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Why no Thunderbolt to USB 3 hub/converter

L

lloyd709

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jan 10, 2008
312
0
The only device I can see on the market that will give you this is using the Sonnet Tempo Thunderbolt to ExpressCard adaptor and then use a USB 3.0 ExpressCard. This at least proves that it must be technically possible. If I use one of these though I won't be able to connect to a screen at the same time - unless I'm missing something.

Is there sort of technical problem with Thunderbolt tripping company's up on this. I've been waiting for about a year for someone to bring something to market and no one has. A couple of companies have been sporting pictures of thunderbolt docks for many months now but nothing tangible has come from them.

What's the problem? There must be problem because there must be a massive market just waiting for one of these.
 
G

g4cube

macrumors 6502a
Apr 22, 2003
760
13
I think the problem is simple.

I think people are willing to spend no more than $19 or $29 for such an adapter of hub.

Apple has done so for Ethernet and for FireWire. Perhaps they might do one for USB 3.0. they certainly have the capability.

With component costs being what they are, I don't think there are any companies other than Apple who would or could build such a product. There simply is not enough margin to do so.

For example, from the various take-apart videos and pictures available of the Ethernet to Thunderbolt dongle, it is clear that it is a complex project. Few other than Apple have the ability to make something similar at low cost, or are able to subsidize the product.
 
AZREOSpecialist

AZREOSpecialist

Suspended
Mar 15, 2009
2,354
1,278
lloyd709 said:
The only device I can see on the market that will give you this is using the Sonnet Tempo Thunderbolt to ExpressCard adaptor and then use a USB 3.0 ExpressCard. This at least proves that it must be technically possible. If I use one of these though I won't be able to connect to a screen at the same time - unless I'm missing something.

Is there sort of technical problem with Thunderbolt tripping company's up on this. I've been waiting for about a year for someone to bring something to market and no one has. A couple of companies have been sporting pictures of thunderbolt docks for many months now but nothing tangible has come from them.

What's the problem? There must be problem because there must be a massive market just waiting for one of these.
Click to expand...

Why would you want a USB3 hub via Thunderbolt when today's MacBook Pros have several USB3 ports - to any of which you can attach a hub?
 
A

asdad123

macrumors regular
Jun 16, 2010
155
0
AZREOSpecialist said:
Why would you want a USB3 hub via Thunderbolt when today's MacBook Pros have several USB3 ports - to any of which you can attach a hub?
Click to expand...

I would really appreciate one for my TB display (just an adapter, not a dock. I only have one USB 3.0 HDD)
 
L

lloyd709

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jan 10, 2008
312
0
AZREOSpecialist said:
Why would you want a USB3 hub via Thunderbolt when today's MacBook Pros have several USB3 ports - to any of which you can attach a hub?
Click to expand...

For one reason not everyone has a new macbook pro or want's to buy one!!

For a second reason - not wanting to start another topic - some people still have software that only runs on Rosetta - and hence tied into Snowleopard (that can't run on USB3 equipped MacBook pros!!
 
dusk007

dusk007

macrumors 68040
Dec 5, 2009
3,411
104
The problem is easily explained.

As you said yourself it requires an PCIe USB3 card.
A hub wouldn't be much different.
You need a USB controller cheap no problem.
You need a thunderbolt controller not cheap at all.
You need a quite complicated set up so those work together.

The Apple TV has a logicboard inside that competes with any Apple TV to deliver those functions. The one in the Seagate goflex takes the area of an HDD. Look at thunderbolt devices. Compare that to USB devices that fit on a fingernail.
They have quite expensive logicboards in there with not so cheap chips on them. Making a Thunderbolt to USB 3 hub is possible but not worth it. Just too expensive and very few people are willing to pay for it.
Most people today have USB 3 and would rather get a USB hub for a tenth of the price.
Doing anything with Thunderbolt is only worth it if the device is expensive. Like a full blown dock that offers a lot more than just USB ports.
Or a display that costs 1000 bucks anyway.
Or an expensive raid nas drive.

All the external Thunderbolt HDDs that exist charge about 100$ for the Thunderbolt in it. That is about what you could expect as a price for a such a hub.
Especially if all you want is to connect the one external HDD you own to a fast port you won't pay for a hub that costs more than your external drive. It is more likely people use Gbit LAN or suffer USB 2 until they get a new notebook.

Thunderbolt is a bad product because it is just too expensive for all the small stuff as in single devices and this won't change anytime soon. That is what we have cheap USB 3 for. USB requires little space, small controllers and almost no money.
It sucks that the 2011 MBP didn't have USB3 which is why wouldn't have bought one.

I think the best option is Displays that come with thunderbolt support. Asus is launching one and others will follow. A decent external display you might need anyway and the added thunderbolt costs shouldn't be too bad. You get USB 3.0 on the display.
I don't know what it costs but it will probably be cheaper than the Apple one but also not as cheap as comparable alternatives.
 
Z

ZipZap

macrumors 603
Dec 14, 2007
6,076
1,448
A thunderbolt hub that offers USB 3 is certainly possible for any generation Mac with a thunderbolt jack.

The beauty of the hub...less or no dongles.

I want just one wire leaving my rMBP...have 4 right now.

Apple should offer one as they already have it...just need to put it in a simpler box.
 
