Need advice from previous converts

Apple fanboy said:

Hi all
I've been an avid reader of this site for a while (well since just before iPhone 4 came out, which I got on launch day) and thought I would finally get round to signing up. Anyway back to the matter at hand. I've recently decided to take the plunge and ditch PC's in favour of something much more stable. I'm trying to decide between a mac mini or an iMac. I'm not a programmer or anything but would like to get into digital photography and run photoshop etc. Also how different will the interface be with Lion compared to Vista I currently use. My daughter is 10 and not great with changes as she has special needs. Any advice is much appreciated.

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I am a fairly recent convert. I can only speak for myself and based on my own needs, but I went with an entry-level 27" iMac i5 w/ 1TB drive (now wish I'd upgraded that to 2TB) and I couldn't be happier. Since I still have tons of PC software, I invested in a legal copy of Win 7 and installed it using the Bootcamp that comes with the iMac. Now I can boot into Windows OR Mac OS - the best of both worlds.

The interface for Mac OS is Much different (better) than Vist. Win 7 is an improvement over Vista, but I still think teh MAC OS beats it for simplicity and ease of use.

With bootcamp, you can select which OS you want at boot or when restarting.

Have you considered a virtual machine? (such as Parallels or VMWare Fusion)
You can run both OSes at once, though there is a slight performance hit (that won't matter if you don't play games on Windows)

First thing you need to know is that you generally don't shut Macs down. I'm currently at 18 days of uptime, and it's that low only because there was an OS update recently. Sleep/wake works brilliantly, and apps aren't allowed to "memory leak" and run rampant, so there's no compelling reason to power the computer off (unless you obsess over "vampire power" to the point you unplug your toaster).

Second, there's an option with OS X to tell it to boot into Windows, and there's one in Windows to tell it to boot into OS X. Otherwise there's no prompt at startup and it will just go to most recent one used. (There might be a key you can hold down at boot to get a prompt. Not sure.. don't go into bootcamp too often lol)

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I'm partial to iMacs, because there's a lot more power available, the all-in-one form factor is very appealing, and the screen is absolutely gorgeous. The only reason to go with a Mini is if you have a high-quality monitor you intend to keep using. A higher-end Mini can probably handle Photoshop. The lower-end one with the Intel integrated graphics isn't suitable for much more than email and light surfing.

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If someone has un-retrainable muscle memory about how to use Windows, then making the adjustment to OS X might be a challenge. There's a lot of windows and dialogs and such in OS X that don't have a direct corollary, and vice versa. On the other hand, if you think of it as a fresh experience and try to use it without prejudice to your previous Windows knowledge, you pick it up very quickly. It's designed to be intuitive in its own right, not offer helpers that only make sense if you're coming from a different system.

To clarify, when you install Windows via Boot Camp, you hold the alt/option key during boot and it will bring you to a selection menu and you can choose which OS (or whatever bootable partition you have) you want to boot into. You can change the default of what the Mac auto boots into by changing the Startup Disk settings in the System Preferences in OS X. There is no noticeable performance degradation when dual-booting different operating systems... to answer your previous question.

With Boot Camp, you can have it automatically boot into OSX or Windows or you can manually chose by holding down ALT after powering up and before the Apple logo appears. It's straightforward and there's no performance penalty for setting it up. Windows runs natively when you boot into it so it's no different than using a PC at that point.

First wrong thing u had was vista
Get windows 7 its worth a try

Apple fanboy said:

Thanks for the reply. Does the duel os systems slow things up much? I mean do you select which to use every time on start up or isn't that how Bootcamp works.

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Yes, with boot camp you select one or the other on power-up. There are programs like Parallels and others that let you run both OS at the same time and just hot-switch between them at will. I have no experience with those, but would expect there might be some system slowdown due to the CPU and memory required to run both. But with boot camp it's not an issue since you only run one or the other at any time.

BasilFawlty said:

Yes, with boot camp you select one or the other on power-up. There are programs like Parallels and others that let you run both OS at the same time and just hot-switch between them at will. I have no experience with those, but would expect there might be some system slowdown due to the CPU and memory required to run both. But with boot camp it's not an issue since you only run one or the other at any time.

