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jefhatfield
Jul 31, 2002, 01:06 PM
i just saw red hat 7.x's version of aqua

man, how could everybody legally copy apple and get away with it?

...some copying is flattery, but beginning with xp, there have been blatant ripoffs of our great os look

it's not very cute anymore:(

Rower_CPU
Jul 31, 2002, 01:17 PM
Got any pix?

Sherman
Jul 31, 2002, 01:19 PM
What was the name of that blatant iMac ripoff that apple killed (rightfully)?

And compaq copied the iMac color idea awhile ago.

There's plenty of apple ripoffs by people who think they're stuff will be bought of the real thing. Losers.:mad:

jefhatfield
Jul 31, 2002, 02:47 PM
Originally posted by Rower_CPU
Got any pix?

i just caught a peek in the school lab last night around 10 PM

they have bouncing icons in a lower dock just like os x and they have a scheme called os x in the display properties...it's stealing as far as i am concerned

this all hurts apple in the long run

i mean, also, what the heck is microsoft's "X" P about?

Rower_CPU
Jul 31, 2002, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by jefhatfield
i just caught a peek in the school lab last night around 10 PM

they have bouncing icons in a lower dock just like os x and they have a scheme called os x in the display properties...it's stealing as far as i am concerned

this all hurts apple in the long run

i mean, also, what the heck is microsoft's "X" P about?

Don't forget Macromedia's "MX" apps...

XP is supposed to stand for "experience" as far as I had heard...but why MS thinks that anyone will buy it for the experience is beyond me.:rolleyes:

jefhatfield
Jul 31, 2002, 03:02 PM
come to think of it, i don't know if the dock icons bounced, i think they swelled like some "X" video:p

King Cobra
Jul 31, 2002, 03:16 PM
And how would you know about that, jefhornyfield? :eek: :p :p :eek:

This is ridiculous. The peecee world continues to copy Apple to get some whatever they need...why can't there be a stronger protection against this type of thing?

mnkeybsness
Jul 31, 2002, 04:51 PM
because the majority of humans are lazy

AlphaTech
Jul 31, 2002, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by Rower_CPU


Don't forget Macromedia's "MX" apps...

XP is supposed to stand for "experience" as far as I had heard...but why MS thinks that anyone will buy it for the experience is beyond me.:rolleyes:

I thought that the XP stood for extra profit. :eek: :D

I actually had to struggle through heXPee last night *shudder* while working on a customer's computer. They had picked up some kind of worm/virus that had made office xp it's biatch. :eek: :D I had to wipe the computer and do a restore (ugh!). Becuase they were using the 'free' 6 month aohell account, they now have to go and get one of the free cd's (that you can't get away from no matter how hard you try) to reinstall that software. The restore didn't include that.

I have to say, it is far, far easier to navigate under win2k then heXPee... that's just a fact. OS X is even easier (again, more facts for the wicked).

BTW, since they got a dull, and called the dull support before me, they had removed their free copy of NAV (the dumb-**** tech on the phone told them to 'deactivate' NAV, but the person actually used the uninstall from the programs menu :rolleyes: ). I had them go out and purchase the full NAV (the included one was only good for 90 days) before I got there.

On the plus side, I walked away with payment for services rendered, and they were glad that I stayed as late as I did, and installed everything for them. I also advised them on the high speed options, and to take back the wireless router and card. They have a dull laptop, with no integrated NIC (it's under 2 years old). I suggested that they get a PC Card NIC for the laptop and the DSL/Cable Modem router/firewall with the 4-port switch. They will be using both computers in the same small office/room, so wireless will be useless for them. Plus, they want to transfer files between the two dull's, where the speed of the wired network will be appreciated.

szark
Jul 31, 2002, 05:20 PM
XP:

excessively padded
extremely problematic


:D

sparkleytone
Jul 31, 2002, 05:37 PM
XP:

OS X Plagiarized

:cool:

sageenos
Jul 31, 2002, 05:49 PM
It's probably not a theme developed by Redhat. If anything it might be Mosfet's Liquid or Acqua for KDE. It's not organizations copying the OSX look; it's individuals. The icons in the "dock" are probably application shortcuts in the KDE kicker, and the icons are enlarged when a mouse is over them and they do not bounce. Apple does not have exclusive rights to transparent menus, icons that react to user action, or an interface that is predominantly blue or gray that has a lined background. The themes in linux might not be the most original ideas, but good developers have put time and effort into creating interfaces that people like.

this28
Jul 31, 2002, 06:02 PM
<B>First things first...</B>
This is not a Red Hat thing... The KDE window manager is the one that is doing this. It is bundled on all versions of linux that contain a KDE install.

<B>Now that that is out of the way...</B>
The thing that you are talking about is the "panel" and it does "zoom" the icons. This is some thing that can be shut off. other than that, the rest of the conversion that you are seeing are done by people in the linux public.

Pick up a linux magazine and you will see what the Linux world is saying about OS X... They think it is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

sageenos
Jul 31, 2002, 06:20 PM
Originally posted by this28
Pick up a linux magazine and you will see what the Linux world is saying about OS X... They think it is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

I personally can't wait till I can get a mac. I've been waiting to work with OSX for the longest time. Linux drew me in with all it's free programming tools and themeability. Mac OSX.2 is gonna have GCC 3 and the most beautiful gui I've ever seen. If anything all the OSX look-a-like themes tend to do is make the user want to use the actual aqua gui.

barkmonster
Jul 31, 2002, 06:21 PM
eXtra Pants

Something Bill & Co. need everytime they go to court and something isn't going in their favour :D

Gelfin
Jul 31, 2002, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by this28
Pick up a linux magazine and you will see what the Linux world is saying about OS X... They think it is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

I can slice my own bread. I can't do without OS X. :D

G4scott
Jul 31, 2002, 06:45 PM
I thought XP stood for xtra protection :p :eek: :D :cool:

AlphaTech
Jul 31, 2002, 06:54 PM
Originally posted by G4scott
I thought XP stood for xtra protection :p :eek: :D :cool:

Yeah, you need to wear an industrial strength condom when you are ****ing around with heXPee... :eek: :eek: :eek: :D

SilvorX
Jul 31, 2002, 08:05 PM
some of u's shouldnt be flaming linux ;)

lots of linux users are huge fans of mac os x, one of the biggest linux users i know loves osx, but hes too cheap to buy a mac he says, but linux users who were/are also big time windows users arent as mac friendly as ppl who have been with linux for years..

on linux mandrake 7.1 theres a REALLY crappy osx-trying-to-look alike theme on kde, the person who designed it did a POOR job..i'll try getting a screenie, but then again it was put into mandrake almost a year b4 osx was released so ya..

Durandal7
Jul 31, 2002, 08:40 PM
Originally posted by Sherman
What was the name of that blatant iMac ripoff that apple killed (rightfully)?

