Lowend Mac's for Graphic Design?

[dornoforpyros]

Hey everyone, I'm in the market for my first computer(well the first one that I've owned) and I'm also a web/flash designer. My question is just how low end can I go with a Mac and still manage to get a useable machine for my work?
To get an idea of the work I'm doing check out:
http://www.jasondorn.com

Basically whatever machine I decide on I'm gonna get atleast 1 gb of ram but money is a bit of a factor.

So although I'm thinking I'd need something with a G5 chip in it but I keep getting tempted by eMacs and iBooks.

Would I be compelty SOL with one of these machines?

[PlaceofDis]

what types of progams are you going to be using? Photoshop, Dreamweaver? ect??

[dornoforpyros]

yup, Photoshop, Illustrator, Dreamweaver and flash are my toyz.

[zim]

You could use any Mac, just make sure you give yourself plenty of RAM, I would go no lower then 512MB.

[dswoodley]

agreed, an emac (as low end as it gets without buying used) with 1gb of ram would do fine

[brap]

eMac. Hell, maybe a new iBook. Lots of memory...

I use Flash (very sparingly) on this machine and it's fine. Photoshop runs without issues, as does InDesign - my new favourite toy.

Dreamweaver? Pft. Probably. Save the world; use SubEthaEdit (http://www.codingmonkeys.de/subethaedit/) instead!

[dornoforpyros]

ahh well this is certanly helpfull. I mean I've got no problem dropping the cash to max out the ram but even an iBook with 1.25 gb of ram is $1000 less than a powerbook.
THe biggest issue I can see with an iBook is the 1024 X 768 resolution, I would prefer something higher, but not for another 1000 bonez.

[mms]

If you need portability, you might consider an iBook. But if you don't, you can get the most power for your money by getting a desktop. The G5 iMacs are great computers and would serve adequately for just about any graphics work. Even the eMacs would do well with enough RAM. Caution though, since there have been rumors (unsubstantiated, but still...) of G5 eMacs that would be really sweet.

[brap]

THe biggest issue I can see with an iBook is the 1024 X 768 resolution
That's it settled then; 1.2 GHz iBook, 1.25GB memory + a nice big 17-21" CRT... Screen real estate [and true colours] whilst at home, portability for lectures. But honestly, my 12" Albook has 1024 rez, and is perfectly fine. Exposé is your friend.

Although, if the cash is really burning a hole in your pocket, you might consider a G5 iMac, as mentioned above...

[dornoforpyros]

That's it settled then; 1.2 GHz iBook, 1.25GB memory + a nice big 17-21" CRT... Screen real estate [and true colours] whilst at home, portability for lectures. But honestly, my 12" Albook has 1024 rez, and is perfectly fine. Exposé is your friend.

Although, if the cash is really burning a hole in your pocket, you might consider a G5 iMac, as mentioned above...

lol, well it's not quite that easy and I definalty don't have cash burning a hole in my pocket, hell if I did I'd get a 2.5 ghz dual g5 with 8 GB of ram and dual 30" studio displays :p

This is really just a machine to call my own and muck around on things in my free time. I've got a cruddy pee cee at work which I kinda hate but it does support 1280 X 1024 resolution.

[Jaz]

An iBook is fine, but spring for a 15" Powerbook if you can. I used one as my workhorse for 3 years and just upgraded to a new one. Bear in mind if it's for work, then it's usually tax deductable in part. Dreamweaver runs like crap on Mac OS X, even my Dual 2.5 has pauses. Bad programming, not a problem with horsepower. Get SubEthEdit though.

An iBook and a nice CRT will be great for what you do. Max out the RAM for sure. Only thing to note is that if you mirror the desktop initially to get the CRT running it will top out at 1024*768 so make sure to try and change the rez up once you are on the CRT only.

[dornoforpyros]

An iBook is fine, but spring for a 15" Powerbook if you can. I used one as my workhorse for 3 years and just upgraded to a new one. Bear in mind if it's for work, then it's usually tax deductable in part. Dreamweaver runs like crap on Mac OS X, even my Dual 2.5 has pauses. Bad programming, not a problem with horsepower. Get SubEthEdit though.

