Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

k-hawinkler

macrumors 6502
Sep 14, 2011
260
88
Not likely, since you cannot "fully load it as usual" anymore. It's all external, therefore bought and installed by the user, after sale. The only difference between low and high models will be maybe the memory or the ssd disk size.

Under this scope, I don't think we'll see a big price gap between the high and the basic configuration. And, judging by the included parts, I'd say way less than 3000 for the starting model (dollars or euros, doesn't matter for apple, they seem to ignore the difference between those currencies anyway).


By fully loaded I mean fastest CPUs and GPUs, max out flash and RAM memory, add display and that configuration will be closer to $10k than to $5k. :eek: But for me it's worth having unless there are some fatal flaws prohibiting a dependable robust and speedy performance.

Add one or two ARC-8050, plenty of HDDs and an external SSD, a second display and one is easily above $10k. :eek:
 

theSeb

macrumors 604
Aug 10, 2010
7,466
1,893
none
Not likely, since you cannot "fully load it as usual" anymore. It's all external, therefore bought and installed by the user, after sale. The only difference between low and high models will be maybe the memory or the ssd disk size.

Under this scope, I don't think we'll see a big price gap between the high and the basic configuration. And, judging by the included parts, I'd say way less than 3000 for the starting model (dollars or euros, doesn't matter for apple, they seem to ignore the difference between those currencies anyway).

WTF? What about CPU and GPU options? Some good comedians around these parts.
 

antonis

macrumors 68020
Jun 10, 2011
2,085
1,009
WTF? What about CPU and GPU options? Some good comedians around these parts.

Ignoring the last part that drops the level of the discussion. What I meant was:

We know nothing about any GPU options. There will obviously be CPU options, but lacking the multi-cpu feature, options will note be that many. I can only assume that this alone closes the gap between low and high end price. Talking about the main machine of course, not with additions of monitors or any other external devices that user can buy after sale anyway.

Of course I could be wrong, but that's my opinion. And since we are all missing some major details yet for nMP, it's just guesses.
 

VirtualRain

macrumors 603
Aug 1, 2008
6,304
118
Vancouver, BC
Ignoring the last part that drops the level of the discussion. What I meant was:

We know nothing about any GPU options. There will obviously be CPU options, but lacking the multi-cpu feature, options will note be that many. I can only assume that this alone closes the gap between low and high end price. Talking about the main machine of course, not with additions of monitors or any other external devices that user can buy after sale anyway.

Of course I could be wrong, but that's my opinion. And since we are all missing some major details yet for nMP, it's just guesses.

Here's one possible entry level config that will likely start around $2500
- 4-Core CPU (1620?)
- Dual W7000 GPU
- 8 GB RAM
- 256GB SSD

Here are some possible up-sell BTO options (guesstimates)...
- 6-Core CPU (1630/60?) add $500 (might even be the base model at $2999)
- 8-Core CPU (2650?) add $1000
- 10-Core CPU (2670/80?) add $1500
- 12-Core CPU (2695/97?) add $2000 (this is low given leaked pricing)
- 16GB add $200
- 32 GB add $600
- 512GB SSD add $300
- 1TB SSD add $900
- Dual W8000 GPU add $1000 (retail price is $1300 each)
- Dual W9000 GPU add $2000 (retail price is $3-4K each)

If I'm anywhere close, the new Mac Pro might top out at around $8K
 
Last edited:

theSeb

macrumors 604
Aug 10, 2010
7,466
1,893
none
I think VirtualRain has covered it nicely. The difference in price between high and low will be just as big as it always was.
 

antonis

macrumors 68020
Jun 10, 2011
2,085
1,009
It certainly seems very possible. There is only a big assumption concerning the GPUs, if they are going to be dual-only or not, if they are going to be ATI Firepro series only or not. This will make a big change.
 

flat five

macrumors 603
Feb 6, 2007
5,580
2,657
newyorkcity
Here are some possible up-sell BTO options (guesstimates)...
- 6-Core CPU (1630/60?) add $500 (might even be the base model at $2999)
- 512GB SSD add $300
- Dual W8000 GPU add $1000 (retail price is $1300 each)

$4600

about $1000 (after considering sales tax) more than i'm prepared to spend but you might be right :(
 

Skint

macrumors newbie
Sep 9, 2013
2
0
How much will the cabinet you'll need to buy to keep this Trash can/drink dispenser in cost? I can already see mine full of used chewing gum and half empty coffee cups.