I think it was the eOne.

jefhatfield
Jul 31, 2002, 08:58 PM
Originally posted by King Cobra
And how would you know about that, jefhornyfield? :eek: :p :p :eek:



man, you still on that!!!

i can't retort since you say you are sixteen years old, but probably younger...so i will just have to adopt you as my macrumors punk son

i will now put that in my sig:p

AlphaTech
Jul 31, 2002, 09:04 PM
Hey jef.... don't you mean Queen Cobra??? We all know [s]he is more of a cross dresser then either eyelikeart OR iGav ever could be (even combined)... :eek: :eek: :D

MacAztec
Jul 31, 2002, 09:09 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech
Hey jef.... don't you mean Queen Cobra??? We all know [s]he is more of a cross dresser then either eyelikeart OR iGav ever could be (even combined)... :eek: :eek: :D

Ewwww....thats just nasty. Queenie, stop slitherin' :eek:

jefhatfield
Jul 31, 2002, 09:10 PM
wait, wait....is king cobra a she?...like kela?

so i have a new punk daughter

AlphaTech
Jul 31, 2002, 09:14 PM
Originally posted by jefhatfield
wait, wait....is king cobra a she?...like kela?

so i have a new punk daughter

Just a case of your good gene's gone bad... :eek: :D

More like a heshe, both male and female and yet neither... :eek: :D

Rower_CPU
Jul 31, 2002, 09:57 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech
Just a case of your good gene's gone bad... :eek: :D

More like a heshe, both male and female and yet neither... :eek: :D

Oh man...MacRumor's first hermaphrodite!:eek:

jefhatfield
Jul 31, 2002, 09:58 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech


Just a case of your good gene's gone bad... :eek: :D

More like a heshe, both male and female and yet neither... :eek: :D

like any good female techie...doh:p

AlphaTech
Jul 31, 2002, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by jefhatfield
like any good female techie...doh:p

Talking about youself again jefhornyfield??? :eek: :eek: Or would that be about Queen Cobra??? :D

job
Jul 31, 2002, 10:02 PM
Err......

Yeah.......Ok......

**me runs away from fubar thread**

:D

AlphaTech
Jul 31, 2002, 10:10 PM
LMAO as titman runs for cover... :D

job
Aug 1, 2002, 12:50 AM
Originally posted by AlphaTech
LMAO as titman runs for cover... :D

Yeah, I tend to feel safer behind a couple of sand-bags and a 10mm Uzi. :D

AlphaTech
Aug 1, 2002, 09:19 AM
Originally posted by Chitman
Yeah, I tend to feel safer behind a couple of sand-bags and a 10mm Uzi. :D

ooooooooo... Chitman has a little 10mm uzi... :D Real men carry .45 cal... :D

topicolo
Aug 1, 2002, 09:49 AM
I prefer .50 caliber. It makes nice and big holes and punches through just about anything :)

AlphaTech
Aug 1, 2002, 09:54 AM
Originally posted by topicolo
I prefer .50 caliber. It makes nice and big holes and punches through just about anything :)

True, but almost nothing can beat a .45 cal for a side arm... :D

IF I had a few extra grand that I didn't know what to do with, I would pick up a Barrett 'light' 50 cal (11 round box magazine and long range scope too). :D The sniper squads use it against armored targets, it goes through airplane glass (normal sniper rounds cannot penetrate that), and just about anything else in it's way. The weapon also has a range of over a mile... that's just too damned sweet... they litterally don't hear it coming (and their friends don't hear it until you are already dead :D).

jefhatfield
Aug 1, 2002, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by AlphaTech


True, but almost nothing can beat a .45 cal for a side arm... :D

IF I had a few extra grand that I didn't know what to do with, I would pick up a Barrett 'light' 50 cal (11 round box magazine and long range scope too). :D The sniper squads use it against armored targets, it goes through airplane glass (normal sniper rounds cannot penetrate that), and just about anything else in it's way. The weapon also has a range of over a mile... that's just too damned sweet... they litterally don't hear it coming (and their friends don't hear it until you are already dead :D).

and i will take a jsf:p

job
Aug 1, 2002, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by jefhatfield
and i will take a jsf:p

I'd rather have a F-22. :D

Ifeelbloated
Aug 1, 2002, 01:23 PM
Hey AlphaTech, check out this website www.gunsamerica.com

You're in heavan.:D

King Cobra
Aug 1, 2002, 01:28 PM
hornyfield, I've got to ask...WTF is with your sig.? :eek: :rolleyes:

"father of king cobra"

You said it yourself...your young life was filled with prostitutes and drugs. I don't get such traits from my parents.

Tell me you migrated from the Green family. :D :D :D :D

job
Aug 1, 2002, 01:44 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech


True, but almost nothing can beat a .45 cal for a side arm... :D

IF I had a few extra grand that I didn't know what to do with, I would pick up a Barrett 'light' 50 cal (11 round box magazine and long range scope too). :D The sniper squads use it against armored targets, it goes through airplane glass (normal sniper rounds cannot penetrate that), and just about anything else in it's way. The weapon also has a range of over a mile... that's just too damned sweet... they litterally don't hear it coming (and their friends don't hear it until you are already dead :D).

Bah, a Barrett is a p*ssy semi-auto sniper rifle.

Real men use bolt action. :D

I'd rather have this. It's a mean looking mofo and only a few hundred exist.

Haskins M500 .50 Caliber Sniper Rifle
Model: Haskins M500 Military Issue .50 Caliber Sniper Rifle
Type: Bolt action .50 caliber sniper rifle
Scale: Character
Skill: Firearms: Sniper Rifle
Ammo: 1
Cost: 5,000 (ammo: 25)
Availability: 4 X, R
Fire Rate: 1
Range: 10-1000m/1500m/2000m
Damage: 7D (See Ammo)
Game Notes: Comes with 10x telescopic sight for a +2D bonus when used for 1 round of aiming.

This large, heavy sniper rifle is made in very limited quantities. It is a bolt action rifle, so rapid fire is impossible, the bolt must be removed to load each round. A fluted barrel reduces weight and speeds up cooling without sacrificing the stiffness required for accuracy. Even so, the weapon weighs 23 pounds, making the use of a bipod necessary. A muzzle brake deflects propellant gases rearward, diminishing kick.

Ammo: The .50 caliber sniper round is primarily intended to knock out vehicles and weapons. It can shatter a tank's thermal gun sight or cripple an aircraft engine. A huge charge sends the 1.5 ounce bullet out the muzzle with five times the energy of a standard 7.62-mm round. A hardened tungsten-carbide penetrator inside the projectile can pierce four inch armor, while incendiary material in the nose will touch off stored ammunition or a fuel tank. The incendiary also detonates an explosive charge that shatters the bullet's steel fragmentation body into shrapnel.

Ifeelbloated
Aug 1, 2002, 01:53 PM
God I love Texans and their gun-talk. It's one of the few places left in America where you can openly talk about guns and not get looked at weird.
Like the advertising for a local gun shop around here says, "Guns for the Good Guys."

job
Aug 1, 2002, 02:07 PM
Here's a really *****ty pic of the M500.

Each one is hand made by Haskins (it's a person, not a company.)

ctb
Aug 1, 2002, 02:29 PM
Originally posted by jefhatfield
i just saw red hat 7.x's version of aqua

man, how could everybody legally copy apple and get away with it?

...some copying is flattery, but beginning with xp, there have been blatant ripoffs of our great os look

it's not very cute anymore:(

that's not redhat specifically, you moron, it's KDE 3. if you blame anyone, blame KDE.

rEd Eye
Aug 1, 2002, 03:53 PM
"i just saw red hat 7.x's version of aqua

man, how could everybody legally copy apple and get away with it?

...some copying is flattery, but beginning with xp, there have been blatant ripoffs of our great os look

it's not very cute anymore"

Isn't red had linux a free os?If so,and no one's making money from the theme,what's the problem?
If anything,it should be noted as good advertising and general exposure for Apple!I'm sure there are a good handfull of devout linux users starting to eye up Macs now that the os is Unix based.May as well let them get familiar with the interface!

