Apple Releases New iMacs with Upgraded ATI Radeon HD Graphics Cards

BobbyCat · Jul 29, 2010

meb91 said:
Ok look everyone. There are 2 issues here and I see many people not making the distinction between them.

1. Does the iMac meet your needs? (such as, gaming, video editing, graphic design, or whatever you may want to use it for)

2. Is the iMac overpriced (meaning, are the components you get reasonably priced?)

There's a 3rd issue: what if the iMac meets my need, is not overpriced, and yet my wallet can't afford it? Probably a non-issue for wealthy people, but quite significant for others.

Here are the facts: those who were waiting for an upgrade, hoping the 27" would become a little cheaper, one way or another, are totally disappointed. The new models are all at least 200 euros more expensive, and the 27" refurbs have exactly the same price as before the upgrade.

Granted, the cheapest 27" refurb went down 10 euros today. Hurray.

All in all, this refresh is NOT good news for those who were hoping for a cheaper 27".

Xibalba · Jul 29, 2010

mosx said:
OS X? Don't care. I have 10.6.4 on my MacBook. Its nice for basic browsing and listening to music. And if you're an iOS developer. But anything else needs Windows. I have to have half of my HDD dedicated to Windows 7.

Now this had me really laughing.

"Anything else besides basic browsing, listening to music, and developing for iOS NEEDS Windows."

Really?

It's hard to believe anything else in your post if this is your view of logical computing...

Queso · Jul 29, 2010

Xibalba said:
Now this had me really laughing.

"Anything else besides basic browsing, listening to music, and developing for iOS NEEDS Windows."

Really?

Wow. I missed that. What exactly requires Windows these days? All my devices, including my SatNav, work with OSX. My technical libraries work with OSX. My music creation tools work with OSX. I even configure large corporate networks with OSX. So what exactly NEEDS Windows?

Would that be games?

Xibalba · Jul 29, 2010

Joko said:
Seriously, I think some of you people could argue until the end of eternity, what is the point?

If you believe you can build a PC for so much cheaper..JUST &*§!ing DO IT! If you think the iMac is better overall value..BUY ONE! Who cares. What is the obsession with trying to convert people over to your own beliefs all the time?

Coming to Macrumors is always such a negative experience..although I do find it useful at times like these because I am in the market for a new machine.

..and if Steve Jobs hates Apple fanboys, I really wouldn't blame him at all.

nailed it on every point - esp the arguing to convert someone to similar beliefs - a complete waste of time.

i agree the news discussion forums on macrumors are the worst here for actually having a positive learning experience. but i thought that i would at least read this post before purchase since i, too, am in the market for a new iMac. probably a waste of time with all the immature whining, but there is some good information laced throughout the thread.

i'm gonna have to save your post - it's perfect.

blinkin182 · Jul 29, 2010

DesterWallaboo said:
DEFINITELY get the i7.... you're only paying 10% more for minimum of a 40% speed increase.

I'm on same boat. I was aiming for the 21.5 inch with i5 BTO, but seeing the price difference between that and a 27 inch, which sports, quadcore processor, better screen and faster GPU, I decided to go with 27 inch option as I feel it has more value for the money. Now am undecided whether to go with:

A. New mid-2010 27inch i5 quadcore 2.6 Ghz
B. New mid-2010 27inch i7 quadcore 2.93 Ghz
C. Refurbished Late 2009 27inch i7 quadcore 2.8 Ghz

I understand that the ATI 4850 graphics card in late 2009 modelis slightly slower. I also read that it may not make use of new DX11 and future opengl features? Could someone explain that to me further?

I also know that the RAM is slightly slower on late 2009 model. Anyone know how that would affect performance?

Are there any other differences that you think are significant between late 2009 and mid-2010 models?

Master Chief · Jul 29, 2010

We received two new iMacs (Intel Core i3 @ 3.2GHz / 21,5-inch) but are packing in to return these; The new 15-inch MacBook Pro is a hell lot faster. Not acceptable.

MorphingDragon · Jul 29, 2010

Queso said:
Would that be games?

Just buy a PS3 or Wii.

Problem solved.

