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Michael Scrip

macrumors 604
Mar 4, 2011
7,929
12,480
NC
One thing this Surface has, that the Air does not, is that touch-screen with a Wacom pen. That to me sounds like a strong selling point, at least to graphic artists. So many pressure-sensitive bluetooth pens are being made for the iPad, with varying success, but the Surface comes with the pen out of the box.

I'm reminded of all the tablet PCs that came before it. They had a stylus.

What's different today versus the decade of tablet PCs before?
 

Aidan5806

macrumors 6502
Feb 20, 2012
312
0
I think one of the biggest problems this tablet will have is with battery life in the real world. It has a battery smaller than the iPad's, a fairly demanding processor in terms of power consumption (for a tablet with this battery), a 1080p 10.6" display, 2 fans, 2 touch sub-systems, 64 bit pathways, DDR3 RAM, full desktop-style multitasking, and many other laptop-style components, all on a smallish battery. And its running full windows 8, which in my experience draws slightly more power that 7 on the same system. I find it hard to believe that this device can go for more that 4 or 5 hours without a charge.
 

ThunderSkunk

macrumors 68040
Dec 31, 2007
3,814
4,036
Milwaukee Area
Dammit MS, still can't get it right.

Barely powerful enough to run vanilla Autocad, and still not powerful enough to run Autodesk Inventor.

The old Motion 1300's could run then-current Inventor 6. Perhaps I should hunt down one of those decade+ old creaky slates for a sketchbook instead.

+100 points for the wacom digitizer, but -several million for the same old underpowered, underperforming tablet strategy as before.
 

zhenlek

macrumors newbie
Jul 5, 2012
27
0
[url=http://cdn.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogodarkd.png]Image[/url]



- "Of the 64 GB of solid-state storage on the entry-level $899 model, only 30 GB of that is free for the user, according to Microsoft. On the $999 model, 90 GB of the 128 GB total is available for the user."


Gizmodo




Article Link: First Reviews of Microsoft Surface Pro: Good Display, Full Windows 8, Compromised Experience

30GB available for a 64GB storage? Who would put up with that kind of crap? Just get a MacBook Air.....
 

Roessnakhan

macrumors 68040
Sep 16, 2007
3,518
510
ABQ
I'm reminded of all the tablet PCs that came before it. They had a stylus.

What's different today versus the decade of tablet PCs before?

Multitouch. Having the option to use a stylus IN ADDITION to your fingers is great. So many people buy a stylus because while interacting with the OS is better with your finger, drawing or note taking something more complex than words (math problems, diagrams) is better with a stylus.
 
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Navdakilla

macrumors 65816
Feb 3, 2011
1,100
13
Canada
played around with one for a bit at the local tech store.. not a fan.
If I was on the market for a windows 8 laptop. I would get a touch screen ultrabook.
 

Jensend

macrumors 65816
Dec 19, 2008
1,361
1,574
I'd like to see a ~$1000 MacBook Air with an IPS display (doesn't need to be Retina, though that would be a plus)

I'd also like to an iPad with with Wacom tech.

Don't necessarily need both at the same time.
 

Aidan5806

macrumors 6502
Feb 20, 2012
312
0
Although the 64gb iPad still has more actual storage than the 128gb surface ;)

I KNOW RIGHT. Frankly i think the fact that Microsoft feels comfortable shipping a device (and now 2) where the majority of the storage is consumed by the OS and bloatware the OEM calls features. The mail app in widows 8 is pure s***, yet it takes up about 200mbs on the hard drive. You can't even install windows 8 on a 20 gb hard drive, yet OS X has the same functionality and more, and can run on 20 GB with space to spare.
 

bdkennedy1

Suspended
Oct 24, 2002
1,275
528
By the time Microsoft makes its revisions they will be so behind everyone else. They are too big and clunky to make quick changes. They are too much like Blackberry and HP. By the time they figure out how to copy someone else, they are 3 years behind in the market.

At this point they need to focus on Office and Xbox. And if Apple succeeds at casual gaming in the living room, Microsoft may even lose that in the next 5 years.

What happens when you try to please everyone when developing your product? It takes forever to bring it to market. This is a major distinction of why Apple can bring new products to market quickly and other companies take forever.

I used to work for TI. Back in 2000, they were still supporting their products running Windows 3.0 because there were a few countries still using it. I told management, how are you ever going to move forward in technology supporting a 13 year old OS that even Microsoft doesn't support anymore?

At some point in the next 2 years, we are going to get the power of a Core 2 Duo in the thinness of an iPad, and Microsoft's path will probably make sense. Until then, we are going to see the same fumbling that Apple had with the first MacBook Air which was terribly expensive ($1799+), ran too hot, had too little storage, was slow, and only one USB port. And sales didnt take off for a while. And boom, October 2010 revision rolls around with all flash storage at $999 entry price point and a legend is born. Everyone knew that the future of computing would come from the DNA in the MacBook Air, it just wasnt worth owning in 2008.

So just remember that even if the first version sucks (and for any product, it's almost bound to), the revisions are what you really need to watch out for.
 
