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The Death Of Console Gaming?

B

boy-better-know

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Jun 30, 2010
1,358
140
England
(I couldn't find this posted on here)
If you have some free time (26 mins), this presentation is one of the most thought provoking arguments I have seen in a while. I have so much to say on the subject. I am sure you guys do too, and I would like to hear what other people think. The presentation suggests that disruptive technology (smartphones, and our beloved iPhones) is making console gaming obsolete, just like console gaming made arcade gaming obsolete. The presenter, Ben Cousins, puts forward a good argument, heres the link.
http://kotaku.com/5892836/the-best-26+minute-argument-that-game-consoles-are-dying
Over the past year or two, I have been aware, and I am betting you have too, that our beloved industry is in a slump. Poor console sales etc. It is no surprise that smartphones are the cause for this, but replacing our home consoles, putting an end to our ten hour sessions on Uncharted or COD or (insert AAA title here)?? Surely not, I didn't believe it, until I watched this. Maybe I am being impressionable. But it makes me feel a bit sick all the same. I love how things are, I don't want it to change.
I can see the next generation (PS4, Nextbox) being the last gen of consoles as we know them, a move to cloud based gaming is surely coming, but beyond that. Is the iPad and iPhone really the way forward?
What do you guys think?
 
Don't have 26 minutes to watch this right now, but I'll chime in with this:

The only games I enjoy playing on a touch screen are those that were specifically made for the touch screen, like "Where's my Water", "Cut the Rope", the likes. And those are just for very casual gaming. "Real" gaming for me needs to be on a tv, sitting on the couch, controller in hand. I will NEVER trade such intense and engaging experiences as the Uncharted or Mass Effect games for stuff to be played on a portable touch screen.

I think there will be a place for home consoles for quite a while. Mobile gaming however, I can see the 3DS's and PSV's in the world losing a lot of ground to smart phones and tablets.
 
^^^ what if you could play Mass Effect from your iPad, with the screen mirrored to the TV, and a bluetooth controller in your hand? Imagine hotels putting Apple TVs in every room, and having this capability wherever you go on the road?
 
Taustin Powers said:
Don't have 26 minutes to watch this right now, but I'll chime in with this:

The only games I enjoy playing on a touch screen are those that were specifically made for the touch screen, like "Where's my Water", "Cut the Rope", the likes. And those are just for very casual gaming. "Real" gaming for me needs to be on a tv, sitting on the couch, controller in hand. I will NEVER trade such intense and engaging experiences as the Uncharted or Mass Effect games for stuff to be played on a portable touch screen.

I think there will be a place for home consoles for quite a while. Mobile gaming however, I can see the 3DS's and PSV's in the world losing a lot of ground to smart phones and tablets.
Click to expand...
I agree completely. Every game on my iPad and iPhone are time killers, nothing more. But the argument is about the future, and how mobile gaming is going to turn the heads of the young generation. In the presentation it has a quote from a game developer, i forget which one, that basically say the new generation are not playing consoles. I is worrying that most people are happy enough with Angry Birds. But we are not.
dmr727 said:
^^^ what if you could play Mass Effect from your iPad, with the screen mirrored to the TV, and a bluetooth controller in your hand? Imagine hotels putting Apple TVs in every room, and having this capability wherever you go on the road?
Click to expand...
That is pretty much the argument, that one day, these portable devices will catch up, through innovation, to consoles. That may include the use of add on buttons for us. Mirroring could be one of the innovations.

Last weekend I played Uncharted 3 online for 6 hours on end, there is no way in hell I would do that on my iPad or iPhone with touch controls. Touch controls are horrible beyond belief, I don't know how anyone can enjoy using a touch analogue stick.
 
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dmr727 said:
^^^ what if you could play Mass Effect from your iPad, with the screen mirrored to the TV, and a bluetooth controller in your hand? Imagine hotels putting Apple TVs in every room, and having this capability wherever you go on the road?
Click to expand...

yeah sure it is a nice idea for the casual gamer with plenty of money.

for many gamers there is a cost issue here, and don't forget network speeds, controls also have to be worked out.

while these issues (and many more) exist consoles remain the future for gaming.
 
