Isnt the ATI Radeon HD 5870 1GB graphics card a little old to be in the new mac pros?

[davelanger]

Isnt the ATI Radeon HD 5870 1GB graphics card a little old to be in the new mac pros? Isnt that card almost a year old?

[chych]

Well the higher end offering is the 5970, which is ridiculously expensive, or going crossfire (which is un-apple-like). The 5970 isn't even a single GPU anyhow. The 5870 is a good card!

[Vylen]

Yes, they're almost a year old (58xx first released September), but there's nothing newer from ATI - the upcoming Southern Islands GPU family isn't due out tilll later this year. No idea if the SI family will be much of an improvement anyway at the start of launch - it's believed to be a hybrid of the Evergreen (5xxx) series and Northern Island, a stopgap till NI is released 2011...

So... what can you do when there's nothing else.

[jav6454]

Isnt the ATI Radeon HD 5870 1GB graphics card a little old to be in the new mac pros? Isnt that card almost a year old?

It's the best card out there of the ATI generation of Cypress GPUs. What's wrong with it?

[davelanger]

It's the best card out there of the ATI generation of Cypress GPUs. What's wrong with it?

Well if you are going to spend at least $3000 on a computer why would you want the graphics card to be almost a year old?

[Cynicalone]

It's always like this with Apple.

Offering the 5870 is actually a step in the right direction for Apple. Much better than in years past.

[jav6454]

Well if you are going to spend at least $3000 on a computer why would you want the graphics card to be almost a year old?

Ok, can you name me a GPU from ATI that isn't?

[Justinf79]

Yeah, the 5000 series GPUs are ATI's current latest and greatest line.

[davelanger]

Ok, can you name me a GPU from ATI that isn't?

Probably not, I just dont want to buy a 3k computer then in a year have the card be obsolete and have to fork over $400 for a better card.

At least if I bought the computer a year ago I would have gotten two years out of the card or three if im lucky.

I could just buy a pc but I know I would really miss osx.

[ManofMac-au]

Well HTFU and be thankful it is only 12mths old. Previous incarnations have always come out with previous gen cards, rejoice, it's got ample power for any situation (minus 3x30' screen).

Probably not, I just dont want to buy a 3k computer then in a year have the card be obsolete and have to fork over $400 for a better card.

At least if I bought the computer a year ago I would have gotten two years out of the card or three if im lucky.

I could just buy a pc but I know I would really miss osx.

[chych]

They could have gone with an Nvidia 470 or 480 solution, which is half a year old now. Would that have made you happier? But wait, the 5870 is just as fast.

[snberk103]

The problem with saying you want a "better" card is that better means nothing. When you say "better" you should say what you want it to do.

I just read of review of a very high end Eizo monitor. The reviewer stated that the 5870 was one of the very few GPUs that had a 10bit data path (I assume per channel) through the Display Port, and so was using it in his Mac Pro.

For him, "better" meant more colours. For others "better" may mean more more FPS, or more output ports.

Also, IMO if you are building a workstation for doing work, the majority of people would rather use technology that will not crash because the vendor is still ironing out the bugs. Bleeding edge stuff can tend to fall down go poof. Not good for deadlines.

Update: Ignore that bit about the 5870 being 10bit. It may be still, but it was pointed out to me that I was thinking of the 4870 for that review. Although that reinforces my point about "better" being entirely subjective. Sorry about that.

[Vylen]

The problem with saying you want a "better" card is that better means nothing. When you say "better" you should say what you want it to do.

I just read of review of a very high end Eizo monitor. The reviewer stated that the 5870 was one of the very few GPUs that had a 10bit data path (I assume per channel) through the Display Port, and so was using it in his Mac Pro.

For him, "better" meant more colours. For others "better" may mean more more FPS, or more output ports.

Also, IMO if you are building a workstation for doing work, the majority of people would rather use technology that will not crash because the vendor is still ironing out the bugs. Bleeding edge stuff can tend to fall down go poof. Not good for deadlines.

Based on the OPs posts... "better" is something that ain't old... heh

[reel2reel]

Probably not, I just dont want to buy a 3k computer then in a year have the card be obsolete and have to fork over $400 for a better card.

At least if I bought the computer a year ago I would have gotten two years out of the card or three if im lucky.

I could just buy a pc but I know I would really miss osx.

Define "obsolete."

It will stop working?

You won't be able to do the work then that you're doing now?

The tech race is bad for the brain, man. It poisons. I'm ecstatic to get my new 6-core with the 5870 because it's going to worlds better than what I'm using now and serve me well for at least four or five years to come. My core2 duo iMac served me for over four years, for crying out loud. Even though I'm sick of my iMac limitations after four years, I wouldn't even call it "obsolete" because it could still serve someone else just fine.

So why will this graphics card be "obsolete?" What won't it let you do four years down the road?

[CaoCao]

They could have gone with an Nvidia 470 or 480 solution, which is half a year old now. Would that have made you happier? But wait, the 5870 is just as fast.

