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Old Sep 18, 2010, 09:18 AM   #101
tripjammer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jp102235 View Post
1: I have heard there is 16G of flash in TV

2: ->
Holy cow,
man, I don't know how many times I can say this: you don't need 1080p on an appleTV!!!!!!
the information content of the source material (itunes/anything on ipad) is WAAY WAAAAY below 1080p bit rate capability.
[sarcasm flag on]
you would be much better off buying a set of denon AKDL1's - now _they_ will get you unparalleled audio (and maybe video) performance -
or perhaps you need some speaker wire from http://www.pearcable.com/sub_products_anjou_sc.htm from what I understand you can hear EVERYTHING with those cables.
[sarcast flag off]

seriously, before you rant about video quality - read the handbrake forums and the blue ray to apple tv threads here on MR.

you will find that 1080p is not useful unless you have high bit rate content to show it on.

that is all
j
no tv shows are in 1080p...only bluray is 1080p

Apple tv does not need to be 1080p
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 09:23 AM   #102
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Originally Posted by Rocketman View Post
I generally agree, but there are flies in the ointment. The content providers are objecting to Apple recording and managing their subscribers, the 30% take and the target low price.

Personally I think they should charge whatever price the market will bear and once they learn Apple was right people will have beaten them into submission.

The other issue is bandwidth. This may be hard for most of you to understand but half the country is still bandwidth starved. 40% of people are not even on the internet, and most of them do watch TV.

Apple TV has to be as simple as falling off a log and as widespread as any internet signal can be.

It NEEDS to cache content to play smoothly in crippled areas.

Rocketman

The new apple tv will have 16gb of flash and 512mb of ram...along with the A4 chip running at least 1 GHZ all this will b fine.

lets hope! two weeks to go people! Ifixit tear this baby down!
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 10:36 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by cube View Post
The right time is when it gets a hard disk, analog audio out and 1080p.
It's already got analogue audio out.

It will receive content from any hard disk in the house via airplay, so that box is ticked

No official/lega supplier of streaming content does so at 1080 - there is no 1080 content for rental or purchase on line for immediate streaming, which is the preferred method of delivery for apple, so there's no need for the facility at this stage.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 10:39 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
That's works because there's a cursor on screen to indicate where you are pointing to and what is going to be activated by the click or button press. That was his point, iOS doesn't have a cursor.

Touch screen control doesn't work when the screen you're touching and the display aren't the same screen. Unless you throw in a cursor. But then it's not touch screen control anymore, it's called a trackpad.



A remote app is not what is being discussed in these threads, it is not what people think when they say "control AppleTV through your iOS device". They are thinking trackpad without a cursor. Shortsighted.

Also, being a flat surface, iOS devices as a remote is god awful. Tactile feedback is required if you don't want to be staring at the remote while you operate your TV.
Why is a cursor needed? If you need to interact, there are buttons, options - so moving the controller left or right, up or down scrolls between these options. maybe it's you who is being short sighted. The cursor is a full OS device, why is it needed for iOS? You can navigate buttons, options and play many wii games without the need for a cursor. Same difference.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 10:41 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Some_Big_Spoon View Post
I read that as:

"Dear TV Networks,

When it strikes my fancy, I will crush you.

- Love Steve."
Excellent interpretation. Agreed fully, and I can't wait for Steve to do just that. People here are too nearsighted. TV is going to take off, and people are going to scratch their heads wondering how. There's already an answer in place for most questions asked here. Just wait for Apple to come forward with them.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 10:46 AM   #106
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ATV doesn't need internal hard, because it has a mini USB plug. with the USB plug you can connect a 10TB NAS to it.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 11:05 AM   #107
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ATV doesn't need internal hard, because it has a mini USB plug. with the USB plug you can connect a 10TB NAS to it.
Why not use the Ethernet port to connect the NAS? That would be a lot easier.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 11:15 AM   #108
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yea - let's calculate all of this

