Doom 3 for Mac announced

[keysersoze]

From MacMinute:

"Aspyr Media announced today that it will be publishing a Mac version of Doom 3, the critically acclaimed first-person shooter. "Doom 3's dramatic storyline, pulse-pounding action, and incredible graphics, combine to produce the most frightening and gripping gaming experience ever created. Doom 3 utilizes id Software's revolutionary new 3D graphics engine to create disturbingly realistic graphics, with never before seen detail and real-time lighting. Players can fight the forces of evil as a lone marine or battle other marines in team or deathmatch-based multiplayer modes." The game, which is expected in February 2005, can be pre-ordered now for US$49.99. "

The tech specs can be found here:
http://www.aspyr.com/noframes.php/games.php/mac/d3/

[Converted2Truth]

Well that's good... at least we know it's comming now!

And it's a good thing that Aspyr didn't lie about it running on a G4 like they do about lots of other games. Sure seems like a long time for a port though... guess they're busy working on Men of Valor/Sims2 for the time being.

[apple_iBoy]

Wow... seems like they're really going to be selling to a limited audience... not just the subset of home computer users on Apple, but the subset of those home computer users on Apple who also are lucky enough to have a G5 laying around. Was kind of hoping this title would play on the last revisions of the MDD dual G4 Power Macs.

[keysersoze]

Wow... seems like they're really going to be selling to a limited audience... not just the subset of home computer users on Apple, but the subset of those home computer users on Apple who also are lucky enough to have a G5 laying around. Was kind of hoping this title would play on the last revisions of the MDD dual G4 Power Macs.

It's a little strange that the requirements include a 1.5GHz G5 when no 1.5GHz G5 exists.

[Converted2Truth]

TRUE... that is a limited audience. According to the specs, a new imac qualifies. I think that's BS, and that a dual 1.42 G5 w/9800pro would spank the thong off a new imac...

They do say that system requirements may change...

[socamx]

Maybe they are adding 64bit code...

[mowogg]

It's a little strange that the requirements include a 1.5GHz G5 when no 1.5GHz G5 exists.

They also require 10.3.6 when that doesn't exist yet either. I think the 1.5 G5 may be a benchmark and dual G4 1.33s might be equivalent.

Either way, those are some hefty specs. :)

[Dont Hurt Me]

Specs are right, this game needs muscle to run and look well and remember those stated are minimum specs meaning more is better or real world if you will.

[vraxtus]

It's about damn time!

And this only goes to prove to all those that were expecting it to run on their G4 PBs... sorry! But hopefully by then you all may have your G5 PBs by Macworld SF :o

[Poff]

A limited audience indeed. I'm guessing it might be a push for some people to actually upgrade their Mac.

As long as it can be played on the G5 iMacs, it will eventually reach a lot of people. (Although the performance might not be the greatest)

- Mac OS X 10.3.6 or later
- PowerPC G5 1.5 GHz or faster
- 384MB RAM (512MB recommended)
- 2.2 GB free disk space
- ATI Radeon 8500/nVidia GeForce 3 or better
- 32MB of Video Ram (VRAM)
- DVD drive required to install and play

[Converted2Truth]

Maybe they are adding 64bit code...
A 64-bit G5 computer allows for

More memory addressing
Increased floating point precision
and in some instances, two 32-bit ops per clock cycle.

I really don't understand what they could DO to make it 64 bit. They do not need MORE precise collision detection, and a G4 addresses enough memory... and as far as i know, the G5 automatically preforms two ops when it can. So I don't think they're adding 64-bit code.

I would also like to point out that the G5 is more sudo-64bit than actually 64bit. The reason it's compatible with 32bit code is because it allocates memory same as before (by default) and does everything exactly the same as before (by default), except perhaps grabbing two 32bit memory addresses simultaneously etc... I know alot of you guys use G5s, and i know alot of professors that have xserve racks, G5 towers, etc... Only some of my chemistry professors actually use 64bit memory addressing and preform operations on 64 bit numbers. And the only reason they do, is because they need extreme precision.

I guess what i'm saying is that a G4 has the architecture to run doom3. Now it just comes down to what one's definition of 'run' means.