T

ThePreditor

macrumors member
Aug 2, 2012
40
0
AZREOSpecialist said:
Why would you want a USB3 hub via Thunderbolt when today's MacBook Pros have several USB3 ports - to any of which you can attach a hub?
Click to expand...

Because I like my 17" MacBook Pro. But clients give me USB 3 drives sometimes. A thunderbolt to USB 3 adapter would be quite useful.
 
B

beamer8912

macrumors 65816
May 30, 2009
1,137
3
That's an interesting conundrum. Thunderbolt but no USB 3.0. I can see how an adapter would be appreciated, but it's a bit of a niche market since there are only a couple years of thunderbolt but no USB 3.0.

I wouldn't expect apple to make one since they're really pushing TB. I really think they want all other ports to disappear leaving just two TB ports necessary to run all your equipment.
 
G

g4cube

macrumors 6502a
Apr 22, 2003
760
13
ThePreditor said:
Because I like my 17" MacBook Pro. But clients give me USB 3 drives sometimes. A thunderbolt to USB 3 adapter would be quite useful.
Click to expand...

You do know that a USB 3.0 drive will work fine in a USB 2.0 port, right?

It will just be slower, but still functional.

There are also ExpressCard USB 3.0 adapters for the lone slot on your 17" Macbook Pro, and I believe the CalDigit, LaCie, or Sonnet drivers, too.
 
T

ThePreditor

macrumors member
Aug 2, 2012
40
0
g4cube said:
You do know that a USB 3.0 drive will work fine in a USB 2.0 port, right?

It will just be slower, but still functional.
Click to expand...

Right, but speed is the issue here, so USB 2.0 is next to useless for me when transferring 500GB worth of footage in a timely manner.
 
importraverxx

importraverxx

macrumors regular
Aug 1, 2010
169
176
firewire 800? i have a 15" late 2011 too and its perfectly fine. I use fcp x daily on it. Get a G-Drive and you good to go. Or if you wanna swap drive then get a firewire 800 enclosure, its like 30 bucks.
 
pgiguere1

pgiguere1

macrumors 68020
May 28, 2009
2,167
1,200
Montreal, Canada
The price of Thunderbolt controllers is so high that a company would have to price such an adapter at a higher price than what most customers are willing to pay. They know they wouldn't sell much, so the lack of economy of scale would make it even more expensive.

We were in the same situation with FireWire not too long ago. We would have needed a Sonnet Tempo + FireWire ExpressCard + Thunderbolt cable which sums up to around 300$.

Apple decided to make Thunderbolt to FireWire / Ethernet adapters just to sell more rMBPs. I doubt the adapters themselves are profitable at all, when you see just a Thunderbolt cable is 49$ and iFixit claims the price is justified by all the active components it has. Even 3rd party Thunderbolt cables are almost as expensive.

Apple just made sure you can buy a rMBP even if you need Ethernet or FireWire, but they probably don't care about those who won't buy a new computer and just need adapters. All new MacBooks have USB3, so a Thunderbolt to USB3 adapter would only benefit users who own older Macs.

If the adapter had to be priced at 29$ and wouldn't be profitable, Apple would have no interest in investing time into making it unless it would encourage people to buy new Macs, which it wouldn't. It would have to be profitable by itself to justify investing time in making it.

Now the question is: Would you buy a $99 Thunderbolt to USB3 adapter? Apple and other companies predicted the answer would be no for pretty much everybody, so that's why such an adapter doesn't exist.

Now of course Thunderbolt controllers become cheaper with time and Thunderbolt will be coming to PCs so there's still hope in the future.
 
lugesm

lugesm

macrumors 6502a
Sep 7, 2007
572
9
Any UPDATES on this ? ? ?

Corning has announced 100M Thunderbolt cables, and Apple has introduced a 0.5M Thunderbolt cable and several adapters for Thunderbolt to xxx.

But, I still cannot find an offering by anyone for a Thunderbolt to USB-3 hub . . . unless you consider the highly expensive Belkin docking station. At $400 that's just plain foolish.:(
 
P

Ploki

macrumors 601
Jan 21, 2008
4,308
1,558
lugesm said:
Corning has announced 100M Thunderbolt cables, and Apple has introduced a 0.5M Thunderbolt cable and several adapters for Thunderbolt to xxx.

But, I still cannot find an offering by anyone for a Thunderbolt to USB-3 hub . . . unless you consider the highly expensive Belkin docking station. At $400 that's just plain foolish.:(
Click to expand...

It's 299$ now, and its supposed to be out in a few weeks I believe.

And I think OWC is rumored to sell one...

but everything is vaporware for now. :/
 
lugesm

lugesm

macrumors 6502a
Sep 7, 2007
572
9
Ploki said:
It's 299$ now, and its supposed to be out in a few weeks I believe.

And I think OWC is rumored to sell one...

but everything is vaporware for now. :/
Click to expand...

Thanks for the update. Still a pretty steep price, but it looks like a very useful product.
 
B

biallystock

macrumors member
Jun 2, 2009
39
0
Ploki said:
It's 299$ now, and its supposed to be out in a few weeks I believe.

And I think OWC is rumored to sell one...

but everything is vaporware for now. :/
Click to expand...

Still says $399! and just to connect a $79 drive!

Even if you could get it. The Belkin Thunderbolt hub has been on pre-order for over 8 months now. Should be out in time for the Thunderbolt farewell party.

Only in Appleland does this pretend to make sense.
 
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