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Originally Posted by MagnusVonMagnum View Post
You don't get it. It doesn't matter. The mere lack of 1080p regardless of merit will drive MOST PEOPLE away. You WILL NOT convince them they don't need it, regardless of merit.
That's what they said about compressed audio

Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusVonMagnum View Post
... I rent movies from Apple once in awhile, but 90% or more of my usage of my Apple TV is to watch or listen to my own OWNED content. I'm talking about the fact I converted my entire CD and movie (DVD/LD/VHS) and video (Hi8; digital camcorder) libraries to view on Apple TV through streaming from iTunes.
yea that is awesome - but apple tv wasn't intended for it, AND, re-compressing all that video down to bit rates that TV can handle means you lost _some_ quality. As long as you are ok with that - I like your setup as well - mine is similar.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusVonMagnum View Post
The lack of 1080p, though means I have to convert HD movies to 720p to store them.
you are already compressing those movies so much that the small change is resolution would not be noticeable (during my image compression research: I found that 80% of the pixels in an image can be grouped with its neighbors into much bigger macroblocks that far exceed the resolution difference between 720p and 1080p)


Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusVonMagnum View Post
With a half hour leader or so, you could stream a 1080p movie while downloading without too much difficulty with 5Mbps or better.
5Mbps*30 minutes = 9Gb = 1.3GB which is 4.5% of a blu-ray quality movie, and for a 90min movie is about: 4 minutes of the movie.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusVonMagnum View Post
I wait a mere 20-30 seconds on average to buffer/stream an iTunes 720p rental, after all.
because iTunes 720p isn't HD, its barely DVD quality - check the bitrates.


ok, math time: to stream a bluray quality video source: you are looking at 25-40G. That's bytes BTW. so you need min: 25G/90minutes =4.629MBs or *8bits/byte= 37Mbps on your net connection. (yea I left off error correction bits/ and other overhead)

802.11N=160Mbps - best case
Gigabit ethernet=1GBps - best case (great wires/crimps and compatible equipment, no twists,loops or illegal bends)

so if 1) you want to stream from the cloud: it aint happening unless you have a great connection OR massive compression (itunes HD != real HD)

2) you want to stream from your server in house: you better have Gigabit ethernet, and a good server - or you can expect to get stuttering (see the wd tv live forums for more info on that) if you attempt to use 802.11N - the rest of your network will come to a screeching halt.

3) you want to play the HD video from a media player / htpc with a built in hard drive: now that you can do (again see the mac mini forums and wd tv live forums)

in short: an overnight blu ray order from amazon _may_ be faster than downloading it (based on your connection speed) - (see bit torrent forums on how long it takes to download bd iso's)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusVonMagnum View Post
Once again, you seem to miss the point. This device doesn't have to be just about iTunes rentals/sales.
yea - and this is the key point: I think a $99 device was meant to be just that: an itunes portal.

I TOTALLY get the whole home movies/video server setup, yea - that is great and something I wish apple would address beyond the mini (DVR maybe?) - but I think you are really wishing TV was something that it simply was never intended to be. But ask yourself: who has such a product? its kinda untested waters: an non-htpc that has the guts to handle 20-40Mbps video content. I have been in product breifings since 1992 discussing the fabled "STB: set top box" which has long been sought after by many electronics firms. VCR, cable box, DVR, and (???) have all had runs, I anxiously await the next generation, as I am so disappointed our current linux (and windows surprisingly) based DVRs (dish,comcast,directv,etc) have the horsepower to do it, but simply have chosen not to.

my prediction: it'll all be built into your tv (see plex). there will be no stb.

j

Last edited by jp102235; Sep 18, 2010 at 11:35 AM. Reason: embarrassing math error (min and secs got confused)
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 11:19 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by nelmat View Post
It's already got analogue audio out.
The new Apple TV hasn't.