But as far as writing specific 64bit code, i hightly doubt they need it's benifits. They would be better off using altivec technology (g4 & g5 compatible). If they were to use that, perhaps G4's would run the game. Unfortunately, most vector ops are performed on the GPU these days, which offloads the CPU anyway... so i'm going nowhere and blabbering... cheers...

[vraxtus]

I would also like to point out that the G5 is more sudo-64bit than actually 64bit.

FYI it's spelled "psuedo"

On the other side I think we are all aware that a G4 does have the necessary architecture to run D3, however it may have a G5 requirement due to the much higher bus rates present on G5 machines. Since the fastest G4 has a 167 mhz bus, compared to the 1.25 ghz on the dual, this kind of bottlenecking will affect performance highly, IMO.

[Converted2Truth]

FYI it's spelled "psuedo"


sorry, spend too much time in the terminal lately. :eek: (sUPER uSER do)

[keysersoze]

FYI it's spelled "psuedo"



Actually, it's spelled 'pseudo'

:D

[Dont Hurt Me]

Im just glad that whoever was doing it can now say so, its good news but if they are saying Feb you might as well plan late March. so much for a christmas release.
side note this may give apple time to bump up imacs video? maybe? they might as well just say powermac required to play game as intended to be played. yeah it will scare the crap out of you. :cool:

[tom.96]

I thought the min spec for the PC graphics card was 64mb? How come its lower on the Mac? It does not make sense as all G5s to my knowledge have 64mb cards in them (excluding the education only imac G5). :confused:

[benpatient]

ouch. well at least they didn't say "6800 DDL required"

[sebaz]

Feb 2005...man wait that long for a game that takes 2 weeks to beat, and then will collect dust, forever and ever next to your Carmen San Diego Cds. The lack of a worthy multiplayer options also diminish any long last replay value. I played it on my PC, beat it in 2 weeks, at a normal pace. Will I want to replay it in my powermac g5 2.0 with a 64mb video card? Nope.

Oh well, Im just going to continue to use my G5 for creation, and my pc for gaming.

To everyone that has been waiting for this game, let me tell you some things. First, the game is repetitive. Secondly, is way too easy (even the final can beat in less that 2 minutes). Thirdly, prepare for your machines to be taxed, dont expect alot if you have less than 128mb in your GPU. Finally, the game is good, is it worth waiting like half a year for it, well in my view no. But hey to each his own.

[applekid]

It's a little strange that the requirements include a 1.5GHz G5 when no 1.5GHz G5 exists.

They're only preliminary. Besides, it's probably only a typo.

I suspect it can go lower as in bring in the last of the MDD G4s to the picture.

[ScottDodson]

Doom 3...finally for the mac....

I have to change my underwear.....

P.S.
Carmen San Diego NEVER gets dust time on my desk!!!

[benpatient]

the problem is that they say specifically that it needs a G5...which is weird because several of the last dual G4s are faster than any of the single processor G5s, especially if they have a 9800 in them, and especially compared to the new iMac.

a dual MDD G4 with a 128mb 9800 is easily going to smoke a new 1.6 iMac at 3d games...no question.

which makes me think that there may be something to the "needs the 64-bit" claims going around. we know that G5s handle certain kinds of math that x86 processors are good at MUCH better than G4s and earlier PPCs did...maybe they aren't doing the usual work-arounds for Doom 3 because they want to maintain some level of performance, and so the old 32 bit PPCs are out...

which would REALLY narrow the potential base of this release...because honestly a 64mb 5200 card in a SP 1.6 iMac is NOT going to cut it above 640x480.

[hjhhjh]

They also require 10.3.6 when that doesn't exist yet either. I think the 1.5 G5 may be a benchmark and dual G4 1.33s might be equivalent.

Either way, those are some hefty specs. :)

it will run on a g4 processor believe me!

those number are recoendations, doom 3 runs on my friends 2.8 ghz p4, with a 32 mb intel vid card and 256 mb ram farely well, note the requirments r much higher for all but CPU

a dual 1.7 ghz g4 powermac kicks the **** out fo any imac g5 btw, so note it will run

the linux version is an example of this

only requires 50% less than what it says on the same hardware, it allows u to run it, but doesnt recomend it because it may run less than 20 fps

[vraxtus]

Actually, it's spelled 'pseudo'

:D


D'oh! :D

Anyhow,

EVERYONE STOP INSISTING THAT IT WILL "RUN" ON A LOWER END MACHINE!!!!!!!!!

