The Next Big MMO?

niuniu · Aug 21, 2012

Huntn said:
I'm not fighting with you. As a blanket statement your premise, "MMOs suck the life and soul out of you" is mistaken, misleading, which I told you in my very first reply, and flat wrong and you are giving bad advice. Maybe you and others can't control your MMO urges, but there are lots who can, who can manage it, and enjoy it immensely. I'm done explaining this to you. You've broadcast your warning about MMOs. I do agree that for some it's a good warning, but not for all, and that is what I disagreed with. This happens to be a pro- MMO thread, with most participants looking forward to new offerings. I'm moving forward from there.

First of all. My hyperbole was a conclusion, not a premise. Save your pop-phil remarks for someone that has no clue. You have no idea what my actual premises are about MMOs. However I'm here and can tell you. If you were intellectually honest, you would simply ask me what they were instead of saying ridiculous things like, 'your premise is wrong'.

Secondly, I do have plenty of reservations about the emergent strategies of the MMO genre and if you are trying to say I'm wrong about them (even though you have no idea what they are because I haven't voiced many of them), then you have to explain yourself.

Thirdly, you claimed that I didn't know how MMOs function. So again, you have to tell me how you think they function, and explain to me how I'm wrong about that.

Huntn · Aug 21, 2012

niuniu said:
First of all. My hyperbole was a conclusion, not a premise. Save your pop-phil remarks for someone that has no clue. You have no idea what my actual premises are about MMOs. However I'm here and can tell you. If you were intellectually honest, you would simply ask me what they were instead of saying ridiculous things like, 'your premise is wrong'.

Secondly, I do have plenty of reservations about the emergent strategies of the MMO genre and if you are trying to say I'm wrong about them (even though you have no idea what they are because I haven't voiced many of them), then you have to explain yourself.

Thirdly, you claimed that I didn't know how MMOs function. So again, you have to tell me how you think they function, and explain to me how I'm wrong about that.

You really do want to have a debate, lol. I told you that your premise, or if you prefer, conclusion that "MMOs suck the life and soul out of you" is misleading. I took it as a generalized statement. If you had said "MMOs suck the life out of me.", I would not have said anything about being a misleading statement.

This is your opinion, it may apply to you, but as a blanket statement describing the nature of MMOs it is misleading. You took exception and you continue to do so. That's my opinion and I'm finished entertaining you.

niuniu · Aug 21, 2012

Huntn said:
You really do want to have a debate, lol. I told you that your premise, or if you prefer, conclusion that "MMOs suck the life and soul out of you" is misleading. I took it as a generalized statement. If you had said "MMOs suck the life out of me.", I would not have said anything about being a misleading statement.

This is your opinion, it may apply to you, but as a blanket statement describing the nature of MMOs it is misleading. You took exception and you continue to do so. That's my opinion and I'm finished entertaining you.

Premise and conclusion aren't interchangeable. You started this by saying premise, which was patently wrong. You have also not been able to show how it is misleading in any case when asked multiple times. If MMO's do not have the ability suck the life and soul out of people, surely you must be able to show how. Since it was a hyperbole, and ericwalker and I jested over previously, it must then be incredibly easy for even the least intelligent to show how it is wrong, if it is wrong.

You also said that I didn't understand how MMOs function, when I hadn't even mentioned how I think they functioned. And again, you try to run off instead of answering the question. So I'll ask again, how is it you have deduced how I think MMOs function, and how is it wrong, as you claimed?

Dirtyharry50 · Aug 21, 2012

niuniu said:
Premise and conclusion aren't interchangeable. You started this by saying premise, which was patently wrong. You have also not been able to show how it is misleading in any case when asked multiple times. If MMO's do not have the ability suck the life and soul out of people, surely you must be able to show how. Since it was a hyperbole, and ericwalker and I jested over previously, it must then be incredibly easy for even the least intelligent to show how it is wrong, if it is wrong.

