Mac Pro/Hackintosh...

Liquinn said:

Is a Mac Pro better than a hackintosh?

Oh and an added bonus: if you take the EULA literally, it says you can only run mac OS on Apple branded hardware. Well, if you mod a G5 case then it's Apple branded. I put one of the Apple stickers that came with Snow Leopard on my Dell Mini 9 for this reason.

I mean, are they going to stop you from taking your Apple purchased hardware and say you can no longer run MacOS if you put it in a custom wooden box? They don't really specify what the base hardware requirements are to be in compliance with the EULA.

Cheers.

Click to expand...

It depends.

Like so many things in life, it depends on what "better" means to you.

Faster? You can build a faster Hackintosh. Better graphics? Hackintosh. USB3? Hackintosh. Any form factor you want? Hackintosh.

Want to grab your tower by the handle, hop on the #80 bus and take it to the Apple store for servicing? Mac Pro. Want to install OSX without worrying about hardware compatibility lists and special kexts? Mac Pro. Resale value? Probably the Mac Pro.

Some "pros" want the best specs for the money. Others prefer to minimize downtime if something goes wrong. It all depends on your needs.

Yes, it depends on your needs, budget, level of computer knowledge, patience and a few other things.

I just recently retired my 2008 Mac Pro and built a hackintosh. I did this for a number of reasons. Cost was a big factor, I had already upgraded my Pro by putting in an SSD and it had 16GB of RAM, so there was nothing else I could do to speed it up and there was no 'new' Mac Pro to buy. I thought about dropping a grand on a used 4,1 but whats the point in investing in already old technology? So for around a grand, I built a 3.5GHz i7 quad core system with thunderbolt, USB3, over clocking capability, SATA3 speeds and it runs super fast and is rock solid stable. Could I have issues with updates down the road, possibly, but I am aware of that and can take the steps to remedy the issue. Are hackintosh's for everyone, absolutely not, but they are, in my opinion, a viable alternative for some people. The whole EULA thing, sure, its not legit to run OSX on non Apple hardware, however I would like to think that most people who build a hackintosh are at least buying the OS legit from the app store, that's something.

Liquinn said:

Is a Mac Pro better than a hackintosh?

Oh and an added bonus: if you take the EULA literally, it says you can only run mac OS on Apple branded hardware. Well, if you mod a G5 case then it's Apple branded.

Click to expand...

Literally, the G5 case isn't hardware in any significant electrical sense which is what you need to run the software. Besides, Apple motherboards have an Apple logo. That lack of that logo will be what Apple's lawyers will pummel you with on a hackintosh. Even the more dim witted judges are going to be able to figure that one out.

If you take apple "guts" (their motherboard) and put it in new case there is no licensing problem. The logo is still on the motherboard. Several vendors harden/protect/modify Apple electronics with no significant quibble from Apple at all.

csixty4 said:

Want to grab your tower by the handle, hop on the #80 bus and take it to the Apple store for servicing? Mac Pro.

Click to expand...

Why wouldn't you just schedule an on-site AppleCare visit? No way I'd lug my MacPro to the Apple Store.

If you're contemplating a hackintosh, familiarize yourself with www.tonymacx86.com

You have to be prepared for some challenges; especially if you're the type of person that is compelled to stay up to date asap. I've built six hackintoshes (two of my own) and I've loved the process and the reward of the best bang for your buck. My current system is an i7 3770k, Asus Maximus V Gene Z77 mboard, 16gb 1600 ram, 2x 128 ssd + HDs, GTX 670 4gb.

ashman70 said:

I just recently retired my 2008 Mac Pro and built a hackintosh. I did this for a number of reasons. Cost was a big factor, I had already upgraded my Pro by putting in an SSD and it had 16GB of RAM, so there was nothing else I could do to speed it up

Click to expand...

that was primarily because it is an old, dead-end socket and memory architecture design. There were other Mac Pros to transition to.

and there was no 'new' Mac Pro to buy.

Click to expand...

relative to 2008 yes there was. You can choose to skip it.

I thought about dropping a grand on a used 4,1 but whats the point in investing in already old technology?

