't need to open.

jhu
Aug 15, 2004, 04:50 PM
ha ha...yeah, I hate full screen windows. I don't even use full-screen on my PC, it is nice being able to see what's going on behind you.

Of course the other thing that just makes me laugh is when a PC user has just finished using a mac, every application they opened is still running, they just closed the window. So every time I have to go through and quit every program they opened... heh heh heh...

Good times.

well in the windows world (and unix world for that matter), closing the window = quitting the program. i personally like that better since it makes more sense. example: in xwindow, when i start aterm and then type 'exit', the terminal quits. under osx, it seemed rather strange when the terminal window would stay open even after i typed 'exit'. it's rather backwards from everyone else.

MacFan26
Aug 15, 2004, 04:56 PM
ha ha...yeah, I hate full screen windows. I don't even use full-screen on my PC, it is nice being able to see what's going on behind you.
I third that. I feel like there's stuff going on behind the window that I can't see. :rolleyes:

Blue Velvet
Aug 15, 2004, 04:59 PM
well in the windows world (and unix world for that matter), closing the window = quitting the program. i personally like that better since it makes more sense. example: in xwindow, when i start aterm and then type 'exit', the terminal quits. under osx, it seemed rather strange when the terminal window would stay open even after i typed 'exit'. it's rather backwards from everyone else.

Don't know about that...

e.g. I have Photoshop & Acrobat Pro running 24/7 so that I don't have to start them up every time I want to have a good & proper look at an image or PDF.

Use Win2000 at work -- it's horrid.

macsrus
Aug 15, 2004, 05:36 PM
"Xserves are not suitable for clusters"

Well since we bought 1566 of em... And they will be in production soon...
WE WILL PROVE EM WRONG

macsrus
Aug 15, 2004, 05:40 PM
Oh my God, I forgot about that one! :D Cause they're so used to just closing the window, and not actually quiting the app. Yeah, I get frustrated having to Tab through all the apps to quit them all. But its also helpful because I can see just what they were doing on my computer, possibly opening an app that they didn't need to open.

Actually I find that as the most annoying thing about a MAC...
I personally believe that Windows and everyone else has this one right and Macs have it wrong....

Otherwise im a happy Mac user

switchedanhappy
Aug 15, 2004, 06:45 PM
I think a great ad would be just showing screen-capture movies of how to do things on mac and pc side by side. people I talk too don't seem to understand that macs are a whole different machine than windows. the think they're just showy wintel machines. also, a slogan I've been toying with and just thought I'd share-- "apple: be happy with your computer. it's a good thing."

cloud 9
Aug 15, 2004, 07:01 PM
the most things i hear about mac is

'they aren't compatible'
but most people i know haven't even seen a mac, unless on tv or so...and compatible with what? what files do you share? docs, mp3's...i just say 'you don't know what you're talking about' and then i roll my eyes


'they are expensive' (but is that really an ignorant belief? ;) )

Nermal
Aug 15, 2004, 07:16 PM
Actually I find that as the most annoying thing about a MAC...
I personally believe that Windows and everyone else has this one right and Macs have it wrong....

Otherwise im a happy Mac user

On the other hand, I think it's great. You can leave large apps running 'invisibly,' and they'll open immediately when you want them again.

tech4all
Aug 15, 2004, 07:36 PM
Actually I find that as the most annoying thing about a MAC...
I personally believe that Windows and everyone else has this one right and Macs have it wrong....

Otherwise im a happy Mac user

I respectivelly disagree. I think it's much more convienent to close windows on Mac and still have the program open; quite handy.With Windows, in order to keep an app running, you have to keep it in the taskbar; not so handy. IMO.

evilgEEk
Aug 15, 2004, 07:39 PM
On the other hand, I think it's great. You can leave large apps running 'invisibly,' and they'll open immediately when you want them again.