You also said that I didn't understand how MMOs function, when I hadn't even mentioned how I think they functioned. And again, you try to run off instead of answering the question. So I'll ask again, how is it you have deduced how I think MMOs function, and how is it wrong, as you claimed?

Let it go will you? This argument is boring. There is no need to beat this horse to death and then to a bloody pulp. You have already repeatedly made your points. Surely you have the smarts to know he is not going to capitulate and agree with you. Your intellect and command of the English language is obvious. Consider us suitably impressed at this point. You can tuck your Internet forum epeen back in your trousers now, satisfied by a fine showing. Okay?

niuniu · Aug 21, 2012

Dirtyharry50 said:
Let it go will you? This argument is boring. There is no need to beat this horse to death and then to a bloody pulp. You have already repeatedly made your points. Surely you have the smarts to know he is not going to capitulate and agree with you. Your intellect and command of the English language is obvious. Consider us suitably impressed at this point. You can tuck your Internet forum epeen back in your trousers now, satisfied by a fine showing. Okay?

Piggybacking on an argument marks you out as a drama seeker. At least Huntn was actually replying to a hyperbole I made, wheras you're simply seeking approval from your buddies in the thread.

Approval seeking is cute, but a bit sad. I hope you're not a grown man behind that avatar.

Huntn · Aug 21, 2012

niuniu said:
Piggybacking on an argument marks you out as a drama seeker. At least Huntn was actually replying to a hyperbole I made, wheras you're simply seeking approval from your buddies in the thread.

Approval seeking is cute, but a bit sad. I hope you're not a grown man behind that avatar.

DirtyHarry is not seeking drama. He's giving you good advice. You come across as someone who likes bickering, but you are not like that are you?

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and instead talk about the Next Big MMO. That would be Planetside 2. The beta started this month!!!

niuniu · Aug 21, 2012

Huntn said:
DirtyHarry is not seeking drama. He's giving you good advice. You come across as someone who likes bickering, but you are not like that are you?

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and instead talk about the Next Big MMO. That would be Planetside 2. The beta started this month!!!

You quoted me first, saying I had made a premise, which was wrong. Which I hadn't. Then you later said I didn't know how MMO's function. I never even mentioned how MMOs function.

So tell me, who really loves bickering? I just just like asking people to explain themselves. I certainly don't run when asked to explain myself, what sort of person embarrasses themselves by doing that?

Still waiting for you to answer my questions of course. By doing so you can end this discussion, or perpetuate it by dodging them.

TheKnowledgeGuy · Aug 21, 2012

The Elder Scrolls Online apparently will have OS X support. Unfortunately Skyrim won't be given OS X support it seems (some wrappers work, but Steam was patched so they didn't) so I'll just keep using Boot Camp. Probably requires DirectX or something. OpenGL Skyrim anyone?

Huntn · Aug 21, 2012

TheKnowledgeGuy said:
The Elder Scrolls Online apparently will have OS X support. Unfortunately Skyrim won't be given OS X support it seems (some wrappers work, but Steam was patched so they didn't) so I'll just keep using Boot Camp. Probably requires DirectX or something. OpenGL Skyrim anyone?

As in OSX native or something like parallels? I'm currently playing Skyrim over Bootcamp. I'm irritated every time I have to log into Steam to play it, but I'm willing because then I get to play.

doh123 · Aug 21, 2012

Yeah Elder Scrolls Online was announced as being fully Windows and Mac native, which is nice...

as to Skyrim, once you get it working in a wrapper, just know it'll be a major chore if you want to take a risk at patching the game... mine still runs fine and I don't need Windows, but I haven't loaded any of the recent patches.

Huntn · Aug 21, 2012

doh123 said:
Yeah Elder Scrolls Online was announced as being fully Windows and Mac native, which is nice...

as to Skyrim, once you get it working in a wrapper, just know it'll be a major chore if you want to take a risk at patching the game... mine still runs fine and I don't need Windows, but I haven't loaded any of the recent patches.