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Old Sep 18, 2010, 11:25 AM   #110
jp102235
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touch without touching

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Originally Posted by E.Lizardo View Post
Ant therefore have no idea what your fingers are doing!Fail!
The whole point of a touch screen is you TOUCH the SCREEN that is displaying what you want to control/manipulate.If you look away from the TV you've just defeated the whole purpose of turning it on in the first place.
It depends:
do you look at the keys when you are typing on a standard keyboard? some people do, many of us touch-type and some of us weirdos use/buy keyboards that are blank.

game controllers are the same - you don't look at the game controller when you are using it - correct?

you make a gesture (a keypress, touchpad movement, joystick deflection) then use your other senses as feedback (eyes, audio) as to what that gesture accomplished.

its a stretch, but you really don't _have_ to have your hands on the screen to do touch (I used to own a fingerworks touchstream and it worked liked this) - so its not unthinkable that magic trackpad could be used to work a touch interface on a tv.

just saying

j
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 11:26 AM   #111
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there is an adapter for that

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Originally Posted by OllyW View Post
The new Apple TV hasn't.
I believe there are very cheap digital to analogue audio adapters for that.

just saying

j
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 11:31 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by jp102235 View Post
I believe there are very cheap digital to analogue audio adapters for that.

just saying

j
It still hasn't got analogue audio outputs though has it?

How cheap is very cheap?
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 11:41 AM   #113
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upgrade time

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Originally Posted by OllyW View Post
It still hasn't got analogue audio outputs though has it?

How cheap is very cheap?
true that. (50-60 USD) but if you are in need of analogue at this point - you may be a bit of an outlier. perhaps an upgrade is in order?

j
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 12:59 PM   #114
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People are too hung up on 2 things which is completely rediculous.

1. 1080p - most people can't stream it due to lack of bandwidth, and digital purchases of 1080p content takes hours to download and many gigs of space. Its just not practical for digital media right now and 720p HD is plenty good and still better than DVD.

2. Storage - I have an original Apple TV and I found very little reason to store the movies local on the device. The streaming works very well. The only reason might be a bad network signal in your home which means you probably want something else to extend your signal. When its the difference between $229 and $99, I would take the cheaper option.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 01:15 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by tripjammer View Post
The new apple tv will have 16gb of flash and 512mb of ram...along with the A4 chip running at least 1 GHZ all this will b fine.

lets hope! two weeks to go people! Ifixit tear this baby down!
There's only one memory chip in the new Apple TV [max 256 KB] and the A4 is not running at full speed, but at a lower clock rate.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 01:46 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by goobot View Post
4.2 or 5.0 he wouldnt say anything unless it was near.
I agree. We will probably see this in a year max.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 01:48 PM   #117
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Originally Posted by Master Chief View Post
There's only one memory chip in the new Apple TV [max 256 KB] and the A4 is not running at full speed, but at a lower clock rate.
What are you talking about? I think I heard 16 GB somewhere. There is no way the operating system is going to fit in less the 400 MB. Sounds like you are making things up.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 01:51 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by richman555 View Post
People are too hung up on 2 things which is completely rediculous.

1. 1080p - most people can't stream it due to lack of bandwidth, and digital purchases of 1080p content takes hours to download and many gigs of space. Its just not practical for digital media right now and 720p HD is plenty good and still better than DVD.

2. Storage - I have an original Apple TV and I found very little reason to store the movies local on the device. The streaming works very well. The only reason might be a bad network signal in your home which means you probably want something else to extend your signal. When its the difference between $229 and $99, I would take the cheaper option.
Hopefully Apple is close to implementing the new Adhoc Wifi specs so that this isn't a problem. It would be cool if existing devices will be upgraded too.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 02:18 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by gnasher729 View Post
Most people don't care about 1080p...Most 1080p material is so compressed that it doesn't look any better than 720p.
That is one of the problems of just throwing around a buzzword.

Some people with very high-end "videophile level" systems want "1080p" with bitrates approaching the maximum sustainable read rate for a Blu-ray disc. Clearly, you're not going to be able to push that over anything other than the Internet2 system and the businesses and educational institutions connected to Internet2 would not allow streaming of that content anyway.

Others wants "1080p" that is a Blu-ray disc with the data rate knocked down by a factor of 5 to 10 in order to not have a wall of hard disks in a RAID array to store the media files. While the "critics consensus" is that such a compressed fle looks better than a 720p iTMS file, but it's not going to be as good as the original Blu-ray disc source so if "quality" is so important, why not stick with the original Blu-ray disc?

