Schwarzenegger to Veto Illegal Immigrant Driving Licenses

[iLikeMyiMac]

SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger will veto legislation that would allow nearly 2 million illegal immigrants who pass criminal background checks to obtain driver's licenses, a spokeswoman said on Saturday. The Democratic-controlled California Senate and Assembly approved bills on Friday, the final day of the legislative session, to allow illegal immigrants to apply for driver's licenses. Critics have said allowing illegal immigrants to obtain driver's licenses would reward those who break immigration laws.
A representative for Democratic state Sen. Gilbert Cedillo, who led the push to allow illegal immigrants to obtain driver's licenses, was not immediately available to comment. link (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20040828/us_nm/politics_california_immigrants_dc)
I always wondered why people wanted to give driving licenses to illegial immigrants. If they are illegial and they are caught shouldn't they be sent back to where ever they came from? I think Schwarzenegger is making the right choice. Anyone else?

[Laslo Panaflex]

I agree, I mean, most likely the illegal immigrants can't get insurance either, so that just makes things even worse . . .

[RBMaraman]

I agree 100% with Schwarzenegger on this issue.

Driving is a privelige, not a right. If these people are coming into our country illegally, then they should not be granted many of the priveliges we receive as citizens. Now, if they follow the proper procedures, and come into the US legally, then they should be allowed to drive, etc.

I was reading an article today that said within 50 years, 25% of people living in the US will be hispanic. I wonder what the number of illegal vs. legal hispanic residents is in the US.

[iJon]

i agree with laslo. the insurance thing would scare me. there have been many mexicans in my town who simply don't have insurance. they get in a wreck with you and you are just s*** out of luck.

iJon

[iLikeMyiMac]

i agree with laslo. the insurance thing would scare me. there have been many mexicans in my town who simply don't have insurance. they get in a wreck with you and you are just s*** out of luck.

iJon
On my insurance card it says that I am insured against uninsured moter vehicles. I think its like $10 or $20 extra every 6 months for this which isn't that much more $ considering what benefits you get.

[AhmedFaisal]

I always wondered why people wanted to give driving licenses to illegial immigrants. If they are illegial and they are caught shouldn't they be sent back to where ever they came from? I think Schwarzenegger is making the right choice. Anyone else?

Because California's agricultural industry among many others would die an instant nasty death without the cheap "food picker ****ers" to quote Carlos Mencia. That's why. Illegals are not a threat to the California job market, they are the backbone of the industry.
Cheers,

Ahmed

[wdlove]

I agree with Gov. Schwarzenegger, he has taken a stand. Illegal immigrants have broken the law, they should not be rewarded. Our borders need to be made secure, it's a security issue.

[Rower_CPU]

Moved from Current Events to Political Discussion. Please post news of political nature in this forum. Thanks :)

[Neserk]

The problem is you have people who are going to be driving who are not licensed or insured.

By allowing all people to get driver's license w/o asking them to provide documentation you make the streets safer. It also means I'm less likely to be hit by an uninsured driver which raises my costs.

Arnold isn't thinking. Big surprise. He is listening to special interest groups. Big surprise. It is time to recall Arnold and put Davis back in office where he belongs.

[zimv20]

as ahmed indicated, what would be the economic ramifications of such a policy? forgive the pun, but doesn't a car-oriented transportation system help drive CA's economy?

it's a little sad to me to see how many people here want to punish a group of people to whom they don't belong, even if they are here illegally.

would you also agree if schwarzenegger decreed that illegals were also barred from using public trans, renting apartments and buying food?

[IJ Reilly]

Just for the record: Insurance is not a requirement for driver's licenses in California. Insurance is tied to vehicle registration.

I'm not sure what interests would be served by making illegal aliens eligible for driver's licenses, but I do know that denying them licenses is not going to reduce the number of illegal aliens on the highways.

[justinshiding]

I wonder how many would actually go for this offer. Personally, I would think it's a ruse of sort.

Like the simpsons episode where they springfield police offer people with unpaid parking tickets a free boat and then make them pay up....i dont know...if they're illegal...but have drivers liscences...how hard can it be to track them down for deportation ?

[Neserk]

Just for the record: Insurance is not a requirement for driver's licenses in California. Insurance is tied to vehicle registration.


No, but you can't drive a car if you aren't insured.


I'm not sure what interests would be served by making illegal aliens eligible for driver's licenses, but I do know that denying them licenses is not going to reduce the number of illegal aliens on the highways.