Aspyr has TOLD us that it will run MINIMALLY on a G5. Trust me when I say that min specs are hardly performance based; I've barely met the specs for older games on my older computers, and they've all ran like total ass. I would NOT expect this game to run on a G4 "well" at all.

[yellow]

[removed]

[vraxtus]

it will run on a g4 processor believe me!

those number are recoendations, doom 3 runs on my friends 2.8 ghz p4, with a 32 mb intel vid card and 256 mb ram farely well, note the requirments r much higher for all but CPU

a dual 1.7 ghz g4 powermac kicks the **** out fo any imac g5 btw, so note it will run

the linux version is an example of this

only requires 50% less than what it says on the same hardware, it allows u to run it, but doesnt recomend it because it may run less than 20 fps


You need to stop spreading these lies before you get banned.

[fowler.]

How about you guys wait until it's out before you start assuming what it will and won't run on?

[Hlau]

ar... Doom III, I've stopped caring for this game for a while now, great lighting yes, but it's just a so so game. Is there any chance for Half-Life 2? Any at all within the next ten years?

[mattmack]

I thought the min spec for the PC graphics card was 64mb? How come its lower on the Mac? It does not make sense as all G5s to my knowledge have 64mb cards in them (excluding the education only imac G5). :confused:Both cards they spec are 64 mb card at least. I belive the Geforce 3 was a 128 card and the 8500 is a 64 mb card

[ZildjianKX]

those number are recoendations, doom 3 runs on my friends 2.8 ghz p4, with a 32 mb intel vid card and 256 mb ram farely well, note the requirments r much higher for all but CPU

Well, this is where we get into arguments over what mac gamers and PC gamers feel are exceptable. I have a 2.8 GHz P4 w/ HT and a 128 MB Radeon 8500 Pro and Doom 3 runs like crap to me...

[hjhhjh]

Well, this is where we get into arguments over what mac gamers and PC gamers feel are exceptable. I have a 2.8 GHz P4 w/ HT and a 128 MB Radeon 8500 Pro and Doom 3 runs like crap to me...

doom 3 has horrible eficiancy

its requirments are much to high for a game in its league

half life 2 requires a mere 700 mhz, and look at it

[bousozoku]

ar... Doom III, I've stopped caring for this game for a while now, great lighting yes, but it's just a so so game. Is there any chance for Half-Life 2? Any at all within the next ten years?

I'm more interested in what other games will be produced using the Doom III engine. Quake III was fun but limited. Games that were created on top of the engine were much better.

[Converted2Truth]

doom 3 has horrible eficiancy

its requirments are much to high for a game in its league

half life 2 requires a mere 700 mhz, and look at it
Doom3 scales very well! And it's playable on almost any recent system (my frield plays it on a 1.8 P4) that has a nvidia/ati (not IGP/or intel crap) chipset, but you must be willing to sacrafice the features for playability.

Doom 3 scales well because when the features are all turned off, the game really isn't doing much. Turn up the features though, and you'll find the cpu is processing data for a larger screen size, the gpu is calculating 4x as much, etc etc etc.

Doom 3 has impressed everyone. Sure a couple of you who have shiity systems will say that you were severely dissapointed.. but anyone with the hardware, and the self-control to turn off those features that turn it in to a slideshow, will be impressed. This game scares me so bad that i can only play it for about 30minutes a week. I don't know if i'll ever have the time/balls to make it all the way through... But hey, my excuse is that most of you who have played it haven't done so with 5.1 dole-bie headphones with the lights off @ 1600x1200 2xfsaa :D

[MacsRgr8]

Just a note on the specs:

PC requirements:

Pentium® IV 1.5 GHz or Athlon® XP 1500+ processor or higher
384MB RAM
8x Speed CD-ROM drive
2.2GB

SUPPORTED CHIPSETS:
ATI® Radeon(tm) 8500
ATI® Radeon(tm) 9000
ATI® Radeon(tm) 9200
ATI® Radeon(tm) 9500
ATI® Radeon(tm) 9600
ATI® Radeon(tm) 9700
ATI® Radeon(tm) 9800
All nVidia® GeForce(tm) 3/Ti series
All nVidia® GeForce(tm) 4MX series
All nVidia® GeForce(tm) 4/Ti series
All nVidia® GeForce(tm) FX series
nVidia® GeForce(tm) 6800