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Aidan5806

macrumors 6502
Feb 20, 2012
312
0
I'd like to see a ~$1000 MacBook Air with an IPS display (doesn't need to be Retina, though that would be a plus)

I'd also like to an iPad with with Wacom tech.

Don't necessarily need both at the same time.

As for the MBA, you will probably get your wish around WWDC. But I'm not to sure about the Wacom support. The problem is that unless its an app, or standard tech (which i dont consider Wacom, though some artsy folk might), apple, is very stingy on licensing other companies' hardware tech.
 

Michael Scrip

macrumors 604
Mar 4, 2011
7,929
12,480
NC
Multitouch. Using your fingers and having the OPTION to use a stylus in addition to your fingers is great. So many people buy a stylus because while interacting with the OS is better with your finger, drawing or note taking something more complex than words (math problems, diagrams) is better with a stylus.

Ah... so bad touchscreens and styluses were the reason the tablet PC didn't take off all those years ago. I thought it was something else.

Glad to know that in 2013 people will finally get the stylus experience they've been waiting for since 2001.
 

iphone495

macrumors member
Sep 13, 2012
86
0
The "Cool" Factor

I think Microsoft is finally beginning to get the hang of the "cool" factor.
 

blahblah100

macrumors 6502
Sep 10, 2009
272
30
Although the 64gb iPad still has more actual storage than the 128gb surface ;)

Care to elaborate? From my reading, I read "On the $999 model, 90 GB of the 128 GB total is available for the user" which does not align with your comment given than 90 > 64
 

ThunderSkunk

macrumors 68040
Dec 31, 2007
3,814
4,036
Milwaukee Area
I'd also like to an iPad with with Wacom tech.

Yep. Every time I hear someone say the iPad can only improve by incremental performance bumps to its existing hardware, it makes me realize how few of us have written or drawn on-screen with Wacoms precision digitizer. The iPad will become a much more usable platform once that input technology is integrated in.

Apple should buy Wacom, even if they don't utilize it for years yet. Enjoy that revenue stream for a bit, & then pull the rug out from everyone and feature it solely in their own products. Blammo.
 

Roessnakhan

macrumors 68040
Sep 16, 2007
3,518
510
ABQ
Ah... so bad touchscreens and styluses were the reason the tablet PC didn't take off all those years ago. I thought it was something else.

Glad to know that in 2013 people will finally get the stylus experience they've been waiting for since 2001.

An iPad with stylus support from someone like Wacom would be amazing. Paper is a great app, but with a Wacom stylus it would be a game changer.
 

macsrcool1234

Suspended
Oct 7, 2010
1,551
2,130
It's ridiculously expensive...the price of keyboard and cover just put it over the top.

Barely any space left on HD, runs a crappy version of an already crappy OS (im a huge windows 7 fanboy).

Please get rid of Ballmer MS.
 

1Alec1

macrumors regular
As expected, it's junk. Just an overpriced laptop.

----------

Please get rid of Ballmer MS.

How has he been CEO for so long? He's made Microsoft a laughingstock.

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"Of the 64 GB of solid-state storage on the entry-level $899 model, only 30 GB of that is free for the user, according to Microsoft. On the $999 model, 90 GB of the 128 GB total is available for the user."

WTF is it using the other approx 30 GB for??!!! Don't tell me that's how much Windows 8 alone takes! Actually, that's the only possible answer (or some horrible file system).
 

monkor

macrumors regular
May 25, 2012
169
1
Tablets won't replace laptops until they're truly better than a laptop, and I think the surface pro hits the nail on the head in that regard. Wether you like it or not, the surface is the future.

It really is. The touch screen laptop is truly something to behold, especially when it functions as a tablet as well. I've tried the Surface more than a few times, and I'm considering picking up the Pro version.

I only hope Microsoft doesn't suffer to fate of the Sega Dreamcast, for lack of a better product to exact this scenario. The Dreamcast was ahead of it's time; I mean, way ahead of it's time with online play and 480p. Unfortunately, it was early to the market and flopped, while others (PlayStation, Xbox, GameCube) copied and slightly refined it to massive levels of success.

It'd be a shame to see a company who innovated greatly suffer the same fate as Sega.
 

jfriedman8

macrumors 6502
Feb 8, 2008
259
3
I dont know about everyone else, but I thought that these touch screen laptops / hybrids were a terrible idea. I went and played with a few of them, and I am beginning to come around- they're pretty cool. Never thought I'd say this, but I think Apple has some catching up to do in this area. Being able to touch the screen every so often makes for a solid experience on a laptop/convertible. On the Windows side, I'd say all of the products out are a revision or two away. Hoping Apple comes out with something that would be up to par on the first release in this area.
 

StealthGhost

macrumors regular
Oct 13, 2010
131
0
The Zune was better and cheaper than the iPod, why are you people comparing it to this. Plus the software was amazing, while iTunes continues to suck

Surface however, yea...no thanks.
 

PinoyAko

macrumors 6502
Nov 25, 2012
272
1
That 30gb remaining for the user to use on will eventually be eaten up by gargantuan set of windows updates in the next few weeks.
 
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