Exactly. I think Mac has it right and everyone has it wrong. It's not like it's hard to quit an app, I wish I at least had the option in windows.

jhu
Aug 15, 2004, 07:46 PM
Exactly. I think Mac has it right and everyone has it wrong. It's not like it's hard to quit an app, I wish I at least had the option in windows.

one other thing that's not quite right with osx is that the 'alt-tab' (or 'apple-tab', whatever that button is) switches between applications, but not necessarily the other windows of that application.

OldManJimbo
Aug 15, 2004, 07:57 PM
Two observations -

1) Why are there constant threads through these forums that demand Apple do something to improve their image or convince the "rest of the world" that we - the Apple users - are not a bunch of losers? Sheesh - since when does the opinion of others make my Mac run any better? I use Apple products because they do what I want them to do without all the crap associated with PCs.

2) With 30+ years of marketing work under my belt, I can say that one major reason people have so many misconceptions is that they believe what they CHOOSE to believe. There is enough technical information available for anyone who actually wants to engage their brain and compare PC and Mac functionality. Apple has no control over people who have chosen to live in a cave.

Finally - The suggestion that many of us chose Mac because Apple's marketing focused on "looks" and not on "function" is frankly quite demeaning. I feel superior to the guy sitting next to me in an airplane not because my PowerBook "looks cool" but because my battery is still cranking about two hours after his has crapped out.

Blue Velvet
Aug 15, 2004, 08:07 PM
Two observations -

1) Why are there constant threads through these forums that demand Apple do something to improve their image or convince the "rest of the world" that we - the Apple users - are not a bunch of losers? Sheesh - since when does the opinion of others make my Mac run any better? I use Apple products because they do what I want them to do without all the crap associated with PCs.

2) With 30+ years of marketing work under my belt, I can say that one major reason people have so many misconceptions is that they believe what they CHOOSE to believe. There is enough technical information available for anyone who actually wants to engage their brain and compare PC and Mac functionality. Apple has no control over people who have chosen to live in a cave.

Finally - The suggestion that many of us chose Mac because Apple's marketing focused on "looks" and not on "function" is frankly quite demeaning. I feel superior to the guy sitting next to me in an airplane not because my PowerBook "looks cool" but because my battery is still cranking about two hours after his has crapped out.

Hold on. The original topic of this thread was about the ignorance that some self-styled experts display, and was meant to be a bit of humourous, yet smug self-reassuring nonsense... something we could all have a laugh at.

And so with your marketing experience, do you honestly believe that Apple has got it right with their pitch?

It's OK for you as you know something about computers, but when my mother sees a huge poster with Charlie Chaplin on it and it says 'Think Different'... Is that the kind of reassurance she needs before spending a heap of money on a computer?

Nermal
Aug 15, 2004, 08:19 PM
one other thing that's not quite right with osx is that the 'alt-tab' (or 'apple-tab', whatever that button is) switches between applications, but not necessarily the other windows of that application.

That key is called Command. Press Command-Tab to switch between apps, and Command-` (the key above Tab) to switch between windows.

Jalexster
Aug 15, 2004, 08:34 PM
That key is called Command. Press Command-Tab to switch between apps, and Command-` (the key above Tab) to switch between windows.

I didn't know that Command-` switched windows! I'm a new Mac OS X user, but not a new Mac user. My Year 1-6 school had Macs, but they were all running OS9 or lower. I don't know everything about OSX, but I'm learning.

Brother Michael
Aug 15, 2004, 08:36 PM
one other thing that's not quite right with osx is that the 'alt-tab' (or 'apple-tab', whatever that button is) switches between applications, but not necessarily the other windows of that application.

Didn't know that one. Thanks.

However, if you want to swtich between windows, just use expose.

Mike

sgwigle3
Aug 15, 2004, 08:56 PM
2) With 30+ years of marketing work under my belt, I can say that one major reason people have so many misconceptions is that they believe what they CHOOSE to believe. There is enough technical information available for anyone who actually wants to engage their brain and compare PC and Mac functionality. Apple has no control over people who have chosen to live in a cave.


