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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:02 AM   #626
k995
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Originally Posted by andythursby View Post
Again, if you read this thread, It was announced there but not shown, it wasn't actually shown anywhere until Feb 07...... You're looking silly now.
You dont design a phone in weeks

Anyone doesnt matter LG prada WAS shown before iphone and they share just as much .
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:15 AM   #627
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Now as rumors confirm that Apple's coasting on the mediocre iPhone 5, they present us with a Golden Opportunity to try another brand.

There's an exciting new dual core, Super AMOLED Plus equipped, 8.5mm thin, Galaxy S2 to be released soon.

It has a killer video cam and loads of other new features.

http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i910..._s_ii-3621.php
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:23 AM   #628
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Originally Posted by mark28 View Post
The samsung was already presented in 2006 before the iPhone was there
So what? Apple perfected and delivered.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:49 AM   #629
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Originally Posted by AndroidfoLife View Post
Its called criticism, People should not be D!ck riding anything. Apple is doing a a D!ck move right now. They seem to believe they invented the touchscreen, the smart phone, and apps. When we all know these where around far before apple. Apple should not have claims to combining them.
No, this has gone far further than criticism. This should be a reasonably level debate about how a company has ripped off the look and feel of the iPhone for their own gain.

The whole thing is about look and feel, and Apple have rightly protected that look and feel, and are rightly upset about people copying it.

There are some excellent comments on this thread about the situation, but are the haters listening? Nope. Not in the slightest. Instead, we're reading drivel being posted about people who don't want to understand the concept of protecting IP.

And why are you here - if you are an Android fan? Of course you won't be batting for Apple when you already jumped ship.

At the end of the day - so what if people want to hear good things about Apple on this site - its an APPLE FAN SITE FFS. THE CLUE IS IN THE *********G NAME OF THE SITE - MACRUMORS.

Gees.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:55 AM   #630
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Originally Posted by mark28 View Post
The samsung was already presented in 2006 before the iPhone was there
Does it need to be said on every page? It certainly wasn't; it was announced in February 2007, after the iPhone.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:56 AM   #631
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Consultant
1) Show me something that works as well BEFORE Apple demoed the iPhone.

2) Technology =/= usability.

3) If you hate Apple then why are you doing here?
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Originally Posted by maclaptop View Post
1) The list is endless.

2) Even six year old kids know this

3) Try showing some respect, the poster does not hate.

Remember the value of an intelligent exchange of thoughts and experience is of far greater value when approached with an open mind.
1. It's not though.

2006 mobile phone UI design had come to a grind halt. It was one of my big issues about buying a new mobile phone - they were all rubbish.

I don't know if you are US based or European, but if your experience is US, step off now as the US was very late to mobile phones, and you missed out on the whole Nokia vs Sony Ericsson wars.

However, phones by the mid 2000s were rubbish. No one was spending any money on a good UI, there were a few half hearted attempts.

Apple then show the world how to do it, and it really is as simple as that. I wasn't even an Apple person then, and when I finally saw an iPhone, it was a real eye opener. Here was finally a phone that looked good and worked well.

Which is exactly why they shifted millions of the things despite having a poor hardware spec compared to Nokia/SE/Motorola/etc.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:56 AM   #632
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Does it need to be said on every page? It certainly wasn't; it was announced in February 2007, after the iPhone.
It was announced before the iPhone but was 'shown' after the release of the iPhone.

No one knew what the f700 looked like or what it was. It was just a touch screen phone planned for a later release.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 07:57 AM   #633
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Originally Posted by tinman0 View Post
No, this has gone far further than criticism. This should be a reasonably level debate about how a company has ripped off the look and feel of the iPhone for their own gain.
Already guilty he?

Quote:
The whole thing is about look and feel, and Apple have rightly protected that look and feel, and are rightly upset about people copying it.
Only its not, the NExus S doesnt look like and doesnt work and feel like an iphone.



Quote:
There are some excellent comments on this thread about the situation, but are the haters listening? Nope. Not in the slightest. Instead, we're reading drivel being posted about people who don't want to understand the concept of protecting IP.
Apple is trying to copywright a very generic makeup, a makeup already shown before the iphone was even released. Of course people will criticise that. Of course the minute you do speak against apple's policy you are a "hater" .

Quote:
And why are you here - if you are an Android fan? Of course you won't be batting for Apple when you already jumped ship.
I bought my wife and android phone, works fine, get an iphone works also fine. Imac and windows 7 pc all work fine, apple tv, ipad,...