Click to expand...

It is cheaper.... which was one of your "big factors".

So for around a grand, I built a 3.5GHz i7 quad core system with thunderbolt, USB3, over clocking capability, SATA3 speeds and it runs super fast and is rock solid stable.

Click to expand...

USB 3 and SATA 3 are cheaper updates that can be made to even a 2008 infrastructure. Over clocking is far more about 'control' than 'cost'. If want low level control, a tweaking platform, then a hackintosh has much higher value.

'Other Mac Pro's to transition to' other older models with outdated technology, not what I was after.

Sure a Mac Pro 4,1 is cheaper, but again, I wasn't after older technology which all current Mac Pro's are.

I only mentioned USB 3 and SATA 3 because they go towards performance, something you hope to achieve through an upgrade. There is also PCIe 3, so one can benefit from newer GPU's. Also over clocking is a side benefit, its a nice to have not a need to have for me, but its something I may indulge in.

Ultimately what I wanted was a faster performing machine, capable of utilizing current technology, something I could not completely achieve on a Mac Pro platform.Sure I could of bought a 4,1, upgraded the CPU, added a USB 3 card, but why invest in older technology, it doesn't make sense to me.

ZZ Bottom said:

If you're contemplating a hackintosh, familiarize yourself with http://www.tonymacx86.com

You have to be prepared for some challenges; especially if you're the type of person that is compelled to stay up to date asap. I've built six hackintoshes (two of my own) and I've loved the process and the reward of the best bang for your buck. My current system is an i7 3770k, Asus Maximus V Gene Z77 mboard, 16gb 1600 ram, 2x 128 ssd + HDs, GTX 670 4gb.

Click to expand...

ZZ Bottom....i've got to ask...what kind of case is that?

As several people have said, it depends on what you need. It also depends on whether your level of technical knowledge is good enough to build a computer and then install an OS that isn't supported on it. Neither is really all that difficult, but hackintoshes can give you occasional issues that you won't get with a genuine Mac–i.e. when a point update for the OS comes out, on my computer it kills Quartz Extreme and Core Image, so I have to install a patch.

Though to be fair on that last, the same would be true for a Mac Pro with my GPU (HD 4890). There are better supported graphics cards these days that you can use.

Right now I would go with a hackintosh unless you need more than eight cores, which the average person does not. The Mac Pro will be an excellent value again when it's updated.

adr1974 said:

ZZ Bottom....i've got to ask...what kind of case is that?

Click to expand...

Lian Li PC-V600F. Obviously a Mac Pro clone style case, but very premium materials for PC case. I have a couple others, but this one is my favorite for it's compact size (for mATX boards, but can hold 4 HDs + 2 SSDs + DVD). It truly gives the appearance of a "Mac Pro Midtower". The other case I have is a Lian Li PC-V1000 which also looks like a Mac Pro, but is for full ATX boards.

To OP:
If you follow one of the build guides on tonymacx86.com you will ensure almost no chance for hiccups. But bear in mind that you will need a Mac with 10.6.8 or higher to download the Mountain Lion Install AND to create the "Unibeast" Mac OS installer to use on the PC. I had to use my bosses' Mac Mini, as I'm currently between Mac notebooks.

ZZ Bottom said:

If you're contemplating a hackintosh, familiarize yourself with http://www.tonymacx86.com

You have to be prepared for some challenges; especially if you're the type of person that is compelled to stay up to date asap. I've built six hackintoshes (two of my own) and I've loved the process and the reward of the best bang for your buck. My current system is an i7 3770k, Asus Maximus V Gene Z77 mboard, 16gb 1600 ram, 2x 128 ssd + HDs, GTX 670 4gb.

Click to expand...

Hi ZZ Bottom i have a very same system that you (sorry for my english). My system is an i7 3770, Asus Maximus V Gene Z77, 8gb 1600 ram, 1tb SATA 3 and ASUS Geforce gtx 660ti 2gb.

