iMac G5 low score look!

[CubaTBird]

the score is 105?!?? my ibook gets 100.2 !! this is seriously wrong, im at an apple store right now :eek:

[FuzzyBallz]

LOL, man, you need to put in another stick of 512MB and change the energy management to maximum from auto.

[oingoboingo]

LOL, man, you need to put in another stick of 512MB and change the energy management to maximum from auto.

Either that, or Xbench is a notoriously unreliable piece of rubbish.

[Elan0204]

Either that, or Xbench is a notoriously unreliable piece of rubbish.

I'm going to go with that explanation.

However, it does seem that setting processor performace to highest has a very noticable effect on performance, outside of just increasing the xbench score.

[CubaTBird]

you know whats sad though, the proc performance should have been automatically set to highest, its kinda weird that apple wants their desktop comps running slower than they actually can... it would make sense for a laptop to conserve energy but this isn't a laptop...

[quagmire]

Alot of things can change the score on Xbench. You have to set CPU to the highest, close all apps besides Xbench(I close windows as well to be safe), and make sure nothing will interfere with xbench. I got a 99.93 on a rev b 12" pbook 1 Ghz. But, I killed the HD test and got 113.13. Notice on how much the HD removes from your score. I tryed every test one without of each. The HD effected it the most.

[FuzzyBallz]

Either that, or Xbench is a notoriously unreliable piece of rubbish.
I've been saying that for months now, but people are still using it as a benchmark for Mac performance. Is there no other program that can accurately measure Mac performance?

[MegaSignal]

Check out my "real world" bench test elsewhere in this section. It's entitled "Dual 1.25 too fast".

I used iDVD background encoding performance as a testing tool, as this is the app I use most and would want to see the most performance boost.

[NusuniAdmin]

Just for your knowledge I am currently thinking about writing a benchmarking app in cocoa, which will be all optimized for 64 bit and altivec testing and all that good crap. I am hoping it will turn out to be better than xbench :D.

I will start a forum about it if i do decide to write it.

[oingoboingo]

I've been saying that for months now, but people are still using it as a benchmark for Mac performance. Is there no other program that can accurately measure Mac performance?

I wish there was. I've been thinking that perhaps an AppleScript of some sort which will load up a suite of apps, perform a set of operations, and then record the total time taken would be nice. However, that would require that the system being tested have all the same version of all the same apps installed, so in practice it would probably be impossible to implement.

Maybe as a community we need to talk seriously about constructing some standardised application benchmarks (using AppleScript maybe to drive the whole shebang) that people who own the relevant apps can download and execute...something like the PSBench series of actions for benchmarking PhotoShop performance, and set up a centralised repository for submitting and searching the benchmark results. Sites like Barefeats are good, but I find it a little frustrating sometimes that they don't always run the same tests on every machine, and their methodolgies are sometimes a little...err...'uncontrolled'. xlr8yourmac.com has some searchable benchmarks too, but I think the community over there is quite a bit smaller than the one here, probably mostly due to the fact that registrations for their forums have been closed for years.

I dunno...what do people think? Am I just talking about re-inventing the wheel here? Is there already a good site which allows downloading of standardised application benchmarking scripts and then has a good searchable database? I've always thought that actual application benchmarks (eg: benchmarks like UT2004 Flybys, PS7Bench, iTunes album encode times, FCP clip render times) with standardised run-scripts and test data, were better than purely synthetic benchmarks.

Opinions? Flames? Donations to my PayPal account? :)

[Abstract]

Maybe there should be a MacRumours benchmark, or NusuniAdmin benchmark written by NusuniAdmin. I'd happily use that instead of XBench. Every time someone uses XBench scores as irrefutable proof that one system is clearly faster than another, I just laugh. :p

[NusuniAdmin]

Maybe there should be a MacRumours benchmark, or NusuniAdmin benchmark written by NusuniAdmin. I'd happily use that instead of XBench. Every time someone uses XBench scores as irrefutable proof that one system is clearly faster than another, I just laugh. :p

Actually I was thinking of a app called XiBench or something similer....dunno about you but that sounds nifty to me. Anyways I wouldn't be writing it for a long time anyways, i am currently under heavy development of an other app.

[PeterBonnar]

I'm going to go with that explanation.

However, it does seem that setting processor performace to highest has a very noticable effect on performance, outside of just increasing the xbench score.

how do you change the processor performance?

[neoserver]

you know whats sad though, the proc performance should have been automatically set to highest, its kinda weird that apple wants their desktop comps running slower than they actually can... it would make sense for a laptop to conserve energy but this isn't a laptop...

maybe they don't set it to maximum because of heat issues in that case? maybe if the processor is at the highest setting, the cooling system can't keep up and the processor will eventually overheat..

[Elan0204]

how do you change the processor performance?

The Processor Performance setting is under the Energy Saver preference pane in System Preferences. It is under the "Options" tab.

[iMeowbot]

maybe they don't set it to maximum because of heat issues in that case? maybe if the processor is at the highest setting, the cooling system can't keep up and the processor will eventually overheat..
They ship the computers with the energy saving features turned on in order to save energy. In many parts of the world, that is a far more important consideration than xbench scores.