Mac Requirements:

• Mac OS X 10.3.6 or later
• PowerPC G5 1.5 GHz or faster
• 384MB RAM (512MB recommended)
• 2.2 GB free disk space
• ATI Radeon 8500/nVidia GeForce 3 or better
• 32MB of Video Ram (VRAM)
• DVD drive required to install and play

Don't they look really similar????
I mean P4 1.5 GHz, Athlon® XP 1500+ or 1.5 GHz G5??
Both 384 MB RAM
Both Radeon 8500 or GeForce 3???
Which G5 supports a Radeon 8500 or GeForce 3???

Come on.
They simply should have stated G5 with 384 MB RAM.
Is the GeForce 5200 supported or not?
Nothing on SMP support??
That amazes me.

[Little Endian]

Does anyone know if the PC version of Doom 3 supports SMP and to what extent? Anyone know of benchmarks comparing Doom 3 performance to something like an Opteron 148 vs. Opeteron 242 system. Knowing how the game performs on the Opteron could give us good indication of how it may perform on G5 single vs. Dual. Benchmarks of Athlon MP vs. XP systems of Doom 3 performance would be nice too so one could estimate how it would perform on G4 MP systems if it were supported.

Actually after some checking it would appear that the PC version of Doom 3 does not support SMP however John Carmack himself has stated in the Past that Doom 3 would have SMP support like Quake III did. Hopefully the Macintosh Version will support SMP and or will offered as a Patch for the PC version as well seeing how big Hyperthreading is and how the industry is moving towards Dual Core processors. Even if the mac version does not have extensive SMP support I can imagine that at least the Audio should be able to run on the second proccessor and using a Dual Processor Power Mac will at least allow Doom 3 to hog a single proccessor to itself while the other runs background proccesses.

[Anarchy99]

It's a little strange that the requirements include a 1.5GHz G5 when no 1.5GHz G5 exists.
maybe they put 1.5 ghz to make people who are stuck with a 1.6 that there not only meeting the requirements but above them slightly
and my opinion with a high end g4 and gfx card it will most likely run
you can usually use a little crapier hardware with aspyr's games than the requirements say but if it does dont count on anything above medium settings or probably low settings for that matter

[benpatient]

by the way, HL2 will be playable world wide at 12 midnight Pacific time on Tuesday November 16th. Steam will probably crash at exactly 12:01 Pacific time, but we'll see!

Even if you go and buy it in a store and they, for some stupid reason, decide to let you buy it before 12 midnight Pacific time, it won't work until midnight, because it has to be activated online via a steam account.

How 'bout them apples, BestBuy workers?

ha.

anyway, back to with wishful doom 3 thinking!

You guys are going to be so dissapointed... :(

[jared_kipe]

TRUE... that is a limited audience. According to the specs, a new imac qualifies. I think that's BS, and that a dual 1.42 G5 w/9800pro would spank the thong off a new imac...

They do say that system requirements may change...

Wasn't that one of apple's selling points for the iMac G5?

[benpatient]

yes, it was.

but you're forgetting 3 important words.

reality. distortion. field.

[Dont Hurt Me]

Does anyone know if the PC version of Doom 3 supports SMP and to what extent? Anyone know of benchmarks comparing Doom 3 performance to something like an Opteron 148 vs. Opeteron 242 system. Knowing how the game performs on the Opteron could give us good indication of how it may perform on G5 single vs. Dual. Benchmarks of Athlon MP vs. XP systems of Doom 3 performance would be nice too so one could estimate how it would perform on G4 MP systems if it were supported.

Actually after some checking it would appear that the PC version of Doom 3 does not support SMP however John Carmack himself has stated in the Past that Doom 3 would have SMP support like Quake III did. Hopefully the Macintosh Version will support SMP and or will offered as a Patch for the PC version as well seeing how big Hyperthreading is and how the industry is moving towards Dual Core processors. Even if the mac version does not have extensive SMP support I can imagine that at least the Audio should be able to run on the second proccessor and using a Dual Processor Power Mac will at least allow Doom 3 to hog a single proccessor to itself while the other runs background proccesses.
how this for a Benchmark.TimeDemo1 70 frames @ 1024 x768 or 55fps @1280x 1024. high detail everything on including my antivirus stuff no AA. Real world stuff . thats on a AMD 3500+ athlon 64 with 6800GT card and a gig of ram. Guess i could get a little higher if i wanted to mess with it but why bother. No need for SMP in the PC world.

