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Have you been censored on MacRumors?

Have you been censored by MacRumors?

  • Yes, they have deleted one of my posts.

    Votes: 97 61.4%

  • No, I have never had a post deleted.

    Votes: 43 27.2%

  • I don't know.

    Votes: 18 11.4%
  • Total voters
    158
annk

annk

Administrator
Staff member
Apr 18, 2004
15,140
9,351
Somewhere over the rainbow
wordoflife said:
Yep, and for not good reasons either, imo.
Click to expand...

Any time a post is edited or deleted, it's because it violated a rule.

Pretty much sums it up right here. PMing them back is just useless and a waste of your time. A lot of them feel that they're always 100% right about everything. They'll tell you to report it by using the link at the bottom, but nothing will happen. At the end of the day, your post was already deleted.
Click to expand...

I can tell you from personal experience that that's simply not the case. As a moderator, I had some instances of moderation I did overturned when a member complained and the moderation was reviewed by the admins, with the input of my fellow mods. As an admin, I'm involved in dealing with complaints about moderation, and have been on the other side as well. I haven't ever seen any indication of a mod or admin speaking as if they are infallible.

There's a good atmosphere in these discussions; even when my moderation was overturned, I experienced it as a learning situation, not as the admins scolding me for 'getting it wrong'. Moderation is sometimes very difficult, so we try to err on the side of caution, and spend a LOT of time discussing across time zones.

When you use the Contact Us form (the link you're talking about), the contact is read. Every single contact is read, and if it's a complaint, it's discussed. Unless the message is total spam or clearly not meant to be serious, the contact is answered.

I guess whether or not you feel it's worth your time, depends on whether or not you get the answer you want. ;)

wordoflife said:
The only thing is that many of them feel infallible and whenever you try to bring something up, you pretty much get blocked out from giving your opinion.

Sending a PM is useless because they refuse to believe that they might have mesed up.
Clicking "report a problem" isn't going to reverse the problem
Creating a public thread gets deleted (surprised that this one has not been, tbh)

Just my opinion. Don't get offended. I understand that the mods/admins are doing what they think is best for the overall community. Just think that the system is a tad flawed though.
Click to expand...

Opinions are welcome, but they have to be expressed in the right forums and within the rules. As arn points out, it's fine to start a thread about appropriateness of news items in Site and Forum Feedback, but not in a news thread (because it's off-topic there).

Reporting a problem will ensure that the problem is dealt with - - IF there actually was a problem. If you report something and you don't feel anything was done, just ask us (via the Contact Form). We won't be able to give you details about moderation we did to another member, but we will be able to explain exactly why nothing was done if we decided not to moderate what you reported. You'd be surprised at the number of reports where there's actually no rules violation. I wish there were a semi-automated way to give members direct feedback when they report posts, but there isn't.

I think people are confused about what censorship means. When you sign up to be a member here, you agree to a set of rules (which you also agree to read!). Those rules outline very clearly what you can and can't do, and there are extensive FAQs that among other things explain in great detail how moderation is handled, and how you can complain about or question the rules.

tl;dr: Getting moderated because you didn't follow the rules ≠ censorship.
 
Comeagain?

Comeagain?

macrumors 68020
Feb 17, 2011
2,190
46
Spokane, WA
I'm positive I've had posts edited...but it doesn't really bother me. Obviously I did something (knowingly or not) that the staff disapprove of. And if they don't want that on the site, then that's fine with me. I certainly wouldn't call the moderation here "Censorship".
 
Grey Beard

Grey Beard

macrumors 65816
Sep 10, 2005
1,021
72
The Antipodes.
Yeah, I've had numerous posts deleted, received warnings and time outs. Of late, I almost feel like every post is being scrutinized and or deleted. Just put it down to them having a limited sense of humour on that day.

KGB:cool:
 
bruinsrme

bruinsrme

macrumors 604
Oct 26, 2008
7,174
3,036
I have.
On the other hand it seems the opinions of the mods sometimes go further than what I have seen in some posts that were ultimately deleted " cleaned up ;) "

It's their playground and their rules.

Because of it I don't frequent macrumors as regularly as I have in the past.
 
annk

annk

Administrator
Staff member
Apr 18, 2004
15,140
9,351
Somewhere over the rainbow
bruinsrme said:
I have.
On the other hand it seems the opinions of the mods sometimes go further than what I have seen in some posts that were ultimately deleted " cleaned up ;) "

It's their playground and their rules.

Because of it I don't frequent macrumors as regularly as I have in the past.
Click to expand...