Console gaming is not going anywhere. Mobile and tablet games have a pricepoint problem. Analysts everywhere are blind to it as well as the idea software sells hardware in the game industry. They said the 3DS would fail. Once the Mario games were released, it outsold the DS. Then they said the Vita would fail. It's doing quite well. Now Pachter is running around saying the Wii U is gonna fail. I hope nobody listens to him.

Cloud gaming is not going to kill any of these companies. Traditional game companies have something On Live doesn't - exclusive IP. If cloud gaming becomes industry standard, nothing is stopping Nintendo or Sony for coming out with their own cloud gaming service. And people will pay money to cloud game a Mario or Uncharted game. Just like they're paying them money now to play them off cartridges and discs.

And it would be nice to stream Mass Effect off your iPad but at a $10 a download with 30% going to Apple, it's not going to happen. It's not financially viable to make a game of that scope for iOS, which is why all you get are branded companion minigames.
 
I'm not going to watch that right now but if this topic is like the "there's no place/demand for dedicated handhelds"

3DS = 15+ million worlwide
PS Vita = 1.4+ million worldwide (1 week sales)


Thats all the input I got for this topic.




Bless
 
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Liquorpuki said:
Console gaming is not going anywhere. Mobile and tablet games have a pricepoint problem. Analysts everywhere are blind to it as well as the idea software sells hardware in the game industry. They said the 3DS would fail. Once the Mario games were released, it outsold the DS. Then they said the Vita would fail. It's doing quite well. Now Pachter is running around saying the Wii U is gonna fail. I hope nobody listens to him.

Cloud gaming is not going to kill any of these companies. Traditional game companies have something On Live doesn't - exclusive IP. If cloud gaming becomes industry standard, nothing is stopping Nintendo or Sony for coming out with their own cloud gaming service. And people will pay money to cloud game a Mario or Uncharted game. Just like they're paying them money now to play them off cartridges and discs.

And it would be nice to stream Mass Effect off your iPad but at a $10 a download with 30% going to Apple, it's not going to happen. It's not financially viable to make a game of that scope for iOS, which is why all you get are branded companion minigames.
Click to expand...

You put across some good points, for the record, I don't necessarily agree with what is being said by Ben Cousins. I just wanted to discuss withe everyone.

As for the dedicate handheld argument, no the presentation isn't talking about that specifically, its talking about all home consoles too.

I just bought a Vita on the 22nd feb, and I have already put in more hours on that in 3 weeks than I have in 3 years of having an iPhone. There is no competition to me.
 
Both the latest handheld consoles are outperforming their predecessors in their first months. When that figure is so stark I do wonder why this topic even needs discussing. These portable disruptive devices are a great new market, but by the looks of things the handheld console market is still there and even better than before.

Personally I couldn't drop dedicated consoles. I've got an iPad, iPhone and multiple iPods. I've spent more time on my Vita this week on a few games than all my iToys combined.

Edit: ahhh that talk is from a mobile developer. That makes sense now. He's not entirely right though. iOS and mobile gaming is very much in its infancy, and worse than that you need luck to survive much more than in console development.
 
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I don't see the console market going away. Casual gamers might be happy with just Angry Birds but there are still millions of people that want full featured games. Smartphones & tablets are not going to get any of those until Apple and Google find a way to make software piracy more difficult on iOS and Android.
 
boy-better-know said:
You put across some good points, for the record, I don't necessarily agree with what is being said by Ben Cousins. I just wanted to discuss withe everyone.

As for the dedicate handheld argument, no the presentation isn't talking about that specifically, its talking about all home consoles too.

I just bought a Vita on the 22nd feb, and I have already put in more hours on that in 3 weeks than I have in 3 years of having an iPhone. There is no competition to me.
Click to expand...

My rule is that for tablets to replace consoles and handhelds, they have to have games that are as good as the ones that are on consoles and handhelds. They don't, and it's because of the low price point on app stores. The minute Apple fixes this, I'll sell my Nintendo stock. But the only way they can do this is by letting people circumvent the app store, and that's the thing they're least likely to do.