I am frankly surprised that you think the average Joe wants to, or even cares about researching to find out that sort of information. Sure its there... but why bother looking? when quite frankly your analogy of people living in caves could easily be turned around to Apple themselves living in caves. For god sake people look into it with a flash light! But of course they wont. Why should they? there's a party outside to do with a Service Pack 2 release?

And furthering that, you say they can CHOOSE? well that implies they have a choice of two or more options... the point of this thread is that these people who make the choice don't even KNOW about what choices they have. AKA another Winblows user. And it sucks.

macsrus
Aug 15, 2004, 09:18 PM
Exactly. I think Mac has it right and everyone has it wrong. It's not like it's hard to quit an app, I wish I at least had the option in windows.

The other side of this argument is I wish I had the option of having the whole app close when I closed the active window :)

My pbook is low enuff on memory so I wish the dang apps would just close...
But so we differ in likes and dislike.... so what
You cant please everyone

macsrus
Aug 15, 2004, 09:23 PM
I am frankly surprised that you think the average Joe wants to, or even cares about researching to find out that sort of information. Sure its there... but why bother looking? when quite frankly your analogy of people living in caves could easily be turned around to Apple themselves living in caves. For god sake people look into it with a flash light! But of course they wont. Why should they? there's a party outside to do with a Service Pack 2 release?

And furthering that, you say they can CHOOSE? well that implies they have a choice of two or more options... the point of this thread is that these people who make the choice don't even KNOW about what choices they have. AKA another Winblows user. And it sucks.

But people do choose everyday....
They just choose Windows and PC's over Macs by a margin of 19 to 1.
And that is just the reality of it...

fuzzwud
Aug 15, 2004, 09:24 PM
Heaven forbid, indeed. :D

I'm the only Mac user in my family, and I have to correct them all the time about this stuff. Apple really needs to work towards correcting all these misconceptions. I wonder where people get all these wrong ideas from anyway.

I think personal testimony is much more convincing than advertising. TV advertising is expensive and costly and quite probably less convinving than word of mouth from a friend or someone you know or trust. Apple is a small company compared to Intel or Microsoft or Dell. I would rather Apple spend its money in R&D than use it all for advertising misconceptions. Aren't we the ones who can show other ppl what macs truly are?

jhu
Aug 15, 2004, 09:39 PM
I think personal testimony is much more convincing than advertising. TV advertising is expensive and costly and quite probably less convinving than word of mouth from a friend or someone you know or trust. Apple is a small company compared to Intel or Microsoft or Dell. I would rather Apple spend its money in R&D than use it all for advertising misconceptions. Aren't we the ones who can show other ppl what macs truly are?

you know, that's basically what the amd crowd has been trying to do with limited success. apple, at least, has a certain image that they can work with. macs are 'cool', and if you don't have an ipod you're not with the 'in' crowd.

evilgEEk
Aug 15, 2004, 10:07 PM
*while no one's looking, evilgEEk goes back on topic*

Here's one that I forgot about, but find rather humerous.

"You can't even buy anti-virus software for a mac-n-trash!"

heh heh

OldManJimbo
Aug 15, 2004, 10:55 PM
And so with your marketing experience, do you honestly believe that Apple has got it right with their pitch?



Yes - I think they are DEAD ON. The average consumer doesn't buy a computer for HOW it works, they buy for WHAT it will do for them.

Apple is not trying to provide an all-things-to-all-people computer solution. They are focused on a certain segment of the population and - from my persepctive - serve that segment quite well.

My original beef with this thread was related to all the people who whine that Apple isn't doing enough to validate their own decision to buy a Mac. My advice for them is be propud they've made the right decision and quit stressing that the whole world doesn't agree.