AlphaTech
Aug 1, 2002, 03:53 PM
Originally posted by ctb
that's not redhat specifically, you moron, it's KDE 3. if you blame anyone, blame KDE.

Listen good [you reason why women should be allowed to have abortions without being hassled]... The kde thing has been mentioned in earlier posts... IF you bothered to read instead of just posting to the message that started the thread you would have realized this.

Something else you might want to know, newbie, it's generally NOT healthy to be insulting the deities on this site. Especially when it is your first post. Maybe when you have several hundred (or a couple of thousand) posts to your name it will be accepted (also depends on the tone you use that with).

Newbies.... good thing I have the stockpile... right, jefhornyfield??? :D

AlphaTech
Aug 1, 2002, 03:55 PM
Originally posted by hitman
Here's a really *****ty pic of the M500.

Each one is hand made by Haskins (it's a person, not a company.)

Alright Chitman.... I see you got the information from some kind of GAME, not real world data... :p

Some sniper squads DO use the bolt action version of the Barrett (sp?) .50 cal rifle, with god-like opticals on them... :p :D

job
Aug 1, 2002, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech
Alright Chitman.... I see you got the information from some kind of GAME, not real world data... :p

That's cause it's classified. :D :D

The Barrett is a fine gun, but like I said, real men use bolt action. :p

shadowfax0
Aug 1, 2002, 05:01 PM
Linux -> Xp -> OS X -> GUNS, I think I'm missing something here...

crassusad44
Aug 1, 2002, 05:06 PM
Originally posted by shadowfax0
Linux -> Xp -> OS X -> GUNS, I think I'm missing something here...

Me to. I'm lost...... Maybe HornyTech can explain.......

Edit: :p

job
Aug 1, 2002, 05:44 PM
Originally posted by shadowfax0
Linux -> Xp -> OS X -> GUNS, I think I'm missing something here...

I think it goes more like this :

Linux -> XP -> OS X -> Hermaphrodites -> Guns. :D :p

sageenos
Aug 1, 2002, 06:16 PM
Originally posted by hitman


I think it goes more like this :

Linux -> XP -> OS X -> Hermaphrodites -> Guns. :D :p

Perfect case study of how a message board thread can go awry..

ctb
Aug 1, 2002, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech


Listen good [you reason why women should be allowed to have abortions without being hassled]... The kde thing has been mentioned in earlier posts... IF you bothered to read instead of just posting to the message that started the thread you would have realized this.

Something else you might want to know, newbie, it's generally NOT healthy to be insulting the deities on this site. Especially when it is your first post. Maybe when you have several hundred (or a couple of thousand) posts to your name it will be accepted (also depends on the tone you use that with).

Newbies.... good thing I have the stockpile... right, jefhornyfield??? :D

you can take your self-righteous attitude and cram it up... er, have a nice day.

if you think you hold some status over me then you're wrong, my friend. because you have 4k+ posts and i have 2 doesn't mean you can piss any farther.

jefhatfield
Aug 1, 2002, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by ctb


you can take your self-righteous attitude and cram it up... er, have a nice day.

if you think you hold some status over me then you're wrong, my friend. because you have 4k+ posts and i have 2 doesn't mean you can piss any farther.

i see you got initiated by alphatech...he he

i gave him a hard time when he first joined...in silicon valley, someone who talks a lot (or brags) but knows nothing is called an "alpha"-tech or alpha-geek...but it just takes ten seconds to get humbled when the greatest computer minds in the world are sitting next to you in the cafeteria...i pointed this out to him when i saw his handle (as it turns out though, alphatech knows his stuff)

somewhere else, alphatech could mean something different so it may be a regional thang

anyway, welcome to the site;)

ctb
Aug 1, 2002, 08:40 PM
Originally posted by jefhatfield


i see you got initiated by alphatech...he he

i gave him a hard time when he first joined...in silicon valley, someone who talks a lot (or brags) but knows nothing is called an "alpha"-tech or alpha-geek...but it just takes ten seconds to get humbled when the greatest computer minds in the world are sitting next to you in the cafeteria...i pointed this out to him when i saw his handle (as it turns out though, alphatech knows his stuff)

somewhere else, alphatech could mean something different so it may be a regional thang

anyway, welcome to the site;)

thanks. sorry i called you a moron.

sometimes i'm a little put off by some macintosh users' righteousness, that's all, and i took yours out of context, probably because it was time for lunch, oy. so, no harm intended. i'm just a linux geek. :D

jefhatfield
Aug 2, 2002, 01:06 AM
Originally posted by ctb


thanks. sorry i called you a moron.

sometimes i'm a little put off by some macintosh users' righteousness, that's all, and i took yours out of context, probably because it was time for lunch, oy. so, no harm intended. i'm just a linux geek. :D

no biggie

i know nothing of linux...i'm a windows pc techie/networking so i did remember seeing kde and i figured it was a red hat thing...but now i know...he he

i was an original nerd thirty years ago, way before it was stylish and there were no computers to be into...unless you count those 3.5 million dollar vacuum tube running warehouses that were starting to go up in california:D

linux is truly great because it's free and i hope that i can just quit fixing windows stuff one day since it's such a bad piece of software, not logical, and darn right confusing sometimes

i usually come home to a mac if my wife is not using it first

jefhatfield
Aug 2, 2002, 01:39 AM
Originally posted by King Cobra
hornyfield, I've got to ask...WTF is with your sig.? :eek: :rolleyes:

"father of king cobra"

You said it yourself...your young life was filled with prostitutes and drugs. I don't get such traits from my parents.

Tell me you migrated from the Green family. :D :D :D :D

ok, son

you wanted to know the truth, it's more than just about the above posts

see, you are a cobra and reptiles hatch from eggs, so basically, one day i laid an egg

see, you have to realize that when alphatech attacked you the first time that you were on macrumors, or another time, who was it that came to your defense?...it was me, son:p :eek: :)

job
Aug 2, 2002, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by jefhatfield
see, you are a cobra and reptiles hatch from eggs, so basically, one day i laid an egg


Must have been a pretty rotten one, judging from the present day results. :D

tjwett
Aug 2, 2002, 02:39 AM
i know this thread has veered way off course and has entrered the Bermuda Triangle of forums but i just wanted to say that this KDE 3 actually looks pretty good to me. is it at all possible to run KDE on a Mac? it says it is supported by Unix. is there a way to just install Unix on a Mac and run KDE? isn't OS X just a Unix GUI of sorts? is this totally impossible? i don't know much about ultra tech stuff. okay, as you were.

job
Aug 2, 2002, 02:53 AM
Originally posted by tjwett
i know this thread has veered way off course and has entrered the Bermuda Triangle of forums but i just wanted to say that this KDE 3 actually looks pretty good to me. is it at all possible to run KDE on a Mac? it says it is supported by Unix. is there a way to just install Unix on a Mac and run KDE? isn't OS X just a Unix GUI of sorts? is this totally impossible? i don't know much about ultra tech stuff. okay, as you were.

Yeah this thread is "lost at sea." :)

You can run KDE on your Mac. Just install a flavor of your favorite brand of Linux, download the required distros to run KDE and you are in buisness.

Of course it is not as easy as that, but it's close enough. I've got SuSE Linux 7.3 PPC.

You can download it from their ftp site.

tjwett
Aug 2, 2002, 04:02 AM
Originally posted by hitman


Yeah this thread is "lost at sea." :)

You can run KDE on your Mac. Just install a flavor of your favorite brand of Linux, download the required distros to run KDE and you are in buisness.