[PeterBonnar]

The Processor Performance setting is under the Energy Saver preference pane in System Preferences. It is under the "Options" tab.

It's only on laptops right? cause FuzzyBallz's post sounds like hes saying more ram should be added to the imac and increase the processor speed.

maybe i'm just confused and read his post wrong

[Elan0204]

It's only on laptops right? cause FuzzyBallz's post sounds like hes saying more ram should be added to the imac and increase the processor speed.

maybe i'm just confused and read his post wrong

The feature was originally introduced with the Titanium PowerBook G4 DVI models (the 667MHz and 800MHz models), but is now in all modern Macs, including desktops. It extends battery life in laptops, and reduces energy use and heat generation in desktops. The G5 PowerMacs and iMacs both have this feature, and you can set the processor to highest, automatic, or reduced performace.

[PeterBonnar]

I take it my G4 iMac shouldn't have it then... which ends my confusion.

I can understand why they have it in the desktop, lots of people us it just for typing etc and it saves power, but why not ship with it set to best performance?

Tut Tut apple *slaps wrist*

[SpaceMagic]

This is also a demo mac... as in one on show in an apple store... therefore... it's been played with endlessly.. messed about... only 256mb ram... probably hasn't been restarted today... loads of stuff running in Virtual memory, etc... If you benchmarked that machine after a restart... or benchmarked it out of the box... it'll be around 120 not much more though.

[CubaTBird]

i restarted it and had a guy who worked there type in the admin password... it also had 512, which should be enough i mean seriously.. if my ibook can keep up with an imac g5, seriously something is wrong there... i went and benched a dual g5 and got a score of around 187.. which made more sense

[iJon]

I think we had this discussion back when the G5 first came out. Nothing was different from automatic and highest.

iJon

[NusuniAdmin]

I think we had this discussion back when the G5 first came out. Nothing was different from automatic and highest.

iJon

not totally true. I remember readin this from a developer doc or something in xcode that talks about the settings, all automatic does it if the machine gets too hot or whatever it will slow it down, or if not that much power is needed it will slow down. WHen you run benchmarks and such it will not affect the actual benchmark (at least it shouldn't).

[jimjiminyjim]

You know, it strikes me that this forum should be about the leaps made with the G5. Unfortunately it is about how to measure performance and what affects performance. If that's what we're talking about... my guess is that the speed difference just isn't there. Then again, we're talking about miniscule differences. I mean for us e-mail, internet, movie watching, itunes listening, occasional video slapping together, proficient base users, what makes a machine feel faster is the UI speed. For me to be ecstatic about the speed of my computer and OS, here is my wish list:
I click a dock item and it appears, instantly.
I switch between windows in a browser and they appear, instantly.
I navigate through files and folders, they appear instantly.
I pop a DVD in and DVD Player begins, instantly (the wait seems to be an eternity).
I tell my computer "Phone for Jim Appleby" and it understands me, every time.
I go to an internet page I've visited before and it appears, instantly.
And it makes brewed coffee, instantly.

[nospleen]

i restarted it and had a guy who worked there type in the admin password... it also had 512, which should be enough i mean seriously.. if my ibook can keep up with an imac g5, seriously something is wrong there... i went and benched a dual g5 and got a score of around 187.. which made more sense

No disrespect to your ibook, but it most certainly cannot keep up with a 1.8 G5. I think everyone needs to throw Xbench out the window. Just wait until www.barefeats.com performs some real world tests. They will show it is about 95% of what a single Powermac G5 1.8 is. (my guess anyway)

[NusuniAdmin]

the score is 105?!?? my ibook gets 100.2 !! this is seriously wrong, im at an apple store right now :eek:

There is no way your ibook can get that. My 1.2 ghz ibook with 512 megs of ram (that reminds me, i need to update my sig) only get 85! Something is definitly wrong there!!

[CubaTBird]

that could be b/c ur proc isn't set to highest in the energy settings, see look

[NusuniAdmin]

that could be b/c ur proc isn't set to highest in the energy settings, see look

actually it is, and i have done crap loads of things that have optimized the whole system. There is something not right with those results posted though.

[CubaTBird]

there got the pic up c, whats weird is that my ibook shows up as a powerbook in the description, weird but still i get the the 100 score

[NusuniAdmin]

hmmm wutever.

ya it is wierd about it showing at powerbook though, mine does that as well.

xbench definitly is a horrid program, i just ran it again (well 30 mins ago) and it showed i got 110.... wierd!

