iPad: My mother was ripped off on iPad purchase

[Paul**]

Hi All, I apologise for the rant but this is making my blood boil and I wanted to tell people the story.

My mother is 64 years old and ever since she first saw my ipad she's wanted one. To hear her speak an iPad is a miraculous futuristic device filled with wonder.

This new year she told me she was thinking of getting one and asked me which one she should get. I told her to get the new iPad, wifi only, 16gb on the basis that she would not want to pay for a sim card and planned predominantly to use it for photo editing (but not storing) while she was out and about - particularly when she went on holiday. She wrote this information down.

The next I heard from her she'd gone to a small computer shop in Sevenoaks, Kent, UK with an ipad advert in the window rather than going to an apple store because she wanted to "support local business". This is where things began to go wrong.

Firstly the man in the store upsold her the 3G model on the basis that it was selling at a discount (£459 instead of £499) and she could use it on holiday without explaining to her that she'd need to get a simcard and would then incurr roaming charges! I told her to change the order (the store didn't actually appear to have any ipads in stock, they took a credit card payment and promised to deliver) or better yet get a refund and we'd go to the applestore together. The store ammended her order to a 16GB Wifi only model and refunded £70 to her card so that she'd paid £389 as they didn't want to cancel the order. So far so mildly annoying.

The real problems began when she picked the ipad up it turned out not to be the new ipad she'd asked for but to be an iPad 2, 16gb wifi only. When i saw what she'd been sold i immediately called the store and told them that she must have been handed the wrong ipad and we would come into exchange it. The store insisted otherwise: 16gb, wifi only ipad 2 for £389. £10 less than she should have been able to get a retina ipad for.

To hear the store tell it she came in specifically asking for an ipad 2 3g model, that the store had made the order and that she'd then changed her mind to an ipad 2 wifi only model and that the store had generously adjusted the order. This is ridiculous as my mum would quite simply have walked into the store with the piece of paper upon which she'd written down "new ipad, 16gb, wifi only" following our conversation.

I asked the store how they could describe selling a 2 year old ipad for £60 more than the retail recommended price of £329 as "discount on the apple price" which is how they'd described it to my mother or how they could justify selling someone an old product they hadn't asked for at only £10 less than the retail recommended price of the brand new ipad.

They told me that £389 is a great price for an ipad 2, 16gb wifi and that i know "nothing about retail".

I asked them to do the decent thing and either exchange my mother's ipad for a new one for which i'd be willing to pay the retail reccommended price of £399 or give my mother a refund. They refused on both counts.

My mum is upset because she feels that she has bought old technology at new technology prices when all along she was trying to buy the new ipad. She feels pretty stupid even though it's not her fault and the purchase is tainted. The iPad is no longer a thing of wonder for her, instead it's a reminder that someone ripped her off.

[Dekard]

..nevermind..

[Paul**]

Originally Posted by Dekard

I understand 'your' frustration but your mom would probably have been happy with the Ipad2 as well. /shrug.

And if they'd only charged her ipad 2 prices i might not be quite so angy. Getting the ipad you didn't ask for at £60 more than everyone else paid for it and being told by the store you are getting a discount is not honest or cool. If you think it's so "shrug" then you are welcome to buy my old ipad off me... only £600, it's a steal.

[Bear]

File a complaint with the credit card company.

Also, some credit cards offer purchase price protection. At the very least you could possibly get the price difference between Apple's price and what the store charged refunded.

However, since you wanted a new iPad WiFi only and they shipped an iPad 2, that possibly counts as fraud.

[tudyniuz]

You need to get in touch with customer service, customer protection agency or whatever it is called in you country and explain the problem. You'll solve the problem in a month tops. They usually have cases like this with older people being ripped off. The same happened to my grandma when she bought a 10 euro Samsung phone with a black and white screen 6 months ago for almost 100 euros with a 2 year contract. It was resolved in 2 weeks.

[WeegieMac]

That's just morbid opportunism by the store staff.

Hope you get it resolved.