Of course it is not as easy as that, but it's close enough. I've got SuSE Linux 7.3 PPC.

You can download it from their ftp site.

thanks alot! i've heard that certain flavors use AltiVec also. black lab i think. do you find that such a stripped down OS like Linux adds some speed and/or stability to your system? i wouldn't be getting real serious with it but i'm really interested in it as a hobby and i think it would be neat to be able to boot up my Mac into a completely different OS. is it possible to partition a drive and have KDE as one startup disk and MacOS as another? that would be wild.

sageenos
Aug 2, 2002, 06:22 AM
Originally posted by tjwett
i know this thread has veered way off course and has entrered the Bermuda Triangle of forums but i just wanted to say that this KDE 3 actually looks pretty good to me. is it at all possible to run KDE on a Mac? it says it is supported by Unix. is there a way to just install Unix on a Mac and run KDE? isn't OS X just a Unix GUI of sorts? is this totally impossible? i don't know much about ultra tech stuff. okay, as you were.

Try Fink (http://fink.sourceforge.net) . It let's you use KDE along with a bunch of other Xfree86 stuff I think.

King Cobra
Aug 2, 2002, 09:42 AM
>(jefhatfield)ok, son
...
see, you have to realize that when alphatech attacked you the first time that you were on macrumors, or another time, who was it that came to your defense?...it was me, son:p :eek: :)

And for that I have put you in my signature...
jefhornyfield's adopted punk child

>(titman)Must have been a pretty rotten one, judging from the present day results. :D

I can't imagine the mutation YOU went through, bytchman! :p :D :D :D

job
Aug 2, 2002, 09:46 AM
Originally posted by King Cobra
I can't imagine the mutation YOU went through, bytchman! :p :D :D :D

No mutations for me, just good, old fashioned se......errr......I think I'll shut up now. :p :D

King Cobra
Aug 2, 2002, 09:48 AM
I think you being the only titman on the forums and "old fashioned se:eek:" is what should have shut you up in the first place! :p :D :p

jadam
Aug 2, 2002, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by tjwett
i know this thread has veered way off course and has entrered the Bermuda Triangle of forums but i just wanted to say that this KDE 3 actually looks pretty good to me. is it at all possible to run KDE on a Mac? it says it is supported by Unix. is there a way to just install Unix on a Mac and run KDE? isn't OS X just a Unix GUI of sorts? is this totally impossible? i don't know much about ultra tech stuff. okay, as you were.

yeah, you have to run XDarwin, but try out FINK, it has pre-compiled binaries for OSX for popular *nix apps such as KDE and GNOME to run with OSX at the same time.

jefhatfield
Aug 2, 2002, 04:35 PM
Originally posted by hitman


I'd rather have a F-22. :D

the raptor is good...the best out there right now along with eurofighter

raptor has the best pilots in the world...us air force but the eurofighter has the best computer systems in it right now

the downside of these two high tech planes is that they're very expensive

the jsf will have capabilities matching both in real world conditions but work for the us air force, the us navy, the us marine corps, european air forces, asian air forces, and middle eastern air forces

no fighter has been so versatile, not even the F-16

and the icing on the cake will be that these planes will be able to be cheaper than either the raptor or the eurofighter so the us and its allies will be ready for conflicts no matter who is in office in any one of the countries that need air superiority

boeing and lockheed are working on versions right now for this modern, versatile, low cost jet fighter

AlphaTech
Aug 2, 2002, 04:54 PM
Hey jef, is that supposed to replace the F14??? Even though the F14 entered service many years ago, it's still a highly effective fighter. Another case of something that is well designed exceeding it's initial projected service life (like many Mac's out there). :D

me hate windows
Aug 2, 2002, 05:36 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech


ooooooooo... Chitman has a little 10mm uzi... :D Real men carry .45 cal... :D
No, REAL men carry a Galil. Guns used by Israeli Commandos.

"Once available only to the most elite Israeli commandos and anti- terrorist units, Israel Military Industries (IMI) innovator and manufacturer of the finest military and law enforcement products brings to you the Micro Galil series assault rifle, the worlds finest assault rifle."

fitzg2md05
Aug 2, 2002, 11:31 PM
ill take an MP-5 any day of the week. Or better yet...the new MP-10. Those are awesome. Theres a reason that thats what SWAT, Special forces, and just about any other kickass group uses. its a genuine ****-ya-up-gun.

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 12:56 AM
The best artillery piece in the world, the G-5 was designed and built in South Africa using technology stolen from several sources, including the United States. It can fire a 155mm (six-inch) shell twenty-four and a half miles with phenomenal accuracy. The G-5 is towed behind a truck or logistics vehicle. The related G-6 mounts the same gun on a six-wheeled, lightly armored chassis.

ALTERNATIVES TO THE G-5.

GAU-8/A (gun): A 30mm Gatling gun mounted in the nose of the A-10 Warthog. Designed specifically for tank killing, the gun has a rate of fire of 4,200 rounds per minute (nearly 60 a second). It fires a special round made of fantastically heavy depleted uranium.

FOR A LIGHTER LOAD.

The REASON v1.0B7 from Ng Security Industries is a test-phase automatic Gatling-type 3-mm hypervelocity railgun system, equipped with its own flat-screen and GUI. The weapon flings extremely dense pellets of uranium at speeds approaching 18,600 mps (10% C), from twelve polycarbon barrels which cycle about an electric-arc-type primer mechanism, resulting in a maximum output of 10,000 pellets a minute (more than 100 a second).

job
Aug 3, 2002, 12:57 AM
Originally posted by fitzg2md05
ill take an MP-5 any day of the week. Or better yet...the new MP-10. Those are awesome. Theres a reason that thats what SWAT, Special forces, and just about any other kickass group uses. its a genuine ****-ya-up-gun.

Mp5s jam way too easily in rough conditions.

Believe me, you won't want to take one into the field with you.

They are perfect for urban CQB and that's it.

job
Aug 3, 2002, 12:58 AM
Originally posted by citizensane
The REASON v1.0B7 from Ng Security Industries is a test-phase automatic Gatling-type 3-mm hypervelocity railgun system, equipped with its own flat-screen and GUI. The weapon flings extremely dense pellets of uranium at speeds approaching 18,600 mps (10% C), from twelve polycarbon barrels which cycle about an electric-arc-type primer mechanism, resulting in a maximum output of 10,000 pellets a minute (more than 100 a second).

Errr....railgun anyone? :D :D

job
Aug 3, 2002, 01:03 AM
Originally posted by jefhatfield
boeing and lockheed are working on versions right now for this modern, versatile, low cost jet fighter

Lockheed won the contract fyi.

The theory is a nice one, but I'm not so sure it will work.

The JSF project very similar to the F-111 project back in the 80s (that led to the development of the F-14, IMHO, the best air superiority fighter.) The F-111 tried to be a cruise missle carrier, a naval fighter, an interceptor, bomber, etc. The only thing it was good for was mud-moving. :rolleyes:

I'm not saying that the JSF is a bad concept; it's just the words "Jack of all trades, master of none" comes to mind.

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 01:33 AM
Yes, the REASON v1.0B7 is part railgun, part Gatling. It might be the best of both worlds, if only I could ever test one.

However, I'll revise your "railgun" analogy with the following:

RAILGUN + 20ccs RAW AMPHETAMINES = REASON v1.0B7.