Funny how everytime Apple release a new machine their chip factory in China mysteriously burns down putting up the price by 15%
 

spaz8

macrumors 6502
Mar 3, 2007
492
91
Here's one possible entry level config that will likely start around $2500
- 4-Core CPU (1620?)
- Dual W7000 GPU
- 8 GB RAM
- 256GB SSD

Here are some possible up-sell BTO options (guesstimates)...
- 6-Core CPU (1630/60?) add $500 (might even be the base model at $2999)
- 8-Core CPU (2650?) add $1000
- 10-Core CPU (2670/80?) add $1500
- 12-Core CPU (2695/97?) add $2000 (this is low given leaked pricing)
- 16GB add $200
- 32 GB add $600
- 512GB SSD add $300
- 1TB SSD add $900
- Dual W8000 GPU add $1000 (retail price is $1300 each)
- Dual W9000 GPU add $2000 (retail price is $3-4K each)

If I'm anywhere close, the new Mac Pro might top out at around $8K

I think these are good prices, but for the base.. i think the W5000's will be the bottom cards (5000,7000,9000) - good, better, best.
 

mmomega

macrumors demi-god
Dec 30, 2009
3,879
2,089
DFW, TX
sub-$4k for a 12core may be doable for me if it "can last" for 3-4 years.

I'm not worried at all about internal storage, I plan on only using USB 3 and Thunderbolt externals anyway.
Couple it with 1 or 2 LG 27" or 29" Ultrawide monitors a Moshi Luna keyboard, Razer Imperator Mouse and I'll be set.
 

flat five

macrumors 603
Feb 6, 2007
5,580
2,657
newyorkcity
How much will the cabinet you'll need to buy to keep this Trash can/drink dispenser in cost? I can already see mine full of used chewing gum and half empty coffee cups.

have you been watching back to the future again?

(insert image that i'm too lazy to search for right now)

#
 

beaker7

Cancelled
Mar 16, 2009
920
5,010
sub-$4k for a 12core may be doable for me if it "can last" for 3-4 years.

I'm not worried at all about internal storage, I plan on only using USB 3 and Thunderbolt externals anyway.
Couple it with 1 or 2 LG 27" or 29" Ultrawide monitors a Moshi Luna keyboard, Razer Imperator Mouse and I'll be set.

Lol. 12 core for < 4k isn't even remotely within the realm of possibility.
 

Skint

macrumors newbie
Sep 9, 2013
2
0
Last edited:

flat five

macrumors 603
Feb 6, 2007
5,580
2,657
newyorkcity
Here you go

http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4014/4283301530_60db7a832d_o.jpg

(shame you'll never understand)

Aha! A bit of background to that image and Apple's possibly fatal mistake
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...versary-great-leap-forward-beer-drinkers.html

what are you on about
:confused:

you can still get those things only it's a helluva lot more user friendly..

heineken-5l-draughtkeg.jpg
 

greenmeanie

macrumors 65816
Jan 22, 2005
1,418
607
AmigaWarez
If you want to punish APPLE for a high price tag on the PRO why would you buy a IMAC if the price is high? APPLE still wins that way LOL.
 

robgendreau

macrumors 68040
Jul 13, 2008
3,465
329
I realize this is a thread about price, but I think it also begs the question of the target market. Most here seem to be pros, in that they'll use a nMP for their real work, and it also seems that this is often media work, 3d modeling, etc.

But what is Apple is also intent on targeting prosumers? Say someone who just wants to use a lot of Photoshop filters on his or her family photos? Or what about gamers; Apple once ignored them, but has now gone after them in a big way in iOS. I think games on computers may not be the wave of the future, but you never know.

And I wonder about people like me. I have finally had it with iMacs for work (law). I don't need anything really fast, but I would like to have a machine I could upgrade. Or just replace the hard drive for crying out loud. And in any case, the speed boost from using a SSD probably trumps the processor speed upgrades that are available for users like me that aren't rendering or doing intensive processor tasks.

So who is Apple after? Or is it really no one; is the new MP the equivalent of a concept car or just something to get some attention to Apple's commitment to Thunderbolt and some other technologies?
 

deconstruct60

macrumors G5
Mar 10, 2009
12,252
3,852
But what is Apple is also intent on targeting prosumers? Say someone who just wants to use a lot of Photoshop filters on his or her family photos?

The mini and iMac don't do this?