[LeeM]

put the phone down, get in the store and kick up a fuss. hopefully when its busy.
otherwise contact the credit card company and inform them of the situation, they should be able to get the money back

[gnasher729]

Originally Posted by Paul**

The next I heard from her she'd gone to a small computer shop in Sevenoaks, Kent, UK with an ipad advert in the window rather than going to an apple store because she wanted to "support local business".

Which small computer shop in Sevenoaks, Kent?

Originally Posted by Paul**

I asked the store how they could describe selling a 2 year old ipad for £60 more than the retail recommended price of £329 as "discount on the apple price" which is how they'd described it to my mother or how they could justify selling someone an old product they hadn't asked for at only £10 less than the retail recommended price of the brand new ipad.

They told me that £389 is a great price for an ipad 2, 16gb wifi and that i know "nothing about retail".

There is nothing wrong with selling two year old technology at the right price. If they sell it £60 above Apple's recommended price, that is still legal. You should obviously not buy at that price, but it's legal. If they claim it is sold at a discount, when it isn't, that's illegal and you should get your money back. Small claims court it is.

Originally Posted by LeeM

put the phone down, get in the store and kick up a fuss. hopefully when its busy.
otherwise contact the credit card company and inform them of the situation, they should be able to get the money back

The important thing would be to tell them your mother was told that this was a reduced price, when it wasn't. (And it must be actually a credit card, not a debit card).

[Rodster]

Europe has more consumer protection laws than we have here in the US. Surely a visit to the store mgr is in order to see if the matter can come to a proper solution. I also like the idea of contacting your mom's CC company to see what your options are.

In the past when I was younger and more daring I have gone into business establishments that I felt wronged me and created a ruckus and got their attention and got the results I wanted. One in particular was a car dealership with many customers in the showroom. Got a 4K discount real fast.

If none of the above works i'd take them to court and let a judge decide. Nowadays, courts are real sensitive to those who take advantage of seniors.

[AndyWong]

Originally Posted by Paul**

Hi All, I apologise for the rant but this is making my blood boil and I wanted to tell people the story.

My mother is 64 years old and ever since she first saw my ipad she's wanted one. To hear her speak an iPad is a miraculous futuristic device filled with wonder.

This new year she told me she was thinking of getting one and asked me which one she should get. I told her to get the new iPad, wifi only, 16gb on the basis that she would not want to pay for a sim card and planned predominantly to use it for photo editing (but not storing) while she was out and about - particularly when she went on holiday. She wrote this information down.

The next I heard from her she'd gone to a small computer shop in Sevenoaks, Kent, UK with an ipad advert in the window rather than going to an apple store because she wanted to "support local business". This is where things began to go wrong.

Firstly the man in the store upsold her the 3G model on the basis that it was selling at a discount (£459 instead of £499) and she could use it on holiday without explaining to her that she'd need to get a simcard and would then incurr roaming charges! I told her to change the order (the store didn't actually appear to have any ipads in stock, they took a credit card payment and promised to deliver) or better yet get a refund and we'd go to the applestore together. The store ammended her order to a 16GB Wifi only model and refunded £70 to her card so that she'd paid £389 as they didn't want to cancel the order. So far so mildly annoying.

The real problems began when she picked the ipad up it turned out not to be the new ipad she'd asked for but to be an iPad 2, 16gb wifi only. When i saw what she'd been sold i immediately called the store and told them that she must have been handed the wrong ipad and we would come into exchange it. The store insisted otherwise: 16gb, wifi only ipad 2 for £389. £10 less than she should have been able to get a retina ipad for.

To hear the store tell it she came in specifically asking for an ipad 2 3g model, that the store had made the order and that she'd then changed her mind to an ipad 2 wifi only model and that the store had generously adjusted the order. This is ridiculous as my mum would quite simply have walked into the store with the piece of paper upon which she'd written down "new ipad, 16gb, wifi only" following our conversation.