My personal favorite, for ground combat, is the HK G-11. (All the best begin with "G," notice that?) The G-11 fires cubical, caseless rounds in short, lethal bursts of three. And of course, in long-range warfare, the XM-215 would have made for a very formidable main turret gun. (The XM-215 was an experimental "successor" to the M-167 and M-71 1970's-era Gatling weapons, with a changeable rate of fire: 400 (rounds)pm to 10,000. Its dual 500-round clips weren't enough to support such grueling demand.)


P.S. -- a little excerpt from a song by Dennis Leary: "I'm your average white, suburbanite slob . . . I like football, and porno, and BOOKS ABOUT WAR . . ."

(Something to think about.)

AlphaTech
Aug 3, 2002, 02:06 AM
Something you should think about... caseless rounds work only on paper and in movies. The reality of the matter is that they don't burn fast enough to effectively propell the projectile.

My sidearm of choice has to be a Para Ordnance (http://www.paraord.com/) P-14 (.45 cal, high capacity). I actually have one of those bad-assed ****ers. :D I originally purchased it with the alloy frame, but after several thousand rounds (yes that is thousand) it started to show signs of wear. I had the frame replaced with a steel one from Enterprise Arms, and it has held up very well. Granted, I have done some other modifications, all for competition, but it is still an excellent carry gun (helps to have license to do that in MA). With 15-16 rounds in each magazine (I have a total of seven of those) you can have a lot of firepower at your finger tips. The ramped barrel, and tight fit make it a very accurate weapon. Add a recoil suppression guide rod (full length) and you reduce the muzzel rise by ~50%. With my custom loads, I get a maximum rise of about 2". Which puts me back on target very fast. Fast enough, actually, to win my class in IPSC (until I had to put that on hold).

One of the many advantages of a .45 over 9mm or even .38 and .40 calibers is the recoil. The recoil characteristics of a .45 are not nearly as harsh as the other calibers. I have fired a few hundred rounds in a span of a couple of hours (competition) and could keep shooting the rest of the day without any ill effects. Let see people do that with the other calibers.

Remeber why the military initially switched to the .45 all those years ago??? Because a .38 caliber bullet would only piss off people, not knock them down. BTW, a 9mm~.32 caliber. A hit from a .45 will knock a person back, and down. Yes, modern body armor will stop a .45, just as it will stop a 9mm, .38, .40, .50 and every handgun caliber out there. At least the .45 has enough power and kinetic energy behind it to knock the person down, and in many cases, out for a short time.

I am still checking out rifles to see how they actually compare to each other. I know that the 7.62x39mm round is impressive, as is the current 5.56mm (.223 cal.) used in the AR15. The .308 is nothing to scoff at either. But for all around bad-assed rifle rounds, not much can touch the .50 caliber there.

Anyone happen to remember how we strayed from the original topic here???? :eek: :D

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 02:20 AM
Regarding .50 cals . . .:

I recently acquired a .50 cal round from a deceased WWII veteran's footlocker. Underneath it was a sheaf of Philippine currency, also WWII era (the kind which had "PESO" and "THE JAPANSE GOVERNMENT" printed on it, with pink/green ink and a white-limestone obelisk in the background, surrounded in filligree).

The bullet was sectioned into three separate components: (a) a solid, conical tip, (b) a long metallic "thorax" impregnated with a smaller bullet (measurements unknown) of lead or pig iron, (c) and the percussion-cap base, which has not been compromised. I've never seen anything like it before. Anyone want to take a stab at identifying it? I'll take digital photographs as soon as anybody wants them. (AlphaTech, hitman?)

AlphaTech
Aug 3, 2002, 02:33 AM
I'll take a look...

Have you tried taking it to a local gun shop to see what they can make of it??? What does the stamp on the base of the round say, around the primer (that is the proper term)?

I have a dud 20mm round that I was given by a friend of the family. He was in the national guard at the time, and this is one of the rounds that failed to fire when struck.

There is a ww2 history buff at work that I could show the image(s) to and see if he knows anything about it.

There were not too many kinds of .50 cal rounds produced, so it shouldn't be too difficult to figure out.

I hope you haven't pulled the round apart though, since that would ruin any value it might have held (especially as ww2 war memorabilia).

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 02:47 AM
Thanks, Alpha.

There's a slight catch about the pics: since I haven't taken any yet, it wont be until either tomorrow or Sunday that I actually acquire them (since I'll be using someone else's digital camera). So, patience is a necessary ingredient. If any can be mustered. It really is a unique slug.

Also: how should the photos be taken, to provide as much ID-conducive information as possible? Side-view, straight-on, rear? All? Let me know if you think a specific type will make things easier. Thanks again.

(For more private correspondance regarding this, my e-mail's <citizensane@mac.com>)

P.S. -- I have not taken it to a gun shop, as there aren't very many close by.

job
Aug 3, 2002, 02:49 AM
My dad was with the 12th Special Forces Group before it was deactivated by old Billie Clinton (the bastard!)

Anyways, my dad has numerous rounds on his office desk; a 20mm, a .50, a couple of 9mm hollow point rounds. You get the idea. :D

He got most of them while he was working with the Spectre AC-130U gunships. :)

I'd like to see a picture of the round too, citizensane, if it's not a problem.

Oh btw Alpha, the link is a 404. :)

AlphaTech
Aug 3, 2002, 02:51 AM
Try it now Chitman... :p :D

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 02:52 AM
Sure thing, hitman. Read my previous reply for arrival information on the pics. (I saw some great Spectre pics, once -- time lapse, during a run over some village in Vietnam. It was a night time assault: thousands of glaring orange tracers are visible in the pic, racing down in an inverted cone toward a central explosion -- what used to be the village.)

job
Aug 3, 2002, 02:56 AM
Originally posted by AlphaTech
Try it now Chitman... :p :D

Cheers. :D

job
Aug 3, 2002, 02:57 AM
Originally posted by citizensane
(I saw some great Spectre pics, once -- time lapse, during a run over some village in Vietnam. It was a night time assault: thousands of glaring orange tracers are visible in the pic, racing down in an inverted cone toward a central explosion -- what used to be the village.)

Yeah, sometimes it was called "Silent Death" or "Whistling Death" because the target was destroyed before the sound ever reached the target.

Pretty impressive stuff.

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 03:15 AM
Did you ever read about that experimental "Gatling capsule" weapon, tested once on a battleship or something, which (because of its strange, unique "digital eight" barrel arrangement) fired 1.2M rounds per minute (or some equally DISGUSTING figure)? I heard of this, once, but never found any corroborating data online.

jefhatfield
Aug 3, 2002, 10:11 AM
Originally posted by hitman


Lockheed won the contract fyi.

The theory is a nice one, but I'm not so sure it will work.