An iBook and a nice CRT will be great for what you do. Max out the RAM for sure. Only thing to note is that if you mirror the desktop initially to get the CRT running it will top out at 1024*768 so make sure to try and change the rez up once you are on the CRT only.

Ahh cool, so if I end up getting a CRT later and I mirrior the iBook to it's monitor I can set the resolution higher?? Because if I can then it solves my resolution issue. Interesting.

[Peyote]

If you are going to be doing a lot of work in Flash, I say the bigger the better. Big screens are great and all for seeing larger images closer to 100%, but Flash really needs a big screen. I use a 21" CRT at work, I forget what resolution it's at, but it's less that 1600 x 1200..probably closer to 1280 x 1024. Flash uses a LOT of big fat pallettes. For a casual user, it's ok...but if you start getting into actionscripting and need that window open as well, forget about it. I find myself constantly shuffling the pallettes around. An iBook is great and all, as long as you give yourself enough screen space when you need it. IMHO 21" is enough to get by on, but barely.

[stevehaslip]

am i right in thinking that iBooks can only mirror, not span and therefore the maximum resolution you could have on your external display would be 1024x768?
I know powerbooks can do it but i thought this was one of the differences between the two lines.

Of course there is a well known fix that enables monitor spanning and upping the res if you can't already do it.

[cluthz]

iBooks only supports mirroring, but you can do a hack (search around the forum).
I would recomend you the 20-inch iMac.
You get 1680x1050 res!!!
If you add memory youself (512x2) you'll save a lot of money.

for about $2000 you'll get:
20 inch lcd, G5 cpu, 1024mb ram, dvd-burner.

For a designer i think this wil be the best shot.

(I feel that photoshop is almost unusable on a 1024x768 screen...)

[Abstract]

I'd get the slowest iMac, but an 14" iBook would be fine as well. Seriously, you don't need a better video card for this type of work, and you can use the hack if you end up with an iBook. The iBook is a beauty. Seriously. However, you'd be giving up some performance if you went with an iBook instead of an iMac, since the iMac is at least a G5, and supports CoreImage when it comes out with Tiger.

[neut]

have you used Flash on the mac before? it runs like ****. my 17" 1Ghz PB runs it, but i get frustrated when doing heavier animation and rendering is a pain to wait for.

for me 2 monitors are a must. i can't work in Flash (or Dreamweaver) with a single monitor. im about to get a G5 for the performance nad keep my PB for live performance (a/v). a refurb G5 with some third party screens sounds about right.

a 1.5 Ghz 17" refurb might be a good buy if you want portable.


don't be tempted by a consumer machine when you are trying to be a professinal... you'll understand when you try to render that 40fps Flash anim on your iBook to check if it still running smooth; it won't be.


peace.

[vga4life]

If you're strapped for cash, you can't beat a $699 refurb 1.25 GHz emac. Add a *nice* flat 19" aperture-grille CRT that will run 1600x1200 for ~$250, an extra 1 GB dimm from transintl.com for $189, and you've got a badass dual monitor system that'll be much faster than any ibook for around $1150. The low-end G5 imac starts at $1300 and that's before you add (much needed) RAM or a second monitor.

The emac is a fine machine for this sort of work. My fiancee regularly uses our dual-head emac with 1.5 GB RAM for heavy, high-res photoshop work and it's perfect for that application.

-vga4life

[zim]

have you used Flash on the mac before? it runs like ****. my 17" 1Ghz PB runs it, but i get frustrated when doing heavier animation and rendering is a pain to wait for.

for me 2 monitors are a must. i can't work in Flash (or Dreamweaver) with a single monitor. im about to get a G5 for the performance nad keep my PB for live performance (a/v). a refurb G5 with some third party screens sounds about right.

a 1.5 Ghz 17" refurb might be a good buy if you want portable.


don't be tempted by a consumer machine when you are trying to be a professinal... you'll understand when you try to render that 40fps Flash anim on your iBook to check if it still running smooth; it won't be.


peace.

Why are you working at 40fps in Flash? 12-25 is ideal, anything more and you are seriously limiting your audience. Flash runs just fine on a G4. I do agree with you that if you are doing animation of large capacity that a faster machine would be nice and I will say that Flash MX04 runs a lot slower then Flash MX but not to the point where it is unusable.