I'm so used to Elder Scrolls as solo play, it will be interesting to see what they come up and how they will be influenced by WoW vs GW2, which for the latter, as you may know has cast the Holy Trinity aside. In GW2, I'm looking forward to see how group play without a tank shakes out.

Admittedly I have not kept close track of Planetside2 and was caught off guard by the commencement of beta. This is bothering somewhat because I thought I'd have a couple of months to get into GW2. Now not quite.

Liquorpuki · Aug 21, 2012

Huntn said:
I'm so used to Elder Scrolls as solo play, it will be interesting to see what they come up and how they will be influenced by WoW vs GW2, which for the latter, as you may know has cast the Holy Trinity aside. In GW2, I'm looking forward to see how group play without a tank shakes out.

I think ESO is gonna be one big disappointment. Maybe I'll be wrong but I get the sense the devs are delusional about how much innovation they're actually bringing the table, which is practically none

Admittedly I have not kept close track of Planetside2 and was caught off guard by the commencement of beta. This is bothering somewhat because I thought I'd have a couple of months to get into GW2. Now not quite.

It's all good because they're gonna be totally different. PS was more like an FPS, I played it alongside SWG and picked one or the other depending on how I felt like killing time

NateEssex · Aug 22, 2012

Next big MMO is GW2!

I'm thinking the answer is Guild Wars 2. I'll have a better idea this weekend. Thank the lord for Boot Camp!

cosmicjoke · Aug 23, 2012

NateEssex said:
I'm thinking the answer is Guild Wars 2. I'll have a better idea this weekend. Thank the lord for Boot Camp!

Blindly jumping into GW2, I know virtually nothing about it other than it's allegedly breaking away from the typical soul stealing grindfest of traditional MMOs... rather than learn virtually everything I can about the game I'm just gonna nub it up and experience the content first hand. 1 day 3hrs to go

rasmasyean · Aug 23, 2012

Newest Pandaria trailor for those of you haven't seen it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvYXoyxLv64

Huntn · Aug 24, 2012

cosmicjoke said:
Blindly jumping into GW2, I know virtually nothing about it other than it's allegedly breaking away from the typical soul stealing grindfest of traditional MMOs... rather than learn virtually everything I can about the game I'm just gonna nub it up and experience the content first hand. 1 day 3hrs to go

Two important notes- in the skill bar, the first 5 slots are strictly based on weapon type. Check out new skills that comes with new weapon before discarding old weapon.

No tanks, no dedicated healer. You'll have to figure out the best manner to approach group fights. My understanding is that aggro in many cases is based on proximity, but not necessarily. Check out the GW2 Quick and Dirty Guide for a primer.

rasmasyean · Aug 24, 2012

doh123 said:
Yeah Elder Scrolls Online was announced as being fully Windows and Mac native, which is nice...

as to Skyrim, once you get it working in a wrapper, just know it'll be a major chore if you want to take a risk at patching the game... mine still runs fine and I don't need Windows, but I haven't loaded any of the recent patches.

Check it out this Skyrim music video hits 10 million views.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSLPH9d-jsI&list=PL5DF6078ABC09FBCD&index=2&feature=plcp

Huntn · Jan 13, 2013

This is where I'm at today.

...playing lots of Planetside 2 (MMOFPS). I love that it is free and that I can play once a week and still have a meaningful group experience with it. I'm playing in a large guild, some of you might remember Devil Dogs 666. In many cases when there is a huge group, we just roll across the landscape, and playing in armor, Vanguard Tanks specifically, sometimes we sit around waiting for the current facility to cap. However there are times when we get into big fights. There was relatively a small number of our guild/faction at a facility (forget the name on Indar) last night and got involved in a 1hr+ fight repelling the TR and we actually succeeded. It was a hoot.

The game is not perfect. I've whined about this before, but I don't like that I am both driver and main gunner in the Vanguard, but I can deal with it. Overall having fun.