The JSF project very similar to the F-111 project back in the 80s (that led to the development of the F-14, IMHO, the best air superiority fighter.) The F-111 tried to be a cruise missle carrier, a naval fighter, an interceptor, bomber, etc. The only thing it was good for was mud-moving. :rolleyes:

I'm not saying that the JSF is a bad concept; it's just the words "Jack of all trades, master of none" comes to mind.

actually, both may make planes but lockheed has the initial go ahead

the concept may work or fall flat...the F-14 entered service in the early 70s and lacks the ability to be updated to the most modern computer technologies (that being said, it is one of the most successful airplanes in recent history along with F-15 and F-16)...the F/A-18 could take some of the load off the F-14 but JSF will supposedly employ some new technologies and some say stealth capabilities

the magazine seapower by the navy league has some good information on this next gen fighter

one concept which i find interesting is the idea of pilotless fighters, something the local newspaper mentioned that is being researched by naval war college and other military institutions

some proposed models are able to exceed mach 4 and pull Gs (1G is the force of gravity on earth) in a way that it can outcorner a piloted enemy aircraft in a dogfight

human pilots are frail and unable to turn an aircraft with sustained g force because they will pass out

if a pilotless fighter gets shot down, which is highly unlikely, the pilot, safe on earth, does not die...a pilot flying a plane from a computer on earth will still have to earn his wings...my much younger friend of mine is a pilot instructor in the air force and even though he joined a few years ago, his flying time is limited...pilots don't fly for long in the armed forces...there will be no restrictions like that in the future with pilotless aircraft

three million sqaure miles can be monitored with such an aircraft and thousands of enemy aircraft can me monitored and targeted using supercomputers on the ground which are not there to weigh down the fighter

just like the battleship admirals of the 1930s thought they would never be replaced, the stick and rudder pilots who replaced the battleships are now going to be replaced one day

it's just evolution...having worked for the defense department though, uncle sam's movement in the computer world and trainig is still not so great...the army fort near where i live just ditched 286 computers in some areas in 2000...the defense and military establishment love to use computers until they "break"

i used a dell and the defense IT people in general hated macs and were full of misconceptions

network administrator training, if at all, is two weeks in the military and day one covers the use of the mouse

so pilots with proper training flying these computer guided aircraft and a defense department that does not worship dell and other proprietary old guard hardware makers (for high tech gear) may realize a pilotless fighter too many years from now

if the army got a box of g5s this month if they were released, gettting the training and setup going for these machines would be in place around the time the g6 would be out

almost any big organization, especially the military and goernment, are very slow to learn and have the hardest time getting the best people to work for them in every area

though i am a democrat, i am pro defense and one place where we can have a boost is in what we pay our soldiers and defense workers...when i graduated from a fairly decent university with a strong gpa in 1994, the two job offers i got was lt jr. grade in the navy for approx. $11/hr reserve or part time in the defense department as a gs-5 doing the same thing (human resources) at the pay rate of a navy ensign $9.30/hr...this is hardly something that will attract the best college graduates

...in silicon valley at the time in companies, many unexperienced college grads were easily pulling in $20/hr starting pay (about $40k a year)...guess where the talent went? being a fan of the military, i worked for the defense department as an intern with the low gs-5 pay

when i got assigned as a computer person there in hr, i saw a lot of room for improvement....i wish our government would use macs more...one windows nt enabled ship died and got strandedoffshore...thanks microsoft:p

jefhatfield
Aug 3, 2002, 10:35 AM
oh, and one other thing

being 16, by the time you are old enough to fly aircraft, you may be the first generation of pilots to fly the pilotless aircraft...if we ever get the thing off the ground administratively

and maybe you guys will be protecting our skies using macs

btw...i saw a navy weapons computer photo (seapower magazine) and low and behold, they had a compaq presario 1272 just like mine, 366 mhz and all, but in summer of 2002

...time to move to macs, guys:rolleyes:

sparkleytone
Aug 3, 2002, 12:53 PM
www.gunsforkids.com

one of my old school favorites

sparkleytone
Aug 3, 2002, 12:58 PM
:D

http://idisk.mac.com/alanbrent/Public/gfk.jpg

BongHits
Aug 3, 2002, 01:46 PM
maybe i missed something while we were bombing afghanistan....but don't we already have pilotless planes? i can't remember the names (Banshee?) but they look like the alien planes from Halo (the only good contribution microsoft has ever made) but are all white and have no visible openings.

Ifeelbloated
Aug 3, 2002, 02:25 PM
I think their names are 'Global Hawk' and 'Predator'. They do look pretty funky. I can definitely imagine a future battlefield where they're loitering 24-7. Sometimes it amazes me how much restraint the military uses because of it's political masters. Just goes to show the world that America is truly a forgiving country with it's enemies. Makes me so angry to think about those militant extremists out there who hate us just because we believe in freedom. These idiots want to take us back into the middle-ages for God sakes. Just goes to show you, there is nothing more dangerous than a fool with a cause.

King Cobra
Aug 3, 2002, 02:43 PM
I think we already had a few pilot-less planes go over the afgh. territory. I think the name of the aircraft was the B-2 or B-12. But those things cost a ridiculous amount of money, somewhere around a few BILLION dollars.

You want one? Work for about 1000 years. You'll make it sooner or later. :p

jefhatfield
Aug 3, 2002, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by BongHits
maybe i missed something while we were bombing afghanistan....but don't we already have pilotless planes?


global hawk, which is a BAMS, which stands for broad area maritime surveillance aircraft, is used for monitoring airspace

northrop grumman integrated systems makes this aircraft

but in the future, they will be able to have fighter aircraft which will be pilotless and be integrated later than the before mentioned joint strike fighter (jsf) f-32 by boeing and f-35 (already approved for system developement) by lockheed

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 08:37 PM
NOLO rings like "solo" off the tongue, and perhaps appropriately, since that's the name Boeing christened their "NO Live Operator" series of hypothetical, manless aerial combat craft. Advantages of the NOLO include: (a) limitless g-force integrity, (b) lack of traditional life-support systems and the weight which accompany these, (c) can be made one eighth the size of an ordinary assault craft to (d) accomplish the same suite of tasks.

I don't know if they'll serve a surveillance role or a double offensive/defensive one. My guess is both -- however, I think a more practical use of their powerful computer technology and maneuverability will be as singular units acting as part of a larger assault mechanism: "drones" which emerge from the Big Mama craft, overwhelm the opposition, and return to their holds for refueling/repairs. These would be extremely effective, with their sheer volume (over a dozen in one strike) and unmatched speed/maneuverability.

Also -- the "rare .50 cal" pics will be available later today. I have the digital camera, now it's a matter of taking the photos and getting them up.

job
Aug 3, 2002, 09:23 PM
Originally posted by sparkleytone
www.gunsforkids.com

one of my old school favorites

Can you/do you actually buy stuff on this site? :eek:

solvs
Aug 3, 2002, 09:37 PM
Originally posted by sparkleytone
XP:

OS X Plagiarized

:cool:

Ha!

That's a good one.

Linux is cool. But it's got it's problems. Still not as time consuming as a constantly problem ridden Wintel.

I don't know how many of you have actually used XP, but it's terrible. Who cares how fast and secure (yeah right) it is, if the actual user eXPeriance SUX? My parents have it, but all they do is e-mail and digital photo storage. My mom still wishes she had a Mac again (she had a 6400). She has a G3 Powerbook and iMacs at the school she teaches at, and wants an iBook. And now my stepdad wants to burn DVD's. Try that with XP on a 1.2 Celeron. At least it's a Sony, but still.

For those who know about the nightmares of Windows, you can sympathize. I was offered a copy of XP for free, I turned it down. Win98 on my Celeron WOO-HOO.

Now bring on the new Mac Towers. OS X.2!!!

Sorry, I don't know anything about guns. Swords on the other hand...

AlphaTech
Aug 3, 2002, 09:47 PM
solvs, some of what you posted is why I won't go to heXPee, ever. I have win2k on the game pc that I constructed, and that is the OS that I am keeping it at. I have heard from someone else (guy that works at Electronix Boutique) that heXPee doesn't log people out like win2k does. Under w2k, you log out, and the applications you were running are closed out. Under heXPee, they are not closed down, they remain running. That screams security risk to me.