I want to built an hackintosh, but i'm not sure that my system is fully compatible. You can help me to install osx 10.8 or give me a guide that you use for install it?? I have some experience in hackintosh in netbook, but i can't install correctly.

thank you very much, and sorry for my english!

Hackintosh

While I don't condone someone for wanting to build one or find the kexts and drivers to make one work I can say that it can be a challenge, and not all PC's are capable of being hackintoshes, though if you search on forums you can find what you are looking for..


Consider my laptop, a Gateway P-7805u FX. I had to read through forums to get what I needed to make my Gateway run OS X. After hours and hours of finding what I needed and making modifications she is running OS X Snow Leopard and almost all devices native to the laptop are recognized and working! The only things I couldn't get to work are the ethernet as there is no kext, at least currently, working kext for yukon Marvel 8804401 I think. The 56K modem doesn't work, but who needs modems these days? The webcam doesn't work, but I have my own webcam and its a mac related model!

I can't seem to get Mountain Lion to install for some reason, but I know its not meant to be a replacement for the real thing, but for my needs and uses Snow Leopard does everything I need it to. Your milage will vary though.

With all that said.. with regards to the Mac Pro, I expect due to the 4,1 to 5,1 firmware that those Mac Pros will increase in value given that the 4,1 and 5,1 are similar hardware and with flashing the firmware one can just pop out the Nehalem processor for a Westmere. A good value if you ask me.

Do you have enough time to build your own PC and set Mountain Lion?
Take at least a spare weekend for that.

Do you mind if updating your OS might give a lot of trouble?
Do you mind if something isn't working you have to fix it yourself?
Do you have a small budget?
Do you need more speed than an iMac can deliver?

Well, then go ahead and build a hack. If you're not a computer freak like me or you really need a super-power PC, I'd just go with an iMac. It's much easier.

Although I'm happy with my hack, I wouldn't recommend it to just everyone.

If you have to ask then no.

csixty4 said:

Faster? You can build a faster Hackintosh. Better graphics? Hackintosh. USB3? Hackintosh. Any form factor you want? Hackintosh.

Click to expand...

USB3 works fine on Mac Pro.

Liquinn said:

... if you take the EULA literally...

Click to expand...

One thing worth noting here is that many jurisdictions do not see prohibitions/restrictions in an after-purchase agreement (such as most commercial software EULA's) to be legally binding.

RGDS,

jonurq said:

Hi ZZ Bottom i have a very same system that you (sorry for my english). My system is an i7 3770, Asus Maximus V Gene Z77, 8gb 1600 ram, 1tb SATA 3 and ASUS Geforce gtx 660ti 2gb.

I want to built an hackintosh, but i'm not sure that my system is fully compatible. You can help me to install osx 10.8 or give me a guide that you use for install it?? I have some experience in hackintosh in netbook, but i can't install correctly.

thank you very much, and sorry for my english!

Click to expand...

I used the following guide:
http://www.tonymacx86.com/golden-builds/73818-success-gabedamiens-first-build-maximus-v-gene-3770k-16gb-ram-gtx-670-ft03-os-x-10-8-a-9.html

I recommend you read my post on page 9 of the thread for a heads up. Not sure if the OP updated it, but there were a few outdated parts of the guide.

Feel free to PM me if you have any questions. I go by ZZ Bottom on both sites

Jobs and company should have realized that by going Intel in 2006 their OS would be open to work on non-Apple hardware, and while I agree with the EULA and Apple's stance that OS X can not work on non-apple hardware, at this point I think its perfectly fine for PCs to be able to use it.

You buy it, you paid for it and therefore you should be entitled to run it. Thats my stance on it. Maybe die hard fanboys would say otherwise.. OS X Snow Leopard runs just as well as a MacBook Pro on my Gateway P-7805U FX.. What is most surprising though is that Mountain Lion won't work.. and yet my machine has a Core 2 Extreme 3.06 Ghz processor and 8GB DDR3 1066 memory.

I guess Lion is the end of the road for me.. but I hate Mountain Lion either way.

seveej said:

One thing worth noting here is that many jurisdictions do not see prohibitions/restrictions in an after-purchase agreement (such as most commercial software EULA's) to be legally binding.