Quote:
At the end of the day - so what if people want to hear good things about Apple on this site - its an APPLE FAN SITE FFS. THE CLUE IS IN THE *********G NAME OF THE SITE - MACRUMORS.

Gees.
No need to get upset , nothing personal.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 08:00 AM   #634
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Originally Posted by tinman0 View Post
Apple then show the world how to do it, and it really is as simple as that. I wasn't even an Apple person then, and when I finally saw an iPhone, it was a real eye opener. Here was finally a phone that looked good and worked well.

Which is exactly why they shifted millions of the things despite having a poor hardware spec compared to Nokia/SE/Motorola/etc.
BS

Look at spb mobile shell, htc with its shell over windows mobile, lg prada with its icons and dock,...

The whole market was already shifting, apple was one of them (and yes one of the best)

Its not because you didnt see it , nothing existed at the time.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 08:32 AM   #635
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Originally Posted by dethmaShine View Post
It was announced before the iPhone but was 'shown' after the release of the iPhone.

No one knew what the f700 looked like or what it was. It was just a touch screen phone planned for a later release.
When I say announced I should have said unveiled, but regardless the point is the same. The iPhone was shown and sold first so there's no copying.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 08:49 AM   #636
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The first of apple lawsuits seems to go against apple :

HTC and Nokia score legal win against Apple

http://www.rethink-wireless.com/2011...inst-apple.htm

Lets hope apple puts a bit more effort into iOS 5 and the iphone 5 and not in inventing legal charges against its competitors.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 09:24 AM   #637
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Originally Posted by DeathChill View Post
When I say announced I should have said unveiled, but regardless the point is the same. The iPhone was shown and sold first so there's no copying.
I never said you were wrong. Unveiled is displaying the phone/ announcing is not.

Never mind, we both are on the right track.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 10:42 AM   #638
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Originally Posted by paradox00 View Post
Funny, Apple specifically mentioned the UI, so they think they can. If you can't defend the UI, why do people keep bringing up the Prada (although the UI's are very different through anyone but an apple haters glasses)?
You can try but I have yet to see a win case of vague UI patent or any UI patent based on "look and feel".

I will tell you my story. I have consulted with a lot of media lawyers and software developers (some who were responsible for PalmOS) and I was also advised to patent some of my GUI ideas but not to protect it but rather to leave a watermark saying i came up with that first (or I patented it first). Why? Because Patent office does not regulate whole look and feel yet, as a matter of fact its somewhere in between patent and trademark, not defined yet. Also after it spreads into mainstream there is just no way to collect royalties. Those are real stories I heard all over the place. Plain english if you want to make a strong patent case you have to make sure you say in very precise detail how something works to do what it does. GUI is a lot more complex than that because it uses something that is protected already and allows a manipulation of the same and that is the problem. But here is the kicker, even software patents are so loosley regulated and that is a whole another mess, because you can't patent algorithm you can always get end result of your competitor without stealing the code.

Its a mess made by United States Patent and Trademark Office because they approve patents that fall down in court.

Here is a useful link for starters http://www.ftc.gov/os/comments/intel...patentthat.pdf
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 11:00 AM   #639
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re: apps

That's really *not* where the iPhone is clearly superior. I've owned several iPhones and currently have an HTC Evo. I'll be the first to say I like the iPhone better overall - but seriously, BOTH platforms have plenty of good apps. If you want to play the game you played below? I could respond with, "How much did Angry Birds cost you for the iPhone? Full version was FREE on Android! How about Amazon's cloud music player? Firefox 4 mobile browser? Native Flash support? Widgets? My local TV station, Channel 4, also has a handy Android news and weather app but no iPhone compatible version."

The bottom line is, just as Google has done a few Android-exclusive things in support of their own platform (like the Google Maps with voice), Apple has done the same for their iOS platform by selling their own apps like Garageband and the mobile versions of Pages/Keynote/Numbers.

But 90% of the time, you can find the SAME apps for both platforms. My Android phone is loaded with most of the same apps I used before on the iPhone like UrbanSpoon, USA Today, Pandora, Amazon's Kindle Reader, Realtor.com, and a Yellow Pages lookup app.

The reason I like the iPhone better is mainly due to iOS itself. I think it's far easier to delete an app by holding the icon until it jiggles, and tapping the little X in the corner than by going through multiple levels of menus to find it in a list of installed apps and delete. I think it's far nicer being able to manage which icons are on which screens right from thumbnail views in iTunes, and to be able to slide them around on the phone itself to re-arrange them on a single screen. I think iOS is less likely to need a hard reboot to clear up strange behavior like apps refusing to use a wi-fi connection or 3G data connection that's available. I think the iPhone has better battery life and a camera that takes better quality photos than most Android phones.