Those who are racist against people who speak minimal or no English. I'm sure they have their groups which Arnold is playing to.

I have no doubt if those "illegals" were from Australia or Europe no one would care. The only issue is the fact that they are Hispanic and (heaven forbid) don't speak English, or speak little English. It is racism.

[Neserk]

I wonder how many would actually go for this offer. Personally, I would think it's a ruse of sort.



That is what I thought at first. But basically you don't require a SS# when getting the license. There is no way to know who is legal and who is not.

[skunk]

I wonder how many would actually go for this offer. Personally, I would think it's a ruse of sort.

Like the simpsons episode where they springfield police offer people with unpaid parking tickets a free boat and then make them pay up....i dont know...if they're illegal...but have drivers liscences...how hard can it be to track them down for deportation ?
As AhmedFaisal said, if you deport them, the fruit will rot on the branch.

[IJ Reilly]

No, but you can't drive a car if you aren't insured.

Of course you can! In fact I don't know how someone could even get auto insurance without owning a car.

[skunk]

???

[Neserk]

Of course you can! In fact I don't know how someone could even get auto insurance without owning a car.


I don't know but you can't rent a car or drive a car w/o insurance. And the issue isn't people not having a car anyway. It is driving them legally -- as a licensed driver.

[Leo Hubbard]

As AhmedFaisal said, if you deport them, the fruit will rot on the branch.
No it won't, the price will go up for that fruit to compensate those places paying a higher wage for legal employees to pick it.

[skunk]

And then they'll lose their market, and they won't NEED any pickers.

[IJ Reilly]

I don't know but you can't rent a car or drive a car w/o insurance. And the issue isn't people not having a car anyway. It is driving them legally -- as a licensed driver.

Yes, you most certainly can. In fact I have never been asked for any proof of insurance when renting in California or elsewhere (including the UK, skunk). The rental companies always try to sell you "supplemental" insurance, but that only covers the deductibles in their policies. Sometime ask your insurance company whether you can lend your car to friend who doesn't own one (and therefore won't be insured). I'm sure they'll say it's okay so long as they're a licensed driver, and it's not a regular thing.

I realize this is off the thread topic, but someone did imply that denying valid California driver's licenses to illegal aliens would somehow decrease the number of people driving without insurance. This is obviously not the case, if only because insurance is not a perquisite for obtaining a license. The real problem is unregistered cars, or owners who pay only a month or two of premiums so they can show the proof on registration.

[Leo Hubbard]

And then they'll lose their market, and they won't NEED any pickers.
Then that could be evidence that it is a function of our market that is no longer nesessary.

Typical argument, we can't claim we are truly equal because to do so would mean everyone in the ACLU would be unemployed so in order to insure they all still have jobs we must go out of our way to prove that their are still minorities who are being trodden on.

Market expands, grows, matures and some parts of it needs to drop off when no longer needed. If a product can not be produced at a price the consumer is willing to pay, then perhaps that product is no longer necessary in our society.

[pseudobrit]

I wonder if Arnold had a license when he was an illegal alien?

[Ugg]

Sometime ask your insurance company whether you can lend your car to friend who doesn't own one (and therefore won't be insured). I'm sure they'll say it's okay so long as they're a licensed driver, and it's not a regular thing.

I realize this is off the thread topic, but someone did imply that denying valid California driver's licenses to illegal aliens would somehow decrease the number of people driving without insurance. This is obviously not the case, if only because insurance is not a perquisite for obtaining a license. The real problem is unregistered cars, or owners who pay only a month or two of premiums so they can show the proof on registration.

I wonder how the insurance companies feel about insured cars driven by unlicensed drivers. Do they go after the owner of the policy if there's an accident?

Anyway, it is a loaded subject but I think it points to the failure of both the US and all points south to effectively deal with immigration issues. Personally, I think it's better to give them a license than not and it's just another sign of the states trying to deal with something the feds can't or won't solve.

[Leo Hubbard]

I wonder how the insurance companies feel about insured cars driven by unlicensed drivers. Do they go after the owner of the policy if there's an accident?

Anyway, it is a loaded subject but I think it points to the failure of both the US and all points south to effectively deal with immigration issues. Personally, I think it's better to give them a license than not and it's just another sign of the states trying to deal with something the feds can't or won't solve.
The driver of an uninsured motor vehicle in the state of Florida who gets caught either by being in an accident or some other way, loses their liscence for 3 years and I think gets their car impounded.