OldManJimbo
Aug 15, 2004, 10:59 PM
the average Joe


I'm not sure I could care much less about the opinions or purchase behavior of the "average Joe."

evilgEEk
Aug 15, 2004, 11:01 PM
Ugh...so much for trying to get back on topic... :rolleyes:

jhu
Aug 15, 2004, 11:09 PM
I'm not sure I could care much less about the opinions or purchase behavior of the "average Joe."

i'm sure apple does though. they'd love nothing more than to sell more things. and that's what they've been doing, be it computers or other 'stuff'.

mvc
Aug 15, 2004, 11:24 PM
When some truly misguided and uninformed PC zealot comes at you spouting ignorant drivel about your Mac, remember that's probably why he bought the PC in the first place, because, usually, these kind of people don't really understand anything about computers, and prefer to follow the opinions of those around them regardless of whether they are correct because they can't tell good from bad or think for themselves.

He should have your pity, not your anger. He's now suffering for his decision every day and so feels the need to justify his purchase by berating yours.

Its a darwinian process you see, computer users really do find the platform that suits them :p

Be grateful.

puckhead193
Aug 16, 2004, 12:42 AM
These lies were furthered by this movie (http://webdev.o1.com/rvb/movies/switch/RvB_switch.mov). "On the Mac, when it's time to upgrade, just pick it up, throw it away, and go buy another one."
Yeah, you've probably seen it. But it's a personal favorite. ;)

God that makes me wanna cry.... there isn't one thing that i can't do with my mac then i could do with a pc..... if not more... I had my new powerbook for about 2 weeks now and i haven't had one problem... o wait there was one, when the internet stoped working...then i relized that the power wire for my wire came out because i was leaning on it.... i want my airpot express to ship already... :D

starcrossed
Aug 16, 2004, 01:23 AM
.... i want my airpot express to ship already... :D

I figured this may go a little off-topic but this post is a good lead in for my little story, and i don't want to make a seperate thread for it. Well I ordered an Airport Express in July with education discount, but Apple was saying online it wouldn't ship till mid-August, so I decided to check the local CompUSA at the end of July to see if they recieved any. Well they had a bunch in hand, so I figured I couldn't wait anymore and I would just cancel my Apple order. So I bought it, and since I was having so much time playing with it, I figured I would call Apple the next day since there was still time before they would fill the order. The next day I got the email that it had shipped, so there was no way to stop the shipment once it is out Apple's door I figured I would just let it arrive then send it back. But then I thought rather than go through that hassle, I will just take the Apple sent Airport Express, and my reciept from the one I bought a CompUSA and return it. CompUSA accepted the return and credit back my card, and I overall got my AE at the educational price. :cool: Sorry I've just telling that story to people because of how cool it turned out for me.

rdowns
Aug 16, 2004, 05:09 AM
Yes - I think they are DEAD ON. The average consumer doesn't buy a computer for HOW it works, they buy for WHAT it will do for them.

Apple is not trying to provide an all-things-to-all-people computer solution. They are focused on a certain segment of the population and - from my persepctive - serve that segment quite well.

My original beef with this thread was related to all the people who whine that Apple isn't doing enough to validate their own decision to buy a Mac. My advice for them is be propud they've made the right decision and quit stressing that the whole world doesn't agree.

Well, I only have 20 years of marketing experience under my belt and I think Apple is DEAD OFF. And I hardly need Apple to validate my decision to buy and use Macs. I've never owned any other computer.

Take the recent G5 ad with the kid getting blown out of his house. How does that help Apple sell more Macs? Sure, they get across the point of its speed but if many still believe the fallacies of the Mac (many mentioned in this thread), the speed does not matter. They are preaching to the choir and the choir knows all about the G5.

IMO, Apple needs a campaign to educate people (i.e. consumers) on just how easy Macs work, how compatible they are and how complete a package you buy. How I'd love to see a series of ads with families huddled around their PCs trying to do what we Mac users do without second thought (iLife stuff). Split screen, how easy it is in a Mac and the frustration of the PC family. That, IMO, would at least get people to consider a Mac, if they could find them on the shelf of a local retailer. (now there's another issue that Apple needs to address)

Squire
Aug 16, 2004, 06:43 AM
When some truly misguided and uninformed PC zealot comes at you spouting ignorant drivel about your Mac, remember that's probably why he bought the PC in the first place, because, usually, these kind of people don't really understand anything about computers, and prefer to follow the opinions of those around them regardless of whether they are correct because they can't tell good from bad or think for themselves.