If there are rules you feel are unreasonable, or moderation that doesn't seem to jive with the rules as you experience them, you can bring these up in a separate SFF thread. We can't give out any details of specific moderation (unless the person involved specifically states that it's ok that we do so), but we can and are more than willing to discuss things on a general level, and to take feedback with us into our internal discussions afterwards.

I can tell you that the one goal we have with moderation is to keep the place running in a way that's acceptable to the greatest number of users, most of the time. Anything more than that is impossible (and it's a pretty tall order to begin with, considering we have over 700 000 members!).

Seriously, it's better to bring stuff up than to stay away from MR. I know you all can't see it, but there's often pretty intense and lively debate behind the scenes about feedback from members. We DO listen. :cool:
 
balamw

balamw

Moderator emeritus
Aug 16, 2005
19,366
979
New England
wordoflife said:
Sending a PM is useless because they refuse to believe that they might have mesed up.
Clicking "report a problem" isn't going to reverse the problem
Creating a public thread gets deleted (surprised that this one has not been, tbh)
Click to expand...

MOD NOTE: That's because all three are on the "What not to do" list in the Moderation FAQ

  • Do not lose your temper. The moderators are willing to answer questions and the administrators are willing to review moderation cases, but blowing up will not help you make your case.
  • Do not contact us without reviewing the information listed above. You'll be wasting your time and ours.
  • Do not send a Private Message to dispute moderation. Instead use the Contact form so that administrators can review the case independently.
  • Do not report a reminder or warning message as if you were reporting an inappropriate Private Message, since you will not get a reply.
  • Do not post about the moderation of a thread in that thread. To ask general questions about moderation or moderation policies, post in the Site and Forum Feedback Forum. To ask questions about specific cases of moderation, use the Contact form. To maintain user privacy we do not answer questions about specific cases of moderation in forum threads. There is one exception - see point 2 under Moderation Privacy.
  • Do not insult the moderators for doing their job. Insulting any forum member is against the rules.
  • Do not re-register during a time-out or after a ban. You will likely be recognized and permanently banned. Trying to bypass a time-out or ban shows an unwillingness to respect the rules that will dim any chance you have of retaining your account or being reinstated after a ban.
Click to expand...

The only proper way to question a specific act of moderation is the Contact Us form.

We're far from infallible, and as annk has indicated we don't always agree. Above all we are users here, and are about as diverse a bunch of people as the overall user base.

We do try to enforce the rules in a somewhat consistent way though even though we may not interpret a rule the same way as another mod we try to follow the general trend until we discuss it and come to another approach by changing the rules or how we interpret them.

B
 
firedept

firedept

macrumors 603
Jul 8, 2011
6,277
1,130
Somewhere!
We all have to live by rules. For the last few years I have been a diligent reader of the forums without becoming a member. Last year I became a member so I could post. I read the rules and will abide by them the best I can. Do we all not have rules where we work? Or if we are the boss or owner, do we not have rules in place to keep order?

If you think the rules here are tough, try being a member of any emergency service. They have very strict rules and I speak from experience. Break the rules there and the punishment can be harsh. Much harsher than simply having a post moderated or removed. The information I have gained from these forums far exceeds a couple of rules.

It is about respect for other members. I always tell my trainees that if you are not happy with the rules then you know what you have to do. We are not all well spoken, so a little moderation sometimes does no harm.
 
kastorff

kastorff

macrumors regular
Oct 7, 2006
132
20
Yep.

[EDIT: Discussion of a specific case of moderation removed.]

In the big picture, it's nothing. I wouldn't have handled it that way, but I don't walk in his shoes. Administration and moderation of forums this active is a way harder job than one might think.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
lostngone

lostngone

macrumors 65816
Aug 11, 2003
1,431
3,804
Anchorage
Yes...

Yes;
Most times it was warranted.

However once or twice I have had posts moved to wasteland for reasons I can not explain...
 
kastorff

kastorff

macrumors regular
Oct 7, 2006
132
20
balamw said:
MOD NOTE: Please follow the rules and do not discuss any specific cases of moderation.

B
Click to expand...

You know how general the post was. No one else will, I guess. I guess the OP passes the test, and I didn't. Too bad. I figured if this thread passed, my comment would. :)
 
balamw

balamw

Moderator emeritus
Aug 16, 2005
19,366
979
New England
kastorff said:
You know how general the post was. No one else will, I guess. I guess the OP passes the test, and I didn't. Too bad. I figured if this thread passed, my comment would. :)
Click to expand...

MOD NOTE: Sometimes posts are deleted/edited for the way they can take a thread down a particular path, not the specific contents of the post. This was one of those cases.