Smartphone gaming to me is like going to Fry's and looking at the PC games aisle. You have all those $40-50 retail boxes with AAA games covering the shelf. Then you have a little rack with $1-5 budget software in cardboard sleeves. That budget market is app store gaming. The retail boxes are console gaming. There's very little overlap.

Cousins spends a good portion of that presentation talking about hardware performance and how tablets are becoming more powerful than consoles. But in the game industry, software sells hardware, not the other way around. The newest tablet having a better screen or faster processor than a console doesn't matter when because of the low price point, most games can't afford to take advantage of those features anyway. Which is why even though the iPhone gets more and more powerful, most mobile games are still 2D games that look like they could run in a browser. Or how a year after Airplay was introduced and hyped up as a console killing feature, nobody can name a game that uses it other than Real Racing.

Until all this gets fixed, and the only way it'll get fixed is if the price of these games gets raised, consoles are not going anywhere. Instead, the price of mobile games is dropping due to commoditization. Which is why all these companies are going to Freemium. Cousins thinks Freemium is a superior business model. In reality, it's the only way to get people to download your game on a market flooded with cheap stuff.

Mobile gaming is a bubble. It's overhyped and people investing in companies like Zynga are gonna lose a lot of money once the bubble pops.
 
I was really happy when Final Fantasy was port into iphone... I play a lot of Final Fantasy, Risk, Secret of Mana and other games like that on my ipod Touch... But last month i payed 300$ to get a PS3 and I got Little Big Planet, Gran Tourismo 3 SE, my wife bought Atelier Rorona and Totori.... We got a 3DS last october and we have a wii. I still keep a PC to play game like Guild Wars and all.....

So it really goes down to one thing.... the games... the console maker will pay more and more to have exclusive titles and like other people already said it's the software that sell the hardware, not the other way around. We got mac's because of OS X and ppl get iphone because of the appStore and itunes....

So in the end if Pokémon and Mario stay only on Nintendo... they will continu to sell... Final Fantasy saved the Playstation one...... and Halo is certainly one reason of the success of the Xbox
 
Yeah I think Cousins failed to mention the fact that the conveinence of having a console at home is probably the main reason that arcades dies.
Also, an iPad would never off a cinematic experience like the PS3 and xbox can.

I have enjoyed reading the comments here, I remember nintendo were under pressure from their investors to add games to the app store. i would say that'd be a terrible move on ninty's part.
 
boy-better-know said:
Yeah I think Cousins failed to mention the fact that the conveinence of having a console at home is probably the main reason that arcades dies.
Also, an iPad would never off a cinematic experience like the PS3 and xbox can.

I have enjoyed reading the comments here, I remember nintendo were under pressure from their investors to add games to the app store. i would say that'd be a terrible move on ninty's part.
Click to expand...

The daft thing about that is the sheer profit the Mario and Pokemon series generate. It's in the billions of £££. iOS games only sell in the millions (like the Mario and Pokemon games on Nintendo systems) when priced at 69p, not the usual £30-40 of console games.

I don't believe that story for a second that investors were pressuring Nintendo to release mobile games. The amount of profit Nintendo generates and the amount they have in reserves... Just doesn't add up!
 
Dagless said:
The daft thing about that is the sheer profit the Mario and Pokemon series generate. It's in the billions of £££. iOS games only sell in the millions (like the Mario and Pokemon games on Nintendo systems) when priced at 69p, not the usual £30-40 of console games.

I don't believe that story for a second that investors were pressuring Nintendo to release mobile games. The amount of profit Nintendo generates and the amount they have in reserves... Just doesn't add up!
Click to expand...
I honestly did read a story about it a few months back.
Or are you doubting the reports rather than doubting me? Either way, yeah youre right. It would cheapen the brand amongst other things.
 
I personally can envision a day when all console games are delivered via services like Gaikai or OnLive and therefore accessible on every device we have, alongside a small inexpensive little console device for the tv.

I don't think mobile devices will replace a console, but do think how we define and what the delivery mechanism of that console is, will change.
 