He should have your pity, not your anger. He's now suffering for his decision every day and so feels the need to justify his purchase by berating yours.

Its a darwinian process you see, computer users really do find the platform that suits them :p

Be grateful.

Good idea. The next time someone spews said meaningless drivel, I'm going to say, "That's probably why you bought the PC in the first place, because, usually, you type of people don't really understand anything about computers, and prefer to follow the opinions of those around you regardless of whether they are correct because you can't tell good from bad or think for yourself."

And go on...

"I'm not angry. You should have my pity, not my anger. You're now suffering for your decision every day and so feel the need to justify your purchase by berating mine. It's a darwinian process, you see? Computer users really do find the platform that suits them."

Then I'll smile and walk away. ;)


IMO, Apple needs a campaign to educate people (i.e. consumers) on just how easy Macs work, how compatible they are and how complete a package you buy. How I'd love to see a series of ads with families huddled around their PCs trying to do what we Mac users do without second thought (iLife stuff). Split screen, how easy it is in a Mac and the frustration of the PC family. That, IMO, would at least get people to consider a Mac, if they could find them on the shelf of a local retailer. (now there's another issue that Apple needs to address)

Good idea #2. Then, at the end, have someone from the 'Mac' family copy a file to a CD (or send an email), walk across to the other side of the screen, and give it to the 'PC' family. They open the file and it's completely compatible. An MS Word document, for instance. Actually, there could be a whole series of them. Including iLife stuff, as you suggest, would be a must.

Squire

mkaake
Aug 16, 2004, 07:09 AM
Good idea #2. Then, at the end, have someone from the 'Mac' family copy a file to a CD (or send an email), walk across to the other side of the screen, and give it to the 'PC' family. They open the file and it's completely compatible. An MS Word document, for instance. Actually, there could be a whole series of them. Including iLife stuff, as you suggest, would be a must.

Squire

or, have them download a patch to a fatal flaw in windows, walk across the room, and hand it to their pc using family... that would be great :)

Squire
Aug 16, 2004, 07:24 AM
or, have them download a patch to a fatal flaw in windows, walk across the room, and hand it to their pc using family... that would be great :)

Nice. ;)

Squire

Lacero
May 13, 2005, 05:22 AM
(This then caused me to think about the actual effectiveness of Apple's marketing strategy with the average consumer instead of the hype...)This brings up a really good point about how Apple markets their products, especially their consumer electronic goods, like the iPod. For the iPod unveilings, it has always been towards the throngs of Mac enthusiasts at very obscure meeting places, obscure in the sense to the general public. For instance, ask my sister about MacWorld or WWDC and she'll give you a blank stare.

This is in stark contrast to how Microsoft is marketing the XBox 360. It's given a public unveiling targeted right at the "cool kids" demographic on MTV. This gains tremendous exposure. As for the iPod, you rarely see any sort of general public awareness, apart from the cryptic silhouette iPod commercials or retail shelf space.

Apple could learn a thing or two from Microsoft on how to effectively advertise their products. It took the iPod nearly two years to reach critical mass.

baummer
May 13, 2005, 11:46 AM
This brings up a really good point about how Apple markets their products, especially their consumer electronic goods, like the iPod. For the iPod unveilings, it has always been towards the throngs of Mac enthusiasts at very obscure meeting places, obscure in the sense to the general public. For instance, ask my sister about MacWorld or WWDC and she'll give you a blank stare.

This is in stark contrast to how Microsoft is marketing the XBox 360. It's given a public unveiling targeted right at the "cool kids" demographic on MTV. This gains tremendous exposure. As for the iPod, you rarely see any sort of general public awareness, apart from the cryptic silhouette iPod commercials or retail shelf space.

Apple could learn a thing or two from Microsoft on how to effectively advertise their products. It took the iPod nearly two years to reach critical mass.

You do realize that this thread is from August of 2004?