Nvidia should offer cooking lessons with the GTX 480 :rolleyes:

[skiffx]

OP is a troll or just doesnt understand what he is talking about at all...

[Chaosg5]

Isnt the ATI Radeon HD 5870 1GB graphics card a little old to be in the new mac pros? Isnt that card almost a year old?

If you check videocardbenchmark.net (http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/high_end_gpus.html) you will see that there are nothing else to choose from, atleast not talking ATI. I think there are some cards not listed (eyefinity?) but those aren't realistic anyhow. I can't say how accurate those results are cus I wouldn't know but they should give a good estimate anyway.

Maybe you'd rather apple had put off the MP update for another half year or how ever long in waiting for new cards to come out? :rolleyes:

[sboerup]

Apple decided 9 months ago what they were going to use. They pick their components when they are announced, and then when they finally decide to produce their machines its old tech. Just the way Apple is.

[skiffx]

One thing I did not expect people to think Apple made a wrong choice about is 5870 - being the best overall choice possible TODAY.

[jjahshik32]

The problem with saying you want a "better" card is that better means nothing. When you say "better" you should say what you want it to do.

I just read of review of a very high end Eizo monitor. The reviewer stated that the 5870 was one of the very few GPUs that had a 10bit data path (I assume per channel) through the Display Port, and so was using it in his Mac Pro.

For him, "better" meant more colours. For others "better" may mean more more FPS, or more output ports.

Also, IMO if you are building a workstation for doing work, the majority of people would rather use technology that will not crash because the vendor is still ironing out the bugs. Bleeding edge stuff can tend to fall down go poof. Not good for deadlines.

I'm assuming the OP means "newer" in the case of "better."

I'm pretty sure the 10' Mac Pros can handle the newer GPUs next year unless Sandy Bridge is something insane.

[Pressure]

The problem with saying you want a "better" card is that better means nothing. When you say "better" you should say what you want it to do.

I just read of review of a very high end Eizo monitor. The reviewer stated that the 5870 was one of the very few GPUs that had a 10bit data path (I assume per channel) through the Display Port, and so was using it in his Mac Pro.

For him, "better" meant more colours. For others "better" may mean more more FPS, or more output ports.

Also, IMO if you are building a workstation for doing work, the majority of people would rather use technology that will not crash because the vendor is still ironing out the bugs. Bleeding edge stuff can tend to fall down go poof. Not good for deadlines.

Are you sure that wasn't the Radeon HD 4870? Which also supports 10bit.

[snberk103]

Are you sure that wasn't the Radeon HD 4870? Which also supports 10bit.

Actually, now that you mention it..... I think it was the 4870. Drat. Gotta go, I need to edit my 1st post.

[jav6454]

Nvidia should offer cooking lessons with the GTX 480 :rolleyes:

Well reviewers do. They managed to cook an egg on the heat sink of the GTX480.

Yes, people, that's how hot it can get.

[Fast Shadow]

Aren't you a little old to be trolling on the Internet, OP?

[davelanger]

OP is a troll or just doesnt understand what he is talking about at all...

How am I a troll? And yes I don't know what I am talking about, that is why I asked the question. The answer seems to be, it doesn't matter how old the card is, its still one of the best cards out there. And most people said this, are you a little bit old for name calling?

Isn't a forum like this here to ask questions that people are not too familiar with the answers?

I just like to get all my info before deciding what to do with esp when its buying a 3k computer.

Thanks everyone for your help

[G4DP]

Be grateful, us who bought the 08's got a piece of crap that was already 2 years old.

[thejadedmonkey]

How am I a troll? And yes I don't know what I am talking about, that is why I asked the question. The answer seems to be, it doesn't matter how old the card is, its still one of the best cards out there. And most people said this, are you a little bit old for name calling?

Isn't a forum like this here to ask questions that people are not too familiar with the answers?

I just like to get all my info before deciding what to do with esp when its buying a 3k computer.

Thanks everyone for your help

A forum like this one is for Apple apologists to bash those who are not iSheep. I'm not saying that everyone is an apple apologist here, but many people drink the khool aid and forget that spending $2000 on a machine with outdated tech is absurd, for everyone but Apple.

[chych]

I guess the real question is: when the ATI HD 6 series is released, how long will Apple take to actually use them?

[Pressure]

I guess the real question is: when the ATI HD 6 series is released, how long will Apple take to actually use them?

Only Apple can answer this one unless ATI/AMD finally decides to supply EFI and drivers by themselves, like the Radeon HD 3870.

[goMac]

How am I a troll?

Because the 5870 is the newest ATI card out?

You're asking why Apple didn't include something that is newer than the newest card ATI has. It doesn't make sense.

[johnnymg]

Because the 5870 is the newest ATI card out?

You're asking why Apple didn't include something that is newer than the newest card ATI has. It doesn't make sense.

:D ........................ That's too funny!

[maflynn]

Because the 5870 is the newest ATI card out?

You're asking why Apple didn't include something that is newer than the newest card ATI has. It doesn't make sense.