Macromedia screwed up with MX04, I think most agree with that, but that is no reason why not to buy an iBook. I know "professionals" that have limited budgets and work very successfully on iMacs. Professionalism is not determined by what computer or how fast your processor is. The poster will be fine with an iBook, iMac or eMac.

[dornoforpyros]

Why are you working at 40fps in Flash? 12-25 is ideal, anything more and you are seriously limiting your audience. Flash runs just fine on a G4. I do agree with you that if you are doing animation of large capacity that a faster machine would be nice and I will say that Flash MX04 runs a lot slower then Flash MX but not to the point where it is unusable.

Macromedia screwed up with MX04, I think most agree with that, but that is no reason why not to buy an iBook. I know "professionals" that have limited budgets and work very successfully on iMacs. Professionalism is not determined by what computer or how fast your processor is. The poster will be fine with an iBook, iMac or eMac.

I have used Flash MX 2004 on a mac, but it was a dual processor G5 so obviosly it was pretty smokin.

The main reason I posted this is because I'm considering getting eMac because the price is right, for just over $2000(canadian) I can get essentially everything I want in a computer with out breaking the bank. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't gonna be kicking myself in 2 months for not saving the extra cash for a G5 iMac.

Then apple comes along with the speed bumped iBooks and makes my decision harder again :p

So basically right now it's a toss up between an eMac or the iBook. I just haven't decided if I need the sexy laptop or not.

[Peyote]

Professionalism is not determined by what computer or how fast your processor is.

No, Productivity is. I don't think the poster will be happy with an iBook, or an eMac. I think the 20" iMac is the best option right now, because you don't have to buy a lousy external CRT, 20" should be enough to work in Flash...plus the iMac is 38% faster just on processor speed alone, not to mention using matched RAM for 128K, faster bus speeds, etc. IMHO, the only people that should buy a notebook, are people that need a notebook. Don't buy a notebook because it seems like a good value..because everything built for a notebook is more expensive, and more likely to break, and if you just don't need to take it with you very often, there's just no point.

Plus, when apps start coming out that take advantage of the iMac's 64 bits, and you just bought a 32 bit emac or ibook just a few months prior to that, don't you think that you'd have some regrets?

The G4 is an antiquated chip, the G5 is the future. There was a time when buying a Mac meant keeping up with current technology, maybe even safeguarding a little against a Mac being outdated. The iBook has been outdated for at least a year now...why buy something that won't keep up in two years?

[solvs]

Gotta agree with vga4life about the eMac. An iBook would be cool, but with that tiny screen and slow hard drive, it will not be ideal. Especially if you don't need the portability. You can always add more RAM, bigger internal or external hard drive. The hack will work for it as well, and you can get a nice 19" CRT with a high refresh rate at a higher resolution. I would wait for the next rev though. It is about to be updated (we hope). Hopefully a nice video card upgrade now that the iMac has a G5, but since the iBook still has the 32MB Radeon, I'm not holding my breath.

[zim]

I have used Flash MX 2004 on a mac, but it was a dual processor G5 so obviosly it was pretty smokin.

The main reason I posted this is because I'm considering getting eMac because the price is right, for just over $2000(canadian) I can get essentially everything I want in a computer with out breaking the bank. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't gonna be kicking myself in 2 months for not saving the extra cash for a G5 iMac.

Then apple comes along with the speed bumped iBooks and makes my decision harder again :p

So basically right now it's a toss up between an eMac or the iBook. I just haven't decided if I need the sexy laptop or not.

Of the two, I would personally also have a hard decision to make. The eMac would give you a larger screen, which is important to a designer, yet the iBook would grant your freedom from the "studio."

Sorry, not much help only can say that I can relate to your situation. What you might want to do is take a look at how you work, are you the type to be on the go a lot? If so, then the laptop is the right direction. If not, then go with the eMac.

[zim]

No, Productivity is. I don't think the poster will be happy with an iBook, or an eMac. I think the 20" iMac is the best option right now, because you don't have to buy a lousy external CRT, 20" should be enough to work in Flash...plus the iMac is 38% faster just on processor speed alone, not to mention using matched RAM for 128K, faster bus speeds, etc. IMHO, the only people that should buy a notebook, are people that need a notebook. Don't buy a notebook because it seems like a good value..because everything built for a notebook is more expensive, and more likely to break, and if you just don't need to take it with you very often, there's just no point.