Queso · Jul 29, 2010

Master Chief said:
We received two new iMacs (Intel Core i3 @ 3.2GHz / 21,5-inch) but are packing in to return these; The new 15-inch MacBook Pro is a hell lot faster. Not acceptable.

That's interesting. Any details on where the bottlenecks are? Did you run any benchmarks?

hundert · Jul 29, 2010

I ve just heard the news about iMacs being updated.

OMG 5750 is not even 10% faster than 4850.

I wonder if a 5850 hackintosh will be possible now

hundert · Jul 29, 2010

blinkin182 said:
I'm on same boat. I was aiming for the 21.5 inch with i5 BTO, but seeing the price difference between that and a 27 inch, which sports, quadcore processor, better screen and faster GPU, I decided to go with 27 inch option as I feel it has more value for the money. Now am undecided whether to go with:

A. New mid-2010 27inch i5 quadcore 2.6 Ghz
B. New mid-2010 27inch i7 quadcore 2.93 Ghz
C. Refurbished Late 2009 27inch i7 quadcore 2.8 Ghz

I understand that the ATI 4850 graphics card in late 2009 modelis slightly slower. I also read that it may not make use of new DX11 and future opengl features? Could someone explain that to me further?

I also know that the RAM is slightly slower on late 2009 model. Anyone know how that would affect performance?

Are there any other differences that you think are significant between late 2009 and mid-2010 models?

We should wait first for the new problems like yellow tinge to appear, then we can say which one to buy.

But as of now, the graphics card is like 7% faster (thats not even noticable) the rest is almost the same.

did the price go up? was it 2 grand before?

meb91 · Jul 29, 2010

BobbyCat said:
There's a 3rd issue: what if the iMac meets my need, is not overpriced, and yet my wallet can't afford it? Probably a non-issue for wealthy people, but quite significant for others.

Here are the facts: those who were waiting for an upgrade, hoping the 27" would become a little cheaper, one way or another, are totally disappointed. The new models are all at least 200 euros more expensive, and the 27" refurbs have exactly the same price as before the upgrade.
Granted, the cheapest 27" refurb went down 10 euros today. Hurray.

All in all, this refresh is NOT good news for those who were hoping for a cheaper 27".

My post was more directed at the people saying "If I pay $2200 for a computer, it should have _______" which I was reminding people they are not paying $2200 for just a computer, they're also paying a premium for that expensive display it includes. Whether they want it or not is a different story.

I understand where you are iMacs are more expensive... I'm not sure what the deal is with Apple and the euro. Here in the US it's still expensive sure but not as much so.

With that said, if a product is not overpriced, and you just can't afford it, the manufacturer is not to blame. There are many things I want that may or may not be overpriced, such as a fully loaded 12 core Mac Pro with 27" ACDs, and a 2010 Camaro SS, but I simply cannot afford them.

Again I am speaking based on the US dollar, I am not really aware of how the current pricing in other countries compares. If Apple is raising the price unnecessarily where you are, then sure they are to blame, and that makes the iMac overpriced in your country.

I too was hoping the 27" models would be cheaper, and that the i7 would be standard in the $1999 config. But in the US they are the same prices as the previous models at least.

sdugoten · Jul 29, 2010

meb91 said:
My post was more directed at the people saying "If I pay $2200 for a computer, it should have _______" which I was reminding people they are not paying $2200 for just a computer, they're also paying a premium for that expensive display it includes. Whether they want it or not is a different story.

I understand where you are iMacs are more expensive... I'm not sure what the deal is with Apple and the euro. Here in the US it's still expensive sure but not as much so.

With that said, if a product is not overpriced, and you just can't afford it, the manufacturer is not to blame. There are many things I want that may or may not be overpriced, such as a fully loaded 12 core Mac Pro with 27" ACDs, and a 2010 Camaro SS, but I simply cannot afford them.

Again I am speaking based on the US dollar, I am not really aware of how the current pricing in other countries compares. If Apple is raising the price unnecessarily where you are, then sure they are to blame, and that makes the iMac overpriced in your country.

I too was hoping the 27" models would be cheaper, and that the i7 would be standard in the $1999 config. But in the US they are the same prices as the previous models at least.