The GUI on heXPee also blows massive chunks. I had the misfortune of seeing it on a client's computer last week... It just reaffirms my advise to everyone purchasing a peecee to get win2k on it. Even if it means going out and purchasing a copy (if the computer company won't install it for you when you get the system).

jefhatfield
Aug 3, 2002, 09:59 PM
Originally posted by citizensane
NOLO rings like "solo" off the tongue, and perhaps appropriately, since that's the name Boeing christened their "NO Live Operator" series

now take that concept and feminize it with the right "features" and you have a fembott

i will be the testor of, course

"yeah, roger that, the fembott roles off the tongue quite nicely":D :p :p :o :o :eek: :eek: :eek: :cool:

citizensane
Aug 3, 2002, 10:19 PM
Okay, the pictures are in. Now -- Alpha, hitman, would you rather I e-mailed them to you? Because (being a "newbie") I have no idea how to post them here. Otherwise I would.

job
Aug 3, 2002, 11:03 PM
Use the attach feature when posting; everyone will be able to see it.

I think the maximum size is 100KB.

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 12:31 AM
I don't understand how to post an image. Type the file heirarchy data? Doesn't make any sense to me -- help.

Here, I'll take a shot at it:

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 12:40 AM
Mystery bullet:

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 12:44 AM
Mystery bullet, side view:

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 12:47 AM
Mystery bullet, top view:

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 12:50 AM
Mystery bullet, rear angle:

AlphaTech
Aug 4, 2002, 12:51 AM
What's the writing on the side of the bullet head???

BTW, that's not an entire round, it's just the head (the part that goes into/through things/people.

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 12:57 AM
The writing appears to be "[<pi>] AGO". I can't decipher the first letter, but it looks a lot like the Pi symbol (<pi>).

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 01:36 AM
Some annotations.

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 02:30 AM
I've reposted below the original, full-sized image. It also features the WWII-era Philippine currency with which the bullet was found.

job
Aug 4, 2002, 02:48 AM
Do you have any dimensions? Because that thing does not look like any .50 cal round I've ever seen, WW2 era included.

job
Aug 4, 2002, 02:49 AM
Originally posted by AlphaTech
What's the writing on the side of the bullet head???

BTW, that's not an entire round, it's just the head (the part that goes into/through things/people.

I think you may be right.

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 03:11 AM
I'd say it's about two inches in length, and about an inch in breadth. But I don't know, for certain. I'll try and get a picture of it next to a ruler, tomorrow. Maybe I don't know what "fifty caliber" really means . . .

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 03:57 AM
I took down the old William Gibson tribute to make a few revisions. Alright, what do you think of this version (hint: no color):

It was created in Photoshop from a scanned picture taken off the hardcover edition of IDORU. Getting the jacket area gunk free was about the hardest part, aside from replicating the Think Different sigil.

job
Aug 4, 2002, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by citizensane
I took down the old William Gibson tribute to make a few revisions. Alright, what do you think of this version (hint: no color):

It was created in Photoshop from a scanned picture taken off the hardcover edition of IDORU. Getting the jacket area gunk free was about the hardest part, aside from replicating the Think Different sigil.

Looks like a actual poster.

Looks nice. :)

AlphaTech
Aug 4, 2002, 11:53 AM
Originally posted by citizensane
I'd say it's about two inches in length, and about an inch in breadth. But I don't know, for certain. I'll try and get a picture of it next to a ruler, tomorrow. Maybe I don't know what "fifty caliber" really means . . .

A .50 caliber round has a bullet head with a diameter of ~.50", just like a .45 is ~.45" (the heads I reload with are .452").

With the head you are showing being ~1" I would say that is more likey a 20mm round. Which opens up an entirely different range of what it could be. It would have helped if the round was intact (head on the case/shell) since those typically have what it is stamped on the bottom of it. Is the bottom of the bullet head soft (like lead) or hard (like steel/copper)???

awrc
Aug 4, 2002, 11:58 AM
Originally posted by Rower_CPU


Don't forget Macromedia's "MX" apps...


Named after the missile system I believe, on account of being late, very expensive and not delivering everything that was expected of it.

Plus if you actually bought the full boxed version you need a big truck to carry all of the manuals around (whereas if you bought online and paid the $$$ for the "backup CD" and manuals you get one crappy little "Introduction To Studio MX" booklet and that's it).

Still waiting for a web development system that supports PHP but doesn't assume I love MySQL to the exclusion of all other databases. I want PostgreSQL support, dammit.

jefhatfield
Aug 4, 2002, 02:13 PM
Originally posted by AlphaTech


A .50 caliber round has a bullet head with a diameter of ~.50", just like a .45 is ~.45" (the heads I reload with are .452").

With the head you are showing being ~1" I would say that is more likey a 20mm round. Which opens up an entirely different range of what it could be. It would have helped if the round was intact (head on the case/shell) since those typically have what it is stamped on the bottom of it. Is the bottom of the bullet head soft (like lead) or hard (like steel/copper)???

i would also say 20 mm cannon round

and if found with wwII era philippine currency, i would say from the nose of an army air force p-38 fighter cannon

mnkeybsness
Aug 4, 2002, 02:19 PM
i think this thread needs to be closed...it now has nothing to do at all with macs or apple

jefhatfield
Aug 4, 2002, 02:25 PM
Originally posted by mnkeybsness
i think this thread needs to be closed...it now has nothing to do at all with macs or apple

it got way off topic ;)

topic was originally about when someone showed me their red hat/kde linux and some of the aqua looking features i saw on it and somehow we got to talking about bullets and guns

funny how things get way off topic here when apple gives us nothing to speculate about

you should have been around for all the SMG talk:p

Spock
Aug 4, 2002, 03:56 PM
Originally posted by King Cobra
I think we already had a few pilot-less planes go over the afgh. territory. I think the name of the aircraft was the B-2 or B-12. But those things cost a ridiculous amount of money, somewhere around a few BILLION dollars.

You want one? Work for about 1000 years. You'll make it sooner or later. :p

The B-2 is a Stealth Bomber and cannot be purchased.

citizensane
Aug 4, 2002, 05:25 PM
First (Alpha): thanks for helping me out with the .50 caliber issue. Since 20 millimeters is equivalent to 1.00", I'll agree. The base is Cu 29 (copper). However, a cap or plug of "foreign metal" exists, flattened, on the very bottom. An annotated photograph has been posted for your analysis.

Second (hitman): if you desire a larger picture of the William Gibson "Think Different" tribute, I can send the original Photoshop file (or a jpeg of the same size). E-mail me: <citizensane@mac.com>

Third (jefhat): a P-38 Fighter cannon? I'll have to look those up. Any more info you could post? Thanks.

RUNCIBLE 2.0
Aug 4, 2002, 06:39 PM
Lockheed P-38 Lightnings flew as long-range bomber escorts during World War II (1939-1945), protecting bombers from intercepting enemy fighters.

citizensane
Aug 5, 2002, 12:04 AM
Jeeze, guys . . . where are you? By the time I had opened this post, it was nearly drowned by a deluge of fresh ones. Can't let THAT happen. Respond when you can.

job
Aug 5, 2002, 01:13 AM
It could be from a P-38, however, the possibility of a land based cannon round has also not been ruled out.