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I would recommend at least 8 GB of RAM when using virtual machines from personal experience. I'd dedicate 4 GB of RAM to each OS and they'd both run quite fast. When I had 4 GB it wasn't such a great experience.

I actually use VMWare Fusion, but I rarely use it. There are a few Windows only applications I have to use for school, but other than that I don't need it. If you just want to occasionally run some simple applications, I think this is the best approach.

I would recommend going cold turkey, but spend some time with your daughter and learn how to use it with her. OSX is fairly simple to use although there may be a few minor differences coming from a Windows background (it took me a while to figure out how to launch an application when I first came over from XP).

MonkeyBrainz said:

I would recommend at least 8 GB of RAM when using virtual machines from personal experience. I'd dedicate 4 GB of RAM to each OS and they'd both run quite fast. When I had 4 GB it wasn't such a great experience.

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I would have to agree with that! One of teh first things I did when I got my iMac was install an additional 8GB from OWC for total of 12GB. (only a $50 upgrade)

Apple fanboy said:

Is this easy to do on a mac? I've upgraded memory on a pc before but would not feel as confident taking a new iMac apart. Also I guess this would void your warranty?

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2 screws at the base, under the "chin". Easier than putting it in a beige box. Doesn't affect the warranty in the slightest, except that if you bring it in to a genius bar for an issue they may ask to have the factory RAM put back in to eliminate that as a possible cause.

You can see teardown instructions for the iMac here. Here is a direct link to the RAM replacement procedure in the current gen iMac.

I converted in November. I bought a 27" top of the line iMac to replace my dying HP. I love it OSX is easily the best OS I have ever used. OSX is very intuitive and user friendly it may seem a little confusing at first but once you get used to it you will wonder how you ever did with out it. One thing that is great about a Mac is that it simply works, you don't have to worry about installing a driver for everything under the sun and nothing crashes it just works. There is no need for any virus software as Macs just don't get sick lol. OSX is very lean and doesn't come with and endless useless amount of bloatware like windows PC's do. After having my iMAc for a few months I simply couldn't stand using windows 7 on my Sony Vaio and bought both a MacBook Pro and MacBook Air. Having the notebooks just completes my experience transferring files between the computers is simple using AirDrop and makes life so much easier using all my iOS devices, iPod, iPad, iPhone and Apple TV every syncs together and if a make a calendar appt on my iPhone or iPod it pushes it right to all my computers and other devices. Apple TV is great and works seamlessly with my computers to access my iTunes and photos so I can watch/listen to them on my TV. The photo editing software is amazing for Macs and before I never got into to really doing anything with my digital photos or home videos until I bought my iMac. Now it is super easy to edit them especially movies using iMovie which is included on any Mac you purchase. Plus Apple customer service is top notch. Anytime I have had a question or problem they answer for me in the most polite manner never belittling me or making me feel stupid, plus they make sure that you have a complete understanding of the answer before you leave. Also when you buy your device they take you aside and set it up in store with you and give you a one on one lesson and crash course into the operating system and all that fun and show you some shortcuts and where to go for support.

Basically you can't possibly go wrong making the switch. IT may seem confusing at first but you will quickly learn the Mac way of doing things and realize how simple and user friendly it is and wonder how you ever managed before OSX. But beware once you buy an iMac it will not be enough, then you will need a MacBook and then an iPad and iPhone. Apple products are like crack, one hit and your addicted for life, but man addiction never felt so good! Take the plunge you'll love it and so will your daughter OSX will be much easier for her to use then windows it is much easier and much simpler!

Apple fanboy said:

Okay I have a cheap temporary solution which might help my family make the leap. I've been offered an old white iMac from work. It's from around 2009 with 2.1ghz and 120 gig hard drive (sorry not sure of the ram) running snow leapord. They look to be in good condition and they are selling them for £350. Does this sound like a good deal?

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Seems an ok'ish deal, though probably you'll regret not buying something more up to date after about a week! I have hunch it is older than 2009 though, the white imacs were about 2006-7, they were aluminium in 2009 I think. If you want to dip your toes with minimal outlay I would buy a mac mini and if it really doesn't work out with you and family, just sell it and get most of your cash back.