---Guild Wars 2 (MMORPG)- I have more or less set it aside. I play about 75% solo and after getting my butt kicked a couple of times in scenarios I supposedly was high enough to handle, I said "meh". Possibly I'm inept.

What is interesting about GW2 is the way combat works, no dedicated tank, healer, etc. I had high hopes for this. It's free too and I may eventually go back to it. Strangly enough, I still hold up WoW as my standard, however I realize I may have grown/changed since playing it as to what I need in a MMORPG to keep me happy.

---Just read a preview of the new Neverwinter (MMORPG) in the Feb13 PCGamer. It's a "could be".

monkeycid · Jan 13, 2013

Finally a discussion I can take part in!

I have played WoW and while it did not entertain me, I do believe it's a difficult game to beat for developers seeking to be the next big thing. Rift held that claim until its release and then Guild Wars 2. Whilst both games are fun to play, neither have the content to really challenge WoW.

I would actually like to see a better version of Aion. Flying combat with an angels versus demons theme was fun for me although I didn't have the computer then to fully enjoy it. That was new and completely different from the usual ground battles that seem to be the dominate feature in every MMO.

As for upcoming MMO. I have no idea. I used to often visit sites for the latest F2P games in my teens when I would change from game to game every 6 months but now I prefer longevity in games and expect them to play them upwards of 3 years or more. Since Guild Wars 2 was released, there isn't really anything to look forward to at the moment. Perhaps The Elder Scrolls Online is a good contender but I can't think of anything other that.

Still enjoying playing Diablo 3 solo. But, sadly, with the ability to change skills and things it doesn't nearly have as much replayability as Diablo 2. I actually miss the inability to change choices you make and restarting over and over again to try different builds and such. Add years onto the lifespan of the game.

Huntn · Jan 13, 2013

monkeycid said:
Finally a discussion I can take part in!

I have played WoW and while it did not entertain me, I do believe it's a difficult game to beat for developers seeking to be the next big thing. Rift held that claim until its release and then Guild Wars 2. Whilst both games are fun to play, neither have the content to really challenge WoW.

I would actually like to see a better version of Aion. Flying combat with an angels versus demons theme was fun for me although I didn't have the computer then to fully enjoy it. That was new and completely different from the usual ground battles that seem to be the dominate feature in every MMO.

As for upcoming MMO. I have no idea. I used to often visit sites for the latest F2P games in my teens when I would change from game to game every 6 months but now I prefer longevity in games and expect them to play them upwards of 3 years or more. Since Guild Wars 2 was released, there isn't really anything to look forward to at the moment. Perhaps The Elder Scrolls Online is a good contender but I can't think of anything other that.

Still enjoying playing Diablo 3 solo. But, sadly, with the ability to change skills and things it doesn't nearly have as much replayability as Diablo 2. I actually miss the inability to change choices you make and restarting over and over again to try different builds and such. Add years onto the lifespan of the game.

I assume that because of all the restrictions Blizzard put on the game including making it online only? I don't like how they handled the game. Personally I'd be more likely to try Torchlight 2.

Washac · Jan 13, 2013

Do you know I do not know nor do I care, harsh I know but..........

I have always enjoyed playing solo off line rpg/adventure games over the years then I joined WoW some years ago, I played through the first 3 updates (Burning Crusade, Wrath of the Lych King and Cataclysm), no real story to it and all the quests were/are just killing things of varying amounts depending on level and I never did max level any character.

Then I got heavely involved in Runescape, yes I know, but I found the skilling strangely addictive and played it for 6 years, now the people behind RS are destroying it, new content/updates nearly every week and not for the best either, the economy is screwed and the game is full of bots, scammers and gamblers, so no more RS.

Then my next heavy involvment more recently was in Guild Wars 2, it took me 3 months to max level a character and complete my personal story and as good as complete the world map. The game is full of bugs and there really is nothing left in the game that I want to do.