And even those compressed files push well into the multi-GB range, which means depending on the speed and capacity caps your ISP imposes, they take time to download and you can only download so many. So even if Apple offered "1080p" content in a similar file size, you could only download so much before you ran out of time or allowed bandwidth.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 02:21 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by 4nNtt View Post
What are you talking about? I think I heard 16 GB somewhere. There is no way the operating system is going to fit in less the 400 MB. Sounds like you are making things up.
You are confused. I'm talking about RAM not flash storage, which has to be larger yes.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 02:27 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by Newton1666 View Post
The right time might be when the server farm in North Carolina goes operational, and then those puny Rebels will be wiped from the Aldarin System.

In truth I don't expect much from TV until more content providers start making there own apps for iOS ecosystem. Jobs flips the switch and everyone is happy. This egg is waiting for more chickens to hatch.

*More than enough mixed metaphors and Star Wars references for one day.

I am fairly confident the data center will be running on Netlist Hypercloud technology. This is amazing cloud computing memory that removes the bottleneck in server farms and allows them to running faster, cooler and cheaper. Check it out at netlist.com
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 02:34 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by mplaisance View Post
Did you ever stop to think that Steve gave you just ALL the stuff you wanting in a little device called a Mac Mini!!
You are the second to suggest this, but you are flat out wrong. I'm not going to keep repeating myself over and over again to explain why so I suggest you look for that post instead of posting nonsense all over again. For starters, you might look at the control interface (or the total lack of one unless you count the hopelessly outdated Front Row) and the total lack of Blu-Ray support in OSX.

Ironically, a *PC* running Windows7, ironically, COULD do and be what I talk about if it had a proper unified control interface that is simple enough to use in home theaters (i.e. you should not have to run it like a regular computer). But a Mac is wholly inadequate for the job given its tiny internal hard drive (2.5" based is unacceptable given you cannot even fit 1TB in it and having to expand externally defeats the point of a home theater shaped box). You cannot access existing HD rentals (that ATV uses) from a Mac Mini under ANY circumstance (defeats the ENTIRE point of the box). There is no simple living room method to convert DVDs, let alone Blu-Ray discs to be stored on its hard drive or a house server (more work). Without the governing interface to make access to Netflix, Hulu, etc. easy to use from a remote type situation (or at least a good controller like a Wii type remote to make navigating such sites simpler), all you end up with is a bloody PC sitting in your living room and having to use the same old mouse-type controls that are NO GOOD for that kind of situation.

In short, your idea sucks because it's 85% incomplete and does not deal with ANY of the shortcomings of being used in a home theater environment. You could run something like Plex instead, but it no more handles Blu-Ray, ripping and encoding (ala iTunes CD ripping ease for movies) any more than iTunes or ATV does. In short, it's not a total or elegant solution to home theater AT ALL. The only benefit about ATV is the ability to handle 1080p and possibly internet-based video services from 3rd party software without "hacking". But you also lose the best feature of ATV over such a setup and that is the ability to rent thousands of HD titles (only a few can be rented or purchased outside ATV). And until recently, the Mac Mini didn't even have HDMI and thus it was unsuitable for rentals anyway.


Quote:
Also have you thought that maybe this is not all Apples decisions that effect product realeases. There are a lot of legal, license, and copy right issues that have to be ironed out and as successful as Apples has been especially the Music Industry, other Media Companies tread lightly as to what Apple has planned.
Man, did you read the other guy's post and copy it point for point? Give it up. Apple already has rentals for all those movies. They can't seem to get the license to SELL those titles or use them with non-HDCP Macs and thus the reasons Steve has no rentals for the thousands of titles ATV handles for regular Macs and thus the reason that iTunes sucks so hard compared to Blu-Ray where thousands of movies are available to both buy and rent. Yes, you can encode your own stuff (illegally) from either BD rips or pirated material, but that is hardly an elegant home theater solution.