The UK Apple refurb store had mac minis on for £450 a couple of days ago though they have gone now, so keep an eye out there they seem to appear every couple of weeks or so (check in the morning and they sell fast!).

http://store.apple.com/uk/browse/home/specialdeals/mac

This is the 2GB ram version though and would need RAM updating to 4GB though this is relatively cheap these days and a doddle to do on the new minis. The benefit of the mini to you at this point is that you can just reuse your dell monitor and any usb keyboard/mouse. If you want the imac, they have the current entry imac for £850 on the refurb store, which isn't too bad. My current mac mini is a refurb and was in pristine condition when it arrived and is still going strong 2 years later.

Personally, I would also suggest holding off with the dual boot configuration. You'll probably find it really isn't worth the bother as there is nothing you need on windows, why lost the hard drive space? My work is PC based and I have full integration using OS X (mail, calendar, office, etc.). You could always hold on to the Dell for any Windows requirements?

Have fun switching, you will wonder why you didn't do it years ago!

Apple fanboy said:

Hi all
I've been an avid reader of this site for a while (well since just before iPhone 4 came out, which I got on launch day) and thought I would finally get round to signing up. Anyway back to the matter at hand. I've recently decided to take the plunge and ditch PC's in favour of something much more stable. I'm trying to decide between a mac mini or an iMac. I'm not a programmer or anything but would like to get into digital photography and run photoshop etc. Also how different will the interface be with Lion compared to Vista I currently use. My daughter is 10 and not great with changes as she has special needs. Any advice is much appreciated.

Click to expand...

Since most everyone covered the hardware end I'll speak mostly to the user experience. I will say however that I currently have a Macbook Pro but when the new iMacs come out I'm going for the high end maxed version (Except memory which I'll do myself).

I've been using my Macbook Pro for about 18 months. Prior to that I was a Windows 7 and various Linux distro user.

Now that I'm used to the Mac way I think it's awesome. Simple, intuitive and easy to use. My workflow was never as streamlined and intuitive as it is now.

With that said it can be a jarring experience the first time you fire up the Mac. No matter what people here will tell you there is a learning curve. If you've never touched a computer before then I believe it is easier to pick up on how a Mac works however, when coming from Windows there are going to be things that you're going to consider as should be simple but will seem overly complicated.

You can find threads all over this forum attesting my last statement.

My advice is, go to Apple support and check out all the videos and tutorials on migrating from Windows to Mac. It will make your life easier.

And as for your daughter, I'm not sure if you meant that she's a special needs child but if she is it will probably be a bit harder for her due to how for her she probably doesn't have to think at this point on how to do something but rather just does it. She will have to re-learn it. Patience and getting a good grasp of it all yourself is probably the best way to help her transition.

Also before you even touch iPhoto read up on it. A lot of new Mac users have big issues with it only because they don't understand how it works, myself included. Until I took the time to read up on it and understand the iPhoto process I was pulling my hair out.

Whichever Mac you choose I'm sure you'll love it. Good luck and enjoy!!

Ok there is a BIT of a learning curve, but I would hardly classify it as jarring. Apple is very user friendly and while the switch may seem confusing at first you will very quickly pick up on it and realize how simple and logical it is. I think the most difficult thing for you will be the realization that there is no start button, but instead launch pad that lays out all your apps and programs in a clear concise and easy to use manner. Thats about it. The keyboard is a keyboard, the trackpad is a trackpad (albeit an awesome one) and the ports are all the same, so if you can already use the above you should be alright.

Medic278 said:

I think the most difficult thing for you will be the realization that there is no start button, but instead launch pad that lays out all your apps

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It's this, plus the window close/minimize/maximize are on the left and color coded.

Oh, and it's not a big deal, but closing an application's only window is usually not the same thing as quitting the application.

forty2j said:

It's this, plus the window close/minimize/maximize are on the left and color coded.

Oh, and it's not a big deal, but closing an application's only window is usually not the same thing as quitting the application.

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I agree but all of this is really quite minimal are certainly not going to be jarring for anyone, even the OP child as its a very quick learn OS and is just so simple to use. The user interface is easily the best I have ever used.

How it works out for you. I think you will be really impressed with it its a great OS. Hope all goes well for you and your daughter!