PDA

View Full Version : The changing face of Web design


MacBytes
Nov 28, 2004, 01:11 PM
Category: Reviews
Link: The changing face of Web design (http://www.macbytes.com/link.php?sid=20041128141142)
Posted on MacBytes.com (http://www.macbytes.com)

Approved by Mudbug

chanoc
Nov 28, 2004, 11:44 PM
The average user wants a WYSIWYG for writing HTML code? :rolleyes:

Now I can understand for PHP, I recently added a PHP guestbook to my Web site, see below, and it was all done in a GUI without having to do any PHP coding. Despite all that, I still want to learn PHP and customize everything!

wrldwzrd89
Nov 29, 2004, 04:23 AM
The average user wants a WYSIWYG for writing HTML code? :rolleyes:

Now I can understand for PHP, I recently added a PHP guestbook to my Web site, see below, and it was all done in a GUI without having to do any PHP coding. Despite all that, I still want to learn PHP and customize everything!
Unlike you, I hand-code everything - HTML, JSP, etc. I would never pay for a WYSIWYG editor because I don't need one. I liked the part of the article that mentioned content management systems - you'd be surprised at just how widely those things are used now.

JLS
Nov 29, 2004, 05:54 AM
Unlike you, I hand-code everything - HTML, JSP, etc. I would never pay for a WYSIWYG editor because I don't need one. I liked the part of the article that mentioned content management systems - you'd be surprised at just how widely those things are used now.

Hand code all your HTML? Iím surprised youíre using a computer at all, and not doing paintings on a wall in a cave.

WYSIWYG is an important step forward, it is a tool to maximize the use of your time, by saying you don't use it is not doing you any favors in more ways than one.

I often come across arrogant people who think they are clever because they code their own html, in fact it is an admission of stupidity for not using the most efficient tools around them.

edit: And nobody is saying that anyone should pay for one.. there are hundreds of free editors around.

asif786
Nov 29, 2004, 06:49 AM
i think this is one topic that is fairly controversial with web designers - some prefer hand coding, and fair enough - at the end of the day that's how you get the most efficient coding.

personally, i use a bit of both, but technologies like these do in fact worry me - if every tom dick and harry can design a good looking website, where's the future for web designers?

something to think about.

/asif

brap
Nov 29, 2004, 07:00 AM
Hand code all your HTML? Iím surprised youíre using a computer at all, and not doing paintings on a wall in a cave.
Ooh, harsh.
WYSIWYG is an important step forward, it is a tool to maximize the use of your time, by saying you don't use it is not doing you any favors in more ways than one.

I often come across arrogant people who think they are clever because they code their own html, in fact it is an admission of stupidity for not using the most efficient tools around them.
WYSIWYG has it's limitaitons, though. Very few of them write valid, readable, reusable code without lots and lots of hand-tweaking.

They will be an important step forward, but when they're good enough. The thing is, each to his own. I've personally had a look at the new Dreamweaver, and found it bloody awful to use - my productivity is increased 5-fold writing code and refreshing firefox - because I don't know how to use WYSIWYG - I never have. It's just personal preference, really, and the time taken to learn a whole new way of doing things isn't well spent.

When the learning curve is shallower, then maybe it'll become worthwhile.

edit:
but technologies like these do in fact worry me - if every tom dick and harry can design a good looking website, where's the future for web designers?I had this very same argument given to me years back by my assesor, when I did a Microsoft Visual Studio course (haha, back in the day). He used the example of complex mechanical adding machines - skilled to operate, but when they became obsolete... poof. There goes an entire job market.

wrldwzrd89
Nov 29, 2004, 11:48 AM
Hand code all your HTML? Iím surprised youíre using a computer at all, and not doing paintings on a wall in a cave.

WYSIWYG is an important step forward, it is a tool to maximize the use of your time, by saying you don't use it is not doing you any favors in more ways than one.

I often come across arrogant people who think they are clever because they code their own html, in fact it is an admission of stupidity for not using the most efficient tools around them.

edit: And nobody is saying that anyone should pay for one.. there are hundreds of free editors around.
For some parts of Web design, a WYSIWYG tool is handy (for example, complex tables not used for formatting purposes). For everything else, though, you're much more likely to get well-formed HTML that follows the rules if you write it yourself, at least for right now. When WYSIWYG tools become capable of outputting XHTML and CSS that validates 99% of the time is when I'll use one of these tools for most design work.

kettle
Nov 29, 2004, 11:58 AM
Dreamweaver is not amazing because of its WYSIWYG abilities.

Dreamweaver is a very useful tool for anyone who hand codes.

I don't see the point of the WYSIWYG, it rarely works well enough to render valid code correctly.

Hand coding in Dreamweaver using text only document windows and then surround yourself with browsers, virtual machines and pc computers to test stuff on.

That's the only true WYSIWYG that Dreamweaver will do.

JLS
Nov 29, 2004, 01:47 PM
..the time taken to learn a whole new way of doing things isn't well spent...

LOL.. well Apple better hope that everyone isn't like that.. no more switchers :p

I agree that WYSIWYG is not a lone solution to web design, you can't write PHP WYSISYG style.. lol. But there are definite advantages that almost every designer could utilize.


btw.. good to see somebody local. I went to Canterbury college. :)

brap
Nov 29, 2004, 01:54 PM
LOL.. well Apple better hope that everyone isn't like that.. no more switchers :p
Context, context, context! I'm openminded, except when there is no net gain. Besides, the learning curve on my iBook was smooo-oooooth. Heh...
btw.. good to see somebody local. I went to Canterbury college. :)
I didn't... I went to college where there were things to do :)
You moved away? Don't blame you, Canterbury is dead as the proverbial doornail. For Medieval architectural history, though, I can't go wrong :rolleyes:

awulf
Nov 29, 2004, 04:22 PM
When I make web pages, I use a WYSIWYG editor (GoLive) and then edit the code if it doesn't render properly in one of the web browsers (usually IE for Windows), but GoLive usually does a good job. For me its just faster that way, since you draw up what you want and then modify the code if necessary.

Of course when I edit PHP code, or templates of scripts, then you need to hand code a lot of it. And for advanced CSS code, you need code that yourself.

JLS
Nov 29, 2004, 05:36 PM
Context, context, context! I'm openminded, except when there is no net gain. Besides, the learning curve on my iBook was smooo-oooooth. Heh...

I didn't... I went to college where there were things to do :)
You moved away? Don't blame you, Canterbury is dead as the proverbial doornail. For Medieval architectural history, though, I can't go wrong :rolleyes:

I live in Ramsgate, and travelled to Canterbury every day for 2 years while I did a BTEC in Graphic Design :) I will be doing my xmas shopping in Canterbury too.. Ramsgate really has nothing to do :p


*Sorry for being totally off topic*