It is technically legal for the insurance company to sue the unlicensed driver of an uninsured cars. However, how much money would they get from such a person compared to how much it would cost to sue them. Remember all they win is a judgement. After the judgement then they have to go for the actual money.

[zimv20]

The driver of an uninsured motor vehicle in the state of Florida [consequences deleted]
hey, look everyone -- sly forgot to pretend he's living in colorado.

[Leo Hubbard]

hey, look everyone -- sly forgot to pretend he's living in colorado.
Both myself and Slyhunter live in Florida. We go to the same school. I have no idea where Colorado came from. :rolleyes:

[Neserk]

hey, look everyone -- sly forgot to pretend he's living in colorado.

*Sigh* he is NOT sly/Voltron, for the 100th time. And Voltron has *always* said he lives in Florida.

[skunk]

*Sigh* he is NOT sly/Voltron, for the 100th time. And Voltron has *always* said he lives in Florida.
Some of the more observant may also have noticed that Sly/Voltron ALWAYS was on "stealth mode" on this forum. Leo is quite visibly there at the bottom of the page when he's on. NOT the same person. He clearly shares many views, but that's not surprising.

[mactastic]

I have real mixed feelings on this. Of course it won't reduce the number of uninsured on the road (it's analogous to the right-wing arguments against gun control on the grounds that it won't stop criminals from getting guns), but a drivers license is THE key for getting many other items. I also understand the economic need and impact of an illegal workforce. I don't like the idea of that form of power being given to an illegal immigrant. Perhaps if the drivers license wasn't the ubiquitous ID that it is my reservations would fade, since I don't have anything per se against illegals driving. They do it right now and I manage to get to work and back every day. And I drive right through the farmlands to get out of my house.

[acdninjapan]

The problem is you have people who are going to be driving who are not licensed or insured.

By allowing all people to get driver's license w/o asking them to provide documentation you make the streets safer. It also means I'm less likely to be hit by an uninsured driver which raises my costs.

Arnold isn't thinking. Big surprise. He is listening to special interest groups. Big surprise. It is time to recall Arnold and put Davis back in office where he belongs.

No, Schwartzchan has the right of it. Illegals should not be allowed to drive. OTH why not have an easily obtained 6 month visa that can be renewed by just leaving and re-entering the country for the migrant workers. Make it cost say US$100 and be easy to apply for and receive. Workers would be allowed to apply for this 6 times in a row and if after the 6th time their record is clean they get a 1 year pass for another US$100 and after 3 years they get their green card. Money comes into the country's coffers, illegals become documented and assimilated in an orderly fashion and the border guards catch a break as the coyotes are put out of business.

Extend this to the Chinese and other SEAsians with slightly higher prices and the treasury will soon be full.

BTW the Japanese, S koreans and Chinese use this system-works well for them...

[IJ Reilly]

I don't think the situations are very comparable. The US shares a lengthy border with a populous and impoverished nation to which the US also has deep cultural and historical ties. Short of placing armed guards every 100 yards along the border, we realistically cannot keep people from crossing it. Guest worker programs have been implemented over the years, but the problem with them (according to those who oppose them at least) is that the guest workers often don't return home when their permits expire.

We certainly do need a sane, rational and pragmatic policy towards immigration. I don't see how the driver's license prohibition gets us any closer. It looks to me like just another "feel good" law that does nothing of value.

[Chip NoVaMac]

The problem is you have people who are going to be driving who are not licensed or insured.

By allowing all people to get driver's license w/o asking them to provide documentation you make the streets safer. It also means I'm less likely to be hit by an uninsured driver which raises my costs.

Arnold isn't thinking. Big surprise. He is listening to special interest groups. Big surprise. It is time to recall Arnold and put Davis back in office where he belongs.

Here I disagree with you.

Just giving them the ability of getting a DL does not mean that they will be able to get or even get insurance.

We need to stop rewarding those that break the law. And being in the country illegally is breaking the law.

Also remember that some of the 9-11 terrorists got DL's in Virginia rather easliy, before they closed the loopholes.

[Chip NoVaMac]

No it won't, the price will go up for that fruit to compensate those places paying a higher wage for legal employees to pick it.

And that is not a bad thing IMO. Knew we would get you on the liberal side of "living wages" for all workers! :)

It would be a period of adjustment; but in the end the nation would benefit as a whole. More people would be able to have decent, affordable housing. More people might be able to afford health insurance. Tax brackets might tighten up, with the higher incomes that everyone would see.

IMO we have just created legal slavery, that's all.