So no more MMOs for me, I am going back to the solo off line rpg/adventure games of which there are quite a few out there, I knew I installed Bootcamp for a reason

monkeycid · Jan 13, 2013

I have to agree with playing solo over multiplayer. I used to enjoy grouping and guilding but it just seems a bit of a bore and cookie-cutter to some extent. Fallout: New Vegas and Elder Scrolls: Morrowind are right at the top of my favourites nowadays.

I don't mind having to be connected to the internet to play solo albeit that has been listed as one of the negatives of Diablo 3. I simply miss the skills and synergy system of Diablo 2 as well as the runes, too. Which, for me, kept me playing for over 8 years. I can't see myself still playing Diablo 3 in 2015, though.

Thumbs up for RuneScape! One of the first games I played and after reading your post, I may try it out again. Though, I miss the early days of it and the concept of "pures". For those that don't know - a pure would be someone that prioritised their combat skills to keep their overall level low but their combat high. That way they gained an advantage over players that trained in everything. It made PvP fun and player-killing for loot even more so!

jstnlzr · Jan 13, 2013

monkeycid said:
I have to agree with playing solo over multiplayer. I used to enjoy grouping and guilding but it just seems a bit of a bore and cookie-cutter to some extent. Fallout: New Vegas and Elder Scrolls: Morrowind are right at the top of my favourites nowadays.

I don't mind having to be connected to the internet to play solo albeit that has been listed as one of the negatives of Diablo 3. I simply miss the skills and synergy system of Diablo 2 as well as the runes, too. Which, for me, kept me playing for over 8 years. I can't see myself still playing Diablo 3 in 2015, though.

Thumbs up for RuneScape! One of the first games I played and after reading your post, I may try it out again. Though, I miss the early days of it and the concept of "pures". For those that don't know - a pure would be someone that prioritised their combat skills to keep their overall level low but their combat high. That way they gained an advantage over players that trained in everything. It made PvP fun and player-killing for loot even more so!

I have yet to touch Oblivion... I feel left out

Solomani · Jan 13, 2013

Huntn said:
In what way? I've heard the Final Fantasy series has always been heavy with grind.

Been through the Mother of All MMORPG Grindfests.... The pre-CU Star Wars Galaxies. Players were expected to grind for months just obtaining those frackin Holocrystals (required to become a Jedi).

Did the Evercrack thing, the original EQ1. Tho the EQ world was so huge and had tons of expansions that the game never felt stale for the first few years you played it.

I dunno. IMHO some bit of grinding/tinkering/crafting is necessary, it's what separates the dedicated long-term players from the casual kids who just come to gank in PVP for the weekend (and likely they never worked for their loot, they just bought it from some Asian loot/gold seller).

But yeah, a game that forces you to grind excessively, just to advance, is a lousy MMO model.

Washac · Jan 14, 2013

monkeycid said:
I have to agree with playing solo over multiplayer. I used to enjoy grouping and guilding but it just seems a bit of a bore and cookie-cutter to some extent. Fallout: New Vegas and Elder Scrolls: Morrowind are right at the top of my favourites nowadays.

I don't mind having to be connected to the internet to play solo albeit that has been listed as one of the negatives of Diablo 3. I simply miss the skills and synergy system of Diablo 2 as well as the runes, too. Which, for me, kept me playing for over 8 years. I can't see myself still playing Diablo 3 in 2015, though.

Thumbs up for RuneScape! One of the first games I played and after reading your post, I may try it out again. Though, I miss the early days of it and the concept of "pures". For those that don't know - a pure would be someone that prioritised their combat skills to keep their overall level low but their combat high. That way they gained an advantage over players that trained in everything. It made PvP fun and player-killing for loot even more so!

Pures are one of the things that updates etc have killed, it is not the Runescape you used to know, nobody chats anymore just abuse or ask if your a bot or botting, very boring.

Some areas of the game are almost unplayable becuase of bots now.

My copy of Dark Souls Prepare to Die arrives in the next hour so going to bury myself in that

The Next Big MMO?

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