Plus, when apps start coming out that take advantage of the iMac's 64 bits, and you just bought a 32 bit emac or ibook just a few months prior to that, don't you think that you'd have some regrets?

The G4 is an antiquated chip, the G5 is the future. There was a time when buying a Mac meant keeping up with current technology, maybe even safeguarding a little against a Mac being outdated. The iBook has been outdated for at least a year now...why buy something that won't keep up in two years?

True, productivity is improved with faster technology but not necessarily made better. I know of many successful studios that work on equipment that is outdated. Yet the equipment does not prevent them from being any less productive then someone on a new G5. Work habits also contribute to the efficiency of development and although a faster computer would create more efficiency, it does not mean that the final work is produced any faster.

I think that the only time speed becomes an issue is in video editing, rendering, 3D development and complex digital imaging.

I agree with you that the poster's best option is the iMac but if they are in a budget then they should know that yes, the eMac will preform efficiently for them today, who knows what will happen in a year or two. I would assume that the eMac would just be an entry into their professional development and as they gain more work their needs will grow and change as well as their piggy bank.

-Web design does not require a G5. If it does then I know a lot of people who are in trouble.

[_bnkr612]

To lucky one$ out there who have dual G5's. I am just as happy with my 1.6 G5.

Using Photoshop, Illustrator, Flash, Dreamweaver and other various apps. I have not had a problem with what my processor runs at. I think it is shady that Apple puts so little RAM in their "Pro" series. 768MB (I have) should be the lowest, not 256MB.

But price it out and buy what fits and remember to buy something you know you will still want in three years.

With a desktop you'll have a longer shelf-life. Opposed to notebooks which get hauled around and banged up, the shelf-life is not so nice.

To each their own.

Cheers.

[matthutch]

hey well first of all as was mentioned above it is not the computer that makes the design it is the designer.

An iBook will be fine, yes a desktop such as the imacG5 or even an emac may be faster, but up until recently i have been working on an g3 400Mhz imac (was a red one ;) ). If your using the apps that one would assume you will be using in graphic design or even web design the main thing is to make sure you have ram, and lots of it. I know people in the industry (graphic designers more then web design) along with myself who work extremely well on older machine, and even more who work on ibooks. Yes if you can afford the cash and you want something portable the powerbook is the better option, for nothing more then the extended desktop (it is mighty hard working in front of a small screen for long periods - especially in photoshop or illustrator - in my opinion), however as you said it is $1000(cant remember exactly??) extra for the powerbook.

Apple updated the ibook range last night (for me here in aus it was last night) and the 14 inch ones would perform pretty well for what you would be using - and you can always get the hack so you can span the moniters. Just make sure you remember, you can never have too much ram ;)

Well welcome to the industry,

[Lancetx]

The new SP Power Mac G5 is another good alternative if you already have a usable CRT monitor around. Then you wouldn't have to worry about the lower resolution issues with the iBook.

[Peyote]

True, productivity is improved with faster technology but not necessarily made better. I know of many successful studios that work on equipment that is outdated. Yet the equipment does not prevent them from being any less productive then someone on a new G5. Work habits also contribute to the efficiency of development and although a faster computer would create more efficiency, it does not mean that the final work is produced any faster.

I think that the only time speed becomes an issue is in video editing, rendering, 3D development and complex digital imaging.

I agree with you that the poster's best option is the iMac but if they are in a budget then they should know that yes, the eMac will preform efficiently for them today, who knows what will happen in a year or two. I would assume that the eMac would just be an entry into their professional development and as they gain more work their needs will grow and change as well as their piggy bank.

-Web design does not require a G5. If it does then I know a lot of people who are in trouble.



It's not only in rendering or running programs that you benefit from a faster computer. Startup times, login times, file copying times, OS maintenance, these are all things that are sped up by a faster computer.