I asked the store how they could describe selling a 2 year old ipad for £60 more than the retail recommended price of £329 as "discount on the apple price" which is how they'd described it to my mother or how they could justify selling someone an old product they hadn't asked for at only £10 less than the retail recommended price of the brand new ipad.

They told me that £389 is a great price for an ipad 2, 16gb wifi and that i know "nothing about retail".

I asked them to do the decent thing and either exchange my mother's ipad for a new one for which i'd be willing to pay the retail reccommended price of £399 or give my mother a refund. They refused on both counts.

My mum is upset because she feels that she has bought old technology at new technology prices when all along she was trying to buy the new ipad. She feels pretty stupid even though it's not her fault and the purchase is tainted. The iPad is no longer a thing of wonder for her, instead it's a reminder that someone ripped her off.

Call retail shop again, tell them you intend to file case fraud with the credit card company. They might exchange the iPad 4 with you. Otherwise, DO NOT use your "new" iPad2, file fraud case with your credit card company.

[Menel]

Too much text.

But keep in mind, your mother is probably over 40, if not over 50. Her eyes probably can't appreciate the Retina pixel density. So if she saved money are the perfectly capable iPad 2. All the better.

What I recommended my parents, and they love.

Same processing power as iPad Mini... so 'old' is yes, but it's old enough to be an issue.

[WeegieMac]

Originally Posted by Menel

Too much text.

But keep in mind, your mother is probably over 40, if not over 50. Her eyes probably can't appreciate the Retina pixel density. So if she saved money are the perfectly capable iPad 2. All the better.

What I recommended my parents, and they love.

Same processing power as iPad Mini... so 'old' is yes, but it's old enough to be an issue.

Too much text? Clearly that you didn't read she was charged £60 over the RRP for an iPad 2.

Oh and his Mum is 64 ... second paragraph. See if you don't read the full thing, don't comment.

Simples.

[tudyniuz]

Why do people comment when they don't read the whole thing? Just to gather more posts?

[WeegieMac]

Misread post.

[KdParker]

Originally Posted by WeegieMac

Too much text? Clearly that you didn't read she was charged £60 over the RRP for an iPad 2.

Oh and his Mum is 64 ... second paragraph. See if you don't read the full thing, don't comment.

Simples.

Right, just thinking the same thing.

[trouble747]

Originally Posted by Menel

Too much text.

But keep in mind, your mother is probably over 40, if not over 50.

64. It's the second sentence, dude.

[AC Rempt]

I never understand people who post BS about how someone should just be happy and get over whatever their complaint it, especially in this case when it involves OP's mom. I also have an elderly mom, and any time I think some is trying to rook her, I get steamed.

Good for you for getting involved, OP.

----------

Originally Posted by racer1441

Not a blame the OP post, but if you knew she had no idea what she was doing, why did you let her go alone?

Did you read his post? His mom decided to go on her own.

[Macs4u]

Try and make it faulty and take it back for a full refund. Under 28 days old and your entitled to a full refund. Also they are lumbered with a did iPad then. Sounds wrong to do this but they didn't care about ripping you off.

[ManUMark]

A sad story and if any positive can come from it, it would be the lesson that some people have zero morals and see others as cash cows.
I would say that the shop has commited a fraud or mis sold at best. Write a letter to the shop insisting on a full refund and threat of legal action (the CAB should be able to help) and inform them of your intend to protest outside the shop with flyers of the case.
If the shop has a history of poor service then try to get some support from other disastified customers. Pop into the police station for a chat they will know of bad reputation and should help you on advice too, a visit to the local MP on his surgery day could be helpful.
Dont rant have clear points on what happened and be strong in the insistance of a full refund. Get advice on what you can and cant say/print and this seems a case of making yorself as big a nusinsance as possible to get fairness.
Also check out the VAT fraud line as a visit from the VAT man is most shop owners worse fear, this is something i did when my letting agent failed to follow my instructions and resulted in loss of fixtures from my flat.

[Alex225]

To be honest I'd be massively p!ssed if that was me but if the item is unopened I'd probably march it back in there and show my displeasure.