I guess you were refering to my post about the PC spec I post earlier. Perhaps you should read my post again. Your information is still not quite right.

The new iMac 27 + i7 + 8G ram = US $2399.
If you go back to my post, https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/10677249/

The cost CAD $2057 is already include the "premium for that expensive display". The price comes with the Dell U2711 IPS monitor, which on the spec is superior to the iMac 27 screen. (U2711 support 32 bit deep color) Convert CAD $2057 back to US dollars, which is US $1985.

So, you are paying a premium of US $414 for.....a all-in-one cool looking computer. With that extra $414, you can upgrade from 5750 to ......perhaps a HD 5970 on a PC.

As I said in my previous post. It's all good to get the iMac if you are not looking for a gaming rig. Check out the iMac forum and you will be amazed so many ppl here are specifically asking for a serious gaming rig on iMac, which iMac is not their answer.

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/979907/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/979897/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/978676/

By no mean I am complaining the iMac is not a gaming rig. I am just saying if anyone want to buy a gaming rig, go else where. Get a PC or PS3.

cawesjmu · Jul 29, 2010

Just a quick question. Will which video card I choose make any discernible difference when editing 720p footage in iMovie or browsing through 10k+ pictures in iPhoto? And I'm just thinking either the 4670 or the 5670.

floridapcguy · Jul 29, 2010

Expensive!

Prices from Tigerdirect!

28" lcd 1920 x 1200 = $249.00
Killer Coolermaster Case 1000 w ps and water cooled = $225.00.00
Intel i7 2.93 GHZ Unlocked for overclocking 5 mb L3 Cashe = $349.00
Intel Motherboard with triple crossfire/SLI and triple channel DDR3 = $229.99
Also supports six raid drives 0,1,5,10 16x16 pci express 12 usb,1 firewire, 7.1 sourround sound & external sata port
12 gb ram=$289.00
1 TB hard drive =$59.00
3 yes 3 Crossfire Grafics cards ATI 5770 1 GB DDR5 total = $450.00
you can run 6 monitors or use GPU in Crossfire mode to run 2 monitors

Total for a kick ass awesome performing and looking PC with win 7OS $1950.00
Not having to pay the apple tax for old technology....priceless!

PS. As far as SSD drives yes they are better at reads, but very poor at writes. The main advantage of these drive right now is that they are almost shockproof, hence better for laptops and portable computers. If you build the right raid with traditional or SCSI drives you will outperform an SSD.

cawesjmu · Jul 29, 2010

floridapcguy said:
... PC with win 7OS

This is where you lose a lot of people on this forum. Myself included. I have to work with Windows at work everyday and much prefer OS X. Hackintosh, yeah, yeah, no thanks. I'm really just curious if the 5670 vid card will make iPhoto and iMovie perform any better than the 4670. I was thinking it wouldn't make much difference but if someone could tell me for sure, I'd appreciate it.

MorphingDragon · Jul 29, 2010

floridapcguy said:
Prices from Tigerdirect!

28" lcd 1920 x 1200 = $249.00
Killer Coolermaster Case 1000 w ps and water cooled = $225.00.00
Intel i7 2.93 GHZ Unlocked for overclocking 5 mb L3 Cashe = $349.00
Intel Motherboard with triple crossfire/SLI and triple channel DDR3 = $229.99
Also supports six raid drives 0,1,5,10 16x16 pci express 12 usb,1 firewire, 7.1 sourround sound & external sata port
12 gb ram=$289.00
1 TB hard drive =$59.00
3 yes 3 Crossfire Grafics cards ATI 5770 1 GB DDR5 total = $450.00
you can run 6 monitors or use GPU in Crossfire mode to run 2 monitors

Total for a kick ass awesome performing and looking PC with win 7OS $1950.00
Not having to pay the apple tax for old technology....priceless!

PS. As far as SSD drives yes they are better at reads, but very poor at writes. The main advantage of these drive right now is that they are almost shockproof, hence better for laptops and portable computers. If you build the right raid with traditional or SCSI drives you will outperform an SSD.