RGDS,

Click to expand...

Liquinn said:

Is a Mac Pro better than a hackintosh?

Oh and an added bonus: if you take the EULA literally, it says you can only run mac OS on Apple branded hardware. Well, if you mod a G5 case then it's Apple branded. I put one of the Apple stickers that came with Snow Leopard on my Dell Mini 9 for this reason.

I mean, are they going to stop you from taking your Apple purchased hardware and say you can no longer run MacOS if you put it in a custom wooden box? They don't really specify what the base hardware requirements are to be in compliance with the EULA.

Cheers.

Click to expand...

Nope, Mac Pro - Dual Xeon workstation,
Hackintosh - Gaming Hardware (i7's blah blah) (for the most part anyway, don't flame me!)
I think the Mac Pro is a better option by far, for stability, support, and in general how long the beast lasts!

csixty4 said:

Like so many things in life, it depends on what "better" means to you.

Faster? You can build a faster Hackintosh. Better graphics? Hackintosh. USB3? Hackintosh. Any form factor you want? Hackintosh.

Want to grab your tower by the handle, hop on the #80 bus and take it to the Apple store for servicing? Mac Pro. Want to install OSX without worrying about hardware compatibility lists and special kexts? Mac Pro. Resale value? Probably the Mac Pro.

Some "pros" want the best specs for the money. Others prefer to minimize downtime if something goes wrong. It all depends on your needs.

Click to expand...

deconstruct60 said:

Literally, the G5 case isn't hardware in any significant electrical sense which is what you need to run the software. Besides, Apple motherboards have an Apple logo. That lack of that logo will be what Apple's lawyers will pummel you with on a hackintosh. Even the more dim witted judges are going to be able to figure that one out.

If you take apple "guts" (their motherboard) and put it in new case there is no licensing problem. The logo is still on the motherboard. Several vendors harden/protect/modify Apple electronics with no significant quibble from Apple at all.

Click to expand...

This is a funny one, if any sort of law enforcement (cop, whatever..)tried to tell me off for having Mac OS on wintel hardware I'd laugh, what can they do about it?

PowerPCMacMan said:

Jobs and company should have realized that by going Intel in 2006 their OS would be open to work on non-Apple hardware, and while I agree with the EULA and Apple's stance that OS X can not work on non-apple hardware, at this point I think its perfectly fine for PCs to be able to use it.

You buy it, you paid for it and therefore you should be entitled to run it. Thats my stance on it. Maybe die hard fanboys would say otherwise.. OS X Snow Leopard runs just as well as a MacBook Pro on my Gateway P-7805U FX.. What is most surprising though is that Mountain Lion won't work.. and yet my machine has a Core 2 Extreme 3.06 Ghz processor and 8GB DDR3 1066 memory.

I guess Lion is the end of the road for me.. but I hate Mountain Lion either way.

Click to expand...

Wow, havent heard of a Core 2 Extreme in a long time, nice to see someone else who has one! *high five*

lucasfer899 said:

Nope, Mac Pro - Dual Xeon workstation,
Hackintosh - Gaming Hardware (i7's blah blah) (for the most part anyway, don't flame me!)
I think the Mac Pro is a better option by far, for stability, support, and in general how long the beast lasts!






This is a funny one, if any sort of law enforcement (cop, whatever..)tried to tell me off for having Mac OS on wintel hardware I'd laugh, what can they do about it?



Wow, havent heard of a Core 2 Extreme in a long time, nice to see someone else who has one! *high five*

Click to expand...

Throw you in the slammer for copywright infingement, just 4-7 years

Lil Chillbil said:

Throw you in the slammer for copywright infingement, just 4-7 years

Click to expand...

Good luck seeing that ever happen WRT Apple and people building hackintoshes for themselves.

Just got it a few months ago. Its the x9100 and I am shocked that such a powerful Laptop can't run Mountain Lion.. but, really I prefer the best OS Apple ever produced: Snow Leopard!!

Wow, havent heard of a Core 2 Extreme in a long time, nice to see someone else who has one! *high five*
[/QUOTE]