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And while I am sure Apple wants to push iTunes content because it's money to them, remember iTunes is a big part of Apples user experience. With iTunes Application and Apple's Hardware it great combination. These TWO hardware/software integration is a big part of the iPods success. But also Apple has shown it plays well with others. They played well with Google for the iPhone(of course look what Google did), now they playing well with Netflix.
WTF is your point? You cannot rent most HD titles except through ATV. You cannot buy hardly any titles in HD from iTunes. iTunes will not handle any 3rd party formats (home videos will have to be converted to M4V to even watch them through that archival system). Worse yet, Apple is increasingly releasing buggered versions of iTunes in order to meet hardware release dates when the software clearly isn't ready (i.e. iTunes 10 crashes 50x more often than iTunes 9, but they had a deadline so they shoved it out the door anyway). If Apple wants to keep the reputation of iTunes mated with Apple hardware intact, they better start thinking more about QUALITY than being in a hurry to meet timetables. NO ONE wants a POS full of bugs and crashes or in the case of a certain iOS hardware device, dropping calls constantly because they were in a hurry to get your money.


Quote:
I understand you WANT IT ALL and you can by putting a damn computer in you living room!! But Apple too has to tread lightly with the "content companies". Business is business and its a cut-throat industry.
Bullcrap. Content companies have NOTHING to do with ATV not sporting BD. They have nothing to do with a decent remote. They have nothing to do with app support. They have nothing to do a lack of 1080p support both on ATV and in iTunes. They have nothing to do with 3rd party format support in iTunes (so you don't have to convert all your existing material including home videos to M4V just to get them to work and then without 1080p and no DTS support or any other modern audio decoder support like Dolby True HD, etc.) They have nothing to do with a lack of gaming support on the the device of any kind, the lack of a front panel display for title information (forcing a TV/Projector to be on even when only playing music titles, wearing the bulbs out when it should be unneeded for music). It has nothing to do with a lack of facilities to converting your existing DVD collection as iTunes does for music CDs. It has nothing to do with the lack of an iTunes style visualizer to use with music CDs (only being able to watch photo slide-shows). It has nothing to do with the lack of support of UPnP or NAS storage devices (thus requiring a PC or Mac to be on and running in order to watch your streamed material). It has nothing to do with the lack of external drive support on the device (at least without hacking). The ATV interface doesn't even give the time of day (let alone weather reports like XBMC) despite the device having the time internally. Forget alarms or sleep modes, etc. I'm sure Hollywood prevented those from being included as well!

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Plus who are to judge Steve's business. The man started a Billion Dollar company from his garage, pioneered the Macintosh, left the Company he
found, found another company, no two, Next and Pixar, the former to become what is now the OS you are currently running, MAC OS X, and Pixar?
WTF does any of that have to do with whether a consumer buys a product or not????? Oh, Steve is a great rich guy who made Pixar so I'm going to just buy anything he sells? Man, are you living in fan-boy world or something? Get with reality!


Well I would hope you know who they are. He than came back to Apple and pulled them out of near bankruptcy to now the Second highest company in Market Cap just under Exxon in just a little over 10 years. HOW IS THAT http://www.macworld.com/article/1460...rc=rss_mainFOR A RESUME!!

Quote:
Also I can't understand why people are screaming 1080p.
You don't seem to understand anything so I'm nor surprised.

Suffice to say if you have a 120" screen with a high-end projector that does a crisp 1080p and you're sitting 10 feet away, you can EASILY see the difference between 720p and 1080p. And let me tell you that such a person is not going to want to watch relatively low bit-rate 720p when high bit-rate 1080p is available (i.e. Blu-Ray).