From the sounds of it, the OP didn't know that card was ATI's latest and greatest. Coming from that perspective, it does makes sense.

Besides as others have stated, apple has a long history of using prior generation GPUs and/or underclocking them. One of the points being danced around is why does apple cut corners on graphics cards, especially on the MacPro. I say generally because as others have stated, the 5870 is a good card.

[Peace]

It doesn't matter how new your card is as long as OSX only does OpenGL 3.0. The newer cards take advantage of OpenGL 3.5 and 4.0.

The OS doesn't.

[Cindori]

It doesn't matter how new your card is as long as OSX only does OpenGL 3.0. The newer cards take advantage of OpenGL 3.5 and 4.0.

The OS doesn't.

osx does not even have 3.0 support yet :rolleyes:

[davelanger]

Because the 5870 is the newest ATI card out?

You're asking why Apple didn't include something that is newer than the newest card ATI has. It doesn't make sense.

I did not know that, plus why can't apple use other newer or better graphics cards?

I just know that macs tend to use older graphics cards and didn't know why.

If I knew that was the newest card, you really think I would have asked the question? I just know recently a ton of graphics cards (on PC) were released. That is why I was asking.

[goMac]

I did not know that, plus why can't apple use other newer or better graphics cards?

The NVidia GeForce 480 is really the only other newer GPU on the market. It's generally considered not as good as the 5870, and the Mac NVidia drivers have been having issues.

A GeForce 480 is likely to come out directly from NVidia anyway. But the GeForce 480 being newer does not necessarily mean it's better.

[Umbongo]

I did not know that, plus why can't apple use other newer or better graphics cards?

I just know that macs tend to use older graphics cards and didn't know why.

If I knew that was the newest card, you really think I would have asked the question? I just know recently a ton of graphics cards (on PC) were released. That is why I was asking.

Apple actually use the latest cards when Mac Pros come out. What tends to happen is newer cards come out a short time afterwards and the Mac Pros have a sales life of over a year.

As to why they don't update graphics cards during the life of the Mac Pro, well that is likely down to cost of driver development and not needing to in order to sell systems.

[davelanger]

The NVidia GeForce 480 is really the only other newer GPU on the market. It's generally considered not as good as the 5870, and the Mac NVidia drivers have been having issues.

A GeForce 480 is likely to come out directly from NVidia anyway. But the GeForce 480 being newer does not necessarily mean it's better.


Ok thanks, so that card should be fine for games like WOW, old republic, and diablo 3 for a couple of years.

Sure I could build a computer for much cheaper (which I was also looking at) but I love osx that is why Im trying to see all my options.

[snberk103]

I did not know that, plus why can't apple use other newer or better graphics cards?

I just know that macs tend to use older graphics cards and didn't know why.

If I knew that was the newest card, you really think I would have asked the question? I just know recently a ton of graphics cards (on PC) were released. That is why I was asking.

One of the differences between PCs and Macs are the focus on gamers (PC) and, well not really interested (Macs). A lot of the development $$ that goes into developing new video cards is to win the gaming crowd. A card that is mind-blowingly-awesome for a game isn't going to make a whit of difference for 90% of what a Mac is actually used for, by the most common user.

I believe that there are a number of video professionals who wished Apple stayed a bit more up to date with their cards.... but they are small minority, compared to most purchasers of Macs.

Apple wants the "user experience" to be problem free and they want their technical support to be easy. So, they use tried and trusted hardware, they test it extensively to make sure it doesn't cause problems.

Bad for gamers, good for most other users.

Now that Valve is moving more games over Apple seems to be paying a bit more attention to their video stuff.... so perhaps things are changing ??

[goMac]

Ok thanks, so that card should be fine for games like WOW, old republic, and diablo 3 for a couple of years.

Sure I could build a computer for much cheaper (which I was also looking at) but I love osx that is why Im trying to see all my options.

You'll have graphics upgrade options for a while if you buy a Mac Pro. I'm planning on picking up a 5870 for my 2008 Mac Pro.

[davelanger]

You'll have graphics upgrade options for a while if you buy a Mac Pro. I'm planning on picking up a 5870 for my 2008 Mac Pro.

Ok thanks, so the 5870 should be ok for games like WOW for a while, then in a few years I can always upgrade.

[goMac]

Ok thanks, so the 5870 should be ok for games like WOW for a while, then in a few years I can always upgrade.

The 5870 should kick total ass at WoW, I wouldn't be too worried.

[davelanger]

The 5870 should kick total ass at WoW, I wouldn't be too worried.

Ok thanks, do you think it would be better in osx or bootcamp?

[goMac]

Ok thanks, do you think it would be better in osx or bootcamp?

It seems to go back and forth. Currently it's Boot Camp, but two years ago it was OS X.

[davelanger]

It seems to go back and forth. Currently it's Boot Camp, but two years ago it was OS X.

Ok thanks.

So I guess its best to go 750 for osx and 250 for windows just for certain games?