However my main arguement for the G5 over anyhthing with a G4, is that the G4 simply won't last. Can you honestly say that if you bought a G4 right now, that it would still keep up in 3 years, when G5 processors are around 4 Ghz at least, and programs have been written to take advantage of them? When you go to buy a computer...if you can afford it, you buy this year's model. You don't pick a model that's been outdated for over a year. Computers become outdated quick enough, especially now that the G5 is out...If I were in this guy's shoes, I wouldn't help myself have an outdated computer sooner, by investing in a processor that is already old.

When I shop for a Mac, I don't just look for what's going to be ok at running photoshop, because I know that I need to keep in mind future OS versions that will need more processing power, and applications will be written in 64-bit, which I won't be able to take advantage of unless I choose a Mac that will let me do that. In other words, I want a Mac that's going to last me and at least somewhat keep up with my changing needs....For those reasons, I wouldn't recommend a G4 to anyone that doesn't really need a laptop.

[Manzana]

Basically whatever machine I decide on I'm gonna get atleast 1 gb of ram but money is a bit of a factor.

How much does a 1GB stick cost for an ibook? 400-500? I think your best choice is still the emac for the ram you need and your budget. Plus the 7200 rpm hd would stomp all over the ibook's hd.

Certainly a G5 would be great, but not absolutely necessary right now. As it has been pointed out, people do get their work done without having the latest and greatest hardware.

The emac will last you at least three years, that is great value.

[dornoforpyros]

How much does a 1GB stick cost for an ibook? 400-500? I think your best choice is still the emac for the ram you need and your budget. Plus the 7200 rpm hd would stomp all over the ibook's hd.

Certainly a G5 would be great, but not absolutely necessary right now. As it has been pointed out, people do get their work done without having the latest and greatest hardware.

The emac will last you at least three years, that is great value.


ahh yes then perhaps the eMac is the way to go. As much as I wouldn't mind having a laptop performance definalty over rules sexiness. Besides I can always get a laptop at a later date.
Thanks for the input everyone.

[neut]

didn't realize eMacs supported multiple monitors...

*****
i bought a top of the line (almost... hey what's another 50mhz?) dual G4 450 with all the tricks for $4700 in 1996; im so glad i did. i hated my PC (slow) and the machines at school (imacs). the only good ones were the G3 towers and they were showing age. my G4 carried me till 2001. then i got a PB. :)

i still say try to invest in a nicer system now. that way it can take you through school and a little longer so you can get a new G6. ;)

*to those argueing about technology making the designer... of course it doesn't; but it can hinder and frustrate one. im glad i had a fast system when i was a begining designer. even if my work wasn't good because of the system; it was good because i had so much time to spend on project rather than waiting for my computer to do something.

**technology can also make you broke. :(

peace.

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

hey well first of all as was mentioned above it is not the computer that makes the design it is the designer.

An iBook will be fine, yes a desktop such as the imacG5 or even an emac may be faster, but up until recently i have been working on an g3 400Mhz imac (was a red one ;) ). If your using the apps that one would assume you will be using in graphic design or even web design the main thing is to make sure you have ram, and lots of it. I know people in the industry (graphic designers more then web design) along with myself who work extremely well on older machine, and even more who work on ibooks. Yes if you can afford the cash and you want something portable the powerbook is the better option, for nothing more then the extended desktop (it is mighty hard working in front of a small screen for long periods - especially in photoshop or illustrator - in my opinion), however as you said it is $1000(cant remember exactly??) extra for the powerbook.

I totally agree. My girlfriend is a designer and works daily with Photoshop, Illustrator, Indesign (and Quark) and Dreamweaver. Her workhorse is my old 14" (1024x768) 400MHz Pismo with 512MB RAM and a 40GB HD. It does its job very nice. Of course it's not superfast when adding Photoshop filters on LARGE files, but the computer waits for her more often than she has to wait for it... ;)

Any iBook will be more than good enough for a while. Take the 14" if you want a Superdrive, and the 12" if a combo drive is all you need. You'll love the portability, and for its price it's a very capable little machine... :)

Edit: Hey, dornoforpyros, I see you're leaning towards the eMac. Probably the best choice monywise, but I'd still go for the (new) 12" iBook... Once you've had a laptop for a while you'll never want to go back to a desktop...