Mord
May 13, 2005, 11:58 AM
look at lancro's post frequency, he's posting in every thread he can

Dr.Gargoyle
May 13, 2005, 12:27 PM
All these misconceptions is really a result of Apple not informing people otherwise.
Ask yourself, when did you see an ad for an Apple computer last time?
Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if there are people out there ignorant about the fact that Apple makes computers too. (They still do that right?)
I think it would be a good idea, if Apple directed some of the money they have made on iPods and iTMS towards some informative ads about Apple computers. I know this sounds terribly boring, not hipp at all, but all the stories posted above tell the same thing. People just don't have a clue, what Macs can do.
One of the most widespread "truths" are that Macs can't run Office. That is huge failure for Apples marketing division as I see it.

CubaTBird
May 13, 2005, 04:01 PM
arguing with ignorent people is pointless.. they will always want to feel as if they are correct... yeah ive seen a ton of mac stupidity at my highschool.. from too expensive.. to "yeah weren't they the computers in the 80's? and then ms bought em right?"... its just silly.. most of the time i just ignore it.. once i fought with this stupid fool about em and i made a fool of myself in front of the class b/c he was getting facts wrong about ipod sales and what not.. had to do with economy and what not...

Lacero
May 14, 2005, 06:12 PM
arguing with ignorent people is pointless.. they will always want to feel as if they are correct... yeah ive seen a ton of mac stupidity at my highschool.. from too expensive.. to "yeah weren't they the computers in the 80's? and then ms bought em right?"... its just silly.. most of the time i just ignore it.. once i fought with this stupid fool about em and i made a fool of myself in front of the class b/c he was getting facts wrong about ipod sales and what not.. had to do with economy and what not...I was on the other side myself and at the time Windows 95 came out, there really was no compelling reason for me to use Macs. I too made the argument of software selection and low prices. It was probably at this time Apple was trying desperately to compete against PCs, which was a mistake in hindsight. The whole beige box era of Macs looks painful now. But as I smartened up, the concept of long term PC ownership costs, security bugs starting around 1997 with my DSL internet, and overall enjoyment compelled me to look at the Macs. It wasn't until Apple released the G4 with Altivec that I made my Switch™.

tech4all
May 14, 2005, 06:27 PM
All these misconceptions is really a result of Apple not informing people otherwise.
Ask yourself, when did you see an ad for an Apple computer last time?
Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if there are people out there ignorant about the fact that Apple makes computers too. (They still do that right?)
I think it would be a good idea, if Apple directed some of the money they have made on iPods and iTMS towards some informative ads about Apple computers. I know this sounds terribly boring, not hipp at all, but all the stories posted above tell the same thing. People just don't have a clue, what Macs can do.
One of the most widespread "truths" are that Macs can't run Office. That is huge failure for Apples marketing division as I see it.

I have to agree. From an outsider's view, Apple only makes iPods and nothing more. Apple really needs to start marketing Macs A LOT more to educate people on Macs.

arguing with ignorent people is pointless..

True, but sometimes you can't help yourself in those "debates" no matter where the discussion won't go.

Dr.Gargoyle
May 14, 2005, 06:38 PM
arguing with ignorent people is pointless.
The reason why people are ignorant is because they dont know. That is the main task of Apples marketing divison.

5300cs
May 14, 2005, 07:06 PM
Since coming to Japan I've had it a lot easier. The Japanese say "Oh! You use a Mac. Why?" and then I tell them so and so whatever blah blah and they patiently listen and seem interested.

There are Mac freaks over here (as most people already know) but they stay quiet and don't chase people down with the evangelism or anything like that.

The only time I ever get ish from anyone is when I run into another foreigner who's anti-Mac and they start spouting all kinds of uneducated garbage. I'm the pres of the city's Macintosh Users Group though, so there's not much they can say ;) Even then though, there are a lot of Mac using foreigners here. Witness the opening of the Sakae Apple Store there were zillions of people and quite a lot of foreigners.

Also my boss at work is a Mac-head and so it's a very Mac-friendly place. :)