[MacsRgr8]

how this for a Benchmark.TimeDemo1 70 frames @ 1024 x768 or 55fps @1280x 1024. high detail everything on including my antivirus stuff no AA. Real world stuff . thats on a AMD 3500+ athlon 64 with 6800GT card and a gig of ram. Guess i could get a little higher if i wanted to mess with it but why bother. No need for SMP in the PC world.

True.
But what of all those Dual > 1 GHz G4s out there....
Doom 3 PC requirements are low enough for any "pretty new" PC to be able to play it.
Doom 3 Mac requirements are so high that hardly anyone can play it. I'm luck enough to play it on my PC now, and also have a Dual G5.
But MOST home Mac users out there must have a G4. Most Mac gamers (a bit of a contradiction in terms) probably own a > 1 GHz G4 Dual with a decent grfx card like a GeForce 4 Ti or Radeon 9700 or 9800.
Are all those people really going to be left out?
Especially as these guys have better gaming Macs than the iMac G5 owners... :rolleyes:

[supergod]

I'm fairly interested to see how this game runs on my powermac. I've got the 1.6ghz ugraded to 1 gig RAM with the Radeon 9600, overclocked with software 25% of course. I haven't really done any gaming: I'm not so much into Unreal 04 although I did really like the demo when I got it able to run, but I really want to play this game if just for the atmosphere and graphics. No way I'd buy this thing... They better get a demo out.

[benpatient]

supergod, why are you bothering with an OC if you don't play games, if I may ask?

it isn't really going to help you with much else...

[vraxtus]

I'm fairly interested to see how this game runs on my powermac. I've got the 1.6ghz ugraded to 1 gig RAM with the Radeon 9600, overclocked with software 25% of course. I haven't really done any gaming: I'm not so much into Unreal 04 although I did really like the demo when I got it able to run, but I really want to play this game if just for the atmosphere and graphics. No way I'd buy this thing... They better get a demo out.

I really would NOT OC it THAT high... my 9800 artifacts at about 10% and though I know the reports say that the 9600 is capable of higher OCs, it really will take its toll on your hardware.

[chanoc]

Too bad it takes a high-end g5 to run it though. :(

[Anarchy99]

im planning on getting the dual 1.8 with the 9600 bto option around Christmas but how will doom3 run for it

[mattmack]

im planning on getting the dual 1.8 with the 9600 bto option around Christmas but how will doom3 run for itIf you are getting it to play games and regular tasks why not get the single 1.8. The dual won't help with Doom and unless you are doing any heavy processing the second processor won't do much for you as far as performance goes.
On another note I have a rev b dual 1.8 with a 9800 in it and hopefully will be able to play it well

[Abstract]

FYI it's spelled "psuedo"


You just made me spit out my food! :p :D

[Little Endian]

how this for a Benchmark.TimeDemo1 70 frames @ 1024 x768 or 55fps @1280x 1024. high detail everything on including my antivirus stuff no AA. Real world stuff . thats on a AMD 3500+ athlon 64 with 6800GT card and a gig of ram. Guess i could get a little higher if i wanted to mess with it but why bother. No need for SMP in the PC world.


SMP is a neccesity in my opinon as it does matter on an Intel Chip with Hyperthreading and it will matter with Dual Core Chips which both AMD and Intel Have planned to ship next year. SMP does matter more on the mac though since many users theoretically have the power with MP G4 systems and the Mac is much better at highlighting the speed increase of SMP enabled softaware as Mac OSX is optimized for MP much better than any version of Windows. I am pretty confident that once the Geforce 6800 series drivers are mature enough on the mac and with 2Ghz-2.5Ghz of PowerPC 970Fx should hold it's own against an AMD 64 bit chip clocked at 2.2-2.6GhZ.