Basically they've sold it by deception and I'd probably mention Trading Standards. Had similar things happen before and as soon as you mention Trading Standards, especially a small company they'll most likely take notice.

Good luck it mate, I'd be p!ssed off.

Oh and I'm not that far from Sevenoaks so I'll be steering clear of that shop!!

[gnasher729]

Originally Posted by Menel

Too much text.

But keep in mind, your mother is probably over 40, if not over 50. Her eyes probably can't appreciate the Retina pixel density. So if she saved money are the perfectly capable iPad 2. All the better.

Actually, you are wrong. When your eyesight isn't perfect, every little improvement in the screen helps. I find text on an rMBP much more readable than on an ordinary MBP with the same size screen.

Originally Posted by shortcrust

It sounds like they don't have one, and as I've said in my post above there is no legal right to return unwanted goods. Stores that offer 14 or 30 day returns do so out of goodwill and good customer service. Sorry to bang on about it, but so many people get caught out by this because they think they have more protection than they really do.

Just saying: If the store _offers_ 14 or 30 days return, that is out of goodwill. But once they _offer_ this in the store, they actually have to do it. They can't offer returns, you buy the goods, and then they refuse.

Originally Posted by Pressure

Since you bought it inside of the EU, you are allowed to return the product for a full refund.

Where do you get that from? Only when you buy through mail order. Or if someone comes to your door and offers goods for sale. If _you_ go to the store and buy an item, that's a valid contract and nothing saves you (as long as everything the sales guys said are true).

Originally Posted by mpayne2k

EDIT: Sorry, didn't mean to sound elitist on that one...I only mean due to the completitive nature of the US retail market, generally all stores have a favorable return policy.

Most stores do in the UK. Stores that rip off old ladies usually don't.

Originally Posted by Rodster

I don't know if this is allowed in the UK but i'd be tempted to hold up a sign in front of the store saying "These Guys Ripped Of My Mom".

That could be libel. You could hold up a sign "These guys sold my mum an iPad 2 for £369 which is sold everywhere else for £319". That's not libel, it just demonstrates that they are excellent businessmen

[bevsb2]

Originally Posted by Menel

Too much text.

But keep in mind, your mother is probably over 40, if not over 50. Her eyes probably can't appreciate the Retina pixel density. So if she saved money are the perfectly capable iPad 2. All the better.

What I recommended my parents, and they love.

Same processing power as iPad Mini... so 'old' is yes, but it's old enough to be an issue.

I'm 69 and I can certainly tell the difference and very much appreciate the retina display. I've seen this stated before and don't know where it comes from. If anything people with "old eyes" or poor vision can probably benefit most from a sharp screen. I love my iPad 4 and would not settle for the iPad 2 if the 4 was what I intended to buy.

[kaylerrific]

That's just horrible. Even more reason to just buy from an Apple store! Lots of these small business owners are unscrupulous.

[fiddlestyx]

Originally Posted by Menel

Too much text.

But keep in mind, your mother is probably over 40, if not over 50. Her eyes probably can't appreciate the Retina pixel density. So if she saved money are the perfectly capable iPad 2. All the better.

What I recommended my parents, and they love.

Same processing power as iPad Mini... so 'old' is yes, but it's old enough to be an issue.

Really? The dude's mum got taken advantage of by the store and they're just supposed to accept it?

[thekev]

Originally Posted by Paul**

I should have done, but i had no idea she was actually going to buy. She's been talking about ipads for a year and so though i told her what she should get if she got one i was under the impression the conversation was still hypothetical.

That could just as easily have been my parents. I'm not sure why, but they've always been a bit technophobic. I hope you get this straightened out. There isn't much to distinguish these at a glance for the uneducated buyer.

Originally Posted by kaylerrific

That's just horrible. Even more reason to just buy from an Apple store! Lots of these small business owners are unscrupulous.

Don't be too general. Some of them have been much more helpful to me than the Apple Store. Of course I'm fairly cautious, but they provide options.