Many people's systems will not show a big difference, but that does not mean you build for the lowest common denominator. Suppose I cannot tell the difference between 480p and 1080p because I have a small HDTV and sit far away. Does that mean I should start a large DVD collection now? No, because in the future I may be able to afford/buy a larger TV and then all my videos would be sub-standard when if I had bought 1080p Blu-Ray, I'd be all set with content for my new screen. Similarly, why would someone purposely start buying a large collection of 720p movies when 1080p movies are available? Because Apple doesn't want to support them. Yeah, right. The person simply doesn't buy the Apple product and gets a Blu-Ray player or a video display from someone else. 1080p has been available for a decade and BD for over a half decade. Apple is living in the past and it's really starting to grate. People don't want to hear BS excuses about "bags of hurt". The only "bag of hurt" is Steve Jobs himself refusing to support technology by other companies that is clearly superior to the crap he's pushing in the iTunes store (most iTunes movies are NOT available to sell even in 720p! You have to get poorly encoded 480p stuff that doesn't even have Dolby Digital 5.1 sound from over 15 years prior! (e.g. even latter day Laserdisc supported Dolby Digital AC3 5.1!)

Quote:
Pleas people over 90% of the content you watch is in 720p or at best 1080i, which many say 720p is much better than 1080i. The reason is bandwidth!! Try downloading a blueray size movie or streaming that puppy. The thing is
You don't need to stream a blu-ray "size" movie. 1080p will compress nicely to 1/4 that size without appreciable increase in artifacts. BD has the extra room so they use less compression. It's that simple. It doesn't mean a streamed movie has to be that large. A 4-5GB sized BD ripped/encoded movie will still look better than a 720p Apple 2.5 GB movie and it will stream just fine over a network. If you have 10Mbps Internet (increasingly common), it will stream in real time over the Internet even just as 720P Apple movies will on a 5Mbps network. You'd need a 40minute to 1 hour delay on a 5Mbps Internet connection (still competitive against having to drive to Best Buy or Hollywood Video in many cases to buy or rent a disc) and much more convenient. Once purchased, it will easily stream on 802.11N in real time.

Quote:
it's obvious Apple is moving to the cloud. No more CD's or DVD's. Companies like Apple see those as "old" technology. Apple is building this huge Data Farm in Nort Carolina. Be interesting to see what they do with it. Maybe once it's online we will all be able to stream ALL our owned content from Apple's servers. So basically content anywhere you have a connection. And of course you can still keep you content local if you choose.
Yes, let's put our entire lives on Apple servers so they can control our lives for us! I'm sure my personal data would be MUCH safer from hackers, etc. on Mobile Me than on my own Mac. Imagine if you're writing an important document with a word processor running "from the cloud" and the "cloud" goes down (for whatever reason from hacking to local power failure to a computer bug/glitch). YOU'RE FRAKED! You can reboot or switch computers or go to battery backup at home, but you cannot control what happens in North Carolina. So no thanks. I don't want the "cloud".
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 02:59 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E.Lizardo View Post
wrong in so many ways,but I'll point out a few:
Nobody's going to get a license to sell a Blu-Ray ripper,repeat:NOBODY
And you support that conclusion HOW exactly? Oh that's right. You just made it up. There's a freaking shock.

It's more like they would NOT ALLOW a Blu-Ray ripper to be sold to the general public. OTOH, they MIGHT allow a secure BD ripping device if the results were also watermarked/protected for secure home use only. Such devices were created for DVD and perfectly LEGAL so spare me the BS you're making up off the top of your head about it could never happen.

Quote:
Many people(me included) already have a DVR,including one would be a deal killer for me
The point is that with storage (at 1.5TB selling for <$99, don't tell me it's too expensive to include) it could simply be an *APP*. How would a free app be a deal breaker? You could simply choose not to use it. Besides, the number of people I see that WANTED one when the last ATV came out greatly outnumbered those that said they would not buy one if it was included. My cable box has a DVR, but its internal hard drive is only around 40GB. You cannot expand it yourself. I'd LOVE to have an ATV with a 2TB drive that has a DVR function. I could store dozens of HD movies and TV shows and not worry about them getting bumped. Would I want to buy a separate box (Tivo?) to do this? No, but if all I had to do was connect a 2TB external drive for around $100, I'd do it in heartbeat. You wouldn't? I couldn't care less what YOU do, but I believe plenty of others would like that flexibility if it didn't cost much. Even the new ATV has a USB port on it. Apple could easily enable for external storage if they chose. But they would have had to include some form of input to offer such functions. It would have added little to the price and could have been used for apps to transfer other mediums as well (home videos on VHS, older camcorders, etc.)