[MacsRgr8]

I am pretty confident that once the Geforce 6800 series drivers are mature enough on the mac and with 2Ghz-2.5Ghz of PowerPC 970Fx should hold it's own against an AMD 64 bit chip clocked at 2.2-2.6GhZ.

That's part of a huge problem: Drivers for the nVidia cards for Mac OS X.
Apple makes them themselves. No fancy nVidia drivers, demos and utilz for their cards for the Mac, like ATi does.
I'm pretty sure the GeForce 6800 should even outperform the X800 XT once that card comes to the Mac because of the GeForce's better OpenGL performance (on PCs). But.... but.... Apple has to make the drivers themselves. IMHO Apple will put more effort in CoreImage optimization than OpenGL gaming performance.
ATi will get the X800 to be Mac's best gaming card.

Still, I ordered the 6800 Ultra (ages ago... still haven't got it) and am very, very anxious....
I am going to test my Mac vs. my PC (gotta wait for the test software anyway... Doom 3):

Mac:
Dual 1.8 GHz G5 (Rev A)
1.5 GB RAM
nVidia GeForce 6800 Ultra

PC:
P4 3.6 GHz
1.0 GB RAM
ATi X800 XT (PCI Express)

I just gotta know... ;)

[Ninja_Turtle]

ar... Doom III, I've stopped caring for this game for a while now, great lighting yes, but it's just a so so game. Is there any chance for Half-Life 2? Any at all within the next ten years?

you're too optomistic...id say within the next twenty years
:-P :-D

[Dont Hurt Me]

Sorry about that, its a no contest for a 3.6 P4 vs a dual G5 1.8 MacsRgr8.

[MacsRgr8]

My prediction too.

But I would like to know how they actually compare. This game is an OpenGL game, running better on a GeForce 6800 than on a Radeon X800 on a PC.
IMHO this is THE chance for a "high profile game" to do well on a Mac.
So, no DirectX port, and no underpowered grfx card....
No real excuses this time why Doom 3 should not run well on my G5. (getting ready to be disappointed... ;) )

[johnnyjibbs]

Don't know where I've been for the last few days. I've only just seen this annoucment! Still, I'm no big PC games player (consoles only) and I kind of had a feeling it wouldn't run too well on my 1GHz 12" PB G4.. ;)

Still, it seems strange that the CPU requirements are so high yet the GPU requirements are relatively low (only 32MB VRAM required, even my nVidia 5200 GO would be ok). Forgive me if this has already been discussed to death but this suggests to me that they're moving a lot of the GPU stuff to the CPU for some strange reason.

It would be strange if a dual 1.42GHz G4 with a top-of-the-line graphics card could not trump an iMac G5 1.6GHz with the 5200, even though, according to the specs, the former would not run the game and the latter would.

Oh well, since it's not likely to ever be released on GameCube, I'll probably just have to get an Xbox or PS2 - they're pretty cheap these days.. :p

[Santaduck]

Glenda Adams of Aspyr addresses the G5 issue at IMG forums here:
http://www.insidemacgames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=186572&highlight=&sid=32e93eb8e1a0b9196d8721f9c5f2b3c2#186572
Basically they're not commited to locking out the G5 at this point in time, it's just a ballpark... and better to start high, and recede than the other way around. Remember they rescinded their cpu clockspeed check in the first BF1942 patch too...


Also interesting are relevant comments by Ryan Gordon, the coder for the mac port of Unreal Tournament 2004, regarding how games could be faster if they left the G3, as well as the G4 behind:
http://www.macologist.org/viewtopic.php?t=607

[9hundred]

MACS ARE NOT FOR GAMES....................................

ibox will soon be released to address the apple gaming problem.

[Anarchy99]

MACS ARE NOT FOR GAMES
why do people say macs aren't for games there are really good fun games that are for mac and we dont get the 100,000 crap games for pc we also get games later than pcs but there are some improvements usually bug fixes but sometimes upping the graphics like when they redid the textures on worms 3 ect.
you know that happens in the console world also
the only difference is people realize getting something 1st isn't always better like with the GTA double pack way improved graphics and soundtrack feature ect. for xbox compared to the ps2
if this happened on pc and mac instead of mentioning that we got a game that in its own way is better than the pc counterpart (less bugs or crashing ect.)you would say it sucks cause i had to wait a extra year