Apple Stock Down 10% in After Hours Trading Amidst Concerns of Flat Growth

Clearly a pump-and-dump strategy going in here. Large investors tank the stock and find a new reason to herald the company anew, which will shoot it back up again.

What happened the past few weeks was so transparently obvious. It started with some rational profit-taking which lowered the stock, and they took it as an opportunity to run it through a grind cycle. All the street needed was a reason.

That said, Tim Cook **** the bed big time by releasing highly constrained products during Apple's largest quarter. Insomuch as Apple faltered, that was all Tim - aka master of the supply chain. Or maybe not.

pipa said:

Just imagine selling millions if tv's at $2,000 to $3,000 a set.

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Who's going to pay $2000-$3000 for a TV set apart from a handful of Apple & tech enthusiasts? Here in the UK you can get decent smart TV's for as little as £400. The average consumer is simply not going to spent $2-3k on a TV set. Ever.

I thought growth was based on revenues not profit. And Apple's revenue did grow. iPhone and iPad sales YOY were up. Yes profit was flat and margins were compressed but a lot of new stuff was introduced late in the year so costs will be higher. But if we're using profit to define whether a company is growing or not then Amazon isn't really growing at all is it?

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towg said:

'Flat growth' is such a 'reality distortion field' kinda term.

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And what metric shows that Apple had flat growth. Profit isn't growth. Heck Amazon is all about growth even if it's at the expense of profits.

Steve121178 said:

Who's going to pay $2000-$3000 for a TV set apart from a handful of Apple & tech enthusiasts? Here in the UK you can get decent smart TV's for as little as £400. The average consumer is simply not going to spent $2-3k on a TV set. Ever.

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Back in 2006:

J.Doe said:

Who's going to pay $700-$800 for a phone apart from a handful of Apple & tech enthusiasts? Here in the UK you can get decent phones for as little as £80. The average consumer is simply not going to spent $700-800 on a phone. Ever.

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wilhelmer said:

Back in 2006:

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And people didn't bough $800 phones, people started to buy the iPhone when it started to be subsidized.

wilhelmer said:

Back in 2006:

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A ridiculous analogy. In 2006 people were already paying up to £600 for stuff like Nokia N9x series phones anyway so that was still the going rate for high end phones.

The average consumer will simply not pay $2-3K for a TV set, particularly in these tough economic times and particularly when people can buy great TV sets for a fraction of that cost. What is $2-3k, more than a months wages for the vast majority of people in the US and Europe? That money will not go on a TV set.

This is why one of my top rules of investing is to sell before conference calls no matter how good you think they may be. Someone always finds a negative to the call and if that is the case then the stock drops 10-20%. If the stock blows the market away then it goes up like 3-5% or so. It isn't worth it. I sold the day of the previous conference call when it was at $610. I was waiting for this call before I considered getting back in.

Let's say the growth has peaked and they maintain single digit growth percentages for the next 5 years or so. What kind of PE would the company deserve in that case?

Face it, Apple didnt really invent anything new for the past few years. Yes, the iPhone 5 is a great phone with great specs, iPad is also great and so on but other than that nothing really new. And market analysts know that, just like you all do but most of you still close your eyes to this fact.

i think i called this at about 700$

No body wants to buy shares at hundreds of dollars each. Why dont they do a stock split. Then it might go up.

but most likey hit 400 given patterns

pipa said:

This stock is a steal at this price. If/when apple attacks the TV market it is going to take that company into another stratosphere. Just imagine selling millions if tv's at $2,000 to $3,000 a set. I know ill be a day one buyer. And trust me when Steve was alive he said that he cracked the tv and knows what we need. Just remember in 07 when he cracked the cell phone what happened. With apples ecosystem in place and icloud a TV is the last piece of the puzzle and the possibilities of what can be done is incredible. FaceTime, iMessage,apps made for the set, safari. It's going to be amazing.

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Samsung is already doing this, not sure it will be that big of a splash.

Wait until the retina display iPad mini and retina display MBA drop. OMFG!

The Wall Street Journal's Tom Gara notes that Apple's losses in market cap today were roughly equal the value of two Research in Motions and two Nokias.

Why did she compare to two companies that were both in very serious trouble, one has kind of managed to pull itself back but not fully, the other was rescued, of course they are not going to be anywhere near the value of Apple. Also 10% is a massive amount in anyones books. Looks like investors want to see growth, not excuses. This is becoming a bit of a trend of late with AAPL, be interesting to see where it goes..

If you think about it, apple has really made the same 3 or four products in its entire history

Smartass said:

Face it, Apple didnt really invent anything new for the past few years. Yes, the iPhone 5 is a great phone with great specs, iPad is also great and so on but other than that nothing really new. And market analysts know that, just like you all do but most of you still close your eyes to this fact.