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Originally Posted by LagunaSol View Post
No, quite honestly it's really not that debatable at all. Where's Android's GarageBand? Keynote? Pages? OmniFocus? Carcassonne? Death Rally? Netflix? TabToolkit? DJay? World of Goo? Infinity Blade? Reeder? Flipboard? The list goes on. And on. And on.

Of course Android has...Google Maps with voice.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 11:02 AM   #640
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Windows 7 just came out and it doesn't look like the iPhone's UI. If Microsoft can do it so can the rest of the guys.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 12:02 PM   #641
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i admire 's aggressiveness here - keep the market in check and keep making profits...
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 02:53 PM   #642
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Originally Posted by k995 View Post
You dont design a phone in weeks

Anyone doesnt matter LG prada WAS shown before iphone and they share just as much .
well from what i see, the first working model was in march, that's 2 months. anyway you put that phone side by side with the iPhone and it's not similar, unlike the galaxy which is a poor man's iPhone. apple have specified the galaxy, not the F700.

its funny how people are trying to deflect the fact the galaxy is a practial ripoff of the iPhone by claiming the f700 and the iPhone look alike....

look at motorola's and htc's android phones, much different designs compared to the iPhone
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 03:52 PM   #643
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Great article at Businessinsider about how many things Samsung copies, which includes the connectors lol.

http://www.businessinsider.com/samsung-designs-2011-4#
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 04:00 PM   #644
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Originally Posted by andythursby View Post
unlike the galaxy which is a poor man's iPhone.
"Poor man's iPhone"???
You do realize they cost the same don't you?

As for similarity in looks, put a chrome bezel around most phones and they will "look similar" to an iPhone.

Look at almost any current smartphone and you'll see the shapes are almost identical.
One glaring difference between the iPhone and the Galaxy S is the Galaxy S is a bigger phone with a bigger screen.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 04:16 PM   #645
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"Poor man's iPhone"???
You do realize they cost the same don't you?

As for similarity in looks, put a chrome bezel around most phones and they will "look similar" to an iPhone.

Look at almost any current smartphone and you'll see the shapes are almost identical.
One glaring difference between the iPhone and the Galaxy S is the Galaxy S is a bigger phone with a bigger screen.
i said poor man's iPhone as it looks like a cheap knockoff.

Again you miss my point, it's not just the chrome bezel, it's all the things adding up to it, the bezel, the shape, samsungs touchwiz UI which is a ripoff of the iPhone UI, which you see in the promo pics for the device. Actually i think you're wrong, adding a chrome bezel to the HTC desire or legend and it they won't look like the iPhone, plus they made the effort to make sense UI different.

It's funny that some people are missing certain things out cos it doesn't suit their argument against apple
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 04:23 PM   #646
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So I take it you don't want any more medications, yes? Because the only ways pharmaceutical companies can make back the tremendous investments in new drugs are either to:

1) take advantage of government-granted patents to exclude competition (which can easily reverse-engineer and duplicate the drugs) for enough time to allow the companies to pay back their research money and earn a profit

-OR-

2) charge thousands of dollars (or more) a dose in the short time window before the competition reverse engineers and copies the drug.

And there are many more examples.
There's a big difference between pharmaceutical patents and software patents both in range/scope and the length of the validity of it. Things like copyrights also have not been adjusted for shelf lives (e.g. old video games are 'ancient' within a few years and many arcade boards were rotting away and preservation projects like MAME are preserving them, but the copyrights go on and on even if they're not used and rotting (i.e. abandonware). Many laws need changes/updates, but you NEVER EVER get them because even if companies know they don't NEED or USE them in those conditions, they won't EVER EVER EVER give up one red cent or a iota of control over anything once they have it and will lobby tooth and nail to keep it forever. (e.g. Look at Disney and its classic animation; it was set to expire and Disney convinced them to extend it and now it's practically indefinite. Corporations don't 'die' so copyrights are now abused to the end of time. The original INTENT has been subverted and the public screwed again and again and again. Music/Books/Movies almost NEVER (short of b-stuff that no one gives a crap about either way) go into public domain anymore. It just doesn't happen. It's passed down forever. Again, the original intent for the original copyright holder to make money for a set time off their idea is subverted and the public 'good' ignored.