The X58 boards are for 1366 processors only, not 1156. Therefore your RAM, CPU, MOBO is incompatible with each other. Also you would be better spending that money on a single 5970, games don't scale as well as the blurb would make you believe.

Damn that must suck, being corrected on rig building by a Mac user.

floridapcguy · Jul 29, 2010

MorphingDragon said:
The X58 boards are for 1366 processors only, not 1156. Therefore your RAM, CPU, MOBO is incompatible with each other. Also you would be better spending that money on a single 5970, games don't scale as well as the blurb would make you believe.

Damn that must suck, being corrected on rig building by a Mac user.

You are correct, but I put this together in 5 minutes off of TD web page and didn't really look at the socket specs. With price difference of a MAC I could afford a 980x Extreme 3.33 6 core 12mb cashe that would raise the price to 2500.00 or I could step down and use the 930 at 2.8 save a hundred dollars and overclock the chip, still no apple tax, and totally upgradeable. I myself run Xeon processors dual 8 core 16 w/hyperthreading, not a gamer but run heavy reporting with Crystal reports. I prefer linux and open source and run 4 monitors while writing code (help out a lot) I can't imagine running only one monitor, such a production kill! That said I am impressed you know so much about hardware when Apple themselves market their computers to people who don't know how to run computers!

Lotharseven · Jul 29, 2010

It depends on what you want to do. It gets tiring listening to jet engine cooling systems on PCs like the one you speced the other 80% of the time your using the computer for non-gaming. Not to mention power use and cable maze/dust magnet. To each his own.

meb91 · Jul 29, 2010

sdugoten said:
I guess you were refering to my post about the PC spec I post earlier. Perhaps you should read my post again. Your information is still not quite right.

The new iMac 27 + i7 + 8G ram = US $2399.
If you go back to my post, https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/10677249/

The cost CAD $2057 is already include the "premium for that expensive display". The price comes with the Dell U2711 IPS monitor, which on the spec is superior to the iMac 27 screen. (U2711 support 32 bit deep color) Convert CAD $2057 back to US dollars, which is US $1985.

So, you are paying a premium of US $414 for.....a all-in-one cool looking computer. With that extra $414, you can upgrade from 5750 to ......perhaps a HD 5970 on a PC.

As I said in my previous post. It's all good to get the iMac if you are not looking for a gaming rig. Check out the iMac forum and you will be amazed so many ppl here are specifically asking for a serious gaming rig on iMac, which iMac is not their answer.

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/979907/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/979897/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/978676/

By no mean I am complaining the iMac is not a gaming rig. I am just saying if anyone want to buy a gaming rig, go else where. Get a PC or PS3.

I wasn't necessarily only referring to your post, but I did go back and read it. If you can get the U2711 for $698, that certainly is a good deal and saves you some cash. The MSRP however through Dell's US site is $1099, and Amazon sells it for about $979. To be fair, there are sites you can get discounts on iMacs as well, such as MacConnection (and on top of that, avoid paying taxes).

Correct me if I'm wrong but, in your PC build post I didn't see you include extras such as a webcam, bluetooth, wifi, etc. which add to the price.

Even if there were a $400 difference (though unless you order through Dell's Hong Kong store, it'd be more like a $100-$200 difference), to me and many others paying the extra money is worth it for OS X, iLife, and the ability to run other Mac specific software. When you're dropping $2k+ on a computer, a difference of a few hundred dollars isn't a big deal how I see it anyway.

eroxx · Jul 29, 2010

SSD question

If I got the new imac with the SSD, would i be able to take out that SSD and put it in a computer that I buy in the future? I'm just trying to justify the added $900 ...

Eidorian · Jul 31, 2010

Is there any GPU video playback acceleration on these ATI cards now?

MorphingDragon · Jul 31, 2010

Eidorian said:
Is there any GPU video playback acceleration on these ATI cards now?

I didn't notice a difference by installing Gala, removed it and went back to stable.

Benedict · Aug 1, 2010

Hi,

Have any benchmarks been released yet? I would like to see how much faster the new i7 machine compared to the previous model. If not, would anyone like to hazard a guess?

Thank you

Apple Releases New iMacs with Upgraded ATI Radeon HD Graphics Cards

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