^ I think in the very near future we're going to inch towards cross compatibility between devices. Vita and PS3/4, 3DS and Wii U... Just continuing the link up abilities. I think we're going to head into a future where buying a home console version of a game nets you a companion app for it's handheld brethren, like how Pokemon Heart Gold came with a pedometre that strengthens your team as you walk.

In the distant future I think we'll be streaming content from one device to another. Run a game off a PS6 at home, play it (with minor lag thanks to full high speed mobile data) anywhere on any mobile device. I can't imagine private streaming services to take over though. Not with how much power it'll take to run everyone's games.

boy-better-know said:
I honestly did read a story about it a few months back.
Or are you doubting the reports rather than doubting me? Either way, yeah youre right. It would cheapen the brand amongst other things.
Click to expand...

Just the article :) I read it a few weeks/months ago too.
 
One question though:

Are Playstation and XBox actually profitable enterprises for Sony and Microsoft nowadays?

I remember hearing how their gaming divisions kept losing money at some point...does anyone have some up-to-date info on that?
 
Taustin Powers said:
One question though:

Are Playstation and XBox actually profitable enterprises for Sony and Microsoft nowadays?

I remember hearing how their gaming divisions kept losing money at some point...does anyone have some up-to-date info on that?
Click to expand...
That is what I was wondering. Every time I read about the industry it claims that it is losing money left right and centre. It can't be true otherwise they would all pull ou, surely.
Here is another arcticle IGN have posted.

http://uk.games.ign.com/articles/122/1220883p1.html

It seems to be a hot topic at the minute.
 
Taustin Powers said:
Are Playstation and XBox actually profitable enterprises for Sony and Microsoft nowadays?
Click to expand...
Lose money through console sales for first half of its life.
Make money through licensing, first party dev sales, download sales.

I don't know how it all adds up but there's a reason why they stay in the market. Nintendo (for every console until the 3DS) made a profit on hardware so it's a bit easier to see why they stick around.
 
I think he's right about one thing: as phones and tablets become more powerful, console gaming as a percentage of all gaming will fall. But I think we'll see that is because the overall pie is becoming larger, not because console games are dying.

Look at franchises like Call of Duty, where each release exceeds the last in sales and revenue. That's hardly indicative of a dying industry.
 
I wish there is alot more games for Mac OS X and OS X will become the number one Operating System, and be more Popular then the others, Probably won't happen for awhile or if at all, Just my two cents :D
 
Things will change...but how we don't know yet

I think we are moving towards a more unified and integrated experience. Imagine a day when you can have one device that rules them all. A device that is your processing unit which you can take with you on the go, or link up to your home system. It will be able to function as a full console at home with a controller but can also double as a tablet or mobile device to play games, make calls, send and receive emails and texts ect.

Mobile tech has come a long way. A phone is no longer just a phone. It is also a camera, camcorder, games, music, movies, gps, browser and everything else in between. We have effectively augmented our ability to communicate, research and gather information, find our way and record our life and entertain ourselves all from 1 single device. I believe it is going to be very interesting to see just what direction the tech sector goes.
 
I think change and convergence are inevitable, but it's not like gaming consoles are just gaming consoles anymore. I read something a few months ago that said that gaming consoles were the #1 way people streamed movies & TV shows to their TVs. For a long time MS has wanted to be the hub of a digital living room and the Xbox was their Trojan horse. MS also has a big asset in Xbox Live.

If in 5yrs time the console landscape hasn't changed I think they will be in serious trouble but I doubt that Sony, MS and Nintendo are just going to wait around for other devices to eat them alive. I honestly think that Nintendo is going to have to change the most because they are the slowest of the big three to get away from the idea of creating a pure gaming device. Single purpose devices, outside of professional niches, are largely on their way out because consumers will be happy w/a multipurpose device that is convenient to use and is just 'good enough' compared to a single purpose device which is 'great'.


Lethal
 
how can you compare consoles vs. mobile games, thats like comparing apples and oranges?? console gaming is far more superior then mobile gaming
 
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