Your story was more detailed than the OP and other posts in the thread to date and was seen (by more than one mod) to be right at or to have crossed the line.


----------
lostngone said:
However once or twice I have had posts moved to wasteland for reasons I can not explain...
Click to expand...

MOD NOTE: Threads can be sent to Wasteland for many reasons having nothing to do with the original post. Sometimes it is just too difficult to save a thread once it has been derailed, .... Don't take it personally. We can't always send a PM or reminder when we move a thread to Wasteland.

B
 
kastorff

kastorff

macrumors regular
Oct 7, 2006
132
20
balamw said:
MOD NOTE: Sometimes posts are deleted/edited for the way they can take a thread down a particular path, not the specific contents of the post. This was one of those cases.

Your story was more detailed than the OP and other posts in the thread to date and was seen (by more than one mod) to be right at or to have crossed the line.
Click to expand...

Understood.
 
GoCubsGo

GoCubsGo

macrumors Nehalem
Feb 19, 2005
35,741
153
I've broken rules and was put in time out a few times. I've had a couple of posts where I was put in time out because the mods believed what I said broke the rules but their own biased interpretation of my post caused their error in judgement. I've had posts moved, deleted, and edited for a variety of reasons: to remain on track, to remove a deleted quoted post, duplicate posting, someone is cranky, etc.

This is not my site. I am not a mod. I have no financial vested interest in the site. If they want to make rules on the fly then I can take my toys home and go, I would not be missed. I deal with it because I lose sleep over dozens of things every day; this is not one of them.
 
A

Aspasia

macrumors 65816
Jun 9, 2011
1,345
101
Halfway between the Equator and North Pole
I've had one reply deleted - was in the thread about removing the down vote option. No big deal.

On the other hand, I left a another iForum because one of the mods was blatant about flirting and self-promotion - not to mention a blinking, winking two-inch signature line. Never figured out why the owners kept her on and didn't bother to ask.
 
aarond12

aarond12

macrumors 65816
May 20, 2002
1,145
107
Dallas, TX USA
I got a post deleted for saying, "It smells like a troll in here.", along with a warning to follow the forum rules.

The reasoning was "you shouldn't be calling people trolls". :confused: I didn't call anyone a troll; it was insinuated. In no way did I directly call anyone a troll.

Since then, I found MANY posts where people are directly calling other people names and using insults... and the posts are not getting deleted. :mad:

Consistency matters, mods.
 
ucfgrad93

ucfgrad93

macrumors Core
Aug 17, 2007
19,535
10,821
Colorado
I've had a few posts deleted over the years I've been posting here. It is a private forum and they can do what they want to. If it becomes too egregious then I'll go elsewhere. But I am satisfied with how this site is run. I appreciate the moderators that keep the level of discussion usually quite high, unlike some other websites.
 
chown33

chown33

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2009
10,747
8,421
A sea of green
aarond12 said:
Since then, I found MANY posts where people are directly calling other people names and using insults... and the posts are not getting deleted. :mad:

Consistency matters, mods.
Click to expand...

Did you report the posts for name-calling? If not, then how would the moderators know?
 
annk

annk

Administrator
Staff member
Apr 18, 2004
15,140
9,351
Somewhere over the rainbow
aarond12 said:
I got a post deleted for saying, "It smells like a troll in here.", along with a warning to follow the forum rules.

The reasoning was "you shouldn't be calling people trolls". :confused: I didn't call anyone a troll; it was insinuated. In no way did I directly call anyone a troll.

Since then, I found MANY posts where people are directly calling other people names and using insults... and the posts are not getting deleted. :mad:

Consistency matters, mods.
Click to expand...

Sigh. Don't post about specific moderation in public threads. As it very, very clearly states in the forum rules, send us a message via the Contact Us form. We will be more than happy to answer it.
 
LostSoul80

LostSoul80

macrumors 68020
Jan 25, 2009
2,136
7
Yes, but I don't care. I don't give internet forums in general almost any importance.
 
aarond12

aarond12

macrumors 65816
May 20, 2002
1,145
107
Dallas, TX USA
chown33 said:
Did you report the posts for name-calling? If not, then how would the moderators know?
Click to expand...
I did. The posts remained.

----------
annk said:
Sigh. Don't post about specific moderation in public threads. As it very, very clearly states in the forum rules, send us a message via the Contact Us form. We will be more than happy to answer it.
Click to expand...
I believe I did. If I remember, I got an answer that just said the same thing.

If you want to remove the post I just made in reference to this moderation decision, feel free. My point in posting this was that some moderators have a hair-trigger while others have a normal, human amount of tolerance.
 
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