Ill get started on my own bench utility asap :D

[jefhatfield]

You know, it strikes me that this forum should be about the leaps made with the G5. Unfortunately it is about how to measure performance and what affects performance. If that's what we're talking about... my guess is that the speed difference just isn't there. Then again, we're talking about miniscule differences. I mean for us e-mail, internet, movie watching, itunes listening, occasional video slapping together, proficient base users, what makes a machine feel faster is the UI speed. For me to be ecstatic about the speed of my computer and OS, here is my wish list:
I click a dock item and it appears, instantly.
I switch between windows in a browser and they appear, instantly.
I navigate through files and folders, they appear instantly.
I pop a DVD in and DVD Player begins, instantly (the wait seems to be an eternity).
I tell my computer "Phone for Jim Appleby" and it understands me, every time.
I go to an internet page I've visited before and it appears, instantly.
And it makes brewed coffee, instantly.


good points, except for maybe the coffee thing...that's years away but don't be surprised if someday computers do help make food/beverages and do other mechanical things

[tateusmaximus]

what makes a machine feel faster is the UI speed. For me to be ecstatic about the speed of my computer and OS, here is my wish list:
I click a dock item and it appears, instantly.
I switch between windows in a browser and they appear, instantly.
I navigate through files and folders, they appear instantly.
I pop a DVD in and DVD Player begins, instantly (the wait seems to be an eternity).
I tell my computer "Phone for Jim Appleby" and it understands me, every time.
I go to an internet page I've visited before and it appears, instantly.
And it makes brewed coffee, instantly.


i agree jimmy... except when im encoding video and playing around with 100MB photoshop files. i was going to buy a 17in powerbook (when the new one comes out whatever it is), until i went into a mac store in chatswood the other day and fiddled with a 1.6 G5 256MB.
to me coming from a 3.5GHz pentium to play with a g4 powerbook seems SOOOO slow between windows and starting apps. all the things that you have mentioned are sooo slow on a $5000 g4 laptop, but then i had a go with the g5 and it was QUICK! compparable to what im used to that is.

now that is one of the things ive disliked about macs (aswell as OS9). and it seems like they have fixed it up with the g5s!!!

it must be the much quicker FSB compared to the measely 166 offered by the g4s.

now im saving for one of those and ill swing it over my shoulder by the power cable with mouse and keyboard dragging on the ground when i want to move it!!! hehaheaheh

[NusuniAdmin]

i agree jimmy... except when im encoding video and playing around with 100MB photoshop files. i was going to buy a 17in powerbook (when the new one comes out whatever it is), until i went into a mac store in chatswood the other day and fiddled with a 1.6 G5 256MB.
to me coming from a 3.5GHz pentium to play with a g4 powerbook seems SOOOO slow between windows and starting apps. all the things that you have mentioned are sooo slow on a $5000 g4 laptop, but then i had a go with the g5 and it was QUICK! compparable to what im used to that is.

now that is one of the things ive disliked about macs (aswell as OS9). and it seems like they have fixed it up with the g5s!!!

it must be the much quicker FSB compared to the measely 166 offered by the g4s.

now im saving for one of those and ill swing it over my shoulder by the power cable with mouse and keyboard dragging on the ground when i want to move it!!! hehaheaheh

Mac laptops are natoriously (spelling?) slow, apple still does not know how to put a 7200 rpm drive in them....*sigh*. Or heck....at least make it a farggin BTO option! These terrible 5400 and 4200 rpm speeds just suck.

[tateusmaximus]

yeah i gotta say the 17inch was pretty slow to this g5 imac. hopefully they put a g5 in the new powerbook.... but lets not start this thread again!! :D

[jefhatfield]

yeah i gotta say the 17inch was pretty slow to this g5 imac. hopefully they put a g5 in the new powerbook.... but lets not start this thread again!! :D

it's funny how each generation of processor is "way faster" than the one before...there was a huge jump, mhz for mhz, when apple went from the 604e processor machines to the G3 machines...and then the mightly G4 hit the shelves, but now people are dying to have the G5 in everything, including laptops

it won't be long though before the G5 will seem painfully slow...intel and amd move so fast that it makes us macheads feel behind all the time...when i compare speeds, i compare macs to macs as to not get disappointed...really though, so what if the pc pentium 4 is faster? what if i don't like windows xp?

...btw, i think xp is just fine and a great improvement over windows me but i prefer macs for the better user interface

[Diatribe]

Mac laptops are natoriously (spelling?) slow, apple still does not know how to put a 7200 rpm drive in them....*sigh*. Or heck....at least make it a farggin BTO option! These terrible 5400 and 4200 rpm speeds just suck.

It is spelled notoriously if you wanted an answer. :D

And yes, Apple should use 7200rpm drives but only as a BTO because I for one rather have 80/100GB 5400 than a 60GB 7200.

[ign]

>>They ship the computers with the energy saving features turned on in order to save energy. In many parts of the world, that is a far more important consideration than xbench scores.

It's also true that those who own a Mac don't have major
money problems to notice the difference in the electricity bill
if having settings set on max or low performace

I simply think that a mac set on low performance will last longer with
less problems, just like with cars, if you often keep rpms hi, your engine
will more likely have problems or upkeep to do (wear/heat).

[NusuniAdmin]

>>They ship the computers with the energy saving features turned on in order to save energy. In many parts of the world, that is a far more important consideration than xbench scores.

It's also true that those who own a Mac don't have major
money problems to notice the difference in the electricity bill
if having settings set on max or low performace

I simply think that a mac set on low performance will last longer with
less problems, just like with cars, if you often keep rpms hi, your engine
will more likely have problems or upkeep to do (wear/heat).

just a note: use the quote buton when you quote.