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Smartass said:

Face it, Apple didnt really invent anything new for the past few years. Yes, the iPhone 5 is a great phone with great specs, iPad is also great and so on but other than that nothing really new. And market analysts know that, just like you all do but most of you still close your eyes to this fact.

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What have others invented? Is bigger screened phones an invention?

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pandamonia said:

i think i called this at about 700$

No body wants to buy shares at hundreds of dollars each. Why dont they do a stock split. Then it might go up.

but most likey hit 400 given patterns

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Google went way up yesterday.

The rate of increase of profit every year is growth, apple had almost none

In hard core alpple fan language it means apple is peddling harder to make the same profit. Like dell

Rogifan said:

I thought growth was based on revenues not profit. And Apple's revenue did grow. iPhone and iPad sales YOY were up. Yes profit was flat and margins were compressed but a lot of new stuff was introduced late in the year so costs will be higher. But if we're using profit to define whether a company is growing or not then Amazon isn't really growing at all is it?

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And what metric shows that Apple had flat growth. Profit isn't growth. Heck Amazon is all about growth even if it's at the expense of profits.

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I sold the bulk of my Apple stock 2 weeks ago.

I am so HAPPY now as wasnt sure at the time.

I will be celebrating this weekend!

JayJayAbels said:

The ONLY questions you need to ask yourself is... do you agree with the way they run their business and do you see them bringing out some new innovative tech in the short term which would be attractive to consumers?

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No matter how high the stock price may be? If the stock were at $2000, or if the P/E were at 50, would your question really be the only thing to consider?

If not , then why is it the only thing to consider now?

Macrumors, the place you come for investment advice from people that have their entire portfolio in one stock.

pipa said:

This stock is a steal at this price. If/when apple attacks the TV market it is going to take that company into another stratosphere. Just imagine selling millions if tv's at $2,000 to $3,000 a set. I know ill be a day one buyer.

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The real question is what is the market size for TV's at that price.

In the US, sharp has around 70% of the 60"+ market and expects to sell around a million units. Many of their sets sell in the 1000 -1500$ dollar range. Given those numbers I'd say imagining Apple selling millions at 2 - 3K is just that - imagination.

And trust me when Steve was alive he said that he cracked the tv and knows what we need. Just remember in 07 when he cracked the cell phone what happened. With apples ecosystem in place and icloud a TV is the last piece of the puzzle and the possibilities of what can be done is incredible. FaceTime, iMessage,apps made for the set, safari. It's going to be amazing.

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Cracking TV doesn't mean building a set - Apple could deliver content w/o making a TV. Taking on cable rather than Sharp may be a better path. That's not to say they won't make a TV - but I don't think that is what Steve meant when he said they'd cracked TV.

ksgant said:

Aaaaaandd....that's it. I'm done trying to figure out the stock market.

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Don't give up. Your level of understanding has nowhere to go but up.

Rogifan said:

I thought growth was based on revenues not profit. And Apple's revenue did grow. iPhone and iPad sales YOY were up. Yes profit was flat and margins were compressed but a lot of new stuff was introduced late in the year so costs will be higher. But if we're using profit to define whether a company is growing or not then Amazon isn't really growing at all is it?

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And what metric shows that Apple had flat growth. Profit isn't growth. Heck Amazon is all about growth even if it's at the expense of profits.

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The basic concept is as revenue grows profits will follow since many costs do not grow at the same rate as revenue; unless you have an unusual way of accounting for costs. For example, sales and marketing costs should grow at a much slower rate; unless of course you include shipping costs as part of sales and marketing, which they should not be but doing so would mask your true cost structure.

!!

Still wish I had bought stock in Apple!

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Concept design for iphone with 4.8inch screen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6pKfgaGPvU

parapup said:

they will badly need disruptive new product or at least leaps and bounds improvements to existing ones. And there are no winds of that for past couple years and counting.

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because iPhone needs more apps I don't need installed and OSX still doesn't do what I want to do on a daily basis.

Steve121178 said:

Who's going to pay $2000-$3000 for a TV set apart from a handful of Apple & tech enthusiasts? Here in the UK you can get decent smart TV's for as little as £400. The average consumer is simply not going to spent $2-3k on a TV set. Ever.

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If consumers think there's enough value in a $2000 TV, they will buy. I don't think Apple will price themselves out of the market - they aren't dumb. People claim "Apple are expensive".. but yet, look at Apple - their products are selling. iPad mini is selling well, despite it being at a price point higher than what was originally speculated by analysts.