Quote:
I never store video on my aTV,streaming only
Neither do I, but I do store PHOTOS because I don't care for a 2 second load time when they can come up instantly locally (besides iTunes won't stream photos from the main library on the 1st gen ATV). But that does mean that even my 40GB ATV could have acted as a DVR if they had bothered since almost all of that space is available for use.

Quote:
500 buicks????You obviously want to make the original aTV look like the most successful product ever made.
You obviously are completely and without a doubt CLUELESS to even make such a statement. I'm talking about a box that is also a Blu-Ray player/Ripper/DVR/Game machine and you're talking about the 1st Generation ATV.... Go look up what a good quality Blu-Ray player alone costs. I'd gladly pay $500 for the device I'm talking about because it would replace most of my home theater (add receiver and you're done). I already bought two 1st Gen ATV units ($600 total) and one isn't even used for video most of the time. You talk like that's too much money when most Apple users fork out $1500+ every other year for a new iMac or $2000+ for a new MBP and think nothing of it. My cost schemes are based on Apple margins, not 3rd party companies. $500 would be cheap for Apple. The Mac Mini is $700 MINIMUM now and STILL doesn't even have a BD drive.

But if price was the ONLY reason why ATV didn't sell, then these new $99 units should sell like HOTCAKES. I'm betting in their current form they will not because they lack new features (other than Airstream and Netflix) and don't do 1080p nor does iTunes support (let alone the new ATV work with) HD movie sales. This is purely a rental device. The new XBMC player box has much better potential.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jp102235 View Post
That's what they said about compressed audio
Even Blu-Ray is compressed guy.

Quote:
yea that is awesome - but apple tv wasn't intended for it, AND, re-compressing all that video down to bit rates that TV can handle means you lost _some_ quality. As long as you are ok with that - I like your setup as well - mine is similar.
You don't seem to understand compression at all based on the totality of your post. You keep talking about bit-rates and quality loss, etc., but you don't look ONE BIT at the METHODS being used for the compression! DVD uses MPEG2 for goodness sake! It's CRAP. M4V is H264. You don't need a 5GB movie file to get "DVD quality" with H264! 2GB is more than sufficient for DVD quality. Similarly, BD is OVERKILL on the light compression front. You can get a BD compressed MKV file that is 5-8GB that indistinguishable from the original under 95% of displays and the lack of head-to-head still comparisons. But I guarantee that 1080p at that rate is still going to look better than a 2.5GB 720P file!

Quote:
you are already compressing those movies so much that the small change is resolution would not be noticeable (during my image compression research:
If you think that going from 1920x1080 to 1280x720 is a "small change" in resolution, no wonder you're confused. The difference is large enough that you can fit a 16x9 DVD signal in between the two!

Quote:
5Mbps*30 minutes = 9Gb = 1.3GB which is 4.5% of a blu-ray quality movie, and for a 90min movie is about: 4 minutes of the movie.

because iTunes 720p isn't HD, its barely DVD quality - check the bitrates.
If you think ATV is "barely DVD quality" you are BLIND. Again, learn the difference between MPEG2 and H264 (PLEASE do it; you are stating NONSENSE and have obviously never even seen an ATV HD movie! I've got a top-notch 720P projector and watch both 720p and 480p movies on my 93" screen and it's night and day!)

I'll leave the rest of your pointless post alone sense it's based on faulty assumptions about encoding methods and the amount of data needed to achieve a clean signal.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 03:31 PM   #124
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Last edited by adriaanmulder; Oct 25, 2011 at 07:47 PM.
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Old Sep 18, 2010, 03:35 PM   #125
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High bitrates do not equate to high quality; you have to consider the codec and type of content. Some things can be sampled at a lower bitrate without andy perceptible loss of quality...YMMV of course.
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