If it is a P-38 round then this would be your culprit :

The P-38 E was very similar to the P-38 D, except a Hispano-Suiza 20 mm cannon was introduced.

AlphaTech
Aug 5, 2002, 08:48 AM
Originally posted by citizensane
First (Alpha): thanks for helping me out with the .50 caliber issue. Since 20 millimeters is equivalent to 1.00", I'll agree. The base is Cu 29 (copper). However, a cap or plug of "foreign metal" exists, flattened, on the very bottom. An annotated photograph has been posted for your analysis.


Actually, 20mm doesn't equate to 1 inch. 1 inch is 2.54cm (25.4mm) so 20mm is not 1".

I know of no rounds that had a 'cap' or such on the underside of the head. Even explosive rounds are either impact detonated or via a time (for flack shells). The plug you are seeing could be where they inserted explosive material into the head, but without a better image it is hard to say.

It would help if you could clean the oxidation off of the bottom of the bullet head so that we could see it better.

jefhatfield
Aug 5, 2002, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by hitman
It could be from a P-38, however, the possibility of a land based cannon round has also not been ruled out.

If it is a P-38 round then this would be your culprit :



two less likely possibilities are the p-39 aircobra and the p-61 black widow, both with models that had the 20mm shells

now there were also the japanese aircraft but i don't know if any of them had a 20mm cannon, but it is definitely likely some did

and then there are british aircraft in world war II and then there's possibility that this was not even a wartime bullet and it could be from another time period

job
Aug 5, 2002, 12:49 PM
Originally posted by jefhatfield


two less likely possibilities are the p-39 aircobra and the p-61 black widow, both with models that had the 20mm shells

now there were also the japanese aircraft but i don't know if any of them had a 20mm cannon, but it is definitely likely some did

and then there are british aircraft in world war II and then there's possibility that this was not even a wartime bullet and it could be from another time period

So in other words, we have no earthly idea where this thing came from. :D :p

Those are all definate possibilities, especially the thought of it being a Japanese round.

The only way we could figure out where the round came from would be to compare it to other rounds of the same calibre, both American and Japanese.

Have we even established what calibre it is?

jefhatfield
Aug 5, 2002, 05:29 PM
Originally posted by hitman


So in other words, we have no earthly idea where this thing came from. :D :p

Those are all definate possibilities, especially the thought of it being a Japanese round.

The only way we could figure out where the round came from would be to compare it to other rounds of the same calibre, both American and Japanese.

Have we even established what calibre it is?

if it's bigger than the fifty caliber and smaller than one inch, then it's very likely a 20mm bullet/shell, but this was also used after world war II

but what is the context of the shell?...maybe someone into world war II paraphanalia was into collecting everything, so the bullet, if from world war II, could also be from the european theatre of operations

the most effective all around gun in a world war II airplane was the faster shooting fifty caliber rounds as opposed to the slower but more powerful 20mm cannons, so the possiblities are fewer than if it was just a generic fifty caliber bullet

i can't imagine a hand gun or rifle with such a large round in it...maybe ahnold:p

job
Aug 5, 2002, 08:53 PM
There were also land based 20mm antiaircraft artillery as well. The round could have come from one of these cannons

Apart from that, I can't think of any other ground based cannon that fired 20mm rounds. Most half-tracks and tanks used .50 machine guns as their secondary weapon.

It's probably not from a 20mm rifle, unless it's from some sort of recoiless or anti-tank rifle. :p

And only the Russians used anti-tank rifles...

mnkeybsness
Aug 5, 2002, 09:49 PM
would someone move this thread already...it's starting to really bother me how off topic it is

AlphaTech
Aug 5, 2002, 09:59 PM
Originally posted by mnkeybsness
would someone move this thread already...it's starting to really bother me how off topic it is

If you don't like it, then don't read it... You CAN unsubscribe to it you know, ya nit. :rolleyes: :p

jefhatfield
Aug 5, 2002, 10:39 PM
Originally posted by mnkeybsness
would someone move this thread already...it's starting to really bother me how off topic it is

if i knew where this thread i started was going to go, with bullets and all, i would have put it into community discussion area...sorry for that

i don't know who the moderator for this section is...maybe it's eyelikeart...but where this thread has gone, it should be shelved into the community discussion forum

btw...does sarah michelle gellar deserve her own category on macrumors?...she certainly gets a lot of attention on macrumors;)

job
Aug 5, 2002, 11:52 PM
In comparison to the other off topic threads that are around, this one seems to be going quite strong with real, logical debate and discussion.

Great stuff!

And yeah, if you don't like it, don't read it. :p

citizensane
Aug 6, 2002, 12:24 AM
Much has occured in my absence.

Alpha, thank you for correcting my measurement comparisons. Hitman, Jef -- your input is appreciated.

Back to the issue at hand:

Measuring the bullet produced these figures.

citizensane
Aug 6, 2002, 12:31 AM
Here's a chance to examine the "engraved text" for yourselves.


Nearest I could get was "(Pi symbol or D) AGO"

There's another etching which I didn't capture on film. Resembles a crescent moon, near the screw-bolt on its opposite side.

citizensane
Aug 6, 2002, 12:38 AM
.

citizensane
Aug 6, 2002, 12:40 AM
This shot has very poor grain integrity, so bear with me.

Highlighted is the "mysterious crescent shape" I write of in the previous post.

citizensane
Aug 6, 2002, 01:06 AM
Here is what the interior is like (extrapolated from memory).

Zeitgeist 2101
Aug 6, 2002, 01:52 AM
This place is the Tom Clancy FANATIC freakhouse! Utterly unexpected at a Mac-related forum -- one might say Mac/Apple is the complete anti-icon of glorified war.

But my two cents aren't entirely without value, because: What was that gun -- the Viktor?

I hope this thread generates a lot of drama. ESPECIALLY if I'm (quote) "completely off the map" (unquote).

NOTE: NO, the parenthetical "quote" and "unquote" are not botched programming -- they were written out that way to emphasize the actual quote marks. To enhance the (quote) "sarcasm" (unquote).

As Juan Carlos, head chef/cashier at YIASSOO GREEK CUISINE would say, "En-yoy."

DannyZR2
Aug 6, 2002, 02:12 AM
what the chee-hey?!?

citizensane
Aug 7, 2002, 12:50 AM
Hey, what's all this about "completely neglecting the mystery bullet post"? Alpha, hitman? Where the heck are you guys?

This thing was almost at the bottom of the forum page. Shame on you. . . . Anyway, comment on the recent picture updates. We need info.

RUNCIBLE 2.0
Aug 7, 2002, 01:04 AM
So maybe you can help me.

I've owned an iBook since July of 2001. So far it has been a great tool: but -- I alway suspected the battery had a horribly short Free-From-Socket lifespan. Today I clocked it. It went from 98% to 8% in 27:58 minutes. Is this normal?

Zeitgeist 2101
Aug 7, 2002, 01:12 AM
That's really odd. I took a peek at the new iBooks in Cupertino's COMPANY STORE and, apparently, their batteries were made to last several HOURS. Not a teensy bracket of useless minutes.

I'd be haggling with my Apple about my Warrantee right now, if I were you . . .

citizensane
Aug 7, 2002, 01:35 AM
I was serious about this bullet.

job
Aug 7, 2002, 08:50 PM
Hey

Sorry I have not replied, I've been sick the last couple of days.

Anyways, I asked my dad about the round and he has no idea what it could be.

I really don't know what else to say.

hitman