Or what about gamers; Apple once ignored them, but has now gone after them in a big way in iOS.

and the Mac Pro runs iOS? Yes, they are enabling games with iOS since that market appeared. But as games take over the app store stats I doubt Apple will look at that as an accomplished goal. It isn't a particularly good sign long term. The objective is more likely far more well rounded ecosystem.



I think games on computers may not be the wave of the future, but you never know.

It isn't whether they are the future, it is whether they are dominate driver of sales. And of sales in this class of machine at what are now normal Mac Pro price points.

There is a class of gamers are who as much about tweaking hardware and/or benchmark chasing as playing games. No, Apple never really has gone after spec porn market in a big way for long periods of time.


And I wonder about people like me. I have finally had it with iMacs for work (law). I don't need anything really fast,

So need a machine with $800-7000 worth of just CPU+GPU inside ? Pretty fast is where the Mac Pro is aimed.


but I would like to have a machine I could upgrade. Or just replace the hard drive for crying out loud.

the storage drive on the new Mac Pro is prominently easily accessible once take the cover off ( slide latch and lift cover). Upgradability is different from mature, commodity priced parts.


And in any case, the speed boost from using a SSD probably trumps the processor speed upgrades that are available for users like me that aren't rendering or doing intensive processor tasks.

so if apply a SSD to a Mac mini ????

Users whose workloads are plateaued but who several years ago might of gone into a Mac Pro will be targeted with something lower on the product line up. That is just natural cannibalization following the gap between user workloads progress and technology progress.


So who is Apple after?

They are not after the same people they are targeting with the other Macs. ( this is not a back door into xMac land. )


Or is it really no one;

If the non-tinker crowd is "no one", then yes no one. Just because it isn't you doesn't mean it is no one. There are several factors that you were very busily dismissing that amount to a group of "someones".

a. Folks who use the machine to generate revenue. They are less price sensitive if the revenue generated is substantially larger than the system price.

b. Folks who need performance. Not ultimate, money-is-no-object performance but "substantively faster than what I was using 5-7 years ago" faster. [ In other words folks who have increasing workloads but don't want to change infrastructure every 1-3 years. ]

For example, folks who need to "chew on" 2-3x as much data as several years ago who also just want a tool to just use. Not an upgrade project.



c. Folks who are in settings were a group of people work on the same data. Either large amounts of "sneaker net" disk sharing or LAN disk sharing.

The media industry chase as "more megapixels" to push "progress means this is a pretty good bet. The white hot business of "big data" also means this is fairly well aligned. HD -> 4K UltraHD -> 8K UltraHD .... couple with "don't delete anything, keep it all in giant catalogs" runs 180 degrees opposite of all data in a single box for a single person.


is the new MP the equivalent of a concept car or just something to get some attention to Apple's commitment to Thunderbolt and some other technologies?

No. First, they are probably going to sell 10's of thousands of these if not ridiculously priced (i.e., in same price range as before). Concept cars don't sell in anywhere near those kinds of numbers. Neither do "limited edition millionaire collectable" cars.

Apple selling over 10M Thunderbolt equipped Macs per year for the last two years is a demonstration of Apple's commitment to Thunderbolt. This new Mac Pro wouldn't bring any dramatic shift in those numbers. Far more about bringing the Mac Pro into alignment with Mac siblings than demonstrative any increased commitment to Thunderbolt.

The other "concept" that will probably be apparent once the full 2013 Mac line up is introduced is that Apple is cutting SATA loose as being the most common internal storage connection technology. It isn't where they think things might go... but rather where they they think things are going.

Coupled with that and bringing things back to "price" is the notion that Flash storage will be affordable enough for most folks' individual systems is a contributor to the cutting SATA loose mindset.
 

handsome pete

macrumors 68000
Aug 15, 2008
1,725
259
I realize this is a thread about price, but I think it also begs the question of the target market. Most here seem to be pros, in that they'll use a nMP for their real work, and it also seems that this is often media work, 3d modeling, etc.

But what is Apple is also intent on targeting prosumers? Say someone who just wants to use a lot of Photoshop filters on his or her family photos? Or what about gamers; Apple once ignored them, but has now gone after them in a big way in iOS. I think games on computers may not be the wave of the future, but you never know.

And I wonder about people like me. I have finally had it with iMacs for work (law). I don't need anything really fast, but I would like to have a machine I could upgrade. Or just replace the hard drive for crying out loud. And in any case, the speed boost from using a SSD probably trumps the processor speed upgrades that are available for users like me that aren't rendering or doing intensive processor tasks.