[stevehaslip]

I totally agree. My girlfriend is a designer and works daily with Photoshop, Illustrator, Indesign (and Quark) and Dreamweaver. Her workhorse is my old 14" (1024x768) 400MHz Pismo with 512MB RAM and a 40GB HD. It does its job very nice. Of course it's not superfast when adding Photoshop filters on LARGE files, but the computer waits for her more often than she has to wait for it... ;)

Any iBook will be more than good enough for a while. Take the 14" if you want a Superdrive, and the 12" if a combo drive is all you need. You'll love the portability, and for its price it's a very capable little machine... :)

Edit: Hey, dornoforpyros, I see you're leaning towards the eMac. Probably the best choice monywise, but I'd still go for the (new) 12" iBook... Once you've had a laptop for a while you'll never want to go back to a desktop...

you will go back to a desktop! when? when you send off a proof to a printer and it comes back with the colours clashing cos your ibook wasn't properly colour calibrated. You will be out of pocket because you went for a laptop. I'm not saying that the eMac will solve you problems, ideally you'd have a dual G5 and a 30" calibrated Cinema Display or top quality CRT. But you don't need that, you might just be learning.

Serious work gets done on desktops, i have a powerbook and always find myself going back to my G5 because it whips its ass when it comes to rendering etc. Laptops are good but thats why people still use desktops.

[Blue Velvet]

...when you send off a proof to a printer and it comes back with the colours clashing cos your ibook wasn't properly colour calibrated..

Proofs are the things that come BACK from the printer, if you or the job can afford them. Chromalins, pull-downs etc.

[cluthz]

didn't realize eMacs supported multiple monitors...

*****
i bought a top of the line (almost... hey what's another 50mhz?) dual G4 450 with all the tricks for $4700 in 1996; im so glad i did. i hated my PC (slow) and the machines at school (imacs). the only good ones were the G3 towers and they were showing age. my G4 carried me till 2001. then i got a PB. :)


Funny,
I bought i bought a G3/266 MT December 1997, I was then the top of the apple line, and it costed over $3500.
The dual 450 G4 wasn't introduced before summer 2000 (I bought a g4 400 then).. Wow, your $4700 G4 lasted for a half year.

And, the emacs doesn't support two monitors, but you can use the ibook screen spanning hack.

[kirk26]

Hey everyone, I'm in the market for my first computer(well the first one that I've owned) and I'm also a web/flash designer. My question is just how low end can I go with a Mac and still manage to get a useable machine for my work?
To get an idea of the work I'm doing check out:
http://www.jasondorn.com

Basically whatever machine I decide on I'm gonna get atleast 1 gb of ram but money is a bit of a factor.

So although I'm thinking I'd need something with a G5 chip in it but I keep getting tempted by eMacs and iBooks.

Would I be compelty SOL with one of these machines?

Yes, any current iBook or PowerBook can do all what you need.

[dornoforpyros]

you will go back to a desktop! when? when you send off a proof to a printer and it comes back with the colours clashing cos your ibook wasn't properly colour calibrated. You will be out of pocket because you went for a laptop. I'm not saying that the eMac will solve you problems, ideally you'd have a dual G5 and a 30" calibrated Cinema Display or top quality CRT. But you don't need that, you might just be learning.

Serious work gets done on desktops, i have a powerbook and always find myself going back to my G5 because it whips its ass when it comes to rendering etc. Laptops are good but thats why people still use desktops.


well considering 1% of what I do is print and the other 99% is web based that's not really a problem for me. Plus I have a desktop pee cee at work for my actually work. Whatever machine I end up buying will be for me at home and although I'd obviosly do some work at home it wouldn't be my work horse so to speak.

[combatcolin]

Right, dead simple

1ST Buy a refurb G5, or a previous gen G5 or a late model G4.

2ND Buy the BIGGEST monitor you can afford .

3RD Make sure you have at least 512mb to make life easy for yourself.

And finally...

4TH Next year buy the biggest Hard drive you can afford.