Look at libraries. I can check out a DVD and watch it at home for free (really my taxes pay for that library to stay open), but if I download a movie off the Net to watch and then erase I've broken copyright law. There is zero functional difference between the two (either way I personally see the same movie), but one is illegal and one isn't. It's downright STUPID. But do you think we could get a national online library of movies to 'check out' online from taxes instead of conventional libraries? NO WAY. Companies know everyone would stop renting movies and just 'borrow' them from the online library so they make you drive down the street and borrow a physical copy of a digital medium that does the same exact thing anyway. But I guarantee you if libraries were just now being suggested for the first time they would never in a million years get them passed. They would be called socialism or communism or some other BS to protect corporate mega-profits. They ARE socialism, but socialism isn't a bad word (some want you to think it is at any cost, though since their mega-profits depend on robbing you blind at every corner)

Like I said before, some will always disagree with my views because I'm leaning away from greed and more towards the common good. I believe this is my spiritual imperative (towards love and away from selfishness) and therefore the right thing to do. I know greedy people will disagree. So be it. I'm just sick of people trying to label things 'bad' based on screwed up systems like Soviet Communism. While they had some socialistic aspects, they were controlled by an elite oligarchy at the top. I find PURE socialism and PURE capitalism to both be flawed. You need some incentives to invent and take risks and yet people's basic needs should be able to be met without massive disparities between 16 MILLION a year CEOs and $9000 a year workers with pushes to take jobs to countries where they can pay them $800 a year.... It's downright disgusting, IMO.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 05:52 PM   #647
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Originally Posted by andythursby View Post
well from what i see, the first working model was in march, that's 2 months.
8 weeks impossible to design let alone show something.

Quote:

anyway you put that phone side by side with the iPhone and it's not similar, unlike the galaxy which is a poor man's iPhone. apple have specified the galaxy, not the F700.

its funny how people are trying to deflect the fact the galaxy is a practial ripoff of the iPhone by claiming the f700 and the iPhone look alike....

look at motorola's and htc's android phones, much different designs compared to the iPhone
i never said the galaxy s doesnt look like an iphone , i do say that looking at what apple gives as logic to sue, the same can be used by lg to sue apple. Just as much simularities btween prada and iphone as between iphone and google nexus.

You can ignore that timenafter time but that never changes .
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 06:08 PM   #648
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i said poor man's iPhone as it looks like a cheap knockoff.

Again you miss my point, it's not just the chrome bezel, it's all the things adding up to it, the bezel, the shape, samsungs touchwiz UI which is a ripoff of the iPhone UI, which you see in the promo pics for the device. Actually i think you're wrong, adding a chrome bezel to the HTC desire or legend and it they won't look like the iPhone, plus they made the effort to make sense UI different.

It's funny that some people are missing certain things out cos it doesn't suit their argument against apple
To quote myself, I said "most phones", not all.
The promo shot they keep using is not the TouchWiz UI, it's the Android App Drawer with custom icons. (Android stock icons in the App Drawer look nothing like Apple icons.)

This is the TouchWiz 3.0 UI on the Galaxy S 2

Ohh... they removed the Samsung logo... must be an iPhone.


Those don't look like Apple icons to me.


Here's the original Galaxy S.
Still no Apple looking icons...


Here is the shot everyone is complaining about.
They took stock Android icons and gave them a background.
Apple-ish, but still not the same. The corners are still much more squared off than Apple icons.
Ignore the huge Samsung logo staring you in the face as well.
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Last edited by rjohnstone; Apr 20, 2011 at 06:19 PM. Reason: More photos
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 08:04 PM   #649
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Actually there are a few devices now that have netflix, and Keynote, and pages are debatable when you have equally good software like quickoffice(love it on my Nokia). I did a quick google and I think DJay is out for Android now, same goes or Reeder. I know Android crud, but do some research, even for 1min if you have to.
Is this even true? I don't think Netflix is out for any Android device. It will only be available on newer devices that have specifically worked with Netflix for security as well.

No, the leaked app that doesn't work does not count.
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Old Apr 20, 2011, 09:35 PM   #650
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Actually there are a few devices now that have netflix
Not Android (which is what we're talking about).

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Originally Posted by coldmack View Post
I think DJay is out for Android now
Nope.

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Originally Posted by coldmack View Post
same goes or Reeder.
Negatory.

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Originally Posted by coldmack View Post
I know Android crud, but do some research, even for 1min if you have to.
Sounds like you should take your own advice.
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