So who is Apple after? Or is it really no one; is the new MP the equivalent of a concept car or just something to get some attention to Apple's commitment to Thunderbolt and some other technologies?

I think Apple is after as many consumers they can lure in. Yes, the fully spec'ed out Mac Pro will almost certainly be geared towards a business or high-end pro. But if the direction they've taken with pro-apps is any indication, then I would think the new Mac Pro design fits the prosumer market.

However, the new Mac Pro isn't really much more expandable than an iMac. You're mostly going to be relegated to thunderbolt for that. And I'm not sure your "prosumer" examples really fit either. A photoshop hobbyist? Gamers? Why is a Mac Pro necessary for them? Seems a bit overkill to me (of course not knowing what the entry level specs will be).
 

robgendreau

macrumors 68040
Jul 13, 2008
3,465
329
I think Apple is after as many consumers they can lure in. Yes, the fully spec'ed out Mac Pro will almost certainly be geared towards a business or high-end pro. But if the direction they've taken with pro-apps is any indication, then I would think the new Mac Pro design fits the prosumer market.

However, the new Mac Pro isn't really much more expandable than an iMac. You're mostly going to be relegated to thunderbolt for that. And I'm not sure your "prosumer" examples really fit either. A photoshop hobbyist? Gamers? Why is a Mac Pro necessary for them? Seems a bit overkill to me (of course not knowing what the entry level specs will be).

Gamers and photo hobbyists wre my examples because they love to spend money on pro stuff they don't need.
 

deconstruct60

macrumors G5
Mar 10, 2009
12,252
3,852
I think Apple is after as many consumers they can lure in.

Not really. If Apple was trying to be all things to all people they wouldn't limit themselves to a small focused group of products. The products are targeted. If folks at the edges of the target buy it all the better. However, the targets aren't as narrow as some make them out to be. The Mac Pro as only after niche media types. No. Only good for "Apple Pro" apps? No. (in either direction. the Apps aren't only targeted at the pro systems either. ).


However, the new Mac Pro isn't really much more expandable than an iMac.

If have a Mac type "expand" into the dictionary app. That characterization, expandable, doesn't fit. Internal adjustments as the complete scope of 'expand' or 'upgrade' is mindset more than a reality.



And I'm not sure your "prosumer" examples really fit either. A photoshop hobbyist? Gamers? Why is a Mac Pro necessary for them? Seems a bit overkill to me (of course not knowing what the entry level specs will be).

"Prosumer" has mutliple meanings. Sometimes it is used as a "not professionally (i.e., high) priced enough" products. The exclusivity/barrier-to-entry is not high enough for some but low enough a larger group to jump in. Often used more as being indicative of measuring/characterizing the latter group's purely discretionary income size than of anything really about the usefulness (or not) of the tools in question. [ leaning toward someone who causally consumes at high price points. As if pros don't buy anything. ] Folks buying a Nikon D4 ( or D800 ) primarily to take pictures of their kid's youth soccer game or vacation pictures.


Sometimes it is used to mark product that can be used for a mix of users at the transition between only "used by professionals" and only "used by non professionals" zone. Limited complexity , but high quality/standards used in the product. Semiprofessional might be a better usage match if this is the connotation after in some contexts.


In the case of the first, there a sizable group of folks who believe that most folks buy Apple stuff as some sort of "status symbol" buy. Folks might buy a Mac Pro because no one else makes something like a Mac Pro. I don't think Apple tries in any way to turn those folks away but also not particularly the point of the more successful products either.

In the case of the second, a hobby photographer than can occasionally need to leverage more than what a mini or iMac can do could be drawn into a Mac Pro. Gaming not a the bleeding edge but higher than average could be in a similar boat. Same issue though in that Apple isn't necessarily primarily targeting these folks, nor trying to turn them away.
 

clamnectar

macrumors regular
May 7, 2009
178
0
Not really. If Apple was trying to be all things to all people they wouldn't limit themselves to a small focused group of products.

No, I think the guy you're arguing with is right. They're advertising in movie theatres. They want to sell a LOT of these. They're trying to elevate the desktop PC from "useful work tool" to "desirable consumer product" while maintaining the main criterion of its existence -- power. By stripping away the workmanlike aspects of the design, you're left with a striking monolithic design that people will want whether they need it or not. I think Apple is thinking wide market with these.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.