[Col127]

to sport a completely different opinion, you would get by just fine on a g4 machine. i've got a g4 450 mhz dual processor and it's been running for me just fine. i bought it in april 2001 for about $3200 cdn. as of late, i've seen them go for about $500 on ebay.ca. that sucks about technology :P

i'm a graphic design student, so i use programs like photoshop, illustrator, indesign, quark, acrobat, dreamweaver and flash and i've never felt my mac to be slow. i do work with large files too. the only time i wished i had a faster mac was rendering video, in after effects or premiere. but if you're not going to ever get into video, don't worry about it. granted, i have 896 mb of ram.

sure, a g5 tower would be nice, and it would total wipe the floor with an old g4, it really depends on your budget. it seemed to me that you were looking for the cheapeast mac that would suit your needs. if they aren't going to change, then i say find a g4. that'll be the most cost efficient solution. if you have other interests (like video for example) that you may pursue in the future, then go for a g5 if you can afford it.

i did just place an order for a dual 2.0 g5, but that's because i want to get into video. if i didn't, i would be using this g4 for years to come. i know a lot of professionals that still work with older g4s in os 9!

hope that helps.

[Jimong5]

flash runs great on a Dual 867 G4 just fine, and for a while, I had a friend running it fine on an iMac (600 G3, blue Dalmatian) In short, I think any current mac would be good.

As for MX vs 2004, I like 2004 more, because I felt MX had several flaws. examples: the palette had some quirks, It screwed up movies with long soundtracks at low bitrates too, and MX defaulted at a stupid zoom to fill the screen, rather than 100%, which I used most of the time to start anyway. Ill take a slowdown vs a quirky app anyday.

[stevehaslip]

Proofs are the things that come BACK from the printer, if you or the job can afford them. Chromalins, pull-downs etc.

oops my bad! thanks for correcting me, but my point still stands that you should buy as much computer as you can afford. Spend now and make it last, i will use my G5 for another 3 more (or so) years and i've had it for 1 already. I worked my arse of for my computer, spent more than i originally thought but it will last me for ages. I would seriously consider a low end/refurb G5 or G4.

[neut]

Funny,
I bought i bought a G3/266 MT December 1997, I was then the top of the apple line, and it costed over $3500.
The dual 450 G4 wasn't introduced before summer 2000 (I bought a g4 400 then).. Wow, your $4700 G4 lasted for a half year.

And, the emacs doesn't support two monitors, but you can use the ibook screen spanning hack.

:)

i don't know what i was thinking with those dates... your right. i bought my 450 shortly after release 2000/2001. it lasted until the summer of 03. about 3.5 years. not bad. i could have kept using it much longer but i was tempted by the portability of the PB (tired of carrying my G4 to and from gigs).

i know about the hack, but i didn't realize it worked on more than the ibook. too bad my friends 867 imac isn't supported...


peace.

[slooksterPSV]

One site: http://www.baucomcomputers.com you could have a computer with only 256MB of RAM and those programs would run fine, maybe not simultaneously... well... it did run alright on a G3 with 256MB of RAM. I did those sorts of things in GD.

I think this would work just perfect for you if you don't need a brand new one: iMac/600 (Graphite or Snow) (256/40GB/CDRW/56k/FW/usb) . . . . .. . . $465

Be sure that if you do get a mac from apple you check out the refurb section. they have emacs for like $529 or that.

[solvs]

i know about the hack, but i didn't realize it worked on more than the ibook. too bad my friends 867 imac isn't supported...
867 MHz iMac? Do you mean the 800MHz G4 with the GF4MX card? Because it should work on that. Any G4 iMac, eMac, or iBook with a Radeon chip (though preferably with a 32MB chip). The only 867MHz G4s were the PowerMac and original 12" PowerBook, both of which have native spanning.

[neut]

867 MHz iMac? Do you mean the 800MHz G4 with the GF4MX card? The only 867MHz G4s were the PowerMac and original 12" PowerBook, both of which have native spanning.
:rolleyes:

..and the 867 was also released in the Ti PB; i know, i owned one. yeah, that's what i meant (800Mhz iMac).

Do you mean the 800MHz G4 with the GF4MX card? Because it should work on that. Any G4 iMac, eMac, or iBook with a Radeon chip (though preferably with a 32MB chip).

? Have you read the supported machines list ?

This iMac is not supported. Go ahead...try installing it. :)


peace.